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(NBC News)   Study finds Obamacare won't kill jobs or cut hours, except in the fantasy world in which Republicans live   (nbcnews.com) divider line 296
    More: Obvious, Republican, obamacare, Douglas Holtz-Eakin, health education, White Castle, CEPR, ACA, Dean Baker  
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3102 clicks; posted to Politics » on 28 Jul 2013 at 10:46 AM (37 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-28 07:55:14 AM
So this study concludes that, because employers haven't cut hours yet, it means they're not going to when the mandate goes into effect 2 years from now? Doesn't sound like good science to me.
 
2013-07-28 09:01:00 AM
The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research

About as credible as an endorsement from Alec Baldwin, Michael Moore, Sean Penn, Matt Damon and Susan Sarandon.

Wait, that's pretty much the whole cast
 
2013-07-28 09:40:54 AM

serial_crusher: So this study concludes that, because employers haven't cut hours yet, it means they're not going to when the mandate goes into effect 2 years from now? Doesn't sound like good science to me.


It's about as reliable as the GOP's foregone conclusions that Obamacare is guaranteed to fail, therefore they must keep wasting time and taxpayer $ to repeal.
 
2013-07-28 09:54:46 AM
Let's be fair. It won't cut hours further. Because all the shiat Republicans are complaining about companies going to do because of Obamacare? THEY ALREADY farkING DO IT. Hour-shaving so employees count as part-time so they don't have to pay for benefits has been around for years.
 
2013-07-28 09:58:44 AM

IamKaiserSoze!!!: The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research

About as credible as an endorsement from Alec Baldwin, Michael Moore, Sean Penn, Matt Damon and Susan Sarandon.

Wait, that's pretty much the whole cast



Is that why GOP minions wait breathlessly to form their opinions until Ted Nugent, Rush, and Hannity decide how to weigh in?
 
2013-07-28 10:01:37 AM
Can we just get a frikkin Obamacare tab already?
 
2013-07-28 10:09:49 AM
The Republicans know all about killing jobs.  Free trade, baby!
 
2013-07-28 10:30:26 AM
There is only one reason republicans want this to fail, and that is they don't want democrats to succeed.
 
2013-07-28 10:31:51 AM

IamKaiserSoze!!!: The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research

About as credible as an endorsement from Alec Baldwin, Michael Moore, Sean Penn, Matt Damon and Susan Sarandon.

Wait, that's pretty much the whole cast


yeah, i'll wait until i hear from breitbart, newsmax and the heritage foundation.
 
2013-07-28 10:33:21 AM

IamKaiserSoze!!!: The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research

About as credible as an endorsement from Alec Baldwin, Michael Moore, Sean Penn, Matt Damon and Susan Sarandon.

Wait, that's pretty much the whole cast


Kill the messenger much? You should quote the poll questions, or the demographics, or the time of day if you want to be taken seriously, because you are not.
 
2013-07-28 10:43:05 AM
What, the GOP would do that? Blatantly lie about something?
 
2013-07-28 10:50:39 AM

vudutek: serial_crusher: So this study concludes that, because employers haven't cut hours yet, it means they're not going to when the mandate goes into effect 2 years from now? Doesn't sound like good science to me.

It's about as reliable as the GOP's foregone conclusions that Obamacare is guaranteed to fail, therefore they must keep wasting time and taxpayer $ to repeal.


It's amazing that a program they endorsed as a solution until 2008 isn't going to work, which is what actual Libruls have been saying for 30 years.
 
2013-07-28 10:52:04 AM

hardinparamedic: What, the GOP would do that? Blatantly lie about something?


Remember, Jerry:  It's not a lie if you believe it.
 
2013-07-28 10:52:10 AM

serial_crusher: So this study concludes that, because employers haven't cut hours yet, it means they're not going to when the mandate goes into effect 2 years from now? Doesn't sound like good science to me.


That's as valid as the GOP claiming, because a few employers have threatened to cut hours (even though most haven't), that they ARE going to when the mandate goes into effect.

It's only "not good science" when they do it!
 
2013-07-28 10:54:59 AM
"The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research "

"It contradicts business owners who say they've already started cutting back."  (I am sure the people in that Obamacare call center will be relieved to know that)

Funny!

Thanks subby for the laugh.
 
2013-07-28 10:55:56 AM
They needed a study for that?
 
2013-07-28 10:56:02 AM
ITS STILL REAL TO ME, DAMNIT
 
2013-07-28 10:56:33 AM

Marcus Aurelius: The Republicans know all about killing jobs.  Free trade, baby!


You mean like NAFTA?
 
2013-07-28 10:57:49 AM
 
2013-07-28 10:58:51 AM

PreMortem: There is only one reason republicans want this to fail, and that is they don't want democrats to succeed.


More specifically, they don't want President Obama to succeed. It's why they made a huge stink about raising the debt ceiling in July and August 2011, a bill which used to be a routine procedure which passed unanimously and with less fanfare than the renaming of post offices.

It's also why the GOP-controlled House passed about 40 bills to repeal Obamacare (which is about 45-50 more than the number of jobs bills they've passed, and that's terrible) and why they passed a bill that defunded the President's teleprompter.
 
2013-07-28 10:58:54 AM

4.54kilogramsofqueso: "The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research "

"It contradicts business owners who say they've already started cutting back." (I am sure the people in that Obamacare call center will be relieved to know that)

Funny!

Thanks subby for the laugh.


I just had a three-way with Scarlett Johansson and Alison Brie last night. The left-leaning CEPR says I didn't, but who are you going to believe? A bunch of dirty pinko Commie socialist liberals using scientific data, or a dude who is certain he had sex with two of the hottest women on the planet last night?
 
2013-07-28 10:59:07 AM

Alphax: They needed a study for that?


Well, sure, you can play the odds and just assume the GOP talking points are full of shiat, but it helps to have evidence - something the GOP still doesn't get.
 
2013-07-28 11:00:36 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: "It contradicts business owners who say they've already started cutting back."  (I am sure the people in that Obamacare call center will be relieved to know that)


This makes no sense, whatsoever. It's like trying to string together two completely separate ideas.
 
2013-07-28 11:00:54 AM
I think it's giving businesses another excuse to go with mostly part timers, ala Walmart. The great thing is they can blame Obamacare instead of having to defend shiatty policy.
 
2013-07-28 11:01:43 AM

Nemo's Brother: Even Obama is getting in on the action.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/354556/obamacare-call-center-wi ll -not-offer-health-care-benefits-employees-eliana-johnson


Obama runs California too? DAMN that guy gets around.
 
2013-07-28 11:02:36 AM

cameroncrazy1984: Nemo's Brother: Even Obama is getting in on the action.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/354556/obamacare-call-center-wi ll -not-offer-health-care-benefits-employees-eliana-johnson

Obama runs California too? DAMN that guy gets around.


Obama gave me testicular cancer.
 
2013-07-28 11:02:56 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: Marcus Aurelius: The Republicans know all about killing jobs.  Free trade, baby!

You mean like NAFTA?


and granting permanent Most Favored Trading Nation to China less than a year after Tienanmen Square?
 
2013-07-28 11:03:40 AM

PreMortem: IamKaiserSoze!!!: The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research

About as credible as an endorsement from Alec Baldwin, Michael Moore, Sean Penn, Matt Damon and Susan Sarandon.

Wait, that's pretty much the whole cast

Kill the messenger much? You should quote the poll questions, or the demographics, or the time of day if you want to be taken seriously, because you are not.


Really?
The "report" does not have any poll questions or any demographics list or even the time of day.

It is an opinion piece.

Here is part of their "brilliant" analysis:

"Some employers claim to have reduced employment because of the provisions of the ACA as soon as its passage in 2010, and many have blamed the ACA for the slow pace of employment growth in the years from 2010 - 2012. This is not plausible. There is enormous churning in the labor market, with close to 3 percent of employees leaving their job every month (half voluntarily and half involuntarily). If an employer felt the need to hire additional employers in 2010 - 2012 to meet the demand for labor they were seeing at the time, they would have no difficulty getting their employment. Just the normal churning in the labor market would bring a firm with 52 or 53 employees below the 50 employee threshold in a few months.  "

Laughable.
 
2013-07-28 11:03:45 AM

Nemo's Brother: Except that it already has in the real world. Not in the bribed world of Derp that this study came from.


Right wingers looking for every possible way to screw workers didn't start with Obamacare. What you've linked as evidence is essentially "Republicans predict bad things will happen because of Obamacare and prove it by doing them."
 
2013-07-28 11:04:07 AM

Nemo's Brother: tenpoundsofcheese: Marcus Aurelius: The Republicans know all about killing jobs.  Free trade, baby!

You mean like NAFTA?

and granting permanent Most Favored Trading Nation to China less than a year after Tienanmen Square?


Tienanmen Square was in 1989...who was president then?
 
2013-07-28 11:04:10 AM
Some people at my job are getting their hours cut to 27.5 a week (from 35) so that they won't have to be offered health coverage. Maybe it's not happening everywhere (yet), but it is happening.
 
2013-07-28 11:04:39 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: "It contradicts business owners who say they've already started cutting back."  (I am sure the people in that Obamacare call center will be relieved to know that)


Having health insurance is no longer tied to being employed. Imagine that.
 
2013-07-28 11:05:15 AM

Nemo's Brother: Except that it already has in the real world. Not in the bribed world of Derp that this study came from.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/02/12/1186608/-Virginia-cuts-part -t ime-state-workers-hours-in-response-to-Obamacare

Even Obama is getting in on the action.

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/354556/obamacare-call-center-wi ll -not-offer-health-care-benefits-employees-eliana-johnson


You might wanna scroll a few links down on the politics tab to see your argument ripped apart, as I'm guessing sensible Farkers are already weary of these talking points.
 
2013-07-28 11:05:59 AM
Don't forget all the dickhead business owners who would much rather cut off their noses to spite Obama.
 
2013-07-28 11:06:35 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: Laughable.


What's laughable is that you think posting one paragraph out of context is a good argument.
 
2013-07-28 11:07:59 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: "The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research "

"It contradicts business owners who say they've already started cutting back."  (I am sure the people in that Obamacare call center will be relieved to know that)

Funny!

Thanks subby for the laugh.


"Hey, cheese, your arguments were thoroughly debunked, what are you going to do now?"

"I'm going to try using them in an new thread!"
 
2013-07-28 11:08:19 AM

Serious Black: 4.54kilogramsofqueso: "The report, from the left-leaning Center for Economic and Policy Research "

"It contradicts business owners who say they've already started cutting back." (I am sure the people in that Obamacare call center will be relieved to know that)

Funny!

Thanks subby for the laugh.

I just had a three-way with Scarlett Johansson and Alison Brie last night. The left-leaning CEPR says I didn't, but who are you going to believe? A bunch of dirty pinko Commie socialist liberals using scientific data, or a dude who is certain he had sex with two of the hottest women on the planet last night?


What scientific data do you think they used to disprove that companies are cutting back or plan to?  Did you read the study?
There is actually information about their about people cutting back - that is a lot more information that this study opinion piece used.
 
2013-07-28 11:09:04 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: What scientific data do you think they used to disprove that companies are cutting back or plan to?  Did you read the study?
There is actually information about their about people cutting back - that is a lot more information that this study opinion piece used


If there was, why didn't you put it in your reply?

Oh wait, because there isn't.
 
2013-07-28 11:09:05 AM

cameroncrazy1984: Nemo's Brother: tenpoundsofcheese: Marcus Aurelius: The Republicans know all about killing jobs.  Free trade, baby!

You mean like NAFTA?

and granting permanent Most Favored Trading Nation to China less than a year after Tienanmen Square?

Tienanmen Square was in 1989...who was president then?


The answer is obvious. OBAMA IS A TIMELORD!

datechguyblog.com
 
2013-07-28 11:10:34 AM
Nonsense they're setting up the Death Panels and Abortionplexes even as we speak. Re:re:re:re emails told me so.
 
2013-07-28 11:10:40 AM

Enfenestrate: Some people at my job are getting their hours cut to 27.5 a week (from 35) so that they won't have to be offered health coverage. Maybe it's not happening everywhere (yet), but it is happening.


What isn't clear yet is how the insurance industry is going to respond to these actions.  Will they simply offer plans that people can't afford, and say "tough shiat" if you can't, or will they realize there will be a new demand for lower-cost employer-independent plans, and offer them in order to make some (rather than no) profit?

I'm not sure how the exchanges or tax benefit fit into this.  I do know that COBRA is a cruel farking joke, and that it would be tough to get much worse.
 
2013-07-28 11:11:11 AM
In the Republican fantasy world, they're the only ones working as it is.
 
2013-07-28 11:11:15 AM

hardinparamedic: tenpoundsofcheese: "It contradicts business owners who say they've already started cutting back."  (I am sure the people in that Obamacare call center will be relieved to know that)

Having health insurance is no longer tied to being employed. Imagine that.


Imagine that.
People were never ever have been able to buy health insurance before. The absolute only way they could get is by the employer providing it and paying for a large portion of it.
They never ever had an alternative.
 
2013-07-28 11:11:23 AM

The My Little Pony Killer: Don't forget all the dickhead business owners who would much rather cut off their noses to spite Obama.


A few months back, I tried figuring out how much money a business owner who had close to 50 full-time employees would save by either firing to get below 50 employees or cutting hours to get below the threshold. It ended up being negligible at best and seemed to suggest that employers who would save money because of this would save money regardless of whether they were being "forced" to do it by ObamaCare.

Of course, when I presented my numbers to some of my hardcore Tea Party/Religious Right friends that own small businesses, they all said I was unequivocally wrong, called me a whore, and told me that only business owners know how much it costs to run a business.
 
2013-07-28 11:12:17 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: People were never ever have been able to buy health insurance before. The absolute only way they could get is by the employer providing it and paying for a large portion of it.
They never ever had an alternative.


Without spending more than they make? Correct.
 
2013-07-28 11:13:04 AM

The My Little Pony Killer: Don't forget all the dickhead business owners who would much rather cut off their noses to spite Obama.


Dickhead business owners gimping their ability to compete against decent business owners? I'm okay with this.
 
2013-07-28 11:13:48 AM

cameroncrazy1984: tenpoundsofcheese: Laughable.

What's laughable is that you think posting one paragraph out of context is a good argument.


Go read the opinion piece.
That was their best "analysis".
 
2013-07-28 11:14:14 AM
Is this the Republican fantasy world where 4 out of 5 Americans face near poverty, chronic unemployment, and food stamp roles have exploded because we haven't given the rich enough tax cuts yet?
 
2013-07-28 11:14:15 AM
In related news, a bunch of Papa John's just closed in the Albany area. I'm sure it's completely irrelevant to their ability to hire competent workers while offering non-competitive benefits.
 
2013-07-28 11:14:33 AM

tenpoundsofcheese: People were never ever have been able to buy health insurance before. The absolute only way they could get is by the employer providing it and paying for a large portion of it.


Oh come on. You think a poverty level family can afford 400-500 dollars a month out of pocket for a basic insurance plan? Or do you think that the system we have had for the past 30 years is adequate to provide for these people? The fact of the matter is that discouraging people from seeking private care, we're costing the entire system more. You don't seem to realize that fact.

At least through insurance exchanges and competitive pricing through regulation, people will be able to afford it now.
 
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