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(The Epoch Times)   Despite denials from the government, foreign investment is fleeing China because it's becoming too expensive for many manufacturers - with many taking their factories elsewhere   (theepochtimes.com) divider line 105
    More: Interesting, foreign investment, South China Morning Post, China's National Bureau of Statistics, Guangdong, manufacturers, value-added taxes  
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2283 clicks; posted to Business » on 02 Aug 2013 at 1:07 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-08-03 03:29:11 PM  

FormlessOne: The All-Powerful Atheismo: This has been coming for years.  Look now to Vietnam, Bangladesh, Indonesia, etc.

Also China has a housing bubble that will make ours look as bad as a stain on an apartment floor.

"Will"? Hell, Chenggong has 100,000+ brand new, freshly built apartments without tenants, entire blocks of empty skyscrapers, and so on, and that's just in one city - China has plenty of "ghost cities". It's not a "housing bubble" - it's an expanding housing universe, about ready to collapse in upon itself in a marketing compression so complete not even corruption can escape.


Other than the fact that it's probably made from shiat materials that won't last that excess housing stock won't be a problem because the Chinese still have about a billion people living on the farm, that stock would probably be taken up in a month or two if they had jobs that would allow them to afford a place in the city. The fact is robot's are going to replace labor faster than a supply of cheap labor is exhausted in China or anywhere else. That's why manufacturing jobs aren't coming back into the midwest in droves, we produce more stuff today than we have since the early 1970's, be we do it with a fraction of the labor that was required back then (US steel production in 2011 was the highest since 1974 but it was produced with about 10% of the 1974 labor force)
 
2013-08-03 06:27:21 PM  

kab: No one in this thread will live to see it, but it will be a wonderful day when capitalism simply runs out of exploitable labor.  I'd love to see what winds up happening next.


Androids. The only thing that forstalled the automation craze of the 80's and 90's was the opening up of the trade and exploitable populations of the Third World. Now that cheap labor has run it's course, it's back to robots.
 
2013-08-03 07:48:56 PM  

Evil Twin Skippy: kab: No one in this thread will live to see it, but it will be a wonderful day when capitalism simply runs out of exploitable labor.  I'd love to see what winds up happening next.

Androids. The only thing that forstalled the automation craze of the 80's and 90's was the opening up of the trade and exploitable populations of the Third World. Now that cheap labor has run it's course, it's back to robots.


Hmm, I'm not an expert on robotics, but my impression is that there were damned few "pauses" in their progress over the past 30 years. Advances haven't been as startling and visible as some might have wanted, but it wasn't for lack of effort or money. Still, I agree with your conclusion: jobs lost to automation will never be regained.

Now the question is what to do about massive permanent unemployment and then, how to pay for it? The first is addressed in a fairly comprehensive manner in this article. The second in this one. We live in interesting times indeed.
 
2013-08-03 10:53:51 PM  

meyerkev: inglixthemad: Cepheus Crater: Well, looks like China will need to become innovators and producers in the world market instead of the cheap labor pool and knock-off kingdom.  Much harder to do, especially since innovation and new ideas do not usually proliferate under restrictive governments.

It also appears that Western corporations are beginning to run out of cheap labor on a worldwide scale, we'll all be paying full price for our crap in the future.  When that happens a world perma-recession may commence and never end.

I've heard perma-recession comments before, in my 1st year economics class. The teacher smacked that down quick.

Do you remember (in broad terms) roughly what the teacher said?  I'd be interested in hearing why the economists think that's bullshiat.




Because permanent recessions would require static conditions. We are nowhere near having purely (or remotely) static conditions. That's the broad view, he went into more detail about changes in technology, society, et al. Some of it being disruptive, other bits being supportive.
 
2013-08-03 11:58:12 PM  
The problem of no cheap labor and switching to robots to produce everything, is that there's no definable reason for the potential consumers of those products to have money to buy those items.

What happens to the potentially millions, if not billions, of humans that will eventually have no reason to really do anything because machines can do it all for them, and they only need to shove in some factory-food each day to keep alive?
 If robots can produce everything, and nobody has any money, the whole capitalist system collapses, because people without money can't "consume" and the profiteers can't profit because they already own everything, and potential buyers have no money unless the profiteers simply give it to them, for doing nothing in exchange.


I realize that ideal is the Star Trek way where nobody has to work unless they want to, but in real life we are all greedy "I got mine so fark you".

I generally expect all nations that reach this point or get close to it, will eventually start doing forced sterilizations at birth, or the one-child policy like China, to reduce the burden of these useless sacks of human flesh that exist for no particular reason.
 
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