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(Huffington Post)   House Republicans declare war on science   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 231
    More: Dumbass, House Republicans, humans, Dana Rohrabacher, group object, Mount St. Helens, Jim Sensenbrenner, Competitive Enterprise Institute, climate policy  
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10006 clicks; posted to Politics » on 13 Sep 2013 at 5:05 PM (49 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-14 08:03:01 AM

Biological Ali: Whoever's moderating these threads can't possibly not know that Neighborhood Watch is a troll, right? I mean seriously - I'm pretty sure trolls far less obvious than this guy have been given timeouts in the past.


They have to say something pretty farked up to get that treatment. If the mods weren't going to do it for the racist shiat he spewed in the threads that gave this alt Fark Fame, they're not going to do it for standard derpery. The politics tab runs on these trolls.

Years ago, right around the time when Weaver95 finally had to give in and stop defending the Bush administration, Fark had the choice to either let political threads devolve into a massive circlejerk, or give big leeway to obvious conservatrolls. Not even the PITA could fix things. To see what their alternative choice was, look at how Reddit's /r/politics turned out.

It's a shame. You used to be able to get a feel for who had political momentum based purely on the headlines around here - because funny *was* the number 1 priority. So whoever was farking up most would be the target of more headlines. But the Republicans farked up so consistently, for so long, artificial "balance" had to be infused.
 
2013-09-14 08:57:27 AM

VJStinger: dangelder: Is being the neighborhood watch around here an unpaid position?

I sincerely hope so... but for some reason I doubt it.


When someone like Steven Milloy tells lies on behalf of plutocrats who would poison their own mothers if it would bring in a few bucks, at least he separates said plutocrats from some fraction, however minuscule, of their billions.  Neighborhood Watch apparently provides these services for free.
 
2013-09-14 09:07:59 AM

The Name: Leishu: dookdookdook: "There's no way to make it work," Ebell said. "It would still give scientists an opportunity to pontificate, and we're opposed to it."

Serious question: Besides American conservatives, is there any other nationally-powerful organization in any other country as openly and proudly hostile to science in particular and objective reality in general this side of the Taliban?

Yup. The Anti-Vax movement.

So, American conservatives.


There are just as many leftists that are anti-vax as there are rightists. Seriously. Both are retarded, too.
 
2013-09-14 09:15:57 AM

Jensaarai: To see what their alternative choice was, look at how Reddit's /r/politics turned out.


how did it turn out?
 
2013-09-14 09:29:12 AM
FTA: "There's no way to make it work," Ebell said. "It would still give scientists an opportunity to pontificate, and we're opposed to it."

...because pontificating is something that only politicians, political pundits, and Farkers on the politics tab should be allowed to do.
 
2013-09-14 09:40:34 AM

abb3w: FTA: "There's no way to make it work," Ebell said. "It would still give scientists an opportunity to pontificate, and we're opposed to it."

...because pontificating is something that only politicians, political pundits, and Farkers on the politics tab should be allowed to do.


Yeah, it's pretty telling how scared they are of science.
 
2013-09-14 10:31:07 AM

MontanaDave: HighZoolander: vygramul: HighZoolander: [ecx.images-amazon.com image 234x346]
It's a very depressing read...

It's also seriously flawed.

how so? (I'm not very far into it yet)

You haven't read much of what ViagraMule writes, either. The "serious flaw" is that it criticizes Republicans.


You apparently haven't read a lot of what I write.
 
2013-09-14 10:36:38 AM

starsrift: abb3w: FTA: "There's no way to make it work," Ebell said. "It would still give scientists an opportunity to pontificate, and we're opposed to it."

...because pontificating is something that only politicians, political pundits, and Farkers on the politics tab should be allowed to do.

Yeah, it's pretty telling how scared they are of science.


scared of facts in general I think.

/shameful
 
2013-09-14 10:42:01 AM

robohobo: Neil Degrasse Tyson smirks at partisan hacks.


Yeah, I wonder how his tune has changed since he made those statements 4+ years ago.
 
2013-09-14 10:45:52 AM

robohobo: Neil Degrasse Tyson smirks at partisan hacks.


Yes, because political parties don't evolve over time and Abraham Lincoln is the same sort of Republican as Michele Bachmann. In the Republican's case its been for the worse. Certain idiots were voted in in 2010, who had a pro spending cutting platform. Which is what they did, by eventually insisting that that they wouldn't raise the debt ceiling unless there were cuts. Which as we know resulted in S&P downgrading our credit rating.

Then there is the sequester which might not be all the Republican's fault is a direct result of them wanting more cuts because we cut the Bush era tax cuts especially for the so called job creators (hah). Oh, and debt ceiling round two is coming up. So that should be fun.

Anyway, Republican's certainly don't hold all the blame but science has certainly payed the price as result of this sort of Republican created environment on the hill.
 
2013-09-14 10:53:30 AM
Of course the Republicans had to declare war on science.
Science attacked first. Do you think DSM IV was a warning shot?
 
2013-09-14 10:54:14 AM
But America's still exceptional, right?
 
2013-09-14 11:01:40 AM

Jensaarai: Years ago, right around the time when Weaver95 finally had to give in and stop defending the Bush administration, Fark had the choice to either let political threads devolve into a massive circlejerk, or give big leeway to obvious conservatrolls. Not even the PITA could fix things. To see what their alternative choice was, look at how Reddit's /r/politics turned out.


The problem with trolls like Neighborhood Watch isn't that they're conservative - it's that they very obviously don't believe the things they're posting and the result is that entire threads get derailed by a single attention whore who has no intention of ever engaging in sincere discussion.

Every once in a while, trolls have been sent away (and the nonsense they've posted purged from the threads), and it's not as though the site turned into a "circlejerk" when that happened. The only result it had was that the quality of discussion briefly improved, at least until the next attention-whoring threadshiatter came along.
 
2013-09-14 11:01:47 AM
What could go wrong with mixing science and politics, it's working out great for politics and religion.
 
2013-09-14 11:07:26 AM

jigger: How about one that does nothing but go around the country dispelling myths about GMOs and fracking?


The opposition to fracking is more about the poor safety record of energy companies.  (Recall BP and gulf of Mexico where completely safe technology with blow-out preventers and back-up blow-out preventers failed and eleven people died.)

This year in Ohio a fracking company was found to have illegally dumped their toxic waste water into local water ways. We have energy companies swearing the the technology and proven and completely safe, and then this shiat ALWAYS happens.  It is the public that bears the costs and the private companies that makes the profits.

Fracking companies do need more regulation and oversite.  If they are so sure about their technology then they should put up a performance bond to guarantee their work.
 
2013-09-14 11:15:47 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Liberals want the old & infirm to hurry up and die (that's the cold, hard truth) and think about what the liberal/democrat reaction will be when science soon enables a 90 day old (or younger) fetus to survive outside the womb and grow into a normal & healthy infant?


wat?  Dude what are you on?  I'm pretty sure that if you make up stuff to get angry about you should see a doctor.
 
2013-09-14 12:00:55 PM

paygun: What could go wrong with mixing science and politics, it's working out great for politics and religion.


Exactly.  Why are Republicans politicizing science?
 
2013-09-14 12:18:20 PM

Neighborhood Watch: It's not a 'War on Science'.  I agree with not creating yet another bs public figure (with accompanying staff & payroll) on borrowed money to help promote the democrat party.

Scientists are already free to travel the country on money-begging tours and preach the snake oil on Global WarmingTM .  God knows that nobody's been stopping them for the last decade.


The REAL war on science are the attacks on technological progress that actually benefit mankind, such as fracking, genetically modified seed, techniques that allow premature infants to survive at younger and younger ages and, of course, defense technology.



I am (as always) late to the Thread, and have read no further than this comment as of yet..but, this post has elevated you from "Ridiculous Troll to be Disregarded in All Things" to "Subtle Wordsmith who Knows How to Stir the Pot, When He Makes the Effort," in my mind.

Bravo..
 
2013-09-14 12:39:39 PM

paygun: What could go wrong with mixing science and politics, it's working out great for politics and religion.


I always saw Religion as pure sodium and Science as Water.
 
2013-09-14 12:58:58 PM

DVOM: Neighborhood Watch: cloning humans for organ harvesting.

You really have absolutely no grasp of what is actually going on.


I have it blocked, but someone should inform it that The Island was fiction. Terrible fiction.
 
2013-09-14 01:32:47 PM

Biological Ali: Jensaarai: Years ago, right around the time when Weaver95 finally had to give in and stop defending the Bush administration, Fark had the choice to either let political threads devolve into a massive circlejerk, or give big leeway to obvious conservatrolls. Not even the PITA could fix things. To see what their alternative choice was, look at how Reddit's /r/politics turned out.

The problem with trolls like Neighborhood Watch isn't that they're conservative - it's that they very obviously don't believe the things they're posting and the result is that entire threads get derailed by a single attention whore who has no intention of ever engaging in sincere discussion.

Every once in a while, trolls have been sent away (and the nonsense they've posted purged from the threads), and it's not as though the site turned into a "circlejerk" when that happened. The only result it had was that the quality of discussion briefly improved, at least until the next attention-whoring threadshiatter came along.


Careful.  You're criticizing one of the pet trolls.
 
2013-09-14 01:35:50 PM

Damnhippyfreak: You seem to be conflating specific policy decisions and applications with the idea of a "scientific field".

For instance, genetically modified seed and domestic energy exploration are specific policy decisions based on the underlying scientific fields of genetics and geology/physics. One can be against specific applications of the scientific knowledge without somehow being against the knowledge itself. Evolution and stem cell research, on the other hand are in of themselves scientific fields of inquiry - opposition to these is not based upon their applications, but the scientific information itself.


"Opposition to stem cell research" is a misnomer and is only opposed when the source of embryonic stem cells is aborted fetuses.  Stem cell research on embryonic stem cells from umbilical cord blood or adult stem cells is not opposed by anyone as far as I have seen.  In fact, cord blood is routinely stored and banked commercially and research continues.

Keep in mind that ethical decisions about pure research (like not using aborted fetuses) keeps the science aspect of it alive.  Eugenics was a scientific field until the political application of it made the entire field abhorrent and it is now a not considered a science but a social movement.

Climate studies are a scientific field but Global Warming has moved into a political movement.  Pure science is interested in discovery of facts but it becomes social movement when those facts are used and manipulated to create societal change.

No scientist doubts evolution and that genetic attributes are passed from parent to child.  We use that knowledge to manipulate plants and animals to create more hardier strains or specific breeds of dogs.  Scientists research and apply that to plants and animals but there is no way any scientists would try the same with humans.  It isn't because the science is invalid, it's because the politicians and social change advocates applied it in such a way that it's use is very limited.  There is the very real danger that legitimate climate studies will be curtailed if politicians and activists continue to overplay their hand.  Scientists are caught in the middle in terms of funding and research that becomes narrowly targeted to support a social activist agenda.  If, say, in thirty years, it appears that changes in the availability of coal and power for 3rd world nations caused poverty and famine,  and science (not social activists) are blamed, climatology could go the way of eugenics and the dodo bird.  The same could be true for embryonic stem cell research if there is an unethical method of obtaining research material.

Science itself is never the issue.  It's political advocacy for action based on an interpretation of science that causes problems.  There are literally hundreds of stories of misapplied science causing unnecessary harm or inconvenience.  From insect control to cancer causing agents from plastic baby bottles to hormones given to cows to create more milk.  Likewise there is the unethical application of science (like eugenics) that have literally destroyed avenues of advancement.

Oh, and everyone likes to point out science has expanded the human lifespan.  IN reality the upper bounded number has remained virtually unchanged.  There are no 130 year old humans.   That would be the next great scientific breakthrough and perhaps stem cell research is part of that direction.  But for now, science has only manipulated the low and medium ends of actuarial tables.  Infant mortality goes down.  Cancer deaths in middle age decline and these all push the "at birth life expectancy up".  But for someone that has made it to 90 or 100 years old, the actuarial table for remaining years is virtually unchanged for the last century.   More people make it there, but they die at the same rate as they have always have and maybe even faster.  Notice that the oldest human alive at any given period is always about the same age.
 
2013-09-14 01:52:34 PM

tbeatty: Damnhippyfreak: You seem to be conflating specific policy decisions and applications with the idea of a "scientific field".

For instance, genetically modified seed and domestic energy exploration are specific policy decisions based on the underlying scientific fields of genetics and geology/physics. One can be against specific applications of the scientific knowledge without somehow being against the knowledge itself. Evolution and stem cell research, on the other hand are in of themselves scientific fields of inquiry - opposition to these is not based upon their applications, but the scientific information itself.

"Opposition to stem cell research" is a misnomer and is only opposed when the source of embryonic stem cells is aborted fetuses.  Stem cell research on embryonic stem cells from umbilical cord blood or adult stem cells is not opposed by anyone as far as I have seen.  In fact, cord blood is routinely stored and banked commercially and research continues.

Keep in mind that ethical decisions about pure research (like not using aborted fetuses) keeps the science aspect of it alive.  Eugenics was a scientific field until the political application of it made the entire field abhorrent and it is now a not considered a science but a social movement.

Climate studies are a scientific field but Global Warming has moved into a political movement.  Pure science is interested in discovery of facts but it becomes social movement when those facts are used and manipulated to create societal change.

No scientist doubts evolution and that genetic attributes are passed from parent to child.  We use that knowledge to manipulate plants and animals to create more hardier strains or specific breeds of dogs.  Scientists research and apply that to plants and animals but there is no way any scientists would try the same with humans.  It isn't because the science is invalid, it's because the politicians and social change advocates applied it in such a way that it's use is very ...



I agree with you here, and I shouldn't have lumped stem cell research in there.
 
2013-09-14 01:56:23 PM

Damnhippyfreak: tbeatty: Damnhippyfreak: You seem to be conflating specific policy decisions and applications with the idea of a "scientific field".

For instance, genetically modified seed and domestic energy exploration are specific policy decisions based on the underlying scientific fields of genetics and geology/physics. One can be against specific applications of the scientific knowledge without somehow being against the knowledge itself. Evolution and stem cell research, on the other hand are in of themselves scientific fields of inquiry - opposition to these is not based upon their applications, but the scientific information itself.

"Opposition to stem cell research" is a misnomer and is only opposed when the source of embryonic stem cells is aborted fetuses.  Stem cell research on embryonic stem cells from umbilical cord blood or adult stem cells is not opposed by anyone as far as I have seen.  In fact, cord blood is routinely stored and banked commercially and research continues.

Keep in mind that ethical decisions about pure research (like not using aborted fetuses) keeps the science aspect of it alive.  Eugenics was a scientific field until the political application of it made the entire field abhorrent and it is now a not considered a science but a social movement.

Climate studies are a scientific field but Global Warming has moved into a political movement.  Pure science is interested in discovery of facts but it becomes social movement when those facts are used and manipulated to create societal change.

No scientist doubts evolution and that genetic attributes are passed from parent to child.  We use that knowledge to manipulate plants and animals to create more hardier strains or specific breeds of dogs.  Scientists research and apply that to plants and animals but there is no way any scientists would try the same with humans.  It isn't because the science is invalid, it's because the politicians and social change advocates applied it in such a way that it's use ...


Chris Mooney considers opposition to stem cells to be anti-science because one of the arguments Republicans make is that there are n number of strains when it's really n-6 (it was like it was 16 but Republicans said it was 22 or something on that order). To scientists, the difference is substantial. To the public, it probably isn't. To Mooney, it was evidence of a war on science.
 
2013-09-14 02:42:23 PM

Neighborhood Watch: Biological Ali: The problem with trolls like Neighborhood Watch isn't that they're conservative - it's that they very obviously don't believe the things they're posting and the result is that entire threads get derailed by a single attention whore who has no intention of ever engaging in sincere discussion.

Every once in a while, trolls have been sent away (and the nonsense they've posted purged from the threads), and it's not as though the site turned into a "circlejerk" when that happened. The only result it had was that the quality of discussion briefly improved, at least until the next attention-whoring threadshiatter came along.


Why don't you back off a little bit, my friend.


Why don't you stop trolling this website? Surely you can find a better hobby than this.
 
2013-09-14 03:12:16 PM

Gyrfalcon: I'll just leave this here:

[www.anneofcarversville.com image 465x916]


HA HA! SUCK IT, LIECHTENSTEIN!
 
2013-09-14 05:22:29 PM

log_jammin: Jensaarai: To see what their alternative choice was, look at how Reddit's /r/politics turned out.

how did it turn out?


He fixed the cable?
 
2013-09-14 06:27:40 PM

Somacandra: the 101st Fighting Keyboardists


I like that.
 
2013-09-14 08:49:21 PM

Gyrfalcon: I'll just leave this here:


maybe we could restrict "participating regions of the united states" to wealthy suburbs around the country (except atlanta) and all of massachussetts (except for south boston) and we'll see how well we compare with your "average" chinaman...

/hell, if you point is comparison of "economical system" and not to be based on race, why not compare asian americans to asian asians. wonder who will perform better?
 
2013-09-14 08:58:48 PM

lennavan: So I'm going to give up and go to medical school.


wait, you got a phd, and now you're going to go to medical school? jesus man, will the abuse never end???
 
2013-09-14 09:15:01 PM
Herb Utsmelz:

I like that.

The Killer Keyboard Kommandos usually swats two flies simultaneously.
 
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