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(Christian Science Monitor)   Halliburton: "Oh... THAT evidence. Yeah, we destroyed that"   (csmonitor.com) divider line 86
    More: Obvious, Halliburton, gulf, free daily, plead guilty, Macondo, criminal information  
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8207 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Jul 2013 at 1:00 PM (38 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-26 12:00:00 PM
If corporations were people, they'd face jail time.

Oh who am I kidding? If they were a person, they'd be too rich to go to jail.
 
2013-07-26 12:00:36 PM
Computer simulations wouldn't be much use as evidence, I would imagine. And the nuts and bolts of what was used in the simulation would probably be incomprehensible to a jury, the lawyers and judge.
 
2013-07-26 12:05:00 PM
agreed to plead guilty "to one misdemeanor violation associated with the deletion of records created after the Macondo well incident, to pay the statutory maximum fine of $200,000 and to accept a term of three years probation."

The Justice Department has agreed it will not pursue further criminal prosecution of the company or its subsidiaries for any conduct arising from the 2010 spill


There is nothing right about any of this.

69.89.31.199
 
2013-07-26 12:09:54 PM
Yeah, they're gonna have to pay a $50 fine and pickup the garbage in the snow.
 
2013-07-26 12:17:08 PM

Eddie Adams from Torrance: Yeah, they're gonna have to pay a $50 fine and pickup the garbage in the snow.


Then the corporation is being punished. I do not understand the reason for disapproval.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-07-26 12:17:30 PM
Reuters is now reporting that the "maximum fine" is $200,000.
 
2013-07-26 12:46:10 PM

SilentStrider: If corporations were people, they'd face jail time.

Oh who am I kidding? If they were a person, they'd be too rich to go to jail.


Um... they are people, according to SCOTUS.  But very special, very protected, very privileged people.
 
2013-07-26 01:02:38 PM
There's no point in punishing them because the government will just pay them back in the next contract.
 
2013-07-26 01:03:51 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: SilentStrider: If corporations were people, they'd face jail time.

Oh who am I kidding? If they were a person, they'd be too rich to go to jail.

Um... they are people, according to SCOTUS.  But very special, very protected, very privileged people.


They know the names of the people who gave the orders and who carried them out. Apparently the Corporation-People have the power to protect their human servants from harm as well. (for "power" read "$$$")
 
2013-07-26 01:04:52 PM

Dimensio: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Yeah, they're gonna have to pay a $50 fine and pickup the garbage in the snow.

Then the corporation is being punished. I do not understand the reason for disapproval.


handing over whatever change is in the ashtray is a class of 'punished' very few experience in our courts.
 
2013-07-26 01:06:26 PM
And that sunnuvabieotch Cheney is laughing all the way to the bank.
 
2013-07-26 01:06:43 PM

Nadie_AZ: agreed to plead guilty "to one misdemeanor violation associated with the deletion of records created after the Macondo well incident, to pay the statutory maximum fine of $200,000 and to accept a term of three years probation."

The Justice Department has agreed it will not pursue further criminal prosecution of the company or its subsidiaries for any conduct arising from the 2010 spill

There is nothing right about any of this.

[69.89.31.199 image 200x218]


Oh you want REALLY wrong?  Halliburton pays a $200k fine for this, and makes a $55 Million "voluntary contribution" to Fish and Wildlife"  ..oh and is on two year's probation....whatever the hell that means in this context.

OTOH by pleading guilty they've probably saved thier buddies at BP tens of billions of dollars by giving it an ironclad defense in the lawsuit the US has filed against BP alleging gross negligence; because Now BP can point to Halliburtons confessed criminal conduct and basically say "See ? we relied on them, they're the bad gys"
 
2013-07-26 01:08:17 PM

ZAZ: Reuters is now reporting that the "maximum fine" is $200,000.


Wow, I bet Halliburton stock will take a real beating on the news that they are being required to give up the loose change under their couch cushions!
 
2013-07-26 01:08:24 PM

Dimensio: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Yeah, they're gonna have to pay a $50 fine and pickup the garbage in the snow.

Then the corporation is being punished. I do not understand the reason for disapproval.


Has Halliburton rehabilitated itself?
 
2013-07-26 01:08:45 PM
So, oil is going up?
 
2013-07-26 01:09:11 PM

ZAZ: Reuters is now reporting that the "maximum fine" is $200,000.


See they're paying a full 0.01% of the economic damage their now apparently intentional negligence caused.
 
2013-07-26 01:09:19 PM
Somebody in the company is ultimately responsible for destroying that evidence.  That person needs to be sitting in Federal prison right now.
 
2013-07-26 01:09:45 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: Um... they are people, according to SCOTUS. But very special, very protected, very privileged people.


Just like the the judges on the SCOTUS.  Very **VERY** special.
 
2013-07-26 01:10:47 PM
Did you silly little people think they would face any real penalty?
 
2013-07-26 01:12:33 PM
If a corperation is a person are shareholders slave owners? Is it considered human trafficking to move them offshore? Did Bain Capital tear people limb from limb and eat them? Is this real life?
 
2013-07-26 01:13:06 PM

simplicimus: Computer simulations wouldn't be much use as evidence, I would imagine. And the nuts and bolts of what was used in the simulation would probably be incomprehensible to a jury, the lawyers and judge.


Even so, that doesn't mean they can just get rid of them.

Oh wait, they did.

Okay then.
 
2013-07-26 01:13:57 PM

someonelse: Dimensio: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Yeah, they're gonna have to pay a $50 fine and pickup the garbage in the snow.

Then the corporation is being punished. I do not understand the reason for disapproval.

Has Halliburton rehabilitated itself?


They need to sit on the Group W bench
 
2013-07-26 01:15:18 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: SilentStrider: If corporations were people, they'd face jail time.

Oh who am I kidding? If they were a person, they'd be too rich to go to jail.

Um... they are people, according to SCOTUS.  But very special, very protected, very privileged people.


$ome people are more equal than others.
 
2013-07-26 01:16:08 PM

Magorn: Oh you want REALLY wrong?  Halliburton pays a $200k fine for this, and makes a $55 Million "voluntary contribution" to Fish and Wildlife"  ..oh and is on two year's probation....whatever the hell that means in this context.

OTOH by pleading guilty they've probably saved thier buddies at BP tens of billions of dollars by giving it an ironclad defense in the lawsuit the US has filed against BP alleging gross negligence; because Now BP can point to Halliburtons confessed criminal conduct and basically say "See ? we relied on them, they're the bad gys"


"Too big to fail" takes on a whole new meaning in this context.
 
2013-07-26 01:16:37 PM

SpectroBoy: ZAZ: Reuters is now reporting that the "maximum fine" is $200,000.

Wow, I bet Halliburton stock will take a real beating on the news that they are being required to give up the loose change under their couch cushions!


They might have to cancel one of the Friday afternoon money fights they have in the executive dining room!
 
2013-07-26 01:17:18 PM

Pincy: Somebody in the company is ultimately responsible for destroying that evidence.  That person needs to be sitting in Federal prison right now.


And I'm sure that if it came down to that, they already have a paper trail that leads it to some intern.
 
2013-07-26 01:17:51 PM
Come on, it's not like Halliburton used chalk to draw on the sidewalk outside of a few banks.

/oils well that ends well, right?
 
2013-07-26 01:19:57 PM
so they caused billions of dollars in ecological damage to the gulf of mexico, the aftereffects of which are still being discovered, and for punishment, they had to pay 1/100th of what disney paid johnny depp to star in the lone ranger.  that sounds fair to me.
 
2013-07-26 01:20:09 PM
I thought Halliburton moved to Dubai.
 
2013-07-26 01:20:28 PM

Dimensio: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Yeah, they're gonna have to pay a $50 fine and pickup the garbage in the snow.

Then the corporation is being punished. I do not understand the reason for disapproval.


I gave my kid a bottle of Jack and the keys to my monster truck for his 12th birthday.  He then used your property and house as an obstacle course.  Sure, I'll pay the two dollar fine.
 
2013-07-26 01:20:58 PM
We can't send Halliburton the company to jail physically, but maybe we could adopt a more prison-like payscale for their executives, say, $0.25 an hour.
 
2013-07-26 01:21:28 PM

gfid: simplicimus: Computer simulations wouldn't be much use as evidence, I would imagine. And the nuts and bolts of what was used in the simulation would probably be incomprehensible to a jury, the lawyers and judge.

Even so, that doesn't mean they can just get rid of them.

Oh wait, they did.

Okay then.


Well, they could re-run the simulations, unless they also destroyed the software, comparable computers, and all the engineers died in an accident.
 
2013-07-26 01:23:28 PM

uncleacid: I thought Halliburton moved to Dubai.


Houston and Dubai. Still a US Corp though.
 
2013-07-26 01:24:17 PM
Well they do own the country they can do what they want with it.
 
2013-07-26 01:25:16 PM
$200,000 eh?  Geeves - hand me the walking around money briefcase.  No, not that one - that's the bribe foreign dignitaries briefcase.
 
2013-07-26 01:26:31 PM

ikanreed: ZAZ: Reuters is now reporting that the "maximum fine" is $200,000.

See they're paying a full 0.01% of the economic damage their now apparently intentional negligence caused.


the fine isn't really what matters.  it's what affect the destruction of evidence has on the trial.  BP now has a rather funny position to stand from when it comes to certain arguments.  there is a presumption of adversity (my brain is dead, i can't remember the actual name of the doctrine) when a party doesn't use their own evidence or, as here, destroys it  (i also really flubbed this description... but, for basic purposes, it makes enough sense).  it's possible that this may ending up hurting halliburton more than had it revealed the evidence.
 
2013-07-26 01:28:06 PM
Just to add some fuel to the fire - the maximum penalty for federal obstruction of justice for destroying evidence in a federal investigation (18 U.S.C. 1519) is 20 years. And of course, there's the conspiracy charges that go along with that (hey, did you call or email someone and talk about doing this? It's conspiracy!) that always get piled on in a Federal case. I mean, a Federal case against a real person, not a corporation-person.
And probation - so, Halliburton has to wear an ankle bracelet? They can't drive after 9pm? They have to submit to a drug-test?  It's meaningless.

So, yeah. This isn't even a slap on the wrist. It is barely disapproving glance or a loud sigh. It'll probably be followed by an apology about making Halliburton feel bad and a promise to go out for ice cream later.
 
2013-07-26 01:28:13 PM
Oh, good.  0.007% (rounding up) of their annual net income.  That'll teach'em.
 
2013-07-26 01:29:20 PM

Magorn: Nadie_AZ: agreed to plead guilty "to one misdemeanor violation associated with the deletion of records created after the Macondo well incident, to pay the statutory maximum fine of $200,000 and to accept a term of three years probation."

The Justice Department has agreed it will not pursue further criminal prosecution of the company or its subsidiaries for any conduct arising from the 2010 spill

There is nothing right about any of this.

[69.89.31.199 image 200x218]

Oh you want REALLY wrong?  Halliburton pays a $200k fine for this, and makes a $55 Million "voluntary contribution" to Fish and Wildlife"  ..oh and is on two year's probation....whatever the hell that means in this context.

OTOH by pleading guilty they've probably saved thier buddies at BP tens of billions of dollars by giving it an ironclad defense in the lawsuit the US has filed against BP alleging gross negligence; because Now BP can point to Halliburtons confessed criminal conduct and basically say "See ? we relied on them, they're the bad gys"


this
gives me little hope
for change
 
2013-07-26 01:29:22 PM
vudukungfu

And that sunnuvabieotch Cheney is laughing all the way to the bank.

No he's not. He's got direct deposit. An assistant's android phone beeps. The assistant scuries down the hallway and finds Dick sitting in front of a roaring fireplace. He whispers some numbers in his ear and Dick looks at his glass of brandy and says "Excellent. Let'sssss celebrate. Bring me two live babies for lunch. One American and one Chinese. i have the taste for a little Asian cuisine. Bwa hahahaha!"
 
2013-07-26 01:30:49 PM
My faith in the justice system has been restored.
 
2013-07-26 01:31:06 PM

ikanreed: ZAZ: Reuters is now reporting that the "maximum fine" is $200,000.

See they're paying a full 0.01% of the economic damage their now apparently intentional negligence caused.


With all the money they saved, I can't wait for the influx of employment opportunities.

Can you?
 
2013-07-26 01:31:13 PM
farm6.staticflickr.com

I say we go Old-School Republican on their arses.
 
2013-07-26 01:31:46 PM

MorteDiem: My faith in the justice system has been restored.


Legal system, legal.

There is no Justice, here.
 
2013-07-26 01:31:56 PM
Vir Cotto needs more lawn ornaments.
 
2013-07-26 01:35:51 PM

Dimensio: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Yeah, they're gonna have to pay a $50 fine and pickup the garbage in the snow.

Then the corporation is being punished. I do not understand the reason for disapproval.


The point of punishment (or the threat or it) is that it is supposed to prevent the recipient from doing the same thing again.
In Halliburton's case, this "punishment" is the equivalent of a light tap on the nose with a feather duster.
 
2013-07-26 01:37:17 PM

NutWrench: Dimensio: Eddie Adams from Torrance: Yeah, they're gonna have to pay a $50 fine and pickup the garbage in the snow.

Then the corporation is being punished. I do not understand the reason for disapproval.

The point of punishment (or the threat or it) is that it is supposed to prevent the recipient from doing the same thing again.
In Halliburton's case, this "punishment" is the equivalent of a light tap on the nose with a feather duster.


While making cooing noises, no less.
 
2013-07-26 01:39:14 PM
As much as I want to tee off on Halliburton, one of the few entities out there who can hang with Monsanto and Philip Morris* and Blackwater** in terms of pure tonnage of evil, it's kind of not their fault.

Why on earth would they have done anything differently? From their perspective, it would be stupid and pointless to avoid doing something merely because it was against the law. They've never once been held to any serious account (most definitely including this, ahem, "conviction") and the lesson they learned again today is that it won't start happening anytime soon.

People point out, quite correctly, that Halliburton does in fact provide services that the U.S. government genuinely needs, so we can't just tell them to go pound sand when the next round of no-bid contracts need to be fulfilled.

But we could tell them that the next time they get caught stealing a few hundred million from the federal till, or freezing out competitors for government contractors, or electrocuting soldiers because the million-dollar showers they built were hardwired into the electrical system, or imprisoning employees who report being gang-raped by co-workers... the next time something like that goes down we'll just  nationalize the motherfarkers. Hey, sorry, Halliburton shareholders... you were warned. Thanks for the cool company.

The nice thing is that you only have to do it once, and then all of a sudden you start getting what you pay for from all your other contractees. Yeah, I know, it'll never happen. But if I ever get the chance I'm going to whisper it in Dick Cheney's ear. I bet I could stop his cyborg heart for a moment.

* now the Altria Group
**  now Xe now Academi
 
2013-07-26 01:50:01 PM
Hey, Halliburton!  fark you!
 
2013-07-26 01:56:40 PM

jake_lex: SpectroBoy: ZAZ: Reuters is now reporting that the "maximum fine" is $200,000.

Wow, I bet Halliburton stock will take a real beating on the news that they are being required to give up the loose change under their couch cushions!

They might have to cancel one of the Friday afternoon money fights they have in the executive dining room!


Nah, the money fights are still on, at least according to their latest newsletter. They'll just have 20 fewer chew toys to give to their dogs at their next cash BBQ.
 
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