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(Glamour Magazine)   If you look thinner in the mirror, would you hate your body less? What about if you knew the mirror did that on purpose?   (glamour.com) divider line 57
    More: Unlikely, mirror images, hate  
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1310 clicks; posted to Geek » on 31 Jul 2013 at 1:56 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-31 01:59:20 PM  
That's actually a pretty cool idea, but you'll just double down on saying how fat you look in every other situation where you see yourself.
 
2013-07-31 02:03:26 PM  
seems pretty stupid.  so you feel good about yourself while alone in the bathroom, and deciding what to wear.

then, the moment you're in public, you see your self as much fatter than you expected, wearing clothes that are inappropriate for your body type, and basically you just feel terrible.

/ better to feel terrible alone.  otherwise you'll endanger your relationships with other people.  and by endanger, i mean not make them.  i don't mean lose friends that actually exist.
 
2013-07-31 02:05:30 PM  
Put the fork down fatty
 
2013-07-31 02:06:03 PM  
Because self-delusion is healthy.
 
2013-07-31 02:09:10 PM  

pute kisses like a man: seems pretty stupid.  so you feel good about yourself while alone in the bathroom, and deciding what to wear.

then, the moment you're in public, you see your self as much fatter than you expected, wearing clothes that are inappropriate for your body type, and basically you just feel terrible.

/ better to feel terrible alone.  otherwise you'll endanger your relationships with other people.  and by endanger, i mean not make them.  i don't mean lose friends that actually exist.


I saw it more as a cheap way for people to get some self confidence, which would make more of a difference in their lives than the handful of pounds this mirror hides.
 
2013-07-31 02:11:56 PM  

Psychopusher: Because self-delusion is healthy.


Biatches be crazy.
 
2013-07-31 02:12:03 PM  

Bashar and Asma's Infinite Playlist: pute kisses like a man: seems pretty stupid.  so you feel good about yourself while alone in the bathroom, and deciding what to wear.

then, the moment you're in public, you see your self as much fatter than you expected, wearing clothes that are inappropriate for your body type, and basically you just feel terrible.

/ better to feel terrible alone.  otherwise you'll endanger your relationships with other people.  and by endanger, i mean not make them.  i don't mean lose friends that actually exist.

I saw it more as a cheap way for people to get some self confidence, which would make more of a difference in their lives than the handful of pounds this mirror hides.


Yeah, they leave the house with their head up and feeling good, thinking their gunt doesn't look so bad.
Then someone on the street calls them fatty, and they Rascal their way home.
 
2013-07-31 02:12:47 PM  
But would you ever want a mirror that skinnifies at home?

Of course you would, tubby. Then you never have to actually see how fat and disgusting you are. Unfortunately that's not the case for the rest of us.
 
2013-07-31 02:22:01 PM  

Pinner: Bashar and Asma's Infinite Playlist: pute kisses like a man: seems pretty stupid.  so you feel good about yourself while alone in the bathroom, and deciding what to wear.

then, the moment you're in public, you see your self as much fatter than you expected, wearing clothes that are inappropriate for your body type, and basically you just feel terrible.

/ better to feel terrible alone.  otherwise you'll endanger your relationships with other people.  and by endanger, i mean not make them.  i don't mean lose friends that actually exist.

I saw it more as a cheap way for people to get some self confidence, which would make more of a difference in their lives than the handful of pounds this mirror hides.

Yeah, they leave the house with their head up and feeling good, thinking their gunt doesn't look so bad.
Then someone on the street calls them fatty, and they Rascal their way home.


that's the way i picture it.  they have a false sense of confidence at home.  but the moment they walk outside and see their reflection in a window or real mirror, and that false confidence gets destroyed.

better to see yourself honestly at home so there's no shock at your real reflection in public.  in fact, it's probably better to have a fat mirror at home, so you look better in public.
 
2013-07-31 02:24:53 PM  
Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.
 
2013-07-31 02:27:13 PM  

meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.


Same logic applies to drug users.....but we still tell them to quit.
 
2013-07-31 02:30:40 PM  

Psychopusher: Because self-delusion is healthy.


The disturbing thing is that it probably is. The people with an accurate view of themselves are generally the ones who are clinically depressed.
 
2013-07-31 02:33:12 PM  
Would you do me? 'Cause I would do me so hard.
 
2013-07-31 02:36:19 PM  
Aren't mirror images the reason we typically hate seeing ourselves in pictures?

We're used to seeing ourselves in the mirror, and no one is actually symmetrical. The slight change in the "regular" view (as in a picture) makes us think something is wrong.

/This isn't on topic
 
2013-07-31 02:46:58 PM  

Psychopusher: Because self-delusion is healthy easier than improving exercise and diet habits.


FTFY.
 
2013-07-31 02:48:10 PM  

DirtyDeadGhostofEbenezerCooke: Would you do me? 'Cause I would do me so hard.


Before or after the lotion is applied to the skin?

/I giggled
 
2013-07-31 02:49:21 PM  

GoldSpider: Psychopusher: Because self-delusion is healthy easier than improving exercise and diet habits.

FTFY.


Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.

i.imgur.com
Click to embiggen
 
2013-07-31 02:51:16 PM  
Warning: Objects in mirror are less attractive than they appear.


/Lightspeed briefs
 
2013-07-31 02:53:20 PM  
Seinfeld reference!
 
2013-07-31 02:54:33 PM  
If you buy this mirror knowing that it will make you look skinnier than you are, doesn't that defeat the purpose?

How can you feel good about something you know is an inaccurate depiction of your body?
 
2013-07-31 02:55:18 PM  
Make me a mirror that gives me a normal hairline and a bit more muscle tone and I'd be happy - thinner really isn't in the cards for me.
 
2013-07-31 02:56:03 PM  

Elegy: Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.


Is that really a thing?
 
2013-07-31 02:56:03 PM  

Elegy: GoldSpider: Psychopusher: Because self-delusion is healthy easier than improving exercise and diet habits.

FTFY.

Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.

[i.imgur.com image 300x209]
Click to embiggen


...No.   Self delusion IS easier than the incredible amount of effort and willpower needed to work hard & diet.

And that privilege thing...ok, so it's never earned.  Then what IS earned by becoming fit & healthy?  Are you saying that we shouldn't treat people we'd like to breed with better than people we'd rather not?
 
2013-07-31 02:56:52 PM  

Lexx: Are you saying that we shouldn't treat people we'd like to breed with better than people we'd rather not?


Sure, but they have to pay!
 
2013-07-31 02:57:31 PM  

Elegy: GoldSpider: Psychopusher: Because self-delusion is healthy easier than improving exercise and diet habits.

FTFY.

Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.

[i.imgur.com image 300x209]
Click to embiggen


Holy cow, that's not Fat Acceptance.  That's Hatred of Healthy people, and a Loser.
 
2013-07-31 03:01:03 PM  

elchupacabra: Elegy: GoldSpider: Psychopusher: Because self-delusion is healthy easier than improving exercise and diet habits.

FTFY.

Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.

[i.imgur.com image 300x209]
Click to embiggen

Holy cow, that's not Fat Acceptance.  That's Hatred of Healthy people, and a Loser.


I have trouble believing that it's anything but sour grapes by fat people who are pissed off that attractive people are more desired by society.  What they don't get is that, unlike race, sex, or age, they DO have control over their body composition, and it's totally fair to judge someone based on that, and to assume that gluttons have other manifold character defects related to lack of impulse control.
 
2013-07-31 03:05:12 PM  

GoldSpider: Elegy: Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.

Is that really a thing?


Google proves it so, sadly enough.  Someone managed to pound out that crap on their blog, which, amazingly enough, is not full of typoes when the crusted cake and cheetos on their fingers hit alternate keys.

Suprised the blog doesn't post their "Dumbest Twat on the Internet" badge with pride.
 
2013-07-31 03:09:48 PM  

Lexx: elchupacabra: Elegy: GoldSpider: Psychopusher: Because self-delusion is healthy easier than improving exercise and diet habits.

FTFY.

Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.

[i.imgur.com image 300x209]
Click to embiggen

Holy cow, that's not Fat Acceptance.  That's Hatred of Healthy people, and a Loser.

I have trouble believing that it's anything but sour grapes by fat people who are pissed off that attractive people are more desired by society.  What they don't get is that, unlike race, sex, or age, they DO have control over their body composition, and it's totally fair to judge someone based on that, and to assume that gluttons have other manifold character defects related to lack of impulse control.


I'm fat and I know better than to have such a ridiculous attitude.  Then again, I'm probably in the "Healthy" or "Husky" level of fatness according to Gabriel Iglesias, and I bet this person's well past "DAMN" and waddling into "OH HELL NO" territory.
 
2013-07-31 03:12:50 PM  

meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.



How is that possible?

The body uses fuel for energy. If you consume less fuel than your body uses, it taps into the strategic fat reserve.

That sounds like "basic science" to me.
 
2013-07-31 03:16:13 PM  

LiberalWeenie: meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.


How is that possible?

The body uses fuel for energy. If you consume less fuel than your body uses, it taps into the strategic fat reserve.

That sounds like "basic science" to me.


1 - the body adapts by lowering its base metabolic rate.  The body likes to have a caloric surplus and can't abide a deficit - goes into starvation mode, making it very difficult to diet beyond the short term, and the rebound when you start eating "normally" is severe, as your base metabolism's lower so more of your calories goes to fat storage.
2 - food is now well understood to have a similar effect on the brain as opiate drugs.  When you're in a caloric deficit, you feel like you're starving all the time, & the cravings are insane.  And, unlike drugs, it's hard to avoid being in the presence of food, making it that much harder to "stay clean".
 
2013-07-31 03:17:30 PM  

meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.


Did we get these studies out of a Paula Deen cookbook or something?
 
2013-07-31 03:17:46 PM  

LiberalWeenie: meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.


How is that possible?

The body uses fuel for energy. If you consume less fuel than your body uses, it taps into the strategic fat reserve.

That sounds like "basic science" to me.



Your body develops a "set point".  When you go below that point, your appetite increases and your resting metabolism slows down.  It's not violating the laws of thermodynamics, but you do need to put in more mental and physical effort.
 
2013-07-31 03:19:18 PM  

LiberalWeenie: The body uses fuel for energy. If you consume less fuel than your body uses, it taps into the strategic fat reserve.

That sounds like "basic science" to me.


It's not that simple in that if you have a net deficit of calories, your body burns excess fat until it's gone.
 
2013-07-31 03:23:14 PM  
cschick2317
2013-07-31 02:54:33 PM


If you buy this mirror knowing that it will make you look skinnier than you are, doesn't that defeat the purpose?

How can you feel good about something you know is an inaccurate depiction of your body?

You mean you don't know any idiot who sets his clock/watch ahead ten minutes?
 
2013-07-31 03:23:38 PM  
Lexx:

1 - the body adapts by lowering its base metabolic rate.  The body likes to have a caloric surplus and can't abide a deficit - goes into starvation mode, making it very difficult to diet beyond the short term, and the rebound when you start eating "normally" is severe, as your base metabolism's lower so more of your calories goes to fat storage.
2 - food is now well understood to have a similar effect on the brain as opiate drugs.  When you're in a caloric deficit, you feel like you're starving all the time, & the cravings are insane.  And, unlike drugs, it's hard to avoid being in the presence of food, making it that much harder to "stay clean".


What is starvation mode? The body eats itself and you get dizzy and weak instead of burning fat? Because that doesn't sound like a good system.

If it's just a matter of the body screaming at you to eat, it still seems like if you work with a nutritionist so that you know you are actually not starving, it should be at least possible to do without surgery.

Obviously a lot of fat people are poor and don't have those resources, let alone access to high-nutrition, low-calorie food, but hypothetically...
 
2013-07-31 03:24:04 PM  

FrancoFile: Your body develops a "set point". When you go below that point, your appetite increases and your resting metabolism slows down. It's not violating the laws of thermodynamics, but you do need to put in more mental and physical effort.


Not only that but your body metabolizes carbs, fats, proteins, etc. at different rates and different times.  Knowledge of nutrition is more important than having a good exercise regimine.
 
2013-07-31 03:27:03 PM  

GoldSpider: Elegy: Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.

Is that really a thing?


Oh hell yes it is. everysmilealie is dead serious when she posts about thin privilege.

So. Have you checked your thin privilege today?
 
2013-07-31 03:34:00 PM  

Elegy: GoldSpider: Elegy: Take your hate filled thin privilege elsewhere.

Is that really a thing?

Oh hell yes it is. everysmilealie is dead serious when she posts about thin privilege.

So. Have you checked your thin privilege today?


Wow.  The phrase "your blog sucks" is almost tailor-made for that page.
 
2013-07-31 03:44:31 PM  

FrancoFile: LiberalWeenie: meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.


How is that possible?

The body uses fuel for energy. If you consume less fuel than your body uses, it taps into the strategic fat reserve.

That sounds like "basic science" to me.


Your body develops a "set point".  When you go below that point, your appetite increases and your resting metabolism slows down.  It's not violating the laws of thermodynamics, but you do need to put in more mental and physical effort.


The problem with this argument is that gastric bypass surgery is INCREDIBLY effective.

All the set point arguments and the 'metabolic changes' and 'starvation mode' arguments completely ignore the fact that the most effective treatment for obesity is to forcefully stop people from eating.  That's all it is.  You could eat the same calories, even in starvation mode, and lose weight just as effectively as someone with the surgery.

The only difference (aside from cost, of course) is that, without the surgery you have the option to overeat.  With the surgery, you'll be physically unable to do so for a long time (but determined people still manage to do so).

If what people are saying were actually true - the body would go through it's metabolic changes, reset the set point, enter starvation mode - and fat people would stay fat eating their 800-1200 calories per day, after their surgery.  But that doesn't happen.  People eat a lot less and their lose a lot of weight.  It's that simple.
 
2013-07-31 03:47:26 PM  

LiberalWeenie: What is starvation mode? The body eats itself and you get dizzy and weak instead of burning fat? Because that doesn't sound like a good system.


IIRC starvation mode is just that your body is more likely to store any bit of excess calories as fat and it ramps up the hunger drive when actually eating. So you store more and you eat more before you feel satiated.

If it's just a matter of the body screaming at you to eat, it still seems like if you work with a nutritionist so that you know you are actually not starving, it should be at least possible to do without surgery.

There is no "knowing you aren't starving" because the brain doesn't actually run this particular show. Your entire being screams for food despite objective knowledge. Another iirc: it takes about 2 years for your baseline to drop. So basically people need to tolerate the feeling that they are constantly hungry for almost 2 years. That takes an insane amount of self control to beat.
 
2013-07-31 03:47:36 PM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: FrancoFile: LiberalWeenie: meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.


How is that possible?

The body uses fuel for energy. If you consume less fuel than your body uses, it taps into the strategic fat reserve.

That sounds like "basic science" to me.


Your body develops a "set point".  When you go below that point, your appetite increases and your resting metabolism slows down.  It's not violating the laws of thermodynamics, but you do need to put in more mental and physical effort.

The problem with this argument is that gastric bypass surgery is INCREDIBLY effective.

All the set point arguments and the 'metabolic changes' and 'starvation mode' arguments completely ignore the fact that the most effective treatment for obesity is to forcefully stop people from eating.  That's all it is.  You could eat the same calories, even in starvation mode, and lose weight just as effectively as someone with the surgery.

The only difference (aside from cost, of course) is that, without the surgery you have the option to overeat.  With the surgery, you'll be physically unable to do so for a long time (but determined people still manage to do so).

If what people are saying were actually true - the body would go through it's metabolic changes, reset the set point, enter starvation mode - and fat people would stay fat eating their 800-1200 calories per day, after their surgery.  But that doesn't happen.  People eat a lot less and their lose a lot of weight.  It's that simple.


Other weird metabolic things happen with gastric bypass surgery - things that were unanticipated.  Gut bacteria ecosystem shifts & the children of moms who've had gastric bypass have metabolic changes too.
 
2013-07-31 03:50:18 PM  

Lexx: Fark_Guy_Rob: FrancoFile: LiberalWeenie: meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.


How is that possible?

The body uses fuel for energy. If you consume less fuel than your body uses, it taps into the strategic fat reserve.

That sounds like "basic science" to me.


Your body develops a "set point".  When you go below that point, your appetite increases and your resting metabolism slows down.  It's not violating the laws of thermodynamics, but you do need to put in more mental and physical effort.

The problem with this argument is that gastric bypass surgery is INCREDIBLY effective.

All the set point arguments and the 'metabolic changes' and 'starvation mode' arguments completely ignore the fact that the most effective treatment for obesity is to forcefully stop people from eating.  That's all it is.  You could eat the same calories, even in starvation mode, and lose weight just as effectively as someone with the surgery.

The only difference (aside from cost, of course) is that, without the surgery you have the option to overeat.  With the surgery, you'll be physically unable to do so for a long time (but determined people still manage to do so).

If what people are saying were actually true - the body would go through it's metabolic changes, reset the set point, enter starvation mode - and fat people would stay fat eating their 800-1200 calories per day, after their surgery.  But that doesn't happen.  People eat a lot less and their lose a lot of weight.  It's that simple.

Other weird metabolic things happen with g ...


Well......

That pretty much invalidates everything I've said.  My apologies.  I'll have to do some more reading on the topic.
 
2013-07-31 03:54:54 PM  

DerAppie: LiberalWeenie: What is starvation mode? The body eats itself and you get dizzy and weak instead of burning fat? Because that doesn't sound like a good system.

IIRC starvation mode is just that your body is more likely to store any bit of excess calories as fat and it ramps up the hunger drive when actually eating. So you store more and you eat more before you feel satiated.

If it's just a matter of the body screaming at you to eat, it still seems like if you work with a nutritionist so that you know you are actually not starving, it should be at least possible to do without surgery.

There is no "knowing you aren't starving" because the brain doesn't actually run this particular show. Your entire being screams for food despite objective knowledge. Another iirc: it takes about 2 years for your baseline to drop. So basically people need to tolerate the feeling that they are constantly hungry for almost 2 years. That takes an insane amount of self control to beat.


I'm thinking that 2 year thing is highly variant -- from a few months to several years.  Unlocking the science behind that will be awesome.
 
2013-07-31 03:57:38 PM  
There are people (people like me, for example) who  1. really like tasty food, and 2. really dislike strenuous exercise. They tend to look at very fit people with exemplary diets who work out all the time and say... that's just not me. I'm not like that. So I'm going to accept myself like this. And that's fine.

And it is fine. Until you're about 44 or so.

And then it all catches up with you, and you start to look and feel really awful. And it keeps getting worse. And worse, still. Until you no longer recognize the guy in the mirror.

For people like this, there is a good answer. Don't stop eating tasty foods... just eat 20 to 30% less of it next time. And don't start making yourself uncomfortable with ball-busting exercise every day. You'll just find an excuse to stop. So do what you can do, and stick to it.

It's not an all-or-nothing proposition. You don't have to become a health freak. Do what you can do. And then, do a little more the next day. Just a little.

It won't make you suddenly look "good" in the mirror. But it will make you continue to look like "you" in the mirror.

I swear by all that's righteous, you will reach a point where that sounds like a very good thing.
 
2013-07-31 03:57:55 PM  
Related:   http://www.drsharma.ca/early-glycemic-benefits-of-bariatric-surgery-a r e-largely-due-to-caloric-restriction.html

While this study attributes most of the immediate weight loss to the calorie restriction - it also mentions the changes Lexx was referring to.

the changes in gut hormones may well explain why patients with surgery are more successful in the long term in their ability to continue adhering to lower caloric intake and keeping the weight off.
 
2013-07-31 03:58:27 PM  

elchupacabra: I'm thinking that 2 year thing is highly variant -- from a few months to several years. Unlocking the science behind that will be awesome.


Yeah, I know for damn sure when I lost weight (~35lbs) that I didn't tolerate a gnawing, hungry feeling for two years.  I don't think I did for two weeks.
 
2013-07-31 04:13:27 PM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: Lexx: Fark_Guy_Rob: FrancoFile: LiberalWeenie: meanmutton: Is this the thread where people deny the basic science that says that in the long term the vast majority of people are unable to lose and keep weight off through diet and exercise alone?

Every study ever done on the topic comes up with the same result: once you get the weight, you're not going to lose it unless you get gastric bypass or some other invasive surgery.

Don't gain the weight in the first place, eat healthfully and exercise regularly and don't bother with the scale.


How is that possible?

The body uses fuel for energy. If you consume less fuel than your body uses, it taps into the strategic fat reserve.

That sounds like "basic science" to me.


Your body develops a "set point".  When you go below that point, your appetite increases and your resting metabolism slows down.  It's not violating the laws of thermodynamics, but you do need to put in more mental and physical effort.

The problem with this argument is that gastric bypass surgery is INCREDIBLY effective.

All the set point arguments and the 'metabolic changes' and 'starvation mode' arguments completely ignore the fact that the most effective treatment for obesity is to forcefully stop people from eating.  That's all it is.  You could eat the same calories, even in starvation mode, and lose weight just as effectively as someone with the surgery.

The only difference (aside from cost, of course) is that, without the surgery you have the option to overeat.  With the surgery, you'll be physically unable to do so for a long time (but determined people still manage to do so).

If what people are saying were actually true - the body would go through it's metabolic changes, reset the set point, enter starvation mode - and fat people would stay fat eating their 800-1200 calories per day, after their surgery.  But that doesn't happen.  People eat a lot less and their lose a lot of weight.  It's that simple.

Other weird metabolic things happen ...


Not arguing that.

a) I said it takes more MENTAL effort.
b) the setpoint is not magic, but it is a thing, and it affects how hungry you get.

After surgery, if you eat too much (ie more than half a cup), you puke.  Avoiding puke can be a stronger behavioral motivator than satisfying cravings.

If you want to go below your habitual weight, it takes willpower *or* a powerful external force to avoid the refrigerator.  Willpower can come from a diet buddy, 10-step program, self-motivation, whatever.  An external force is fat camp, hypnosis (sometimes), or surgery.  But fat camp doesn't last forever - unless you can get someone to do your shopping for you, and somehow get banned from every restaurant and convenience store, you need to internalize your motivation at some point.

/now that the painters are gone I can get back to exercising
//refrigerator is in good shape
///had wings and onion rings last night for the first time in 2 months
////need to lose about 20
 
2013-07-31 04:17:05 PM  

elchupacabra: DerAppie: LiberalWeenie: What is starvation mode? The body eats itself and you get dizzy and weak instead of burning fat? Because that doesn't sound like a good system.

IIRC starvation mode is just that your body is more likely to store any bit of excess calories as fat and it ramps up the hunger drive when actually eating. So you store more and you eat more before you feel satiated.

If it's just a matter of the body screaming at you to eat, it still seems like if you work with a nutritionist so that you know you are actually not starving, it should be at least possible to do without surgery.

There is no "knowing you aren't starving" because the brain doesn't actually run this particular show. Your entire being screams for food despite objective knowledge. Another iirc: it takes about 2 years for your baseline to drop. So basically people need to tolerate the feeling that they are constantly hungry for almost 2 years. That takes an insane amount of self control to beat.

I'm thinking that 2 year thing is highly variant -- from a few months to several years.  Unlocking the science behind that will be awesome.


Ofcourse it is highly variant, we are talking about people after all. I simply thought that went without saying. But the 2 year figure is all I remember so no standard deviation for you.

/Just like the 2500 calories
//Or the 200 grams of vegetables and 2 pieces of fruit a day
///No, 2 blue berries don't count
 
2013-07-31 04:28:05 PM  
"In God's own image, yessirree"
 
2013-07-31 04:40:28 PM  

Mr_Fabulous: There are people (people like me, for example) who  1. really like tasty food, and 2. really dislike strenuous exercise. They tend to look at very fit people with exemplary diets who work out all the time and say... that's just not me. I'm not like that. So I'm going to accept myself like this. And that's fine.

And it is fine. Until you're about 44 or so.

And then it all catches up with you, and you start to look and feel really awful. And it keeps getting worse. And worse, still. Until you no longer recognize the guy in the mirror.

For people like this, there is a good answer. Don't stop eating tasty foods... just eat 20 to 30% less of it next time. And don't start making yourself uncomfortable with ball-busting exercise every day. You'll just find an excuse to stop. So do what you can do, and stick to it.

It's not an all-or-nothing proposition. You don't have to become a health freak. Do what you can do. And then, do a little more the next day. Just a little.

It won't make you suddenly look "good" in the mirror. But it will make you continue to look like "you" in the mirror.

I swear by all that's righteous, you will reach a point where that sounds like a very good thing.


This is probably some of the best "diet" advice I've seen.  I tried quite a few of the fad diets, lost weight and then rebounded when I attempted to move away from the strict, short term restrictions to the easier, longer term restrictions.  I also tried cutting out all the "bad stuff" and exercising my butt off but every time, usually a month of so in, I'd lose patience and fall back into my old patterns.  Then I decided one day that rather than try to lose 100lbs by running and dieting, I was simply going to cut back on the bad things, but not eliminate them.  At the same time, I decided to incorporate some light exercise into my routine...nothing terribly strenuous but enough to get my heart rate up for at least 20 mins.  I'm happy to say that I've been more successful taking this route than I have with any other attempt.  I started almost 6 months ago and have lost just over 40 lbs.  It's not a massive amount of weight and I still have a long way to go, but this is an incredibly easy plan for me to stay on.  I may not be shedding the pounds rapidly but I can easily keep this up the rest of my life, meaning getting back to a healthy weight should be within my reach.  YMMV of course, but it's worked wonders for me.
 
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