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(USA Today)   Is your arm starting to hurt? I bet it's getting hot in there. Itch it   (usatoday.com) divider line 216
    More: Asinine, NASCAR, Martin Truex Jr., Michael Waltrip Racing, Flavio Briatore, Brian Vickers, Rubens Barrichello, Clint Bowyer, Richard Childress Racing  
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2306 clicks; posted to Sports » on 09 Sep 2013 at 1:14 PM (31 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



216 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2013-09-09 09:10:36 AM
Worst code phrase ever.

I hope Nascar slams the hammer on MWR racing.
 
2013-09-09 09:23:39 AM
NASCAR should really make an example of these guys. If they tolerate this kind of blatant manipulation of the outcome of a race, they are going to lose the fans that have stuck around this long.
 
2013-09-09 10:36:42 AM
Holy cow.

I saw the Boyer spin and thought "WTF is wrong with that guy? He's had a good car".

I don't know. If there is any truth to this there should be a BIG points deduction and a realignment of just who is and who is not in the chase.
 
2013-09-09 11:54:06 AM
There were other antics at play too. Brian Vickers slowed down to 77 MPH AND came into pit during green flag so that Joey Logano would get ahead of him, thereby putting Joey in 10th and allowing the second wild card spot to open up for Truex.
 
2013-09-09 12:49:37 PM
Then there was the Brian Vickers exchange:
"We're probably going to pit here on green," Norris says.
"Are you talking to me?" a surprised Vickers asks.
Vickers continued to question the call, at one point asking, "I don't understand, pit right now?"
"You've got to pit this time. We need that 1 point," Norris replies.
"10-4. Do I got a tire going down?" Vickers asked.
Vickers then pitted as the field went green. When he asked afterward if his crew found anything with the tire, Norris replied, "I'll see you after the race, Brian, I owe you a kiss."
 
2013-09-09 01:15:56 PM
If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?
 
2013-09-09 01:19:13 PM

wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?


Up until now, "teammanship" meant letting your teammate lead a lap for a bonus point. That, and maybe a drafting partner. But we have not seen this magnitude of cohesion.
 
2013-09-09 01:20:01 PM

wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?


Yeah, I'm not sure I understand why this is a big deal. Isn't the point of teams that you CAN manipulate the outcome?

/Shake n Bake
 
2013-09-09 01:26:49 PM
Teammates helping each other out! What a travesty!
 
2013-09-09 01:28:08 PM
If only there was a way to race stock cars without schenanigans.  Some sort simple race.  Go fast, turn left, unmodified stock cars.
 
2013-09-09 01:28:20 PM
Also, it's "scratch it" you f*cking f*ck.

Something itches. So you scratch it. You don't itch an itch, you stupid buffoon.
 
2013-09-09 01:28:53 PM
Team orders done right.

i.dailymail.co.uk

Team orders done wrong
www.gannett-cdn.com
 
2013-09-09 01:35:06 PM

IAmRight: Teammates helping each other out! What a travesty!


This kind of blatant horseshiat isn't tolerated in Cup like it is in F1, and this is the first time it has been used like this.

Frankly, I'm surprised ti took this long, but if NASCAR doesn't come down HARD on MWR as a whole, this is going to be standard operating procedure at Richmond every year, and the fans will (rightly) throw a huge fit about it. We simply don't want this shiat in Cup, plain and simple.
 
2013-09-09 01:38:07 PM
fark you Michael Waltrip, you cheater scumbag
 
2013-09-09 01:39:04 PM

Random Name Generator: fark you Michael Waltrip, you cheater scumbag


(to be fair everyone cheats in NASCAR, but especially MW, like in rocketfuelgate)
 
2013-09-09 01:40:04 PM
It's still real to me goddamnit!
 
2013-09-09 01:51:00 PM
It was never real to me.
 
2013-09-09 01:51:27 PM
I've watched NASCAR for a long time and didn't think anything about it when Bowyer spun out.  It wasn't until you factor in the radio communication that it became clear that they were manipulating the race using their entire stable of drivers.  It's a joke and they should be pummeled with a substantial fine and loss of driver and owner points to set a clear example.  I've always liked Michael Waltrip, but this team is always at the front of any scandal.
 
2013-09-09 02:00:44 PM
Throw Bowyer and Truex out of the chase, add Gordon and Newman to the Chase.

Problem solved.
 
WGJ
2013-09-09 02:00:49 PM

Rapmaster2000: It's still real to me goddamnit!


Yep, we're getting closer to WWE on wheels. Next up will be a driver slapping a race official to really add to the "drama".
 
2013-09-09 02:02:09 PM
This is just a blatant attempt to make NASCAR interesting. Won't work on me, though
 
2013-09-09 02:03:38 PM

PowerSlacker: Throw Bowyer and Truex out of the chase, add Gordon and Newman to the Chase.

Problem solved.


I say just throw Boyer out of the Chase and move everyone up one. Now whether it's Newman or Gordon, I don't know. But don't penalize Truex, as he was simply the beneficiary. He and his crew chief didn't do anything wrong.
 
2013-09-09 02:08:58 PM

soopey: Team orders done right.



Team orders done wrong


It wasn't even really done right there. The resulting investigation essentially blacklisted Nelson Piquet, Jr and cost two of Renault's top officials their jobs.

On topic, I haven't rooted for NASCAR this hard in quite some time. My dream punishment? MWR loses both their Chase positions, gets automatically sent to the bottom of the owner's points, gets a minimum-seven-figure fine, and ends up on hard probation for three years.
 
2013-09-09 02:10:07 PM

Bonkthat_Again: PowerSlacker: Throw Bowyer and Truex out of the chase, add Gordon and Newman to the Chase.

Problem solved.

I say just throw Boyer out of the Chase and move everyone up one. Now whether it's Newman or Gordon, I don't know. But don't penalize Truex, as he was simply the beneficiary. He and his crew chief didn't do anything wrong.


I'd be fine with that too.

NASCAR will probably just dock Bowyer five points and call it a day.
 
2013-09-09 02:12:07 PM

IAmRight: Also, it's "scratch it" you f*cking f*ck.

Something itches. So you scratch it. You don't itch an itch, you stupid buffoon.


I came only to say this.  I couldn't care less about the article, or NASCAR, but submitter, you are a farking idiot.

Definition of ITCHintransitive verb1a  : to have an itch  <her arm  itched>b  : to produce an  <long underwear thatitches>2: to have a restless desire or hankering for something  <wereitching to go outside>transitive verb1: to cause to itch2:vex, irritate
 
2013-09-09 02:13:00 PM
It used to be that shiat like this would be solved by a nice fistfight between the drivers. Alas, that won't be happening here.

If i was the driver that got screwed, i'd find one of those "start and park" drivers and offer him something to wreck the conspirators for me at the start of the next race. After all, they werent going to race their cars anyway; might as well get some use out of them.
 
2013-09-09 02:13:49 PM

PowerSlacker: NASCAR will probably just dock Bowyer five points and call it a day.


Sponsors are PISSED, too, though. The financial payout structure for big teams like the 24 swing well into the millions for Chase berths. Anything less than effectively knocking Bowyer out of the championship rce (50 points, one-race ban, whatever) will piss off an incredibly high number of both fans and sponsors.
 
2013-09-09 02:14:41 PM

Satan's Bunny Slippers: IAmRight: Also, it's "scratch it" you f*cking f*ck.

Something itches. So you scratch it. You don't itch an itch, you stupid buffoon.

I came only to say this.  I couldn't care less about the article, or NASCAR, but submitter, you are a farking idiot.

Definition of ITCHintransitive verb1a  : to have an itch  <her arm  itched>b  : to produce an  <long underwear thatitches>2: to have a restless desire or hankering for something  <wereitching to go outside>transitive verb1: to cause to itch2:vex, irritate


Read the article (and others). The headline is damn near verbatim.
 
2013-09-09 02:17:35 PM

Clutch2013: Satan's Bunny Slippers: IAmRight: Also, it's "scratch it" you f*cking f*ck.

Something itches. So you scratch it. You don't itch an itch, you stupid buffoon.

I came only to say this.  I couldn't care less about the article, or NASCAR, but submitter, you are a farking idiot.

Definition of ITCHintransitive verb1a  : to have an itch  <her arm  itched>b  : to produce an  <long underwear thatitches>2: to have a restless desire or hankering for something  <wereitching to go outside>transitive verb1: to cause to itch2:vex, irritate

Read the article (and others). The headline is damn near verbatim.


Not this article, which is the one linked from this thread:

Analysis: NASCAR facing ethical quandary after Richmond
 
2013-09-09 02:17:36 PM
...it could undermine the integrity of NASCAR...

BWAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!!
 
2013-09-09 02:22:51 PM

Satan's Bunny Slippers: Clutch2013: Satan's Bunny Slippers: IAmRight: Also, it's "scratch it" you f*cking f*ck.

Something itches. So you scratch it. You don't itch an itch, you stupid buffoon.

I came only to say this.  I couldn't care less about the article, or NASCAR, but submitter, you are a farking idiot.

Definition of ITCHintransitive verb1a  : to have an itch  <her arm  itched>b  : to produce an  <long underwear thatitches>2: to have a restless desire or hankering for something  <wereitching to go outside>transitive verb1: to cause to itch2:vex, irritate

Read the article (and others). The headline is damn near verbatim.

Not this article, which is the one linked from this thread:

Analysis: NASCAR facing ethical quandary after Richmond


OK, not this article.

But in every article that quotes him, and the in-car audio, those are Brian Pattie's exact words.
 
2013-09-09 02:23:07 PM

Dick Gozinya: It used to be that shiat like this would be solved by a nice fistfight between the drivers. Alas, that won't be happening here.

If i was the driver that got screwed, i'd find one of those "start and park" drivers and offer him something to wreck the conspirators for me at the start of the next race. After all, they werent going to race their cars anyway; might as well get some use out of them.


I am pretty unfamiliar with NASCAR, but isn't the point of "start and park" to save money? You would basically have to offer them a car. What is the bare minimum for a car that is qualified to race?
 
2013-09-09 02:25:43 PM

Random Name Generator: Random Name Generator: fark you Michael Waltrip, you cheater scumbag

(to be fair everyone cheats in NASCAR, but especially MW, like in rocketfuelgate)


Speaking of Rocketfuelgate, did we ever find out what the mystery substance was?
 
2013-09-09 02:26:27 PM

Satan's Bunny Slippers: I came only to say this.  I couldn't care less about the article, or NASCAR, but submitter, you are a farking idiot.


Southern colloquialism. It's more common than you'd guess.
 
2013-09-09 02:27:46 PM

Gonz: Southern colloquialism. It's more common than you'd guess.


I can't stand it when southerners say "hisself".
 
2013-09-09 02:28:13 PM

Satan's Bunny Slippers: IAmRight: Also, it's "scratch it" you f*cking f*ck.

Something itches. So you scratch it. You don't itch an itch, you stupid buffoon.

I came only to say this.  I couldn't care less about the article, or NASCAR, but submitter, you are a farking idiot.

Definition of ITCHintransitive verb1a  : to have an itch  <her arm  itched>b  : to produce an  <long underwear thatitches>2: to have a restless desire or hankering for something  <wereitching to go outside>transitive verb1: to cause to itch2:vex, irritate


RTFA. Subby was quoting what the crew chief said on the radio.
 
2013-09-09 02:29:28 PM
img.photobucket.com

img.photobucket.com

img.photobucket.com
 
2013-09-09 02:32:30 PM

Bonkthat_Again: Gonz: Southern colloquialism. It's more common than you'd guess.

I can't stand it when southerners say "hisself".


I grew up in Kentucky. There are many, many Southern (and Appalachian) abuses of grammar that cause me to twitch audibly. I actually credit the steretypical Kentuckian for my lack of an accent- I didn't want to sound like those hilljacks, so I tried to talk like like Tom Brokaw.

//Get a few drinks in me, and the occasional phrase might sneak out.
 
2013-09-09 02:33:06 PM
NASCAR Wonka @NASCAR_Wonka

Newman says he found some old pics of Bowyer at RCR, and he and Childress have spent the morning using them as a dart board.
 
2013-09-09 02:46:33 PM

wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?


Exactly. There's nothing to be done about it, really. I guess people would be happier if Bowyer stuffed some guy from DNM Racing instead?

/DNM. Does Not Matter.
 
2013-09-09 02:52:26 PM

MFAWG: wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?

Exactly. There's nothing to be done about it, really. I guess people would be happier if Bowyer stuffed some guy from DNM Racing instead?

/DNM. Does Not Matter.


If some guy from DNM Racing was a hair's width from making the Final 10, yeah, we'd be having this same conversation.

It's not who it was done to; it's that it was done in the first place. It shouldn't have been.
 
2013-09-09 02:56:24 PM

desertgeek: RTFA. Subby was quoting what the crew chief said on the radio.


Article was TL; DR.
 
2013-09-09 02:56:56 PM
Team orders? That's a shame.

Bowyer's tire shredded on the way to the pits, which suggests it may have been going down when he spun. Unless there's concrete proof that it was a deliberate, concerted effort to screw around the standings, what can NASCAR do about it?
Plus, who the hell does something stupid like that over a live, public radio channel? "Hey, we know people are going to hear this and wonder what the hell we're talking about and then pair it with the spin and the timing and everything and give us hell, but we're gonna do it anyhow!" Makes no sense at all.

I see concrete proof that there was a conspiracy, I'll be disappointed as a MWR fan. But proof please.
 
2013-09-09 02:57:14 PM
The announcers had just said something to the effect that all Gordon had to do was drive out the race.  He didn't even need to pass anyone, and since there was only one car on the same lap as Logano, he wouldn't be passing anyone.

The pit crew must moniter the TV broadcast.
 
2013-09-09 02:57:47 PM
And Ctrl+F doesn't come up with any mentions of "itch."

Now we have to read the article, look for all other articles, and read videos? F*ck you, Fark, that's like homework.
 
2013-09-09 02:59:29 PM

Five Tails of Fury: Team orders? That's a shame.

Bowyer's tire shredded on the way to the pits, which suggests it may have been going down when he spun. Unless there's concrete proof that it was a deliberate, concerted effort to screw around the standings, what can NASCAR do about it?
Plus, who the hell does something stupid like that over a live, public radio channel? "Hey, we know people are going to hear this and wonder what the hell we're talking about and then pair it with the spin and the timing and everything and give us hell, but we're gonna do it anyhow!" Makes no sense at all.

I see concrete proof that there was a conspiracy, I'll be disappointed as a MWR fan. But proof please.


Brian Pattie, apparently, is that man.
 
2013-09-09 03:01:39 PM

MFAWG: wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?

Exactly. There's nothing to be done about it, really. I guess people would be happier if Bowyer stuffed some guy from DNM Racing instead?

/DNM. Does Not Matter.


Sure there is something to be done,  they need to punish MWR to reestablish that only NASCAR can affect the outcome of races by causing late cautions with phantom debris yellow flags...

Seriously though, while some teamwork is expected and encouraged, this blatant meddling in the outcome takes it beyond something we want.  I hate to use the old slippery slope argument, but if this behavior is allowed, what is to stop the wrecking of competition with cars not involved in the championship.  Allowing the conduct of Bowyer puts himself, other competitors, and safety crew at risk as once a car is spinning, who knows what could happen and who may get hurt in response to the act.

Financially and competitively it made all the sense in the world for MWR to engage in this behavior.  Unless actions are taken to show that teams cannot profit from this misconduct it will become the norm.  Regardless of what happens now, we will probably see something similar in the future, but be masked better than the blatant meddling in the outcome that MWR engaged in through open radio communications broadcasting what they want done. Disqualify MWR from the chase and move the next two cars into the field who qualify if their cars are removed.  That is the only way this can be discourage from occurring in the future.
 
2013-09-09 03:04:44 PM

Five Tails of Fury: Team orders? That's a shame.

Bowyer's tire shredded on the way to the pits, which suggests it may have been going down when he spun. Unless there's concrete proof that it was a deliberate, concerted effort to screw around the standings, what can NASCAR do about it?
Plus, who the hell does something stupid like that over a live, public radio channel? "Hey, we know people are going to hear this and wonder what the hell we're talking about and then pair it with the spin and the timing and everything and give us hell, but we're gonna do it anyhow!" Makes no sense at all.

I see concrete proof that there was a conspiracy, I'll be disappointed as a MWR fan. But proof please.


So you didn't watch the race, and haven't followed this issue at all since then, either. Good to know.
 
2013-09-09 03:11:00 PM
 
2013-09-09 03:11:04 PM

Daedalus27: MFAWG: wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?

Exactly. There's nothing to be done about it, really. I guess people would be happier if Bowyer stuffed some guy from DNM Racing instead?

/DNM. Does Not Matter.

Sure there is something to be done,  they need to punish MWR to reestablish that only NASCAR can affect the outcome of races by causing late cautions with phantom debris yellow flags...

Seriously though, while some teamwork is expected and encouraged, this blatant meddling in the outcome takes it beyond something we want.  I hate to use the old slippery slope argument, but if this behavior is allowed, what is to stop the wrecking of competition with cars not involved in the championship.  Allowing the conduct of Bowyer puts himself, other competitors, and safety crew at risk as once a car is spinning, who knows what could happen and who may get hurt in response to the act.

Financially and competitively it made all the sense in the world for MWR to engage in this behavior.  Unless actions are taken to show that teams cannot profit from this misconduct it will become the norm.  Regardless of what happens now, we will probably see something similar in the future, but be masked better than the blatant meddling in the outcome that MWR engaged in through open radio communications broadcasting what they want done. Disqualify MWR from the chase and move the next two cars into the field who qualify if their cars are removed.  That is the only way this can be discourage from occurring in the future.


Because nobody in the history of NASCAR has ever thrown debris on the track to bring out a yellow.

And yeah, shiat like this is part of the game now, and really always has been.
 
2013-09-09 03:13:11 PM

Bonkthat_Again: "Itch" comment midway through article


I see. What we should've done is read this article, plus all the linked articles, just to validate subby.

Also, re: the subject. That's what you get for putting a dumbass "playoff" in place, NASCAR. You f*cking asked for it.
 
2013-09-09 03:13:56 PM

MFAWG: Because nobody in the history of NASCAR has ever thrown debris on the track to bring out a yellow.


I'm convinced Chad Knaus has fitted a trap door on Jimmy Johnson's car full of debris so can get himself a caution when he deems it necessary.
 
2013-09-09 03:21:49 PM

soopey: MFAWG: Because nobody in the history of NASCAR has ever thrown debris on the track to bring out a yellow.

I'm convinced Chad Knaus has fitted a trap door on Jimmy Johnson's car full of debris so can get himself a caution when he deems it necessary.


Chad is way more stylish than that.
 
2013-09-09 03:27:22 PM

Five Tails of Fury: Team orders? That's a shame.

Bowyer's tire shredded on the way to the pits, which suggests it may have been going down when he spun. Unless there's concrete proof that it was a deliberate, concerted effort to screw around the standings, what can NASCAR do about it?
Plus, who the hell does something stupid like that over a live, public radio channel? "Hey, we know people are going to hear this and wonder what the hell we're talking about and then pair it with the spin and the timing and everything and give us hell, but we're gonna do it anyhow!" Makes no sense at all.

I see concrete proof that there was a conspiracy, I'll be disappointed as a MWR fan. But proof please.


I believe he blamed Jr for spinning him out..

Jr's comments on what he saw.

"He just spun right out," Earnhardt said afterward. "That's the craziest thing I ever saw. ... He was hemming around on the brakes and jerking the car around, and then the thing just spun out. It was crazy. I don't know what was going on."
 
2013-09-09 03:29:49 PM

mjones73: Five Tails of Fury: Team orders? That's a shame.

Bowyer's tire shredded on the way to the pits, which suggests it may have been going down when he spun. Unless there's concrete proof that it was a deliberate, concerted effort to screw around the standings, what can NASCAR do about it?
Plus, who the hell does something stupid like that over a live, public radio channel? "Hey, we know people are going to hear this and wonder what the hell we're talking about and then pair it with the spin and the timing and everything and give us hell, but we're gonna do it anyhow!" Makes no sense at all.

I see concrete proof that there was a conspiracy, I'll be disappointed as a MWR fan. But proof please.

I believe he blamed Jr for spinning him out..

Jr's comments on what he saw.

"He just spun right out," Earnhardt said afterward. "That's the craziest thing I ever saw. ... He was hemming around on the brakes and jerking the car around, and then the thing just spun out. It was crazy. I don't know what was going on."


Joonyer also suggested taking a look at the telemetry of the car, which I thought was interesting.
 
2013-09-09 03:35:05 PM
So NASCAR has finally graduated to the level of Formula 1.  Got it.
 
2013-09-09 03:35:07 PM
Even if you go full idiot and try to explain away Bowyer's spin, there's no other possibilities for the subsequent actions of both Bowyer (repeated pit stops "just to make sure") and Vickers (pits under green for no reason at all under the clear orders of his bosses, then proceeds to go half-speed for several laps) than they were tanking the race. It's impossible to come to any other conclusion, this isn't a debate.

Appropriate penalties are the only thing to discuss.
 
2013-09-09 03:36:08 PM
I kind of wonder what Mark Martin would have to say about all of this were he still in the 55 car.
 
2013-09-09 03:36:16 PM

MFAWG: Joonyer also suggested taking a look at the telemetry of the car, which I thought was interesting.


It was probably from when he spun himself out at Bristol. He said, "No i didn't." Nascar said, "Yes you did." That might be how they got him.
 
2013-09-09 03:42:54 PM

Old_Chief_Scott: I kind of wonder what Mark Martin would have to say about all of this were he still in the 55 car.


They shoul remake the commercial with MM and MW to add cheating to what they do not have in common.

I am with the people suggesting removing MWR cars from the chase and adding Jeff and Newman.

Also, stop with the BS cautions, NASCAR. There was no need to yellow Bowyer's spin in the first place.
 
2013-09-09 03:49:20 PM

wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?


I fail to see the outrage.  NASCAR, like Formula 1, is a TEAM SPORT.  It is inherent in racing teams that if a driver in your team has the best shot at the championship, the other driver(s) support him  and maximize his points haul.  If that means moving over for him at the last corner (Barrichello for Schumacher Austria 2002), or being told "Alonso is faster than you.  Can you acknowledge" (Massa being told by his race engineer to basically move his ass over for Fernando Alonso) or being told to maintian position (LeMans.  you pick the year and teams have been ordered to hold station until the end to ensure all cars finished, even when one car was clearly faster than their teammates').

I'm surprised NASCAR fans are outraged.  They do realize that the term "got the call" had its genesis in NASCAR, and was famously brought to public attention when Dale Earnhardt won that highly improbably Daytona 500, when it certainly looked like he was nowhere near the fastest guy on track.  Earnhardt even admitted as such to a reporter from Racer Magazine back in the day.
 
2013-09-09 03:59:53 PM
pbs.twimg.com
 
2013-09-09 04:00:38 PM
I didn't know NASCAR had any ethics to undermine.
 
2013-09-09 04:08:31 PM
This being NASCAR, I expect them to add Newman and Gordon to the chase, and somehow include Danica Patrick because why the hell not.
 
2013-09-09 04:12:55 PM

Mi-5: wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?

I fail to see the outrage.  NASCAR, like Formula 1, is a TEAM SPORT.  It is inherent in racing teams that if a driver in your team has the best shot at the championship, the other driver(s) support him  and maximize his points haul.  If that means moving over for him at the last corner (Barrichello for Schumacher Austria 2002), or being told "Alonso is faster than you.  Can you acknowledge" (Massa being told by his race engineer to basically move his ass over for Fernando Alonso) or being told to maintian position (LeMans.  you pick the year and teams have been ordered to hold station until the end to ensure all cars finished, even when one car was clearly faster than their teammates').

I'm surprised NASCAR fans are outraged.  They do realize that the term "got the call" had its genesis in NASCAR, and was famously brought to public attention when Dale Earnhardt won that highly improbably Daytona 500, when it certainly looked like he was nowhere near the fastest guy on track.  Earnhardt even admitted as such to a reporter from Racer Magazine back in the day.


*points to 2008 Renault scandal*

If you were outraged by that, you should be outraged at this.
 
2013-09-09 04:36:07 PM
pbs.twimg.com
 
2013-09-09 04:47:35 PM

Guelph35: This being NASCAR, I expect them to add Newman and Gordon to the chase, and somehow include Danica Patrick because why the hell not.


The ratings will make it all worthwhile. She might get involved in a wreck and if we could have her firesuit pre-ripped in several strategic places, the post-crash interview will be solid gold. Let's run it by her agent and see how much she'd want for that.
 
2013-09-09 05:09:01 PM
If NASCAR does nothing, Newman needs to man up and put Bowyer into the wall.  Actually, he should do that anyways regardless of what NASCAR does.

And it showed the right-front tire was shredded.  Normally a right-front going down puts you up into the wall, not just spinning around near the bottom
 
2013-09-09 05:18:54 PM
Fine Bowyer 100 points for being a douchebag and costing Newman the lead

Fine Vickers 50 points for that pit stop just to let Logano pass him to knock the 24 out of 10th spot

Suspend both of their crew chiefs 6 races

And finally ban Michael Waltrip from ever driving in a Sprint Cup event ever again for his classless comments Saturday AND Sunday
 
2013-09-09 05:24:20 PM
After all the fake debris cautions during the season and Boyer's spin, I just have one thing to say. I'm ready for some football.
 
2013-09-09 05:27:00 PM

smerfnablin: Fine Bowyer 100 points for being a douchebag and costing Newman the lead

Fine Vickers 50 points for that pit stop just to let Logano pass him to knock the 24 out of 10th spot

Suspend both of their crew chiefs 6 races

And finally ban Michael Waltrip from ever driving in a Sprint Cup event ever again for his classless comments Saturday AND Sunday


Since I was not in a position to watch the race - do you have a link to Waltrip's "classless comments"?
 
2013-09-09 05:41:06 PM

smerfnablin: Fine Bowyer 100 points for being a douchebag and costing Newman the lead

Fine Vickers 50 points for that pit stop just to let Logano pass him to knock the 24 out of 10th spot

Suspend both of their crew chiefs 6 races

And finally ban Michael Waltrip from ever driving in a Sprint Cup event ever again for his classless comments Saturday AND Sunday


That doesn't remedy the misconduct.  MWR still will profit from their wrongful actions and all it does is promote teams to further collusion in attempts to win.  Your 4th team driver out of contention for the race/championship taps the leader while being lapped, fakes a tire going down and turns right taking out the leader, or have them pull out slowly on pit road to block or cause damage.  If you are allowed to cause a caution and monkey with the finishing order, why not directly damage competition?  It puts NASCAR one step closer to WWE when it seems at times it is already uncomfortably close. The only way to prevent this is to issue incredibly harsh penalties to show the gravity of the situation and restore some credibility.   Of course I still believe misconduct of this nature can occur, it will just be masked better by discussions prerace and implemented in coded phrases or hand signals which hopefully won't be recorded.

There needs to be scalps claimed by NASCAR.  Outright banning crew chiefs for a year. Massive fines for the organization. Although it appears Truex did nothing wrong, he profited from the misconduct of his organization so he shouldn't be rewarded with a Chase spot.  The tougher question is Bowyer who was securely in the Chase but seemingly overtly undermined the integrity of NASCAR. I wouldn't be opposed to disqualifying him, but at the very least 100 point penalty at the start of the chase to make it very unlikely he would win the championship. The credibility of the sport is on the line, so steps need to be taken immediately before it is too late.
 
2013-09-09 05:49:53 PM
What pisses me off most is that you have a driver racing his guts out because he HAS to win to make the cut and some assclown drives like a dick on purpose to lose spots to someone else.

This sucks.
 
2013-09-09 05:55:52 PM

Mi-5: wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?

I fail to see the outrage.  NASCAR, like Formula 1, is a TEAM SPORT.  It is inherent in racing teams that if a driver in your team has the best shot at the championship, the other driver(s) support him  and maximize his points haul.  If that means moving over for him at the last corner (Barrichello for Schumacher Austria 2002), or being told "Alonso is faster than you.  Can you acknowledge" (Massa being told by his race engineer to basically move his ass over for Fernando Alonso) or being told to maintian position (LeMans.  you pick the year and teams have been ordered to hold station until the end to ensure all cars finished, even when one car was clearly faster than their teammates').

I'm surprised NASCAR fans are outraged.  They do realize that the term "got the call" had its genesis in NASCAR, and was famously brought to public attention when Dale Earnhardt won that highly improbably Daytona 500, when it certainly looked like he was nowhere near the fastest guy on track.  Earnhardt even admitted as such to a reporter from Racer Magazine back in the day.


Cup fans don't like this shiat, and "everyone else does it"  won't change that.
 
2013-09-09 06:20:12 PM
Bah, I don't really expect NASCAR to do anything effective, because, let's face it, when have they ever? What I really wish, in that evil little place I call a heart, is for the sponsors to call in the image clauses you just know they have in all their contracts and pull their names from the MWR cars as loudly and publicly as possible. It would be a lot better positive press for them than anything they would gain from being on the hood of a Chase driver, at this point, and I would just love to see a championship contender forced to wear the blank hood of shame.
 
2013-09-09 06:39:17 PM
I don't expect NASCAR to fine Bowyer or Vickers, it was a team call. Anyone would do it as they do not want to lose their ride.  I would, however, fine MWR at least half of the bonus money they get from Truex finishing above 13th spot. I would possibly fine a percentage of Bowyer's as well.

Another possibility would be to fine and suspend Ty Norris for the remainder of the season and a $500,000 fine for MWR.
 
2013-09-09 06:40:10 PM

Mi-5: wxboy: If you're going to have driver teams, why wouldn't you expect this sort of thing?

I fail to see the outrage.  NASCAR, like Formula 1, is a TEAM SPORT.  It is inherent in racing teams that if a driver in your team has the best shot at the championship, the other driver(s) support him  and maximize his points haul.  If that means moving over for him at the last corner (Barrichello for Schumacher Austria 2002), or being told "Alonso is faster than you.  Can you acknowledge" (Massa being told by his race engineer to basically move his ass over for Fernando Alonso) or being told to maintian position (LeMans.  you pick the year and teams have been ordered to hold station until the end to ensure all cars finished, even when one car was clearly faster than their teammates').

I'm surprised NASCAR fans are outraged.  They do realize that the term "got the call" had its genesis in NASCAR, and was famously brought to public attention when Dale Earnhardt won that highly improbably Daytona 500, when it certainly looked like he was nowhere near the fastest guy on track.  Earnhardt even admitted as such to a reporter from Racer Magazine back in the day.


You're saying the *entire field* moved aside as some kind of conspiracy to let Dale win?

Also, Daytona is plate racing, where a lot more than speed matters.
 
2013-09-09 06:42:51 PM

LongWindedMute: Bah, I don't really expect NASCAR to do anything effective, because, let's face it, when have they ever?


When have they ever?  They place people on "probation" all the time.

/WTF does "probation" even mean in NASCAR?
 
2013-09-09 06:50:45 PM

downstairs: LongWindedMute: Bah, I don't really expect NASCAR to do anything effective, because, let's face it, when have they ever?

When have they ever?  They place people on "probation" all the time.

/WTF does "probation" even mean in NASCAR?


Probation = Don't do anything else or we'll really fark you up.

I seem to remember Chad Knaus being suspended for several races a few years ago. Also Mark Martin being penalized in points at the very end of the 2002 (?) season because they found a spring that was something like 1/3 of a coil too long, even though he was a championship contender. Also, MWR's jet-fuel incident. And let us not forget "every time a driver swears in a post-race interview or slugs someone."

TL;DR- All the farking time.
 
2013-09-09 06:54:08 PM

downstairs: LongWindedMute: Bah, I don't really expect NASCAR to do anything effective, because, let's face it, when have they ever?

When have they ever?  They place people on "probation" all the time.

/WTF does "probation" even mean in NASCAR?


They came down pretty damned hard on KyBu a few years back when he speared Hornaday (I think it was Hornaday). Chad Knaus has had his balls slapped pretty hard a couple times over the years. KuBu as well, but he's feeling much better now, really he is.
 
2013-09-09 07:02:15 PM

bestsportnascar: I don't expect NASCAR to fine Bowyer or Vickers, it was a team call. Anyone would do it as they do not want to lose their ride.  I would, however, fine MWR at least half of the bonus money they get from Truex finishing above 13th spot. I would possibly fine a percentage of Bowyer's as well.

Another possibility would be to fine and suspend Ty Norris for the remainder of the season and a $500,000 fine for MWR.


The problem is, this is a multi-million dollar team. Even a half-million dollar fine is nothing to them.

Yanking them out of the Chase, however, is. That should be standard punishment for something like this. Fix a race, and you are automatically out of the top 12. Doesn't matter at what point you do it, or how many wins you have, or whether your attempt was successful or not. Do it, and the highest you can hope for is 13th. No head table for you.
 
2013-09-09 07:05:02 PM
Here's what gets me:

If Jimmie Johnson and dale Earnhardt jr pulled this shiat to get Gordon in the chase people would be fire bombing Hendrick team headquarters until NASCAR suspended both teams indefinitely

Since its MWR? Eh we are just going to act like nothing happened just like when they caught waltrip with an oxygenizer in his air intake 6 years ago...
 
2013-09-09 07:11:25 PM
I started Bowyer on my fantasy team so I hope NASCAR throws the book at MWR.

/fantasy is serious business
 
2013-09-09 07:14:33 PM

smerfnablin: Here's what gets me:

If Jimmie Johnson and dale Earnhardt jr pulled this shiat to get Gordon in the chase people would be fire bombing Hendrick team headquarters until NASCAR suspended both teams indefinitely

Since its MWR? Eh we are just going to act like nothing happened just like when they caught waltrip with an oxygenizer in his air intake 6 years ago...


Is your post from opposite land?

Fans (and sometimes Nascar) let Jr. get away with quite a bit. Nascar is already doing an investigation into this incident. Waltrip was penalized for the jet fuel incident.
 
2013-09-09 07:15:50 PM
Is there an actual rule in the books that Nascar can use here, or will they have to whip oit the old "Actions detrimental to stock car racing?"
 
2013-09-09 07:16:33 PM

Clutch2013: bestsportnascar: I don't expect NASCAR to fine Bowyer or Vickers, it was a team call. Anyone would do it as they do not want to lose their ride.  I would, however, fine MWR at least half of the bonus money they get from Truex finishing above 13th spot. I would possibly fine a percentage of Bowyer's as well.

Another possibility would be to fine and suspend Ty Norris for the remainder of the season and a $500,000 fine for MWR.

The problem is, this is a multi-million dollar team. Even a half-million dollar fine is nothing to them.

Yanking them out of the Chase, however, is. That should be standard punishment for something like this. Fix a race, and you are automatically out of the top 12. Doesn't matter at what point you do it, or how many wins you have, or whether your attempt was successful or not. Do it, and the highest you can hope for is 13th. No head table for you.



I agree with you, but it is not something NASCAR will do.  They will most likely suspend Ty Norris for 3 races and a $200,000 fine to MWR.  No fines for individual drivers.  I'm not completely sure they will do anything though. I am a Gordon fan, and I hate it effected his chances, but I do not think Logano should come out and add Jeff in.  Joey took advantage of the circumstances, I would not penalize him for that. I also can't penalize Bowyer unless it can be proved it was his idea.  It is something they talked about before the race obviously, but I still think it has to be viewed as a organizational call.  My view is if Truex or Bowyer win the cup, they should get to keep it, but all the money they gain over 13th should be taken as a fine.  Half of Truex's is a compromise that is a little more reasonable, but still harsh enough to make other teams think about it.
 
2013-09-09 07:17:47 PM
Twitter says Nascar will hold a press conference at 8:15 tonight. I think we know what it's on.
 
2013-09-09 07:25:26 PM

Fireproof: Twitter says Nascar will hold a press conference at 8:15 tonight. I think we know what it's on.


Any idea which channels are airing it?
 
2013-09-09 07:29:05 PM

bestsportnascar: Fireproof: Twitter says Nascar will hold a press conference at 8:15 tonight. I think we know what it's on.

Any idea which channels are airing it?


No idea of specifics, but I'm sure it'll be on SPEE-aww...
 
2013-09-09 07:33:59 PM

Fireproof: smerfnablin: Here's what gets me:

If Jimmie Johnson and dale Earnhardt jr pulled this shiat to get Gordon in the chase people would be fire bombing Hendrick team headquarters until NASCAR suspended both teams indefinitely

Since its MWR? Eh we are just going to act like nothing happened just like when they caught waltrip with an oxygenizer in his air intake 6 years ago...

Is your post from opposite land?

Fans (and sometimes Nascar) let Jr. get away with quite a bit. Nascar is already doing an investigation into this incident. Waltrip was penalized for the jet fuel incident.


They caught Mikey with the unknown substance in his air intake during inspection

Any other team would be facing fines and loss of points just like Jr got for using the wrong color bolts on his rear spoiler the year before...

What did NASCAR do to waltrip? They told him to change the intake

What did the team do? Installed another one with even more of the unknown substance on it

That's when he got penalized
 
2013-09-09 07:37:25 PM
nascarcasm @nascarcasm

Ready for some Monday Night Press Conference! ALL my rowdy friend are coming over to the R&D center!
 
2013-09-09 07:38:36 PM

smerfnablin: Fireproof: smerfnablin: Here's what gets me:

If Jimmie Johnson and dale Earnhardt jr pulled this shiat to get Gordon in the chase people would be fire bombing Hendrick team headquarters until NASCAR suspended both teams indefinitely

Since its MWR? Eh we are just going to act like nothing happened just like when they caught waltrip with an oxygenizer in his air intake 6 years ago...

Is your post from opposite land?

Fans (and sometimes Nascar) let Jr. get away with quite a bit. Nascar is already doing an investigation into this incident. Waltrip was penalized for the jet fuel incident.

They caught Mikey with the unknown substance in his air intake during inspection

Any other team would be facing fines and loss of points just like Jr got for using the wrong color bolts on his rear spoiler the year before...

What did NASCAR do to waltrip? They told him to change the intake

What did the team do? Installed another one with even more of the unknown substance on it

That's when he got penalized


Wow, did not know that particular detail.

Almost makes Waltrip's reaction of "I dunno what idiot put that there, but it wasn't me" almost believable.
 
2013-09-09 07:41:36 PM

Fireproof: Twitter says Nascar will hold a press conference at 8:15 tonight. I think we know what it's on.


There is nothing on the NASCAR twitter feed...

You got a link gmoney?
 
2013-09-09 07:42:52 PM

DanZero: nascarcasm @nascarcasm

Ready for some Monday Night Press Conference! ALL my rowdy friend are coming over to the R&D center!


Ah thank you

Was on the wrong twitter
 
2013-09-09 07:47:06 PM
@JennaFryer 3m
BREAKING: Newman in, Truex out among MWR penalties. 300k MWR fine. All 3 drivers docked 50 points. Ty Norris suspended indefinitely.


/please be true
//please please
 
2013-09-09 07:49:11 PM

smerfnablin: Fireproof: Twitter says Nascar will hold a press conference at 8:15 tonight. I think we know what it's on.

There is nothing on the NASCAR twitter feed...

You got a link gmoney?


https://twitter.com/jim_utter

Mike Helton and Robin Pemberton will meet with the media tonight at 8:15 at the NASCAR R&D Center to discuss Saturday's race
 
2013-09-09 07:50:10 PM

good_2_go: @JennaFryer 3m
BREAKING: Newman in, Truex out among MWR penalties. 300k MWR fine. All 3 drivers docked 50 points. Ty Norris suspended indefinitely.


/please be true
//please please


There is a God

Thank you NASCAR.

You have restored my faith in your sport

Only thing that could make this any better is by saying "we aren't formula 1"
 
2013-09-09 07:52:04 PM

good_2_go: @JennaFryer 3m
BREAKING: Newman in, Truex out among MWR penalties. 300k MWR fine. All 3 drivers docked 50 points. Ty Norris suspended indefinitely.


/please be true
//please please


This
(is huge)
 
2013-09-09 07:53:01 PM
WOW

CONCORD, N.C. (AP) - Ryan Newman is replacing Martin Truex Jr. in the Chase for the Sprint Cup championship as part of NASCAR'S penalties against Michael Waltrip Racing for manipulating the outcome of last weekend's race at Richmond.

Two independent people familiar with the situation described the penalties to The Associated Press on condition of anonymity because NASCAR had yet to announce its decision. The governing body had scheduled a news conference for Monday night.

Michael Waltrip Racing has been fined $300,000, and general manager Ty Norris is suspended indefinitely. Truex, Clint Bowyer and Brian Vickers have been docked 50 points apiece.

The action by NASCAR is a result of Bowyer intentionally spinning with seven laps remaining to bring out a caution with Newman leading Saturday night. Newman was racing Truex for the final spot in the 12-driver Chase field.
 
2013-09-09 07:56:42 PM
I hope espn interrupts Monday night football for this breaking news
 
2013-09-09 07:57:53 PM

smerfnablin: I hope espn interrupts Monday night football for this breaking news


that would be awesome.

But the NFL would throw a shiat fit
 
2013-09-09 07:57:59 PM
NASCAR.com has the link up, but the page isn't active. It confirms Truex is out.
 
2013-09-09 07:58:38 PM
nascarcasm @nascarcasm

Statement from Michael Waltrip: "My wallet hurts."

I bet more than that's gonna hurt
 
2013-09-09 07:59:23 PM
NASCAR Wonka @NASCAR_Wonka

Could be wrong, but I think Bowyer might just want to apply anti-itch cream to his arms before every race from now on.
 
2013-09-09 07:59:57 PM
So let me get this straight: If you're Jeff Gordon and intentionally wreck out a championship contender, timing your "revenge" to when it is most needed by your teammate, you get one race probation.

If you're MWR and you spin your own car out to help a teammate, the heavens open up to smite you.

The lesson is clear: Bowyer and Vickers should have intentionally wrecked Gordon and/or Newman, then claimed petty revenge.
 
2013-09-09 08:00:33 PM

bestsportnascar: NASCAR.com has the link up, but the page isn't active. It confirms Truex is out.


Pretty farking bad to have the main story on your front page 404ing.
 
2013-09-09 08:02:03 PM

Fireproof: bestsportnascar: NASCAR.com has the link up, but the page isn't active. It confirms Truex is out.

Pretty farking bad to have the main story on your front page 404ing.


Now they've taken it off. Posted too soon, perhaps?
 
2013-09-09 08:04:29 PM
Jenna Fryer @JennaFryer

The point deduction does not change Bowyer post Chase re-seeding.
 
2013-09-09 08:04:59 PM

Jensaarai: So let me get this straight: If you're Jeff Gordon and intentionally wreck out a championship contender, timing your "revenge" to when it is most needed by your teammate, you get one race probation.

If you're MWR and you spin your own car out to help a teammate, the heavens open up to smite you.

The lesson is clear: Bowyer and Vickers should have intentionally wrecked Gordon and/or Newman, then claimed petty revenge.


The lesson is "be Jeff Gordon."
 
2013-09-09 08:05:26 PM

DanZero: Jenna Fryer @JennaFryer

The point deduction does not change Bowyer post Chase re-seeding.


LMFAO
 
2013-09-09 08:07:53 PM

PowerSlacker: Throw Bowyer and Truex out of the chase, add Gordon and Newman to the Chase.

Problem solved.


Huge THIS !!   and Vickers didn't have a clue until everything came out....
 
2013-09-09 08:07:59 PM

DanZero: Jenna Fryer @JennaFryer

The point deduction does not change Bowyer post Chase re-seeding.


On RaceHub Dave Despain wanted Clint fined 450 points, guaranteeing he finishes 12th.
 
2013-09-09 08:08:14 PM
I'm wondering if NASCAR is motivated to do this over the fear of losing fans and sponsors...

Or are they afraid drivers would kill eachother on the track enforcing justice?

/I'm guessing money
 
2013-09-09 08:10:59 PM
 
2013-09-09 08:12:09 PM
Espn just put up the story

Excuse the linking on phone:

http://m.espn.go.com/rpm/nascar/story?storyId=9655907
 
2013-09-09 08:13:30 PM

bestsportnascar: http://www.nascar.com/en_us/news-media/articles/2013/09/09/nascar-spr i nt-cup-richmond-penalties-mwr-chase.html


Wow.
 
2013-09-09 08:14:43 PM
@ESPNMcGee
So the car that caused all this still has a chance to win the championship and the one MWR car not in on it is out?

/uh, there are no innocents in this
 
2013-09-09 08:15:24 PM
"MWR was found to have violated Section 12-4 (Actions detrimental to stock car racing). "

CALLED IT!
 
2013-09-09 08:16:20 PM
@dustinlong
Helton said they reviewed video, audio, timing scoring & more and met with MWR officials.


/oh, to have been a fly on that wall
 
2013-09-09 08:16:51 PM
The three crew chiefs - Brian Pattie (No. 15), Scott Miller (No. 55) and Chad Johnston (No. 56) - have all been placed on NASCAR probation until Dec. 31

Well that's a relief. Double secret probation always does the trick.
 
2013-09-09 08:17:12 PM
"As the sport's sanctioning body, it is our responsibility to ensure there is a fair and level playing field for all of our competitors and this action today reflects our commitment to that."

Is this a true statement? Never since I've been following this have i seen such a commitment to this.
 
2013-09-09 08:17:35 PM
Just submitted this for a new thread...

What channel is this on?

I see nothing :(
 
2013-09-09 08:19:00 PM
I have really mixed feelings about Boyer now. You know who else was just following orders?
 
2013-09-09 08:19:11 PM

Fireproof: "MWR was found to have violated Section 12-4 (Actions detrimental to stock car racing). "

CALLED IT!


You would think not racing cars that are stock would be detrimental to stock car racing.
 
2013-09-09 08:20:59 PM

smerfnablin: What channel is this on?


@dustinlong 10m
NASCAR press conference about to start. It is NOT being televised
 
2013-09-09 08:22:33 PM
I just like having a NASCAR thread on Monday Night :D
 
2013-09-09 08:22:53 PM
@dustinlong
Helton on nothing for Jeff Gordon: "We don't react to ripple affect.''
 
2013-09-09 08:24:31 PM
Ok they makes sense (sorta)

They fined all 3 teams after the race so it puts Newman in on points but doesn't hurt bowyer in the chase standings

/I'm sure Gordon will take care of Bowyer's chase standing...
 
2013-09-09 08:24:48 PM
@nascarcasm
The penalty to the #15 will be assessed on track by the #24 car at a time of his choosing.
 
2013-09-09 08:24:55 PM
So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.
 
2013-09-09 08:29:25 PM
nascarcasm @nascarcasm 9m

"The penalty to the #15 will be assessed on track by the #24 car at a time of his choosing."
 
2013-09-09 08:30:01 PM

Jensaarai: So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.


I am really surprised that they pulled him out of the chase.
 
2013-09-09 08:30:12 PM

DanZero: I just like having a NASCAR thread on Monday Night :D


Just you wait until you see the "Chase Buddha"
 
2013-09-09 08:30:25 PM

good_2_go: @nascarcasm
The penalty to the #15 will be assessed on track by the #24 car at a time of his choosing.


doh!
 
2013-09-09 08:31:28 PM
Wow NASCAR just gave Gordon a green light to go after bowyer on the track for screwing him over...

I'm ok with this
 
2013-09-09 08:32:27 PM
ESPN News channel is discussing it now on Sportscenter.
 
2013-09-09 08:33:36 PM
This whole clusterfark is simply one more example of why having a playoff system is dumb for motorsports.
 
2013-09-09 08:33:38 PM

Jensaarai: So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.


Ooh! Haven't gotten to use one of these in a while!

i.imgur.com
 
2013-09-09 08:34:08 PM

crotchgrabber: DanZero: I just like having a NASCAR thread on Monday Night :D

Just you wait until you see the "Chase Buddha"


Can I propose a seize fire on the 48 please?

At least for the next 10 races all power idols and glowing buddas should be targeting the 15!

Bowyer needs to feel the power
 
2013-09-09 08:34:32 PM

crotchgrabber: Jensaarai: So let me get this straight: If you're Jeff Gordon and intentionally wreck out a championship contender, timing your "revenge" to when it is most needed by your teammate, you get one race probation.

If you're MWR and you spin your own car out to help a teammate, the heavens open up to smite you.

The lesson is clear: Bowyer and Vickers should have intentionally wrecked Gordon and/or Newman, then claimed petty revenge.

The lesson is "be Jeff Gordon."


IOKIYAG?

smerfnablin: Wow NASCAR just gave Gordon a green light to go after bowyer on the track for screwing him over...

I'm ok with this


Yup. I guess so.
 
2013-09-09 08:37:32 PM

Jensaarai: So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.


Because showing a little courtesy and doing the aforementioned is exactly the same thing as ordering one of your drivers, over open channels, to spin his car out to draw a caution and another driver to pit and then subsequently run laps 50 mph slower than anyone else out there.

If anything, MWR still got off light.  Bowyer should be sitting on the outside as well, and all three should get a time out for this weekend.

I'm a little anxious to see how the sponsors react.  If this is as much of a big deal to them as Smoke said it was, I'm eagerly awaiting the reports of NAPA, 5-Hour Energy and Aaron's either going "FARK YOU, we're out" or "Get your farking house in order by this date, or we're gone."
 
2013-09-09 08:40:37 PM
@dmcnulty12
So Ty Norris falls on his sword and Michael Waltrip will get to use his TV pulpit to spin himself some new clothes..
 
2013-09-09 08:40:50 PM

DanZero: smerfnablin: I hope espn interrupts Monday night football for this breaking news

that would be awesome.

But the NFL would throw a shiat fit


They had a "BREAKING NEWS" scroll at the bottom of the screen about it.
 
2013-09-09 08:43:47 PM

Fireproof: Jensaarai: So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.

Ooh! Haven't gotten to use one of these in a while!

[i.imgur.com image 500x75]


You're missing which action I think is more extreme.

/intentionally wrecking someone else
 
2013-09-09 08:44:17 PM

smerfnablin: crotchgrabber: DanZero: I just like having a NASCAR thread on Monday Night :D

Just you wait until you see the "Chase Buddha"

Can I propose a seize fire on the 48 please?

At least for the next 10 races all power idols and glowing buddas should be targeting the 15!

Bowyer needs to feel the power


But I worked really hard on this one for like... a minute and a half. It took me almost a whole beer to come up with the idea.
 
2013-09-09 08:45:53 PM

Clutch2013: Jensaarai: So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.

Because showing a little courtesy and doing the aforementioned is exactly the same thing as ordering one of your drivers, over open channels, to spin his car out to draw a caution and another driver to pit and then subsequently run laps 50 mph slower than anyone else out there.

If anything, MWR still got off light.  Bowyer should be sitting on the outside as well, and all three should get a time out for this weekend.

I'm a little anxious to see how the sponsors react.  If this is as much of a big deal to them as Smoke said it was, I'm eagerly awaiting the reports of NAPA, 5-Hour Energy and Aaron's either going "FARK YOU, we're out" or "Get your farking house in order by this date, or we're gone."


One of the articles pointe out sponsors pay millions to teams for each driver that makes the chase

Napa gets to put their checkbook away and in pretty sure Mikey is going to have issues getting sponsors when these contracts are up...

I think the 55 is locked in but the limited race schedule 56 might be pressed for dollars next year
 
2013-09-09 08:54:02 PM

crotchgrabber: DanZero: I just like having a NASCAR thread on Monday Night :D

Just you wait until you see the "Chase Buddha"


Yay, Chase Buddha!

All Hail Chase Buddha!
 
2013-09-09 08:54:48 PM
Michael Waltrip @mw55

This wasn't a master plan or about a spin. It's about a split-second decision made by Ty to try to help a teammate. I stand by my people

images.wikia.com
 
2013-09-09 08:56:09 PM

DanZero: Michael Waltrip @mw55
This wasn't a master plan or about a spin. It's about a split-second decision made by Ty to try to help a teammate. I stand by my people


Pants on fire much?
 
2013-09-09 08:56:45 PM
@nateryan
The takeaway from the Michael Waltrip tweet: Ty Norris is our Lee Harvey Oswald.
 
2013-09-09 08:57:13 PM
ESPN just aired a tweet from Gordon. He's pissed.
 
2013-09-09 09:00:06 PM
Wow.
NASCAR did something almost right. They should have made it a 13 car chase field and let Gordon in because of Vicker's pitting at the end of the race intentionally screwed him.
 
2013-09-09 09:00:23 PM

DanZero: Michael Waltrip @mw55

This wasn't a master plan or about a spin. It's about a split-second decision made by Ty to try to help a teammate. I stand by my people


Utter pinnochio.

Two teams, *at the same time*, making changes that change the landscape.

Sorry, but that is fresher bs than what's in the field.

Also, Gordon is being very classy about all this. Best to him...
 
2013-09-09 09:01:48 PM
They take away driver points and a chase spot from the one guy on the team who didn't appear to be in on it (but was the beneficiary), while giving the guy who was behind the biggest, most dangerous, and most shameful a slap on the wrist that's functionally worthless.

NASCAR clearly doesn't understand or care why fans were truly angry here, they just threw out the most easily token penalty they could muster to beg fans to shut up. One of the blackest days in the history of the sport.
 
2013-09-09 09:02:05 PM

Clutch2013: ESPN just aired a tweet from Gordon. He's pissed.


I liked the anchor's response.

"Three question marks. That's a lot of characters."
 
2013-09-09 09:04:40 PM

smerfnablin: Fine Bowyer 100 points for being a douchebag and costing Newman the lead

Fine Vickers 50 points for that pit stop just to let Logano pass him to knock the 24 out of 10th spot

Suspend both of their crew chiefs 6 races

And finally ban Michael Waltrip from ever driving in a Sprint Cup event ever again for his classless comments Saturday AND Sunday


link to comments? Or better yet just surmise it real quick? been a crazy work week...
 
2013-09-09 09:04:56 PM
Mark my words: Bowyer wins the Chase.
 
2013-09-09 09:05:08 PM
fark Michael waltrip

Fox and napa need to fire his ass

Jeff Gordon needs to put Bowyer in the wall then punch Mikey in the mouth
 
2013-09-09 09:06:44 PM
Nascar Memes @NascarMemes

Truex's reaction at home.

pbs.twimg.com
 
2013-09-09 09:08:14 PM

rubertidom: smerfnablin: Fine Bowyer 100 points for being a douchebag and costing Newman the lead

Fine Vickers 50 points for that pit stop just to let Logano pass him to knock the 24 out of 10th spot

Suspend both of their crew chiefs 6 races

And finally ban Michael Waltrip from ever driving in a Sprint Cup event ever again for his classless comments Saturday AND Sunday

link to comments? Or better yet just surmise it real quick? been a crazy work week...


Saturday when asked about how the 55 made the chase he said truex has really great teammates

Sunday when he was quoted and asked to explain he knew nothing, couldn't explain the context, then said no comment

It was like they asked him to comment on finding him in bed with a transvestite hooker
 
2013-09-09 09:08:57 PM

zanysatsuma: Mark my words: Bowyer wins the Chase.


Clint's going to have trouble finishing every race.

/nudge nudge
//wink wink
 
2013-09-09 09:09:36 PM

smerfnablin: fark Michael waltrip

Fox and napa need to fire his ass

Jeff Gordon needs to put Bowyer in the wall then punch Mikey in the mouth


With not much to race for, I'm sure there will be a few people looking for retribution on MWRs cars this weekend. NASCAR may have cleaned up their image in the past decade, but at heart there's still a lot of drivers, owners, crew chiefs, officials, and spotters that are good ole southern boys that don't take too kindly to that kind of bullshiat.

/ wouldn't be surprised if some MWR cars get really hassled at tech
// possibly even fail inspection.
 
2013-09-09 09:12:11 PM
NAPA No (way you're getting in the chase any) How

/expect less NAPA ads next year
 
2013-09-09 09:13:06 PM

smerfnablin: Clutch2013: Jensaarai: So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.

Because showing a little courtesy and doing the aforementioned is exactly the same thing as ordering one of your drivers, over open channels, to spin his car out to draw a caution and another driver to pit and then subsequently run laps 50 mph slower than anyone else out there.

If anything, MWR still got off light.  Bowyer should be sitting on the outside as well, and all three should get a time out for this weekend.

I'm a little anxious to see how the sponsors react.  If this is as much of a big deal to them as Smoke said it was, I'm eagerly awaiting the reports of NAPA, 5-Hour Energy and Aaron's either going "FARK YOU, we're out" or "Get your farking house in order by this date, or we're gone."

One of the articles pointe out sponsors pay millions to teams for each driver that makes the chase

Napa gets to put their checkbook away and in pretty sure Mikey is going to have issues getting sponsors when these contracts are up...

I think the 55 is locked in but the limited race schedule 56 might be pressed for dollars next year


Toyota is HATING this, "honor" is HUGE to the Japs. They may very well kick Mikey to the curb now, it's no secret that this is really their house team anyways.
 
2013-09-09 09:13:58 PM

smerfnablin: Jeff Gordon needs to put Bowyer in the wall then punch Mikey in the mouth


He should wait until it benefits his teammates though like he did last year. ;)
 
2013-09-09 09:17:09 PM
Congrats Newman

pbs.twimg.com
 
2013-09-09 09:19:40 PM

DanZero: Congrats Newman

[pbs.twimg.com image 599x602]


I loled.

Will LOL again.
 
2013-09-09 09:21:56 PM

DanZero: Congrats Newman

[pbs.twimg.com image 599x602]


I was waiting for that.  Good work.

I've been listening to the NASCAR channel on Sirius/XM all day, and Dave Moody made a good point (before the penalty was announced).  He said he feels bad for Bowyer, as he was given direct (indirect) orders to spin.  He had no choice.  You could tell from his tone that he didn't want to, but knew he had to.

I also feel horrible for Truex.  I believe he was truly innocent in all of this.  But all that being said, congrats to Newman.

Of course, Kyle Petty compared everyone at MWR to the 1919 Chicago Black Sox and said whatever penalty NASCAR dished out wasn't severe enough.  Yeah...
 
2013-09-09 09:23:07 PM
Fifty points from Boyerdoor..
 
2013-09-09 09:25:31 PM

DanZero: Congrats Newman


NASCAR should do just that...

Bad photoshop skills and all
 
2013-09-09 09:25:50 PM

smerfnablin: rubertidom: smerfnablin: Fine Bowyer 100 points for being a douchebag and costing Newman the lead

Fine Vickers 50 points for that pit stop just to let Logano pass him to knock the 24 out of 10th spot

Suspend both of their crew chiefs 6 races

And finally ban Michael Waltrip from ever driving in a Sprint Cup event ever again for his classless comments Saturday AND Sunday

link to comments? Or better yet just surmise it real quick? been a crazy work week...

Saturday when asked about how the 55 made the chase he said truex has really great teammates

Sunday when he was quoted and asked to explain he knew nothing, couldn't explain the context, then said no comment

It was like they asked him to comment on finding him in bed with a transvestite hooker


Thank you
 
2013-09-09 09:26:24 PM

smerfnablin: DanZero: Congrats Newman

NASCAR should do just that...

Bad photoshop skills and all


That was Nascarcasm's bad skills
 
2013-09-09 09:26:56 PM
Called it. (Though I said 250k)
 
2013-09-09 09:31:02 PM
nascarcasm @nascarcasm

Congrats to Newman, who got a job, a Chase berth, and a free Bloomin' Onion on what will go down in history as "Least sh-tty Monday ever."
 
2013-09-09 09:32:07 PM
I am glad NASCAR reviewed all of the info and booted Truex out. I think the sponsors will be PISSED and the additional punishment against MWR'S will be in ways that aren't so obvious to the casual observer. And I am really glad Newman is in. He earned that right.
 
2013-09-09 09:32:25 PM
Contrarian tendencies aside, I think NASCAR came the closest it has to making a "right call" tonight that I can remember.

I just don't know if it'll be enough to truly curtail the long ignored growing cancer that is team orders. As technical restrictions tighten more and more in the coming years, I fear we will only have an increase on track shenanigans, both in frequency and scale. Guys like Hendrick and Roush will just become more clever about it like they did in F1 when it was still widely practiced but technically illegal. More code words, intentionally blown motors, and even false "rivalries" to cover taking out competitors are all in the future of the sport, I fear.
 
2013-09-09 09:33:20 PM

soopey: Wow.
NASCAR did something almost right. They should have made it a 13 car chase field and let Gordon in because of Vicker's pitting at the end of the race intentionally screwed him.


I'd have had no problem if Bowyer had been tossed from the Chase and Gordon let in as another Wild Card.

the biggest redneck here: Toyota is HATING this, "honor" is HUGE to the Japs.


I am glad you put that in caps, because Japanese leadership (see: Pride Fighting, TEPCO, etc) seems to only care, these days, when their dishonor becomes public.
 
2013-09-09 09:34:15 PM
Err, quotations, not caps.

Anywho, yes, this shouldn't fly well with them. Now, if Ferrari were in NASCAR... fuggeddaboutit!
 
2013-09-09 09:37:37 PM

vegaswench: Of course, Kyle Petty compared everyone at MWR to the 1919 Chicago Black Sox and said whatever penalty NASCAR dished out wasn't severe enough. Yeah...


For a number of reasons, I think he's absolutely right.

I'd rather every athlete ever take as many PEDs as possible than intentionally fix results (or be involved in said fixing).

Leave that crap to the occasional Super Bowl ref or World Series ump, or the BCS.
 
2013-09-09 09:37:47 PM
They should have just parked MWR for the remainder of the year.  No fines, no suspensions, no point deductions - just a BIG "think about this until we go to Daytona next year."
 
2013-09-09 09:38:21 PM
@dustinlong
Michael Waltrip Racing announces it will NOT appeal penalties.
 
2013-09-09 09:42:29 PM

good_2_go: @dustinlong
Michael Waltrip Racing announces it will NOT appeal penalties.


Also, MWR just released this statement:

What occurred on the No. 55 radio at the end of Saturday night's race in Richmond was a split-second decision made by team spotter Ty Norris to bring the No. 55 to pit lane and help a teammate earn a place in the Chase.  We apologize to NASCAR, our fellow competitors, partners and fans who were disappointed in our actions.  We will learn from this & move on.
 
2013-09-09 09:43:50 PM

vegaswench: good_2_go: @dustinlong
Michael Waltrip Racing announces it will NOT appeal penalties.

Also, MWR just released this statement:

What occurred on the No. 55 radio at the end of Saturday night's race in Richmond was a split-second decision made by team spotter Ty Norris to bring the No. 55 to pit lane and help a teammate earn a place in the Chase.  We apologize to NASCAR, our fellow competitors, partners and fans who were disappointed in our actions.  We will learn from this & move on.


And yet, nothing about the 15. Fu*k them.
 
2013-09-09 09:44:32 PM

good_2_go: @dustinlong
Michael Waltrip Racing announces it will NOT appeal penalties.


Toyota's call.
 
2013-09-09 09:45:06 PM
As an aside, isn't it weird how Twitter has taken over as the place for news instead of radio and TV?  The accuracy of most of it is to be taken with a grain of salt, of course, but if you had told me that five years ago we would be getting our news from Twitter instead of news websites, I would have thought you were nuts.  Yet, here we are.  Retweeting news into a news aggregate.
 
2013-09-09 09:45:20 PM

smerfnablin: fark Michael waltrip


Jeff Gordon needs to put Bowyer in the wall then punch Mikey in the mouth


He can't reach that high....
 
2013-09-09 09:46:14 PM

the biggest redneck here: And yet, nothing about the 15. Fu*k them.


It wasn't Clint's spin that brought about the penalty...

@JennaFryer
Helton: "There's not conclusive evidence that the spin was intentional. There's a lot of chatter, but we didn't see any conclusive evidence

@dustinlong
Helton said the "most clear piece of evidence'' of MWR"s actions was the radio conversation on Vickers' channel.
 
2013-09-09 09:49:26 PM

good_2_go: the biggest redneck here: And yet, nothing about the 15. Fu*k them.

It wasn't Clint's spin that brought about the penalty...

@JennaFryer
Helton: "There's not conclusive evidence that the spin was intentional. There's a lot of chatter, but we didn't see any conclusive evidence

@dustinlong
Helton said the "most clear piece of evidence'' of MWR"s actions was the radio conversation on Vickers' channel.


That's ridiculous.
 
2013-09-09 09:56:29 PM
Random question :

Is waltrip going to be driving the 55 at talladega?

If so Gordon is going to have a very busy day

/might need to buy tickets
//can bring power idol if you want me to rub it on the 15 or 18
 
2013-09-09 09:57:45 PM

vegaswench: As an aside, isn't it weird how Twitter has taken over as the place for news instead of radio and TV?  The accuracy of most of it is to be taken with a grain of salt, of course, but if you had told me that five years ago we would be getting our news from Twitter instead of news websites, I would have thought you were nuts.  Yet, here we are.  Retweeting news into a news aggregate.


No problems with me. They got the news (and the laughs) a lot more right on than a lot of news outlets.
 
2013-09-09 09:58:08 PM
As long as that assclown Mike Helton is in a position of authority within the sport, NASCAR will continue to slide further into absurdity and eventual irrelevancy in a cycle of self-inflicted destruction.

/Done.
 
2013-09-09 10:01:31 PM
Bowyer was penalized and still had the points to make the Chase, I don't see why he should be booted. Besides, it's going to be farking hilarious watching him get wrecked at some point in the final races. I do think they should have made an exception and added Gordon.
 
2013-09-09 10:06:13 PM
 
2013-09-09 10:09:09 PM

smerfnablin: Random question :

Is waltrip going to be driving the 55 at talladega?

If so Gordon is going to have a very busy day

/might need to buy tickets
//can bring power idol if you want me to rub it on the 15 or 18


That was the original plan...he may re-think that.
 
2013-09-09 10:09:53 PM
Absolute horseshiat! I wonder if they forgot (how conveniently) that every "start and park" car entered also "manipulates the finishing order" by taking up the lower points spots so that someone who wrecks early won't lose as many points as they could have if all the cars actually tried to finish the race.

Not to mention JJ (running 40th many laps down) hit the wall to bring out a yellow so Jeffy wouldn't get lapped. Gordon intentionally took out Boyer last year during the chase and didn't get penalized, doesn't that "alter the outcome of a race?" (Boyer was still in contention for the championship when Gordon took him out.)

And to think everytime they run Talladega and Daytona the announcers talk about "team plans" to work together, or with drivers who are in the same make of car...and that isn't "altering the outcome"?

Helton got one thing right...they can't prove Boyer spun deliberately. He said he thought he was losing a tire, and he did. Unless you hit something and turn the sheet metal in, not very damned often do you manage to shred a tire by flat-spotting it on a short track. Yet Boyer shredded his.

I think NASCAR is running a distraction for the fact they completely blew the last restart on Friday and Saturday night's races. Edwards jumped the start and didn't get penalized for it. If they'd penalized him Newman might have had a chance to win it still...despite his crap pit crew, now residing under the bus. If they yellow flagged it again and sent him to back of the line, how would the results have changed point wise?

They need to get back to racing, not "lucky dogs" and "chases" to try to liven up dull races.

A lot of folks are talking about how other sports have "cleaned up"...bah! How may times can someone fake an injury in football to get an official's time out, sit out a play and return?

If they are going to do a "chase" make it to where the "wild cards" can't be manipulated...top 10 in points, plus anyone in top 20 who wins a race, period. NASCAR is more guilty of "actions detrimental to the sport" than any of the teams and drivers.
 
2013-09-09 10:10:18 PM
How the meeting played out in my mind...

Brian France as Walter:
"Over the line!"
"This is a league race, this determines who enters the next phase of the chase"
"This isn't Nam, this is racing and there are rules!"
"Mark his points zero!"

If he pulled a gun on waltrip I think he could run for president ...
 
2013-09-09 10:13:41 PM

uncleacid: After all the fake debris cautions during the season and Boyer's spin, I just have one thing to say. I'm ready for some football.


Thanks NASCAR, football can wait.
 
2013-09-09 10:17:53 PM
And the real one that gets me...in what other sport do you have a "playoff" where all the other teams also get to run interference? You want a real tight playoff? Send all the other teams home for the winter and race only the chase teams...now you can only lose a race by 13-14 points or so, and the standings will remain tight throughout the playoff. (Please Gawd, don't let Helton see this post, it might give him bad ideas.)
 
2013-09-09 10:29:55 PM
Can't believe a new thread didnt go green yet

Are the mods not entertained?
 
2013-09-09 11:11:02 PM

HamstersFromHell: Absolute horseshiat! I wonder if they forgot (how conveniently) that every "start and park" car entered also "manipulates the finishing order" by taking up the lower points spots so that someone who wrecks early won't lose as many points as they could have if all the cars actually tried to finish the race.

Not to mention JJ (running 40th many laps down) hit the wall to bring out a yellow so Jeffy wouldn't get lapped. Gordon intentionally took out Boyer last year during the chase and didn't get penalized, doesn't that "alter the outcome of a race?" (Boyer was still in contention for the championship when Gordon took him out.)

And to think everytime they run Talladega and Daytona the announcers talk about "team plans" to work together, or with drivers who are in the same make of car...and that isn't "altering the outcome"?

Helton got one thing right...they can't prove Boyer spun deliberately. He said he thought he was losing a tire, and he did. Unless you hit something and turn the sheet metal in, not very damned often do you manage to shred a tire by flat-spotting it on a short track. Yet Boyer shredded his.

I think NASCAR is running a distraction for the fact they completely blew the last restart on Friday and Saturday night's races. Edwards jumped the start and didn't get penalized for it. If they'd penalized him Newman might have had a chance to win it still...despite his crap pit crew, now residing under the bus. If they yellow flagged it again and sent him to back of the line, how would the results have changed point wise?

They need to get back to racing, not "lucky dogs" and "chases" to try to liven up dull races.

A lot of folks are talking about how other sports have "cleaned up"...bah! How may times can someone fake an injury in football to get an official's time out, sit out a play and return?

If they are going to do a "chase" make it to where the "wild cards" can't be manipulated...top 10 in points, plus anyone in top 20 who wins a race, period. NASCAR is more guilty of "actions detrimental to the sport" than any of the teams and drivers.


Bowyer did shred a tire...after the fact. And it was his right front. Tell me, when was the last time losing a right front lead to a tail-happy condition and spin?

I don't think they wanted to waste any more time building up such a case that would have broken the blatant "code" Brian Pattie used (even though they should have), especially when they had Ty Norris and the 55 dead to rights with their equally or more blatant BS.
 
2013-09-10 12:17:10 AM

Clutch2013: I don't think they wanted to waste any more time building up such a case that would have broken the blatant "code" Brian Pattie used (even though they should have), especially when they had Ty Norris and the 55 dead to rights with their equally or more blatant BS.


And so we should have penalized JJ for the times this season he's let Gordon pass him to lead a lap for a point? Or Busch for allowing Kenseth...or vice-versa? Might as well face it, "team orders" have been in play ever since there was the first 2 (or more) car teams. This was no different (though more "in your face") than anything nearly every other competitive team has done, and will continue to do.

If NASCAR would uphold their own damn rules, Edwards would have been penalized for jumping the restart and the race outcome could have been different.

Now put your tinfoil hats on folks, but did you notice.that out of all the teams with drivers on the bubble EVERY SINGLE DRIVER for the contending teams finished BEHIND their driver on the bubble? All MWR drivers finished behind Truex, all Hendrick drivers finished behind Gordon, Martin finished behind Newman and Logano was behind BK. Coincidence or subtle team playing to get their drivers in the chase?

And yeah, Boyer did shred the tire...but prove he spun deliberately. He had already said prior to his "orders" that the car wasn't right. And yes, you can spin a car with a RF tire going down, if you jerk the wheel and slam the brakes to keep it from going straight for the wall. Jr. commented Boyer was riding the brakes and weaving....hell, on a short track, just flooring it in the turn would have spun him, no need for the theatrics..
 
2013-09-10 12:31:34 AM
i just suspect that bowyer will have to spin it again...because a tire is going down and take out Kasey Kahne.
 
2013-09-10 12:59:03 AM

HamstersFromHell: Clutch2013: I don't think they wanted to waste any more time building up such a case that would have broken the blatant "code" Brian Pattie used (even though they should have), especially when they had Ty Norris and the 55 dead to rights with their equally or more blatant BS.

And so we should have penalized JJ for the times this season he's let Gordon pass him to lead a lap for a point? Or Busch for allowing Kenseth...or vice-versa? Might as well face it, "team orders" have been in play ever since there was the first 2 (or more) car teams. This was no different (though more "in your face") than anything nearly every other competitive team has done, and will continue to do.

If NASCAR would uphold their own damn rules, Edwards would have been penalized for jumping the restart and the race outcome could have been different.

Now put your tinfoil hats on folks, but did you notice.that out of all the teams with drivers on the bubble EVERY SINGLE DRIVER for the contending teams finished BEHIND their driver on the bubble? All MWR drivers finished behind Truex, all Hendrick drivers finished behind Gordon, Martin finished behind Newman and Logano was behind BK. Coincidence or subtle team playing to get their drivers in the chase?

And yeah, Boyer did shred the tire...but prove he spun deliberately. He had already said prior to his "orders" that the car wasn't right. And yes, you can spin a car with a RF tire going down, if you jerk the wheel and slam the brakes to keep it from going straight for the wall. Jr. commented Boyer was riding the brakes and weaving....hell, on a short track, just flooring it in the turn would have spun him, no need for the theatrics..


Like I said earlier in this topic, that has fark all to do with what happened Saturday night.  If you have evidence that any other team out there was given orders to spin their cars deliberately or bring their cars in to pit for inexplicable reasons, and then turn laps way off race pace, please, by all means.  Post it.

That you believe anything Bowyer says after his in-car audio/video and that half-assed interview he gave after the race is...laughable, to be kind.  Two laps go by with no weaving whatsoever, and then he loops it, with no warning, from a right front.  "But you can spin it if--"  If you're driving like a farking moron.  You're telling me that a supposedly championship-caliber driver gets a flat at one of the slower points on the racetrack, and his first move is to slam on brakes.  While in traffic.
 
2013-09-10 01:50:16 AM

Clutch2013: HamstersFromHell: Clutch2013: I don't think they wanted to waste any more time building up such a case that would have broken the blatant "code" Brian Pattie used (even though they should have), especially when they had Ty Norris and the 55 dead to rights with their equally or more blatant BS.

And so we should have penalized JJ for the times this season he's let Gordon pass him to lead a lap for a point? Or Busch for allowing Kenseth...or vice-versa? Might as well face it, "team orders" have been in play ever since there was the first 2 (or more) car teams. This was no different (though more "in your face") than anything nearly every other competitive team has done, and will continue to do.

If NASCAR would uphold their own damn rules, Edwards would have been penalized for jumping the restart and the race outcome could have been different.

Now put your tinfoil hats on folks, but did you notice.that out of all the teams with drivers on the bubble EVERY SINGLE DRIVER for the contending teams finished BEHIND their driver on the bubble? All MWR drivers finished behind Truex, all Hendrick drivers finished behind Gordon, Martin finished behind Newman and Logano was behind BK. Coincidence or subtle team playing to get their drivers in the chase?

And yeah, Boyer did shred the tire...but prove he spun deliberately. He had already said prior to his "orders" that the car wasn't right. And yes, you can spin a car with a RF tire going down, if you jerk the wheel and slam the brakes to keep it from going straight for the wall. Jr. commented Boyer was riding the brakes and weaving....hell, on a short track, just flooring it in the turn would have spun him, no need for the theatrics..

Like I said earlier in this topic, that has fark all to do with what happened Saturday night.  If you have evidence that any other team out there was given orders to spin their cars deliberately or bring their cars in to pit for inexplicable reasons, and then turn laps way off race pace, please, b ...


We have telemetry, we have the video, we have observations from the car behind.  All tend to point to an intentional act to spin rather than a uncontrollable blowout.  Maybe it was a tire going down, maybe not.  It sure as hell was very convenient for him to lose that tire in that area where he spins, doesn't hit anything, with a few laps left on a night where tires weren't really an issue.

As far as the allowing team members to lead or get a lap back (slowing up under yellow cars would race back to the line to get a lap back) those are traditional acts that have existed for a long time.  They are traditionally done mid race, rather than at the end of the race.  Placing those events in the same category as what happened on Saturday is comparing apples to oranges.

I agree that Carl Edwards jumped the start and should have been penalized.  It was a blown call. However it is difficult to remedy that after the race. It is interesting that the finishing order was that way across all wildcard teams.  The difference was that MWR was overly meddling with the order while the other teams had either made arrangements prior to the race or had better coded phrases to implement that way. The message sent by hitting MWR hard hopefully will fire a warning shot to Hendrick's, Roush, and others on what will not be tolerated.  It sets a precedent that hopefully will prevent the team orders practice from escalating.

I hope Hendrick's has some expendable cars he can have Jeff Gordon play with for the next few weeks.
 
2013-09-10 01:54:19 AM
HamstersFromHell:

1) The Chase isn't going anywhere.  If you don't like it, then fine.  Jimmie Johnson finished with the most points. He's your champion, go watch football. (Yes, I know he didn't, but if it mattered he would have.)

2) There issue isn't so much with the team tanking points.  They really don't care about that.  It's the tanking of points that backs up the claim that they wrecked intentionally not only changing the race, but putting drivers (and spectators) at risk with a deliberate act.

3) Bowyer did it.  Even MWR isn't denying it or contesting the penalty

.HamstersFromHell: (Please Gawd, don't let Helton see this post, it might give him bad ideas.)

Okay, on that we agree.
 
2013-09-10 02:01:34 AM

Daedalus27: If NASCAR would uphold their own damn rules, Edwards would have been penalized for jumping the restart and the race outcome could have been different.

Now put your tinfoil hats on folks, but did you notice.that out of all the teams with drivers on the bubble EVERY SINGLE DRIVER for the contending teams finished BEHIND their driver on the bubble? All MWR drivers finished behind Truex, all Hendrick drivers finished behind Gordon, Martin finished behind Newman and Logano was behind BK. Coincidence or subtle team playing to get their drivers in the chase?

And yeah, Boyer did shred the tire...but prove he spun deliberately. He had already said prior to his "orders" that the car wasn't right. And yes, you can spin a car with a RF tire going down, if you jerk the wheel and slam the brakes to keep it from going straight for the wall. Jr. commented Boyer was riding the brakes and weaving....hell, on a short track, just flooring it in the turn would have spun him, no need for the theatrics..

Like I said earlier in this topic, that has fark all to do with what happened Saturday night.  If you have evidence that any other team out there was given orders to spin their cars deliberately or bring their cars in to pit for inexplicable reasons, and then turn laps way off race pac ...


Agreed, except on one point.   Even Menard said that he spun the tires (Remember he didn't change left sides.) on the restart (and may have made contact with the 99).  I'd go as far to say that if Edwards had braked at that point some of the cars behind them would have gotten squeezed (see Atlanta one week ago).

Understandable that no one was paying attention to Paul Menard or anything he said after that race.
 
2013-09-10 02:12:36 AM

Jensaarai: So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.


I'm disappointed, Jensaarai. I generally consider you to be smarter than that.

Letting a teammate lead a lap/pulling over to let a teammate back on the lead lap is  completely differentfrom DELIBERATELY manipulating the outcome of the Chase slotting by deliberately manipulating on-track results through team orders. F1 doesn't tolerate that crap, and now NASCAR has made it clear they won't either.
 
2013-09-10 02:22:27 AM

zanysatsuma: They take away driver points and a chase spot from the one guy on the team who didn't appear to be in on it (but was the beneficiary), while giving the guy who was behind the biggest, most dangerous, and most shameful a slap on the wrist that's functionally worthless.

NASCAR clearly doesn't understand or care why fans were truly angry here, they just threw out the most easily token penalty they could muster to beg fans to shut up. One of the blackest days in the history of the sport.


It's not as black and white as you'd like it to be.

Brian Vickers was obviously not in on it until Ty Norris told him to pit(at which point he was confused, and he was punished with a loss of owner/driver points as well. Martin Truex was penalized with the same points loss, which pushed him out of the Chase  because he was the beneficiary of that manipulation. That action delivered message that NASCAR will not tolerate deliberate manipulation of the Chase slotting.

Punishing Bowyer is difficult, because the evidence that his spin was intentional is circumstantial at best. Removing him from the Chase wipes out his  entire seasons' worth of work, which is too harsh a penalty for the stupid move he made. With Vickers, on the other hand, the radio communication is pretty damning as to what they were doing, so that was NASCAR's focal point when they sat down to work out the penalties.

So while I understand where you're coming from, if you put down the pitchfork and torch, and look at the big picture...you'll realize what I'm saying makes a hell of a lot of sense.
 
2013-09-10 07:34:30 AM

FiendishFellow05: Jensaarai: So, if working with a teammate to manipulate the points is bad, will we see NASCAR regulating all calls to pit road designed to help a teammate? How about pulling over to let your teammate get a point for leading or clinching the "leading the most laps?" Letting them around you when they're on the tail end of the lead lap? These are all common on-track behaviors.

We all know directly and intentionally wrecking championship contenders is only worthy of a slap on the wrist.

I'm disappointed, Jensaarai. I generally consider you to be smarter than that.

Letting a teammate lead a lap/pulling over to let a teammate back on the lead lap is  completely differentfrom DELIBERATELY manipulating the outcome of the Chase slotting by deliberately manipulating on-track results through team orders. F1 doesn't tolerate that crap, and now NASCAR has made it clear they won't either.


Ha, yeah. I seem to have expressed myself poorly in my attempt to play contrarian ass. Spent too much time playing with the Reddit kids these past couple days, who are almost exclusively 24 fans.

The point I was trying to make was that regardless of premeditation, team orders, or what have you, actually taking out someone who is in close contention with your teammate is much, much worse than taking yourself out of contention, even if doing so causes a game changing yellow. Both events caused a yellow. But under no circumstances can you claim MWR's move was more than a roll of the dice regarding Newman. They couldn't have known he'd get beat out of the pits by Carl, or that Carl would jump the restart. Hell, considering Bowyer's lazy spin, they couldn't have even known the yellow would fly. They manipulated their own cars, and their own cars only.

If the penalty for taking out a teammates competitor intentionally in the Chase is 1 race probation, it follows that taking yourself out intentionally must be less, regardless of team orders. Otherwise you create an incentive to go headhunting.

That is all.
 
2013-09-10 07:47:59 AM
Of course, my point is NASCAR should have penalized Gordon much more severely.

But since they didn't, and they've now brought the hammer down on MWR, I don't want any of you farkers whining when a non-Chase teammate of Chase contender starts roughing up their compatriot's main competitor while shouting "rivalry!" when a camera is in their face. This will be the result of the system NASCAR has built, and almost everyone seems fine with because it satisfies their short term sense of fairness, despite the complete lack of consistency or sense of proportionality.
 
2013-09-10 08:22:51 AM

HamstersFromHell: Clutch2013: I don't think they wanted to waste any more time building up such a case that would have broken the blatant "code" Brian Pattie used (even though they should have), especially when they had Ty Norris and the 55 dead to rights with their equally or more blatant BS.

And so we should have penalized JJ for the times this season he's let Gordon pass him to lead a lap for a point? Or Busch for allowing Kenseth...or vice-versa? Might as well face it, "team orders" have been in play ever since there was the first 2 (or more) car teams. This was no different (though more "in your face") than anything nearly every other competitive team has done, and will continue to do.

If NASCAR would uphold their own damn rules, Edwards would have been penalized for jumping the restart and the race outcome could have been different.

Now put your tinfoil hats on folks, but did you notice.that out of all the teams with drivers on the bubble EVERY SINGLE DRIVER for the contending teams finished BEHIND their driver on the bubble? All MWR drivers finished behind Truex, all Hendrick drivers finished behind Gordon, Martin finished behind Newman and Logano was behind BK. Coincidence or subtle team playing to get their drivers in the chase?

And yeah, Boyer did shred the tire...but prove he spun deliberately. He had already said prior to his "orders" that the car wasn't right. And yes, you can spin a car with a RF tire going down, if you jerk the wheel and slam the brakes to keep it from going straight for the wall. Jr. commented Boyer was riding the brakes and weaving....hell, on a short track, just flooring it in the turn would have spun him, no need for the theatrics..


Bowyer admitted to Newman he spun intentionally, but nobody with an IQ over 16 needed that admission. Stop being a homering little biatch.
 
2013-09-10 09:42:54 AM
I've been reading comments about Boyer's right front tire going down causing the spin.  Well, I might possibly buy that argument if it was the right rear tire.  Rear tire goes down, you spin.  Right front tire goes down or blows out you go straight into the wall.  I didn't think much of it until the guys in the booth called BS, then I listened to the radio chatter.  Add it all together and I think NASCAR made the best call they could.  No way in hell were they (Helton/Pemberton) going to make everyone (read: Gordon fans) happy by letting him in too.  I personally can't stand Jeff Gordon, but I hope he makes Clint Boyer's life miserable for the next ten weeks -- "accidently" of course!
 
2013-09-10 09:45:23 AM

Jensaarai: The point I was trying to make was that regardless of premeditation, team orders, or what have you, actually taking out someone who is in close contention with your teammate is much, much worse than taking yourself out of contention, even if doing so causes a game changing yellow. Both events caused a yellow. But under no circumstances can you claim MWR's move was more than a roll of the dice regarding Newman. They couldn't have known he'd get beat out of the pits by Carl, or that Carl would jump the restart. Hell, considering Bowyer's lazy spin, they couldn't have even known the yellow would fly. They manipulated their own cars, and their own cars only.

If the penalty for taking out a teammates competitor intentionally in the Chase is 1 race probation, it follows that taking yourself out intentionally must be less, regardless of team orders. Otherwise you create an incentive to go headhunting


I kinda thought poor little Jeffy's missing the chase was karma for intentionally wrecking Boyer last year. Go ahead Jeff, try to take out another chase contender, just remember, he has teammates who also have nothing to lose.

NASCAR = Nancy Ass Still Crying About Richmond
 
2013-09-10 09:52:55 AM
As someone replying to Hinton's column on ESPN commented:

"Gordon's teammate intentionally wrecked in the middle of green flag pit stops while running 28 laps down, trapping 8 cars better than the 24 a lap down and moving Gordon from outside the Chase to inside. But because he made this move with 50 laps to go instead of 8 it's ok? I don't think so. Gordon does not deserve to be in the Chase."
 
2013-09-10 09:58:04 AM
Robby Gordon in 2005: "Michael Waltrip is not the nice guy that everybody thinks he is. He spun me out, and he wrecked me. He's a piece of shiat."
 
2013-09-10 09:59:56 AM
It's OK If You Are Gordon.

IOKIYAG
 
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