If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Miami Herald)   Maybe it's time we stop referring to tasers as 'non'-lethal   (miamiherald.com) divider line 176
    More: Scary, Mount Sinai Hospital, Miami Beach, Taser  
•       •       •

6466 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Aug 2013 at 8:39 PM (49 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



176 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | » | Last | Show all
 
2013-08-09 10:07:21 AM

Litterbox: snuff3r: You know, i would have felt some sympathy had I not read that he was involved in Graffiti. I have assholes graffiti my walls all the time and though obviously i don't believe capital punishment is the solution i certainly don't care of they get killed in the process if there was no intention to kill them.

Having said that, i disagree with state thugs carrying tasers. Horrible devices.

Those "horrible devices" have saved a lot of lives, prevented a lot of injuries and resolved an untold number of incidents where it could have gone a whole lot worse.  My department Tases people on a daily basis and we have yet to have anyone die.  And the officers that carry them are required to be Tasered every year.  Taser instructors have been Tased dozens of times.  Lets wait for the toxicology test to come back on this "artist".  My guess is cocaine.


i706.photobucket.com

Difficulty: not from a Taser manufacturer or Police Department

\and not pulled out yer ass, like your statement above
\\it may take week, months or years but anyone who tases me will get tased back
 
2013-08-09 10:20:38 AM

Kiwimann: Yeah, read the article.


Really?

 If he hadn't tried to run away from the police who caught him vandalizing private property, he would also be alive today.

FTA: It ended at 71st and Harding when he was cornered by police and ran toward the officers, ignoring commands to stop

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/08/07/3548779/graffiti-artist-dies-af t er-tasering.html#storylink=cpy
Let's just set the scene here:

FTA: Félix Fernández said he saw about five police officers chasing Hernández and shoving him against a wall. ..."He is a very skinny guy, very small"

You have a small guy, unarmed, surrounded by several cops, a wall at his back, who tries to get away by running straight at them.

You think they really needed to taser him, as opposed to just grabbing the guy? Sounds to me like they thought, "har de har, let's zip this sucker."

When some old white person is tazed instead of tackled, there's a furious uproar followed by a six figure out of court settlement.

Do it to someone young and/or brown, meh.
 
2013-08-09 10:24:58 AM

Litterbox: hubiestubert: And you think that tasering a teenager who was spray painting as his big crime de jour, meets those requirements? Really?

I never said that.  From what I understand of this event, he ran and then allegedly attacked an officer.  He got Tased because he was not complying with the officers while being arrested, not because he was spraypainting.  Lets look at it another way...what if there were no Taser here and the cops got into a fistfight with this kid or something else happens that didnt need to.  Its unfortunate that he died, but the Taser had little to nothing to do with that.


I'm not against cops (well, except when they give me a ticket, in which case they are nothing more that tax collectors) and I will not insult you or call you names. But that last statement leaves me wondering. The kid may have been high, he may have had a preexisting medical condition, but what ultimately killed him was the cops' Taser. Until he ran into the Taser, he had managed to live quite well (though perhaps not productively) with his hypothesized drug habit or medical condition, so those are not what killed him. Have you ever considered that every single time your department uses a Taser there is a possibility (you place it 1:100000) that it will kill someone ? in your city of 20,000,000 that's at least 200 people who should not be tasered. Are you willing to take the risk that everyone you taser is not one of these 200 ?

I bet that within your own department, every time a Taser is used to train one of your own, a doctor is present...
 
2013-08-09 10:38:30 AM

CheapEngineer: Litterbox: snuff3r: You know, i would have felt some sympathy had I not read that he was involved in Graffiti. I have assholes graffiti my walls all the time and though obviously i don't believe capital punishment is the solution i certainly don't care of they get killed in the process if there was no intention to kill them.

Having said that, i disagree with state thugs carrying tasers. Horrible devices.

Those "horrible devices" have saved a lot of lives, prevented a lot of injuries and resolved an untold number of incidents where it could have gone a whole lot worse.  My department Tases people on a daily basis and we have yet to have anyone die.  And the officers that carry them are required to be Tasered every year.  Taser instructors have been Tased dozens of times.  Lets wait for the toxicology test to come back on this "artist".  My guess is cocaine.

[i706.photobucket.com image 271x271]

Difficulty: not from a Taser manufacturer or Police Department

\and not pulled out yer ass, like your statement above
\\it may take week, months or years but anyone who tases me will get tased back


Not that it is harmless, but statistically it is easily possible that a PD is tasering the shiat out of everyone in town and still not killing anyone.

As has been pointed out, damn near 100% of LEOs that carry have been tased and can tell you that the second it is over you get right back up feeling fine, then you get a little soreness the next day.  Adverse reactions certainly exist, but they really are quite rare.  The question is whether that rarity of occurrence should be grounds to raise the taser higher on the use of force than it is.  Answering that question should be based on something other than letting emotions defeat statistics. Emotions should NEVER be allowed to cloud one's judgement when it comes to statistical probabilities*.

*which doesn't mean emotions shouldn't factor into the decision you make, it doesn't matter how few people die, you are more than welcome to hold the opinion that it is terrible and horrific. What you aren't welcome to do is pretend numbers don't exist and embrace every psychological brain-failure in the book to turn a rare yet salient event into commonplace.  Well, you are allowed to, but it makes you an idiot.
 
2013-08-09 10:47:39 AM

capt.hollister: I bet that within your own department, every time a Taser is used to train one of your own, a doctor is present...


You might lose that bet.  I know CBP doesn't bring in a doc for taser training.  I couldn't speak to a random internet cop's station though.

capt.hollister: Have you ever considered that every single time your department uses a Taser there is a possibility (you place it 1:100000) that it will kill someone ? in your city of 20,000,000 that's at least 200 people who should not be tasered


Perhaps I am nitpick here, but you did a fair bit of twisting to push this logic through.  First of all he said 1/100,000 has a chance of medical complication, not death.  Furthermore he did not say the odds of anyone getting tazed and having a medical complication was 1/100,000, because even after the 1/100,000 he had a "might" in there.  Finally, if 1/100,000 individuals have perfect storm that makes the taser unsafe, it is unlikely to be distributed among the population evenly.  I highly doubt the average tased individual is the 60 year old with a pacemaker.  I mean, I couldn't speak to the veracity of his 1/100,000 claim to begin with, but if you are going to use his numbers, be honest about it.


capt.hollister: Until he ran into the Taser, he had managed to live quite well (though perhaps not productively) with his hypothesized drug habit or medical condition, so those are not what killed him.


Also, I have to disagree with this line of thinking as well. If a man had a heart condition and fled from the cops and excitement of the chase did him in, would you call the cops murderers for chasing/tackling/etc?  If you would then your statement makes sense for the taser too, I suppose.  But personally I wouldn't in this case blame the police for the heart attack.
 
2013-08-09 11:25:04 AM

Smackledorfer: capt.hollister: I bet that within your own department, every time a Taser is used to train one of your own, a doctor is present...

You might lose that bet.  I know CBP doesn't bring in a doc for taser training.  I couldn't speak to a random internet cop's station though.

capt.hollister: Have you ever considered that every single time your department uses a Taser there is a possibility (you place it 1:100000) that it will kill someone ? in your city of 20,000,000 that's at least 200 people who should not be tasered

Perhaps I am nitpick here, but you did a fair bit of twisting to push this logic through.  First of all he said 1/100,000 has a chance of medical complication, not death.  Furthermore he did not say the odds of anyone getting tazed and having a medical complication was 1/100,000, because even after the 1/100,000 he had a "might" in there.  Finally, if 1/100,000 individuals have perfect storm that makes the taser unsafe, it is unlikely to be distributed among the population evenly.  I highly doubt the average tased individual is the 60 year old with a pacemaker.  I mean, I couldn't speak to the veracity of his 1/100,000 claim to begin with, but if you are going to use his numbers, be honest about it.


capt.hollister: Until he ran into the Taser, he had managed to live quite well (though perhaps not productively) with his hypothesized drug habit or medical condition, so those are not what killed him.

Also, I have to disagree with this line of thinking as well. If a man had a heart condition and fled from the cops and excitement of the chase did him in, would you call the cops murderers for chasing/tackling/etc?  If you would then your statement makes sense for the taser too, I suppose.  But personally I wouldn't in this case blame the police for the heart attack.


Points well-made and well-taken. I am one of those people who probably should not be tasered, so I am a little sensitive about the issue of Taser safety. The point I was trying to make, perhaps clumsily, is that the safety of Tasers is not absolute (I know that Litterbox did not say it was, but his statement that his dept tasers people on a daily basis with no harm suggests that the officers in his department act as though it were). Cops should keep in mind that every single time they use one, they run the risk of causing serious damage or even death to the individual.

To do a little nitpicking of my own, I did not imply that the cops were murderers. I am reasonably sure that they were not intending to kill the kid and I do not believe that they were left unmoved by his unexpected death. But perhaps that illustrates my point: police officers do not expect a tasering to be lethal, but sometimes it is.
 
2013-08-09 11:43:49 AM

capt.hollister: Cops should keep in mind that every single time they use one


Agreed.

capt.hollister: To do a little nitpicking of my own, I did not imply that the cops were murderers. I am reasonably sure that they were not intending to kill the kid and I do not believe that they were left unmoved by his unexpected death. But perhaps that illustrates my point: police officers do not expect a tasering to be lethal, but sometimes it is.


My bad, and I agree.
 
2013-08-09 11:50:17 AM

iq_in_binary: Litterbox: iq_in_binary:

I'm all for LTL weaponry being issued to police, don't get me wrong. But any cop who gets in front of me and tells me that it's a tool that saves lives and then turns around to say that having a Taser pointed at them is justification to shoot somebody has just dropped completely off the list of people who I'd ever do a favor for. Ever. No statements, no questions answered, no aid rendered.

I was trying to make a point about safety of the device.  With all the cops being Tased for the benefit of training, I don't believe there has ever been a fatality.  The "justification" comes when the person is not complying with you, is fighting you, is assaulting someone etc.  The Taser is very effective most of the time.


I've had my Edison cherry popped too, I know what it's like. And it's a serious weapon. I didn't carry one because it wouldn't do ME any good to use it if things went pear shaped, I don't have backup on the way or a dispatcher to send help. Police officers have Glock, Motorola, the Justice system and a whole brotherhood of people with the same to back them up. Pain compliance methods, hand to hand training, verbal judo, physical restraints, capsaicin, night sticks, nunchaku (in more and more PDs, yes), sap gloves, batons, you show me a picture of the contents of your average duty bag and I'll show you a picture of what would normally be considered ITG porn by the majority of folks looking at it if it were posted by non LEO p ...

Im thankful for having a Taser as a tool.  Its very presence in situations has helped resolve them.  Simply displaying the Taser is often all it takes to gain compliance.  My department only allows ASP's, OC and Tasers.  No nunchaku, no night sticks, PR24 etc. Pain compliance is a joke for the most part...its difficult to stay proficient with all that and you better hope the guy you are using it on has a pain threshold.  Some mental people Ive dealt with don't.  Same with OC.  Sap gloves will get you a laws ...


I hear you and agree with most of what you said.  Having a partner makes a huge difference, yes.  That said, we still do not know what actually happened in this case ( at least I haven't heard anything) so trying to quarterback it is folly.  Im proficient with everything I carry, but your suggestion to do 100 rounds a month is crazy!  Nobody got money for that lol.  And if you know where we can get that kind of ammo, let me know!
 
2013-08-09 11:54:00 AM

Nhojwolfe: LiberalConservative: Nhojwolfe: Yeah because paint on a wall should = a death sentence by a over zealous cop?

Yeah because...
a) police see person committing minor crime, that person resists arrest, and police try to subdue that person using a method which very rarely kills, and
b) police see person committing minor crime, decide the penalty is death, and then enact that punishment
... are TOTALLY the same thing.

In this case yes it was. My point is tasers are over used. And defended by people who don't want to do their job properly are maybe they are not properly trained.


And you apparently know zero about either of those issues.  Why is it that the least educated people on a topic have to comment as if they know?
 
2013-08-09 11:54:35 AM

Oldiron_79: I hate that it happened but a fleeing and resisting suspect is pretty much like the textbook example of when TO use a taser


ding ding ding.  Winner winner....
 
2013-08-09 11:59:21 AM

CheapEngineer: Litterbox: snuff3r: You know, i would have felt some sympathy had I not read that he was involved in Graffiti. I have assholes graffiti my walls all the time and though obviously i don't believe capital punishment is the solution i certainly don't care of they get killed in the process if there was no intention to kill them.

Having said that, i disagree with state thugs carrying tasers. Horrible devices.

Those "horrible devices" have saved a lot of lives, prevented a lot of injuries and resolved an untold number of incidents where it could have gone a whole lot worse.  My department Tases people on a daily basis and we have yet to have anyone die.  And the officers that carry them are required to be Tasered every year.  Taser instructors have been Tased dozens of times.  Lets wait for the toxicology test to come back on this "artist".  My guess is cocaine.

[i706.photobucket.com image 271x271]

Difficulty: not from a Taser manufacturer or Police Department

\and not pulled out yer ass, like your statement above
\\it may take week, months or years but anyone who tases me will get tased back


Between our law enforcement division (serving somewhere around 500K) and detention division (about 3,500 inmates), I would put the number at anywhere between 3-5 a week.
 
2013-08-09 12:02:55 PM
Threads like this make me want to smile and condescendingly pat some people on the head, like the children they appear to be.

We get it, you have decided that the police are your enemy; maybe you absorb youth culture like a sponge or perhaps engage in illegal activity of your own, and thus are a criminal.  Whatever the reason, you feel personally and directly threatened by the police, and so automatically view every act by the police not as upholding the law, but rather as a potential injury to your own person.

I especially enjoy when folks like this work against their own best interests, and advocate more lethal alternatives to devices like tasers, such as pepper spray (rarely used now a days), clubbing with nightsticks, asps or other device, or simple, straight up physically tacking and beating, all of which have a statistically higher injury and mortality rate than tasers.

Perhaps the most amusing of all is those who suggest that, because the crime is small in scope, the police should be negligent, or lazy, when they come across a perpetrator, especially one caught in the act.  The ones that use phrases like, "They should have just let him go."  If law enforcement is going to make a ruling like, "We won't chase you if you're involved in the commission of these crimes: ____" official, they are really making them legal.  If there's no enforcement of the law, there's no purpose to the law.

The fact that these claimants effectively want police to be able to have this power to subjectively determine which laws they should enforce or not is doubly amusing, given the standard distrust of law enforcement.  If I distrusted law enforcement, I certainly wouldn't want them to be able to effectively overrule both prior legislation and the entire judicial system on a whim.

Then again, the individuals who do suggest these views are thinking like children, after all.  It's all remedial 'Us vs. Them' with no rational basis other than the concept of opposing sides.
 
2013-08-09 12:10:10 PM

Litterbox: Nhojwolfe: LiberalConservative: Nhojwolfe: Yeah because paint on a wall should = a death sentence by a over zealous cop?

Yeah because...
a) police see person committing minor crime, that person resists arrest, and police try to subdue that person using a method which very rarely kills, and
b) police see person committing minor crime, decide the penalty is death, and then enact that punishment
... are TOTALLY the same thing.

In this case yes it was. My point is tasers are over used. And defended by people who don't want to do their job properly are maybe they are not properly trained.

And you apparently know zero about either of those issues.  Why is it that the least educated people on a topic have to comment as if they know?



Im glad you know my background and training.
Please continue with other things about myself I may not be aware of.

Im also guessing when you go to taze someone you know their complete medical history before hand, and know that a electric shock through the system wont cause painful injury or in this case death.

Tasers should be used one step above guns.  Its been my experience latley that they are used way to early,  and situations can be defused the old fashion way most of the time.  Hey why waist the time taze them book or send them to the morge and move on.
 
2013-08-09 12:13:49 PM

capt.hollister: Litterbox: hubiestubert: And you think that tasering a teenager who was spray painting as his big crime de jour, meets those requirements? Really?

I never said that.  From what I understand of this event, he ran and then allegedly attacked an officer.  He got Tased because he was not complying with the officers while being arrested, not because he was spraypainting.  Lets look at it another way...what if there were no Taser here and the cops got into a fistfight with this kid or something else happens that didnt need to.  Its unfortunate that he died, but the Taser had little to nothing to do with that.

I'm not against cops (well, except when they give me a ticket, in which case they are nothing more that tax collectors) and I will not insult you or call you names. But that last statement leaves me wondering. The kid may have been high, he may have had a preexisting medical condition, but what ultimately killed him was the cops' Taser. Until he ran into the Taser, he had managed to live quite well (though perhaps not productively) with his hypothesized drug habit or medical condition, so those are not what killed him. Have you ever considered that every single time your department uses a Taser there is a possibility (you place it 1:100000) that it will kill someone ? in your city of 20,000,000 that's at least 200 people who should not be tasered. Are you willing to take the risk that everyone you taser is not one of these 200 ?

I bet that within your own department, every time a Taser is used to train one of your own, a doctor is present...


You would categorically lose that bet.  Doctors are not present at all because there is no need for them.  Hell, when these people are shot with the Taser in the field, the probes are removed by the officers in most cases.  In our detention center, we remove the probes with our response team and the inmates are checked by either an LVN or a MA. They get a band-aid for the probe wound and sent back to their cell.  The 1:100,000 figure is from Taser themselves.  There is nothing to prove that this kid died from the Taser..heck, for all we know it was excited delirium. Everything is pure speculation at this point.  Also, keep in mind that when we train new officers as Taser operators, you are looking at 20-25 people all getting shot with the Taser in one instance.  Thats like a years worth of people for a medium sized department.  0 deaths. 0 complications.  Also, no cocaine, no heroin, no meth, no excited delirium etc.  The Taser instructors are shot repeatedly during their training and have to endure it yearly.  Again, 0 deaths, 0 complications.
 
2013-08-09 01:14:51 PM

quietwalker: Threads like this make me want to smile and condescendingly pat some people on the head, like the children they appear to be.

We get it, you have decided that the police are your enemy; maybe you absorb youth culture like a sponge or perhaps engage in illegal activity of your own, and thus are a criminal.  Whatever the reason, you feel personally and directly threatened by the police, and so automatically view every act by the police not as upholding the law, but rather as a potential injury to your own person.

I especially enjoy when folks like this work against their own best interests, and advocate more lethal alternatives to devices like tasers, such as pepper spray (rarely used now a days), clubbing with nightsticks, asps or other device, or simple, straight up physically tacking and beating, all of which have a statistically higher injury and mortality rate than tasers.

Perhaps the most amusing of all is those who suggest that, because the crime is small in scope, the police should be negligent, or lazy, when they come across a perpetrator, especially one caught in the act.  The ones that use phrases like, "They should have just let him go."  If law enforcement is going to make a ruling like, "We won't chase you if you're involved in the commission of these crimes: ____" official, they are really making them legal.  If there's no enforcement of the law, there's no purpose to the law.

The fact that these claimants effectively want police to be able to have this power to subjectively determine which laws they should enforce or not is doubly amusing, given the standard distrust of law enforcement.  If I distrusted law enforcement, I certainly wouldn't want them to be able to effectively overrule both prior legislation and the entire judicial system on a whim.

Then again, the individuals who do suggest these views are thinking like children, after all.  It's all remedial 'Us vs. Them' with no rational basis other than the concept of opposing sides.


Best post in this whole thread.  Nice.
 
2013-08-09 04:09:02 PM

Smackledorfer: CheapEngineer: Litterbox: snuff3r: You know, i would have felt some sympathy had I not read that he was involved in Graffiti. I have assholes graffiti my walls all the time and though obviously i don't believe capital punishment is the solution i certainly don't care of they get killed in the process if there was no intention to kill them.

Having said that, i disagree with state thugs carrying tasers. Horrible devices.

Those "horrible devices" have saved a lot of lives, prevented a lot of injuries and resolved an untold number of incidents where it could have gone a whole lot worse.  My department Tases people on a daily basis and we have yet to have anyone die.  And the officers that carry them are required to be Tasered every year.  Taser instructors have been Tased dozens of times.  Lets wait for the toxicology test to come back on this "artist".  My guess is cocaine.

[i706.photobucket.com image 271x271]

Difficulty: not from a Taser manufacturer or Police Department

\and not pulled out yer ass, like your statement above
\\it may take week, months or years but anyone who tases me will get tased back

Not that it is harmless, but statistically it is easily possible that a PD is tasering the shiat out of everyone in town and still not killing anyone.

As has been pointed out, damn near 100% of LEOs that carry have been tased and can tell you that the second it is over you get right back up feeling fine, then you get a little soreness the next day.  Adverse reactions certainly exist, but they really are quite rare.  The question is whether that rarity of occurrence should be grounds to raise the taser higher on the use of force than it is.  Answering that question should be based on something other than letting emotions defeat statistics. Emotions should NEVER be allowed to cloud one's judgement when it comes to statistical probabilities*.

*which doesn't mean emotions shouldn't factor into the decision you make, it doesn't matter how few people die, you are mor ...


You're comparing the response of a prepared, relaxed Police officer who *knows* there are trained personnel there to help them( and knows it's just a demonstration) - to someone who is at *minimum* seriously agitated and thinks, true or not, that they are running for their life and someone's tryibng to torture them.

Comparing the effect of a taser under controlled conditions with Real Life is silly, and pointless.

If I was sure that all police officers are well trained, thoughtful stewards of the law who considered each situation before using the appropriate amount of force (somehow police forces for years and years managed to find ways to control the situation *before* tasers and pepper spray, and *didn't* just shoot people in the head) then tasers as a tool for law enforcement wouldn't bother me.

But the "fact" that more often than ever we are hearing about dumb-ass cops and security guards are firing tasers and spraying pepper spray for punishment's sake makes me think that since y'all wont police yourselves, I'm all for taking your f'ing toys away until you know how to use them.
 
2013-08-09 04:12:54 PM

quietwalker: Threads like this make me want to smile and condescendingly pat some people on the head, like the children they appear to be.

We get it, you have decided that the police are your enemy; maybe you absorb youth culture like a sponge or perhaps engage in illegal activity of your own, and thus are a criminal.  Whatever the reason, you feel personally and directly threatened by the police, and so automatically view every act by the police not as upholding the law, but rather as a potential injury to your own person.

I especially enjoy when folks like this work against their own best interests, and advocate more lethal alternatives to devices like tasers, such as pepper spray (rarely used now a days), clubbing with nightsticks, asps or other device, or simple, straight up physically tacking and beating, all of which have a statistically higher injury and mortality rate than tasers.

Perhaps the most amusing of all is those who suggest that, because the crime is small in scope, the police should be negligent, or lazy, when they come across a perpetrator, especially one caught in the act.  The ones that use phrases like, "They should have just let him go."  If law enforcement is going to make a ruling like, "We won't chase you if you're involved in the commission of these crimes: ____" official, they are really making them legal.  If there's no enforcement of the law, there's no purpose to the law.

The fact that these claimants effectively want police to be able to have this power to subjectively determine which laws they should enforce or not is doubly amusing, given the standard distrust of law enforcement.  If I distrusted law enforcement, I certainly wouldn't want them to be able to effectively overrule both prior legislation and the entire judicial system on a whim.

Then again, the individuals who do suggest these views are thinking like children, after all.  It's all remedial 'Us vs. Them' with no rational basis other than the concept of opposing sides.


Beautiful Strawman. Lovingly constructed with Artisinal WheatStraw by a Licensed Bullshiat artist.

\it's so much easier to win your arguments when you can tell everyone what your opponents think
\\saves time, and conserves valuable electrons
 
2013-08-09 04:16:09 PM

quietwalker: more lethal alternatives to devices like tasers, such as pepper spray


Is that really true? The stats I can easily find show somewhere around 500 documented taser deaths in the US, vs. less than 100 for pepper spray... I suppose that could just be due to tasers being used more often than pepper spray... But, I'm curious what source you're going by to determine pepper spray is more lethal?
 
2013-08-09 04:17:36 PM
I've long wished they would declare open season on taggers. Nothing turns a nice are into a shiat hole faster than a bunch of graffiti. Costs millions each year to clean up.
 
2013-08-09 04:59:02 PM

CheapEngineer: Smackledorfer: CheapEngineer: Litterbox: snuff3r: You know, i would have felt some sympathy had I not read that he was involved in Graffiti. I have assholes graffiti my walls all the time and though obviously i don't believe capital punishment is the solution i certainly don't care of they get killed in the process if there was no intention to kill them.

Having said that, i disagree with state thugs carrying tasers. Horrible devices.

Those "horrible devices" have saved a lot of lives, prevented a lot of injuries and resolved an untold number of incidents where it could have gone a whole lot worse.  My department Tases people on a daily basis and we have yet to have anyone die.  And the officers that carry them are required to be Tasered every year.  Taser instructors have been Tased dozens of times.  Lets wait for the toxicology test to come back on this "artist".  My guess is cocaine.

[i706.photobucket.com image 271x271]

Difficulty: not from a Taser manufacturer or Police Department

\and not pulled out yer ass, like your statement above
\\it may take week, months or years but anyone who tases me will get tased back

Not that it is harmless, but statistically it is easily possible that a PD is tasering the shiat out of everyone in town and still not killing anyone.

As has been pointed out, damn near 100% of LEOs that carry have been tased and can tell you that the second it is over you get right back up feeling fine, then you get a little soreness the next day.  Adverse reactions certainly exist, but they really are quite rare.  The question is whether that rarity of occurrence should be grounds to raise the taser higher on the use of force than it is.  Answering that question should be based on something other than letting emotions defeat statistics. Emotions should NEVER be allowed to cloud one's judgement when it comes to statistical probabilities*.

*which doesn't mean emotions shouldn't factor into the decision you make, it doesn't matter how few people die, you are mor ...

You're comparing the response of a prepared, relaxed Police officer who *knows* there are trained personnel there to help them( and knows it's just a demonstration) - to someone who is at *minimum* seriously agitated and thinks, true or not, that they are running for their life and someone's tryibng to torture them.

Comparing the effect of a taser under controlled conditions with Real Life is silly, and pointless.

If I was sure that all police officers are well trained, thoughtful stewards of the law who considered each situation before using the appropriate amount of force (somehow police forces for years and years managed to find ways to control the situation *before* tasers and pepper spray, and *didn't* just shoot people in the head) then tasers as a tool for law enforcement wouldn't bother me.

But the "fact" that more often than ever we are hearing about dumb-ass cops and security guards are firing tasers and spraying pepper spray for punishment's sake makes me think that since y'all wont police yourselves, I'm all for taking your f'ing toys away until you know how to use them.


First, I am not a cop so I don't know why you are addressing me as one.

Second, your post is shenanigans.
 
2013-08-09 06:05:38 PM

anuran: Nobody deserves to die for petty vandalism. But stop romanticizing him. Taggers are like dogs pissing on fire hydrants except that taggers' mess is expensive to clean up


Who is romanticising him ?

(taggers are worse than dogs pissing, dog piss is easier to clean off)
 
2013-08-09 06:12:00 PM

dr_blasto: BummerDuck: I would be outraged if he was innocent.

1. He was vandalizing private property.
2. He resisted arrest.

No need to read further. Outcome was harsh, but avoidable by not being a punk. No loss to society IMO.

I disagree. Every time the cops use violence society loses. Every time someone dies from cop violence, society loses even more. They should have let the punk go.


Let him go? So he keeps trashing our stuff? My buddy had his truck get tagged right in his own driveway, twice in as many months. Cost close to two grand to have the panel repainted twice. A bunch of other victims in the same neighborhood were hit with tags on their homes and cars. The kind of human trash who vandalizes other people's property benefits nobody.
 
2013-08-09 06:13:00 PM

Smackledorfer: First, I am not a cop so I don't know why you are addressing me as one.


Don't remember calling you a cop. It's not generally an insult, but sorry regardless.

Second, your post is shenanigans.

xaxor.com

\Cheers!
 
2013-08-09 07:19:51 PM
Under no circumstances is vandalism an acceptable reason to put someone's life in danger.
 
2013-08-09 07:33:35 PM

parasol: Let's hope, someday, should fate throw you an unexpected death and leave your story to reporters, that you aren't judged by strangers who live far from where you did and want to assume the worst - and share that assumption - with many more strangers. You should have some dignity.
Let's hope that your unexpected death isn't because you committed a misdemeanor
Lets hope you don't have an older sister who loved you and has access to the web, too


Let's hope that you emulate your hero, get high, commit a misdemeanor and are confronted by the police.

Let's hope you miscalculate the dosage of whatever street drug you're on and it makes you irrational.

Let's hope that that your last act is to attack some police who have had their Tasers taken away because of bullshiat artists like yourself and so they use their service weapons to spray paint your brains onto whatever wall you happen to be running by as you attack them.

It wouldn't be ironic but it would be an unfortuitous coincidence.

No life is ever truly wasted, yours or his can always serve as a cautionary tale.  Don't be a dumbass.
 
2013-08-09 07:48:43 PM

koder: Under no circumstances is vandalism an acceptable reason to put someone's life in danger.


They tazed his ass and the weak little punk couldn't take it and died. The kid made a terrible decision and paid dearly for it, not the cops fault. Being an idiot is sometimes deadly.
 
Displayed 26 of 176 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report