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(Anchorage Daily News)   Bill O'Reilly vacations in Alaska. And then has to ruin it all by trying to psychoanalyze everything. "This is America the way it used to be"   (adn.com) divider line 251
    More: Silly, Bill O'Reilly, Alaskans, Fox News  
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4506 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Aug 2013 at 10:29 AM (46 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



251 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-08-20 08:50:47 AM
"This is America the way it used to be"

No wifi and addicted to meth.
 
2013-08-20 08:54:00 AM
It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.
 
2013-08-20 09:03:43 AM
Alaska! Where you can't be too fat or too drunk. Where no one says things like "Let's see your high school equivalency certificate."
 
2013-08-20 09:03:48 AM
Then the White Man screwed it all up.
 
2013-08-20 09:05:01 AM

Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.


PocketNinja is on fire this morning. 10/10, thank you, good night.
 
2013-08-20 09:26:34 AM
Somehow, I doubt the looks of the Best Buy parking lot on the day PFD checks come out would fit neatly into O'Reilly's character profile of Joe Alaska.

PFD doesn't count as welfare though because the people of Alaska are more...uhh...umm...

Can someone dog whistle this one out for me?
 
2013-08-20 09:31:44 AM

sigdiamond2000: Can someone dog whistle this one out for me?


Alaska is exceptional in that it has exceptional mineral resources, and thus proves American Exceptionalism.  PFD is just the fruits of Alaskans being excellent.
 
2013-08-20 09:38:05 AM
I understand Alaskans are pretty busy, fighting grizzly bears and what-not. But would it kill them to send a thank you letter every once in a while for all the federal aid we give? Even a text message would do.
 
2013-08-20 09:47:38 AM

vernonFL: "This is America the way it used to be"

No wifi and addicted to meth.


And socialist.
 
2013-08-20 09:57:40 AM
This is Russia the way it used to be?
 
2013-08-20 10:05:19 AM
I prefer my America without the run down trailer parks, disenfranchised native population and meth heads?
 
2013-08-20 10:31:45 AM
The America where everyone gets yearly checks from oil companies?

Bill O'Reilly loves socialism!!!
 
2013-08-20 10:31:46 AM
Populated by mostly Natives?
 
2013-08-20 10:32:12 AM

bdub77: PocketNinja is on fire this morning. 10/10, thank you, good night.

 
2013-08-20 10:32:44 AM
So...he's saying everyone in the U.S. should receive a check from the government annually to pay us each our fair share of the mineral resources extracted from the land?

OK.
 
2013-08-20 10:33:26 AM

Radak: This is Russia the way it used to be?


Yes, because of how light works, what you see when you look towards Russia from your back yard actually has a slight time delay.  You are seeing Russia's history play out right before your eyes.
 
2013-08-20 10:33:35 AM
Lots and lots of sex with moose? But not gay moose, because that would be disgusting.
 
2013-08-20 10:34:09 AM
I don't think Billo's ancestors fresh off the boat from County Cavan saw much in the way of Alaskan-style wilderness in northern New Jersey.
 
2013-08-20 10:34:22 AM
But the US Mail still brings them their checks from Uncle Sugar; Social Security, military and government retirement, Medicare, Medicaid, WIC, food stamps.

And none of that stupid living with other people to mess with.
Messy humans, always needing something.
 
2013-08-20 10:34:30 AM
I presume he flew up there. I hope he draws some inspiration from Ted Stevens.
 
2013-08-20 10:34:32 AM
People like him are incapable of seeing anything without putting it through their preconception filter.
 
2013-08-20 10:35:15 AM
Sarah Palin still isn't going to sleep with you, Billo.
 
2013-08-20 10:35:26 AM

Pocket Ninja: Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own.


When I was a kid, you  could buy a woman for a packet of sewing needles up there.
 
2013-08-20 10:35:35 AM

theorellior: I don't think Billo's ancestors fresh off the boat from County Cavan saw much in the way of Alaskan-style wilderness in northern New Jersey.


Billo wouldn't have let filthy immigrants like his ancestors into these glorious United States.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-08-20 10:35:41 AM
Why doesn't he go to somalia?  That's the REAL land before the evil gubbmint.
 
2013-08-20 10:36:18 AM
O'Reilly vacations in reliably red state; is reliably red.
 
2013-08-20 10:36:20 AM
ioneglobalgrind.files.wordpress.com
Bill O or Eric Von Zipper, you decide.
 
2013-08-20 10:36:59 AM

Peter von Nostrand: I prefer my America without the run down trailer parks, disenfranchised native population and meth heads?


Were you not informed that the South has made plans to rise again?
 
2013-08-20 10:37:13 AM

vudukungfu: When I was a kid, you could buy a woman for a packet of sewing needles up there.


Well, duh, what use is a woman without sewing needles?
 
2013-08-20 10:37:35 AM
Now you know how the Native Americans felt, assbag.

Except that rich white people aren't being systematically slaughtered.
 
2013-08-20 10:37:40 AM

sigdiamond2000: Somehow, I doubt the looks of the Best Buy parking lot on the day PFD checks come out would fit neatly into O'Reilly's character profile of Joe Alaska.

PFD doesn't count as welfare though because the people of Alaska are more JESUS.uhh...umm...

Can someone dog whistle this one out for me?



there ya go
 
2013-08-20 10:38:09 AM

bdub77: Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.

PocketNinja is on fire this morning. 10/10, thank you, good night.


Damn it's dusty in here.
 
2013-08-20 10:38:30 AM
The sun doesn't set all summer long ... you can't explain that!
 
2013-08-20 10:38:50 AM
i came by the read the post .. i am not psychoanalyzing anybody.
 
2013-08-20 10:39:13 AM
"This is America the way it used to be"

About 10 degrees cooler?
 
2013-08-20 10:39:25 AM
Hey, not all of us are meth heads.

/but we do like our beer
 
2013-08-20 10:39:44 AM

Pocket Ninja: That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.


0-media-cdn.foolz.us

But only because there was no more to read. Bravo! You are killing it today!
 
2013-08-20 10:40:21 AM

sigdiamond2000: Somehow, I doubt the looks of the Best Buy parking lot on the day PFD checks come out would fit neatly into O'Reilly's character profile of Joe Alaska.

PFD doesn't count as welfare though because the people of Alaska are more...uhh...umm...

Can someone dog whistle this one out for me?


Rural
 
2013-08-20 10:40:53 AM

Pants full of macaroni!!: Sarah Palin still isn't going to sleep with you, Billo.


Sure she would. How do you think she achieved her success in politics in the first place? Sure wasn't using her mouth for talking.
 
2013-08-20 10:41:50 AM
Alaska is great. There's so much open space, beautiful terrain, and amazing wildlife that one can easily spend a day away from another human and explore. Its not hard to find an empty stream to fish, or lazily kayak a bay to observe whales and seals, or spent a day hiking up a mountain. I miss it every once in a while when I'm dealing with annoying panhandlers, busy crowds of assholes, and the overarching smell of urine here in Chicago.
 
2013-08-20 10:41:55 AM

Dahnkster: [ioneglobalgrind.files.wordpress.com image 370x490]
Bill O or Eric Von Zipper, you decide.


He kinda looks like Colin from "Whose Line Is It Anyway" having a very angry stroke.
 
2013-08-20 10:42:32 AM
Days of neverending darkness?
 
2013-08-20 10:42:53 AM

Jackson Herring: sigdiamond2000: Somehow, I doubt the looks of the Best Buy parking lot on the day PFD checks come out would fit neatly into O'Reilly's character profile of Joe Alaska.

PFD doesn't count as welfare though because the people of Alaska are more...uhh...umm...

Can someone dog whistle this one out for me?

Rural


Perfect. Let's go with that.
 
2013-08-20 10:43:01 AM
mediadisruptus.com

Alaska? Do it Live Bill, do it live...
 
2013-08-20 10:43:11 AM

rumpelstiltskin: But would it kill them to send a thank you letter every once in a while for all the federal aid we give? Even a text message would do.


Since the amount of federally owned land in Alaska is about 150% the size of Texas, I think that they really don't owe anyone much of anything. Add that in to the amount of millitary bases, other govermental obligation and thenrealize that the size of the population up there is tiny and it is not hard to figure out why dollars fly up there and trickle back.
 
2013-08-20 10:43:31 AM

sigdiamond2000: Somehow, I doubt the looks of the Best Buy parking lot on the day PFD checks come out would fit neatly into O'Reilly's character profile of Joe Alaska.

PFD doesn't count as welfare though because the people of Alaska are more...uhh...umm...

Can someone dog whistle this one out for me?


Alaska sucks so hard they have to pay people to live there?
 
2013-08-20 10:43:58 AM
if i want to know what alaskans are like i'll just watch a few episodes of northern exposure
 
2013-08-20 10:44:09 AM
Unless he's vacationing in the interior, he's never actually seen what Alaska is like.
 
2013-08-20 10:44:36 AM

The Dog Ate My Homework: So...he's saying everyone in the U.S. should receive a check from the government annually to pay us each our fair share of the mineral resources extracted from the land?

OK.


Speaking as a resident of a region currently being raped for marcellus shale gas extraction, I am definitely okay with this.
 
2013-08-20 10:44:58 AM
Little known fact: In America we all used to get checks each year based on the amount of resources extracted from the ground.
 
2013-08-20 10:45:18 AM

Lost Thought 00: Unless he's vacationing in the interior, he's never actually seen what Alaska is like.


You think Palin used that pick-up line with McCain or Roger Ailes?
 
2013-08-20 10:45:28 AM
So let me get this straight... O'Reilly observed that thanks to climate change, Alaska now looks like the old west?
 
2013-08-20 10:46:40 AM

EyeballKid: You think Palin used that pick-up line with McCain or Roger Ailes?


Oh, man, I'm glad the room was empty when I read that.
 
2013-08-20 10:46:43 AM
Who knew BillO would be so happy in a place where you can go hours on end without seeing any, um, AHEM..."darkness?"
 
2013-08-20 10:49:08 AM

vudukungfu: Populated by mostly Natives?


Came here for this
 
2013-08-20 10:50:05 AM
Rugged individualism or gimmie gimmie gimmie welfare state?
 
2013-08-20 10:50:40 AM

vernonFL: "This is America the way it used to be"

No wifi and addicted to meth.


And covered in snow from coast to coast...
 
2013-08-20 10:52:04 AM
Used to be?  Alaska has only been America for 54 years.
 
2013-08-20 10:54:01 AM

mediablitz: The America where everyone gets yearly checks from oil companies?

Bill O'Reilly loves socialism!!!


I was going to say something like this.
 
2013-08-20 10:54:16 AM

Dahnkster: Bill O or Eric Von Zipper, you decide.


i1168.photobucket.com

Oh, it's von Zipper all the way.

/DVR'd a buncha the Frankie/Annette beach movies for my daughter, she loves 'em.
//Don Rickles' improv in Beach Blanket Bingo where he rips the cast is pure classic comedy gold

To Frankie: "You're 43!!!  What're you tryin' act like a teenager???  You're 43!!!"
To Annette:  "Y'know, I never did like your personality"
 
2013-08-20 10:55:09 AM

HeadLever: rumpelstiltskin: But would it kill them to send a thank you letter every once in a while for all the federal aid we give? Even a text message would do.

Since the amount of federally owned land in Alaska is about 150% the size of Texas, I think that they really don't owe anyone much of anything. Add that in to the amount of millitary bases, other govermental obligation and thenrealize that the size of the population up there is tiny and it is not hard to figure out why dollars fly up there and trickle back.


There's always an excuse for red-state welfare.
 
2013-08-20 10:56:08 AM

vudukungfu: Populated by mostly Natives?


and Russian strippers (if you get to Anchorage be sure to hit the ABC)
 
2013-08-20 10:56:37 AM
No one cares, Bill.
 
2013-08-20 10:57:22 AM

The Dog Ate My Homework: So...he's saying everyone in the U.S. should receive a check from the government annually to pay us each our fair share of the mineral resources extracted from the land?

OK.


They get those checks for the destruction of the natural beauty of their land. The Midwest and east coast get water that catches on fire, it seems appropriate.
 
2013-08-20 10:57:49 AM
Bill, when you were born, Alaska was not a State.
 
2013-08-20 10:58:19 AM

Lionel Mandrake: There's always an excuse for red-state welfare.


You could always give it to the states if you don't want to pay for its management......
 
2013-08-20 10:59:00 AM
www.finalcomments.seanbond.me
You mean the old America that was socialist?
 
2013-08-20 10:59:57 AM

vudukungfu: Populated by mostly Natives?


Alaska does have by far the highest population of Native Americans at about 16 to 17 percent.  That is another large federal obligation on top of everythign else.
 
2013-08-20 11:00:23 AM

HeadLever: Lionel Mandrake: There's always an excuse for red-state welfare.

You could always give it to the states if you don't want to pay for its management......


The do. much of it are for programs at are administered at the state level.
 
2013-08-20 11:01:04 AM

Corvus: HeadLever: Lionel Mandrake: There's always an excuse for red-state welfare.

You could always give it to the states if you don't want to pay for its management......

They do. much of it are for programs that are administered at the state level.


sorry early. FTFM
 
2013-08-20 11:02:13 AM
HeadLever:

Your statement is very confused.  They don't owe anything because we already give them so much.  And we shouldn't have a problem with giving them more because there are reasons why we give them money.  This doesn't make any sense... so please articulate your point more clearly.  As it is, it sounds like you're claiming that they're doing us a favor by letting us spend money there.  Which is usually followed by disdain for those that receive government money (except for all those exceptions that appeal to you).
 
2013-08-20 11:03:09 AM

Lost Thought 00: Unless he's vacationing in the interior, he's never actually seen what Alaska is like.


This. He probably went to the touristy areas in the touristy season, especially judging from that pic of him with the sign.

/I have never seen more drunk/drugged out homeless people than in downtown Juneau in mid-September
 
2013-08-20 11:03:11 AM

HeadLever: vudukungfu: Populated by mostly Natives?

Alaska does have by far the highest population of Native Americans at about 16 to 17 percent.  That is another large federal obligation on top of everythign else.


So they depend on government handouts? I've been told those on the right government hand outs makes you dependent on government, why would you want that states to be that?

Why shouldn't they be bootstrapy and be able to provide to their own populations by themselves?
 
2013-08-20 11:05:24 AM

Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.


community.us.playstation.com
 
2013-08-20 11:06:35 AM

Fireproof: Lost Thought 00: Unless he's vacationing in the interior, he's never actually seen what Alaska is like.

This. He probably went to the touristy areas in the touristy season, especially judging from that pic of him with the sign.

/I have never seen more drunk/drugged out homeless people than in downtown Juneau in mid-September


Isolated incident. Overzealous mama grizzly.
 
2013-08-20 11:06:56 AM
It costs so much to transport everything that it's ridiculously expensive? Or does he mean a mostly empty wilderness?
 
2013-08-20 11:07:02 AM
I'm starting to realize how much of the conservative ideology is based on bad nostalgia.
 
2013-08-20 11:07:30 AM

Corvus: HeadLever: vudukungfu: Populated by mostly Natives?

Alaska does have by far the highest population of Native Americans at about 16 to 17 percent.  That is another large federal obligation on top of everythign else.

So they depend on government handouts? I've been told those on the right government hand outs makes you dependent on government, why would you want that states to be that?

Why shouldn't they be bootstrapy and be able to provide to their own populations by themselves?


What is your point?
 
2013-08-20 11:08:29 AM
Bill likes his wilderness like he likes his cities

Uneducated
Racist
Sexist
Homophobic
Antisemitic
People in constant fear of their own shadow
Trigger happy

 Just like the good lawrd intended..
 
2013-08-20 11:09:25 AM

Mr. Shabooboo: Bill likes his wilderness like he likes his cities

Uneducated
Racist
Sexist
Homophobic
Antisemitic
People in constant fear of their own shadow
Trigger happy

 Just like the good lawrd intended..


How can "wilderness" be any of this things?
 
2013-08-20 11:09:47 AM

Corvus: [www.finalcomments.seanbond.me image 333x500]
You mean the old America that was socialist?


Just when I thought I've read every single dumb quote that has come out of that insufferable woman, I read something new.  Wow.
 
2013-08-20 11:10:48 AM

Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.


I swear to farking God you need to just copy and paste these all into a book, The Pocket Book of Pocket Ninja.  Each quotation will feature the Fark thread/topic of course..so it has *some* sort of context.

You magnificent bastard.  I heart you. In a non-gay way of course.  NTTAWT.
 
2013-08-20 11:10:56 AM

Frank N Stein: Alaska is great. There's so much open space, beautiful terrain, and amazing wildlife that one can easily spend a day away from another human and explore. Its not hard to find an empty stream to fish, or lazily kayak a bay to observe whales and seals, or spent a day hiking up a mountain.


Sounds like a liberal environmentalist's paradise!
 
2013-08-20 11:13:09 AM

Rocket To Russia: Frank N Stein: Alaska is great. There's so much open space, beautiful terrain, and amazing wildlife that one can easily spend a day away from another human and explore. Its not hard to find an empty stream to fish, or lazily kayak a bay to observe whales and seals, or spent a day hiking up a mountain.

Sounds like a liberal environmentalist's paradise!


Yeah, could be. Also enjoyed by conservative conservationists or just people who enjoy nature.
 
2013-08-20 11:14:36 AM
TFA (the parts that weren't quotes from Reilly)  sounds like Alaskans are getting tired of right wing media personalities making them look bad.
 
2013-08-20 11:14:37 AM
Wow, coincidentally, the same week that Bill-O was in Alaska, I was there too!  And surprisingly, my impressions were nothing like his.  It sounds like  one of us must've had some preconceived notions. Must've been me, since he's always right.
 
2013-08-20 11:14:45 AM
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-08-20 11:17:02 AM

Headso: Little known fact: In America we all used to get checks each year based on the amount of resources extracted from the ground.


O Really?

struckbyenlightning.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-08-20 11:18:29 AM

Corvus: They do. much of it are for programs that are administered at the state level.


Not sure what you are talking about here, Corvus.  What programs are administed at the state level for Forest Service, Park Service and BLM lands?  These lands are exclusivly administered by the US Goverment, not the state.

/pretty sure I am not mistaken here.
 
2013-08-20 11:18:58 AM

kid_icarus: TFA (the parts that weren't quotes from Reilly)  sounds like Alaskans are getting tired of right wing media personalities making them look bad.


How do those Alaskans vote, again? Ted Stevens? Murkowski? Governor Palin?

In the words of Gypsy, "This is YOUR dishwashing liquid, YOU soak in it!"
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-08-20 11:18:59 AM

Corvus: HeadLever: Lionel Mandrake: There's always an excuse for red-state welfare.

You could always give it to the states if you don't want to pay for its management......

The do. much of it are for programs at are administered at the state level.


Until they don't like how the state is doing it and they go whine to the Federal level again.

//There is NO CONSISTENCY in the GOP.  None at all... except their own selfishness.
 
2013-08-20 11:19:24 AM

bdub77: Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.

PocketNinja is on fire this morning. 10/10, thank you, good night.


you earned it
www.foodchannel.com
 
2013-08-20 11:20:50 AM

HeadLever: Lionel Mandrake: There's always an excuse for red-state welfare.

You could always give it to the states if you don't want to pay for its management......


wat
 
2013-08-20 11:22:29 AM
This is America the way it used to be?

Dumb enough to vote Republican reliably?
 
2013-08-20 11:22:48 AM
elffster:

Eh. A whole book of his fark posts? He's pretty formulaic. He takes a position, writes a narrative, exaggerates, throws in a strawman or two and calls it a day.
I know I'll be open to criticism, especially since I usually disagree with the political point he's trying to make, but his essays (for lack of a better word) are pretty much all the same shiat. There's also the "forum personality" thing that people don that I absolutely hate, but that's a whole different subject

I will give him some point though, because every once in a while someone who doesn't know his shtick will claim he's a troll or something
 
2013-08-20 11:23:11 AM
d23:  
[struckbyenlightning.files.wordpress.com image 310x266]

Right,
drag teh Jews into this.
 
2013-08-20 11:24:17 AM

elffster: Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.

I swear to farking God you need to just copy and paste these all into a book, The Pocket Book of Pocket Ninja.  Each quotation will feature the Fark thread/topic of course..so it has *some* sort of context.

You magnificent bastard.  I heart you. In a non-gay way of course.  NTTAWT.


I second this.
 
2013-08-20 11:24:41 AM

Corvus: So they depend on government handouts?


They depend?  No.  It is the federal governement's land and thier obligation to manage it.  The state gets no direct revenue for this and they shouldn't have to pay for its management.  Now if you wanted to give this land to the state for them to manage, that would be a different story.
 
2013-08-20 11:25:24 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: They do. much of it are for programs that are administered at the state level.

Not sure what you are talking about here, Corvus.  What programs are administed at the state level for Forest Service, Park Service and BLM lands?  These lands are exclusivly administered by the US Goverment, not the state.

/pretty sure I am not mistaken here.


I wasn't talking about those. I talking about much bigger programs. You seem like you want to pretend that Akaskas federal money has to do with programs that are not that big.

Why should the state take care of their own land anyways?
 
2013-08-20 11:31:40 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: They do. much of it are for programs that are administered at the state level.

Not sure what you are talking about here, Corvus.  What programs are administed at the state level for Forest Service, Park Service and BLM lands?  These lands are exclusivly administered by the US Goverment, not the state.

/pretty sure I am not mistaken here.


Oh I see I guess your admitting federal spending on things like welfare, education and medicade really doesn't factor much to federal money being spent.
 
2013-08-20 11:31:46 AM

Corvus: Why shouldn't they be bootstrapy and be able to provide to their own populations by themselves?


They do as what is required by law.  It is not the state's fault that most of the landmass is owned by the Federal Goverment and the feds have to pay for that management.  It is not the state's fault that a high percentage of the population if Native American and Federal Goverment is required to provide assistence and aid to them.  It is not the stat's fault that there are a large amount of federal millitary bases in AK that the federal goverment is required to fund.

If you want less federal money to go to Alaska and have it go back to 'providing to thier own' that wouldn't really impact the state government all that much.
 
2013-08-20 11:32:29 AM

Fireproof: I'm starting to realize how much of the conservative ideology is based on bad nostalgia.


All of it?
 
2013-08-20 11:32:31 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: You mean the old America that was socialist?

Actaully, it was a bit more than that.  Here is a old, but excellent recap of the history of our (and Alaska's) mineral rights.


It's still sociism that people of the state is getting the history of it doesn't really matter.
 
2013-08-20 11:33:49 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: So they depend on government handouts?

They depend?  No.  It is the federal governement's land and thier obligation to manage it.  The state gets no direct revenue for this and they shouldn't have to pay for its management.  Now if you wanted to give this land to the state for them to manage, that would be a different story.


So then it's not state spending if it's federal land. So you are lying then.
 
2013-08-20 11:34:15 AM

Corvus: You seem like you want to pretend that Akaskas federal money has to do with programs that are not that big.


So having the federal goverment required to manage a land mass that is 150% the size of Texas (that is just the land that the federal goverment owns up there and not the entire state) is not very big?  Are you high?
 
2013-08-20 11:34:51 AM

Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.


Best one ever.
 
2013-08-20 11:35:49 AM

Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.


You, sir, are welcome to my wife. She has all her teeth and can cook a mean fish.
 
2013-08-20 11:38:09 AM

Corvus: Oh I see I guess your admitting federal spending on things like welfare, education and medicade really doesn't factor much to federal money being spent.


Strawman argument penatlty.  10 yards and loss of down.

Of course it counts.  If you want states to manage this themselves, that would likely be fine by many of them, so long as you reduce their federal taxes accordintly.  You also need to realize that the federal goverment is bound by treaty with many Native American tribes up there for these obligations, so you will need to address these seperately from the state.
 
2013-08-20 11:39:05 AM

Jackson Herring: sigdiamond2000: Somehow, I doubt the looks of the Best Buy parking lot on the day PFD checks come out would fit neatly into O'Reilly's character profile of Joe Alaska.

PFD doesn't count as welfare though because the people of Alaska are more...uhh...umm...

Can someone dog whistle this one out for me?

Rural


Untan?
 
2013-08-20 11:40:33 AM

Corvus: So then it's not state spending if it's federal land. So you are lying then.


Another strawman.  I never said it was state spending.  It is federal land so the federal governement is obligated to pay for its managment.
 
2013-08-20 11:41:23 AM

Frank N Stein: elffster:

Eh. A whole book of his fark posts? He's pretty formulaic. He takes a position, writes a narrative, exaggerates, throws in a strawman or two and calls it a day.
I know I'll be open to criticism, especially since I usually disagree with the political point he's trying to make, but his essays (for lack of a better word) are pretty much all the same shiat. There's also the "forum personality" thing that people don that I absolutely hate, but that's a whole different subject

I will give him some point though, because every once in a while someone who doesn't know his shtick will claim he's a troll or something


6/10 you might get some bites
 
2013-08-20 11:41:58 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: Oh I see I guess your admitting federal spending on things like welfare, education and medicade really doesn't factor much to federal money being spent.

Strawman argument penatlty.  10 yards and loss of down.

Of course it counts.  If you want states to manage this themselves, that would likely be fine by many of them, so long as you reduce their federal taxes accordintly.  You also need to realize that the federal goverment is bound by treaty with many Native American tribes up there for these obligations, so you will need to address these seperately from the state.


Well then why then when I brought it up early you said I was only allowed to talk about parks and taking care of the native Americans? Which is it?
 
2013-08-20 11:42:08 AM

Pocket Ninja: That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.


Like the fields and mountains of Alaska that was a thing of wonder and beauty
 
2013-08-20 11:42:46 AM

d23: Why doesn't he go to somalia?  That's the REAL land before the evil gubbmint.


Antarctica has no government as well.
 
2013-08-20 11:43:21 AM
Anyone else *REALLY happy Pocket Ninja is back?

i913.photobucket.com
 
2013-08-20 11:44:04 AM

Corvus: It's still sociism that people of the state is getting the history of it doesn't really matter


In a certain way, yes as the royalties do go to the public good.  This does make sense as mininging and resource extraction does have an a  external cost, even with tight envioronmental regulations.  However, the leasee is still the primary benificiary of the wealth, which would not fly in a socialist utopia.
 
2013-08-20 11:45:13 AM

Corvus: Well then why then when I brought it up early you said I was only allowed to talk about parks and taking care of the native Americans?


Where?
 
2013-08-20 11:45:50 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: So then it's not state spending if it's federal land. So you are lying then.

Another strawman.  I never said it was state spending.  It is federal land so the federal governement is obligated to pay for its managment.


Sorry then I thought that's what we were talking about.

So you have no problem with other federal money being spent in other states like for infrastructure, national parks, and other things along those lines? Or is it just for Alaska?
 
2013-08-20 11:47:02 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: Well then why then when I brought it up early you said I was only allowed to talk about parks and taking care of the native Americans?

Where?


right here:

HeadLever: Corvus: They do. much of it are for programs that are administered at the state level.

Not sure what you are talking about here, Corvus.  What programs are administed at the state level for Forest Service, Park Service and BLM lands?  These lands are exclusivly administered by the US Goverment, not the state.

/pretty sure I am not mistaken here.

 
2013-08-20 11:48:32 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: It's still sociism that people of the state is getting the history of it doesn't really matter

In a certain way, yes as the royalties do go to the public good.  This does make sense as mininging and resource extraction does have an a  external cost, even with tight envioronmental regulations.  However, the leasee is still the primary benificiary of the wealth, which would not fly in a socialist utopia.


Ok so you support socialism as long as it's not the a "socialist utopia" kind? I don't think there is such a thing so you must support the same levels of socialism I do right?
 
2013-08-20 11:48:51 AM
I had to live on the Kenai Peninsula for 9th grade.

There might be somewhere worse in the world than Alaska, but in 32 years of bouncing around the globe travelling, I have yet to find it.
 
2013-08-20 11:49:01 AM
i wonder if PocketNinja thinks people who kiss his ass are massive losers, or loves it so much he has a little secret feel around his pants each time
 
2013-08-20 11:51:39 AM

Corvus: So you have no problem with other federal money being spent in other states like for infrastructure, national parks, and other things along those lines? Or is it just for Alaska?


I have no issue with the federal goverment spending money that it is obligated to spend in these states (things like public land management, military bases, assistence to Native Americans per treaty obligations).  My beef is with those that would conflate this spending with welfare to the state.  When you get into things like infrastructure, education, and public assistence, then that argument of state aid by the federal goverment does have some merit.
 
2013-08-20 11:53:23 AM

Corvus: right here:


Bzzt - Nowhere in that argument did I say that you were only allowed to talk about these thing.
 
2013-08-20 11:54:38 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: So you have no problem with other federal money being spent in other states like for infrastructure, national parks, and other things along those lines? Or is it just for Alaska?

I have no issue with the federal goverment spending money that it is obligated to spend in these states (things like public land management, military bases, assistence to Native Americans per treaty obligations).  My beef is with those that would conflate this spending with welfare to the state.  When you get into things like infrastructure, education, and public assistence, then that argument of state aid by the federal goverment does have some merit.


So if I have a INTERSTATE that is used so that one state can ship their products to another state that is a STATE expense but if I have a park in my OWN state that only people of my state can go to, it's federal money and not a hand out.

Really?
 
2013-08-20 11:55:17 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: right here:

Bzzt - Nowhere in that argument did I say that you were only allowed to talk about these thing.


So then why did you refuse to answer my point then? How about those programs?
 
2013-08-20 11:55:50 AM

Lady J: i wonder if PocketNinja thinks people who kiss his ass are massive losers, or loves it so much he has a little secret feel around his pants each time


There's nothing wrong with giving credit where credit is due.  BTW, how many threads have you been in where you're praise for something you've said as much as P.N.?  None, oh well then by all means, please continue to bash everyone that is patting P.N. on the back for something well deserved.
 
2013-08-20 11:55:52 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: right here:

Bzzt - Nowhere in that argument did I say that you were only allowed to talk about these thing.


If you considered that valid then why didn't you actually answer my question?
 
2013-08-20 11:56:06 AM

Corvus: Ok so you support socialism as long as it's not the a "socialist utopia" kind?


Limited socalism as in public sector?  Sure.  I support spending on some things that supports the public good from public taxes/royalties.  I do not support the socialist notion that all private sector/capitalist ideals are bad and shouldn't be a part of socieity.
 
2013-08-20 11:57:17 AM

Peter von Nostrand: I prefer my America without the run down trailer parks, disenfranchised native population and meth heads?


What part of American is that?
 
2013-08-20 11:57:42 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: So you have no problem with other federal money being spent in other states like for infrastructure, national parks, and other things along those lines? Or is it just for Alaska?

I have no issue with the federal goverment spending money that it is obligated to spend in these states (things like public land management, military bases, assistence to Native Americans per treaty obligations).  My beef is with those that would conflate this spending with welfare to the state.  When you get into things like infrastructure, education, and public assistence, then that argument of state aid by the federal goverment does have some merit.


I see so rural things, where Republicans live, federal handouts are boot strappy. But when you live in places that have things like federal interstates, or national borders to deal with it's "State welfare".

Got it!
 
2013-08-20 11:58:52 AM
Corvus:
img.fark.net
You mean the old America that was socialist?

Not related to the oil fund, but what the hell's up with her glasses in that pic? They're not symmetrical- one side is half-framed, the other full-framed. I've never seen glasses like that, and I've bought a new pair of glasses every year or two since I was in 1st grade. They look like someone smacked her upside the head and broke them.
 
2013-08-20 11:58:58 AM

HeadLever: Corvus: Ok so you support socialism as long as it's not the a "socialist utopia" kind?

Limited socalism as in public sector?  Sure.  I support spending on some things that supports the public good from public taxes/royalties.  I do not support the socialist notion that all private sector/capitalist ideals are bad and shouldn't be a part of socieity.


Talk about strawman. Do you really think any mainstream politician does? You know almost no one actually wants that right?
 
2013-08-20 11:59:00 AM

MadMike5200: Lady J: i wonder if PocketNinja thinks people who kiss his ass are massive losers, or loves it so much he has a little secret feel around his pants each time

There's nothing wrong with giving credit where credit is due.  BTW, how many threads have you been in where you're praise for something you've said as much as P.N.?  None, oh well then by all means, please continue to bash everyone that is patting P.N. on the back for something well deserved.


I did no such thing! it is ass kissing, but he is funny

anyway im sure they can stand up for themselves
 
2013-08-20 12:00:21 PM

rumpelstiltskin: I understand Alaskans are pretty busy, fighting grizzly bears and what-not. But would it kill them to send a thank you letter every once in a while for all the federal aid we give? Even a text message would do.


Thanks.

imageshack.us
 
2013-08-20 12:01:07 PM

Corvus: So if I have a INTERSTATE that is used so that one state can ship their products to another state that is a STATE expense but if I have a park in my

OWN state that only people of my state can go to  , it's federal money and not a hand out.

That is quite a hypothetical there.  Interstate system is another primary federal obligation.  State higways are managed by the state. County roads are managed by the county, and on down the line.

National Parks are never limited to "only people of my state can go to"?

Not sure where you get your information on these topics but they are way off base.  I'll bet that 80% of all traffic that enters Yellowstone is out-of-state.  In fact, the joke around here is that Yellowstone is where the locals go to experience traffic jams, road rage, and crowded vistas.
 
2013-08-20 12:01:18 PM
Corvus:

What exactly is your point?
 
2013-08-20 12:02:32 PM

HeadLever: When you get into things like infrastructure, education, and public assistence, then that argument of state aid by the federal goverment does have some merit.


Most of that money is going towards those things in Alaska.  Due to the size, geography, and remoteness of population infrastructure costs more than it does in other states.
 
2013-08-20 12:02:35 PM

Corvus: So then why did you refuse to answer my point then? How about those programs?


did you read my response here: 2013-08-20 11:38:09 AM ?
 
2013-08-20 12:07:26 PM
Including spousal abuse.
 
2013-08-20 12:07:43 PM

Corvus: Do you really think any mainstream politician does? You know almost no one actually wants that right?


You were not talking about mainstream politicians. You were talking about socialism.  Two different discussions, sparky.  Thought you are correct that most politicans dont want that.  Unless you consider Maxine Waters as mainstream.
 
2013-08-20 12:08:49 PM

HeadLever: Corvus: Oh I see I guess your admitting federal spending on things like welfare, education and medicade really doesn't factor much to federal money being spent.

Strawman argument penatlty.  10 yards and loss of down.

Of course it counts.  If you want states to manage this themselves, that would likely be fine by many of them, so long as you reduce their federal taxes accordintly.  You also need to realize that the federal goverment is bound by treaty with many Native American tribes up there for these obligations, so you will need to address these seperately from the state.


Is this the America O'Reilly refers to? THAT'S what he longs for a return to?
 
2013-08-20 12:09:21 PM
So .. America use to be infested with poodle sized mosquito, unrelenting cold and whores.

Gotcha
 
2013-08-20 12:10:26 PM
A few travelogue tips on visiting Alaska.

1)  Anchorage is entirely civilized, clean and pretty.  There are Victorian and modern bed and breakfasts near the center of the city, as well as fine hotels, but you have to book far ahead of time.  Lots of green everything and the city has a flower theme in summer.  Golden and bald eagles instead of pigeons.

2)  The first two weeks of July are the best time to visit, because temperatures in Anchorage are in the high 60's to low 70's, by then the mosquitoes are gone, and there is about 20 hours of sunlight a day, so you never want to sleep and want to walk everywhere.

3)  The state railroad is classic 1940s style, comfortable with lots of leg room, which is a great way to travel to Seward, because it is insanely beautiful.  Seward is gorgeous, but has a more classical Alaskan look, and is where you can catch a 100-ton boat to see the Denali National Park.

4)  As peaceful and calm as the land is, the water is right at the border of fisherman's heaven and hell.  It is full of giant fish, but can turn from smooth as glass to 8-10' swells in minutes.  There are warnings everywhere that the glacial silt beaches are deadly, and they are not kidding.

5)  In the countryside, there are critters everywhere, including bear, moose, reindeer, wolves, you name it.  There are also little creeks everywhere, and many people commute with light aircraft.

6)  Oddly enough, the prices there are pretty comparable for most things, though there are no convenience stores and few fast food restaurants.  Direct flights to many US cities.
 
2013-08-20 12:10:34 PM

HeadLever: You were not talking about mainstream politicians. You were talking about socialism.  Two different discussions, sparky.


Actually its dozens of different discussions, socialism encompasses a wide range of political theories, many of which do not consider all private sector ideals bad as you seemed to imply they all did before.

Theres a lot more to 'socialism' than marxism.
 
2013-08-20 12:10:40 PM

Fart_Machine: Most of that money is going towards those things in Alaska. Due to the size, geography, and remoteness of population infrastructure costs more than it does in other states.


Partially.  Don't forget that some of this overlaps.  For instance US highways being built on US Government lands, would be somewhat of an overlap on this.
 
2013-08-20 12:14:06 PM
Shut up, you cock
 
2013-08-20 12:14:46 PM

lilplatinum: HeadLever: You were not talking about mainstream politicians. You were talking about socialism.  Two different discussions, sparky.

Actually its dozens of different discussions, socialism encompasses a wide range of political theories, many of which do not consider all private sector ideals bad as you seemed to imply they all did before.

Theres a lot more to 'socialism' than marxism.


"If that is Marxism, then I am not a Marxist".
 
2013-08-20 12:15:53 PM

lilplatinum: Theres a lot more to 'socialism' than marxism.


True, but the generalized political idea behind socialism is  the 'social and economic doctrine that calls for public rather than private ownership or control of property and natural resources'

I agree that the public does need a stake in these resources, however, I don't agree that it needs to be public ownership.
 
2013-08-20 12:19:08 PM
Can't explain this either:
www.tide-forecast.com
 
2013-08-20 12:21:01 PM

Frank N Stein: Rocket To Russia: Frank N Stein: Alaska is great. There's so much open space, beautiful terrain, and amazing wildlife that one can easily spend a day away from another human and explore. Its not hard to find an empty stream to fish, or lazily kayak a bay to observe whales and seals, or spent a day hiking up a mountain.

Sounds like a liberal environmentalist's paradise!

Yeah, could be. Also enjoyed by conservative conservationists or just people who enjoy nature.


Whatever happened to the concept of a 'conservative conservationist', anyway? Even though it seems obvious and logical, these days the phrase sounds like an oxymoron.
 
2013-08-20 12:21:09 PM

HeadLever: True, but the generalized political idea behind socialism is  the 'social and economic doctrine that calls for public rather than private ownership or control of property and natural resources'

I agree that the public does need a stake in these resources, however, I don't agree that it needs to be public ownership.


In realistic discussion of Western politics, however, using this definition isn't really useful.  Even the actual socialist parties in Europe mostly do not call for abolition of private property ownership, and certainly there is zero hardcore socialist sentiment in American politics.  

shiat, to most of our electorate Socialist means "central right politician".

(My hillbilly Alaskan relatives who call Obama a socialist and then take their socialist oil handout from the state always amuse me).
 
2013-08-20 12:24:24 PM

elffster: Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.

I swear to farking God you need to just copy and paste these all into a book, The Pocket Book of Pocket Ninja.  Each quotation will feature the Fark thread/topic of course..so it has *some* sort of context.

You magnificent bastard.  I heart you. In a non-gay way of course.  NTTAWT.


I'm late to the thread, but I'm already (kind of) doing that.
 
2013-08-20 12:24:25 PM
www.alaska-in-pictures.com
The way America Used to Be:  filled with old people in the summer.
 
2013-08-20 12:25:29 PM

ginkor: A few travelogue tips on visiting Alaska.

2)  The first two weeks of July are the best time to visit, because temperatures in Anchorage are in the high 60's to low 70's, by then the mosquitoes are gone, and there is about 20 hours of sunlight a day, so you never want to sleep and want to walk everywhere.


No, the mosquitoes are never gone until the first good freeze, usually Late September, early October.  They come back at breakup, usually in April.

3)  The state railroad is classic 1940s style, comfortable with lots of leg room, which is a great way to travel to Seward, because it is insanely beautiful.  Seward is gorgeous, but has a more classical Alaskan look, and is where you can catch a 100-ton boat to see the Denali National Park.

Have to be one helluva boat to make it almost 400 miles inland.  Denali National Park is in the middle of the state.  (I think you meant to say Kenai Fjords National Park)

4)  As peaceful and calm as the land is, the water is right at the border of fisherman's heaven and hell.  It is full of giant fish, but can turn from smooth as glass to 8-10' swells in minutes.  There are warnings everywhere that the glacial silt beaches are deadly, and they are not kidding.

Used to be.  Overfishing has seriously depleted the populations.  When I was a kid catching a 200lb halibut out of Seward or Whittier was so common it was barely worth mentioning.  Now 35-40lb catches are considered a good day.


6)  Oddly enough, the prices there are pretty comparable for most things, though there are no convenience stores and few fast food restaurants.  Direct flights to many US cities.

This is probably the most confusing.  Convenience stores are everywhere.  In many of the rural villages all they have is a convenience store.

Everything else was pretty spot on though.
 
2013-08-20 12:27:46 PM

Skyd1v: When I was a kid catching a 200lb halibut out of Seward or Whittier was so common it was barely worth mentioning.  Now 35-40lb catches are considered a good day.


farking pukers have nigh on run the commercial fisherfolk into the ground.
 
2013-08-20 12:29:01 PM
I'd like to see the million dollar resort he's vacationing at while declaring Alaskans are independent self starters.
 
2013-08-20 12:29:30 PM
I don't remember America coming with a great big fat natural resources royalty cheque from the Government, but if it did, hey, I like the Old America.

BIG FAT GOVERNMENT CHEQUE FOR EVERY ONE! YOU CAN'T EXPLAIN THAT!
 
2013-08-20 12:29:38 PM

Frank N Stein: Mr. Shabooboo: Bill likes his wilderness like he likes his cities

Uneducated
Racist
Sexist
Homophobic
Antisemitic
People in constant fear of their own shadow
Trigger happy

 Just like the good lawrd intended..

How can "wilderness" be any of this things?


Never turn your back on a Larch...Never...
 
2013-08-20 12:31:20 PM
John Aronno of the Alaska Commons website counters O'Reilly's "mansplaining."

I don't want to white-knight Bill O'Reilly, but at least he doesn't use the term "mansplaining".
 
2013-08-20 12:33:07 PM

Frank N Stein: Alaska is great. There's so much open space, beautiful terrain, and amazing wildlife that one can easily spend a day away from another human and explore. Its not hard to find an empty stream to fish, or lazily kayak a bay to observe whales and seals, or spent a day hiking up a mountain. I miss it every once in a while when I'm dealing with annoying panhandlers, busy crowds of assholes, and the overarching smell of urine here in Chicago.


You know in the western states if you are willing to walk a mile off the road on any of the public lands, you pretty much get that too, without the mosquitoes and bears.  No one, just you and the rare German tourist.

lilplatinum: My hillbilly Alaskan relatives who call Obama a socialist and then take their socialist oil handout from the state always amuse me


Alaska is the most northern of the southern states.
 
2013-08-20 12:33:34 PM
img.photobucket.com

img.photobucket.com

i.imgur.com

i.imgur.com

/it's the internet, no way it's obscure
 
2013-08-20 12:38:41 PM

ChipNASA: Anyone else *REALLY happy Pocket Ninja is back?

[i913.photobucket.com image 400x192]


YES. As a testament to that: in my will, I am leaving all of my internets to PN. So he's got that going for him, which is nice.
 
2013-08-20 12:38:51 PM

lilplatinum: In realistic discussion of Western politics, however, using this definition isn't really useful.


Meh, it is an overused buzzword used by both sides to beat up on the other.  On the right, they point to the slippery slope of liberals wanting to move the country into socalism, while the left takes the same strawman and beats up on Sarah Palin photos.

I'll agree that it is far from useful, though you do have the occasional true socialst democrat call for nationalizing an industry.
 
2013-08-20 12:39:10 PM

Rapmaster2000: [www.alaska-in-pictures.com image 468x310]
The way America Used to Be:  filled with old people in the summer.


Little tourist, Little tourist
Little tourist from America
Well they all drive Winnebagos and they all drive real slow
And they all have fuzzy poodles
And their wives all have blue hair
And they all come to Alaska, for what, I don't know.

And they all have bumper stickers
That say "There's no inheritance
because I'm up here and I'm spending it now"
They take photographs of the caribou
And stop every time they see a moose
But they prob'ly couldn't tell you a bull from a cow.
 
2013-08-20 12:41:15 PM

Rapmaster2000: www.alaska-in-pictures.com
The way America Used to Be: filled with old people in the summer.


How can we be certain this is not an image of Canadians making their way south?
 
2013-08-20 12:41:40 PM

Rocket To Russia: Frank N Stein: Rocket To Russia: Frank N Stein: Alaska is great. There's so much open space, beautiful terrain, and amazing wildlife that one can easily spend a day away from another human and explore. Its not hard to find an empty stream to fish, or lazily kayak a bay to observe whales and seals, or spent a day hiking up a mountain.

Sounds like a liberal environmentalist's paradise!

Yeah, could be. Also enjoyed by conservative conservationists or just people who enjoy nature.

Whatever happened to the concept of a 'conservative conservationist', anyway? Even though it seems obvious and logical, these days the phrase sounds like an oxymoron.


They're still out there. Although no-one really uses the term "conservative conservationist". It's a clumsy phrase that I used just to counter your "liberal environmentalist" term. However there are plenty of conservatives that identify as conservationist. Organizations such as Ducks Unlimited, which does great work in protecting wetlands, are I'm guessing full of political conservatives.
 
2013-08-20 12:43:09 PM

Kirzania: Rapmaster2000: www.alaska-in-pictures.com
The way America Used to Be: filled with old people in the summer.

How can we be certain this is not an image of Canadians making their way south?


There's no snow.  they only go south when it's snowing.

/exception for hockey playoffs
 
2013-08-20 12:44:01 PM

mediablitz: The America where everyone gets yearly checks from oil companies?

Bill O'Reilly loves socialism!!!


Is there a term for corporatized socialism?
 
2013-08-20 12:46:16 PM
Is Bill O'Reilly that desperate to keep Sarah Palin relevant?  It seems like the only reason on God's green earth why he would go there.

Well...that and because he's still upset that white men over 40 aren't the only demographic worth catering to in election years anymore.
 
2013-08-20 12:46:33 PM

Rocket To Russia: Whatever happened to the concept of a 'conservative conservationist', anyway?


That may be because the liberals that make the talking points problably refuse to belive that they exist.  The town where I come from is mostly supported by mining and ranching and some logging where nearly everyone is conservative and loves to hunt, fish, ski, hike, camp, snomobile, dirtbike, hunt for shed antlers, birdwatch, pick wild chokecherries, rasberries, mushrooms, asparagus, horseradish and plums.  They don't want to see these lands become another California and will fight to keep public access open and these areas wild.
 
2013-08-20 12:47:48 PM
Ahh SE Alaska, a fine mix of criminals, scoundrels, bums, scallywags, lowlifes and losers all running from something down South.

/I miss the "P" Bar and wandering through Old Thompson Harbor
 
2013-08-20 12:48:20 PM

Frank N Stein: Organizations such as Ducks Unlimited, which does great work in protecting wetlands, are I'm guessing full of political conservatives.


Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation would be another one that is mostly filled with 'conservatives'.
 
2013-08-20 12:50:21 PM

Clemkadidlefark: So .. America use to be infested with poodle sized mosquito, unrelenting cold and whores.

Gotcha


I too long for the day when the whores were unrelenting.
 
2013-08-20 12:50:47 PM
So, still no one saying  "M-Fer, I want more iced tea."
 
2013-08-20 12:53:26 PM
I still wanna know how the state of Alaska gets the money off of a national resource like oil. Where's my damn check?

/Would prefer they invest my check to stabilize entitlement finances.
 
2013-08-20 12:53:57 PM
BillO the Clown wouldn't last a week in the America that 'used to be'.

working sunup to sundown, and then some.  the best of America was the 60's/70's.  except vietnam and civil rights.  it was down hill from there.

and, starting in the mid 70's, according to the Congressional Budget Office, Real Wages and Worker productivity begin to diverge.  Real wages flattend out and worker productivity went thru the roof.

wonder where all that extra wealth went?

to our friends in the richest 2% of the Nation.

and THAT is much of the reason why this Nation is in the place its in today.

cheers!
 
2013-08-20 12:54:17 PM
Bill O'Reilly doesn't know poo about the real Alaska, and heaven help us if the rest of the US was like it, but hey....we're thankful, yes?  On to attention grabbing:

Oooh me, pick me!!  Me, me, me!!! Over here!

Ok, have the attention of the class now.  I have relatives in Alaska and none to be found more rednecky than my cousins.  Anyway, the first story my great-uncle told me when I moved up there was about a guy who dismembered his wife with a chainsaw while she was still alive (of course she died from her injuries) his defense was that it was due to cabin fever-which is a real mental condition and is super scary.  That and the whole moose keeping me from picking up the morning newspaper at 5AM, the earthquakes and the other guy who got mauled to death by a hungry bear on the Park Strip in downtown.  Best places to party are the Eskimo bars if you're in Anchorage if they take to you.

/spent most of a year drunk, stoned and working in a health food store in Anchorage AK, LOL
//don't ever mess with the bush pilots, those folks be way crazy
///in the winter, you do one of three things, drink beer, smoke pot or play hockey, hopefully not all 3 at once, the results are usually lost teeth
////cops in AK get high too, BTW

Back in Colorado now and that's wild enough for me, although I miss AK and always will
 
2013-08-20 12:54:24 PM

The Lone Gunman: mediablitz: The America where everyone gets yearly checks from oil companies?

Bill O'Reilly loves socialism!!!

Is there a term for corporatized socialism?


Yep. It's called fascism. There's a lot more to fascism than that, of course, but that's how they handled their economy.
 
2013-08-20 12:54:50 PM
Was in Alaska last week actually, if you like the outdoors it is the spot.  Spend a 4 days backpacking Denali, and drove down the Kenai Peninsula.  The gas stations between Denali and Anchorage have this gas station of the apocalypse thing going on.
fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net
 
2013-08-20 12:54:54 PM
Does he mean "Mostly natives and a few crazy whites"?
 
2013-08-20 12:57:40 PM

Ghastly: Does he mean "Mostly natives and a few crazy whites"?


Alaska has a mostly white population
 
2013-08-20 12:59:58 PM

mbillips: I still wanna know how the state of Alaska gets the money off of a national resource like oil. Where's my damn check?

/Would prefer they invest my check to stabilize entitlement finances.


It comes from state royalties.  The Mine Acts as currently codified does not require federal royalties, though there are other permits/fees associated with mines that operate on public lands.  There have been some attempts to change this, but nothing has passed yet.
 
2013-08-20 01:06:18 PM
Alaska is a defensive, military outpost and a resource reserve. Nothing more.
 
2013-08-20 01:09:54 PM

Churchill2004: Corvus:

You mean the old America that was socialist?

Not related to the oil fund, but what the hell's up with her glasses in that pic? They're not symmetrical- one side is half-framed, the other full-framed. I've never seen glasses like that, and I've bought a new pair of glasses every year or two since I was in 1st grade. They look like someone smacked her upside the head and broke them.


OK, you wear glasses, go do an experiment: go look at yourself in a mirror.

I don't want to use the wrong technical term here, but check out how the shape of your face is distorted by the lens. The line from your forehead to jaw will look like it has a dent in it. The stronger your prescription, the more distortion there will be.

Now, look at every picture of Palin. There's never any of that- no break in the line. Her glasses aren't serving any purpose- they're strictly for show. They're a prop.
 
2013-08-20 01:11:05 PM

Sybarite: Alaska! Where you can't be too fat or too drunk. Where no one says things like "Let's see your high school equivalency certificate."


I did not see a lot of fat people up there, except the tourists, only stayed 2 weeks though around Anchorage
 
2013-08-20 01:12:07 PM
It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.

I love you, PocketNinja.  If you want to vacay to Alaska, I can recommend accommodations in Juneau, Fairbanks and Anchorage.  I'd like to think that my redneck cousins would put you and your family up for a few nights.  Watch out for the mooses, the bears and the horrid creeping things that are foxes, tho.  Go in the summer, not the winter.  Don't forget your bag of rice and knife :)
 
2013-08-20 01:17:01 PM
Since I was in Alaska the same week as Billo, I'll pass along my impressions of the place (the people and culture, not the scenery, which of course is magnificent), which don't necessarily align with Bill's:

--About half the population of the state lives in Anchorage, but it's still not a very large city, maybe around 300K people (spread out over a very large geographical area of city limits).  The people in Anchorage fancy the place to be something of a cosmoplitan urban area similar to, I dunno, Seattle.  It's not.  It reminds me more of a larger version of Eureka, California--a working seaport area that, while not large, is still by far the largest city for many, many miles in any direction (in the case of Anchorage, a couple thousand miles).  While the area it's in is scenic (like virtually all of Alaska), the town itself (i.e., the buildings and architecture) isn't particularly scenic.  But it does have lots of good places to eat, good places to stay, and the everyday commercial enterprises that are in any decent-sized town in the lower 48 but that generally don't exist elsewhere in Alaska outside of Anchorage (Costco, etc.).  It's home to the only freeway in the entire state of Alaska (about 25 miles worth), so it's definitely more urban and "crowded" than the rest of the state, though to an outside it still seems like a small town.

--Even though, as mentioned above, Anchorage is hardly a crowded metropolis, many of the Alaskan people outside of Anchorage talk shiat about it as if it is the worst, most crowded and oppressive kind of urban hellscape.  It's the same sort of comments one hears in rural California about how "They're tryin' to turn this place into L.A.!" except in Alaska you hear them say "If we did that, we would be just like Anchorage!"  In their minds, Anchorage and L.A. are basically the same kind of place--some of the locals even sarcastically refer to Anchorage as "Los Anchorage," as seen on this defaced road sign I snapped a pic of:

www.majhost.com

Of course, as much as they profess to dislike what Anchorage represents, those close enough to go there do so regularly.  To go to Costco, for example.  People in Alaska sure seem to like Costco and worship the place like a religion, even more than people in the lower 48.  And you can kinda understand why, of course--when the nearest town's only general store sells no "fresh" meat other than a couple of frozen sirloin steaks (purchased from Costco on the store owner's most recent trip to Anchorage, most likely) stored in a residential style Kenmore freezer in the back of the store for $15 a pound, the fresh fruit and vegetable selection consists of one head of cabbage and two dried-up onions, and rest of the food selection consists of a few cans of Del Monte green beans, a few loaves of Wonder bread, a few bags of Fritos, and a couple of dozen similar products, going to Costco has got to seem like a trip through the Garden of Eden.

--The vast majority of people who live in Alaska were born elsewhere and moved there later--sometimes as kids along with their parents, but most often as adults.  For some reason it seemed that half the people I met who lived there had moved there from either Minnesota or Pennsylvania, along with a number of other places.  Some of them may leave in the winter and work/live in places such as Washington or Oregon for the season, but they all seem fiercely devoted to Alaska and swear they would never move anywhere else.  I can understand this.  Many of these people came for a visit years ago and fell in love with the place and never left.  I can also understand this--I didn't really want to leave either!

--There are plenty of rednecks in Alaska (as the existence of the Palin clan proves), but there is also a decent representation of groovy hippie leftist types.  The former outnumbers the latter, of course, and the former is more likely to vote, resulting in Alaska being a very red state politically.  Both groups, however, share a certain amount of common ground--they both tend to be of a certain libertarian bent, they both like the outdoors (and many of the same outdoor activities, including hunting and fishing), both like the fact that they can avoid sales and income taxes in Alaska by taxing oil production, and they both complain about being ripped off on health care expenses.  One thing that seems very different about much of the rest of America is that both groups generally seem to like and appreciate each other, and are respectful of either other's views while disagreeing with them.  They drink in the same bars (because there may be only one bar in town), their kids go to the same schools (because there may be only one school in the area), they work in the same industries or even at the same places, and they see each other all the time and know about how the other half actually lives and what they do.  So it's harder, I think, to rely on stereotypes and false narratives about the other side, because they know first-hand that some of those stereotypes and narratives don't actually apply to the people they personally know quite well.  So they may discuss politics in the local bar and jokingly dismiss the other's views with an "of course you would say that, because that's how you Palin-lovin' rednecks think" or "well, yeah, I figured an Obama-lovin' hippie like you would think that," and then buy the next round and talk about going moose hunting next month.  In that respect, Billo is right, it's more like "America used to be," before he and others on Fox and similar sources poisoned the well by vitriolically demonizing those who don't think they way they do.
 
2013-08-20 01:17:46 PM

vernonFL: "This is America the way it used to be"

No wifi and addicted to meth.


Yeah, isn't Alaska basically a cold Nevada? White trailer trash, no education, fascinating Native American culture, beautiful landscape, tons of meth?
 
2013-08-20 01:23:43 PM
Cyberluddite:

You seem to really dislike the place. Why did you visit a sparsely populated area full of rural folks and vast wilderness if you don't like sparsely populated areas full of rural folks and vast wilderness?
 
2013-08-20 01:23:47 PM

mbillips: The Lone Gunman: mediablitz: The America where everyone gets yearly checks from oil companies?

Bill O'Reilly loves socialism!!!

Is there a term for corporatized socialism?

Yep. It's called fascism. There's a lot more to fascism than that, of course, but that's how they handled their economy.


See also: Republican domestic policy.
 
2013-08-20 01:24:21 PM
"This is America the way it used to be"

And here I thought it IS still America. You can't explain that.
 
2013-08-20 01:28:04 PM

Frank N Stein: Cyberluddite:

You seem to really dislike the place. Why did you visit a sparsely populated area full of rural folks and vast wilderness if you don't like sparsely populated areas full of rural folks and vast wilderness?


If you think I "really disliked the place" from what I wrote, you need to read it again and/or work on reading comprehension.  Quite the contrary.  I really, really, really enjoyed it.  A lot.
 
2013-08-20 01:29:09 PM

Cyberluddite: Frank N Stein: Cyberluddite:

You seem to really dislike the place. Why did you visit a sparsely populated area full of rural folks and vast wilderness if you don't like sparsely populated areas full of rural folks and vast wilderness?

If you think I "really disliked the place" from what I wrote, you need to read it again and/or work on reading comprehension.  Quite the contrary.  I really, really, really enjoyed it.  A lot.


Ah ok. I was mistaken and read it on the run. Nevermind
 
2013-08-20 01:31:22 PM

Frank N Stein: Cyberluddite:

You seem to really dislike the place. Why did you visit a sparsely populated area full of rural folks and vast wilderness if you don't like sparsely populated areas full of rural folks and vast wilderness?


I didn't get that out of his post at all.  It sounded like he enjoyed the trip to me.

In Alaska right now, where I have been for the last 26 years working both urban and rural settings.  His observations were both well thought out and right on the money.
 
2013-08-20 01:37:51 PM

Barael's Blade: meth



the South and midwest
 
2013-08-20 01:44:27 PM

Cyberluddite: If you think I "really disliked the place" from what I wrote, you need to read it again and/or work on reading comprehension. Quite the contrary. I really, really, really enjoyed it. A lot.


Yeah, you seem to convey that you enjoyed the trip.  The rural area I grew up in down here in the states is a bit like that as well.
 
2013-08-20 01:45:47 PM

Corvus: HeadLever: Lionel Mandrake: There's always an excuse for red-state welfare.

You could always give it to the states if you don't want to pay for its management......

The do. much of it are for programs at are administered at the state level.



Not sure how much has changed in the past ten years, but here is a breakdown of what Fed money in Alaska was for in 2003.
http://www.iser.uaa.alaska.edu/Publications/FedSpendSum.pdf

Page 2 has a nice pie chart, but page 3 gives a more meaningful breakdown for purposes of this discussion.
If you do the math, about 38% goes to federal wages and purchases. The other 62% goes to SSI, local aid, or block grants.
So that's 62% "red-state welfare".
 
2013-08-20 01:49:47 PM
Bill-O

i280.photobucket.com
 
2013-08-20 01:52:24 PM
Alaska isn't what America used to be. It's a microscope for what America currently is.

You have massive corporations buying the government and rewriting the tax code, with angry fundamentalist Christians supporting everything they do, as long as they can keep hating minorities.

Then you have environmental extremists trying to shut down all resource gathering, from mining to oil to hunting and fishing.

And in between, you have a lot of working-class people, rural and urban, just trying to keep their jobs and scratching their heads trying to make sense of the silly politicians.

The difference between Alaska and the America as a whole is that in Alaska, you know the names and faces of all the players, instead of them being faceless entities manipulating others in the shadows.
 
2013-08-20 01:53:03 PM

Cubicle Jockey: The other 62% goes to SSI, local aid, or block grants.


With that too, you have to cosider the federal obligation to Native Americans that are outside the jurisdition and control of the state government.  It is not likely a huge chunk of that 62% as Native Americans are about 17% of the population.
 
2013-08-20 01:57:07 PM

Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.


You're beautiful.
 
2013-08-20 02:03:53 PM

Frank N Stein: Rocket To Russia: Frank N Stein: Rocket To Russia: Frank N Stein: Alaska is great. There's so much open space, beautiful terrain, and amazing wildlife that one can easily spend a day away from another human and explore. Its not hard to find an empty stream to fish, or lazily kayak a bay to observe whales and seals, or spent a day hiking up a mountain.

Sounds like a liberal environmentalist's paradise!

Yeah, could be. Also enjoyed by conservative conservationists or just people who enjoy nature.

Whatever happened to the concept of a 'conservative conservationist', anyway? Even though it seems obvious and logical, these days the phrase sounds like an oxymoron.

They're still out there. Although no-one really uses the term "conservative conservationist". It's a clumsy phrase that I used just to counter your "liberal environmentalist" term. However there are plenty of conservatives that identify as conservationist. Organizations such as Ducks Unlimited, which does great work in protecting wetlands, are I'm guessing full of political conservatives.


Ducks Unlimited was the first thing I thought of too, but I asked the question anyway to see what answer I'd get. I miss real conservatives, as opposed to most of the people calling themselves conservatives now. Those people seem to be just anti-everything, and that includes environmentalism, for the sake of "pissin' off the libs".
 
2013-08-20 02:06:27 PM

DarwiOdrade: So, still no one saying  "M-Fer, I want more iced tea."


But we got "you can't explain that" covered, so there's that. You gotta move on with the times!
 
2013-08-20 02:08:35 PM

Gonz: Churchill2004: Corvus:

You mean the old America that was socialist?

Not related to the oil fund, but what the hell's up with her glasses in that pic? They're not symmetrical- one side is half-framed, the other full-framed. I've never seen glasses like that, and I've bought a new pair of glasses every year or two since I was in 1st grade. They look like someone smacked her upside the head and broke them.

OK, you wear glasses, go do an experiment: go look at yourself in a mirror.

I don't want to use the wrong technical term here, but check out how the shape of your face is distorted by the lens. The line from your forehead to jaw will look like it has a dent in it. The stronger your prescription, the more distortion there will be.

Now, look at every picture of Palin. There's never any of that- no break in the line. Her glasses aren't serving any purpose- they're strictly for show. They're a prop.


I've got some serious coke-bottles, and every single picture of me has that effect to the max, so I'm perfectly familiar with it. 

The lack of fishbowl effect (hell if I know the technical term) doesn't jump out at you, though. Plenty of people have relatively weak scrips so it's not very noticeable, particularly if it's just reading glasses. I wouldn't be surprised if hers are just cosmetic, but I don't think you can definitely tell that just from a pic. Most people's glasses seem like flat planes of glass compared to mine.

The half-half-frame jumped out at me because it's unbalanced. Like I said, it looks like someone gave her a good smackin' around and broke the things.
 
2013-08-20 02:08:44 PM

EyeballKid: Lost Thought 00: Unless he's vacationing in the interior, he's never actually seen what Alaska is like.

You think Palin used that pick-up line with McCain or Roger Ailes?


You funny bastard!
 
2013-08-20 02:15:39 PM
Butt farking cold or when you were 8 years old?
 
2013-08-20 02:17:39 PM

Rocket To Russia: Those people seem to be just anti-everything, and that includes environmentalism, for the sake of "pissin' off the libs".


The issue you run into here (rural west) is that the 'anti-everything' position has been co-opted the the radical envioronmentalis.  Many of the traditional conservatives recognize multiple-use as the best standard so long as you do things in the right way.  Most ranches and logging companies use sustainable practices and mining companies are typically held to a pretty high environmental standard.  This satisfies many of us since we get to make a living off the land, but we can still enjoy it to hunt, fish and recreate.  Sadly, there are those environmental groups that ignore this and still attempt to abolish all natural resource extraction.

Add to this the Antiquites Act habit of Clinton arbitrarily locking up chunks of land and New Yorkers proposing NREPA without any real input from the locals or Congress and you get some pretty grumpy rural folks.

For what it is worth, the pendulum has appeard to swing somewhat back toward the middle somewhat once Babbitt's reign ended, but the fight still is ongoing.
 
2013-08-20 02:21:11 PM

HeadLever: Rocket To Russia: Whatever happened to the concept of a 'conservative conservationist', anyway?

That may be because the liberals that make the talking points problably refuse to belive that they exist.  The town where I come from is mostly supported by mining and ranching and some logging where nearly everyone is conservative and loves to hunt, fish, ski, hike, camp, snomobile, dirtbike, hunt for shed antlers, birdwatch, pick wild chokecherries, rasberries, mushrooms, asparagus, horseradish and plums.  They don't want to see these lands become another California and will fight to keep public access open and these areas wild.


Conservatives should be conservationists! They share the same root word, fer cripes sake! What I don't get are the ones who call themselves conservatives just because they only do the opposite of what liberals do, and that includes environmentalism. That's not an ideology, that's a temper tantrum.
 
2013-08-20 02:21:40 PM
If Bill O'Reilly says nothing, is he still wrong?
 
2013-08-20 02:22:38 PM

Frank N Stein: Alaska is great. There's so much open space, beautiful terrain, and amazing wildlife that one can easily spend a day away from another human and explore. Its not hard to find an empty stream to fish, or lazily kayak a bay to observe whales and seals, or spent a day hiking up a mountain. I miss it every once in a while when I'm dealing with annoying panhandlers, busy crowds of assholes, and the overarching smell of urine here in Chicago.


it doesnt smell like pee in my Chicago office.  Maybe you should change your Depends.
 
2013-08-20 02:24:26 PM

Mr. Shabooboo: Bill likes his wilderness like he likes his cities

Uneducated
Racist
Sexist
Homophobic
Antisemitic
People in constant fear of their own shadow
Trigger happy

 Just like the good lawrd intended..


URSHPT?
 
2013-08-20 02:30:48 PM

Rocket To Russia: Conservatives should be conservationists! They share the same root word, fer cripes sake! What I don't get are the ones who call themselves conservatives just because they only do the opposite of what liberals do, and that includes environmentalism. That's not an ideology, that's a temper tantrum.


Conserve does not always align with environmentalism.  Especially when considering the anti-everything faction of environmentailism.
 
2013-08-20 02:37:24 PM

Cyberluddite: People in Alaska sure seem to likelove Costco and worship the place like a religion, even more than people in the lower 48

everywhere and so should you.

FTFY.
 
2013-08-20 02:43:18 PM

Kirzania: Cyberluddite: People in Alaska sure seem to likelove Costco and worship the place like a religion, even more than people in the lower 48everywhere and so should you.

FTFY.


I do.  In fact, I got my law degree there!
 
2013-08-20 02:49:33 PM

ginkor: A few travelogue tips on visiting Alaska.

1)  Anchorage is entirely civilized, clean and pretty.  There are Victorian and modern bed and breakfasts near the center of the city, as well as fine hotels, but you have to book far ahead of time.  Lots of green everything and the city has a flower theme in summer.  Golden and bald eagles instead of pigeons.

2)  The first two weeks of July are the best time to visit, because temperatures in Anchorage are in the high 60's to low 70's, by then the mosquitoes are gone, and there is about 20 hours of sunlight a day, so you never want to sleep and want to walk everywhere.

3)  The state railroad is classic 1940s style, comfortable with lots of leg room, which is a great way to travel to Seward, because it is insanely beautiful.  Seward is gorgeous, but has a more classical Alaskan look, and is where you can catch a 100-ton boat to see the Denali National Park.

4)  As peaceful and calm as the land is, the water is right at the border of fisherman's heaven and hell.  It is full of giant fish, but can turn from smooth as glass to 8-10' swells in minutes.  There are warnings everywhere that the glacial silt beaches are deadly, and they are not kidding.

5)  In the countryside, there are critters everywhere, including bear, moose, reindeer, wolves, you name it.  There are also little creeks everywhere, and many people commute with light aircraft.

6)  Oddly enough, the prices there are pretty comparable for most things, though there are no convenience stores and few fast food restaurants.  Direct flights to many US cities.


You obviously only saw the very tourist friendly and sanitized parts of Alaska. Your number 6 post was the biggest giveaway.
Hey! Wait a minute...is that you,Bill?

/I prefer the bush, it's pretty rough and mad max-ish though....not too postcard worthy.
 
2013-08-20 02:53:20 PM

Nuclear Monk: Can't explain this either:


The massive Cook inlet or Bristol bay tides would probably give him an aneurism.
He should visit!
 
2013-08-20 03:19:04 PM

Cyberluddite: Since I was in Alaska the same week as Billo, I'll pass along my impressions of the place (the people and culture, not the scenery, which of course is magnificent), which don't necessarily align with Bill's:

--About half the population of the state lives in Anchorage, but it's still not a very large city, maybe around 300K people (spread out over a very large geographical area of city limits).  The people in Anchorage fancy the place to be something of a cosmoplitan urban area similar to, I dunno, Seattle.  It's not.  It reminds me more of a larger version of Eureka, California--a working seaport area that, while not large, is still by far the largest city for many, many miles in any direction (in the case of Anchorage, a couple thousand miles).  While the area it's in is scenic (like virtually all of Alaska), the town itself (i.e., the buildings and architecture) isn't particularly scenic.  But it does have lots of good places to eat, good places to stay, and the everyday commercial enterprises that are in any decent-sized town in the lower 48 but that generally don't exist elsewhere in Alaska outside of Anchorage (Costco, etc.).  It's home to the only freeway in the entire state of Alaska (about 25 miles worth), so it's definitely more urban and "crowded" than the rest of the state, though to an outside it still seems like a small town.

--Even though, as mentioned above, Anchorage is hardly a crowded metropolis, many of the Alaskan people outside of Anchorage talk shiat about it as if it is the worst, most crowded and oppressive kind of urban hellscape.  It's the same sort of comments one hears in rural California about how "They're tryin' to turn this place into L.A.!" except in Alaska you hear them say "If we did that, we would be just like Anchorage!"  In their minds, Anchorage and L.A. are basically the same kind of place--some of the locals even sarcastically refer to Anchorage as "Los Anchorage," as seen on this defaced road sign I snapped a pic of:



Of course, as much as they profess to dislike what Anchorage represents, those close enough to go there do so regularly.  To go to Costco, for example.  People in Alaska sure seem to like Costco and worship the place like a religion, even more than people in the lower 48.  And you can kinda understand why, of course--when the nearest town's only general store sells no "fresh" meat other than a couple of frozen sirloin steaks (purchased from Costco on the store owner's most recent trip to Anchorage, most likely) stored in a residential style Kenmore freezer in the back of the store for $15 a pound, the fresh fruit and vegetable selection consists of one head of cabbage and two dried-up onions, and rest of the food selection consists of a few cans of Del Monte green beans, a few loaves of Wonder bread, a few bags of Fritos, and a couple of dozen similar products, going to Costco has got to seem like a trip through the Garden of Eden.

--The vast majority of people who live in Alaska were born elsewhere and moved there later--sometimes as kids along with their parents, but most often as adults.  For some reason it seemed that half the people I met who lived there had moved there from either Minnesota or Pennsylvania, along with a number of other places.  Some of them may leave in the winter and work/live in places such as Washington or Oregon for the season, but they all seem fiercely devoted to Alaska and swear they would never move anywhere else.  I can understand this.  Many of these people came for a visit years ago and fell in love with the place and never left.  I can also understand this--I didn't really want to leave either!

--There are plenty of rednecks in Alaska (as the existence of the Palin clan proves), but there is also a decent representation of groovy hippie leftist types.  The former outnumbers the latter, of course, and the former is more likely to vote, resulting in Alaska being a very red state politically.  Both groups, however, share a certain amount of common ground--they both tend to be of a certain libertarian bent, they both like the outdoors (and many of the same outdoor activities, including hunting and fishing), both like the fact that they can avoid sales and income taxes in Alaska by taxing oil production, and they both complain about being ripped off on health care expenses.  One thing that seems very different about much of the rest of America is that both groups generally seem to like and appreciate each other, and are respectful of either other's views while disagreeing with them.  They drink in the same bars (because there may be only one bar in town), their kids go to the same schools (because there may be only one school in the area), they work in the same industries or even at the same places, and they see each other all the time and know about how the other half actually lives and what they do.  So it's harder, I think, to rely on stereotypes and false narratives about the other side, because they know first-hand that some of those stereotypes and narratives don't actually apply to the people they personally know quite well.  So they may discuss politics in the local bar and jokingly dismiss the other's views with an "of course you would say that, because that's how you Palin-lovin' rednecks think" or "well, yeah, I figured an Obama-lovin' hippie like you would think that," and then buy the next round and talk about going moose hunting next month.  In that respect, Billo is right, it's more like "America used to be," before he and others on Fox and similar sources poisoned the well by vitriolically demonizing those who don't think they way they do.


You nailed it. It sounds like you got off the beaten path and got a true sense of what makes that place so great.
 
2013-08-20 03:22:20 PM
About the government welfare argument, the federal government has locked up so much of the Alaskan lands and resources that the population is basically unable to develop, profit from, or even expand very far into land that should, rightfully, belong to the state per agreements made when the territory became a state.  If the federal government is going to stifle development on purpose and treat a state like a 3rd world territory then the government had better compensate the population for it.

Secondly, I'm told that the dividend isn't socialist, but royalty checks paid from oil companies that are wrecking the state by pumping out all of the oil and then selling it back to the residents at wildly inflated prices.  What could be more American than allowing someone the pleasure of paying you to rape your land?  When I argue that the idea of the residents owning and profiting from the land collectively sounds a little...red, I'm told I don't understand the issue.

Thirdly, as a resident of interior Alaska...it sucks.  Never move here.  You may hear stories about how beautiful it is or you may crave an Alaskan adventure, but just don't.  Nothing looks as good as a professional photographer and imaging software can make it.  Let your dreams stay in your head.  However, if you MUST come, don't wait until you're 80.  An unreasonable number of old people come up here because it's on their bucket list and they die in camp grounds, hotels, and RVs.  It can be an expensive problem to solve.

Winter, mud, fire, fall, winter.  The Alaskan seasons.
 
2013-08-20 03:23:48 PM

Frank N Stein: Cyberluddite:

You seem to really dislike the place. Why did you visit a sparsely populated area full of rural folks and vast wilderness if you don't like sparsely populated areas full of rural folks and vast wilderness?


Did you read the same trip summary I did?
His last paragraph summed up the parts of Alaska I know beautifully.
 
2013-08-20 03:29:55 PM

ficklefkrfark: ginkor: A few travelogue tips on visiting Alaska.

1)  Anchorage is entirely civilized, clean and pretty.  There are Victorian and modern bed and breakfasts near the center of the city, as well as fine hotels, but you have to book far ahead of time.  Lots of green everything and the city has a flower theme in summer.  Golden and bald eagles instead of pigeons.

2)  The first two weeks of July are the best time to visit, because temperatures in Anchorage are in the high 60's to low 70's, by then the mosquitoes are gone, and there is about 20 hours of sunlight a day, so you never want to sleep and want to walk everywhere.

3)  The state railroad is classic 1940s style, comfortable with lots of leg room, which is a great way to travel to Seward, because it is insanely beautiful.  Seward is gorgeous, but has a more classical Alaskan look, and is where you can catch a 100-ton boat to see the Denali National Park.

4)  As peaceful and calm as the land is, the water is right at the border of fisherman's heaven and hell.  It is full of giant fish, but can turn from smooth as glass to 8-10' swells in minutes.  There are warnings everywhere that the glacial silt beaches are deadly, and they are not kidding.

5)  In the countryside, there are critters everywhere, including bear, moose, reindeer, wolves, you name it.  There are also little creeks everywhere, and many people commute with light aircraft.

6)  Oddly enough, the prices there are pretty comparable for most things, though there are no convenience stores and few fast food restaurants.  Direct flights to many US cities.

You obviously only saw the very tourist friendly and sanitized parts of Alaska. Your number 6 post was the biggest giveaway.
Hey! Wait a minute...is that you,Bill?

/I prefer the bush, it's pretty rough and mad max-ish though....not too postcard worthy.


Yeah, that's like me making statements about all of New York City based on my stay in Manhattan during New Years once.
 
2013-08-20 03:36:24 PM

heavymetal: Yeah, that's like me making statements about all of New York City based on my stay in Manhattan during New Years once.


Except there is tons of shiat to see in NYC.   Once you have seen a tree, a bear, a fish, a meth addict, and a drunk eskimo you can pretty much describe anywhere in that shiathole of a state with a pretty precise degree of accuracy. 

The only good thing about Alaska is some little shiathole cabin masquerading as a hotel in ninilchik (iirc) with a big sign that says "Enjoy nice modern hotel" - that made me laugh a bit before I went back to looking for ways to kill myself so as not to spend any more time in Alaska.
 
2013-08-20 04:00:35 PM

lilplatinum: The only good thing about Alaska is some little shiathole cabin masquerading as a hotel in ninilchik (iirc) with a big sign that says "Enjoy nice modern hotel" - that made me laugh a bit before I went back to looking for ways to kill myself so as not to spend any more time in Alaska.


Sounds like you need to select your places better.  In one of the places we stayed in Alaska (a B&B), we had probably the nicest room I've ever stayed in anywhere, at any price.  The room was about 700 square feet, with a bathroom bigger than most people in Manhattan's entire apartment, including a full-size round (about 7 or 8 feet in diameter) jacuzzi tub, shower with two shower heads, and full-size in-room sauna.  Not that I wanted to watch TV while I was there, but for those who do, the room had about a 50" LED flat-screen with a huge number of premium sattelite channels, along with a blu-ray player, and libary of movies to choose from downstairs. Of course, there was high-speed wi-fi access in the room, as you would expect.  All of this for around $200 a night--less than half the price I typically pay for a small, ordinary room in a decent hotel in Manhattan.

Or maybe I just dreamed all of that, because you stayed in a shiathole dump in East Moosefart Village, AK, and everything else in the entire state is obviously the same as that, right?
 
2013-08-20 04:12:42 PM

lilplatinum: heavymetal: Yeah, that's like me making statements about all of New York City based on my stay in Manhattan during New Years once.

Except there is tons of shiat to see in NYC.   Once you have seen a tree, a bear, a fish, a meth addict, and a drunk eskimo you can pretty much describe anywhere in that shiathole of a state with a pretty precise degree of accuracy.

The only good thing about Alaska is some little shiathole cabin masquerading as a hotel in ninilchik (iirc) with a big sign that says "Enjoy nice modern hotel" - that made me laugh a bit before I went back to looking for ways to kill myself so as not to spend any more time in Alaska.


I agree with you 100%  I mean, just look at this picture I took off the back deck of the hunting cabin last weekend.

img694.imageshack.us

Horrific.  Stay far, far away from Alaska if you possibly can.
 
2013-08-20 04:19:35 PM
We used to get PFD checks? DAMN IT what happened?!
 
2013-08-20 04:24:22 PM

Cyberluddite: Sounds like you need to select your places better.  In one of the places we stayed in Alaska (a B&B), we had probably the nicest room I've ever stayed in anywhere, at any price.  The room was about 700 square feet, with a bathroom bigger than most people in Manhattan's entire apartment, including a full-size round (about 7 or 8 feet in diameter) jacuzzi tub, shower with two shower heads, and full-size in-room sauna.  Not that I wanted to watch TV while I was there, but for those who do, the room had about a 50" LED flat-screen with a huge number of premium sattelite channels, along with a blu-ray player, and libary of movies to choose from downstairs. Of course, there was high-speed wi-fi access in the room, as you would expect.  All of this for around $200 a night--less than half the price I typically pay for a small, ordinary room in a decent hotel in Manhattan.

Or maybe I just dreamed all of that, because you stayed in a shiathole dump in East Moosefart Village, AK, and everything else in the entire state is obviously the same as that, right?


I lived there for a year and went up to fish at my Aunt's fish site twice for summer during colleges (the things we subject ourselves to Money).   I've been to every excuse for a 'large' settlement there as well as crisscrossed through a good portion of nature. 

Try living there in Winter and see how awesome it is when you get off of the tour guide track.
 
2013-08-20 04:24:59 PM

Skyd1v: I agree with you 100%  I mean, just look at this picture I took off the back deck of the hunting cabin last weekend.


Wow, trees AND water?   AND you get to stalk animals with firearms?  Wow, that sure sounds swell!
 
2013-08-20 04:26:18 PM

leonel: We used to get PFD checks? DAMN IT what happened?!


Adobe licensing fees and compatibility issues killed the profit margin.
 
2013-08-20 04:27:06 PM

Cyberluddite: All of this for around $200 a night--less than half the price I typically pay for a small, ordinary room in a decent hotel in Manhattan.


Also, if you typically pay over $400 for small ordinary rooms in Manhattan you really need to learn to shop around (or you do it on the company guide and don't give a shiat - in which case I don't blame you for being lazy).
 
2013-08-20 04:28:53 PM

lilplatinum: Skyd1v: I agree with you 100%  I mean, just look at this picture I took off the back deck of the hunting cabin last weekend.

Wow, trees AND water?   AND you get to stalk animals with firearms?  Wow, that sure sounds swell!


Trees, water, meat on the hoof, and nobody with attitudes like yours as far as the eye can see.
 
2013-08-20 04:32:27 PM

Skyd1v: lilplatinum: Skyd1v: I agree with you 100%  I mean, just look at this picture I took off the back deck of the hunting cabin last weekend.

Wow, trees AND water?   AND you get to stalk animals with firearms?  Wow, that sure sounds swell!

Trees, water, meat on the hoof, and nobody with attitudes like yours as far as the eye can see.


Works out both ways, people who think stalking and killing things is a good form of entertainment should probably be exiled to our version of siberia anyways.  

/more power to you shooting them anyway, Moose are farking pests.  Always fun when you are late for school and one decides it isn't going to move from your driveway.
 
2013-08-20 04:34:06 PM

lilplatinum: Skyd1v: lilplatinum: Skyd1v: I agree with you 100%  I mean, just look at this picture I took off the back deck of the hunting cabin last weekend.

Wow, trees AND water?   AND you get to stalk animals with firearms?  Wow, that sure sounds swell!

Trees, water, meat on the hoof, and nobody with attitudes like yours as far as the eye can see.

Works out both ways, people who think stalking and killing things is a good form of entertainment should probably be exiled to our version of siberia anyways.

/more power to you shooting them anyway, Moose are farking pests.  Always fun when you are late for school and one decides it isn't going to move from your driveway.


Seems to me there isn't much you WON'T complain about, is there?

img21.imageshack.us
 
2013-08-20 04:35:05 PM

Skyd1v: Seems to me there isn't much you WON'T complain about, is there?


Especially people who go out of the time to post screenshots to show exactly how much displeasure they have at someones opinions.   Those guys are the worst!
 
2013-08-20 04:35:40 PM
Go out of the time?   My english are very good!
 
2013-08-20 04:50:51 PM
i42.tinypic.com
 
2013-08-20 05:20:21 PM

DarwiOdrade: So, still no one saying  "M-Fer, I want more iced tea."


Came here just for that.  Bill O'Reilly, Sociologist.
 
2013-08-20 06:11:51 PM

lilplatinum: Cyberluddite: All of this for around $200 a night--less than half the price I typically pay for a small, ordinary room in a decent hotel in Manhattan.

Also, if you typically pay over $400 for small ordinary rooms in Manhattan you really need to learn to shop around (or you do it on the company guide and don't give a shiat - in which case I don't blame you for being lazy).


Yes, I mostly travel to NYC on business so I'm not concerned about the rate, but at modern, decent-but-not-super-plush hotels (Hyatt, Hilton, Westin sorts of places) the rate for a standard room is generally in the $350-$450 range, for the "guaranteed lowest rate" booked on their websites.  Fancier, more high-end places are even more.  If you actually know of midtown Manhattan hotels in that class that charge less, I'd love to hear about it.
 
2013-08-20 06:23:46 PM

Cyberluddite: Yes, I mostly travel to NYC on business so I'm not concerned about the rate, but at modern, decent-but-not-super-plush hotels (Hyatt, Hilton, Westin sorts of places) the rate for a standard room is generally in the $350-$450 range, for the "guaranteed lowest rate" booked on their websites.  Fancier, more high-end places are even more.  If you actually know of midtown Manhattan hotels in that class that charge less, I'd love to hear about it.


Most of my friends when visiting have been able to book good deals somewhere or another on expedia/priceline in the 200s (or in low-mid 100s if they are willing to stay at a holiday inn express - a room is a room after all).  But yeah, Midtowns always a bit more of a ripoff and I'm sure its seasonal.   Expedia right now has the Sheraton in times square for 215 and NY Hilton midtown for 270 for booking something on a weekend a couple days in the future.

If its your money and you are ever here I highly suggest never going through the hotel websites.    As I said though, if work is paying then just pick whatever is closest to where you have to be.
 
2013-08-20 07:00:26 PM
"America... The way it USED to be!"
 
2013-08-20 07:01:22 PM
They didn't allow my photo of a lynching... It might cause people to question their sentiment.
 
2013-08-20 07:08:15 PM
lilplatinum:   Expedia right now has the Sheraton in times square for 215 and NY Hilton midtown for 270 for booking something on a weekend a couple days in the future.

As I said, I generally travel there on business, which means midweek travel.  I realize weekend rates are significantly lower, but that's irrelevant to me because like other business travelers, I'm generally there midweek, not on weekends.  Which, of course, is precisely why weekend rates are so much lower.

Also, it's seemed to me that rates have increased rather dramatically within the two years or so.  I used to have few problems finding something in the $200-$275 range midweek, but in the last year or so that seems to have become a thing of the past.
 
2013-08-20 07:12:48 PM

Cyberluddite: I realize weekend rates are significantly lower, but that's irrelevant to me because like other business travelers, I'm generally there midweek, not on weekends.  Which, of course, is precisely why weekend rates are so much lower.


Wow weekend rates are actually cheaper in Manhattan, that is the opposite of pretty much everywhere else i've ever been (even business destinations like London IIRC)..    Goes to show how often I go to midtown  :)
 
2013-08-20 07:53:58 PM

lilplatinum: Wow weekend rates are actually cheaper in Manhattan, that is the opposite of pretty much everywhere else i've ever been (even business destinations like London IIRC)..    Goes to show how often I go to midtown  :)


It's true in the "business district" part of most big cities, even if the opposite is usually true outside the business district.  Using your example of London, midweek rates tend to be lower than weekend rates in the more touristy parts of town, but in the "City of London" (i.e, the central financial district, around the Tower Hill and Aldgate tube stations), it's precisely the opposite.  For example, I just checked the best available rates for the first week in October at the place I usually stay in the City of London when I travel there on business, and the weekend rate is £135/night, while the midweek rate is £245/night for the same room.  Unfortunately, pretty much all of Manhattan--or all of midtown anyway--is really considered the "business district," so you won't find deals there mid-week.

Though for places other than Manhattan, this phenomenon can be used to one's advantage if one is traveling for pleasure, rather than business, on weekends--in most big cities, you can save a lot of money buy staying right downtown in the central "business district" on weekends, rather than in the places closest to the weekend tourist areas.  Even in a place like, for example, Los Angeles, if you choose to stay right downtown rather than in Westwood or Santa Monica or Hollywood or West L.A. or some other area where all the tourists flock, you might find a special weekend rate of for $99 on Saturday night in a downtown 4-star luxury hotel that might cost you $400 for the same room on Wednesday night.  Sure, downtown L.A. is kind of a ghost town on weekends, but you get to stay in a really nice place for next to nothing, and just drive to wherever you want to go (any everyone drives everywhere in L.A. anyway).  It beats spending twice as much to stay in some crappy Best Western in Westwood or some other similar nearby location that's deemed to be more "happening" on weekends.
 
2013-08-20 08:08:27 PM

Cyberluddite: Unfortunately, pretty much all of Manhattan--or all of midtown anyway--is really considered the "business district," so you won't find deals there mid-week.


Yeah I never really noticed since I always book my folks at botiques or something here in Brooklyn when they visit and its generally cheaper.  Fortunately really everything is fairly accessible in the city as opposed to a lot of places where you have to worry about driving.
 
2013-08-20 08:58:07 PM

Frank N Stein: Ghastly: Does he mean "Mostly natives and a few crazy whites"?

Alaska has a mostly white population


Northern Exposure has LIED to me!
 
2013-08-20 10:32:37 PM

r1niceboy: Pocket Ninja: It's absolutely true. Everyone in Alaska is content to be snowed in for months at a time with no modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, or the Internet. They live off the fat of the land, hunting moose with black powder rifles and ice fishing. They bury their meat in the ground and smoke it that way. They go on long walks into the wilderness with only bags of rice and a knife to survive, and some of them never come back, and they simply nod at that and explain that "this is Alaska." They share their wives with strangers and when someone grows too ill to survive another winter, he does not complain or whimper about "universal health care;" no, he merely finds an ice floe and sits down upon it and faces west so that he can witness one last sunset, one last beacon of God's creation, before allowing himself to slip silently beneath the waves. Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own. They are like Canadians, in some ways, except of course Alaskans cherish freedom and liberty above all things, even life, while Canadians do not. For it is true that long ago God crafted a mold from which he fashioned the earliest pioneers, those rugged individuals who wrenched America from the vast and empty wilderness. When the job was done, God cast that mold aside, into a land where only the strongest and most able could survive. That land was Alaska, and the mold lies there still.

You, sir, are welcome to my wife. She has all her teeth and can cook a mean fish.


blog.commarts.wisc.edu
What a mean fish may look like.
 
2013-08-20 10:39:02 PM

Mr. Shabooboo: Frank N Stein: Mr. Shabooboo: Bill likes his wilderness like he likes his cities

Uneducated
Racist
Sexist
Homophobic
Antisemitic
People in constant fear of their own shadow
Trigger happy

 Just like the good lawrd intended..

How can "wilderness" be any of this things?

Never turn your back on a Larch...Never...


i.chzbgr.com
 
2013-08-20 10:53:42 PM
America like it used to be: getting a check from the government every year.
 
2013-08-21 01:39:27 AM
O'Rly: "This is the way America used to be."

A vast arctic region, covered with ice?

i.ytimg.com
 
2013-08-21 03:18:06 AM
As long as he does not do a live feed from that damned bus outside of Healy, we're cool.  Bring on the money from his followers.  They really can't fark up our politics anymore than they already are.

Political fleecing is nothing new.  The TEA party literally sent a delegation up by cruise ship last election cycle. Hardship pay for the staffers, I'm sure.
 
2013-08-21 12:38:50 PM

vudukungfu: Pocket Ninja: Capitalism for an Alaskan consists of bartering bits of bone, wild nuts, and salmon for what necessities he cannot make on his own.

When I was a kid, you  could buy a woman for a packet of sewing needles up there.


As we call them up here in Alaska: "Tundra Wookies"

/Shudder
 
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