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(Opposing Views)   Giving gay couples in the military extra time off to travel to a state that allows gay marriage is discrimination against heterosexual couples claims Sen. Jim Inhofe   (opposingviews.com) divider line 334
    More: Fail, U.S., discrimination, U.S. military, couples claims, The Oklahoman, Secretary of Defense Chuck Hagel, heterosexuals  
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1446 clicks; posted to Politics » on 23 Aug 2013 at 3:55 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-08-23 01:38:05 PM  
It is. Why should they get a "benefit" that's not given to hetero couples?
 
2013-08-23 01:42:44 PM  
Lets make it fair by only recognizing straight marriages from states where gay marriage is legal.
 
2013-08-23 01:43:14 PM  

dj_bigbird: It is. Why should they get a "benefit" that's not given to hetero couples?


I'm pretty sure if it was as hard for hetero couple to get married they would have the same "benefit."  And it's quite telling that you object to gay couples getting extra time to travel to places where they have equal rights, and not the fact that only 13 states have marriage equality.

/but remember, it's the libruls who hate the troops
 
2013-08-23 01:44:30 PM  
It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.
 
2013-08-23 01:45:23 PM  
Yes... talk about traditional marriage, in the state that has the highest divorce rate in the nation. You f*cking dickhole.
 
2013-08-23 01:46:47 PM  

dj_bigbird: It is. Why should they get a "benefit" that's not given to hetero couples?


Fine, so give heteros some time off to travel to a state that allows them to legally marry.

...what's that? They're already in one? Then STFU and GBTWedding.
 
2013-08-23 01:46:55 PM  

kronicfeld: It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.


So we increase the time that hetero couples have as long as they're going to the same states?
 
2013-08-23 01:48:19 PM  
also:
enda13.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-08-23 01:49:34 PM  

reillan: kronicfeld: It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.

So we increase the time that hetero couples have as long as they're going to the same states?


um... i'm pretty sure he was suggesting legalizing gay marriage nationwide.
 
2013-08-23 01:50:27 PM  
He's right.  It is discriminatory; gays are being given special treatment.

I suggest a reasonable solution: give straight troops the same treatment.  Allow them enough time off to get to travel to a state in which they can exercise their constitutional rights.
 
2013-08-23 01:51:19 PM  

reillan: kronicfeld: It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.

So we increase the time that hetero couples have as long as they're going to the same states?


It seems to me that it would be more efficient and more equitable and just to simply make marriage equality the law of the land, so that nobody has to travel to a different state to have their rights respected.
 
2013-08-23 01:53:32 PM  

FlashHarry: reillan: kronicfeld: It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.

So we increase the time that hetero couples have as long as they're going to the same states?

um... i'm pretty sure he was suggesting legalizing gay marriage nationwide.


Yeah, but that's unlikely to happen immediately.  This is a solution for "in the mean time" so Jim Inhofe can stop getting his precious feelings hurt.
 
2013-08-23 01:54:03 PM  
Dear Senator Dumbass:  the statements:

"I firmly support the Department of Defense's stated commitment to ensuring that all men and women who serve our country and their families should be treated fairly and equally.  and "I strongly oppose the Obama Administration's attack on traditional marriage and attempts to overturn the Defense of Marriage Act.

are mutually exclusive.
 
2013-08-23 01:56:22 PM  

Karac: He's right.  It is discriminatory; gays are being given special treatment.

I suggest a reasonable solution: give straight troops the same treatment.  Allow them enough time off to get to travel to a state in which they can exercise their constitutional rights.


or let's just ban hetero marriage in any state that doesn't allow gay marriage!
 
2013-08-23 01:58:49 PM  

reillan: also:
[enda13.files.wordpress.com image 350x272]


I get what you're trying to say, but you're completely wrong - and you're playing into bigots hands by tacitly endorsing their arguments.

Gay citizens do not deserve special rights - they deserve equal rights - the rights heterosexuals have already.

And if you want to accept their theory that we're creating a new right - they right to gay marriage then we're still talking about equal - not special - rights.  After all, when gay marriage is legalized from sea to shining sea it won't be limited to just homosexuals; straights will be allowed to marry someone of the same sex as well.
 
2013-08-23 02:12:40 PM  
reillan:

Yeah, but that's unlikely to happen immediately.  This is a solution for "in the mean time" so Jim Inhofe can stop getting his precious feelings hurt.

Well then, in the meantime, I suggest getting a team of long distance runners, hikers, football punters, and soccer fullbacks to take turns kicking Jim Inhofe in the fork repeatedly, so that he realizes he has bigger things to worry about than whether or not servicemen and women are allowed to get married.

That way everybody's happy.

Except Jim Inhofe, of course.  But the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
 
2013-08-23 02:13:52 PM  

Karac: reillan: also:
[enda13.files.wordpress.com image 350x272]

I get what you're trying to say, but you're completely wrong - and you're playing into bigots hands by tacitly endorsing their arguments.

Gay citizens do not deserve special rights - they deserve equal rights - the rights heterosexuals have already.

And if you want to accept their theory that we're creating a new right - they right to gay marriage then we're still talking about equal - not special - rights.  After all, when gay marriage is legalized from sea to shining sea it won't be limited to just homosexuals; straights will be allowed to marry someone of the same sex as well.


What I'm trying to say is "here's a meme associated with Inhofe's argument".  There was literally no more thought than that put into it.
 
2013-08-23 02:14:27 PM  

FloydA: reillan:

Yeah, but that's unlikely to happen immediately.  This is a solution for "in the mean time" so Jim Inhofe can stop getting his precious feelings hurt.

Well then, in the meantime, I suggest getting a team of long distance runners, hikers, football punters, and soccer fullbacks to take turns kicking Jim Inhofe in the fork repeatedly, so that he realizes he has bigger things to worry about than whether or not servicemen and women are allowed to get married.

That way everybody's happy.

Except Jim Inhofe, of course.  But the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.


I'd vote for that.
 
2013-08-23 02:22:36 PM  

reillan: Karac: reillan: also:
[enda13.files.wordpress.com image 350x272]

I get what you're trying to say, but you're completely wrong - and you're playing into bigots hands by tacitly endorsing their arguments.

Gay citizens do not deserve special rights - they deserve equal rights - the rights heterosexuals have already.

And if you want to accept their theory that we're creating a new right - they right to gay marriage then we're still talking about equal - not special - rights.  After all, when gay marriage is legalized from sea to shining sea it won't be limited to just homosexuals; straights will be allowed to marry someone of the same sex as well.

What I'm trying to say is "here's a meme associated with Inhofe's argument".  There was literally no more thought than that put into it.


And I'm just pointing out the flaws in that meme; it doesn't have a special right to be incorrect merely because it's in picture form.  A better one to use would be:
secondclasscitizen.info
or
24.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-08-23 02:39:08 PM  

Karac: reillan: Karac: reillan: also:
[enda13.files.wordpress.com image 350x272]

I get what you're trying to say, but you're completely wrong - and you're playing into bigots hands by tacitly endorsing their arguments.

Gay citizens do not deserve special rights - they deserve equal rights - the rights heterosexuals have already.

And if you want to accept their theory that we're creating a new right - they right to gay marriage then we're still talking about equal - not special - rights.  After all, when gay marriage is legalized from sea to shining sea it won't be limited to just homosexuals; straights will be allowed to marry someone of the same sex as well.

What I'm trying to say is "here's a meme associated with Inhofe's argument".  There was literally no more thought than that put into it.

And I'm just pointing out the flaws in that meme; it doesn't have a special right to be incorrect merely because it's in picture form.  A better one to use would be:
[secondclasscitizen.info image 427x334]
or
[24.media.tumblr.com image 403x403]


well, borrowing from your first question, gays would be asking for "special rights" in this case.  They get more days than heterosexual couples get to take off.  Equality would be to A. give homosexual couples the right to marry in every state, or B. give heterosexual couples the same extended amount of time.  I'm all in favor of A.  In the case of B, the only realistic way to do it would be the way I proposed (if you're going to one of those same states to get married, here's the extended amount of time), as otherwise the scales shift back the other direction and hetero couples would be getting, effectively, more downtime after their marriage (or more planning time before) by holding a marriage close to the base.

So in this case, the argument literally is: yes, give homosexual couples "special rights" (extra time off) to make up for "special wrongs" (preventing them from getting married close to base).
 
2013-08-23 02:51:17 PM  
Also commented that the grapes were sour and he didn't want them anyway.
 
2013-08-23 02:54:38 PM  
Also, Inhofe did not mention that he's a little teapot, short and stout.
 
2013-08-23 02:57:32 PM  
I spent 26 years in the military, it seems to me that it's time off to do something. Easy fix, give the exact same time to everyone getting married, (currently there is no time off for marriage). I would not want to try to explain to my troops why Pvt. Timmy got extra time to marry Pvt. John.
 
2013-08-23 03:07:28 PM  

Sofa_king_kewl: I spent 26 years in the military, it seems to me that it's time off to do something. Easy fix, give the exact same time to everyone getting married, (currently there is no time off for marriage). I would not want to try to explain to my troops why Pvt. Timmy got extra time to marry Pvt. John.


It wouldn't be that hard to explain.

"Christian fundamentalists in this state have stolen Timmy and John's right to get married as they see fit.  Therefore, in order to exercise there constitutional rights, they have to be able to travel to some non-bigoted jurisdiction and are being granted leave so that they can do so.

Now, before any of you go pouring a sand dune in your clit, you should know that most of this leave is scheduled between 1630 Friday and 0800 Monday - in other words, the weekend when none of you are going to be at work anyway.  Also, they'll have to pay out of pocket for plane tickets.  All in all, they probably get one day off and have to spend fifteen hundred dollars to do what the rest of you can during lunch.

If your panties are still in a bunch about it, then the next election is on such-and-such a date.  Go file your complaints at the ballot box."
 
2013-08-23 03:23:40 PM  
Would this be the SAME Sen. Inhofe who works tirelessly to prevent same-sex weddings of soldiers on their military bases? It is?  So they can't get married on base or go to another place either?

i.imgur.com

Somehow I sense Sen. Inhofe might just be playing to his base...
 
2013-08-23 03:24:15 PM  

Karac: He's right.  It is discriminatory; gays are being given special treatment.

I suggest a reasonable solution: give straight troops the same treatment.  Allow them enough time off to get to travel to a state in which they can exercise their constitutional rights.


This.  Just give everyone the same amount of time.  Straight people can do something else.  Gays can gay marry.  Everybody's happy.
 
2013-08-23 03:28:12 PM  
I wonder if there's a limit to the number of times this can be used? Gay marriages can end in divorce, too. I'd get divorced and remarried every Christmas and 4th of July.
 
2013-08-23 03:30:12 PM  

show me: I wonder if there's a limit to the number of times this can be used? Gay marriages can end in divorce, too. I'd get divorced and remarried every Christmas and 4th of July.


They already get 4 day weekends for those holidays.
 
2013-08-23 03:30:38 PM  

Somacandra: Would this be the SAME Sen. Inhofe who works tirelessly to prevent same-sex weddings of soldiers on their military bases? It is?  So they can't get married on base or go to another place either?

[i.imgur.com image 419x371]

Somehow I sense Sen. Inhofe might just be playing to his base...


To have such a stable base, he must have quite a wide stance.
 
2013-08-23 03:32:20 PM  

nekom: Karac: He's right.  It is discriminatory; gays are being given special treatment.

I suggest a reasonable solution: give straight troops the same treatment.  Allow them enough time off to get to travel to a state in which they can exercise their constitutional rights.

This.  Just give everyone the same amount of time.  Straight people can do something else.  Gays can gay marry.  Everybody's happy.


Are soldiers/airmen/sailors/Marines paid for their leave-time? If this happens, who's going to foot the bill for all this extra leave that the military now has to authorize? The Federal Government is just expected to foot another $80 trillion for every Sally SAWgunner and William Weapons Depot to tie the knot with an extra two days off?

// what's the current standard for nuptials?
// maybe if we let them marry on-base, they wouldn't need to travel...
 
2013-08-23 03:35:07 PM  

Somacandra: Would this be the SAME Sen. Inhofe who works tirelessly to prevent same-sex weddings of soldiers on their military bases? It is?  So they can't get married on base or go to another place either?



Somehow I sense Sen. Inhofe might just be playing to his base...


Pretty damn much.
 
2013-08-23 03:42:26 PM  

kronicfeld: It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.


Me too, but don't you need a swimming pool to play marco polo?
 
2013-08-23 03:44:00 PM  

Dr Dreidel: nekom: Karac: He's right.  It is discriminatory; gays are being given special treatment.

I suggest a reasonable solution: give straight troops the same treatment.  Allow them enough time off to get to travel to a state in which they can exercise their constitutional rights.

This.  Just give everyone the same amount of time.  Straight people can do something else.  Gays can gay marry.  Everybody's happy.

Are soldiers/airmen/sailors/Marines paid for their leave-time? If this happens, who's going to foot the bill for all this extra leave that the military now has to authorize? The Federal Government is just expected to foot another $80 trillion for every Sally SAWgunner and William Weapons Depot to tie the knot with an extra two days off?

// what's the current standard for nuptials?
// maybe if we let them marry on-base, they wouldn't need to travel...


Military members get 30 days of leave a year.  Gay troops will get extra to travel to a non-bigoted state.  But as I said, those extra days will most likely be Friday afternoon, Saturday, and Sunday to get there, Monday to get married in the morning, and the rest of the day to fly back.  They won't be getting an extra pay out of the deal.  At most, they'll get one day off, probably scheduled by their CO for a when they wouldn't be doing much anyway.
 
2013-08-23 03:45:16 PM  

kronicfeld: It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.


Indeed. Have congress use its enumerated power from Article I Section 8 of "governing such part of [the militia] as may be employed in the service of the United States" by allowing military chaplains and superior officers to perform marriages for active duty service members (whether gay or straight, provided the service member and prospective spouse are both presently unmarried), which all states shall be required to recognize as valid. To accommodate liberty of conscience, allow a chaplain to defer the request to a commanding officer, and a commanding officer to pass the buck up the chain of command.

(First service to reach the CinC loses.)
 
2013-08-23 03:49:40 PM  
Question (I honestly don't know): are straight couples stationed in one state allowed to travel back to their home state to be married there?
 
2013-08-23 03:51:19 PM  

kronicfeld: It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.


This.
 
2013-08-23 03:53:04 PM  

propasaurus: Question (I honestly don't know): are straight couples stationed in one state allowed to travel back to their home state to be married there?


No, they are not.  But then again, neither are gays.  They aren't going seeing their folks and going on a honeymoon at their place of origin here.   They're just taking a day trip to the nearest convenient parallel dimension.
 
2013-08-23 04:00:24 PM  
This guy is my senator.

I shudder to think what will replace him and Coburn.
 
2013-08-23 04:00:58 PM  

Karac: propasaurus: Question (I honestly don't know): are straight couples stationed in one state allowed to travel back to their home state to be married there?

No, they are not.  But then again, neither are gays.  They aren't going seeing their folks and going on a honeymoon at their place of origin here.   They're just taking a day trip to the nearest convenient parallel dimension.


Exactly. The ten days of administrative leave is only to be granted in cases where the nearest state that will grant a same-sex couple a marriage certificate is more than 100 miles away from where the relevant person is station. A Navy ensign stationed at Coronado won't qualify, but an Army sergeant stationed in Fort Hood would qualify.
 
2013-08-23 04:03:39 PM  

Dr Dreidel: Fine, so give heteros some time off to travel to a state that allows them to legally gay marry.


problem solved...
 
2013-08-23 04:04:51 PM  

Perlin Noise: Dr Dreidel: Fine, so give heteros some time off to travel to a state that allows them to legally gay marry.

problem solved...


Haha, I don't know what you heteros are complaining about, you've got the same right to go get gay-married as any other service member.
 
2013-08-23 04:06:10 PM  
It's going to take a military coup to get these craven greedy fools out of power.
 
2013-08-23 04:07:26 PM  

Fark It: dj_bigbird: It is. Why should they get a "benefit" that's not given to hetero couples?

I'm pretty sure if it was as hard for hetero couple to get married they would have the same "benefit."  And it's quite telling that you object to gay couples getting extra time to travel to places where they have equal rights, and not the fact that only 13 states have marriage equality.

/but remember, it's the libruls who hate the troops


It's a moot point that gays can only get married in a limited number of States at this time. They are/would be receiving special privileges which are not afforded to heterosexual couples. That is wrong.
 
2013-08-23 04:07:39 PM  

FloydA: reillan:

Yeah, but that's unlikely to happen immediately.  This is a solution for "in the mean time" so Jim Inhofe can stop getting his precious feelings hurt.

Well then, in the meantime, I suggest getting a team of long distance runners, hikers, football punters, and soccer fullbacks to take turns kicking Jim Inhofe in the fork repeatedly, so that he realizes he has bigger things to worry about than whether or not servicemen and women are allowed to get married.

That way everybody's happy.

Except Jim Inhofe, of course.  But the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.


I pronounce your logic flawless.
 
2013-08-23 04:08:07 PM  
As a 16 year Navy Vet, I am all for gay marriage...just legalize it everywhere but until then make the gay service members use leave like everyone else.
 
2013-08-23 04:10:03 PM  

ferretman: Fark It: dj_bigbird: It is. Why should they get a "benefit" that's not given to hetero couples?

I'm pretty sure if it was as hard for hetero couple to get married they would have the same "benefit."  And it's quite telling that you object to gay couples getting extra time to travel to places where they have equal rights, and not the fact that only 13 states have marriage equality.

/but remember, it's the libruls who hate the troops

It's a moot point that gays can only get married in a limited number of States at this time. They are/would be receiving special privileges which are not afforded to heterosexual couples. That is wrong.


I'd say my being able to marry my prospective spouse in a state where I am stationed when my coworker is unable to do the same qualifies as a special burden which is equally wrong.
 
2013-08-23 04:10:15 PM  
Dr Dreidel:
// maybe if we let them marry on-base, they wouldn't need to travel...

That is also a fair solution.  I want gays to have EQUAL rights, but no one should have SPECIAL rights.
 
2013-08-23 04:10:39 PM  
Perhaps the military should move its bases to states in which Gay Marriage is legal.  That way, gay troops will not need any more time than straight troops to get married!
 
2013-08-23 04:11:02 PM  

abb3w: kronicfeld: It is. But I can think of an amazingly easy fix.

Indeed. Have congress use its enumerated power from Article I Section 8 of "governing such part of [the militia] as may be employed in the service of the United States" by allowing military chaplains and superior officers to perform marriages for active duty service members (whether gay or straight, provided the service member and prospective spouse are both presently unmarried), which all states shall be required to recognize as valid. To accommodate liberty of conscience, allow a chaplain to defer the request to a commanding officer, and a commanding officer to pass the buck up the chain of command.

(First service to reach the CinC loses.)


I seem to recall that when I was in the Navy, there was a service-wide drinking age for when you were on base that was independent of the laws of the particular state the base was in. Same deal could apply here.
 
2013-08-23 04:11:46 PM  

ferretman: Fark It: dj_bigbird: It is. Why should they get a "benefit" that's not given to hetero couples?

I'm pretty sure if it was as hard for hetero couple to get married they would have the same "benefit."  And it's quite telling that you object to gay couples getting extra time to travel to places where they have equal rights, and not the fact that only 13 states have marriage equality.

/but remember, it's the libruls who hate the troops

It's a moot point that gays can only get married in a limited number of States at this time. They are/would be receiving special privileges which are not afforded to heterosexual couples. That is wrong.


What "special privileges", precisely, are gay people getting here? Think carefully before you answer.
 
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