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(CBC)   Not news: Raising awareness about climate change in the Arctic. News: By rowing through the Northwest Passages. FARK: Being forced to quit due to overwhelming amounts of sea ice   (cbc.ca) divider line 136
    More: Fail, Northwest Passages, Arctic, Northwest Territories, Arctic Ocean  
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3474 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Sep 2013 at 9:15 PM (51 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-03 06:39:07 PM
All that thin, decaying and rotten first year ice can be a real buggar
 
2013-09-03 07:06:30 PM
I'd call that REALITY, not FARK.

We see it all the time around here - environmentalists from everywhere but here, coming here to prove that their idea is real, with absolutely no clue what the fark they're talking about in reality.  Lots of computer models,  and hearsay, and "F*CK YEAH!  Take Down Tha MAN!" kinds of things, but no one who has a firm grasp on provable reality.
 
2013-09-03 08:13:25 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: I'd call that REALITY, not FARK.

We see it all the time around here - environmentalists from everywhere but here, coming here to prove that their idea is real, with absolutely no clue what the fark they're talking about in reality.  Lots of computer models,  and hearsay, and "F*CK YEAH!  Take Down Tha MAN!" kinds of things, but no one who has a firm grasp on provable reality.


You mean the provable reality that, while some ships cannot pass through, the ice layer is thinning? You mean that one?
 
2013-09-03 09:17:05 PM
Because nothing on the Earth has ever changed, not the weather, not the landforms, not the temperatures, not anything.
 
2013-09-03 09:19:14 PM

HotIgneous Intruder: Because nothing on the Earth has ever changed, not the weather, not the landforms, not the temperatures, not anything.


Ask the dinosaurs how that change went for them.

We should be able to adapt, but busy body politicians beholden to special interests that want to maintain the status quo seem to want to hinder any attempt at adaptation unless it can make them a lot of money.
 
2013-09-03 09:19:18 PM
Beavers in the Arctic
 
2013-09-03 09:19:23 PM

cameroncrazy1984: You mean the provable reality that, while some ships cannot pass through, the ice layer is thinning? You mean that one?


The reality that this year 22 ships are trapped in the Northwest Passage.
 
2013-09-03 09:20:00 PM
ll-media.tmz.com

/This raises my awareness
 
2013-09-03 09:21:46 PM

HotIgneous Intruder: Because nothing on the Earth has ever changed, not the weather, not the landforms, not the temperatures, not anything.


Could you imagine death spirals and linear trends actually changing directions? THE HORROR
 
2013-09-03 09:22:17 PM

Zoomaster: [ll-media.tmz.com image 550x757]

/This raises my awareness


I'd like to block that passage.
 
2013-09-03 09:23:33 PM
Plus, don't forget, it got COLD last winter.

Checkmate!
 
2013-09-03 09:23:45 PM
In the novel  The Orphan Master's Son, a pair of American girls row a small skiff across the northern Pacific and get picked up by a North Korean ship.

Not sure how that relates to the story except that in both the rowers don't make it all the way to their destination.

Maybe in the future we'll be smart enough not to try rowing across large expanses of water. But by then I expect it will be too late.
 
2013-09-03 09:28:31 PM

leevis: Zoomaster: [ll-media.tmz.com image 550x757]

/This raises my awareness

I'd like to block that passage.


I'll give her an overwhelming amount.
 
2013-09-03 09:29:19 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Benevolent Misanthrope: I'd call that REALITY, not FARK.

We see it all the time around here - environmentalists from everywhere but here, coming here to prove that their idea is real, with absolutely no clue what the fark they're talking about in reality.  Lots of computer models,  and hearsay, and "F*CK YEAH!  Take Down Tha MAN!" kinds of things, but no one who has a firm grasp on provable reality.

You mean the provable reality that, while some ships cannot pass through, the ice layer is thinning? You mean that one?


Maybe the reality that the climate is always changing, and always will change.
 
2013-09-03 09:29:29 PM
Christ on a crutch! We've been looking for that northwest passage thing for 3 centuries. Maybe it's time we admit that being TECHNICALLY navigable is not the same thing as being a navigable waterway.
 
2013-09-03 09:30:15 PM

meat0918: HotIgneous Intruder: Because nothing on the Earth has ever changed, not the weather, not the landforms, not the temperatures, not anything.

Ask the dinosaurs how that change went for them.

We should be able to adapt, but busy body politicians beholden to special interests that want to maintain the status quo seem to want to hinder any attempt at adaptation unless it can make them a lot of money.


You need assistance from the government to adapt to change? Sad.
 
2013-09-03 09:30:28 PM
Well this settles it, man made climate change is fake and Sarah Palin is automatically the new President of the United States.
 
2013-09-03 09:30:55 PM

Abox: Beavers in the Arctic


Zoomaster: [ll-media.tmz.com image 550x757]

/This raises my awareness


Abox already addressed that.Though thanks for the illustration.


/I'd skin that pelt like a French trapper
//er... that's how you do it, right?
 
2013-09-03 09:33:36 PM

WelldeadLink: cameroncrazy1984: You mean the provable reality that, while some ships cannot pass through, the ice layer is thinning? You mean that one?

The reality that this year 22 ships are trapped in the Northwest Passage.


OK, that article says there's a GROUP OF JETSKIIS trapped in the ice up there.
 
2013-09-03 09:33:48 PM

gerbilpox: Abox: Beavers in the Arctic

Zoomaster: [ll-media.tmz.com image 550x757]

/This raises my awareness

Abox already addressed that.Though thanks for the illustration.


/I'd skin that pelt like a French trapper
//er... that's how you do it, right?


Dude, your supposed to make a thinly veiled sexual comment; not say something that you'd hear from Hannibal Lector.
 
2013-09-03 09:33:51 PM

DrPainMD: meat0918: HotIgneous Intruder: Because nothing on the Earth has ever changed, not the weather, not the landforms, not the temperatures, not anything.

Ask the dinosaurs how that change went for them.

We should be able to adapt, but busy body politicians beholden to special interests that want to maintain the status quo seem to want to hinder any attempt at adaptation unless it can make them a lot of money.

You need assistance from the government to adapt to change? Sad.


Don't be obtuse.
 
2013-09-03 09:40:25 PM
Although the climate IS changing, and sea ice IS thinning at the Arctic; and awareness DOES need to be raised....it's still the freaking Arctic and the Northwest Passage is still icebound 11 months out of the year.

Try to keep up, everyone.
 
2013-09-03 09:51:43 PM
Yo, morons from TFA, it's melting, not melted, you might want to bone up on the differences.
 
2013-09-03 09:53:00 PM
There was a successful crossing by sailboat last year, which had record low ice coverage. This year is well below the 30-year average but nowhere near the 2012 low. Most of the open water is on the Russian side.

 i.imgur.com

This map shows a pixel as 'ice' if there's at least 15% coverage. A lot of that white area, including the area right around the geographic pole, is actually floating bits rather than a solid sheet.

i.imgur.com
(click for larger version, or here for other resolutions)
 
2013-09-03 09:56:23 PM

Gyrfalcon: Although the climate IS changing, and sea ice IS thinning at the Arctic; and awareness DOES need to be raised....it's still the freaking Arctic and the Northwest Passage is still icebound 11 months out of the year.

Try to keep up, everyone.


Not true at all. We need to shut down all our dirty, dirty industry, and force the 99% to live in caves. Otherwise we will all die.
 
2013-09-03 10:00:58 PM
Quick! Someone give some rich white guys a lot of money so they can pretend they're doing something about this!
 
2013-09-03 10:03:28 PM
And they're all so glad at the end of the article to get back to their warm beds. That modern, polluting tech gave them.
 
2013-09-03 10:16:00 PM

DesertDemonWY: All that thin, decaying and rotten first year ice can be a real buggar


Plus all the floating dead polar bears.  Can probably walk the NW passage on their corpses and not get your feet wet.
 
2013-09-03 10:26:08 PM

HotIgneous Intruder: Because nothing on the Earth has ever changed, not the weather, not the landforms, not the temperatures, not anything.


untaken_name: Quick! Someone give some rich white guys a lot of money so they can pretend they're doing something about this!


RedVentrue: Not true at all. We need to shut down all our dirty, dirty industry, and force the 99% to live in caves. Otherwise we will all die.


Whoever says these things??

Oh yeah ... deniers when they build their idiotic strawmen.

Why do you guys think you can make a valid point when you are so blatantly dishonest??
 
2013-09-03 10:32:54 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: I'd call that REALITY, not FARK.

We see it all the time around here - environmentalists from everywhere but here, coming here to prove that their idea is real, with absolutely no clue what the fark they're talking about in reality.  Lots of computer models,  and hearsay, and "F*CK YEAH!  Take Down Tha MAN!" kinds of things, but no one who has a firm grasp on provable reality.


I don`t know where exactly you`re from, but I definitely know you haven`t been that far north, because in the Arctic regions, global warming is pretty much acknowledged as fact.  Every elder up here knows it, every researcher that goes to Herschel Island for the thaw slumps knows it, and the mountains of hard evidence definitely shows it.

You can argue all you want about the actual underlying cause of it, but it`s a fact that global warming is effecting things up here in a major way...
 
2013-09-03 10:39:25 PM
IT'S STILL WAY LESS FROZEN THAN IT SHOULD BE TARDMITTER GAWD
 
2013-09-03 10:41:39 PM
I don't see why planting crops in the future in what was a frozen useless wasteland is supposed to be a problem.  Water is plentiful and the sun shines 24 hours a day there in the summer.  Think of the food yields.


We're 6+ billion people on this planet and growing. Think about it.
 
2013-09-03 10:45:54 PM
They also saw a wildlife that normally does not live so far north, including grizzly bears on the rocky shores - where they might have expected polar bears on snow - and at least one beaver swimming in the Arctic Ocean, said rower Denis Barnett.


How about no:

gothunts.com


As for the beavers, it's range actually doesn't go to the northern coast, however it's relatively close where finding one swimming in the Arctic, while rare, would hardly be considered proof of any change in it's range
 
2013-09-03 11:01:13 PM

Is Annual Arctic Sea Ice On Decent Track For A Change?

Quote: "It is hard to interpret this as meaning anything other than the crisis of Arctic Sea ice melting too much and too fast is over."

 
2013-09-03 11:02:48 PM

Abox: Beavers in the Arctic


i31.tinypic.com
 
2013-09-03 11:05:12 PM

Larmer: I don`t know where exactly you`re from, but I definitely know you haven`t been that far north, because in the Arctic regions, global warming is pretty much acknowledged as fact. Every elder up here knows it, every researcher that goes to Herschel Island for the thaw slumps knows it, and the mountains of hard evidence definitely shows it.


The people whose buildings have been swallowed by the not-so-perma frost know it, too.  Are the guys who drive trucks across frozen lakes finding their season cut shorter?
 
2013-09-03 11:09:48 PM

Strongbeerrules: I don't see why planting crops in the future in what was a frozen useless wasteland is supposed to be a problem. Water is plentiful and the sun shines 24 hours a day there in the summer. Think of the food yields.


The sun shines at a shallow angle; there is less sunlight per acre.  In practice, this means that plants shade each other, and you don't get as much total output.

Plus, you may be misunderstanding just how much northern land is available, if you have been looking at a Mercator projection.  Canada is big, but not as big as it looks on most maps.
 
2013-09-03 11:11:15 PM

dennysgod: They also saw a wildlife that normally does not live so far north, including grizzly bears on the rocky shores - where they might have expected polar bears on snow - and at least one beaver swimming in the Arctic Ocean, said rower Denis Barnett.


How about no:

[gothunts.com image 322x350]


As for the beavers, it's range actually doesn't go to the northern coast, however it's relatively close where finding one swimming in the Arctic, while rare, would hardly be considered proof of any change in it's range


The grizzlies are moving outside their current range and into polar bear habitat in northeastern Manitoba.  Dr. Robert Rockwell and his team have documented this:

http ://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=124115253

http://research.amnh.org/~rfr/rockwelletal09.pdf

Can't say anything about the beavers though.
 
2013-09-03 11:30:12 PM

iheartscotch: Christ on a crutch! We've been looking for that northwest passage thing for 3 centuries. Maybe it's time we admit that being TECHNICALLY navigable is not the same thing as being a navigable waterway.


Wait.
 
2013-09-03 11:40:22 PM

Larmer: Benevolent Misanthrope: I'd call that REALITY, not FARK.

We see it all the time around here - environmentalists from everywhere but here, coming here to prove that their idea is real, with absolutely no clue what the fark they're talking about in reality.  Lots of computer models,  and hearsay, and "F*CK YEAH!  Take Down Tha MAN!" kinds of things, but no one who has a firm grasp on provable reality.

I don`t know where exactly you`re from, but I definitely know you haven`t been that far north, because in the Arctic regions, global warming is pretty much acknowledged as fact.  Every elder up here knows it, every researcher that goes to Herschel Island for the thaw slumps knows it, and the mountains of hard evidence definitely shows it.

You can argue all you want about the actual underlying cause of it, but it`s a fact that global warming is effecting things up here in a major way...


OOC, where are you at?
 
2013-09-03 11:42:43 PM

GeneralJim: Is Annual Arctic Sea Ice On Decent Track For A Change?


"There is a more severe problem happening that these graphs don't show; the melting of old ice, ice that is thicker, with multiple years all jammed up into thicker ice, has been severe over recent years. This ice is important because it forms the foundation on which new sea ice forms every year. Even if the climate went back to "normal" because some technology was invented that sucked all the extra Carbon Dioxide out of the atmosphere to return us to pre-industrial levels was implemented, the lack of old ice would mean that regeneration of sea ice in the Arctic each year would be difficult, and it would probably take several year get the Arctic Sea back to a decent track."
 
2013-09-03 11:46:10 PM

DrPainMD: cameroncrazy1984: Benevolent Misanthrope: I'd call that REALITY, not FARK.

We see it all the time around here - environmentalists from everywhere but here, coming here to prove that their idea is real, with absolutely no clue what the fark they're talking about in reality.  Lots of computer models,  and hearsay, and "F*CK YEAH!  Take Down Tha MAN!" kinds of things, but no one who has a firm grasp on provable reality.

You mean the provable reality that, while some ships cannot pass through, the ice layer is thinning? You mean that one?

Maybe the reality that the climate is always changing, and always will change.


Of all the weird things climate change deniers believe the
"this is just a natural cycle" idea has to be the weirdest.
They are basically saying "Sure we totally believe historical data that shows temperature cycles and trends but don't use that same information look at current trends. That is forbidden!"
 
2013-09-03 11:49:32 PM

Electrify: Well this settles it, man made climate change is fake and Sarah Palin is automatically the new President of the United States.


Checkmate, denier!

/extra derpoints for tieing aGW to TEA Party
//Your Dem masters are proud
 
2013-09-03 11:59:47 PM

vygramul: GeneralJim: Is Annual Arctic Sea Ice On Decent Track For A Change?

"There is a more severe problem happening that these graphs don't show; the melting of old ice, ice that is thicker, with multiple years all jammed up into thicker ice, has been severe over recent years. This ice is important because it forms the foundation on which new sea ice forms every year. Even if the climate went back to "normal" because some technology was invented that sucked all the extra Carbon Dioxide out of the atmosphere to return us to pre-industrial levels was implemented, the lack of old ice would mean that regeneration of sea ice in the Arctic each year would be difficult, and it would probably take several year get the Arctic Sea back to a decent track."


Don't bother answering the Green Man; he believes as long as it's cold today, any net warming trend IS OVER FOR GOOD PRAISE GOD AND JESUS!!
 
2013-09-04 12:05:18 AM

Gyrfalcon: vygramul: GeneralJim: Is Annual Arctic Sea Ice On Decent Track For A Change?

"There is a more severe problem happening that these graphs don't show; the melting of old ice, ice that is thicker, with multiple years all jammed up into thicker ice, has been severe over recent years. This ice is important because it forms the foundation on which new sea ice forms every year. Even if the climate went back to "normal" because some technology was invented that sucked all the extra Carbon Dioxide out of the atmosphere to return us to pre-industrial levels was implemented, the lack of old ice would mean that regeneration of sea ice in the Arctic each year would be difficult, and it would probably take several year get the Arctic Sea back to a decent track."

Don't bother answering the Green Man; he believes as long as it's cold today, any net warming trend IS OVER FOR GOOD PRAISE GOD AND JESUS!!


Close. It's a different religion.
 
2013-09-04 12:22:47 AM

DrPainMD: cameroncrazy1984: Benevolent Misanthrope: I'd call that REALITY, not FARK.

We see it all the time around here - environmentalists from everywhere but here, coming here to prove that their idea is real, with absolutely no clue what the fark they're talking about in reality.  Lots of computer models,  and hearsay, and "F*CK YEAH!  Take Down Tha MAN!" kinds of things, but no one who has a firm grasp on provable reality.

You mean the provable reality that, while some ships cannot pass through, the ice layer is thinning? You mean that one?

Maybe the reality that the climate is always changing, and always will change.


Holy cow, you're a genius!
 
2013-09-04 12:28:20 AM

GeneralJim: Is Annual Arctic Sea Ice On Decent Track For A Change?


Yes, it's back on track. Difficulty: that 'track' is still trending downward at a decent rate.

i.imgur.com
 
2013-09-04 12:34:42 AM

Ivo Shandor: GeneralJim: Is Annual Arctic Sea Ice On Decent Track For A Change?

Yes, it's back on track. Difficulty: that 'track' is still trending downward at a decent rate.

[i.imgur.com image 640x465]


As usual, you alarmists are liars:

www.bitlogic.com
 
2013-09-04 12:55:35 AM

vygramul:


GeneralJim: Is Annual Arctic Sea Ice On Decent Track For A Change?

"There is a more severe problem happening that these graphs don't show; the melting of old ice, ice that is thicker, with multiple years all jammed up into thicker ice, has been severe over recent years. This ice is important because it forms the foundation on which new sea ice forms every year. Even if the climate went back to "normal" because some technology was invented that sucked all the extra Carbon Dioxide out of the atmosphere to return us to pre-industrial levels was implemented, the lack of old ice would mean that regeneration of sea ice in the Arctic each year would be difficult, and it would probably take several year get the Arctic Sea back to a decent track."

That's simple horseshiat -- an unending stream of assumptions that have been proven wrong.

First, we are in an ice age -- that is, Earth has ice caps.  Earth normally does NOT have ice caps.  Ice ages are generally 20-40 million years, and happen every 150-250 million years, depending upon whether the Sun is in a galactic arm or not.  This means that if the climate were to go back to "normal," it would be 7-10 K WARMER than now.  Proxy temperature records don't give us the very fine resolution necessary to tell if this is the actual coldest Earth has been since diverse life spread over the planet -- or just tied for the coldest.  It is so cold now, that shortly (geologically) temperature will drop another 8-10 K, and we will have ice sheets covering North America down to about Kentucky.  A tiny bit of warming is the LAST thing we should be worried about.

And, if we could "suck out the extra carbon dioxide" from the air, the temperature would drop most likely about 0.15 K, with around 0.30 K being the maximum.  And that would be an unwise course of action, and not only because we can use every scrap of heat we can get.  Planet Earth has greened considerably recently, most likely due to carbon dioxide levels getting closer to normal levels.  (We are ALSO at the lowest concentration of carbon dioxide EVER.)

So your objective would be to take two of the variables in the equation that is Earth that are currently a bit out of whack, and make them MORE out of whack.  Good plan, Captain Planet.  Don't forget to add more soot to the air, while you're at it.

 
2013-09-04 12:55:41 AM
Al Gore assured me the Science is settled. Global Warming means it will get a lot colder.
 
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