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(Blogger.com)   On Steubenville, Trayvon, and raising kids: The best thoughts from a smrt mom you will read all day   (geekreflection.blogspot.com) divider line 420
    More: Interesting, Teach Your Children, Edtech, short skirt, George Zimmerman, Skittles, credible threat, current events  
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7241 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Jul 2013 at 8:57 AM (52 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-30 12:26:58 AM
Your blog doesn't suck.

/pretty sure this is the same blog I said didnt suck after the Aurora shooting analysis
//farking jesuits and their hoity-toity critical thinking...
 
2013-07-30 12:35:40 AM
In before the "stand your ground wasnt used!!1!" crowd. 
Yeah she incorrectly cites it as part of the case.
Didnt affect the point of TFA.
 
2013-07-30 08:25:25 AM

Laocoon: Your blog doesn't suck.


A rare event indeed, but this blog seems to be quite good. At least this post.
 
2013-07-30 08:44:26 AM
FTFA: What was it about that night that justified his fear in the eyes of a jury? Trayvon, 160 pounds and armed only with a bag of Skittles, was not perceived as a credible threat based on superior physical strength or overwhelming firepower. The jury accepted that Trayvon posed a threat because he was young and male and black.

Stopped reading there. Your blog sucks. Martin posed a credible threat because he was on top of Zimmerman, beating the tar out of him, and Zimmerman had the injuries and witnesses to prove it. In other words, he was perceived as a threat exactly because of his superior physical strength.

This is what passes for "smart" these days? Sheesh. That's frightening.
 
2013-07-30 08:49:56 AM
Elegy: nuh uh
 
2013-07-30 08:57:23 AM

Elegy: Zimmerman had the injuries


Not really. Experts disagreed. If you wanted the black kid to be every embodiment of why you fled to the suburbs or refuse to move to the city, then yes, he was about to kill him.
 
2013-07-30 09:00:07 AM
The early commentary on the verdict has been revealing. From a legal standpoint, the verdict seems to be justified in light of Florida's controversial "stand your ground" law.

Fail, fail, fail. So sick of this. Why are people so dumb? SYG had nothing to do with the case. Christ.
 
2013-07-30 09:01:07 AM
It is an interesting commentary on race relations in this country.  Even though I think she's got the whole Zimmerman thing dead wrong, the overall sentiment is fairly spot on.
 
2013-07-30 09:01:29 AM
Maybe it was due to lack of evidence and witnesses that the jury found Zimmerman not guilty.

As opposed to evidence that demonstrated he was clearly innocent of any wrong-doing.

Reasonable doubt, how does it work?
 
2013-07-30 09:01:46 AM
"...aimed his gun at..."

Sucky blog sucks.
 
2013-07-30 09:01:50 AM
I cannot believe the amount of people that pass off TM as a crown jewel of the human race.

/As blogs go, that wasn't too shabby
 
2013-07-30 09:02:28 AM

Thunderpipes: The early commentary on the verdict has been revealing. From a legal standpoint, the verdict seems to be justified in light of Florida's controversial "stand your ground" law.

Fail, fail, fail. So sick of this. Why are people so dumb? SYG had nothing to do with the case. Christ.


Because they want to cry about dead a dead babby, not acknowledge that there are kids who do stupid shiat and end up paying the price for it.

/there's more to it than that.
 
2013-07-30 09:03:05 AM
Ask yourself this

Had Martin been white, would George have pursued him with the same vigor?

...just saying
 
2013-07-30 09:03:06 AM

Elegy: he was perceived as a threat


The truth is it had gone beyond a threat and into an active attack at the time the shot was fired.
 
2013-07-30 09:04:24 AM
Maybe 17 year old black kids can be violent? Why does everyone seem to think this is somehow odd? Age, race, SYG, nothing to do with any of it.

Race baiting will tear this country apart.
 
2013-07-30 09:04:38 AM
'The early commentary on the verdict has been revealing. From a legal standpoint, the verdict seems to be justified in light of Florida's controversial "stand your ground" law.'

And done... Gawd D@mn Farking Hell you arsewipes. It had zero, nada, nothing to do with SYG. Nothing. This person is another fine example of why laws will never change because they don't which laws they want to change. Idiots.
 
2013-07-30 09:05:26 AM
She's an idiot if she thinks not letting her girls wear short skirts will protect her girls against rape. It's a crime of power not of attraction. Her girls face as high or even higher chance of being a victim to that crime as her friend's sons do of being shot in Florida.
 
2013-07-30 09:05:52 AM
Trayvon's mom wants SYG laws changed too. Even the mother has no idea what is going on, or is intentionally stirring up crap. So does the DOJ. No way they can be that stupid. Intentional race baiting. And most liberals buy it, keeps them in power, and the cycle continues. Sucks.
 
2013-07-30 09:07:13 AM

WTFDYW: I cannot believe the amount of people that pass off TM as a crown jewel of the human race.

/As blogs go, that wasn't too shabby


As opposed to George Zimmerman, the guy who has been arrested multiple times, beat his girlfriend, couldn't hold down a job and writes semicoherent garbage like this:

Im still free! The ex hoe tried her hardest, but the judge saw through it! Big Mike, reppin the Dverse security makin me look a million bucks, broke her down! Thanks to everyone for checkin up on me! Stay tuned for the A.T.F. charges......2 felonies dropped to 1 misdemeanor! The man knows he was wrong but still got this hump, Thanks to everyone friends and fam, G baby you know your my rock!

Of course, I'm not going to accuse you of trying to "pass off GZ as a crown jewel of the human race" because that would be an embarrassingly poor strawman, and I'm better than that.
 
2013-07-30 09:07:37 AM

IdBeCrazyIf: Ask yourself this

Had Martin been white, would George have pursued him with the same vigor?

...just saying


He didn't pursue him.
 
2013-07-30 09:07:40 AM
What a dumb coont.
 
2013-07-30 09:07:56 AM

Laocoon: Your blog doesn't suck.


Yes it does.  (well, at least this specific post does)

Attempting to make and apples to apples comparison between the Ohio Rape Case and the Shooting of Trayvon is disingenuous at best.  Parenting failures are perhaps the only commonality that may link the two situations, and even at that, it is probably a stretch.

Concerning Steubenville, OH - There was corruption, coercion, and cover-ups all over town.  From the local police, to the coaches, to the parents, teachers, and school administrators.  Parents allowed their teenage boys to become little shiats and not respect women.

I am pretty surprised that the woman who wrote this piece somewhat plays into the rape culture...she mentions "asking for it"  and "minimizing the risk" when wearing a short skirt.

As for Trayvon, his mother sent him from Miami to his father's house in Sanford because she could no longer control her hairpin triggered, violent, disrespectful, post smoking teenage son.  Trayvon (unknowingly) brought fists to a gun fight and got himself dead.

This blog post is crap.  "Oh look, I know one well to do black family, so I have the authority and perspective to discuss the plight of the modern black man."  Total bullshiat!  GTFO of here lady.

Protecting one's teenage daughters from rapey teenage boys I am sure is a challenge and a fear that parents face.  I get it.  But it is not even in the same ballpark as raising black teen boys.

As for black parents protecting their teenage sons?  How about shaming the already heavily glorified intercity, ghetto, black stereotypes?  There is nothing cool or progressive about hating that which is "traditionally white" like studying hard, trusting police, not being a thief, not "blazin' it up wit yo homies," being non-violent, using ones words to solve and workout differences, self improvement, aiming for college and a career after...

Florida's self defense laws are not the reason Trayvon is dead.  Trayvon is the reason Trayvon is dead.  Trayvon and many, many other young black men have been raised in a black culture that promotes fiscal irresponsibility, misogyny, drinking and drug useage, drug sales, hatred of police, hatred of the white man, the idea of being the king of the ghetto is somehow better than just simply being a productive member of society, the use of violence to solve any problem, domestic violence, disrespect of any authority figure, and hatred of white culture.

There are vast differences between both situations here.  Look, I get where she is trying to go with this post, but she ain't there...

/flame on
 
2013-07-30 09:08:51 AM
And I am sure Trayvon would go to bat against the local police to defend a white guy killed by a black man.........

The two people are not comparable at all. Remember, jury was not allowed to hear anything about Martin's past, and the kid seems like a murderer waiting to happen.
 
2013-07-30 09:10:11 AM

IdBeCrazyIf: Ask yourself this

Had Martin been white, would George have pursued him with the same vigor?

...just saying


Interesting point. Also if George had been black, would Martin have tried to attack him or would he have respected the possibility of danger and hightailed it home?

We'll never know.
 
2013-07-30 09:12:44 AM
If Martin hadn't attacked Zimmerman he'd be alive today.

But he did.

So he's not.

A good parent will look at that case and advise "Don't attack strangers".  Anything other than that is retarded.
 
2013-07-30 09:13:46 AM

Endive Wombat: Laocoon: Your blog doesn't suck.

Yes it does.  (well, at least this specific post does)

Attempting to make and apples to apples comparison between the Ohio Rape Case and the Shooting of Trayvon is disingenuous at best.  Parenting failures are perhaps the only commonality that may link the two situations, and even at that, it is probably a stretch.

Concerning Steubenville, OH - There was corruption, coercion, and cover-ups all over town.  From the local police, to the coaches, to the parents, teachers, and school administrators.  Parents allowed their teenage boys to become little shiats and not respect women.

I am pretty surprised that the woman who wrote this piece somewhat plays into the rape culture...she mentions "asking for it"  and "minimizing the risk" when wearing a short skirt.

As for Trayvon, his mother sent him from Miami to his father's house in Sanford because she could no longer control her hairpin triggered, violent, disrespectful, post smoking teenage son.  Trayvon (unknowingly) brought fists to a gun fight and got himself dead.

This blog post is crap.  "Oh look, I know one well to do black family, so I have the authority and perspective to discuss the plight of the modern black man."  Total bullshiat!  GTFO of here lady.

Protecting one's teenage daughters from rapey teenage boys I am sure is a challenge and a fear that parents face.  I get it.  But it is not even in the same ballpark as raising black teen boys.

As for black parents protecting their teenage sons?  How about shaming the already heavily glorified intercity, ghetto, black stereotypes?  There is nothing cool or progressive about hating that which is "traditionally white" like studying hard, trusting police, not being a thief, not "blazin' it up wit yo homies," being non-violent, using ones words to solve and workout differences, self improvement, aiming for college and a career after...

Florida's self defense laws are not the reason Trayvon is dead.  Trayvon is the reason Trayvo ...





You will branded a racist pretty quick for your post. Despite being 100% correct
 
2013-07-30 09:15:40 AM

s2s2s2: He didn't pursue him.


s12.postimg.org

\yes because getting out of your car and following someone isn't pursuing him of course
 
2013-07-30 09:16:08 AM
The jury accepted that Trayvon posed a threat because he was young and male and black.

i.imgur.com
 
2013-07-30 09:16:11 AM

Endive Wombat: trusting police


lolwut
 
2013-07-30 09:17:05 AM
She repeats all of the discredited talking points not supported by the evidence. Sorry folks, she is an idiot twat.
 
2013-07-30 09:17:24 AM

Thunderpipes: The early commentary on the verdict has been revealing. From a legal standpoint, the verdict seems to be justified in light of Florida's controversial "stand your ground" law.

Fail, fail, fail. So sick of this. Why are people so dumb? SYG had nothing to do with the case. Christ.


Except for the fact that at least one member of the jury has publicly said that SYG was a factor in her decision to acquit the defendant. In which case, in spite of SYG not being something brought up by the lawyers, it WAS a part of the case. It doesn't have to be a huge part or even the main part, but it was a part of this case to someone who was intimately involved in the trial. Making it kind of a relevant issue.

Did the author of TFA articulate the case and the verdict, particularly the what and why, perfectly and accurately? No. Was her description, therefore, wholly inaccurate? No.
 
2013-07-30 09:18:22 AM

cabbyman: If Martin hadn't attacked Zimmerman he'd be alive today.

But he did.

So he's not.

A good parent will look at that case and advise "Don't attack strangers".  Anything other than that is retarded.




A good parent wouldn't have let thier suspended from school son wander the streets that night. Or fail to look for him for hours
 
2013-07-30 09:19:24 AM

Mid_mo_mad_man: You will branded a racist pretty quick for your post. Despite being 100% correct


Whatever.  If that is what people want to think, well that is fine by me.  I am trying to be as objective as possible and if my observations do not fit into someones world view, that is their problem not mine.
 
2013-07-30 09:20:34 AM

Endive Wombat: Laocoon: Your blog doesn't suck.

Yes it does.  (well, at least this specific post does)

Attempting to make and apples to apples comparison between the Ohio Rape Case and the Shooting of Trayvon is disingenuous at best.  Parenting failures are perhaps the only commonality that may link the two situations, and even at that, it is probably a stretch.

Concerning Steubenville, OH - There was corruption, coercion, and cover-ups all over town.  From the local police, to the coaches, to the parents, teachers, and school administrators.  Parents allowed their teenage boys to become little shiats and not respect women.

I am pretty surprised that the woman who wrote this piece somewhat plays into the rape culture...she mentions "asking for it"  and "minimizing the risk" when wearing a short skirt.

As for Trayvon, his mother sent him from Miami to his father's house in Sanford because she could no longer control her hairpin triggered, violent, disrespectful, post smoking teenage son.  Trayvon (unknowingly) brought fists to a gun fight and got himself dead.

This blog post is crap.  "Oh look, I know one well to do black family, so I have the authority and perspective to discuss the plight of the modern black man."  Total bullshiat!  GTFO of here lady.

Protecting one's teenage daughters from rapey teenage boys I am sure is a challenge and a fear that parents face.  I get it.  But it is not even in the same ballpark as raising black teen boys.

As for black parents protecting their teenage sons?  How about shaming the already heavily glorified intercity, ghetto, black stereotypes?  There is nothing cool or progressive about hating that which is "traditionally white" like studying hard, trusting police, not being a thief, not "blazin' it up wit yo homies," being non-violent, using ones words to solve and workout differences, self improvement, aiming for college and a career after...

Florida's self defense laws are not the reason Trayvon is dead.  Trayvon is the reason Trayvo ...


THIS,

Also, this blog sucks
 
2013-07-30 09:20:56 AM
FTFA: "The jury accepted that Trayvon posed a threat because he was young and male and black."

No the jury accepted he posed a threat because a witness saw him on top of Zimmerman punching him in the face while Zimmerman screamed for help and no one came.
 
2013-07-30 09:22:35 AM

IdBeCrazyIf: s2s2s2: He didn't pursue him.

[s12.postimg.org image 103x91]

\yes because getting out of your car and following someone isn't pursuing him of course


follow |ˈfälō|
verb [ with obj. ]
1 go or come after (a person or thing proceeding ahead); move or travel behind: she went back into the house, and Ben followed her | [ no obj. ] : he was following behind in his car.
go after (someone) in order to observe or monitor: the KGB man followed her everywhere.

pursue |pərˈsoo|
verb ( pursues , pursuing , pursued ) [ with obj. ]
1 follow (someone or something) in order to catch or attack them: the officer pursued the van | figurative : a heavily indebted businessman was being pursued by creditors.

That is correct. Following is not pursuing, but pursuing is following with intent.

What you are getting wrong is intent.
 
2013-07-30 09:23:24 AM

Rapmaster2000: As opposed to George Zimmerman, the guy who has been arrested multiple times, beat his girlfriend, couldn't hold down a job and writes semicoherent garbage like this


You used to be somebody.
 
2013-07-30 09:24:45 AM

Thunderpipes: The early commentary on the verdict has been revealing. From a legal standpoint, the verdict seems to be justified in light of Florida's controversial "stand your ground" law.

Fail, fail, fail. So sick of this. Why are people so dumb? SYG had nothing to do with the case. Christ.


The Tampa Bay tribune has an article comparing this case with SYG outcomes:

http://www.tampabay.com/stand-your-ground-law/cases/case_139

Brief summary: they go through a set of characteristics common to SYG cases, and even though the words "Stand your ground" may not have been used, there seems to be a fair amount of overlap with SYG cases:

Did the victim initiate the confrontation? (no)

Was the victim armed? (no)

Was the victim committing a crime that led to the confrontation? (no)

Did the defendant pursue the victim? (yes)

Could the defendant have retreated to avoid the conflict? (yes)

Was the defendant on his or her property? (no)

I am not a lawyer - what's your read on this?
 
2013-07-30 09:25:01 AM

s2s2s2: What you are getting wrong is intent.


No, he was pursuing him with the intent to catch what he perceived was a possible burglar based on previous incidents in the neighborhood. I never once implied the intent was to attack.

Stop mincing words, and if you are a lawyer..retire because you're a crappy one.
 
2013-07-30 09:25:15 AM

Kome: it WAS a part of the case.


Correct. What people should be saying is "The defense was not based on SYG, but on self defense laws that were on the books for decades longer than SYG, and would still be on the books if SYG were to be repealed."
 
2013-07-30 09:26:50 AM

s2s2s2: Rapmaster2000: As opposed to George Zimmerman, the guy who has been arrested multiple times, beat his girlfriend, couldn't hold down a job and writes semicoherent garbage like this

You used to be somebody.


Hey, man, George Zimmerman is a THUG.  I don't know why people just won't admit it.  It's because the PC Police won't let us say anything mean about the Mexicans.  They're even letting these people break our laws and become citizens.
 
2013-07-30 09:27:26 AM

IdBeCrazyIf: No, he was pursuing him with the intent to catch


No he wasn't, and this was well established in court.

I don't need to be a lawyer, I just need to be informed. He called the police to do the pursuing.
 
2013-07-30 09:27:50 AM

IdBeCrazyIf: Ask yourself this

Had Martin been white, would George have pursued him with the same vigor?

...just saying


Had Martin been white, would still have jumped Zimmerman from the shadows?

...just saying
 
2013-07-30 09:28:51 AM

IdBeCrazyIf: s2s2s2: What you are getting wrong is intent.

No, he was pursuing him with the intent to catch what he perceived was a possible burglar based on previous incidents in the neighborhood. I never once implied the intent was to attack.

Stop mincing words, and if you are a lawyer..retire because you're a crappy one.


Did Zimmerman try and catch any of the other people he called the dispatcher about? Why do you think Martin was any different than the other people he reported/followed?
 
2013-07-30 09:29:03 AM
If we would just reinstitute sundown towns, this never would have happened. That way no black people would be allowed out after dark, and if they violate the curfew, then armed citizens would be justified in shooting them for the scary, dangerous creature they are.

It's really for their own protection.

/Sadly, some people really believe this.
 
2013-07-30 09:29:20 AM

Rapmaster2000: Hey, man, George Zimmerman is a THUG.  I don't know why people just won't admit it.  It's because the PC Police won't let us say anything mean about the Mexicans.  They're even letting these people break our laws and become citizens.


farm3.static.flickr.com
 
2013-07-30 09:29:44 AM

Endive Wombat: Florida's self defense laws are not the reason Trayvon is dead. Trayvon is the reason Trayvon is dead. Trayvon and many, many other young black men have been raised in a black culture that promotes fiscal irresponsibility, misogyny, drinking and drug useage, drug sales, hatred of police, hatred of the white man, the idea of being the king of the ghetto is somehow better than just simply being a productive member of society, the use of violence to solve any problem, domestic violence, disrespect of any authority figure, and hatred of white culture.


You seem to have the ability to read Trayvon's mind and life story. May I ask your sources for the specifics of Trayvon's upbringing re: fiscal irresponsibility, misogyny, etc.? How did, for example, Trayvon promote "domestic violence"? Do you have evidence that Trayvon disrespected "any authority figure", or did he just disrespect specific ones?


the idea of being the king of the ghetto is somehow better than just simply being a productive member of society, the use of violence to solve any problem, domestic violence, disrespect of any authority figure, and hatred of white culture.
 
2013-07-30 09:31:04 AM

Elegy: FTFA: What was it about that night that justified his fear in the eyes of a jury? Trayvon, 160 pounds and armed only with a bag of Skittles, was not perceived as a credible threat based on superior physical strength or overwhelming firepower. The jury accepted that Trayvon posed a threat because he was young and male and black.

Stopped reading there. Your blog sucks. Martin posed a credible threat because he was on top of Zimmerman, beating the tar out of him, and Zimmerman had the injuries and witnesses to prove it. In other words, he was perceived as a threat exactly because of his superior physical strength.

This is what passes for "smart" these days? Sheesh. That's frightening.


Say I'm walking home in the dark, and an SUV tails me for blocks and then an angry guy with a gun confronts and then attacks me.  If I fight back, its my fault?

Zimmerman, a known vigilante, untrained in how to handle conflict or deal with the public in any way, unnecessarily and against police orders confronted at 16 year old in the dark.  Given Zimmerman was the adult, and the one who forced the conflict, he bears the brunt of the responsibility for the escalation of that conflict, and thus the majority of the responsibility for the resulting death.  Martin probably contributed to the conflict as well, but was not primarily responsible, given his age and the fact he had been stalked in the dark, and thus had reason to believe he was being attacked.
 
2013-07-30 09:31:27 AM

draypresct: Endive Wombat: Florida's self defense laws are not the reason Trayvon is dead. Trayvon is the reason Trayvon is dead. Trayvon and many, many other young black men have been raised in a black culture that promotes fiscal irresponsibility, misogyny, drinking and drug useage, drug sales, hatred of police, hatred of the white man, the idea of being the king of the ghetto is somehow better than just simply being a productive member of society, the use of violence to solve any problem, domestic violence, disrespect of any authority figure, and hatred of white culture.

You seem to have the ability to read Trayvon's mind and life story. May I ask your sources for the specifics of Trayvon's upbringing re: fiscal irresponsibility, misogyny, etc.? How did, for example, Trayvon promote "domestic violence"? Do you have evidence that Trayvon disrespected "any authority figure", or did he just disrespect specific ones?


the idea of being the king of the ghetto is somehow better than just simply being a productive member of society, the use of violence to solve any problem, domestic violence, disrespect of any authority figure, and hatred of white culture.


Whups - I'd copied parts of your post into my reply, and something went wrong. That last paragraph (a copy of some of your text I decided not to use) should not have been there. Sorry if I caused any confusion.
 
2013-07-30 09:32:34 AM
Ye gods, this argument again.

Lets just put the following points out there:

SYG deals with the duty to retreat, and says if you are lawfully allowed to be in a place, you do not have to attempt to leave the situation before using deadly force. It does not apply in this case because, according to witness testimony, TM was on top of GZ at the time the shot was fired. He could not retreat, so it does not apply.

Use of lethal force doesn't require imminent death in order for it to be justifiably used. The perception of a reasonable fear of imminent bodily harm is all that is needed. The fact that GZ had head injuries, while minor after the fact, have been shown in edge cases to be fatal, can easily be used to demonstrate reasonable fear.
 
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