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(xoJane)   Remember the Jon Favreau answering machine scene in "Swingers"? This man wrote a letter that is the equivalent   (xojane.com) divider line 83
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14629 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Aug 2013 at 2:03 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-08-26 03:38:17 PM  

tripleseven: I obsessed over my fiancée for about 3 months, while she avoided me.

Finally, one day it happened. She gave reasons for the distance, which were extremely valid.

Not to encourage any sad sacks out there, but, just imagine if I had not continued in my pursuit.


You sound like a predator.  According to a recent questionnaire here, that is textbook sexual harassment.
 
2013-08-26 03:45:18 PM  

mesmer242: When I was in high school, I was complaining about some perceived slight to my mom and she turned to me and said "You know, people don't usually do things to you as much as they do things for themselves." Totally rocked my adolescent worldview because, well, I was a stupid teenager. But it helped.  Sounds the kid who wrote the letter could have used a dose of similar advice at some point.


That's a great quote, and one that I'm stealing shamelessly (because, well look at the quote).
 
2013-08-26 03:46:53 PM  
I bet the next time the guy approaches he will have a shovel and quicklime in his trunk.
 
2013-08-26 03:47:26 PM  
"You wouldn't worry what other people think of you if you knew how seldom they do."
 
2013-08-26 03:47:26 PM  

OldManDownDRoad: CrazyCracka420: OldManDownDRoad you sound like the guy in the comic that Cyno01 posted.

Why do you have so many close female friends?

Because I'm old (pushing 60) and macking on females is something I gave up 30 years ago when I got married?

Just a guess.


Well that makes perfect sense then, but I'm still going to go out on a limb and suggest these females are either mutual friends with other friends or family of yours (i.e. you don't go out just you and one of these female friends to hang out).  Or they are women that you would have sex with if they were willing and there were no repercussion (if it's the latter, those aren't friends).   .
 
2013-08-26 03:48:33 PM  

CrazyCracka420: Well

...

woot!  Simulpost!
 
2013-08-26 04:01:21 PM  

you have pee hands: As I get ready to open my mouth to say hello, you turn to someone on the opposite side of me to say something. My mind is thrown into a whirlwind of rage and my body starts shaking. How could you act ...

The guy's a whiny loser but what's so hard about actually answering the phone once and saying "It didn't work. I don't want to see you again." instead of just ignoring someone and hoping they stop calling?


because they may actually stop calling.  She is going after other unobtainable guys and getting partially rejected, but due to this guys interest, her ego can still be stroked by the fact that at least SOME guy likes her.  May not be the one she wants but its no like she is a loser that NO ONE likes.  It is an ego boost to drag people along like this.  This applies to both men and women, but it seems like women are more likely to keep someone around until they have someone else lined up.  Have known several women who will date just about anyone to not be alone while trying to get someone they desire.

Jeff Foxworthy has a joke about this where when she breaks up with you she has already found another horse or at least has the saddle ready.
 
2013-08-26 04:04:37 PM  

Precision Boobery: tripleseven: I obsessed over my fiancée for about 3 months, while she avoided me.

Finally, one day it happened. She gave reasons for the distance, which were extremely valid.

Not to encourage any sad sacks out there, but, just imagine if I had not continued in my pursuit.

You sound like a predator.  According to a recent questionnaire here, that is textbook sexual harassment.


no, it depends on how attractive he is:

If he is on par with Matthew McConaughey, then it is a lovable rom-com movie plot.

if he is your average guy, then it is the opening scenes for a serial killer movie plot.
 
2013-08-26 04:13:40 PM  

No Expectations: If this note was meaningless to her, why keep it for so long and then write about it?


It the one and only time a guy expressed real feelings for her.
 
2013-08-26 04:23:17 PM  

Salmon: I preferred pictures.

[205x270 from http://lisadelay.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/5737924_std.jpg image 205x270]


eat your ham Tina!
 
2013-08-26 04:24:57 PM  

hubiestubert: In all honesty, I hope all the self referenced "Nice Guys" read this and mebbee take a moment or two of reflection.


Here's the key part for those of you "Nice Guys" who thought TLDR:

"I remember zero ill will toward Adam. For whatever reason -- maybe because he liked me and didn't actually treat me like dirt? -- I wasn't into him at the time. I was of course obsessed with the guy who ignored me and would occasionally drunkenly come calling. Great judgment call there, Mandy."
 
2013-08-26 04:26:20 PM  

Cyno01: abhorrent1: Never saw swingers.

Really? Go watch it. Its a bit dated, but generally great. Launched several careers.


hubiestubert: In all honesty, I hope all the self referenced "Nice Guys" read this and mebbee take a moment or two of reflection.

[686x953 from http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/friends.png image 686x953]


I'm sure that's valid a decent percentage of the time. In my experience, the two times I've ended up in the friendzone started as friendships that progressed to the point where we were spending so much time together and having so much fun that I simply couldn't help wanting to take it to the next level and really be able to be in love with my best friend. Of course, I was a much younger man in those days. Both times I finally had to come out and say, "Hey, I can't do this anymore. I can't just be friends. Nothing else interests me the way that you do. And even though I know I'm risking the connection that we have, I just have to know how you feel."

Crash and burn. Twice. But the last thing I would have ever done is try to manipulate or cajole either of those two amazing women. And I think that's how it is for a lot of guys in those situations.

Personally, I've found that you know if you have that spark within the first 2 times being with someone. Or, to rephrase....if you're wondering after weeks if somebody is interested....they aren't.

YMMV, obviously. Love, and people, are also unpredictable.
 
2013-08-26 04:33:39 PM  

CrazyCracka420: OldManDownDRoad you sound like the guy in the comic that Cyno01 posted.

Why do you have so many close female friends?


Maybe it's because he uses the word "preggers"?
 
2013-08-26 04:37:39 PM  
Guys like the author of the letter always get themselves into trouble because they believe that simply being infatuated enough with the girl is enough, and it is not. They see the "jerks" ignoring the girls that they like and they think that they can make the girl happy by simply pouring love and attention on them. In reality, the "jerk" has something to offer, even if the girl can never articulate what that is exactly. Girls are also subconsciously aware that they, as flawed, selfish and mostly mediocre human beings, do not deserve that level of worship and find if creepy. I don't think that's a double standard either, if I had some girl who thought I was the most amazing man who ever lived, I would be totally weirded out and fear for the safety of my household pets. People like other people for what they can do for them, and the nice guy has nothing to offer but his cloying niceness, and that will never be enough.


That being said, your blog sucks, lady.
 
2013-08-26 04:43:22 PM  

Magnanimous_J: Guys like the author of the letter always get themselves into trouble because they believe that simply being infatuated enough with the girl is enough, and it is not. They see the "jerks" ignoring the girls that they like and they think that they can make the girl happy by simply pouring love and attention on them. In reality, the "jerk" has something to offer, even if the girl can never articulate what that is exactly. Girls are also subconsciously aware that they, as flawed, selfish and mostly mediocre human beings, do not deserve that level of worship and find if creepy. I don't think that's a double standard either, if I had some girl who thought I was the most amazing man who ever lived, I would be totally weirded out and fear for the safety of my household pets. People like other people for what they can do for them, and the nice guy has nothing to offer but his cloying niceness, and that will never be enough.


That being said, your blog sucks, lady.


100% this. At least, when you're under 30. If being with you isn't going to elevate somebody's status in some way, you have no shot. People are insecure enough on their own. That "jerk" is probably a somebody in his own circles.
 
2013-08-26 04:54:24 PM  
I saw someone write something a while back, I think on Cracked, that seems applicable here. Instead of sitting around wondering why that girl you were infatuated with never found you attractive, make yourself attractive. Being a nice guy isn't enough. There are lots of other nice guys out there, and they play guitar. Improve yourself. Achieve something. Write a book. Learn how to play an instrument. Excel in a career field. Give yourself something to offer to the opposite sex instead of just saying you are a nice guy and you aren't a jerk, selfish, etc. like all those other guys. It's like advertising for a restaurant and saying you haven't given anyone food poisoning.
 
2013-08-26 05:01:01 PM  
Here's my take (and I know you were all just waiting idly, nervously, twiddling your digits in anticipation...):

1. A lot of you skimmed the article, especially the parts where she explained that he was a good looking and successful guy who has done well for himself. They DID stay friends, this is years later, and the note had been forgotten and rediscovered.
2. Her estimation is that the note is both awkward and sweet, while he just finds it flat out embarrassing, but in a shrug-your-shoulder kind of way, because he doesn't mind her publishing it.
3. She uses the note as a kind of lesson that we shouldn't read too hard into other people's intentions. She also notes that it was her problems for being imperceptive and distant that she didn't pay enough heed to him.
4. Farkers can't help heaping aspersions upon either and/or both for their insecurities and poor choices to help them feel better than themselves, even if it means willfully ignoring the central points of the article.
5. It's a free country. You're allowed not to like the article or it's subjects, whether or not you were able to glean any insight from it.
6. I assign much to much importance to my own opinion, which according to the CRACKED douche thread makes me douche. I can accept this.
 
2013-08-26 05:02:26 PM  
Holy crap. My stint as an advice maven is gonna be short with that kinda grammar tardity.
 
2013-08-26 05:39:39 PM  

OldManDownDRoad:

And on and on. Sure, guys make bad decisions, but those bad decisions seem to be all over the map. Women's bad choices seem to revolve men who mistreat them. It's really sad, and one of the reasons I'm glad my close female friends are either happily married or have decided to just be single instead of dealing with guys who treat them like crap.

/and it's a damned mystery to me


People like that never learned the difference between lust and love. Most of the time, they're confusing the chemical cocktail that is happening around that person with feelings of genuine love. A lesson I had to learn myself growing up. Christ, I'm glad the internet wasn't what it is today when I was a teenager.

Com-un-sense: I saw someone write something a while back, I think on Cracked, that seems applicable here. Instead of sitting around wondering why that girl you were infatuated with never found you attractive, make yourself attractive. Being a nice guy isn't enough. There are lots of other nice guys out there, and they play guitar. Improve yourself. Achieve something. Write a book. Learn how to play an instrument. Excel in a career field. Give yourself something to offer to the opposite sex instead of just saying you are a nice guy and you aren't a jerk, selfish, etc. like all those other guys. It's like advertising for a restaurant and saying you haven't given anyone food poisoning.


I believe this is what you are talking about. Great article.
 
2013-08-26 05:47:22 PM  
Note to self:  Never date a blogger because she will invariably blog about you.
 
2013-08-26 05:51:51 PM  

Pumpernickel bread: Note to self:  Never date a blogger because she will invariably blog about you.


Counterpoint: at least you know what she would normally say behind your back.
 
2013-08-26 05:55:16 PM  

Cyno01: abhorrent1: Never saw swingers.

Really? Go watch it. Its a bit dated, but generally great. Launched several careers.


hubiestubert: In all honesty, I hope all the self referenced "Nice Guys" read this and mebbee take a moment or two of reflection.

[686x953 from http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/friends.png image 686x953]


Or

You all say that heaven made me beautiful, so much so that this beauty of mine, with a force you can't resist, makes you love me; and you say and even demand that, in return for the love you show me, I must love you. By the natural understanding which God has granted me I know that whatever is beautiful is lovable; but I can't conceive why, for this reason alone, a woman who's loved for her beauty should be obliged to love whoever loves her. What's more, it could happen that the lover of beauty is ugly, and since that which is ugly is loathsome, it isn't very fitting for him to say: 'I love you because you're beautiful; you must love me even though I'm ugly.'
Why do you think I should be obliged to give in to you, just because you say you love me dearly? Or else tell me this: if heaven had made me ugly instead of beautiful, would I have been right to complain about you for not loving me?
 
2013-08-26 06:19:12 PM  

keypusher: Cyno01: abhorrent1: Never saw swingers.

Really? Go watch it. Its a bit dated, but generally great. Launched several careers.


hubiestubert: In all honesty, I hope all the self referenced "Nice Guys" read this and mebbee take a moment or two of reflection.

[686x953 from http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/friends.png image 686x953]

Or

You all say that heaven made me beautiful, so much so that this beauty of mine, with a force you can't resist, makes you love me; and you say and even demand that, in return for the love you show me, I must love you. By the natural understanding which God has granted me I know that whatever is beautiful is lovable; but I can't conceive why, for this reason alone, a woman who's loved for her beauty should be obliged to love whoever loves her. What's more, it could happen that the lover of beauty is ugly, and since that which is ugly is loathsome, it isn't very fitting for him to say: 'I love you because you're beautiful; you must love me even though I'm ugly.'
Why do you think I should be obliged to give in to you, just because you say you love me dearly? Or else tell me this: if heaven had made me ugly instead of beautiful, would I have been right to complain about you for not loving me?


that's why i tell all the ladies, you must love me exactly as i love you!
 
2013-08-26 06:24:34 PM  
Thank god I didn't marry any of the women at University who conceeded to dating  me because I was "mysterious" or "brooding and dark." Truth was, I was a self-absorbed jerk and I treated them poorly.

Like many others though, I did hand-write (not type on a computer class Mac like this guy clearly did) a similar letter to one woman, but mostly that was because she was so far out of my league in playing games I had convinced myself that she was the one. If you're going to go down, do it in flames.
 
2013-08-26 07:50:39 PM  

Martian_Astronomer: Yeah, the letter is bad, but I'll say this: You may regret the girl you were hung up on, and you may badly regret how you did it, but you don't regret the fact that you at least tried.


This. I'm still kicking myself for not taking a shot with a girl I was in live with in High School. She had a huge heart, great personality, and was cute as could be. I, unfortunately, was determined not to get attached to anything where I was, so I eventually pushed her out of my life. Fast forward 10 years and she's engaged to what appears to be a kindly homeless beggar. Lucky, or at the very least Not Stupid, bastard!
 
2013-08-26 08:51:54 PM  
Wow, that was painful, but honestly, I have heard this type of thing isn't uncommon among other folks....
 
2013-08-26 09:34:01 PM  
no I don't remember that.

But then I try not to watch anything with vince vaughan in it.
 
2013-08-26 11:20:13 PM  
* reads article *
* all the way through *

Thank God. I thought it was my letter for a minute there. Christie, I hope you burned that letter.
 
2013-08-27 12:12:44 AM  
The emotions of a young man are irrelevant, unless he looks like Ryan Gosling or is an heir to a 7 figure estate.
 
2013-08-27 02:59:45 AM  
Jesus, that site is awful.
 
2013-08-27 07:41:56 AM  

Hyjamon: Precision Boobery: tripleseven: I obsessed over my fiancée for about 3 months, while she avoided me.

Finally, one day it happened. She gave reasons for the distance, which were extremely valid.

Not to encourage any sad sacks out there, but, just imagine if I had not continued in my pursuit.

You sound like a predator.  According to a recent questionnaire here, that is textbook sexual harassment.

no, it depends on how attractive he is:

If he is on par with Matthew McConaughey, then it is a lovable rom-com movie plot.

if he is your average guy, then it is the opening scenes for a serial killer movie plot.


Well, I did ask her to help me push a couch into my van...


(too obscure?)
 
2013-08-27 01:52:08 PM  

Cyno01: abhorrent1: Never saw swingers.

Really? Go watch it. Its a bit dated, but generally great. Launched several careers.


hubiestubert: In all honesty, I hope all the self referenced "Nice Guys" read this and mebbee take a moment or two of reflection.

[686x953 from http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/friends.png image 686x953]


OMG - this is still me. At least I'm some what attractive and every now and then a girl throws herself at me. But I always ruin it. Thinking if I'm not single how will this be able to happen. She's dated 4 jerks and a biatch since we broke up. FML...
 
2013-08-27 02:59:27 PM  

CrazyCracka420: mesmer242: When I was in high school, I was complaining about some perceived slight to my mom and she turned to me and said "You know, people don't usually do things to you as much as they do things for themselves." Totally rocked my adolescent worldview because, well, I was a stupid teenager. But it helped.  Sounds the kid who wrote the letter could have used a dose of similar advice at some point.

That's a great quote, and one that I'm stealing shamelessly (because, well look at the quote).


Agreed. I'm stealing this so I can tell it to my kid once he hits the right age.
 
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