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(Krypton Radio)   The R-rated Batman fan film on the Joker's origin we've all been waiting for   (kryptonradio.com) divider line 47
    More: Plug, Joker, fan films, Batman, Batman fan, Rated R  
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4065 clicks; posted to Geek » on 31 Jul 2013 at 10:39 AM (51 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



47 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2013-07-31 09:54:03 AM
Alright, I'll be the first to say it. They're trying to deliver a product few people want. The Joker works better with no origin story. He's an enigma, a force of nature that should not have motivation beyond wanting to cause pure chaos.

Or to put it in Joker's own words: "Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another...if I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"
 
2013-07-31 10:12:29 AM

scottydoesntknow: Alright, I'll be the first to say it. They're trying to deliver a product few people want. The Joker works better with no origin story. He's an enigma, a force of nature that should not have motivation beyond wanting to cause pure chaos.

Or to put it in Joker's own words: "Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another...if I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"



Brian Bolland did the best Joker origin there is.  I like the idea of no back story but if there has to be an origin, his should be it...

s11.postimg.org
 
2013-07-31 10:41:34 AM

UberDave: scottydoesntknow: Alright, I'll be the first to say it. They're trying to deliver a product few people want. The Joker works better with no origin story. He's an enigma, a force of nature that should not have motivation beyond wanting to cause pure chaos.

Or to put it in Joker's own words: "Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another...if I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"


Brian Bolland did the best Joker origin there is.  I like the idea of no back story but if there has to be an origin, his should be it...

[s11.postimg.org image 560x457]


Well, to be fair, Bolland had a little help from a writer named Alan Moore on that one.
 
2013-07-31 10:52:45 AM

UberDave: scottydoesntknow: Alright, I'll be the first to say it. They're trying to deliver a product few people want. The Joker works better with no origin story. He's an enigma, a force of nature that should not have motivation beyond wanting to cause pure chaos.

Or to put it in Joker's own words: "Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another...if I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"


Brian Bolland did the best Joker origin there is.  I like the idea of no back story but if there has to be an origin, his should be it...

[s11.postimg.org image 560x457]


Got a link for it? The only one I've heard is the Red Hood opener, and Killing Joke specifically rejects a specific origin story.
 
2013-07-31 11:01:48 AM
That looks interesting enough.  I'll watch it, even if I do prefer the Joker not to have a backstory.  He's a better villain as a horrific force of nature/chaos than as someone it's possible to empathize with, or at least understand.
 
2013-07-31 11:03:36 AM
Ignoring how you feel about the theme I'd say this looks to be more watchable than 90% of what Hollywood puts out nowadays. Nice to see a film that puts story and characters first.
 
2013-07-31 11:04:37 AM

poonesfarm: Well, to be fair, Bolland had a little help from a writer named Alan Moore on that one.


Who considered it a piece of crap himself.
 
2013-07-31 11:15:09 AM
Just how many friggin origin stories does the Joker need?
 
2013-07-31 11:18:26 AM

scottydoesntknow: The Joker works better with no origin story.


Exactly.  That's the same reason I hated Rob Zombie's take on Halloween.
 
2013-07-31 11:48:12 AM
If he must have one, I like the idea of pissed off veteran. At least in regards to his most recent incarnation.
 
2013-07-31 12:06:35 PM
Oh good, another movie with "rising" in the title.  "Rise," "fall," and "fallen" are over used too.
 
2013-07-31 12:09:14 PM
After watching it, I've far too many problems with the origin this puts forth. It requires retconning an entire universe.

Harley Quinn was an MD, a psychiatrist at Arkham who fell for the Joker. Having her show up before Joker is, well, the Joker doesn't make sense. Having her as a prostitute with Riddler as her pimp makes even less sense- retcon out her origin like that and a lot of what makes the character work simply doesn't. Harley's supposed to be a bit different, someone on the good side of the coin who went bad. Starting her out this way kills most of what makes her an interesting character.

Ditto Croc- he was a force of nature himself, and was never as normal as the movie makes him out to be. Hell, Croc worked for Joker in the early days, but it's clear Joker was pretty established when Croc made his criminal debut.

Then we have his name. Cyrus. Cyrus Gold was the name of Solomon Grundy before he was reanimated, not Joker's real name.

What can I say? Interesting concept, but it simply doesn't work for me. Create Joker's origin if you want, but changing everyone else's origin stories to fit it isn't how to do it.

I love the version in the Killing Joke. "The point is, I went crazy. When I saw what a black awful joke the world was, I went crazy as a coot! I admit it! Why can't you?"

/Why aren't you laughing?
 
2013-07-31 12:17:36 PM
Speaking of contrived lines.
"Ever dance with the devil in the pale moonlight?"
Hmm, I just log into Fark, and get the untrusted connection warning when I try to use Google.
That untrusted connection warning sure seems to show up a lot after visiting this site.
/noticing a pattern here.
 
2013-07-31 12:31:26 PM

Kurmudgeon: Speaking of contrived lines.
"Ever dance with the devil in the pale moonlight?"
Hmm, I just log into Fark, and get the untrusted connection warning when I try to use Google.
That untrusted connection warning sure seems to show up a lot after visiting this site.
/noticing a pattern here.


It's the ads, I think.  I use AdBlock, and never get it.
 
2013-07-31 12:32:23 PM

ColSanders: scottydoesntknow: The Joker works better with no origin story.

Exactly.  That's the same reason I hated Rob Zombie's take on Halloween.


I never saw RZ's version, though the original offers enough of an origin story that I don't fully understand your comment.
 
2013-07-31 12:36:21 PM

Sword and Shield: UberDave: scottydoesntknow: Alright, I'll be the first to say it. They're trying to deliver a product few people want. The Joker works better with no origin story. He's an enigma, a force of nature that should not have motivation beyond wanting to cause pure chaos.

Or to put it in Joker's own words: "Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another...if I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"


Brian Bolland did the best Joker origin there is.  I like the idea of no back story but if there has to be an origin, his should be it...

[s11.postimg.org image 560x457]

Got a link for it? The only one I've heard is the Red Hood opener, and Killing Joke specifically rejects a specific origin story.


It's subjective.  And I can't link to something that is subjective.  The "specific rejection" is literally quoted in the message I responded to.  I think most people consider the origin story in the book to be from the writer's or story's perspective rather than one of the realities in the Joker's head.  It doesn't really matter as it is personal preference and personally, I like the origin story presented in the Killing Joke (as did a great many people when it was first released).

On a side note, when the Joker said, basically, that he doesn't remember and that he prefers it to be multiple choice, I considered that to be simply part of his insanity.  He was driven nuts and doesn't really know why (or doesn't want to know) any longer.
 
2013-07-31 12:50:39 PM
"Hey kid, you did alright kid.  Bring the kid in, let's have a chat with the kid. Kid, you do right by me and you'll be set. Kid, why the fark do I keep saying the word 'kid'?"

That trailer was awful, I kid you not.
 
2013-07-31 12:52:44 PM
That trailer could have used a heavy dose of editing.  And I get that it's an ultra-low budget fan film, but it didn't look all that interesting (at least not near the level of "wow" the blog author is proclaiming).
 
2013-07-31 12:58:36 PM

Thunderboy: I never saw RZ's version, though the original offers enough of an origin story that I don't fully understand your comment.


Carpenter simply showed Michael as a boy killing his older sister, with no explanation of motive or reason.  RZ showed much more of Michael's childhood and basically explained away his turn to evil to be a result of child abuse.  The mystery of the sudden turn to evil is gone you're left with an angry abuse victim.

For more botched origin stories, see also: Star Wars prequels.

That's how I see a Joker origin story.  I don't want to know how he got those scars.
 
2013-07-31 12:59:29 PM
Side topic, but if any Batman game should be M rated, the new Arkham Origins should be it. Every trailer I've seen has something that pushes the boundaries of a T rating, let along the Batman character (dropping a guy head first into a Christmas tree potentially breaking his neck, smashing a guy's face into a fuse box with a closeup of the flashlight he was holding in his mouth lodged in his jaw with blood, counting how many more ribs he can break in a guy he is beating up, etc). I know the 60s Batman may not be commercially viable, but I feel this is more the Punisher than the Caped Crusader.

Burton's Batman may have broken the defining rule for the character, but at least he put his foes out of their misery.

/my 0.02 cents
 
2013-07-31 01:30:04 PM

scottydoesntknow: Alright, I'll be the first to say it. They're trying to deliver a product few people want. The Joker works better with no origin story. He's an enigma, a force of nature that should not have motivation beyond wanting to cause pure chaos.

Or to put it in Joker's own words: "Sometimes I remember it one way, sometimes another...if I'm going to have a past, I prefer it to be multiple choice!"


Done in one. What window licker thought anyone was clamoring for a Joker origin?,
 
2013-07-31 01:43:05 PM
I'm sure Warner Brothers', the Rolling Stones', and Blondie's lawyers signed off on all this.
 
2013-07-31 02:28:59 PM

ColSanders: Thunderboy: I never saw RZ's version, though the original offers enough of an origin story that I don't fully understand your comment.

Carpenter simply showed Michael as a boy killing his older sister, with no explanation of motive or reason.  RZ showed much more of Michael's childhood and basically explained away his turn to evil to be a result of child abuse.  The mystery of the sudden turn to evil is gone you're left with an angry abuse victim.


Ah, gotcha.  Yeah, that definitely ruins it.
 
2013-07-31 02:36:14 PM
This was crap.

Not even a good idea. Just crap. Everything about it shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the characters involved. Really, it's not even fanwank. It's a bunch of guys who wanted to turn Batman into Reservoir Dogs starring a group of mooks whose acting chops make them good enough to be stand-ins for Sharknado 2: Shark Harder. Everything about this sucks. Everything.

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: I'm sure Warner Brothers', the Rolling Stones', and Blondie's lawyers signed off on all this.


And THIS, too. Create your own farking Intellectual Property and make crappy movies about that. "Fan film" is just a nice way to say "stolen characters and concepts."
 
2013-07-31 02:40:43 PM

Electrify: Side topic, but if any Batman game should be M rated, the new Arkham Origins should be it. Every trailer I've seen has something that pushes the boundaries of a T rating, let along the Batman character (dropping a guy head first into a Christmas tree potentially breaking his neck, smashing a guy's face into a fuse box with a closeup of the flashlight he was holding in his mouth lodged in his jaw with blood, counting how many more ribs he can break in a guy he is beating up, etc). I know the 60s Batman may not be commercially viable, but I feel this is more the Punisher than the Caped Crusader.

Burton's Batman may have broken the defining rule for the character, but at least he put his foes out of their misery.

/my 0.02 cents


You sound like you need more tampons in your bra grandma.
 
2013-07-31 02:45:05 PM
"It's the ads, I think. I use AdBlock, and never get it."

Thanks, I never considered that. Looks like I may be joining the AdBlock users soon.
 
2013-07-31 02:47:26 PM
And to really nitpick, I wouldn't expect to see palm trees in Gotham City. Even if Nolan couldn't make up his mind if the city was supposed to be Chicago, Manhattan, or some place fictional, all depictions I've seen put it in a temperate zone.
 
2013-07-31 02:49:48 PM
Fail...... Harley Quinn is one of the dumbest contrivances forced on Batman fans ever. You may now commence telling me how I'm a troll/take shiat too seriously.
 
2013-07-31 02:59:58 PM

ScaryBottles: Fail...... Harley Quinn is one of the dumbest contrivances forced on Batman fans ever. You may now commence telling me how I'm a troll/take shiat too seriously.


Does contrivance mean fark puppet?
 
2013-07-31 03:08:14 PM

muteidiotsavant: Just how many friggin origin stories does the Joker need?


Was it the one about the abusive father? Or the one about the runaway mom. Oh yeah, "there was only one time I ever saw dad really happy. He took me to the ice show when I was seven."
 
2013-07-31 03:15:57 PM

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: And to really nitpick, I wouldn't expect to see palm trees in Gotham City. Even if Nolan couldn't make up his mind if the city was supposed to be Chicago, Manhattan, or some place fictional, all depictions I've seen put it in a temperate zone.


Current DC canon places Gotham City in New Jersey.


ScaryBottles: Fail...... Harley Quinn is one of the dumbest contrivances forced on Batman fans ever. You may now commence telling me how I'm a troll/take shiat too seriously.



I'm kind of annoyed by her, too. She's the Venom of DC: Take a popular character, twist them a bit, and give them a trait that appeals to teenage boys.

The only good thing about Quinn was Arleen Sorkin's performance on the Animated Series, and even that wore thin after too much exposure.
 
2013-07-31 03:20:36 PM

Electrify: Side topic, but if any Batman game should be M rated, the new Arkham Origins should be it. Every trailer I've seen has something that pushes the boundaries of a T rating, let along the Batman character (dropping a guy head first into a Christmas tree potentially breaking his neck, smashing a guy's face into a fuse box with a closeup of the flashlight he was holding in his mouth lodged in his jaw with blood, counting how many more ribs he can break in a guy he is beating up, etc). I know the 60s Batman may not be commercially viable, but I feel this is more the Punisher than the Caped Crusader.

Burton's Batman may have broken the defining rule for the character, but at least he put his foes out of their misery.

/my 0.02 cents


The whole not killing people is a newer thing anyway. Bats killed quite a few people in the early days.
 
2013-07-31 03:52:29 PM

Luse: Electrify: Side topic, but if any Batman game should be M rated, the new Arkham Origins should be it. Every trailer I've seen has something that pushes the boundaries of a T rating, let along the Batman character (dropping a guy head first into a Christmas tree potentially breaking his neck, smashing a guy's face into a fuse box with a closeup of the flashlight he was holding in his mouth lodged in his jaw with blood, counting how many more ribs he can break in a guy he is beating up, etc). I know the 60s Batman may not be commercially viable, but I feel this is more the Punisher than the Caped Crusader.

Burton's Batman may have broken the defining rule for the character, but at least he put his foes out of their misery.

/my 0.02 cents

The whole not killing people is a newer thing anyway. Bats killed quite a few people in the early days.


That's true. I actually like how Schumacher tried to take Batman back to his "golden rule" in Forever from Burton's productions, and how he warns Dick about the path of revenge (even if he does kill Two-Face at the end). In the end, it made the 90s storylines follow the progression in the comics quite well - even if it concludes unfortunately with extra campy Batman in Batman and Robin (and this is someone who likes campy Batman).

With Miller and Origins, it is like trying to have your cake and eat it too. Batman might not kill the bad guy, but is having him spend the rest of his life in a wheelchair while suffering from serious brain injury is arguably worse.
 
2013-07-31 03:58:17 PM

Electrify: (even if he does kill Two-Face at the end).


He didn't kill Two-Face in the end. All he did was throw up a bunch of random coins when Two-Face went to flip his coin. It was Two-Face's own obsession with his precious coin that led to his death.
 
2013-07-31 04:37:27 PM

Thunderboy: ColSanders: Thunderboy: I never saw RZ's version, though the original offers enough of an origin story that I don't fully understand your comment.

Carpenter simply showed Michael as a boy killing his older sister, with no explanation of motive or reason.  RZ showed much more of Michael's childhood and basically explained away his turn to evil to be a result of child abuse.  The mystery of the sudden turn to evil is gone you're left with an angry abuse victim.

Ah, gotcha.  Yeah, that definitely ruins it.


It wasn't quite that. It showed Myers as an animal killer as a kid who was also from an abusive and broken home. Dr. Loomis explained (in the movie) that it was the volatile combination of Myers' predisposition (via nature) towards cruelty, mixed with his environment ("nuture"), that created the monster that he became. That narrative is similar to the real life hit-man and/or serial killer "the Iceman" depending on which series of interviews with him one interprets as truthful. I think Zombie's approach was interesting, but came off as "Hey, I just read a few chapters from a Psych 101 textbook and now I can make a serial killer origin story!"

I thought that it had a few half decent moments, but the second one, oh dear God, was the most contrived piece of garbage that I ever saw in a theater. The altered cut on DVD was slightly less awful, but there was no saving that crap fest. For a brief second I thought that "Superbeasto" might have redemeed him, but then I turned it off after twenty godawful minutes.

/Devil's Rejects still rocks though
 
2013-07-31 06:04:12 PM

Luse: The whole not killing people is a newer thing anyway. Bats killed quite a few people in the early days.


The last time Batman killed anyone, was in 1940, so it's hardly a "newer" thing. He only killed for the first 2 years of publication, then Bob Kane decided to change it up with the addition of Robin.
 
2013-07-31 06:56:25 PM
Yeah, I don't really care because this.
 
2013-07-31 08:53:56 PM
Yeesh.
 
2013-07-31 08:56:09 PM
The Joker origin in The Killing Joke was perfect - you actually felt sorry (up to a point) for the poor bastard, and the punch line at the end was priceless.  But I think the part that has always stayed with me is the concept Moore came up with of "...one bad day".
 
2013-07-31 10:48:19 PM

AtlanticCoast63: The Joker origin in The Killing Joke was perfect - you actually felt sorry (up to a point) for the poor bastard, and the punch line at the end was priceless.  But I think the part that has always stayed with me is the concept Moore came up with of "...one bad day".


It's a situation worthy of Satan in Paradise Lost. And the best part is, Jim Gordon refutes it. Tricksy, the Joker is. Who knows if that backstory (some kind of One Bad Day in any variation) is true, or if he believes it to be true, or if it's just more shiat to mindfark everyone with.
 
2013-07-31 11:53:55 PM

muteidiotsavant: Just how many friggin origin stories does the Joker need?


None? I'm good with none.

I've always assumed that the Joker is a crazy psychotic nut-bar because HE JUST IS. No cause. No origin. Sometimes things just happen, and Joker is a bad thing that just happened. I don't know or care if this idea is canon or fits into the overall Batman universes at all; to me it is the best "explanation" of the Joker. The line from the Dark Knight, "Some men just want to watch the world burn" is a sufficient description of the Joker's motivations. No reasons. No causes. He just does it, because is just is the Joker.

I mean, think of the Joker in Batman: TAS or in the Arkham games. Does that seem a character in need of an origin story to you? What he is and what he does explains everything about him. There doesn't need to be a story about how he became that way, and I think it is better for the character that he just is that way because in the randomness of the universe there is just going to be such a character. It's good enough that way, even better than having some half-assed traumatic event made him bad type origin story.

So, yeah... I may be able to respect the hard work of the people making this movie, but have absolutely no desire to see the movie itself.
 
2013-08-01 12:17:07 AM
You know what back story was really dumb? The one in Burton's Batman. It was one of the dumb retcons where the hero's nemesis comes from his origin. And by doing so, Nicholson Joker is like, 10-20 years older than Batman. Napier killed Bruce's parents in Crime Alley, then later became the Joker? Cool at the time, totally stupid later as you think about it.
 
2013-08-01 12:48:46 AM
It's true, Batsy! I know everything. And kinda like the kid who peeks at his Christmas presents, I must admit, it's sadly anti-climactic. Behind all the sturm and batarang, you're just a little boy in a playsuit, crying for mommy and daddy! It'd be funny if it weren't so pathetic. [pause] Oh, what the heck, I'll laugh anyway! HA HA HA HA HA HAA!
 
2013-08-01 01:16:44 AM

scottydoesntknow: Electrify: (even if he does kill Two-Face at the end).

He didn't kill Two-Face in the end. All he did was throw up a bunch of random coins when Two-Face went to flip his coin. It was Two-Face's own obsession with his precious coin that led to his death.


Taking an action likely to lead to someone else's death, even if by their own hand, when you don't need to take the action in self defense, is murder in my book.

Y morals mv.
 
2013-08-01 01:47:47 AM

Fano: You know what back story was really dumb? The one in Burton's Batman. It was one of the dumb retcons where the hero's nemesis comes from his origin. And by doing so, Nicholson Joker is like, 10-20 years older than Batman. Napier killed Bruce's parents in Crime Alley, then later became the Joker? Cool at the time, totally stupid later as you think about it.


While I agree with you about the connection/origin, I gotta admit that I really liked Nicholson as the Joker. He had some great lines and delivery of those lines ("Where does he get those wonderful toys?") and all around was a fun Joker. So, even though I don't think of it seriously with regards to the Batman universe (I know it's a huge universe, but my main connection is through The Animated Series, so that is "canon" to me), I like that movie. It was fun. :)
 
2013-08-01 08:30:50 AM

Electrify: how he warns Dick about the path of revenge (even if he does kill Two-Face at the end)


Gah, talk about farking duplicitous, contradictory bullshiat.

B: "Dick, you can't kill Two-Face, it's wrong!"
R: "You're right Bruce, I was dumb."
B: "Cool, now watch ME kill Two-Face."
 
2013-08-01 09:06:44 AM

DeArmondVI: Thunderboy: ColSanders: Thunderboy: I never saw RZ's version, though the original offers enough of an origin story that I don't fully understand your comment.

Carpenter simply showed Michael as a boy killing his older sister, with no explanation of motive or reason.  RZ showed much more of Michael's childhood and basically explained away his turn to evil to be a result of child abuse.  The mystery of the sudden turn to evil is gone you're left with an angry abuse victim.

Ah, gotcha.  Yeah, that definitely ruins it.

It wasn't quite that. It showed Myers as an animal killer as a kid who was also from an abusive and broken home. Dr. Loomis explained (in the movie) that it was the volatile combination of Myers' predisposition (via nature) towards cruelty, mixed with his environment ("nuture"), that created the monster that he became. That narrative is similar to the real life hit-man and/or serial killer "the Iceman" depending on which series of interviews with him one interprets as truthful. I think Zombie's approach was interesting, but came off as "Hey, I just read a few chapters from a Psych 101 textbook and now I can make a serial killer origin story!"

I thought that it had a few half decent moments, but the second one, oh dear God, was the most contrived piece of garbage that I ever saw in a theater. The altered cut on DVD was slightly less awful, but there was no saving that crap fest. For a brief second I thought that "Superbeasto" might have redemeed him, but then I turned it off after twenty godawful minutes.

/Devil's Rejects still rocks though


I still say House of 1000 Corpses is a good film, if you assume it's meant to be a comedy.
 
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