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(Think Progress)   Jim DeMint, who once advocated RomneyCare as an alternative to going to the ER, now advocates going to the ER as an alternative to ObamaCare   (thinkprogress.org) divider line 36
    More: Dumbass, Jim DeMint, romneycare, obamacare, emergency rooms, R-MA  
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1155 clicks; posted to Politics » on 22 Aug 2013 at 1:22 PM (48 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
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2013-08-22 01:30:08 PM
5 votes:
My wife is a nurse at a hospital emergency room. The amount of people that come in for bullshiat because the ER has to treat them is unreal. It slows down the EMERGENCY room and people that really need treatment cant get it. Her hospital is currently laying off people because they lost $30mil last year. The amount of unpaid ER bills was over $150 mil.
Republicans think this is a fantastic system. It's not.
2013-08-22 01:27:02 PM
4 votes:
Right wingers; These are your leaders and heroes.  Unabashed liars and bullshiatters.  Defend this bullshiat, you trolling lying farks.  Defend your leader and hero Jim DeMint.

DO IT.

DO IT.
2013-08-22 01:36:33 PM
3 votes:

zarberg: You'd think that bastion of fiscal responsibility known as the Republican party would...


After watching them burn $75,000,000 in taxpayer money to chase down a cum-stained blue dress I realized there was no depth of stupidity and petulance to which the republican party is willing to sink.
2013-08-22 01:31:35 PM
3 votes:
Is there any one Republican out there who has a conscience, soul, morals, ethics or anything that would lead me to believe they aren't vile, despicable, maggot-ridden vials of human misery masquerading as meat popsicles?
2013-08-22 01:28:02 PM
3 votes:
Jim DeMint is a horrible person.
2013-08-22 01:57:22 PM
2 votes:

Aristocles: IlGreven: Aristocles: Because it's cheaper.

Medical costs say otherwise.

It's cheaper to not give Obama money for health insurance and mooch off those who do than the other way around. Of course, the value of the procedure remains the same, but if I'm not picking up the bill, it's cheaper for me.


Typical republican, purposely mooching off the system while condemning other people who have no choice for doing the same thing. Bunch of farking hypocrites, the lot of them.
2013-08-22 01:55:29 PM
2 votes:

IlGreven: Serious Black: Serious Black: He actually went further than advocating for Romneycare. Jim DeMint advocated for completely universal and mandated coverage, which goes beyond what Romneycare (or Obamacare) does.

Since I'm sure somebody will ask for a citation, here's part of a letter he signed and sent to President Bush in 2007:

"We would like to work with [President Bush] and your administration to pass legislation in this Congress that would ensure that all Americans would have affordable, quality, private health coverage, while protecting current government programs. We believe the health care system cannot be fixed without providing solutions for everyone. Otherwise, the costs of those without insurance will continue to be shifted to those who do have coverage."

Key word. The only real change to Obamacare is this word to "public"...but that makes all the difference in the world.

/Private good, Public baaaaaad.
//Which is why we let private megacorps get away with things we'd excoriate the eeeeeeeebil gubmint for.


If Republicans were really upset about the whole private versus public issue, they should have been completely on board with Ron Wyden and Bob Bennett's plan that would have abolished Medicaid and put poor people on the private market, much like what Arkansas has provisional approval for from the Obama administration. Instead, Utah's Republicans fired Bob Bennett for heresy.
2013-08-22 01:32:15 PM
2 votes:

Aristocles: Because it's cheaper.



Greetings Confirmed Birther troll account created at the height of the Zimmerman trial, would you care to back up your assertions with some citations today, or was this just you shiatting the thread again?
2013-08-22 01:27:48 PM
2 votes:

Serious Black: He actually went further than advocating for Romneycare. Jim DeMint advocated for completely universal and mandated coverage, which goes beyond what Romneycare (or Obamacare) does.


Since I'm sure somebody will ask for a citation, here's part of a letter he signed and sent to President Bush in 2007:

"We would like to work with [President Bush] and your administration to pass legislation in this Congress that would ensure that all Americans would have affordable, quality, private health coverage, while protecting current government programs. We believe the health care system cannot be fixed without providing solutions for everyone. Otherwise, the costs of those without insurance will continue to be shifted to those who do have coverage."
2013-08-22 01:24:44 PM
2 votes:
Yup clogging up the ER and having the hospital pass along the costs to rate payers sounds totally sustainable.
2013-08-22 03:16:44 PM
1 votes:
Actually, I'm not surprised that Conservatives are now disavowing their original health care solution that we know call Obamacare.  I don't believe they ever really supported it but rather just came up with something in opposition to Hillarycare.  I think they really just like the status quo.
2013-08-22 03:10:34 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: Esc7: Let me guess, taxation is theft?

The so-called public university that I attended taught that all property is theft.  But that has different implications, doesn't it?

But no, I don't believe that taxation is theft.  But you don't have to be a hard-core libertarian to believe that all government action, including taxation, is inherently coercive, as it's always done with the background threat of force (what happens if you don't get a permit to fix your septic system?  and then refuse to pay the fine?).  Likewise, that that's the key difference between cooperative action on the so-called private level and cooperative action on the so-called public level.  If you have a more basic distinction, I'd love to hear it.


Government action is not inherently coercive - so long as the true power in government is still in the hands of the voters. I swear, if I hear this "gun to my head..." argument one more time...

Government action isn't inherently coercive because the right to debate and to vote still exists. We can debate whether or not the cherished illusion of freedom is still a thing in the United States, or if it ever was, but the fact that you have the power to create a movement robs the government of its coercive power. You're just too lazy, helpless, or whiny to actually do it.

On the other hand, the idea that private transactions are FREEDOM and public transactions are TYRANNY is such a wonderful, oversimplified falsehood that I almost feel bad popping that bubble for you. Private transactions are only freedom in the presence of perfect knowledge, and I don't trust any corporate entity to provide me with perfect knowledge. The idea that people vote with their dollars, and won't patronize companies that do harm, might be accurate for microtransactions down at the feed store, but they don't really apply to corporate behemoths that don't have the end-consumer in mind when they produce their products.

And public transactions have more freedom than you might think. Any action is "freedom" to someone willing to take the consequences for performing it. During my protest days, I was more than willing to spend a night in the tank to make what I felt was an important point.

I don't believe in Big Government, but I do believe in a government big enough to check-and-balance other institutions (churches, corporations, landlords) out to exercise their authority over me. Governance is not a zero-sum game. Not every law is a freedom lost.
2013-08-22 03:05:14 PM
1 votes:

Bontesla: djkutch: I wish the GOP shrills would offer an alternative plan to Obamacare.  Maybe they are too busy with laser like focus on job creation?

They're still trying to eliminate medicare and social security.

I don't think they want to replace it. They just want to end it.


It's hard for the Republicans to offer a Republican alternative when ObamaCare is the Republican alternative.
2013-08-22 02:25:10 PM
1 votes:
My mother is the one in my family who actually tried this "ER's are required to treat them; why not just go there?" soundbite that's been circulating for about 20 years now. I replied, "Because there's no such thing as emergency chemotherapy."

Have you ever actually SEEN a paradigm shifting without a clutch? We throw around the phrase "cognitive dissonance" a lot, but watching someone's entire belief system come crashing down in a few seconds really is a marvel to see.

Usually, what you get is some sort of "backfire effect," where the person debating the point immediately whips up a rationale so that they don't have to experience that discomfort, and wind up clinging to their beliefs even more tightly. But Republican defense of the current health care system, in the face of overwhelming evidence, is so brittle, so fragile, so desperate that the only defense they have is "LA LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU."

I didn't even have to add my other soundbites: that our current medical system boils down to "kill the unworthy," that those who can't pay wind up subsidized by those who can so it's sort of socialized anyway, or that she's advocating a sort of economic triage where people with medical issues avoid dealing with them until they become more expensive, adding further burdens to the system. I know it's probably wrong to debate this way - dueling bumper stickers - but it shouldn't be this EASY. I'm not saying Mother became a staunch defender of Obamacare, but it's pretty clear that she has no idea what to think about it now. She had other people doing her thinking for her for the longest time, and it was nice and comfy and cozy. Now she's just confused.
2013-08-22 02:06:11 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: Serious Black: Garet Garrett: Serious Black: He actually went further than advocating for Romneycare. Jim DeMint advocated for completely universal and mandated coverage, which goes beyond what Romneycare (or Obamacare) does.

That statement was awesome in its unabashed disregard for reality.  Well done, sir.

Did you even bother to read the post where I followed up with a snippet of a letter he signed and sent to President Bush AND provided a link to where you can read the whole letter?

You know, it's possible to advocate for comprehensive health care coverage without resorting to government mandates.  Which is actually what he did.  Otherwise all that stuff about encouraging the states to explore their own ideas, modernizing tax rules, etc. wouldn't have meant anything.  His letter amounts to saying "Hey, how about we stop the government from stomping on the collective dick of people and their doctors and see if that makes things better."

But don't think that it's lost on people that no good deed goes unpunished in your book.


Guess what? ObamaCare does both of those things!

Section 1332 of the law provides states an easy way to opt out of basically all of the state rules and requirements, including both the individual and employer shared responsibility payments; Vermont plans to use this waiver to build a single-payer system for all of its residents. Obama came out in support of Ron Wyden and Scott Brown's proposal to move up the initial date for this waiver from 2017 to 2014, but it went absolutely nowhere.

As for modernizing tax rules, it's laughable to suggest ObamaCare doesn't do that given the pretty extensive attempts to equalize the tax treatment of individual and employer health insurance and make these treatments more helpful to those who have the most difficulty purchasing insurance today.
2013-08-22 02:01:07 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: IlGreven: Serious Black: Serious Black: He actually went further than advocating for Romneycare. Jim DeMint advocated for completely universal and mandated coverage, which goes beyond what Romneycare (or Obamacare) does.

Since I'm sure somebody will ask for a citation, here's part of a letter he signed and sent to President Bush in 2007:

"We would like to work with [President Bush] and your administration to pass legislation in this Congress that would ensure that all Americans would have affordable, quality, private health coverage, while protecting current government programs. We believe the health care system cannot be fixed without providing solutions for everyone. Otherwise, the costs of those without insurance will continue to be shifted to those who do have coverage."

Key word. The only real change to Obamacare is this word to "public"...but that makes all the difference in the world.

/Private good, Public baaaaaad.
//Which is why we let private megacorps get away with things we'd excoriate the eeeeeeeebil gubmint for.

No, the reason we let private megacorps get away with things is because they don't have the power of coercion.  I don't go to jail if I refuse to shop at WalMart, eat at McDonalds, or buy gas from Shell.


And you can't go to jail if you don't have insurance or pay the tax for not having it. Since you claim to be a lawyer and all, maybe you should actually read up on what the law says. Not like there's dozens of websites that will break it down so even laymen can understand it.

/You'll probably need the layman's explanation, because there is no way you're actually a lawyer.
2013-08-22 02:00:55 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: I think it's fairly clear that I don't think


Can't argue with that.
2013-08-22 01:54:07 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: wozzeck: How about if I admit that he was a pussy until pushed by Biden?

False equivalence.  You have to assert MALICIOUS INTENT in the changed position for it to be a fair parallel.


And who was the MALICIOUS INTENT against when Obama switched to supporting gay marriage, you pathetic, laughable moron?
2013-08-22 01:53:47 PM
1 votes:

Serious Black: Garet Garrett: Serious Black: He actually went further than advocating for Romneycare. Jim DeMint advocated for completely universal and mandated coverage, which goes beyond what Romneycare (or Obamacare) does.

That statement was awesome in its unabashed disregard for reality.  Well done, sir.

Did you even bother to read the post where I followed up with a snippet of a letter he signed and sent to President Bush AND provided a link to where you can read the whole letter?


You know, it's possible to advocate for comprehensive health care coverage without resorting to government mandates.  Which is actually what he did.  Otherwise all that stuff about encouraging the states to explore their own ideas, modernizing tax rules, etc. wouldn't have meant anything.  His letter amounts to saying "Hey, how about we stop the government from stomping on the collective dick of people and their doctors and see if that makes things better."

But don't think that it's lost on people that no good deed goes unpunished in your book.
2013-08-22 01:53:14 PM
1 votes:

Marcus Aurelius: Aristocles: IlGreven: Aristocles: Because it's cheaper.

Medical costs say otherwise.

It's cheaper to not give Obama money for health insurance and mooch off those who do than the other way around. Of course, the value of the procedure remains the same, but if I'm not picking up the bill, it's cheaper for me.

So you're saying you're a deadbeat.


No, I'm Obama didn't think this through and there will be moochers.
2013-08-22 01:52:07 PM
1 votes:

HotWingConspiracy: Garet Garrett: theorellior: Garet Garrett: Just as soon as you admit that Obama was a knuckle-dragging homophobe until a few months ago.

I have you farkied as "laughable troll", and this is a perfect specimen of what I'm talking about.

So it's trolling in your book to call out "he's a farking asshole who eats babies because he disagrees with a position that the organization he now runs took in the past" for what it was?

He disagrees with his own opinion now.

How come you pretend to be a lawyer on the internet?


You know that episode of Its Always Sunny where Charlie keeps trying to act/talk like a lawyer and obviously has no clue about the legal system? That's what this guy reminds me of.
2013-08-22 01:51:44 PM
1 votes:

Aristocles: IlGreven: Aristocles: Because it's cheaper.

Medical costs say otherwise.

It's cheaper to not give Obama money for health insurance and mooch off those who do than the other way around. Of course, the value of the procedure remains the same, but if I'm not picking up the bill, it's cheaper for me.


So you're saying you're a deadbeat.
2013-08-22 01:48:16 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: theorellior: Garet Garrett: Just as soon as you admit that Obama was a knuckle-dragging homophobe until a few months ago.

I have you farkied as "laughable troll", and this is a perfect specimen of what I'm talking about.

So it's trolling in your book to call out "he's a farking asshole who eats babies because he disagrees with a position that the organization he now runs took in the past" for what it was?


He disagrees with his own opinion now.

How come you pretend to be a lawyer on the internet?
2013-08-22 01:44:57 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: Serious Black: He actually went further than advocating for Romneycare. Jim DeMint advocated for completely universal and mandated coverage, which goes beyond what Romneycare (or Obamacare) does.

That statement was awesome in its unabashed disregard for reality.  Well done, sir.


Did you even bother to read the post where I followed up with a snippet of a letter he signed and sent to President Bush AND provided a link to where you can read the whole letter?
2013-08-22 01:44:42 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: Satanic_Hamster: Right wingers; These are your leaders and heroes.  Unabashed liars and bullshiatters.  Defend this bullshiat, you trolling lying farks.  Defend your leader and hero Jim DeMint.

DO IT.

DO IT.

Just as soon as you admit that Obama was a knuckle-dragging homophobe until a few months ago.


How about if I admit that he was a pussy until pushed by Biden?

Would that satisfy you?

Now explain how that relates to the Heritage Foundation and Jim DeMint threatening to shut down the US government because Obama and Congress passed a plan invented by the Heritage Foundation, passed by the GOP's last presidential candidate, and supported by Jim DeMint?
2013-08-22 01:44:18 PM
1 votes:

Raharu: Aristocles: Raharu: Aristocles: Because it's cheaper.


Greetings Confirmed Birther troll account created at the height of the Zimmerman trial, would you care to back up your assertions with some citations today, or was this just you shiatting the thread again?

why should you be forced to give Obama your money?


Since you have avoided the question I will assume you have no citations let alone facts to back up your claims. This has been noted.



Oh I almost forgot to answer your question.

I like to pay my taxes, with them, I buy civilization.

Also only a very very very small portion of my taxes are going towards the Presidents salary. Which I again have no problem pay, civil servants should be paid. Do you disagree?
2013-08-22 01:42:08 PM
1 votes:

Aristocles: Raharu: Aristocles: Because it's cheaper.


Greetings Confirmed Birther troll account created at the height of the Zimmerman trial, would you care to back up your assertions with some citations today, or was this just you shiatting the thread again?

why should you be forced to give Obama your money?


Threadshiat it is.
2013-08-22 01:40:16 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: Just as soon as you admit that Obama was a knuckle-dragging homophobe until a few months ago.


I have you farkied as "laughable troll", and this is a perfect specimen of what I'm talking about.
2013-08-22 01:40:03 PM
1 votes:

Aristocles: Raharu: Aristocles: Because it's cheaper.


Greetings Confirmed Birther troll account created at the height of the Zimmerman trial, would you care to back up your assertions with some citations today, or was this just you shiatting the thread again?

why should you be forced to give Obama your money?



Since you have avoided the question I will assume you have no citations let alone facts to back up your claims. This has been noted.
2013-08-22 01:39:54 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: Just as soon as you admit that Obama was a knuckle-dragging homophobe until a few months ago.


That right there says an awful lot about republicans. You really think it would be a bad thing to admit that a person is capable of reevaluating and evolving their views as time passes? That seems like the sort of thing that would be a negative for you?
2013-08-22 01:39:20 PM
1 votes:

coeyagi: Is there any one Republican out there who has a conscience, soul, morals, ethics or anything that would lead me to believe they aren't vile, despicable, maggot-ridden vials of human misery masquerading as meat popsicles?


Arlen Spector from PA died and may have been the last one
2013-08-22 01:38:12 PM
1 votes:

Garet Garrett: Satanic_Hamster: Right wingers; These are your leaders and heroes.  Unabashed liars and bullshiatters.  Defend this bullshiat, you trolling lying farks.  Defend your leader and hero Jim DeMint.

DO IT.

DO IT.

Just as soon as you admit that Obama was a knuckle-dragging homophobe until a few months ago.


One would think a lawyer could craft an argument defending DeMint.

Why do you pretend to be a lawyer on the internet?
2013-08-22 01:37:57 PM
1 votes:
Because everybody at the ER works for free and all the medicines are free and the building was free.
2013-08-22 01:33:34 PM
1 votes:

theorellior: Aristocles: Because it's cheaper.

You again? Go away.


He reminds me of a certain internet dentist who hasn't been seen around here for a while.
2013-08-22 01:33:15 PM
1 votes:

Ring of Fire: My wife is a nurse at a hospital emergency room. The amount of people that come in for bullshiat because the ER has to treat them is unreal. It slows down the EMERGENCY room and people that really need treatment cant get it. Her hospital is currently laying off people because they lost $30mil last year. The amount of unpaid ER bills was over $150 mil.
Republicans think this is a fantastic system. It's not.


They would spend upwards of 100 billion dollars to make the HNIC look bad.  No, correction: there is no amount of money they wouldn't spend to make Fartbarfburger look bad.
2013-08-22 01:25:06 PM
1 votes:
He actually went further than advocating for Romneycare. Jim DeMint advocated for completely universal and mandated coverage, which goes beyond what Romneycare (or Obamacare) does.
 
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