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(Reuters)   You know, Britain, when even RUSSIA is busting your chops over how you treat reporters and questioning your commitment to a free press, maybe it's time to re-think your actions   (reuters.com) divider line 38
    More: Obvious, Russia, Guardian, treating  
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2140 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Aug 2013 at 1:30 PM (49 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



38 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-08-21 11:38:07 AM
The problem with that is that by accusing us of double standards they are exposing themselves to being rightly rebutted by pointing out that Putin KILLS journalists and people are a nuisance to him. I would like to see more people criticising the government over this, but not from people who are demonstrably far far worse. Russia might just be the worst country on the planet. At least the worst, most war ravaged African country has nice warm weather. Russia just has vodka and psychopaths.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-08-21 11:38:50 AM
Because Russia is that land of freedom.
 
2013-08-21 11:43:47 AM

Slaxl: The problem with that is that by accusing us of double standards they are exposing themselves to being rightly rebutted by pointing out that Putin KILLS journalists and people are a nuisance to him. I would like to see more people criticising the government over this, but not from people who are demonstrably far far worse. Russia might just be the worst country on the planet. At least the worst, most war ravaged African country has nice warm weather. Russia just has vodka and psychopaths.


But just as in the Cold War, Russia may serve a valuable purpose going forward. By calling out the west when they fail to live up to their own standards of Freedom or Human rights it can force western Democracies not to take certain actions or modify their behavoir for fear of handing the Russian an propaganda victory
 
2013-08-21 11:58:31 AM
i4.mirror.co.uk

Nothing more needs to be said.
 
2013-08-21 12:00:22 PM
Russia is the world's greatest troll.
 
2013-08-21 12:33:16 PM
Russia can say whatever it wants.
 
2013-08-21 12:51:59 PM
And North Korea put out propaganda movies about how bad South Africa was to black people, so farking what.
 
2013-08-21 01:18:25 PM

Elandriel: Russia is the world's greatest troll.


That's a big reason why I approach links from RT with caution.  They are somewhat useful in that they do bring abuses and misdeeds of the US, the UK, and other countries to light, but their motives for doing so worry me.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-08-21 01:33:13 PM
You shut you mouth, you shut it NOW!!!!
img262.imageshack.us
 
2013-08-21 01:34:41 PM

Rand's lacy underwear: And North Korea put out propaganda movies about how bad South Africa was to black people, so farking what.


That's the classic example of why "consider the Source" is a logical fallacy and a debate foul.   The criticism can be valid even if the motives of the criticizer are not pure.
 
2013-08-21 01:39:09 PM
Remember when Britain was prepared to storm the Ecuadorian embassy to get Assange? They really detest whistleblowers and people who help them.
 
2013-08-21 01:40:06 PM
I've been assured by TOP FARKERS in other threads that until 100 years have passed since the last time England/America has done anything remotely like this to a journalists we're not allowed to criticize Russia for murdering political dissidents, reporters, and homosexuals.
 
2013-08-21 01:40:42 PM

vpb: Because Russia is that land of freedom.


Does that make them wrong? Is Britain now correct for doing this since Russia, who has human and civil rights problems of their own, is condemning them for it?
 
2013-08-21 01:43:46 PM
Meh.  Russia, Syria, China, etc. all like pointing out whenever Western countries violate human rights because they think it means they're justified to use those same tactics (or worse) on a daily basis against their people.
 
2013-08-21 01:48:25 PM
Just because a bad guy says it, doesn't mean that he is wrong.
 
2013-08-21 01:48:40 PM

Satanic_Hamster: I've been assured by TOP FARKERS in other threads that until 100 years have passed since the last time England/America has done anything remotely like this to a journalists we're not allowed to criticize Russia for murdering political dissidents, reporters, and homosexuals.


i303.photobucket.com
Who?
 
2013-08-21 01:49:54 PM
It's funny, we tend to here in the US forget that the whole 1st amendment thing is pretty unique to the world and often because of this we take it for granted.
 
2013-08-21 02:03:06 PM

IdBeCrazyIf: It's funny, we tend to here in the US forget that the whole 1st amendment thing is pretty unique to the world and often because of this we take it for granted.


In measuring freedom of the press, which is a pretty good analog for 'freedom of speech', the US ranks #32 by Reporters without Borders.

http://en.rsf.org/press-freedom-index-2013,1054.html
 
2013-08-21 02:18:43 PM
The only reason Snowden wasn't bustled off home to a fun new life of torture followed by a good ol' American-style show trial was to embarrass the west.  The only reason Russia brings this up is to embarrass the west.

What a pity we have so much bad behaviour for our asshole geopolitical rivals to embarrass us with.
 
2013-08-21 02:32:36 PM
The press actually has to answer to the government in Britain. Their relationship has never been like people expect it to be in the US.

In Britain there are lines you don't cross. Even for the press.
 
2013-08-21 02:48:24 PM
Everyone throws around the word 'freedom' like it's a good thing.

The truth is most people do not want to have freedom.  This is true in the US and it is doubly true in the EU.
 
2013-08-21 02:51:34 PM

BafflerMeal: IdBeCrazyIf: It's funny, we tend to here in the US forget that the whole 1st amendment thing is pretty unique to the world and often because of this we take it for granted.

In measuring freedom of the press, which is a pretty good analog for 'freedom of speech', the US ranks #32 by Reporters without Borders.

http://en.rsf.org/press-freedom-index-2013,1054.html


Shhhhh!  Stop confusing the 'Mericans!

US!  LAND OF THE FREE!
 
2013-08-21 03:11:41 PM

No Such Agency: The only reason Snowden wasn't bustled off home to a fun new life of torture followed by a good ol' American-style show trial was to embarrass the west.  The only reason Russia brings this up is to embarrass the west.

What a pity we have so much bad behaviour for our asshole geopolitical rivals to embarrass us with.


Given that Russia has killed more of their press than the US could ever have, the US and Britain have very far to go down before they even can be considered *equal* to Russia.

We dont give radioactive tea to silence the press.

If anything, it means that the US shouldnt care *how* they get Snowden and his helpers, but that they *do*. The US has the means, just that the POTUS doesnt have the balls to bring in someone that has harmed all US citizens. Alive, dead, he just has to be neutralized.

/Why yes, I would turn him in to save the country and proudly.
//Dont sign up to do clearance work if you intend to betray your oaths to secrecy.
 
2013-08-21 03:16:42 PM

BafflerMeal: IdBeCrazyIf: It's funny, we tend to here in the US forget that the whole 1st amendment thing is pretty unique to the world and often because of this we take it for granted.

In measuring freedom of the press, which is a pretty good analog for 'freedom of speech', the US ranks #32 by Reporters without Borders.

http://en.rsf.org/press-freedom-index-2013,1054.html


Your point being? That doesn't invalidate the fact that nobody else has a guaranteed right to free speech like America has, that they get to fight about in court. If other countries have better press freedom, it's because the government allows it.
 
2013-08-21 03:18:58 PM

Gyrfalcon: BafflerMeal: IdBeCrazyIf: It's funny, we tend to here in the US forget that the whole 1st amendment thing is pretty unique to the world and often because of this we take it for granted.

In measuring freedom of the press, which is a pretty good analog for 'freedom of speech', the US ranks #32 by Reporters without Borders.

http://en.rsf.org/press-freedom-index-2013,1054.html

Your point being? That doesn't invalidate the fact that nobody else has a guaranteed right to free speech like America has, that they get to fight about in court. If other countries have better press freedom, it's because the government allows it.



Do you even read what you write?
 
2013-08-21 03:21:24 PM

Fark_Guy_Rob: Everyone throws around the word 'freedom' like it's a good thing.

The truth is most people do not want to have freedom.  This is true in the US and it is doubly true in the EU.


i.imgur.com

Agrees
 
2013-08-21 04:03:49 PM

Breygon: Satanic_Hamster: I've been assured by TOP FARKERS in other threads that until 100 years have passed since the last time England/America has done anything remotely like this to a journalists we're not allowed to criticize Russia for murdering political dissidents, reporters, and homosexuals.

[i303.photobucket.com image 288x363]
Who?


TOP Farkers.
 
2013-08-21 04:11:29 PM
We have always been at war with Eurasia.
 
2013-08-21 04:11:54 PM

BafflerMeal: In measuring freedom of the press, which is a pretty good analog for 'freedom of speech', the US ranks #32 by Reporters without Borders.


No no, you're not getting it. Take for instance in the UK, the government can willfully shut down papers, TV, etc... for whatever reason. They can pass laws to do it and nothing can stop them.

We have a protection for that enshrined into the constitution, it's a pretty unique thing
 
2013-08-21 06:25:35 PM

Rand's lacy underwear: And North Korea put out propaganda movies about how bad South Africa was to black people, so farking what.


And they were completely correct. That's what.

You ought to be better than pointing out the problems in other countries as an excuse to not have your own house in order.
 
2013-08-21 06:27:49 PM

BafflerMeal: IdBeCrazyIf: It's funny, we tend to here in the US forget that the whole 1st amendment thing is pretty unique to the world and often because of this we take it for granted.

In measuring freedom of the press, which is a pretty good analog for 'freedom of speech', the US ranks #32 by Reporters without Borders.

http://en.rsf.org/press-freedom-index-2013,1054.html


The press in Eritrea is less free than in Best Korea.

I didn't think that was even possible.
 
2013-08-21 06:33:55 PM

Gyrfalcon: BafflerMeal: IdBeCrazyIf: It's funny, we tend to here in the US forget that the whole 1st amendment thing is pretty unique to the world and often because of this we take it for granted.

In measuring freedom of the press, which is a pretty good analog for 'freedom of speech', the US ranks #32 by Reporters without Borders.

http://en.rsf.org/press-freedom-index-2013,1054.html

Your point being? That doesn't invalidate the fact that nobody else has a guaranteed right to free speech like America has, that they get to fight about in court. If other countries have better press freedom, it's because the government allows it.


Uh, which weird propaganda instrument has told you that lie? Is that what some Americans actually believe?

Article 77 in the Danish constitution for instance gives every Dane free speech, and specifies that censorship and any other limitation of free speech can never be implemented.

I'm from Denmark, that's why I brought that up.
 
2013-08-21 06:44:56 PM

IdBeCrazyIf: BafflerMeal: In measuring freedom of the press, which is a pretty good analog for 'freedom of speech', the US ranks #32 by Reporters without Borders.

No no, you're not getting it. Take for instance in the UK, the government can willfully shut down papers, TV, etc... for whatever reason. They can pass laws to do it and nothing can stop them.

We have a protection for that enshrined into the constitution, it's a pretty unique thing


I was looking up RWB's description of their rating for the US, and it basically boils down to lack of a Federal source shield law, the frequent citing of national security to prosecute those leaking classified military secrets. Not particularly surprising.
 
2013-08-21 07:36:01 PM

HazMatt: Fark_Guy_Rob: Everyone throws around the word 'freedom' like it's a good thing.

The truth is most people do not want to have freedom.  This is true in the US and it is doubly true in the EU.

[i.imgur.com image 480x270]

Agrees


I think they're both right. Some people want to control, some people want to be controlled, and some people want freedom. They're the minority. Anyone who brings up Annie Lennox loses.
 
2013-08-21 09:30:42 PM

spawn73: And they were completely correct. That's what.

You ought to be better than pointing out the problems in other countries as an excuse to not have your own house in order.


thatsthejoke.jpg
 
2013-08-22 01:52:08 AM

Oldiron_79: We have always been at war with Eurasia.


Eastasia.
 
2013-08-22 05:02:48 AM
England double-plus good reductionwise crimethink.
 
2013-08-22 06:26:39 AM
sethstorm:
If anything, it means that the US shouldnt care *how* they get Snowden and his helpers, but that they *do*. The US has the means, just that the POTUS doesnt have the balls to bring in someone that has harmed all US citizens. Alive, dead, he just has to be neutralized.

What the hell are you smoking? Nothing of the things Snowden exposed harmed a US citizen. He and the journalists he was providing with documents consciously didn't publish any information that might harm people. If you think you are in danger just because now everybody knows that the NSA (and the British) don't care about laws you are clearly paranoid.
 
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