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(Opposing Views)   If you let southern parents decide who their children will be classmates with, do you get: a) a lot of diversity, b) some diversity, or c) total segregation?   (opposingviews.com) divider line 238
    More: Sad, Alabama, lead plaintiff, George Wallace, elementary schools  
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14054 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Aug 2013 at 10:53 PM (35 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-08-21 08:48:11 PM
xavdematoscom.ipage.com

"No! What a shock!"
 
2013-08-21 09:20:27 PM
Poor Obvious tag.  You go grab something from the fridge and return only to find you're slot has been given away.
 
2013-08-21 09:32:08 PM
The South hasn't changed.
 
2013-08-21 09:33:53 PM
So in a school with a 62% black population, the black parents chose black teachers for their kids and the white parents chose white teachers for their kids so the classrooms were ultimately divided by the race of the teacher?  How is the school culpable (other than it's a stupid idea)?  Unless the school fudged the numbers, how is that forced segregation?
 
2013-08-21 10:22:34 PM

slayer199: So in a school with a 62% black population, the black parents chose black teachers for their kids and the white parents chose white teachers for their kids so the classrooms were ultimately divided by the race of the teacher?  How is the school culpable (other than it's a stupid idea)?  Unless the school fudged the numbers, how is that forced segregation?


FTA:The complaint further alleges that the school acted deliberately in segregating the races, even denying requests; "In a few instances the Troy City School District disregarded requests by Caucasian parents to place their child with African-American teachers."
 
2013-08-21 10:25:35 PM

edmo: The South hasn't changed.


I'm not sure the results would be any different if you allowed parents from any school district in the country to make the same choice.
 
2013-08-21 10:27:39 PM

RexTalionis: slayer199: So in a school with a 62% black population, the black parents chose black teachers for their kids and the white parents chose white teachers for their kids so the classrooms were ultimately divided by the race of the teacher?  How is the school culpable (other than it's a stupid idea)?  Unless the school fudged the numbers, how is that forced segregation?

FTA:The complaint further alleges that the school acted deliberately in segregating the races, even denying requests; "In a few instances the Troy City School District disregarded requests by Caucasian parents to place their child with African-American teachers."


Yeah, slayer199.  Where the fark did you find your little bit of information?  Was  it from ... SATAN?

/Played well in another thread from today.
 
2013-08-21 10:29:47 PM

Lsherm: I'm not sure the results would be any different if you allowed parents from any school district in the country to make the same choice.


I'm sorry, but where were you in the South during the 1960s? Gleam in your daddy's eye, perhaps?
 
2013-08-21 10:34:49 PM

AirForceVet: Lsherm: I'm not sure the results would be any different if you allowed parents from any school district in the country to make the same choice.

I'm sorry, but where were you in the South during the 1960s? Gleam in your daddy's eye, perhaps?


Doesn't matter.  The south is still racist, but so is the north.  Pretending otherwise is just delusional.

Whites in the north began moving out of cities once forced integration via busing took hold.  They self-segregated.  So my point stands:  I don't think the results would be any different if you allowed parents in any school district in the country to make the same choice.
 
2013-08-21 10:55:21 PM
I wouldn't let my kids sit in class with those ignorant bastards if I could help it.
 
2013-08-21 10:57:18 PM
" The school allows parents to choose their child's teachers and classmates. "

This seems like a total sham "plan" anyway...... how does this even work?   Do they all write down their preferences, and then they picked a random lottery to see who got first choice?   Because, ok, lets say the 3rd grade classes, there is one teacher out of the five at the school lets say that is much better than the others... I'm sure all the parents wanted their kids in her class (regardless of color).  So, some parents are going to have to go with their 2nd, 3rd, etc choice.

As far as picking classmates... were the black parents primarily picking black classmates as well?   Or was it somehow the school board trying to "lead" the issue and push to same race classrooms, despite who people picked?

The damning statement though is:   "In a few instances the Troy City School District disregarded requests by Caucasian parents to place their child with African-American teachers."  Now, as I stated, the whole system seems odd to me anyway, since there is no way everyone's requests can be met like that.  It has to be a bit more overt than "I didn't get the teacher we wanted"... that has to have happened a lot.   But, if basically all cross-race matches were "denied", then, you have a pretty damning case.
 
2013-08-21 11:01:15 PM

Lsherm: AirForceVet: Lsherm: I'm not sure the results would be any different if you allowed parents from any school district in the country to make the same choice.

I'm sorry, but where were you in the South during the 1960s? Gleam in your daddy's eye, perhaps?

Doesn't matter.  The south is still racist, but so is the north.  Pretending otherwise is just delusional.

Whites in the north began moving out of cities once forced integration via busing took hold.  They self-segregated.  So my point stands:  I don't think the results would be any different if you allowed parents in any school district in the country to make the same choice.


This. Everyone does this, north or south, red or blue.
 
2013-08-21 11:03:05 PM
Did I miss something?  The article didn't mention any all white classes did it?

Sounds like the school just has an honors/gifted program.
 
2013-08-21 11:03:59 PM
I don't think this phenomenon is just in the South.   Probably see the same sort of thing the world over.   I don't think a member of the Muslim Brotherhood would let his kid go to a U.S. school.  Would probably fight to get his kid out of Exeter.
 
2013-08-21 11:05:50 PM

Pumpernickel bread: I don't think this phenomenon is just in the South.   Probably see the same sort of thing the world over.   I don't think a member of the Muslim Brotherhood would let his kid go to a U.S. school.  Would probably fight to get his kid out of Exeter.


He'd probably send him to a madrassa in Indonesia.
 
2013-08-21 11:07:08 PM
"Under the guise of" parental choice. What part of choice don't they like?
 
2013-08-21 11:07:21 PM
Be honest now.  If you had a choice, would you want YOUR kids exposed to southern white kids?
 
2013-08-21 11:07:49 PM
Is shocked, shocked.
ww2.hdnux.com
 
2013-08-21 11:08:11 PM
Alabama: Because Afghanistan needs stupid backwards Westerners to make jokes about
 
2013-08-21 11:08:19 PM
Didn't we have thread yesterday about the most segregated communities being in the northeast?
 
2013-08-21 11:09:14 PM

Nuclear Monk: Be honest now.  If you had a choice, would you want YOUR kids exposed to southern white kids?


Thread over. Go home everyone.
 
2013-08-21 11:09:15 PM
This is odd....
 In its first year in 2009, there were six all black classrooms in Kindergarten through second grade. By 2010, there were seven all black classrooms in Kindergarten through second grade. In 2011, 18 classes from Kindergarten through sixth grade were all black.

Why did they change how they were counting this in 2011 vs. 09 & 10?  How many in K-2 in 2011 were all black?
 
2013-08-21 11:09:15 PM

AirForceVet: Lsherm: I'm not sure the results would be any different if you allowed parents from any school district in the country to make the same choice.

I'm sorry, but where were you in the South during the 1960s? Gleam in your daddy's eye, perhaps?


And his uncle's. And it was the same guy
 
2013-08-21 11:09:29 PM
My native Alabamastan never lets me down.

Roll Tide!!!
 
2013-08-21 11:09:38 PM
Why is this a bad thing?
 
2013-08-21 11:09:43 PM
Well who really cares? Is this representative of the entire population? No? Move along.
 
2013-08-21 11:10:16 PM
It's a human thing, not a Southern thing.
Every race does it, every society does it, and we have always done it.
 
2013-08-21 11:10:28 PM

edmo: The South hasn't changed.


Since it sounds like they gave the black students and parents exactly what they asked for, I'd say the South has changed a lot.
 
2013-08-21 11:11:23 PM

RexTalionis: slayer199: So in a school with a 62% black population, the black parents chose black teachers for their kids and the white parents chose white teachers for their kids so the classrooms were ultimately divided by the race of the teacher?  How is the school culpable (other than it's a stupid idea)?  Unless the school fudged the numbers, how is that forced segregation?

FTA:The complaint further alleges that the school acted deliberately in segregating the races, even denying requests; "In a few instances the Troy City School District disregarded requests by Caucasian parents to place their child with African-American teachers."


That's called affirmative action.
 
2013-08-21 11:11:53 PM
Having lived in Alabama, I can state this much.

While walking through a large hospital, two visiting doctors were speaking Spanish to each other (I was about 20 feet behind them). A very very fat woman huffing down the hall towards us heard them and started screaming that they should speak English if they "wanted to stay here."

Another incident. I was going to deliver something to an elderly lady in a rough part of Birmingham. She asked me point blank if I was white. When I told her I was she said I should find someone black to deliver it because she wouldn't want me to get hurt in her neighborhood.

It goes both ways sometimes. I hate that it does, but there it is.
 
2013-08-21 11:12:00 PM
edmo

The South hasn't changed.

Yeah, it's all the south's fault.
* nclr (National Council of "The Race")
* naacp (National Association for the Advancement of Colored People)
* bet (Black Entertainment Awards)
* cbc (Congressional Black Caucus)
* aapc (African American Planning Commission)
* naba (National Association of Black Accountants)
* AASB (African American Speaker Bureau)
* bca ( Black Culinarians Alliance)
* Miss Black USA
* bwsma (Black Wall Street Merchants Association)

"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. "

Keep the dream alive.
 
2013-08-21 11:12:07 PM
White on black racism prohibited, but anything on white racism perfectly ok. Thanks libmitter.
 
2013-08-21 11:14:07 PM
Dudes, it's Alabama. A LA BA MA. It is not a paragon of racial tolerance. What did you expect? It is the most redneck state in the nation. Alabama and Georgia have knockdown drag-out fights over who is the most redneck and racist. This is not at all surprising.
 
2013-08-21 11:14:21 PM

Vectron: Why is this a bad thing?


Because it proves that we're making bad choices as humans.

And because it forces the next generation to repeat the same mistakes.
 
2013-08-21 11:14:31 PM
If I remember correctly UCLA allows for segregated graduation ceremonies, so this is just prepping the kids for life at a major university.
 
2013-08-21 11:15:40 PM
I can't see this being a good idea.  Parents should be involved in their kids' schooling, but that involvement should be helping with homework, communicating with the teachers about student progress, following up with discipline from school, and attending parent/teacher conferences to get an idea about how their kids are progressing and any issues that they should be aware of.  Basically, parents need to trust the teachers' and school's judgment and reinforce that at home, and take a cooperative role, not a meddlesome one.

Now, in the rare cases where there's a legitimately bad teacher or they feel their kid is being underserved, sure, bring that up to the administration.  However, far too often parents go into snowflake mode instead of trust the judgment of the professionals at the school.
 
2013-08-21 11:15:59 PM

dletter: This is odd....
 In its first year in 2009, there were six all black classrooms in Kindergarten through second grade. By 2010, there were seven all black classrooms in Kindergarten through second grade. In 2011, 18 classes from Kindergarten through sixth grade were all black.

Why did they change how they were counting this in 2011 vs. 09 & 10?  How many in K-2 in 2011 were all black?


It would make sense to put it like that if in 2009 and 2010 they only let K-2nd graders choose their classroom, then in 2011 they let K-6 decide their classroom.
 
2013-08-21 11:16:24 PM

Vectron: Why is this a bad thing?


Separate is not equal. Fourteenth Amendment. Civil Rights Act. Brown v. Board of Education of Topeka, Brownbeckistan.
 
2013-08-21 11:16:31 PM
Funny how people are piling on white folks, but fail to see that the all-black classes were that way because THEIR parents wanted it that way.
 
2013-08-21 11:17:27 PM
I have a feeling that the kids had a much larger voice in this
/Who wouldn't choose their own friends to be classmates
 
2013-08-21 11:17:50 PM
Here's how my town's "magnet" school system works, where parents pick the school they want their children to go to, not based off of neighborhoods. It's been in place since the 70's. From Wikipedia:

"Each school has a magnet theme, which becomes the focus of the school's teaching style. Students have "freedom of choice" as to which school they want to attend. School selection is not dictated based on location of residence within Montclair. When registering in the district, parents rank their school preferences from highest to lowest, with preferences given for siblings of existing students and special needs. School preferences are accommodated as long as space is available."

And here's the racial brewkdown of the schools:

http://www.montclair.k12.nj.us/WebPag eFiles/1042/enrollment-10-11.pdf


So, yeah, at least my town doesn't suck as much as Alabama.

/can't we get a way to post links from a mobile device?
 
2013-08-21 11:18:08 PM

TuteTibiImperes: Now, in the rare cases where there's a legitimately bad teacher or they feel their kid is being underserved, sure, bring that up to the administration.


Riiiiiight.
 
2013-08-21 11:18:50 PM
Southerners you say? But how can this be?

Oh yeah. The curse on the  sons of Ham. Well, you can hardly blame them, can you?

"A black Christian is like a black person with no memory." - Chris Rock
 
2013-08-21 11:18:52 PM
So people tend to choose to be with people who are similar to themselves?

I say the following with every ounce of authority that my PhD in Social Psychology conveys:

Well DUH!!!
 
2013-08-21 11:19:29 PM

Vectron: Why is this a bad thing?


Because people like you still ask that question in 2013.
 
2013-08-21 11:19:30 PM

dletter: " The school allows parents to choose their child's teachers and classmates. "

This seems like a total sham "plan" anyway...... how does this even work?   Do they all write down their preferences, and then they picked a random lottery to see who got first choice?   Because, ok, lets say the 3rd grade classes, there is one teacher out of the five at the school lets say that is much better than the others... I'm sure all the parents wanted their kids in her class (regardless of color).  So, some parents are going to have to go with their 2nd, 3rd, etc choice.

As far as picking classmates... were the black parents primarily picking black classmates as well?   Or was it somehow the school board trying to "lead" the issue and push to same race classrooms, despite who people picked?

The damning statement though is:   "In a few instances the Troy City School District disregarded requests by Caucasian parents to place their child with African-American teachers."  Now, as I stated, the whole system seems odd to me anyway, since there is no way everyone's requests can be met like that.  It has to be a bit more overt than "I didn't get the teacher we wanted"... that has to have happened a lot.   But, if basically all cross-race matches were "denied", then, you have a pretty damning case.


You libs are really reading too much into this.  I've seen the form the parents were given to choose their teachers and they're completely innoculous and innoccent.   You didn't even get to choose your exactly classmates or teachers.  The choices were simpily what skin color your kid was and if you wanted your child to have any n******s in the class.  That's all, nothing racist.

What's your problem, I mean really.
 
2013-08-21 11:20:25 PM

demaL-demaL-yeH: Vectron: Why is this a bad thing?

Separate is not equal. Fourteenth Amendment. Civil Rights Act. Brown v. Board of Education of Topeka, Brownbeckistan.


How about if it is voluntary?
 
2013-08-21 11:20:29 PM

Lsherm: Riiiiiight.


Yeah, there aren't any bad teachers. The NEA told me so!
 
2013-08-21 11:21:45 PM

Satanic_Hamster: if you wanted your child to have any n******s in the class.


You are going to hell.
 
2013-08-21 11:22:01 PM

Vectron: How about if it is voluntary?


Sounds like it wasn't in some cases.
 
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