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(NPR)   Pastor preaching against vaccinations at megachurch, which is now the site of a measles outbreak: "So I'm going to tell you what the facts are and the facts are the facts but then we know the truth, that always overcomes facts"   (npr.org) divider line 54
    More: Followup, Weekend Edition Sunday, vaccinations, outbreaks, measles, Children's Hospital of Philadelphia, MMR vaccine, sermons, truth  
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14985 clicks; posted to Main » on 01 Sep 2013 at 1:04 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Funniest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2013-09-01 10:21:22 AM  
21 votes:
4.bp.blogspot.com
2013-09-01 01:37:19 PM  
6 votes:
Infernalist: lokis_mentor: It's a church in Texas.  Someone call Janet Reno. She'll fix it.

90% of this crowd won't get your reference without googling Janet Reno.


90% of this crowd will fail to see how a dance party will help.
2013-09-01 01:33:20 PM  
6 votes:
It's a church in Texas.  Someone call Janet Reno. She'll fix it.
2013-09-01 01:31:17 PM  
6 votes:

Gergesa: cause I know Jesus is a healer, so I know he's covered us with the blood," Mwangi says.

I think she may be a worshiper of Khorne.


MORE BLOOD FOR MY KHORNE FLAKES.
2013-09-01 01:01:15 PM  
4 votes:
"So I'm going to tell you what the facts are, and the facts are the facts, but then we know the truth. That always overcomes facts," she has said.

I love, love, love that that is an actual quote.

You just can't write self-parody that unconsciously witty, You just can't.
2013-09-01 11:43:20 AM  
4 votes:

Peki: Darwin doesn't always reward the smartest, just the most successful at breeding.


This.  Just ask Clevon

api.ning.com
2013-09-01 08:54:03 PM  
3 votes:
Great Porn Dragon: I am actually a bit of an apatheist now, in part because I sincerely do believe that if the Abrahamic Deity actually GAVE a literal goddamn about humanity that "prosperity gospel" hucksters would be among the first against the wall (along with religionationalist terrorists like Al Quaida and the Army of God).  Because Prosperity Gospel Farking Kills.

I used to be a regular attendee at the local Apatheist church, but one day I stopped going because I realized I just didn't care anymore.
2013-09-01 04:32:52 PM  
3 votes:
"Because I know Jesus is a healer, so I know he's covered us with the blood," Mwangi says. "There's no place for fear."

Well, there's your problem!  Blood is a well-known vector for infectious disease.  Letting yourself get covered with the stuff is a sure-fire way to get sick.  This Jesus guy, he didn't go to med school, did he?
GBB
2013-09-01 03:21:10 PM  
3 votes:
wp.patheos.com.s3.amazonaws.com
2013-09-01 01:40:58 PM  
3 votes:
On the bright side, this would be a great reality show:  "Tard Circus," where several believers test their faith by swimming in infected blood, eating various contaminated bread, and seeing if they can take a bullet to the face to see how much they love God.  And if they catch something/die, then it's their fault and it's some sin that the announcer, safe in a plastic bubble, can make up on the spot.

It's much better than electing these sad idiots to any positions of power, really.
2013-09-01 01:30:26 PM  
3 votes:
cause I know Jesus is a healer, so I know he's covered us with the blood," Mwangi says.

I think she may be a worshiper of Khorne.
2013-09-01 11:57:24 AM  
3 votes:
Saw this biatch on the morning news last week...

Scared the crap out of my daughter when I started screaming at the screen.
2013-09-01 01:45:46 PM  
2 votes:

bigsteve3OOO: Raw_fishFood: bigsteve3OOO: If vaccines are effective then a few people not getting them should have zero effect on the rest of the vaccinated population.

Herd immunity works by having everybody who can get vaccinated, well, get vaccinated. By greatly reducing the people who can get sick this protects the people who cannot get vaccinated for legitimate reasons, like being too young or weak immune systems.

When people don't get vaccinated despite not having any medical reason not to do so it not only makes the people who can't get vaccinated more vulnerable but gives the disease a chance to mutate and infect people who are only vaccinated against the original strain.

Seems like praying to your god of science has not helped you.  Perhaps a different god would.


24.media.tumblr.com
2013-09-01 01:45:16 PM  
2 votes:

bigsteve3OOO: MithrandirBooga: bigsteve3OOO: If vaccines are effective then a few people not getting them should have zero effect on the rest of the vaccinated population.

WRONG.

FTFA:

"Typically, it's the fear that the combination measles-mumps-rubella, or MMR vaccine may have in some way contributed to the epidemic of autism - which has clearly been shown not to be true in study after study," Offit says. He says those who chose to skip vaccines cause serious ripple effects.

There are hundreds of thousands of people in the United States who can't get vaccinated because they're undergoing medical treatment or are too young, for example.

But people who omit vaccinations for whatever reason should only be exposed to vaccinated people therefore no risk.



You must be trolling, because nobody can possibly be this stupid.

bigsteve3OOO: MithrandirBooga: bigsteve3OOO: If vaccines are effective then a few people not getting them should have zero effect on the rest of the vaccinated population.

WRONG.

FTFA:

"Typically, it's the fear that the combination measles-mumps-rubella, or MMR vaccine may have in some way contributed to the epidemic of autism - which has clearly been shown not to be true in study after study," Offit says. He says those who chose to skip vaccines cause serious ripple effects.

There are hundreds of thousands of people in the United States who can't get vaccinated because they're undergoing medical treatment or are too young, for example.

But people who omit vaccinations for whatever reason should only be exposed to vaccinated people therefore no risk.


0/10. I did not enjoy my trolling experience with this troll at all. I would not utilize his services again. Caveat Emptor.
2013-09-01 01:18:28 PM  
2 votes:
Can we try this?  Send a guy in a hazmat suit to the church and give away t-shirts covered in small pox that reads "Jesus saves!"..

If it doesn't wipe out the church, then the t-shirts are right.  If it does, I guess God was angry with them for some reason.  Possibly because of the gays.
2013-09-01 11:29:44 AM  
2 votes:
So let's get this straight-

Parents refuse vaccinations for their kid, kid doesn't get sick- "See, God protects our children!"

Parents refuse vaccinations for their kid, kid gets sick- "This is Gods will!"

Parents get vaccinations for their kid, kid doesn't get sick- "This is Gods will!"

Parents get vaccinations for their kid, kid gets sick - "It's that evil science!"
2013-09-01 11:53:27 PM  
1 votes:
24.media.tumblr.com

300+ posts and no one posts this? Fark I am disappoint.
2013-09-01 07:19:31 PM  
1 votes:

gja: Not all of us who identify as Christian are so universally idiotic.


Like all other mental illnesses and defects, religious belief has a spectrum of severity. You might think you lie on the lower end of the spectrum, like a highly functioning autistic or addict, but you still suffer from the same delusion and irrational beliefs as the full blown fundamentalists. 

In fact, I think it's very telling that the fundamentalists are proof for religious faith being a bad thing. if your religion has a problem with its fundamentalists, more than likely it's an issue with the fundamental beliefs and way of thinking your religion promotes.
2013-09-01 07:03:12 PM  
1 votes:

jayphat: I'd like to point out the Anthrax vaccine is not nearly as effective as you would believe. If memory serves correct from when both my brothers got vaccinated in the Army, you still have a 6 in 7 chance of getting Anthrax.


To be fair, the Army is pretty metal.

www.metal-archives.com
2013-09-01 07:02:02 PM  
1 votes:

Don't Troll Me Bro!: Peki: ....

Dude, you're arguing with someone who's handle is "derp."


And you're on Fark. Both just as productive. :)
2013-09-01 06:34:20 PM  
1 votes:

DoctorWhat: I'm sad that no one has photoshopped the picture in TFA to say "Measle Mountain Church".


Meh, don't have to.  The eagle on the right of the banner is flipping the bird to science, modern medicine, and all other libtardo wordly things of that ilk.

media.npr.org
2013-09-01 05:54:01 PM  
1 votes:

BadJazz: Saul T. Balzac: Saul T. Balzac:
THE DMV SKIPPED NUMBER 666!  It went straight from 664 665 to 667.

*facepalm*

Even the State of Georgia believes there's something wrong with the number 666!

FTFM

I saw a 666 XXX Oregon license plate a few days ago.  Made me smile.


s66256.gridserver.com
2013-09-01 05:06:15 PM  
1 votes:

Guest: bingo the psych-o: Dear Christians:

Immunization prevents more diseases than prayer ever will.  Insulin treats more diabetes than prayer ever will.  Chemotherapy has cured more cancers than prayer ever will.

Please, please, please educate yourselves for the sake of your own children.

Dear Christians:

God gave humans developedthe intelligence to discover immunizations.   God gave humans hadthe intelligence to discover insulin and God gave humans also hadthe intelligence to discover Chemotherapy.   Please start using them your intelligence as you are making God us reasonable and logical folks very sad that you are ignoranting all the good he has placed in your hands.


FTFY
2013-09-01 05:01:37 PM  
1 votes:
I'm not sure which I hate more... Measles, Texas, or Megachurches.
But right now, measles has the Bronze medal.
2013-09-01 04:22:00 PM  
1 votes:

pissnmoan: The truth and a few facts.

A rubella (measles) infection can cause miscarriage, preterm birth, or stillbirth, as well as a variety of birth defects, but it depends on how far along you are when you contract the virus. The risks are highest during the early stages of a baby's development and they go down as pregnancy progresses.
If you get rubella during the first 12 weeks of pregnancy, there's a high chance (up to 85 percent) that your baby will develop CRS (Congenital Rubella Syndrome). The rate of CRS for a baby whose mother is infected between 13 and 16 weeks is about 54 percent, and the rate continues to go down sharply from there. After 20 weeks there's very little risk that the infection will cause a birth defect.
There's a wide range of very serious problems associated with CRS, most commonly deafness, eye defects (which may lead to blindness), heart malformations, and neurologic problems, such as mental retardation. Other defects may also be evident at birth, or problems may surface later in infancy and childhood.

Early in my professional training (1970's), I spent a couple of months in a care unit for children with CRS.  It was horrible, a living nightmare.  Just wait until some of these unvaccinated women start hitting reproductive age and then contracting rubella early in their pregnancies.  I suppose there will again be care units for children with CRS because their stupid mothers weren't vaccinated.


My mom tells the story of being exposed to rubella when she was pregnant for me. She's a nurse, and was working pediatrics, small kid with measles upchucked on her, she tested pregnant a few days later. Massive concern all around. II semed tu trun aut OK
2013-09-01 04:21:32 PM  
1 votes:

J. Frank Parnell: Promised myself i wouldn't post in another pro-vaccination troll thread.

/dammit


Well, yeah, now that you're here it IS a troll thread, Derptaculus.
2013-09-01 03:57:40 PM  
1 votes:
If it's truth you're looking for, Dr. Tyree's philosophy class is right down the hall.
2013-09-01 03:31:58 PM  
1 votes:
Because your science is not 100% effective and in some cases deadly; some people opt out.  You think they are fool.  I think they know statistics.
2013-09-01 03:22:14 PM  
1 votes:

Coming on a Bicycle: You don't die from Measles. Or well, hardly anyone dies from Measles. I mean, my kids are vaccinated as well, but certain things in modern day medicine are simply luxury, and that's not bad. But at least be so fair as to acknowledge that, and let's not pretend some parents are complicit in causing the Second Plague here.


Apparently someone isn't aware of the complications of measles, then (like, oh, fun things like subacute sclerosing panencephalitis and other forms of measles encephalitis)--not only can measles kill, it also can pretty much render you into a rutabaga if one is unlucky, so to speak.

Also, we have a LOT more immunocompromised people (both in numbers and as a percentage of the population) than we had in the days of "pox parties"--not just folks with HIV (and AIDS and ARC--the latter being basically "pre-AIDS") but kids born with immunodeficiencies, people with asthma, people with rheumatoid arthritis and Crohn's disease and psoriasis and multiple sclerosis (which anymore are routinely treated with certain immunosuppressants, now that we realise that these are autoimmune diseases), people who've had organ and tissue transplants (again, immunosuppressants happen), even shiat like type I and type II and OTHER forms of diabetes (some of which are autoimmunity-linked; all diabetes makes you more susceptible to things going bad with getting sick, and there is a theory that in at least SOME types of autoimmune diabetes the downward spiral IS triggered by catching a virus in childhood).

And now you all are going to have the rare pleasure of seeing me go on a DOUBLE rant.  I'm going to TRY to keep this short and sweet:

a) Vaccines do not cause autism.  Your gebroken swimmers and eggs cause autism (probably because they're too old or you have a milder version of the gebrokenness); almost all ASD that does not have some other form of known genetic basis is a neural and cellular migration and differentiation disorder (and it probably affects all cells)--one we can literally detect in the placenta, the VERY FIRST ORGAN that forms in an embryo, which is a major clue-by-four that it's broken genes that are responsible.

(Mind, these prosperity-gospel-peddling chucklefarks probably don't even BELIEVE in gene and germ theory, thinking diseases are caused by demonic oppression or possession...yes, unfortunately, I grew up in a church of folks who would be Fellow Travellers to the Texas megachurch chucklefarks, hence my unfortunate knowledge.  I'm mostly posting this for REASONABLE people.)

b) Prosperity gospel maims, kills, and is probably one of the very few religious movements that I think NEEDS to be given a very hairy eyeball by CPS officials because of the real risk of damage to kids who HAVE NO FARKING SAY.  You know, like those poor kids who are farking sick with the measles thanks to the "name it and claim yer healing!" and "Diseases are really the result of demons that infest you because your distant ancestors read HOROSCOPES!" goddamn bullshiat chucklefarkery.

(Yes, this is a subject that gets me livid to near-Khornate levels.  I've seen where prosperity gospel has killed, firsthand; my smother, who eventually died of a massive heart attack caused by complications of a previous cardiac arrest (which was in turn the result of poorly-controlled diabetes) when she stopped going to cardio rehab thanks to some goddamn name-it-and-claim-it hucksterfark telling her she had a Miraculous Healing Coming.   I lived in effective poverty my entire childhood because said smother would give fully fifty percent of the pre-tax income to the church under the Prosperity Gospel Delusion that somehow the Abrahamic God ran a Ponzi For Christ.  I have PERMANENT, UNCORRECTABLE (nope, not even glasses work) vision impairment in one of my eyes because of the fact aforementioned smother did NOT get the surgery that was recommended (by one of the best pediatric opthamologists in the state) but instead went to numerous "prosperity gospel" services to fill the preacher's coffers and try to pray the eye fixed.)

c) I am actually a bit of an apatheist now, in part because I sincerely do believe that if the Abrahamic Deity actually GAVE a literal goddamn about humanity that "prosperity gospel" hucksters would be among the first against the wall (along with religionationalist terrorists like Al Quaida and the Army of God).  Because Prosperity Gospel Farking Kills.

(And this is not just restricted to the Abrahamics; there are certain groups like Soka Gakkai that I would love to see die in a fire and sent to one of the 108 Hells because they're pretty much the Buddhist version of "name it and claim it" chucklefarkery; hell, one of the Korean "name it and claim" it arsecoonts who pretty much popularised the concept of cell churches (one "David" nee "Paul" Yonggi Cho, may the sanshin have a special hell prepared for him) pretty much ADMITS he cribbed the concept from the Nichiren "prosperity gospel" hucksters..)
2013-09-01 03:04:05 PM  
1 votes:

mhuckins: Dinki: So let's get this straight-

Parents refuse vaccinations for their kid, kid doesn't get sick- "See, God protects our children!"

Parents refuse vaccinations for their kid, kid gets sick- "This is Gods will!"

Parents get vaccinations for their kid, kid doesn't get sick- "This is Gods will!"

Parents get vaccinations for their kid, kid gets sick - "It's that evil science!"

Don't forget parents refuse vaccinations for their kid, kid gets sick, infects someone allergic to the vaccination- "oops".

I don't want to find out the hard way that I am not immune to measles because some dickhead chose not to vaccinate their kids. The odds of a serious allergic reaction are so small there is no reason not to inoculate your kids.


They'd better not try any of this nonsense in Madagascar.
2013-09-01 02:50:31 PM  
1 votes:

SilentStrider: If I weren't agnostic i'd be praying that this guy gets struck down by lightning.


It's still okay to pray if you seriously doubt it will do any good.
2013-09-01 02:30:14 PM  
1 votes:

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: When a liberal celebrity does it: "Ooh lets examine the science, it's good to question big Pharma!"

When a pastor does it: "Haha, dumb hillbillies, they dont bieve in science and modern medicine, what a bunch of rubes!"


Way to beat the shiat out of that strawman.  I hope it made you feel momentarily brave.
2013-09-01 02:27:26 PM  
1 votes:

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: I'm being persecuted? In what way?


Some people indulge others in this "explain my own post back to me" game.  I don't.
2013-09-01 02:20:44 PM  
1 votes:

Ilmarinen: Coming on a Bicycle: Lachwen: Mentat: Coming on a Bicycle: You don't die from Measles. Or well, hardly anyone dies from Measles. I mean, my kids are vaccinated as well, but certain things in modern day medicine are simply luxury, and that's not bad. But at least be so fair as to acknowledge that, and let's not pretend some parents are complicit in causing the Second Plague here.

You know measles isn't the only disease out there, right?  You know people still get bubonic plague, right?

And let's not forget that measles may be an uncomfortable but ultimately non-serious disease for most children, if you contract it as an adult you run a MUCH higher risk of serious, permanent damage, like blindness and sterility.

Sure. But that's more of a risk you run in an almost-fully-vaccinated society, than in a hardly-vaccinated-at-all society. Because in the latter environment, you would have had it as a child. So I would contend that you're arguing against yourself here.

Vaccinated people HAVE had it as a child.


Yes. But what I meant is (at the risk of explaining myself to a troll) - that non-vaccinated people walking around in an almost-fully-vaccinated environment, run a much greater risk of catching it as an adult, because they are more mobile as an adult. Our society is the almost-fully-vaccinated environment, and therefore much more dangerous to the non-vaccinated. Were our society the non-vaccinated kind, then people would have had an equal chance to get it as a child (because when you're vaccinated, you get the disease, but you're not - or hardly - contageous). Which is why - to the non-vaccinated person, the non-vaccinated society is the better one. Get my point?
2013-09-01 02:06:03 PM  
1 votes:

limeyfellow: Coming on a Bicycle: You don't die from Measles. Or well, hardly anyone dies from Measles. I mean, my kids are vaccinated as well, but certain things in modern day medicine are simply luxury, and that's not bad. But at least be so fair as to acknowledge that, and let's not pretend some parents are complicit in causing the Second Plague here.

That is because we have vaccines. Before then it had a 5% death rate. There was a 33% rate of complications including pneumonia, very deadly before antibiotics, hearing loss, and seizures.


Yeah, because in those days, there were no other complicating factors to the death rate of Measles. The truth is, we don't know what the death rate of Measles is in the modern day Western world, because we hardly see it. But I would bet dollars to donuts that it's not going to be 5%. We're just too good for that, nowadays.
2013-09-01 02:03:46 PM  
1 votes:

Tigger: Benevolent Misanthrope: Earlier this week crowds flooded in for regular services. Rose Mwangi had her Bible in hand, and said she's not worried.
 

"Because I know Jesus is a healer, so I know he's covered us with the blood," Mwangi says. "There's no place for fear."

"The concerns we have had are primarily with very young children who have family history of autism and with bundling too many immunizations at one time," she [the pastor] said.
 

"You don't take the word of the guy that's trying to give the shot about what's good and what isn't," he [pastor's father, noted nutbag Kenneth Copland] said.

And Christians wonder why the rest of us think of them as a bunch of servile f*ckwits.

Ideas as stupid as these eventually eliminate the individuals who support them. It just takes too farking long.


"The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right." - Mark Twain
2013-09-01 01:45:24 PM  
1 votes:
bigsteve3OOO: Seems like praying to your god of science has not helped you. Perhaps a different god would.

I pray to the god of bagel bites, riding mowers, and masturbating with a honey bear. It works.
F42
2013-09-01 01:44:42 PM  
1 votes:

vpb: Besides, it's not too hard to figure out that someone with a fatal genetic flaw who is able to survive and breed because of modern medicine


...does not, therefore, have a fatal flaw. By definition.
2013-09-01 01:43:14 PM  
1 votes:

lokis_mentor: It's a church in Texas.  Someone call Janet Reno. She'll fix it.


Hey, did you catch the latest episode of Friends?
2013-09-01 01:39:50 PM  
1 votes:
Okay, let me see if I can get this straight.  In this scenario, the facts are the known knowns, but the truth is the known unknowns.  So until we know the known unknowns, we can't trust the known knowns.  And Pastor Copeland clearly knowns the known unknowns, and he's trying to teach us that he knows what we don't know about the known knowns.   Capisce?

//This has been another episode of Conservative Logic.
2013-09-01 01:36:22 PM  
1 votes:
On the one hand, this is farking hilarious. Enjoy your preventable diseases, you stupid pieces of shiat.

On the other hand, if my kid got measles because some Jesus-freaks decided not to vaccinate, I might be inclined to exercise my second amendment rights at their next congregation.
2013-09-01 01:34:34 PM  
1 votes:

lokis_mentor: It's a church in Texas.  Someone call Janet Reno. She'll fix it.


90% of this crowd won't get your reference without googling Janet Reno.
2013-09-01 01:32:51 PM  
1 votes:
The truth is that you got your facts wrong.
2013-09-01 01:29:50 PM  
1 votes:

bigsteve3OOO: If vaccines are effective then a few people not getting them should have zero effect on the rest of the vaccinated population.


If god is effective then a few people not believing in god should have zero effect...
2013-09-01 01:28:15 PM  
1 votes:
For reference, here's how creators of vaccines were viewed around a century ago:

farm6.staticflickr.com

It's one of those "it's so effective, people take for granted that it is what's working" phenomena. Like "there's no lead in my water, I guess we don't need a clean water act."
2013-09-01 01:27:20 PM  
1 votes:

gilgigamesh: "So I'm going to tell you what the facts are, and the facts are the facts, but then we know the truth. That always overcomes facts," she has said.
I love, love, love that that is an actual quote.
You just can't write self-parody that unconsciously witty, You just can't.


I came in here to see who latched on to that.

You are right. The only other story I heard that came near it was during the debate, years ago, to introduce classes in Spanish at a local school. Some old lady stood up and waved a bible in the air and said, "English was good enough for Jesus and the Prophets. It should be good enough for us."
2013-09-01 01:25:24 PM  
1 votes:
but Pearsons released a statement after the outbreak saying she isn't anti-vaccine. But Pearsons added that she still has some reservations about vaccines. "The concerns we have had are primarily with very young children who have family history of autism and with bundling too many immunizations at one time," she said.

 . . . . citing the research of world famous immunologist, Dr Jenny McCarthy.
2013-09-01 01:25:03 PM  
1 votes:

vpb: There actually is a theory called dysgenics that proposes that people are becoming less healthy because harmful mutations don't die out because of modern medicine.


This.

Hell, just look at how many people have horrible eyesight today.

150-200 years ago, I probably wouldn't have lived past childhood, or if I did, I would have been labeled a moron or something because I can't see six inches in front of my face.

/happy little cyborg
2013-09-01 01:19:43 PM  
1 votes:
Is that eagle on their banner giving me the finger?
2013-09-01 01:18:41 PM  
1 votes:
Enjoy God's plan.
2013-09-01 01:07:38 PM  
1 votes:
farm3.staticflickr.com
2013-09-01 12:55:31 PM  
1 votes:
If I weren't agnostic i'd be praying that this guy gets struck down by lightning.
2013-09-01 11:58:28 AM  
1 votes:

vpb: Tigger: Ideas as stupid as these eventually eliminate the individuals who support them. It just takes too farking long.

There is no natural selection anymore.  Stupidity has become survivable because modern society will provide food and medical treatment.


It's more complex than that.

The rate of human evolution actually appears to be accelerating. Despite the well-argued claims of a cult comedy's opening credits.
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-09-01 11:38:15 AM  
1 votes:

Tigger: Ideas as stupid as these eventually eliminate the individuals who support them. It just takes too farking long.


There is no natural selection anymore.  Stupidity has become survivable because modern society will provide food and medical treatment.
 
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