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(Krypton Radio)   'Honor Harrington' books to become movie, but will Hollywood screw it up to appease the dumb people?   (kryptonradio.com) divider line 74
    More: Scary, Honor Harrington, stupidities, Weber State, design change, creative work, evergreens  
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1832 clicks; posted to Geek » on 31 Jul 2013 at 7:00 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-31 07:00:58 AM  
I'm going to go with big, loud asplosions in space and ignore anything that looks like tactics or strategy...

Don't get me wrong, the Honor Harrington series is kind of a guilty pleasure for me. Kind of like The Dresden Files. Not amazing books, but serviceable and fun, but I am sort of baffled at turning this series into film. They're chock full of dry facts and drawn out tactics and strategy, and that doesn't exactly bode well for staying true to the feel of the books in any way. The interpersonal stuff, the politics, they are going to be easier to access, but in as short a medium as film, that's going to be hard to cram in there as well. It's not a series that I ever thought would get a film. The Dresden Files got a TV series, and that didn't go over so well either, and I like the series well enough, and I sort of understand why it didn't go over so well, in that there's a LOT of back story to shove in there.

I kind of would like to see Peter F. Hamilton's Night's Dawn turned into a series though, because that at least has episodic structure that would do well for TV though. Honor Harrington? To be honest, I thought it would do better as a series, as opposed to film...
 
2013-07-31 07:27:06 AM  
Looks like they're starting with The Honor of the Queen.  I got bored and started reading the Honor books about 3 weeks ago, and I can feel the Death March feeling come over me as I'm now determined to finish the damn series since I've gotten to War of Honor.

I'm ambiguous about them trying to put the whole series into a collection of movies, but at least they're starting at one that won't require a lot of internal character aspects.  That will be harder to avoid in the later books, so those will probably suck.

Overall, eh.  I'm fine with loud asplosions in space and munching popcorn every now and then.  At the same time, I'm seriously pondering going to see Gravity based on the trailer that recently came out.  Debris moving through space at high velocity.  No sounds from explosions.  Sandra Bullock drifting out into space, maybe to never be seen again.  I can live with all of that.
 
2013-07-31 07:28:07 AM  
They're probably going to see how Ender's Game goes first.  If that's successful they might have a better chance at not having asplosions in space.
 
2013-07-31 07:33:57 AM  

Its the same concern I'd have with Enders game.

Not much combat, lots of talking, to be translated by an industry that thinks you need explosions to drive sales.
Of course their gonna FARK with it.

/If it was an explosion based script (see: pacific rim) then it'd be fine.
/...But I'm getting the sense that isn't the jist of the books.

 
2013-07-31 07:37:01 AM  
I suspect, much like Starship Troopers, the political overtones of the books will either be ignored or turned into a parody of themselves.
 
2013-07-31 07:37:50 AM  

hubiestubert: I'm going to go with big, loud asplosions in space and ignore anything that looks like tactics or strategy...

Don't get me wrong, the Honor Harrington series is kind of a guilty pleasure for me. Kind of like The Dresden Files. Not amazing books, but serviceable and fun, but I am sort of baffled at turning this series into film. They're chock full of dry facts and drawn out tactics and strategy, and that doesn't exactly bode well for staying true to the feel of the books in any way. The interpersonal stuff, the politics, they are going to be easier to access, but in as short a medium as film, that's going to be hard to cram in there as well. It's not a series that I ever thought would get a film. The Dresden Files got a TV series, and that didn't go over so well either, and I like the series well enough, and I sort of understand why it didn't go over so well, in that there's a LOT of back story to shove in there.

I kind of would like to see Peter F. Hamilton's Night's Dawn turned into a series though, because that at least has episodic structure that would do well for TV though. Honor Harrington? To be honest, I thought it would do better as a series, as opposed to film...


I'm going to go forward with cautious optimism, but knowing full well this might turn out to be another Wing Commander.
 
2013-07-31 07:48:31 AM  
As long as they don't have the fleet resembling flying dildoes (but...but, they're sword pummels!!!), it might end up OK. I think that the different classes of warships should have some 20th century reference object that tell you this warship is a carrier, such as a large superstrcuture, long lines (flight deck), etc.
 
2013-07-31 07:52:47 AM  
Appease the 'dumb people?'  I thought Hollywood was 'the dumb people.'

Still, the books are fun and I'll go see the movies.
 
2013-07-31 08:04:11 AM  
*sigh*

FINE, I'LL READ THE BOOKS.

/enjoyed the Starfire series
 
2013-07-31 08:07:09 AM  
'Honor Harrington' books to become movie, but will Hollywood screw it up to appease the dumb people?

Yes.

/what?  was this a trick question?
 
2013-07-31 08:18:42 AM  
I rather see a film adaptation of Orbital Decay by Allen Steele.. :)
 
2013-07-31 08:23:14 AM  
Yes. They will fark it up to appease the stupid.
 
2013-07-31 08:24:35 AM  

hubiestubert: I kind of would like to see Peter F. Hamilton's Night's Dawn turned into a series though, because that at least has episodic structure that would do well for TV though. Honor Harrington? To be honest, I thought it would do better as a series, as opposed to film...


way south: Its the same concern I'd have with Ender's Game.
Not much combat, lots of talking, to be translated by an industry that thinks you need explosions to drive sales.


I've come to the same conclusions over the last decade. The success of Game of Thrones further reinforces that belief... well-written science fiction would be far more successful as an HBO or Showtime series than as a blockbuster film franchise.

Personally, I'd love to see some Hammer's Slammers stories filmed Band Of Brothers-style.

Kimpak: They're probably going to see how Ender's Game goes first.  If that's successful they might have a better chance at not having asplosions in space.


The bad part is that poor box office results to Ender's Game might be caused by the "OMFG CARD IS A HOMOPHOBE!!1!" nonsense that has been circulating. If it really is as good as it looks, hopefully the first reviews and early word-of-mouth will prevent that from being the cause of box-office failure.

/nonsense because every author, actor, musician, director, and producer has stupid ideas and beliefs that don't come through in their work. Not because of the other thing.
 
2013-07-31 08:24:45 AM  

Frothy Panties: As long as they don't have the fleet resembling flying dildoes (but...but, they're sword pummels!!!), it might end up OK. I think that the different classes of warships should have some 20th century reference object that tell you this warship is a carrier, such as a large superstrcuture, long lines (flight deck), etc.


Ship design for dumb people.  Check.
 
2013-07-31 08:32:36 AM  

metatronarchetype: Frothy Panties: As long as they don't have the fleet resembling flying dildoes (but...but, they're sword pummels!!!), it might end up OK. I think that the different classes of warships should have some 20th century reference object that tell you this warship is a carrier, such as a large superstrcuture, long lines (flight deck), etc.

Ship design for dumb people.  Check.



Well, no. Just something that doesn't look like a gay sex toy for Galactus. Think Yamato....kind of.
 
2013-07-31 08:39:37 AM  

clkeagle: e bad part is that poor box office results to Ender's Game might be caused by the "OMFG CARD IS A HOMOPHOBE!!1!" nonsense that has been circulating. If it really is as good as it looks, hopefully the first reviews and early word-of-mouth will prevent that from being the cause of box-office failure.


Oh, right I forgot about that.  The sad part is Ender's Game has absolutely zero anti-gay views in it.  I hope it does well, I'll certainly throw my $8 + popcorn money at it.
 
2013-07-31 08:48:18 AM  

Kimpak: clkeagle: e bad part is that poor box office results to Ender's Game might be caused by the "OMFG CARD IS A HOMOPHOBE!!1!" nonsense that has been circulating. If it really is as good as it looks, hopefully the first reviews and early word-of-mouth will prevent that from being the cause of box-office failure.

Oh, right I forgot about that.  The sad part is Ender's Game has absolutely zero anti-gay views in it.  I hope it does well, I'll certainly throw my $8 + popcorn money at it.


None of the Ender/Bean (or Empire or Pastwatch) books do - hell, for a devout Mormon adult male, he's pretty good at writing from atheistic, child, and feminine POVs. As with all media, they should be liked or disliked by their own content instead of as a political protest.

Now, if the media is made as a political statement (Ayn Rand, etc) - protest away.
 
2013-07-31 08:49:09 AM  
It's another never-ending story from a churn-em-out author who's even subbed his work out to a syndicate in order to churn more out. What's left to dumb down?
 
2013-07-31 08:53:03 AM  
The first couple books were great, but by then end it got a little loopy.  I would like to see  Field of Dishonor.
 
2013-07-31 08:54:03 AM  

deadsanta: It's another never-ending story from a churn-em-out author who's even subbed his work out to a syndicate in order to churn more out. What's left to dumb down?


Did I miss the part where someone said they were going to film the most recent stories first?

All franchises become stale given enough time. Stories have endings for a reason.
 
2013-07-31 08:56:37 AM  
Never was a fan of Honor Harrington, I much preferred the War God series... Well the first two books in the series anyway. After that it just nosedives into horribleness, the only reason to read three onwards is just to see how dumb it gets.

/A horse? Really?
 
2013-07-31 09:02:49 AM  
Obvious tag on vacation, subby?
 
2013-07-31 09:09:55 AM  
I'm not a big sci fi reader. I mean, when I was a kid I was continually surrounded by books by Asimov, Niven, Heinlein, Adams, etc, but I fell out somewhere down the line. I stumbled upon the Honor series by accident and wound up reading one.

God damn it's a fun series. Now, I'm a history geek, so the whole Nelson thing really hit my sweet spot. I also liked the basic set up of the physics. The use of tactics in space warfare has always been dodgy. Perhaps it's the result of Star Wars, but very few movies have ever shown a tactical engagement on screen (Wrath of Khan being an exception.). Usually it's just a small scrappy ship that wins because the script demands it, not because the captain out maneuvers an opponent. The Honor series manages to make those battles fun, smart, and appreciative of the tactics used by Honor.

I'm sure the movie will wind up being more like the recent Star Trek with space ships fighting like pilots, and Kirk winning just because.
 
2013-07-31 09:20:54 AM  

clkeagle: Personally, I'd love to see some Hammer's Slammers stories filmed Band Of Brothers-style.



This.
 
2013-07-31 09:26:36 AM  
Aldenata series would make a better movie.
 
2013-07-31 09:57:09 AM  

hubiestubert: I kind of would like to see Peter F. Hamilton's Night's Dawn turned into a series


Shut up and take my money!
 
2013-07-31 10:07:03 AM  

clkeagle: I've come to the same conclusions over the last decade. The success of Game of Thrones further reinforces that belief... well-written science fiction would be far more successful as an HBO or Showtime series than as a blockbuster film franchise.

Personally, I'd love to see some Hammer's Slammers stories filmed Band Of Brothers-style.


I can agree to both of these.

While I know I'll catch flack for saying this: I wish the animation industry in the US would diverge more from kids films and do hard core sci-fi series.
These are all dependent on extreme settings and hard to cast characters. Animation is also relatively cheap compared to CGI heavy shows and movies that demand elaborate sets.
Some books like Man Kizin or Hammers slammers (and I'd even argue the Enders game series) would do better in twelve, hour long, episode format rather than a single movie.

Any series where there's lots of talking or character development simply doesn't fit inside a two hour movie limit.  You can't do an hour long slice of life while the audience is watching the clock and waiting for you to demolish some skyscrapers.
 
2013-07-31 10:14:34 AM  
please please please don't fark it up
 
2013-07-31 10:15:17 AM  

way south: While I know I'll catch flack for saying this: I wish the animation industry in the US would diverge more from kids films and do hard core sci-fi series.


Did you see the fairly recent CGI sequel to Starship Troopers?

It didn't completely suck at all.
 
2013-07-31 10:29:38 AM  

BullBearMS: way south: While I know I'll catch flack for saying this: I wish the animation industry in the US would diverge more from kids films and do hard core sci-fi series.

Did you see the fairly recent CGI sequel to Starship Troopers?

It didn't completely suck at all.


The Roughnecks series done a few years ago was fun. Not quite kid oriented and much more in line with the book for tone. And it brought the Skinnies in.

Damn Verhoeven for basically sh*tting on a book he hated, and then running a franchise into the ground.
 
2013-07-31 10:43:40 AM  
I'd like a Casca tv series on SpikeTV.

upload.wikimedia.org

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casca_(series)
 
2013-07-31 10:49:58 AM  

JakeStone: Looks like they're starting with The Honor of the Queen.  I got bored and started reading the Honor books about 3 weeks ago, and I can feel the Death March feeling come over me as I'm now determined to finish the damn series since I've gotten to War of Honor.


Likewise, though I'm on In Enemy Hands. I've read the Horatio Hornblower and Aubrey-Maturin serieses and Weber's definitely got a good homage working. It's fluff, but fun.

That said, they did a pretty terrible job with the Hornblower miniseries, and while Master and Commander was great, they squished events from three books into that one to get enough action to appease the masses. They'd probably have to do the same here.
 
2013-07-31 10:53:05 AM  
This sounds intriguing. Honor of the Queen does indeed have more action overall than On Basilisk Station...
 
2013-07-31 10:54:15 AM  
Never did like the HH books. The character was just too perfect.

Try Bujolds Vor series . Much much better
 
2013-07-31 11:01:01 AM  
just finished A Rising Thunder. Weber gets way too enamored with the politics of his universe. if I want to read sci fi political machinations and failures, I'll read CJ Cherryh's foreigner books, Bujold's Vorkosigan saga, Dune, or any number of other things.

Horatio Hornblower wasn't all about French internal divisions even when he was captured by the Frogs. in the later books especially, Weber devotes chapter after chapter to side characters and enemy POV shiat that takes away from big assplosions.

that being said, I've read the main Honor Harrington books and generally like them.
 
2013-07-31 11:01:25 AM  

BullBearMS: way south: While I know I'll catch flack for saying this: I wish the animation industry in the US would diverge more from kids films and do hard core sci-fi series.

Did you see the fairly recent CGI sequel to Starship Troopers?

It didn't completely suck at all.


Not as bad as the movie sequels, about as good as the first movie, not as good as Roughnecks.

Could tell it was japanese by the heavy emphasis on tits and lack of physics.
 
2013-07-31 11:03:19 AM  

CujoQuarrel: Never did like the HH books. The character was just too perfect.


"Captain Harrington, you've done your duty and saved the system! So, we're going to knight you, give you six different medals, grant you control over 1/80th of the planet, elevate you above an earl, give you a trillion-dollar bounty, name our children after you, promote you to Admiral, make you the royal protector, have every left-handed person become your slave, pass a law making it illegal to say your name without 'praise be unto her', annoint you as a saint..."
 
2013-07-31 11:04:51 AM  

BullBearMS: way south: While I know I'll catch flack for saying this: I wish the animation industry in the US would diverge more from kids films and do hard core sci-fi series.

Did you see the fairly recent CGI sequel to Starship Troopers?

It didn't completely suck at all.


Well, there's a great idea.

WB has had decent success with the DC Animated Universe Films - and most of them are hard-PG13. Maybe they would take a chance on another celebrated genre franchise with the right arm-twisting. For $20-25 million a film, it should be possible to run a pretty solid (and moderately profitable) franchise with extremely high-quality animation, recognizable voice talent, etc. Do a loss-leading, limited theatrical release to generate interest, and make up the rest of the budget in home media sales and video game tie-ins.

Even for Ender's Game, my belief was that it would have been done better as a Titan AE-quality animated film (so the kids could actually age) than as a live-action blockbuster.
 
2013-07-31 11:14:33 AM  

Theaetetus: CujoQuarrel: Never did like the HH books. The character was just too perfect.

"Captain Harrington, you've done your duty and saved the system! So, we're going to knight you, give you six different medals, grant you control over 1/80th of the planet, elevate you above an earl, give you a trillion-dollar bounty, name our children after you, promote you to Admiral, make you the royal protector, have every left-handed person become your slave, pass a law making it illegal to say your name without 'praise be unto her', annoint you as a saint..."


she's like a sexually repressed version of Danaerys Targaryen.

with super bionic powers.

sometimes, though, the Horatio Hornblower "ha hmm" humility works for Harrington, and sometimes it's just off.
 
2013-07-31 11:31:50 AM  
I liked the Harrington books a lot until he reached the armistice and the Prime Minister's death. Ashes of Victory, I think. After that there was more and more politics and less and less military sci-fi. Buying a 500-page "space opera" book and having about thirty pages devoted to actual space battles didn't sit well, and he's only gotten more and more off the spacework track and into the political side. And he needs an editor, unless he's being paid by the pound these days.

And the Armageddon Reef stories are even worse in the verbiage category. Everybody thinks out loud and the story moves waaaay too slowly. Like with most Weber books, the ideas are interesting but the execution/progression is getting slower and slower as the volumes mount. For a tighter (and sometimes funnier) take on the reclaiming civilization theme, I would recommend David Drake's Bellevue series. The General is the first book, I think.

Also - Weber used to drop hunks of exposition into the strangest places in his early books. In the first book there's an eight-page aside on the total 2000-year history of hyperspace travel which supposedly trips through Hamish Alexander's mind as he waits to gear up for battle. One of the biggest verbal speedbumps I have ever run over. Took me right out of the story.

Who would play Honor Harrington?
 
2013-07-31 11:36:32 AM  

Frothy Panties: As long as they don't have the fleet resembling flying dildoes (but...but, they're sword pummels!!!), it might end up OK. I think that the different classes of warships should have some 20th century reference object that tell you this warship is a carrier, such as a large superstrcuture, long lines (flight deck), etc.


In the books the ships were described as having a hammerhead at either end, the cover artist seemed to think that meant "Double ended dildo!". If I recall rightly it was a plot point that they couldn't tell the difference between a super dreadnought and a carrier until it started launching missiles, or light attack craft.
 
2013-07-31 11:40:44 AM  
who would play Honor Harrington?

some blonde, probably. with big hooters. I don't think the studios would go with someone who looked too much like a Chinaman.

seriously... Mila Kunis? maybe one of them younger Filipina actresses if they want to be more "authentic"?

I wonder if the queen will transform into a white chick.
 
2013-07-31 11:43:49 AM  

Jormungandr: If I recall rightly it was a plot point that they couldn't tell the difference between a super dreadnought and a carrier until it started launching missiles, or light attack craft.


Yes, but not because of the physical similarities... It was because, at that point, they're a tiny dot a million kilometers away, so optical pickups and radar don't resolve any detail, so you've just got this blip on gravitics. When it suddenly launches 100 missiles in a salvo, you know it's not a LAC.

The main way they determined size at distance was based on acceleration, since bigger ships were slower... which meant that a slow moving small ship could be easily mistaken for a big ship.
 
2013-07-31 11:45:16 AM  
I was under the impression that Honor Harrington novels were already targeted towards dumb people.
 
2013-07-31 11:53:18 AM  

Handsome B. Wonderful: I was under the impression that Honor Harrington novels were already targeted towards dumb people.


they aren't fancy navel gazing speculative fiction. they aren't full on mil pr0n schlock fests either.

some people might be too hip to read the Honor Harrington books, though.
 
2013-07-31 12:13:55 PM  

legion_of_doo: who would play Honor Harrington?

some blonde, probably. with big hooters. I don't think the studios would go with someone who looked too much like a Chinaman.

seriously... Mila Kunis? maybe one of them younger Filipina actresses if they want to be more "authentic"?

I wonder if the queen will transform into a white chick.


Audrey Plaza if she were 6' tall
 
2013-07-31 12:21:28 PM  

CujoQuarrel: Never did like the HH books. The character was just too perfect.

Try Bujolds Vor series . Much much better


I liked the series for the space battles, which were tactical fun to read, and the politics was interesting. However, Honor made me want Weber shoot her and continue on with the rest of the series without her.

Can Honor beat the best swordsman on a planet using a style she's never trained in? Yes.

Can Honor beat a professional gunman with only her regular training (apparently done in-between all of her military duties)? Yes.

Can she be the most perfect, gracious, poised, intelligent, annoying character ever? Yes.
 
2013-07-31 02:02:18 PM  

Theaetetus: The main way they determined size at distance was based on acceleration, since bigger ships were slower... which meant that a slow moving small ship could be easily mistaken for a big ship.


Or in one notable case:

Let's make it look like our faster bigger ships with the (secret) new engines are actually just as fast smaller ships with the old (known) engines.

/CD's are here with every book up until Mission of Honor:  http://baencd.thefifthimperium.com/ - Grab the zip repository and start reading.
 
2013-07-31 02:35:20 PM  

legion_of_doo: who would play Honor Harrington?

some blonde, probably. with big hooters. I don't think the studios would go with someone who looked too much like a Chinaman.

seriously... Mila Kunis? maybe one of them younger Filipina actresses if they want to be more "authentic"?

I wonder if the queen will transform into a white chick.


I'll probably be drummed out of Fark for saying this, but I've just started reading the HH books for the first time, and a couple of days ago read the description of her in the first book and thought that it sounded a lot like, uhm, gulp;

Tila Tequila
 
2013-07-31 02:37:57 PM  

GRCooper: legion_of_doo: who would play Honor Harrington?

some blonde, probably. with big hooters. I don't think the studios would go with someone who looked too much like a Chinaman.

seriously... Mila Kunis? maybe one of them younger Filipina actresses if they want to be more "authentic"?

I wonder if the queen will transform into a white chick.

I'll probably be drummed out of Fark for saying this, but I've just started reading the HH books for the first time, and a couple of days ago read the description of her in the first book and thought that it sounded a lot like, uhm, gulp;

Tila Tequila


... except for having a shaved head and being 6' tall with a relatively flat chested athletic build, yeah. But you got the fact that she has almond-shaped eyes right.
 
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