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(Patheos)   "The Bible Belt is collapsing," Russell Moore, president of the SBC's Religious Liberty Commission. "We are no longer the moral majority. We are a prophetic minority"   (patheos.com) divider line 281
    More: Interesting, Russell Moore, Religious Liberty Commission, Southern Baptist Convention, Liberty Commission, White Anglo-Saxon Protestant, Ralph Reed, Christian Coalition, liberty  
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6766 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Aug 2013 at 3:01 PM (48 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-08-21 03:10:42 PM
More like pathet--

clancifer: He misspelled 'pathetic'.


Oh goddammit.
 
2013-08-21 03:10:56 PM

clancifer: He misspelled 'pathetic'.


Damn. I didn't see you down here.
Done in one.
 
2013-08-21 03:10:57 PM
FTA  "We don't hate our gay and lesbian neighbors," he says, but redefining marriage on their behalf is another matter."

Translation:  "We don't hate our neighbors, but we'd like to deny them federal benefits.  Really, we're just saving them from suckling at the teat of big government, the way we do."

Also FTA  "There are a couple of reasons why Christians are losing the debate over gay marriage, Mr. Moore says. One is that even many Christians don't have a real understanding of what marriage is."

Ooh, I know this one!  Marriage is a sacred bond between a man, his wife, and their handmaid.
You know, like it says in the Bible.

/yay, threesomes
//WWJB?
 
2013-08-21 03:11:03 PM

gadian: You're a bunch of dumbasses and I really wonder how your deformed brains are able to think and regulate breathing at the same time.


Jesus loves us.
 
2013-08-21 03:13:11 PM
If you have to describe yourself as a prophet, you're either a lunatic or a shyster. It's bad enough to imply that you talk for god, but to say that you actively have the line on it? That's bullshiat.

I keep seeing blind faith in religion, but it's always religion filtered through people who are greatly flawed. Prophets are worthless liars. If any god has something to say, it should be said directly so the human element can't twist the message over hundreds of years. Christianity itself is mostly based on the writings of a misogynistic Greek sixty years after Jesus was crucified. These are not the words of god, this is a game of telephone thousands of years old that, if the message did come from god, has been twisted into an unrecognizable pile since then.
 
2013-08-21 03:13:21 PM

hubiestubert: Weaver95: cameroncrazy1984: Weaver95: Christianity is imploding and collapsing. Hypocrisy, lies, corruption...it's all there if you scratch the surface and look underneath the gloss

That's always been there. But the lack of information dissemination prior to the 20th Century left a lot of that alone.

Not as much as you'd think. Religious upheavals and schisms have existed long before the invention of the Internet. It might move a bit faster these days but not as much as you'd think.

I think the problem isn't so much communication as it is that modern Christianity has lost its focus. Are they spiritual leaders who act as a focus for the divine on earth or are they a well funded lobbyist organization with oodles of tax free money? Most of what I see from Christians in this country says they're lobbyists and activists, not spiritual trailblazers in the eternal quest for the divine.

Maybe it's time for evangelicals to fall. Maybe they've had their time. I'm pagan so I sort of h ave to believe in cycles. Maybe it's time for Christian churches to lie fallow until the wheel turns again.

The thing is, the fastest growing ministry in the US aren't an Evengelical ministry, but Unitarian-Universalists. A fair number of folks are returning to churches as they grow older, have kids, and want that environment for their kids, and what they don't want, are a bunch of hate filled, mean spirited souls around them and their kids. So, the power of the Evengelicals is waning as other churches, and more progressive churches rise. This, of course, translates to lost revenue, and thus the push for MOAR revivals, MOAR heated rhetoric, to bring those dollars in, and a ramping up of the Prosperity Gospel, in order to keep folks hooked, and looking to be "under fire" and "under attack" and at "war" with your own government and communities is a way to get a foxhole mentality with parishioners, so that they don't stop and consider. It is less about Jesus and his message, than con men lookin ...


Unitarians? Really? What do us Quakers gotta do to get more of that crowd? We're so uncool on that being nice to other people and building a better world bit that we're cool again, yo!

We don't require the silly hats anymore, honest!

\Incidentally, I know one of the historians in this.
\\About the last person I would have ever expected to see on TLC.
 
2013-08-21 03:14:52 PM

PunGent: Ooh, I know this one!  Marriage is a sacred bond between a man, his wife, and their handmaid.
You know, like it says in the Bible.

/yay, threesomes
//WWJB?


I thought the sacred bond included a Man and all of his wives and concubines.
 
2013-08-21 03:15:29 PM
As a "prophetic minority," Mr. Moore thinks his most profound political task will be defending religious liberty from the assaults of a secular government.

You could try leading by example, too.
 
2013-08-21 03:15:54 PM
Beware of false pathetics.
 
2013-08-21 03:15:59 PM
Oblig:

i28.photobucket.com
 
2013-08-21 03:15:59 PM

Bloody William: If you have to describe yourself as a prophet, you're either a lunatic or a shyster. It's bad enough to imply that you talk for god, but to say that you actively have the line on it? That's bullshiat.

I keep seeing blind faith in religion, but it's always religion filtered through people who are greatly flawed. Prophets are worthless liars. If any god has something to say, it should be said directly so the human element can't twist the message over hundreds of years. Christianity itself is mostly based on the writings of a misogynistic Greek sixty years after Jesus was crucified. These are not the words of god, this is a game of telephone thousands of years old that, if the message did come from god, has been twisted into an unrecognizable pile since then.


But if you distill the good from the bad, then it still has some value.  Turn the other cheek.  Love your neighbor.  Do unto others as you would have done unto you(masochists can ignore this one).  Forgive each other.  Be excellent to one another.

Party on, dudes.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-08-21 03:16:41 PM

2wolves: Beware of false pathetics.


what about TRUE pathetics?
 
2013-08-21 03:17:01 PM

impaler: Done in 1 and 2.


No, we still have to point out that they're calling 78.5% of the country (and far more still in the "Bible Belt") a minority.
 
2013-08-21 03:17:12 PM

Diogenes: Lando Lincoln: Christians that lambaste poor people are sick in the head, and are the opposite of what Christianity is supposed to stand for.

The poor and the sick have fallen out of God's favor.  They are punished for not deferring to their moral superiors - God's chosen - in all things.

The modern American Evangelical thinks the core teachings of Christianity are quaint and outdated.  And that sort of ties into hubiestubert's comment on hypocrisy.  They aren't hypocritical when they cheat on their spouses, or steal, or even moral.  They are simply flawed and experiencing small missteps in their fulfillment of God's plan for them as His chosen.

Pretty tidy, huh?

that made shiver go down my back.
 
2013-08-21 03:17:24 PM
I guess it's better than a prolaspe.
 
2013-08-21 03:17:30 PM
The Moral Majority has never been a majority, nor have they ever been moral.
 
2013-08-21 03:18:20 PM

vpb: They never were moral.  Or a majority.


I came here to say that.

cc_rider: Oblig:

[i28.photobucket.com image 400x400]


I saw it on a bumper sticker!
 
2013-08-21 03:18:28 PM

Infernalist: Bloody William: If you have to describe yourself as a prophet, you're either a lunatic or a shyster. It's bad enough to imply that you talk for god, but to say that you actively have the line on it? That's bullshiat.

I keep seeing blind faith in religion, but it's always religion filtered through people who are greatly flawed. Prophets are worthless liars. If any god has something to say, it should be said directly so the human element can't twist the message over hundreds of years. Christianity itself is mostly based on the writings of a misogynistic Greek sixty years after Jesus was crucified. These are not the words of god, this is a game of telephone thousands of years old that, if the message did come from god, has been twisted into an unrecognizable pile since then.

But if you distill the good from the bad, then it still has some value.  Turn the other cheek.  Love your neighbor.  Do unto others as you would have done unto you(masochists can ignore this one).  Forgive each other.  Be excellent to one another.

Party on, dudes.


The more we separate morality from divinity, the better off we are. Yes, loving your neighbor and doing to others as you would ahve done unto you is important. It also should be a fundamentally moral issue without the empty promise that it was said by god or the threat of damnnation if you don't do it.
 
2013-08-21 03:18:29 PM

Diogenes: Lando Lincoln: Christians that lambaste poor people are sick in the head, and are the opposite of what Christianity is supposed to stand for.

The poor and the sick have fallen out of God's favor.  They are punished for not deferring to their moral superiors - God's chosen - in all things.

The modern American Evangelical thinks the core teachings of Christianity are quaint and outdated.  And that sort of ties into hubiestubert's comment on hypocrisy.  They aren't hypocritical when they cheat on their spouses, or steal, or even moral.  They are simply flawed and experiencing small missteps in their fulfillment of God's plan for them as His chosen.

Pretty tidy, huh?


That, and the 'fact' that you wouldn't be poor or sick if you just BELIEVED hard enough - like they do!  See, thats why they have all the money, even if they cheat and steal and kill...
 
2013-08-21 03:18:31 PM
It's just so SAD.
 
2013-08-21 03:18:32 PM

clancifer: He misspelled 'pathetic'.


cdn.lastangryfan.com
 
2013-08-21 03:19:06 PM

clancifer: He misspelled 'pathetic'.


Glad we're all on the same page here.
 
2013-08-21 03:19:37 PM

gadian: You're a bunch of dumbasses and I really wonder how your deformed brains are able to think and regulate breathing at the same time.


Who are you talking to? The religious or the farkers?
 
2013-08-21 03:19:50 PM

North_Central_Positronics: [funnycatwallpapers.com image 400x400]


i5.photobucket.com
 
2013-08-21 03:20:01 PM

Bloody William: Infernalist: Bloody William: If you have to describe yourself as a prophet, you're either a lunatic or a shyster. It's bad enough to imply that you talk for god, but to say that you actively have the line on it? That's bullshiat.

I keep seeing blind faith in religion, but it's always religion filtered through people who are greatly flawed. Prophets are worthless liars. If any god has something to say, it should be said directly so the human element can't twist the message over hundreds of years. Christianity itself is mostly based on the writings of a misogynistic Greek sixty years after Jesus was crucified. These are not the words of god, this is a game of telephone thousands of years old that, if the message did come from god, has been twisted into an unrecognizable pile since then.

But if you distill the good from the bad, then it still has some value.  Turn the other cheek.  Love your neighbor.  Do unto others as you would have done unto you(masochists can ignore this one).  Forgive each other.  Be excellent to one another.

Party on, dudes.

The more we separate morality from divinity, the better off we are. Yes, loving your neighbor and doing to others as you would ahve done unto you is important. It also should be a fundamentally moral issue without the empty promise that it was said by god or the threat of damnnation if you don't do it.


Yeah, it always amuses me when someone claims that without religion, people would be sociopaths because of the lack of damnation to scare them into being 'good'.  I always reply with "So, if you didn't have religion, you'd be another Ted Bundy?"
 
2013-08-21 03:21:29 PM
You never WERE the "moral majority" and there is no goddam such thing as a prophet. So, maybe you will go do something useful with your lives now instead of continuing to bank on the unearned and undeserved deference and respect that you mistakenly have thought was your due for far too long.

/but this thread was done in one.
 
2013-08-21 03:21:30 PM
If you read this passage with "I never promised you a rose garden" by Lynn Anderson, it is a lot funnier:

'He is definitely pushing a new tone for this generation of evangelicals. "This is the end of 'slouching toward Gomorrah,' " he says. Not only is the doomsaying not winning Christians any popularity contests, but he doesn't think it's religiously appropriate either. "We were never promised that the culture would embrace us." '
 
2013-08-21 03:21:30 PM

Weaver95: When evangelicals started being more involved with politics than their relationship to the divine, Christianity started to lose its followers.


*qualifying cough*
 
2013-08-21 03:21:36 PM
Celebrate good times, come on!

2.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-08-21 03:22:01 PM

Solkar: Weaver95: cameroncrazy1984: Weaver95: When evangelicals started being more involved with politics than their relationship to the divine, Christianity started to lose its followers.

Well, that and the Internet and the widely accessible information it provides.

Oh there are a lot of reasons modern Christianity is imploding and collapsing. Hypocrisy, lies, corruption...it's all there if you scratch the surface and look underneath the gloss. Maybe the evangelicals would be better off if all things Christian DID implode, at least for a while. If nothing else it would force them to reevaluate their faith and it's role in their lives and in society.

I still go to a Southern Baptist church, but I couldn't agree more with the above statements. The biggest thing I like about my current pastor, though, is that he keeps politics out of his sermons. That's not common anymore.


I sometimes go along to a church where the pastor tells us black people need to take our authority like we need to take the authority of Jesus. Come to think of it, why do I still go there?
 
2013-08-21 03:22:02 PM
From the original WSJ article I couldn't link to:

Which is not to say that Mr. Moore wants evangelicals to "turn inward" and reject the larger U.S. culture. Rather, he wants to refocus the movement on serving as a religious example battling in the public square on "three core issues"-life, marriage and religious liberty.
...
Mr. Moore is also deeply involved in the evangelical adoption movement.
...
Mr. Moore says he hopes to make the ObamaCare mandate a major issue in the 2016 election. By then, it will have become clear how intrusive the health-care law has become, he says, and the American people will side with religious groups that protest having to act against their beliefs. "The separation of church and state," Mr. Moore says, "is not a liberal issue."


So the "three core issues"-life, marriage and religious liberty - where religious liberty is denying health-care to the poor.
Just like Jesus taught him.
 
2013-08-21 03:22:22 PM

gadian: You're a bunch of dumbasses and I really wonder how your deformed brains are able to think and regulate breathing at the same time.


Evolution.  Wonder no longer.
 
2013-08-21 03:22:25 PM
I always called them the Mental Minority
 
2013-08-21 03:22:26 PM

purplegiraffe: Diogenes: Lando Lincoln: Christians that lambaste poor people are sick in the head, and are the opposite of what Christianity is supposed to stand for.

The poor and the sick have fallen out of God's favor.  They are punished for not deferring to their moral superiors - God's chosen - in all things.

The modern American Evangelical thinks the core teachings of Christianity are quaint and outdated.  And that sort of ties into hubiestubert's comment on hypocrisy.  They aren't hypocritical when they cheat on their spouses, or steal, or even moral.  They are simply flawed and experiencing small missteps in their fulfillment of God's plan for them as His chosen.

Pretty tidy, huh?

That, and the 'fact' that you wouldn't be poor or sick if you just BELIEVED hard enough - like they do!  See, thats why they have all the money, even if they cheat and steal and kill...


No, the Prosperity Gospel preaches that those that give the 'most' of what they can afford to give will be rewarded by God with even 'more' money.  It plays on the idea that those with the least to give and still manage to 'give' are seen by God as sacrificing for him.  He's impressed with their financial irresponsibility, you see.  And doesn't want to see them get their electric cut off, so he'll rain money down upon them before the 1st of the month.

And if he doesn't, then you plainly didn't impress him enough with your bribe.  Tithe.  I meant 'tithe'.
 
2013-08-21 03:22:34 PM
 
2013-08-21 03:22:59 PM

Infernalist: Yeah, it always amuses me when someone claims that without religion, people would be sociopaths because of the lack of damnation to scare them into being 'good'.  I always reply with "So, if you didn't have religion, you'd be another Ted Bundy?"


No. I'm not as good looking as he was.
 
2013-08-21 03:23:21 PM

The My Little Pony Killer: It's high time we remove the Bible Belt and drop the Pants of Religion in this country. Only then can we be a free, upstanding people.


I have had a vision of the future where the Bible Belt has lost its battle to choke back the expanding waistline of American Exceptionalism.... where the Pants of Religion have fallen around the ankles of reason and truth and knowledge... thereby exposing the throbbing throngs of the purple helmeted members of the secular humanists... chafing against the chains that have encumbered them for so long in the dark, dank, sweaty underwear of ignorance and intolerance...
 
2013-08-21 03:23:42 PM

hubiestubert: Weaver95: cameroncrazy1984: Weaver95: Christianity is imploding and collapsing. Hypocrisy, lies, corruption...it's all there if you scratch the surface and look underneath the gloss

That's always been there. But the lack of information dissemination prior to the 20th Century left a lot of that alone.

Not as much as you'd think. Religious upheavals and schisms have existed long before the invention of the Internet. It might move a bit faster these days but not as much as you'd think.

I think the problem isn't so much communication as it is that modern Christianity has lost its focus. Are they spiritual leaders who act as a focus for the divine on earth or are they a well funded lobbyist organization with oodles of tax free money? Most of what I see from Christians in this country says they're lobbyists and activists, not spiritual trailblazers in the eternal quest for the divine.

Maybe it's time for evangelicals to fall. Maybe they've had their time. I'm pagan so I sort of h ave to believe in cycles. Maybe it's time for Christian churches to lie fallow until the wheel turns again.

The thing is, the fastest growing ministry in the US aren't an Evengelical ministry, but Unitarian-Universalists. A fair number of folks are returning to churches as they grow older, have kids, and want that environment for their kids, and what they don't want, are a bunch of hate filled, mean spirited souls around them and their kids. So, the power of the Evengelicals is waning as other churches, and more progressive churches rise. This, of course, translates to lost revenue, and thus the push for MOAR revivals, MOAR heated rhetoric, to bring those dollars in, and a ramping up of the Prosperity Gospel, in order to keep folks hooked, and looking to be "under fire" and "under attack" and at "war" with your own government and communities is a way to get a foxhole mentality with parishioners, so that they don't stop and consider. It is less about Jesus and his message, than con men lookin ...


So an atheist, a buddhist and a gay kid walk into a church....

Sounds like an old joke, but this is my family (Me being the atheist in the equation).  We all joined the local UU church and love it to pieces.  It's all about how to love and how to live now, today. Just beautiful people.  If a year ago you would've told me I'd belong to any church, I would have laughed to bust a gut. I even have friends who are pagans now....lol. For those who feel spiritually betwixt and between, or those who aren't spiritual at all but are looking for a lost sense of community, I highly recommend checking out you local UU Fellowship.
 
2013-08-21 03:23:55 PM
kristinhoppe.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-08-21 03:24:37 PM

Lando Lincoln: Infernalist: Yeah, it always amuses me when someone claims that without religion, people would be sociopaths because of the lack of damnation to scare them into being 'good'.  I always reply with "So, if you didn't have religion, you'd be another Ted Bundy?"

No. I'm not as good looking as he was.


Chloroform makes up for a lot of facial ugly.
 
2013-08-21 03:24:45 PM

clancifer: He misspelled 'pathetic'.


Came here to say that... done in one.  You get one internets.
 
2013-08-21 03:25:57 PM
Their position is suffering due to more and more people seeing that the existence of a God just doesn't make sense, and that many of their views are based purely on a 'because God says so.' In order to be seen as the source of Morality, they need to change their stance on not just GLBT issues, but several others as well, but they can't because their main tenant is "We Have The Truth."

Sadly, many people still believe that religion or God is the source of Morality, when in fact it's simply human empathy.
 
2013-08-21 03:26:31 PM
Well, it is the SBC.  A lot of baptist churches in the south don't acknowledge them.
 
2013-08-21 03:27:27 PM
I wonder just how damaging prosperity gospel theology has been to Christianity in this country?
 
2013-08-21 03:27:28 PM

AirForceVet: Solkar: I still go to a Southern Baptist church, but I couldn't agree more with the above statements. The biggest thing I like about my current pastor, though, is that he keeps politics out of his sermons. That's not common anymore.

I couldn't participate to an organization that actively supports discrimination against GLBTs or anyone else.

But that's just me.


Nah man, that's you and every other reasonable person.
 
2013-08-21 03:27:41 PM
It sounds like he's talking about needing to change so that believers are illustrating by how they live their lives... not by what they say.  That rather than lambast others, that christians should silently and unobtrusively live their lives according to their beliefs.  That by doing so those around them will perhaps start seeing the good that these beliefs (supposedly) bring and hence become more receptive.

And you know what?  I'm ok with that.
 
2013-08-21 03:28:20 PM

North_Central_Positronics: [funnycatwallpapers.com image 400x400]


I'm more of a fan of this one. She seems angrier, which somehow makes it better. Like, "I'm disgusted that these people exist, and the horrible thing that's happening to them makes me... well, not happy, but y'know..."

i47.photobucket.com
 
2013-08-21 03:28:26 PM

jake_lex: [cafewitteveen.files.wordpress.com image 350x262]

Obligatory

/and very true


Exactly, the right to practice your religion is not the right to force others to adhere to it.
 
2013-08-21 03:28:40 PM

clancifer: He misspelled 'pathetic'.


Done in one.
 
2013-08-21 03:28:44 PM

Weisenheimer: Their position is suffering due to more and more people seeing that the existence of a God just doesn't make sense, and that many of their views are based purely on a 'because God says so.' In order to be seen as the source of Morality, they need to change their stance on not just GLBT issues, but several others as well, but they can't because their main tenant is "We Have The Truth."

Sadly, many people still believe that religion or God is the source of Morality, when in fact it's simply human empathy.


It's abdication of responsibility for your own morals.  It's a cowardly way to deal with moral conflict in your life.  Those that cling to religious mores and morals often do so because it's harder to stand up and say "No, I don't care what the Church says, birth control is not a sin, gays are not sinning by simply being gay and I'm done seeing 'thought-crime' as something to feel guilty over."
 
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