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(Guardian)   Publishing the abilities of the NSA helps our enemies. YOU DON'T SAY?   (theguardian.com) divider line 123
    More: Obvious, NSA, United States, human trafficking  
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2934 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Sep 2013 at 6:41 PM (46 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-06 06:10:59 PM
Yet somehow they're great at busting victimless crimes  but not so great at getting terrorists.
 
2013-09-06 06:36:58 PM
1984 was a cautionary tale, not a guidebook. I wish our government would stop trying to make it reality instead.
 
2013-09-06 06:42:08 PM
Enemies come if foreign AND domestic flavors.
 
2013-09-06 06:43:27 PM
If you consider the American people to be the enemy, then yes.
 
2013-09-06 06:44:52 PM

Apik0r0s: Enemies come if in foreign AND domestic flavors.


ftfm
 
2013-09-06 06:45:02 PM

Apik0r0s: Enemies come if foreign AND domestic flavors.


The NSA calls everyone they spy on "adversaries" explicitly. This includes you and me.
 
2013-09-06 06:46:17 PM
The enemy of your enemy is your friend.
 
2013-09-06 06:47:03 PM
What I find absolutely amusing is that people actually think that any of this is being done without the approval of that NSA.

What's that?  Someone just released a new type of encryption that the NSA can't defeat?  lol sure they can't.

Hmm?  Someone just released a collection of NSA tactics and methods?  I'm sure that's not disinformation at all.

I'm sure the whole NSA is all upset and stuff.
 
2013-09-06 06:51:08 PM
if I can't publish information that will help the terrorists win, then the terrorists have already won
 
2013-09-06 06:51:34 PM
Our enemies being, of course, ourselves.
 
2013-09-06 06:52:29 PM

Infernalist: What I find absolutely amusing is that people actually think that any of this is being done without the approval of that NSA.

What's that?  Someone just released a new type of encryption that the NSA can't defeat?  lol sure they can't.

Hmm?  Someone just released a collection of NSA tactics and methods?  I'm sure that's not disinformation at all.

I'm sure the whole NSA is all upset and stuff.



Tom Clancy books are not reference material.
 
2013-09-06 06:53:04 PM

LoneWolf343: If you consider the American people to be the enemy, then yes.


This.
 
2013-09-06 06:58:53 PM
We're all terrorists now.

/They won.
 
2013-09-06 07:02:27 PM
But the NSA is our greatest enemy.
 
2013-09-06 07:04:14 PM
upload.wikimedia.org

Great summer read, when I was 12.
 
2013-09-06 07:04:42 PM
Who are OUR enemies?

It's a very important question.
 
2013-09-06 07:05:05 PM

lostcat: [upload.wikimedia.org image 158x272]

Great summer read, when I was 12.


Huh, I wanded into the wrong thread.

Carry on.
 
2013-09-06 07:09:59 PM

lostcat: [upload.wikimedia.org image 158x272]

Great summer read, when I was 12.


Is that a fight between the Glorious freedom loving GOP and Commie Obummer?
 
2013-09-06 07:11:03 PM
Publishing ANYTHING could somehow in some way help our enemies.  That doesn't mean we make publishing illegal.
 
2013-09-06 07:12:04 PM
If it wasn't for warfare, just think of what kinds of crazy awesome technology we could have by now
 
2013-09-06 07:13:36 PM
according to the NSA, the 'adversaries' are us.  So isn't this good news?
 
2013-09-06 07:17:45 PM
before the trolls try their thing.. here's the article where the NSA says we are the adversaries:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/09/05/nsa-snowden-enc ry ption-cracked/2772721/
 
2013-09-06 07:19:16 PM

lostcat: lostcat: [upload.wikimedia.org image 158x272]

Great summer read, when I was 12.

Huh, I wanded into the wrong thread.

Carry on.


It works.
 
2013-09-06 07:21:59 PM
www.wespeaknews.com
 
2013-09-06 07:22:04 PM
 Considering the general public is included in that "enemy list" I'm ok with this.
 
2013-09-06 07:23:35 PM
If the US Government doesn't like all this shiat being released, they can try behaving how they're supposed to next time. If they weren't massively and flagrantly violating everybody's rights, then nobody would feel the need to come forward and blow the whistle about that.

It's a very complicated concept, I know.
 
2013-09-06 07:26:00 PM
If you define 'enemy' as everyone who isn't aligned with the Dubya/Obama administration, which I'm sure they do, then yes. That includes us.
 
2013-09-06 07:26:52 PM

HypnozombieX: Considering the general public is included in that "enemy list" I'm ok with this.


http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/09/05/nsa-snowden-enc ry ption-cracked/2772721/

It bears repeating.  The NSA considers you an adversary.  Get pissed.  Then tell everyone you know.  Then get more pissed.  and stay pissed.  For a long time.  The only thing they have going for them is our goldfish-esque attention spans.  LETS END THIS CYCLE NOW.
 
2013-09-06 07:27:47 PM
Well that's interesting, because the Public Editor at the New York Times said that publishing this story wasn't a difficult decision at all:

The New York Times has come under fire in the past for agreeing to government requests to hold back sensitive stories or information, but it bucked such requests in publishing a front-page article in Friday's paper.

The executive editor, Jill Abramson, told me that while she and the managing editor Dean Baquet went to Washington to meet with officials and gave them "a respectful hearing," the decision to publish was "not a particularly anguished one."

The article says that the National Security Agency has the ability - and uses it - to break the encryption used in a great deal of Internet communication. It's an important part of a continuing set of stories on the N.S.A.'s surveillance and its implications for privacy, the early ones of which have been published largely in The Guardian and The Washington Post, as a result of a huge leak by Edward J. Snowden, the former N.S.A. contractor.

Top editors at The Times listened to government officials' concerns over national security but decided to publish despite their request, because it was in the public interest to do so.

"Our default position is to inform the public," Ms. Abramson told me. "Publishing information in the public service is our mission in our democracy." The balance between national security and the public's right to know must be considered, she said. In this case, the latter clearly prevailed.


The public in a Democracy has the right to know what it's government is doing in secret when those actions threaten civil liberties?

What a concept.
 
2013-09-06 07:31:54 PM

A Non Amos: If it wasn't for warfare, just think of what kinds of crazy awesome technology we could have by now


Atomic power?
 
2013-09-06 07:32:03 PM

A Non Amos: If it wasn't for warfare, just think of what kinds of crazy awesome technology we could have by now


And because of it. Microwaves? Thank radar development. GPS? Military tech. Internet? DARPA. Nuclear power? Yep.

Military. R&d has brought us a LOT of tech.
 
2013-09-06 07:33:19 PM
I'm taking a computer forensics class this semester and I will seriously be using this news for one of our assignments.

I much prefer white-hat activity to black-hat*, but that doesn't mean I think everyone should have to fear being a potential target by the NSA.

*I have no idea how to 'hack' anything, it's just my opinion
 
2013-09-06 07:35:20 PM

Go Fornicate Without a Partner: HypnozombieX: Considering the general public is included in that "enemy list" I'm ok with this.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/09/05/nsa-snowden-enc ry ption-cracked/2772721/

It bears repeating.  The NSA considers you an adversary.  Get pissed.  Then tell everyone you know.  Then get more pissed.  and stay pissed.  For a long time.  The only thing they have going for them is our goldfish-esque attention spans.  LETS END THIS CYCLE NOW.


gun nuts who don't trust the government aren't so crazy now are we?
 
2013-09-06 07:36:20 PM
And by enemies, the NSA is referring to all of us.
 
2013-09-06 07:37:04 PM

Apik0r0s: Enemies come if foreign AND domestic flavors.


The better question is thus: who is not on the list of NSA adversaries? It seems these days that after Snowden even NSA employees are on the list of NSA adversaries. And if they aren't trusted, who is? It strikes me as a tiny set of friendlies.
 
2013-09-06 07:38:23 PM

HypnozombieX: Considering the general public is included in that "enemy list" I'm ok with this.


It is very much worth remembering what happened when the people began to protest economic injustice in our plutocracy.

New documents show that the violent crackdown on Occupy last fall - so mystifying at the time - was not just coordinated at the level of the FBI, the Department of Homeland Security, and local police. The crackdown, which involved, as you may recall, violent arrests, group disruption, canister missiles to the skulls of protesters, people held in handcuffs so tight they were injured, people held in bondage till they were forced to wet or soil themselves -was coordinated with the big banks themselves.

The Partnership for Civil Justice Fund, in a groundbreaking scoop that should once more shame major US media outlets (why are nonprofits now some of the only entities in America left breaking major civil liberties news?), filed this request. The document - reproduced here in an easily searchable format - shows a terrifying network of coordinated DHS, FBI, police, regional fusion center, and private-sector activity so completely merged into one another that the monstrous whole is, in fact, one entity: in some cases, bearing a single name, the Domestic Security Alliance Council. And it reveals this merged entity to have one centrally planned, locally executed mission. The documents, in short, show the cops and DHS working for and with banks to target, arrest, and politically disable peaceful American citizens.

The documents show that from the start, the FBI - though it acknowledges Occupy movement as being, in fact, a peaceful organization - nonetheless designated OWS repeatedly as a "terrorist threat"


You'd have to be a complete farking idiot to claim we shouldn't be very, very worried about the direction this nation is heading.
 
2013-09-06 07:40:03 PM
Kit Fister: You rock, thank you. *hugs*
 
2013-09-06 07:40:54 PM
BullBearMS:

"Our default position is to inform the public," Ms. Abramson told me. "Publishing information in the public service is our mission in our democracy." The balance between national security and the public's right to know must be considered, she said. In this case, the latter clearly prevailed.

Now, let us translate this:

Both the Washington Post and The Guardian's ad impressions and click throughs are going through the roof. We wanted in on the payola.
 
2013-09-06 07:41:19 PM
The terrorists have won.  All the small steps that have happened, or - as some suggest, been on the government's wish list but didn't have the excuse to implement, right up to our government collecting our communications and metadata and treating us as potential adversaries (without any particular reason) and actively seeking to weaken encryption standards for their own gains at the potential detriment of their citizens is one victory for our enemies.  That had to execute one attack on American soil, and then sit back while they watched our government restrict our freedoms to a point no outside entity ever could.  If they hated us for our freedom, they have succeeded getting the government to capitulate to their demands of less freedom for us.

I'm just a little sad that my country has decided that the best course of action is to collect and keep and data mine my presumably private communications.
 
2013-09-06 07:42:22 PM

flynn80: The enemy of your enemy is your friend.


No, the enemy of your enemy is usually just not your enemy yet.
 
2013-09-06 07:48:38 PM

worlddan: BullBearMS:

"Our default position is to inform the public," Ms. Abramson told me. "Publishing information in the public service is our mission in our democracy." The balance between national security and the public's right to know must be considered, she said. In this case, the latter clearly prevailed.

Now, let us translate this:

Both the Washington Post and The Guardian's ad impressions and click throughs are going through the roof. We wanted in on the payola.


Let's retranslate that to comport with reality, via Supreme Court Justice Hugo Black ruling on Nixon's attempt to shut down the New York Times publication of the Top Secret Pentagon Papers which showed our leadership had deliberately lied us into the Vietnam war:

Only a free and unrestrained press can effectively expose deception in government. And paramount among the responsibilities of a free press is the duty to prevent any part of the government from deceiving the people and sending them off to distant lands to die of foreign fevers and foreign shot and shell.
 
2013-09-06 07:48:59 PM

Kit Fister: Go Fornicate Without a Partner: HypnozombieX: Considering the general public is included in that "enemy list" I'm ok with this.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/09/05/nsa-snowden-enc ry ption-cracked/2772721/

It bears repeating.  The NSA considers you an adversary.  Get pissed.  Then tell everyone you know.  Then get more pissed.  and stay pissed.  For a long time.  The only thing they have going for them is our goldfish-esque attention spans.  LETS END THIS CYCLE NOW.

gun nuts who don't trust the government aren't so crazy now are we?


never thought you were, my brother.  I've always been afraid to be on a list of gun owners.  But now that I know I'm an enemy of the police state, I'm going to arm myself.  Fuk playing nice.  Clearly that's a mistake.

This is a chance for us to unify.  I love all of my fark brotheren.. left, right, under the bridge.  We are all people.  And we are collectively 'adversaries'.  Peace be with you, non-NSA brotheren.
 
2013-09-06 07:50:19 PM
In other news, publishing companies in cahoots with the NSA will be terrible for their business.  What foreign company will want to buy American tech?
 
2013-09-06 07:51:50 PM
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-09-06 07:52:20 PM
This thread needs more drama queens freaking out.
 
2013-09-06 07:53:15 PM
It's pretty sad when your own government neither likes you or trusts you.
 
2013-09-06 07:54:33 PM
Another potential side effect of the NSA's behavior is the damage they've done to America's and the West's computer industry.  The newest revelations make it clear that NO American companies can be trusted to handle, transmit, or process sensitive data.  The NSA, by granting themselves the power to secretly compromise any company has thus placed every company under suspicion.  More and more system administrators across the internet are already saying that from now on, the only type of encryption that can be trusted is open-source software that has been heavily peer reviewed.  If you're a closed-source company that deals in products that handle sensitive data, than the NSA has very likely farked you over when it comes to our ability to make future sales.  On top of that, every network and system administrator now needs to second-guess all of the product and service advice he's worked off of for the last decade.  This is because the NSA revelations make it clear that not only were they trying to compromise software, but they were also trying to compromise individuals at all levels of the network industry... and now there's no way to know if that router, or that new service, or that new software package that an "expert" recommended for your company was recommended to you because it was the best for your situation, or because it was the best for NSA's desire to spy on you.
 
2013-09-06 07:55:45 PM

uber humper: In other news, publishing companies in cahoots with the NSA will be terrible for their business.  What foreign company will want to buy American tech?


The companies with agreed-to backdoors in their software / hardware is more comprehensive than has been released so far.  I would wager that US products of this kind are now starting to be looked at as liabilities.  This can of worms will have far-reaching consequences.

/walked away from this in 2006
 
2013-09-06 07:56:58 PM

Kit Fister: gun nuts who don't trust the government aren't so crazy now are we?


Yeah, right?
Are you going to shoot the government?
When? When they come for your guns, right?
Because you're sure not going to do it when they steal your data.
Hint: they don't need to use force to finish you off if they want to.

/Gun nuts who plan to shoot the government crack me up.
 
2013-09-06 07:57:10 PM

Infernalist: This thread needs more drama queens freaking out.


Go back under your bridge.
 
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