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(Washington Post)   Philadelphia public schools open without any money for paper, books, athletics, arts, music, counselors and some teachers. In other words, it's pretty much like a Nike factory without the shoes   (washingtonpost.com) divider line 74
    More: Fail, Philadelphia public schools, teachers, shuffling, principals  
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3687 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Sep 2013 at 10:50 AM (43 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-09 09:13:36 AM
Ah, I remember those days.  The school shopping was the worst, though.  Not being born to parents of means, and having a mother whose sense of style had been frozen sometime around the mid-Sixties, she would often by me clothes which were, to say the least, out of style by a couple of decades at the time.  in fact, speaking of Nikes, she wouldn't buy me them when we were school shopping.  Apparently, the Zips were on sale.  Don't even get me started on the fabrics and patterns of the shirts and especially the pants I was forced by default to wear to school.  But hey, they were inexpensive, with the shirts only running about a couple of sawbucks.

This fiscal responsibility on the part of my mother is all the more confusing since she drove a Porsche convertible, which I once, in a fit to teenage impulse, got into trouble with while my parents were away.  But that's another story.
 
2013-09-09 09:41:19 AM

dittybopper: Ah, I remember those days.  The school shopping was the worst, though.  Not being born to parents of means, and having a mother whose sense of style had been frozen sometime around the mid-Sixties, she would often by me clothes which were, to say the least, out of style by a couple of decades at the time.  in fact, speaking of Nikes, she wouldn't buy me them when we were school shopping.  Apparently, the Zips were on sale.  Don't even get me started on the fabrics and patterns of the shirts and especially the pants I was forced by default to wear to school.  But hey, they were inexpensive, with the shirts only running about a couple of sawbucks.

This fiscal responsibility on the part of my mother is all the more confusing since she drove a Porsche convertible, which I once, in a fit to teenage impulse, got into trouble with while my parents were away.  But that's another story.


You go to school to work, not for a fashion show. At least that is what MY mother taught me in West Philadelphia.
 
2013-09-09 09:42:21 AM
The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...
 
2013-09-09 09:43:21 AM

vernonFL: You go to school to work, not for a fashion show. At least that is what MY mother taught me in West Philadelphia.


Was that before or after you got into a fight and she made you move in with your rich uncle in Bel-Air?
 
2013-09-09 09:51:57 AM

vernonFL: You go to school to work, not for a fashion show. At least that is what MY mother taught me in West Philadelphia.


Mine taught me I went to school to *LEARN*.
 
2013-09-09 09:52:47 AM

RedPhoenix122: vernonFL: You go to school to work, not for a fashion show. At least that is what MY mother taught me in West Philadelphia.

Was that before or after you got into a fight and she made you move in with your rich uncle in Bel-Air?


That depends on the age and domiciliary status of that hot girly-girl I saw walkin'.
 
2013-09-09 09:54:49 AM
Thanks, Obama
 
2013-09-09 10:00:23 AM

dittybopper: vernonFL: You go to school to work, not for a fashion show. At least that is what MY mother taught me in West Philadelphia.

Mine taught me I went to school to *LEARN*.


Busted! Nice job:)
 
2013-09-09 10:08:27 AM

vernonFL: dittybopper: vernonFL: You go to school to work, not for a fashion show. At least that is what MY mother taught me in West Philadelphia.

Mine taught me I went to school to *LEARN*.

Busted! Nice job:)


Oddly enough, I just watched that video the other night on VEVO.
 
2013-09-09 11:03:42 AM

Weaver95: The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...


It is to the point where being ridiculously wealthy is not even worth the bother.
 
2013-09-09 11:04:15 AM

Weaver95: The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...


Interestingly enough, the state is run by Democrats so I guess the Left is the one that is behind all those things you listed, right?
 
2013-09-09 11:04:15 AM
I had heard from a friend living in Philly that the state was given oversight of the city's school system and kept cutting the budget.  After cutting the budget, they kept saying something like, "you guys are a failing school district, you can't have more money" and would cut the budget again.  If that's accurate, which I'm not sure if it is or it isn't, the system seems like it was designed to fail.  Any experts want to chime in?
 
2013-09-09 11:04:37 AM

dittybopper: Ah, I remember those days.  The school shopping was the worst, though.  Not being born to parents of means, and having a mother whose sense of style had been frozen sometime around the mid-Sixties, she would often by me clothes which were, to say the least, out of style by a couple of decades at the time.  in fact, speaking of Nikes, she wouldn't buy me them when we were school shopping.  Apparently, the Zips were on sale.  Don't even get me started on the fabrics and patterns of the shirts and especially the pants I was forced by default to wear to school.  But hey, they were inexpensive, with the shirts only running about a couple of sawbucks.

This fiscal responsibility on the part of my mother is all the more confusing since she drove a Porsche convertible, which I once, in a fit to teenage impulse, got into trouble with while my parents were away.  But that's another story.


Man, I wish I had the picture handy.  I have a school picture from 5th grade where I'm wearing a silk-ish black shirt with small pictures of all 50 state license plates...how could they let me out of the house in that!
 
2013-09-09 11:08:16 AM
So - a quick check shows that per pupil spending (2011) in PA is about $13,500 - which ranked 12th from the top. Philadelphia spent more than$14,318 per student in district-run schools.

So where is all the money going?
 
2013-09-09 11:08:57 AM

Weaver95: The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...


Perhaps, if one were to donate either time or financial resources directly to the school; the situation would improve. Also; if one were to vote to raise taxes, with an emphasis on education, the situation would, probably, improve. Perhaps, the city could sell education bonds.

/ my point? There are many options and republicans aren't the only ones who don't want to pay more taxes.
 
2013-09-09 11:09:09 AM

zepher: Interestingly enough, the state is run by Democrats so I guess the Left is the one that is behind all those things you listed, right?


Like noted lefty Tom Corbett.
 
2013-09-09 11:09:21 AM

JohnCarter: So - a quick check shows that per pupil spending (2011) in PA is about $13,500 - which ranked 12th from the top. Philadelphia spent more than$14,318 per student in district-run schools.

So where is all the money going?


Union dues.
 
2013-09-09 11:11:11 AM
on the playground's where I spent all of my days..
 
2013-09-09 11:16:13 AM
ts1.mm.bing.net

Forget it, Jake.  It's Philadelphia.
 
2013-09-09 11:17:35 AM

zepher: Weaver95: The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...

Interestingly enough, the state is run by Democrats so I guess the Left is the one that is behind all those things you listed, right?


The hell you say?  shiat I guess I know nothing about my state.  PA may be blue for president elections but it's red the rest of the time.
 
2013-09-09 11:17:36 AM

JohnCarter: So - a quick check shows that per pupil spending (2011) in PA is about $13,500 - which ranked 12th from the top. Philadelphia spent more than$14,318 per student in district-run schools.

So where is all the money going?


Pipe down, citizen!  You'll keep paying more until we say it is enough.
 
2013-09-09 11:19:11 AM
sboyle1020:
Man, I wish I had the picture handy.  I have a school picture from 5th grade where I'm wearing a silk-ish black shirt with small pictures of all 50 state license plates...how could they let me out of the house in that!

encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com
 
2013-09-09 11:20:45 AM

iheartscotch: Also; if one were to vote to raise taxes, with an emphasis on education, the situation would, probably, improve.


http://www.phila.gov/Revenue/individuals/taxes/Pages/SchoolIncomeTax .a spx

Philly schools are already supported by two explicit tax sources, independent of their general fund sources from the city and state.
 
2013-09-09 11:22:24 AM

AngryDragon: JohnCarter: So - a quick check shows that per pupil spending (2011) in PA is about $13,500 - which ranked 12th from the top. Philadelphia spent more than$14,318 per student in district-run schools.

So where is all the money going?

Union dues.


From all those laid off teachers?  Are you a troll or an idiot?

zepher:
Interestingly enough, the state is run by Democrats so I guess the Left is the one that is behind all those things you listed, right?

Are you ignorant or lying?
Governor Corbett is a Republican. The PA General Assembly is currently controlled by Republicans.
 
2013-09-09 11:23:52 AM
Guidance counselors are a 'basic'?  The local schools haven't had dedicated guidance counselors for at least a decade.  The two people who run the detention/suspension rooms for troublemakers are also in charge of making sure the SAT/ACT is scheduled and the military recruiters are let in.  College guidance?  "If you're supposed to go to college, you can probably figger that out for yerself".
 
2013-09-09 11:24:12 AM
Meanwhile, at the DoD:

www.fas.org

Ye Gods, do we have a farked up sense of priority in this country.

Of course, that's what you get when you put a bunch of wealthy sociopaths in power.
 
2013-09-09 11:24:31 AM

iheartscotch: Weaver95: The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...

Perhaps, if one were to donate either time or financial resources directly to the school; the situation would improve. Also; if one were to vote to raise taxes, with an emphasis on education, the situation would, probably, improve. Perhaps, the city could sell education bonds.

/ my point? There are many options and republicans aren't the only ones who don't want to pay more taxes.


They are already spending north of $13,000 per student...it is NOT a lack of money.
 
2013-09-09 11:27:07 AM

This text is now purple: iheartscotch: Also; if one were to vote to raise taxes, with an emphasis on education, the situation would, probably, improve.

http://www.phila.gov/Revenue/individuals/taxes/Pages/SchoolIncomeTax .a spx

Philly schools are already supported by two explicit tax sources, independent of their general fund sources from the city and state.


But, is it actually used for schools; or is it used so the governor's special cousin, Jerry, can have a paying job?

/ I imagine that if one were to fix some graft and purge the public employment rolls of fictitious persons; the money would magically appear.
 
2013-09-09 11:30:43 AM
But I am pretty sure that overglut of administrators are being paid.. and most are needed to make sure the school district complies with federal unfunded maindates.
 
2013-09-09 11:32:04 AM

Lawnchair: Guidance counselors are a 'basic'?  The local schools haven't had dedicated guidance counselors for at least a decade.  The two people who run the detention/suspension rooms for troublemakers are also in charge of making sure the SAT/ACT is scheduled and the military recruiters are let in.  College guidance?  "If you're supposed to go to college, you can probably figger that out for yerself".


That sort of approach may have "worked" in your one-room schoolhouse out in the middle of bumfark, nowhere but it doesn't scale up.  For example, at the high school I taught at last year (about 2,500 students) the guy running the ISS room was a little too busy trying to prevent a mini riot to worry about making sure every 2,500 students were enrolled in the right classes and getting ready for standardized testing.

Of course, you probably think the guy could have done it fine if he was just "bootstrappy" enough.
 
2013-09-09 11:32:45 AM

Stingy Alpha Wolf King Dude: Thanks, Obama


As funny as this meme is, the State Legislature and local school board are totally responsibly for this mess and they're all probably going to get to keep their jobs.
 
2013-09-09 11:38:21 AM
Riche

Not just the U.S., the world. For like, all of history. Warfare, warcraft, war-profiteering, have endured for as long as humans have disliked each others' opinions
 
2013-09-09 11:39:11 AM

iheartscotch: Philly schools are already supported by two explicit tax sources, independent of their general fund sources from the city and state.

But, is it actually used for schools; or is it used so the governor's special cousin, Jerry, can have a paying job?

/ I imagine that if one were to fix some graft and purge the public employment rolls of fictitious persons; the money would magically appear.


Traditionally, it was used so the School Superintendent's special cousin, Jerry, could have a nice paying job.

Philly is a mixture of an entrenched low-performing population base, bleeding of money into charter schools that aren't quite so closely aligned with felon-track education, a shrinking school-age population, and a widely-scattered population putting too few students into too many ancient buildings. Philly's structural upkeep costs are considerable.

There's no easy solution here. What's feasible isn't political, and what's political isn't feasible.
 
2013-09-09 11:44:51 AM
Philadelphia public schools open without any money for paper, books, athletics, arts, music, counselors and some teachers.

Look. I can set some of this slide. I mean, how much does little Johnny need to read  The Crucible? But go'tarnnit, he needs to be in football. How else is he gonna make it into college?
 
2013-09-09 11:45:00 AM

patrick767: AngryDragon: JohnCarter: So - a quick check shows that per pupil spending (2011) in PA is about $13,500 - which ranked 12th from the top. Philadelphia spent more than$14,318 per student in district-run schools.

So where is all the money going?

Union dues.

From all those laid off teachers?  Are you a troll or an idiot?

zepher:
Interestingly enough, the state is run by Democrats so I guess the Left is the one that is behind all those things you listed, right?

Are you ignorant or lying?
Governor Corbett is a Republican. The PA General Assembly is currently controlled by Republicans.


Care to site who the school board is run by?
I'm guessing the teacher's union has had a pretty big say as to who is on the board.
 
2013-09-09 11:52:32 AM

Riche: That sort of approach may have "worked" in your one-room schoolhouse out in the middle of bumfark, nowhere but it doesn't scale up.  For example, at the high school I taught at last year (about 2,500 students) the guy running the ISS room was a little too busy trying to prevent a mini riot to worry about making sure every 2,500 students were enrolled in the right classes and getting ready for standardized testing.

Of course, you probably think the guy could have done it fine if he was just "bootstrappy" enough.


No no... I'm not saying it's right at all.  This is a school of roughly 1000... I'm just saying that lots of schools have basically dropped the whole 'guidance' thing over the last decade of funding fark-yous.
 
2013-09-09 11:52:41 AM

paswa17: Philadelphia public schools open without any money for paper, books, athletics, arts, music, counselors and some teachers.

Look. I can set some of this slide. I mean, how much does little Johnny need to read  The Crucible? But go'tarnnit, he needs to be in football. How else is he gonna make it into college?


A well rounded education and giving children a chance to try different things is a good thing and whether you like it or not that includes sports.
 
2013-09-09 11:54:21 AM
The way you fund schools in America seems to be based on the idea that in the 21st century we you need a peasant class that can read. Barely
 
2013-09-09 12:04:26 PM
I wish teachers' unions were as powerful as y'all make them out to be.

Maybe we wouldn't be so goddam demoralized and exhausted all the time. Instead, the unions continue to try to do their job - which is to guarantee the right to due process before dismissal and endeavoring to make sure working conditions are such that teachers can do their jobs well.

If you really think teachers' unions are the cause of messes like this, you've never set foot inside a big city school district central office.
The number of dollars spent per pupil doesn't mean that number actually comes anywhere near the classroom. A certain significant portion goes to building maintenance and repair, more to busing, more to administrative costs, etc., etc...

Philadelphia, in this case, is simply (like Detroit) the canary in the coal mine. This is the direction of most public school districts in the nation - overwhelming mandates and costs until they go broke and have to be taken over by private companies or charter schools.

"Follow the money" has never been a more important dictum.
 
2013-09-09 12:09:26 PM

dropdead: The way you fund schools in America seems to be based on the idea that in the 21st century we you need a peasant class that can read. Barely


static2.businessinsider.com
 
2013-09-09 12:10:10 PM
I've been hearing about how Philly is going bankrupt for some time now.  This doesn't even seem like news at this point.  Money was mis-managed and now the city is out of it.  Seems right to me, even if it hurts.
 
2013-09-09 12:15:20 PM

Yugoboy: Instead, the unions continue to try to do their job - which is to guarantee the right to due process before dismissal


Unfortunately this is the one thing that the unions do exceedingly well.  I agree that protections should be in place against wrongful termination.  Many of the "teachers" in schools have no business educating anyone though.
 
2013-09-09 12:20:48 PM

Cataholic: dropdead: The way you fund schools in America seems to be based on the idea that in the 21st century we you need a peasant class that can read. Barely

[static2.businessinsider.com image 850x638]


Does this include private, charter, and magnet schools?
 
2013-09-09 12:31:50 PM

tetsoushima: Cataholic: dropdead: The way you fund schools in America seems to be based on the idea that in the 21st century we you need a peasant class that can read. Barely

[static2.businessinsider.com image 850x638]

Does this include private, charter, and magnet schools?


not to mention the difference in the value of the dollar in each of those countries.
 
2013-09-09 12:34:44 PM

JohnCarter: So - a quick check shows that per pupil spending (2011) in PA is about $13,500 - which ranked 12th from the top. Philadelphia spent more than$14,318 per student in district-run schools.

So where is all the money going?


Here's 350 pages of budget if you want it.

The cost of living in Philadelphia is higher than most of the rest of the country (or state) though it's nothing like DC or New York.  The infrastructure is old.  Philly also has the shrinking city problem where fewer services are needed for a smaller population than 30 or 40 years ago so there's disproportionately a high number of retirees to current employees and underused facilities in areas where buildings aren't worth anything.
 
2013-09-09 12:34:49 PM

zepher: Weaver95: The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...

Interestingly enough, the state is run by Democrats so I guess the Left is the one that is behind all those things you listed, right?


I'm pretty sure every Republican could disappear from the face of the earth and they would still be blamed for every government failure.
 
2013-09-09 12:36:39 PM

umad: zepher: Weaver95: The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...

Interestingly enough, the state is run by Democrats so I guess the Left is the one that is behind all those things you listed, right?

I'm pretty sure every Republican could disappear from the face of the earth and they would still be blamed for every government failure.


PA is run by Republicans.
 
2013-09-09 12:37:58 PM
 
2013-09-09 12:42:12 PM

TNel: umad: zepher: Weaver95: The important thing here is that we make sure that we have more tax cuts for the rich. Oh and that psu football isn't affected and that gays can't get married in Pennsylvania. Public education and jobs? Low priority stuff nobody cares about. Something something unions and Jesus...

Interestingly enough, the state is run by Democrats so I guess the Left is the one that is behind all those things you listed, right?

I'm pretty sure every Republican could disappear from the face of the earth and they would still be blamed for every government failure.

PA is run by Republicans.


But Philly isn't.
 
2013-09-09 12:42:37 PM

HindiDiscoMonster: tetsoushima: Cataholic: dropdead: The way you fund schools in America seems to be based on the idea that in the 21st century we you need a peasant class that can read. Barely

[static2.businessinsider.com image 850x638]

Does this include private, charter, and magnet schools?

not to mention the difference in the value of the dollar in each of those countries.


I guess the better question here is by what standards did they come by these numbers?  This could point out that throwing money at a problem doesn't necessarily solve it, or it could suggest that amount of money going into the wealthiest districts is enough to offset the poorest districts enough to put us in the top 5, or it could be none of the above.  This graphic doesn't provide the necessary information to draw any valid conclusions.
 
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