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(Yahoo)   Indian submarine catches fire and sinks. Should have closed the screen doors   (news.yahoo.com) divider line 91
    More: Strange, Indians, nuclear submarines, NDTV  
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4564 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Aug 2013 at 7:40 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-08-14 09:23:37 AM  
Submarines are supposed to sink, subtard.
 
2013-08-14 09:26:04 AM  
FTA:  "India has had 14 diesel-powered submarines, he said..."

FTFY.

/I do have to wonder if they called Russian Sub Tech Support and got put on hold while the customer service rep got his script.

 //Pretty sure this problem got escalated.
 
2013-08-14 09:27:43 AM  

ranak: dittybopper: ranak: I can only imagine the fate that awaits their new carrier. .

It's going to hit some sort of storm-induced temporal anomaly, and go back in time to 1857 on the eave of the Indian Rebellion, and the crew will attempt to interdict British colonial troops, only to be stopped by the reappearance of the storm which sent them back in time in the first place.

I hate you a little bit for now making me want to watch that movie. Off to Netflix.


The interesting thing, if you think about it, is that the Japanese could have probably sank the Nimitz if they knew where it was by simply throwing every available plane at it.  They'd have suffered huge losses in aircraft, of course, but I doubt the Nimitz could have successfully held off a concerted attack by 270-odd strike aircraft.   Just not enough assets to prevent all of them from getting through.

/Quantity has a quality all its own.
 
2013-08-14 09:29:46 AM  

abhorrent1: It was docked and they couldn't keep it from sinking? Don't they have ropes in India?


Did'nt you see that bridge Short Round was on?
 
2013-08-14 09:29:47 AM  

Ned Stark: Submarines are supposed to sink, subtard.


Yeah, but you see, what happens is you take the number of times you've submerged, add that to the number of times you've surfaced, and divide by 2.  If the result isn't even, don't open the hatch.
 
2013-08-14 09:30:45 AM  

NEPAman: FTA:  "India has had 14 diesel-powered submarines, he said..."

FTFY.

/I do have to wonder if they called Russian Sub Tech Support and got put on hold while the customer service rep got his script.

 //Pretty sure this problem got escalated.


Did you try reboarding?
 
2013-08-14 09:31:54 AM  
Was it trying to reach Pakistan?
 
2013-08-14 09:33:13 AM  

Satanic_Hamster: Last year, India acquired a Russian Nerpa nuclear submarine for its navy


Reading comprehension, does you has any?
 
2013-08-14 09:36:01 AM  

dittybopper: The interesting thing, if you think about it, is that the Japanese could have probably sank the Nimitz if they knew where it was by simply throwing every available plane at it. They'd have suffered huge losses in aircraft, of course, but I doubt the Nimitz could have successfully held off a concerted attack by 270-odd strike aircraft. Just not enough assets to prevent all of them from getting through.


CIWS?
 
2013-08-14 09:36:25 AM  

DirtyDeadGhostofEbenezerCooke: ein727: I don't see why Native Americans needed a submarine anyway...

Sneak up on water buffalo.


Air came out of my nose.  This is wrong on so, so many levels.

/You are my new hero.
 
2013-08-14 09:36:48 AM  

DirtyDeadGhostofEbenezerCooke: ein727: I don't see why Native Americans needed a submarine anyway...

Sneak up on water buffalo.


Or hunt whales.
 
2013-08-14 09:37:31 AM  

NEPAman: dittybopper: The interesting thing, if you think about it, is that the Japanese could have probably sank the Nimitz if they knew where it was by simply throwing every available plane at it. They'd have suffered huge losses in aircraft, of course, but I doubt the Nimitz could have successfully held off a concerted attack by 270-odd strike aircraft. Just not enough assets to prevent all of them from getting through.

CIWS?


Nevermind, just remembered CIWS is for anti-ship missile interdiction.
 
2013-08-14 09:41:44 AM  

NEPAman: NEPAman: dittybopper: The interesting thing, if you think about it, is that the Japanese could have probably sank the Nimitz if they knew where it was by simply throwing every available plane at it. They'd have suffered huge losses in aircraft, of course, but I doubt the Nimitz could have successfully held off a concerted attack by 270-odd strike aircraft. Just not enough assets to prevent all of them from getting through.

CIWS?

Nevermind, just remembered CIWS is for anti-ship missile interdiction.


Even so, they'd probably run out of ammo, and they wouldn't help against the dive bombers.
 
2013-08-14 09:43:11 AM  

dittybopper: ranak: dittybopper: ranak: I can only imagine the fate that awaits their new carrier. .

It's going to hit some sort of storm-induced temporal anomaly, and go back in time to 1857 on the eave of the Indian Rebellion, and the crew will attempt to interdict British colonial troops, only to be stopped by the reappearance of the storm which sent them back in time in the first place.

I hate you a little bit for now making me want to watch that movie. Off to Netflix.

The interesting thing, if you think about it, is that the Japanese could have probably sank the Nimitz if they knew where it was by simply throwing every available plane at it.  They'd have suffered huge losses in aircraft, of course, but I doubt the Nimitz could have successfully held off a concerted attack by 270-odd strike aircraft.   Just not enough assets to prevent all of them from getting through.

/Quantity has a quality all its own.


Ah, old Soviet proverbs.

Honestly, IF the Japanese knew where the Nimitz was, they could have tried, but with an E-2 on the carriers side, they'd see a strike force coming long before it ever got close enough to do any damage. Sure, the Tomcats would run out of missiles and have to resort to throwning rocks at the strike force, but still..

I would think the biggest danger to the Nimitz was from submarines since it's screening ships were gone.
 
2013-08-14 09:43:26 AM  
At least it wasn't a Canadian submarine where the roof on the canoe wasn't on tight.
 
2013-08-14 09:56:22 AM  

Dheiner: Reading comprehension, does you has any?


That's already been covered, sweetie.  Came late to the party?
 
2013-08-14 10:22:12 AM  

ranak: I would think the biggest danger to the Nimitz was from submarines since it's screening ships were gone.


I don't.  Speed is armor.

The Japanese subs would have been limited to a maximum submerged speed of less than 10 knots for short bursts, and couldn't go more than a handful of knots for any length of time.  Plus, they couldn't snorkel, so they'd have to come up for air, at which point they'd be vulnerable.

It's really, really hard to hit something travelling at 25+ knots with a torpedo when you can only do maybe 5 knots for any length of time.  Believe me, I've tried.  You have to be very, very close.  Like, within a 1,500 yards close, preferably much closer.

Also, the Nimitz had some ASW air assets of her own.
 
2013-08-14 10:33:39 AM  
Did not realize Kilo class subs were still around, let alone being exported.

/get off my bow
 
2013-08-14 10:49:05 AM  

FullMetalPanda: How do Indian subs even submerge?  Aren't just packed with thousands of people inside and all over it like their trains?


Those people are the ballast. Load 'er up to sink it, eject a few to raise it. See?
/they have more than enough people anyways...
 
2013-08-14 10:52:51 AM  

DirtyDeadGhostofEbenezerCooke: ein727: I don't see why Native Americans needed a submarine anyway...

Sneak up on water buffalo.


lh4.googleusercontent.com
water buffalo...
 
2013-08-14 11:07:53 AM  

ranak: I can only imagine the fate that awaits their new carrier. .


It's going to fly away?
 
2013-08-14 11:18:56 AM  
"Hello this is Sanjeev of Underwater Tech how may I help you?"

"Have you tried putting out the fire?"

"Sir, you have voided the warranty good day."
 
2013-08-14 11:43:56 AM  
Will the casinos close down in mourning?
 
2013-08-14 12:10:16 PM  

dittybopper: ranak: I can only imagine the fate that awaits their new carrier. .

It's going to hit some sort of storm-induced temporal anomaly, and go back in time to 1857 on the eave of the Indian Rebellion, and the crew will attempt to interdict British colonial troops, only to be stopped by the reappearance of the storm which sent them back in time in the first place.


Starring Kirk Douglas.
 
2013-08-14 12:15:34 PM  

Foundling: dittybopper: ranak: I can only imagine the fate that awaits their new carrier. .

It's going to hit some sort of storm-induced temporal anomaly, and go back in time to 1857 on the eave of the Indian Rebellion, and the crew will attempt to interdict British colonial troops, only to be stopped by the reappearance of the storm which sent them back in time in the first place.

Starring Kirk Douglas.


And James Mason as the dark, brooding submarine captain who goes down with his boat when it sinks.
 
2013-08-14 12:15:40 PM  

dittybopper: ranak: I would think the biggest danger to the Nimitz was from submarines since it's screening ships were gone.

I don't.  Speed is armor.

The Japanese subs would have been limited to a maximum submerged speed of less than 10 knots for short bursts, and couldn't go more than a handful of knots for any length of time.  Plus, they couldn't snorkel, so they'd have to come up for air, at which point they'd be vulnerable.

It's really, really hard to hit something travelling at 25+ knots with a torpedo when you can only do maybe 5 knots for any length of time.  Believe me, I've tried.  You have to be very, very close.  Like, within a 1,500 yards close, preferably much closer.

Also, the Nimitz had some ASW air assets of her own.




I'd figure that, since the Nimitz knew where the Pearl Harbor strike force was located and the Japanese had no way to know the Nimitz was anywhere nearby, the only way they could have been attacked is after the PH strike waves had returned. By then their pilots were exhausted, many of the planes were damaged, and they didn't have a lot of torpedoes left in the carriers. Even a half sized strike force would have run into massed missile attacks, and once the missiles were gone the F-14's would have started using their cannon on the Japanese. If any survived all that, didn't the Nimitz have Sea Sparrow missiles for close in defense along with the Phalanx? The bomb the Val carried was a 550 lb SAP weapon, and it couldn't penetrate the British CV flight deck; the Nimitz' flight deck was thicker so I doubt the DB's would have ended up being much of a threat. It's the torpedoes you'd have to worry about.
 
2013-08-14 12:22:20 PM  
"The 16-year-old Russian-made submarine.."

Ah, I think I see the problem.
 
2013-08-14 12:40:17 PM  
dittybopper [TotalFark]
2013-08-14 07:36:48 AM

It's a Kilo class boat.

Sounds like a battery fire (relatively common hazard on diesel/electric boats)



Well they should have planned for it, Slots and Video poker machines take up a lot of power. How many people were on the Casino floor when it sank?
 
2013-08-14 12:59:12 PM  

dittybopper: Ned Stark: Submarines are supposed to sink, subtard.

Yeah, but you see, what happens is you take the number of times you've submerged, add that to the number of times you've surfaced, and divide by 2. If the result isn't even, don't open the hatch.


Trust me. You couldn't open that hatch when the number is odd, even if you wanted to.
 
2013-08-14 01:08:25 PM  

Rabid Badger Beaver Weasel: The 18 who died where trapped after the explosion and fire. Sad day to be a submariner, no matter what country.


lexfridman.com
 
2013-08-14 01:10:52 PM  
My question is what would Indiana need with a submarine. I mean its not like anyone is going to torpedo Gary
 
2013-08-14 01:11:31 PM  

dittybopper: It's a Kilo class boat.

Sounds like a battery fire (relatively common hazard on diesel/electric boats), followed by some of the torpedoes cooking off.  Either that, or torpedo fuel ignited, which subsequently cooked off the warheads.


Battery fires can happen on any boat, not just diesel\electric ones. It just as easily could have been an O2 fire that caused this. That's happened to us in the past, with the same results as this.
 
2013-08-14 01:15:18 PM  
They should have called tech support. They're in the same timezone.
 
2013-08-14 01:22:40 PM  

Bendal: I'd figure that, since the Nimitz knew where the Pearl Harbor strike force was located and the Japanese had no way to know the Nimitz was anywhere nearby, the only way they could have been attacked is after the PH strike waves had returned. By then their pilots were exhausted, many of the planes were damaged, and they didn't have a lot of torpedoes left in the carriers. Even a half sized strike force would have run into massed missile attacks, and once the missiles were gone the F-14's would have started using their cannon on the Japanese. If any survived all that, didn't the Nimitz have Sea Sparrow missiles for close in defense along with the Phalanx? The bomb the Val carried was a 550 lb SAP weapon, and it couldn't penetrate the British CV flight deck; the Nimitz' flight deck was thicker so I doubt the DB's would have ended up being much of a threat. It's the torpedoes you'd have to worry about.


Several points:

1. The Japanese may well have known the Nimitz was in the area, as they had a number of submarines (23, if I remember correctly) as part of the strike force against Hawaii.  They were there largely for screening and reconnaissance purposes, and they could have easily sighted the Nimitz and sent a report, which is a much less taxing thing than trying to get into position to shoot.

2. Nagumo could not have ignored a report of a carrier at sea in the area.  He would have had to do one of two things:
a. Turn tail and run as fast as possible, or
b  Attack with everything he possibly could muster.

3. The Kates had 1,760 lb armor piercing bombs derived from 16"  artillery shells, specifically designed to penetrate armored ships.  The Arizona was penetrated by just such a bomb, which is what sank her.  I'm sure they'd have penetrated the flight deck of the Nimitz.  Plus, as you mentioned, there were the torpedo armed planes.
 
2013-08-14 01:23:50 PM  

Radioactive Ass: dittybopper: Ned Stark: Submarines are supposed to sink, subtard.

Yeah, but you see, what happens is you take the number of times you've submerged, add that to the number of times you've surfaced, and divide by 2. If the result isn't even, don't open the hatch.

Trust me. You couldn't open that hatch when the number is odd, even if you wanted to.


Yes, I know.  Water pressure holds it tight.  It's a joke.
 
2013-08-14 01:29:17 PM  

dittybopper: Radioactive Ass: dittybopper: Ned Stark: Submarines are supposed to sink, subtard.

Yeah, but you see, what happens is you take the number of times you've submerged, add that to the number of times you've surfaced, and divide by 2. If the result isn't even, don't open the hatch.

Trust me. You couldn't open that hatch when the number is odd, even if you wanted to.

Yes, I know.  Water pressure holds it tight.  It's a joke.


Wait a minute:  *TECHNICALLY*, you can, as you should well know because you've trained for that eventuality.
 
2013-08-14 01:49:34 PM  
The crew must've had a mean curry the night before ....
 
2013-08-14 02:41:13 PM  

dittybopper: dittybopper: Radioactive Ass: dittybopper: Ned Stark: Submarines are supposed to sink, subtard.

Yeah, but you see, what happens is you take the number of times you've submerged, add that to the number of times you've surfaced, and divide by 2. If the result isn't even, don't open the hatch.

Trust me. You couldn't open that hatch when the number is odd, even if you wanted to.

Yes, I know.  Water pressure holds it tight.  It's a joke.

Wait a minute:  *TECHNICALLY*, you can, as you should well know because you've trained for that eventuality.


I know more about that than most people, including many other submariners (that was my first checkout that I was given to do for others. 2 hours of hell for those people, 2nd only to DC in the amount of crap you had to know and never use... if you're lucky). But... that's a bit more involved than just opening a hatch and the odds are that you wouldn't survive the attempt unless there's a rescue ship above you, and that you don't hit it on the way up.

Escape trunks were invented for mothers, wives and congressmen. Not to be used in an emergency. 99% of the time you are already in waters much deeper than your design crush depth. There's a reason that so few successful submarine rescues have happened. I believe the last one was the Squalus in the late 1930's. Of course you make the effort anyway but unless you were in a collision with a merchant while transiting to your dive point you are not going to survive a flooding casualty that you can't get under control really quick. See Thresher.
 
2013-08-14 04:08:00 PM  

Radioactive Ass: There's a reason that so few successful submarine rescues have happened. I believe the last one was the Squalus in the late 1930's.


Actually, there have been a number of self-rescues from submarines since the Squailfish,   It was semi-common in WWII in shallower waters, though often only a small handful would make it out.  Often that was because all the other compartments were flooded.  Then, especially in the Atlantic and North Sea, those that did get out that way often froze to death.

There are a number of such escapes documented by Clay Blair in his seminal work "Hitler's U-Boat War", volumes I and II.
 
2013-08-14 05:14:00 PM  

dittybopper: Radioactive Ass: There's a reason that so few successful submarine rescues have happened. I believe the last one was the Squalus in the late 1930's.

Actually, there have been a number of self-rescues from submarines since the Squailfish,   It was semi-common in WWII in shallower waters, though often only a small handful would make it out.  Often that was because all the other compartments were flooded.  Then, especially in the Atlantic and North Sea, those that did get out that way often froze to death.

There are a number of such escapes documented by Clay Blair in his seminal work "Hitler's U-Boat War", volumes I and II.


Yeah. I should have put large scale in there. My point is that the odds of a successful escape are very, very slim. A lot of things have to go perfectly right to pull it off. Unless you sank next to the pier you're pretty much screwed. Right around 700' is the maximum depth that you might be able to get out alive (and by that I mean on the surface and still breathing, probably with at least some minor air embolisms in your lungs, a slight case of the bends and ruptured eardrums at the minimum) and most of the time you're in much deeper water than that (over 99% of the worlds oceans are much deeper than crush depth unless you're on something like NR1).

Like I said, the escape and rescue systems are there so you can tell mothers, wives and congress critters that you can rescue people trapped in a sunken submarine (which you can do in theory). The reality is that if you're in that type of situation you're absolutely screwed unless a lot of things fall into just the right place at just the right time. That's why we have submarine pay (really just a specific type of hazardous duty pay).
 
2013-08-14 07:32:08 PM  

Radioactive Ass: dittybopper: Radioactive Ass: There's a reason that so few successful submarine rescues have happened. I believe the last one was the Squalus in the late 1930's.

Actually, there have been a number of self-rescues from submarines since the Squailfish,   It was semi-common in WWII in shallower waters, though often only a small handful would make it out.  Often that was because all the other compartments were flooded.  Then, especially in the Atlantic and North Sea, those that did get out that way often froze to death.

There are a number of such escapes documented by Clay Blair in his seminal work "Hitler's U-Boat War", volumes I and II.

Yeah. I should have put large scale in there. My point is that the odds of a successful escape are very, very slim. A lot of things have to go perfectly right to pull it off. Unless you sank next to the pier you're pretty much screwed. Right around 700' is the maximum depth that you might be able to get out alive (and by that I mean on the surface and still breathing, probably with at least some minor air embolisms in your lungs, a slight case of the bends and ruptured eardrums at the minimum) and most of the time you're in much deeper water than that (over 99% of the worlds oceans are much deeper than crush depth unless you're on something like NR1).

Like I said, the escape and rescue systems are there so you can tell mothers, wives and congress critters that you can rescue people trapped in a sunken submarine (which you can do in theory). The reality is that if you're in that type of situation you're absolutely screwed unless a lot of things fall into just the right place at just the right time. That's why we have submarine pay (really just a specific type of hazardous duty pay).


Reminded me of this: Mare Island Mud Puppy
 
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