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(Hardball Talk)   Ryan Braun is low-down, dirty, lying, cheating, scoundrel. But he's still no Lance Armstrong   (hardballtalk.nbcsports.com ) divider line
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1493 clicks; posted to Sports » on 23 Jul 2013 at 3:34 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-23 02:28:41 PM  
Of course Braun isn't like Armstrong. He has two balls.

/They both suck at life
 
2013-07-23 03:12:37 PM  
I don't guess there's any way they can take away his MVP at this point, but there should be a big 'ol asterisk by it. And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame, even if he is an asshole that I don't really like all that much.

/don't know why I threw that in, but oh well...
 
2013-07-23 03:38:12 PM  
 
2013-07-23 03:41:01 PM  
He's a douche, too. Don't forget that.
 
2013-07-23 03:44:04 PM  
Well they both lied and lied and lied and in both cases got people fired and ruined their reps. In Braun's case he still hasnt said that he did PEDs just that he is sorry for letting everyone down.

TBH though I think some PEDs should be ok in the pro game. PEDs in part saved baseball.

I feel bad for piss sample collection guy. He is the real loser in this scandal.
 
2013-07-23 03:46:03 PM  

show me: And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame


The day after he passes away so he can't personally enjoy it.
 
2013-07-23 03:46:11 PM  

show me: I don't guess there's any way they can take away his MVP at this point, but there should be a big 'ol asterisk by it. And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame, even if every day he saw a sign telling him he would be banned from the game if gambled on baseball and then proceeded to gamble on it because he is an asshole that I don't really like all that much.

/don't know why I ignored key information when I threw that in, but oh well...

FTFY
 
2013-07-23 03:54:11 PM  
You've got a point, Subby.

Lance actually won something.
 
2013-07-23 03:57:09 PM  

Wadded Beef: Ryan Braun: 'Never believe any of us'


I like the one about the brewers playoff hopes just a little more.
 
2013-07-23 03:58:02 PM  
No real sports fan cares about cycling, the Brewers, or P.E.D.'s.
 
2013-07-23 04:12:08 PM  

fastbow: You've got a point, Subby.

Lance actually won something.


Because an MVP is no big deal.
 
2013-07-23 04:19:04 PM  
That was a really well-written piece.  Braun is a lying douche. And he went out of his way to hint that maybe this guy did something nefarious to the sample when he knew damn well he was dirty and the sample was good. But it's still just one guy and one instance. Armstrong destroyed lots of people and went way out of his way to do it. Intentionally. For years. And slept like a baby the whole time. He happened to be a cyclist and he got his malicious jones off that way... but if we locked him and bundy and manson and a few others up in a cage match to the death I'd like his chances. I'm no psychologist but I don't think he has the capacity for empathy. Braun's just a lying cheater.
 
2013-07-23 04:27:10 PM  

idesofmarch: fastbow: You've got a point, Subby.

Lance actually won something.

Because an MVP is no big deal.


Superlatives are not championships.
 
2013-07-23 04:29:45 PM  
A lot of lance hate in the world, and maybe it's just me, but I've always been MORE inclined to give him a pass than many of these Baseball guys.  Lance fought off a cancer that ravaged his body and cost him an entire testicle.  I figure repairing that damge, and the fact that he could only produce half as much testosterone as his competitiors actually entitled him to a little extra help, especially in a sport so rife with cheating the Cycling folks have had to throw up there hands and say NOBODY won the Tour the years the stripped the title from Lance, because all the guys that finished close behind him have also been DQ'ed subsequently
 
2013-07-23 04:32:38 PM  

fastbow: You've got a point, Subby.

Lance actually won something.


This was my first thought, as well...

/Brewers fan from birth
//We'll never win shiat
 
2013-07-23 04:37:17 PM  

Magorn: Lance fought off a cancer that ravaged his body and cost him an entire testicle


This happens to a lot of dudes. Where's their medal?

Looks like Braun just lost his Kwik Trip sponsorship.
 
2013-07-23 04:44:09 PM  
The butthurt people get over someone taking a few steroids is simply amazing.  Are you all really that upset or surprised?  And if so - why?
 
2013-07-23 04:48:01 PM  

Magorn: A lot of lance hate in the world, and maybe it's just me, but I've always been MORE inclined to give him a pass than many of these Baseball guys.  Lance fought off a cancer that ravaged his body and cost him an entire testicle.  I figure repairing that damge, and the fact that he could only produce half as much testosterone as his competitiors actually entitled him to a little extra help, especially in a sport so rife with cheating the Cycling folks have had to throw up there hands and say NOBODY won the Tour the years the stripped the title from Lance, because all the guys that finished close behind him have also been DQ'ed subsequently


Except that he also bullied other riders on his team into taking PEDs, and once they did, threatened to expose them if they didn't do what he said.
 
2013-07-23 04:48:14 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: The butthurt people get over someone taking a few steroids is simply amazing.  Are you all really that upset or surprised?  And if so - why?


Because people want those they respect to have integrity, and it hurts to find out they were disingenuous.
 
2013-07-23 04:49:55 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: The butthurt people get over someone taking a few steroids is simply amazing.  Are you all really that upset or surprised?  And if so - why?


It sends a message to kids that everyone does it, so you should too. And ruin your long term health. That's one that pops in just off the top of my head.
 
2013-07-23 04:52:14 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: The butthurt people get over someone taking a few steroids is simply amazing.  Are you all really that upset or surprised?  And if so - why?


Celebrities in the sports and entertainment fields are glorified by the people. So when they are seen as having done wrong, the people seek vindication to feed their bloodlust. It's just what happens I guess.
 
2013-07-23 05:03:29 PM  

Magorn: the fact that he could only produce half as much testosterone as his competitiors


citation

... entitled him to a little extra help

even if true, which it ain't to me, what entitled him to be such a dick?
 
2013-07-23 05:08:19 PM  
I am surprised no one is comparing him to Palmiero. Because to me they are pretty similar, with Palmiero pulling that shiat in Congress. Though i do also agree with the Armstrong comparison
 
2013-07-23 05:15:19 PM  
Braun needs to start speaking in Yiddish and act like he can't speak English.
 
2013-07-23 05:36:41 PM  

CheatCommando: show me: And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame

The day after he passes away so he can't personally enjoy it.


Seriously, why are we still keeping Shoeless Joe out? The guy's dead. He can go in now. Maybe Eddie Cicotte too; he's kind of a borderline HOF'er.
 
2013-07-23 05:38:28 PM  
Dude has zero credibility, but unlike Armstrong and Palmero he is still in the prime of his career at 29 and can still prove himself on the field.  His character though proably will never recover no matter if he even goes all "Roberto Clemente" times 20 for the rest of his life, due to being such a jackhole when he beat his initial positive on a technicality.
 
2013-07-23 05:45:43 PM  

Brother_Mouzone: I am surprised no one is comparing him to Palmiero. Because to me they are pretty similar, with Palmiero pulling that shiat in Congress. Though i do also agree with the Armstrong comparison


I would disagree, if for no other reason, on the simple statistic that Braun just has the one MVP while Armstrong had seven championships. The Brewers have not won seven World Series with Braun on board. They haven't won one. They haven't even REACHED one, and the window to do so anytime soon has well and truly closed with or without him. Considering the length of Braun's deal (it goes until 2020 with a mutual option for 2021), he won't even sniff a World Series the rest of his career because Milwaukee won't be able to get him there in the time he's got left. He's 29. He'll play that deal, he'll be entering his age-37 season when the option comes, and by then there are decent odds he'll be struggling to stay in a starting lineup. Braun is going to spend the rest of his career propping up some terrible Brewers teams.
 
2013-07-23 06:01:04 PM  

CheatCommando: show me: And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame

The day after he passes away so he can't personally enjoy it.



Shoeless Joe Jackson died 22,511 days ago. He's been dead for 62 years and was only alive for 63.  I'd say his lifetime ban should be considered expired at this point. Is it really that bad to include a dead guy in a museum? The National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum. MUSEUM. People need to quit treating it like it's some kind of freaking holy site. ITS A MUSEUM
 
2013-07-23 06:35:02 PM  

The Downfall: CheatCommando: show me: And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame

The day after he passes away so he can't personally enjoy it.


Shoeless Joe Jackson died 22,511 days ago. He's been dead for 62 years and was only alive for 63.  I'd say his lifetime ban should be considered expired at this point. Is it really that bad to include a dead guy in a museum? The National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum. MUSEUM. People need to quit treating it like it's some kind of freaking holy site. ITS A MUSEUM


The Museum's mission is to interpret and educate the public on the history of the sport.  One of those components is the Hall of Fame.  I don't see anything wrong with some players being left out if they grossly compromised their sport.

I also happen to believe neither Jackson nor Rose did so.  The players union, owners, and commissioner of baseball, who knew something was going on and did nothing in the interests of increasing ratings and revenue, both of which suffered greatly because of their greed during the strike and the cancellation of the World Series (If you cause the sport's championship to be cancelled, you should be blackballed from the respective Halls of Fame - this includes Gary Bettman and The 1919 Influenza Epidemic.
 
2013-07-23 07:32:08 PM  

show me: I don't guess there's any way they can take away his MVP at this point, but there should be a big 'ol asterisk by it. And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame, even if he is an asshole that I don't really like all that much.

/don't know why I threw that in, but oh well...


How about an asterisk by every MVP of the past 100 years? That is how far back steroids, amphetamines, etc. go.. If you think Braun and the Biogenesis bunch are the only ones currently juicing, you are pretty naive.

Do you think the testing works? Then why did they only catch this batch of guys by busting Biogenesis? There are dozens, if not hundreds, of other clinics like Biogenesis throughout the nation and Canada (and don't get me started on the ease of getting them in countries like DR, Panama, etc).
 
2013-07-23 07:45:58 PM  

scottydoesntknow: Of course Braun isn't like Armstrong. He has two balls.

/They both suck at life


...the balls?
 
2013-07-23 07:56:05 PM  

The Downfall: CheatCommando: show me: And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame

The day after he passes away so he can't personally enjoy it.


Shoeless Joe Jackson died 22,511 days ago. He's been dead for 62 years and was only alive for 63.  I'd say his lifetime ban should be considered expired at this point. Is it really that bad to include a dead guy in a museum? The National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum. MUSEUM. People need to quit treating it like it's some kind of freaking holy site. ITS A MUSEUM


Recognizing a person in the museum does not mean inducting him into the Hall. Two very different things, and plenty of players have accomplishments recognized without being inducted.

I could get behind Rose being inducted after he dies (and I would give it minimal fanfare) because, from what I know, the evidence there is no evidence he ever bet against his team, thereby jeopardising the integrity of the game.

The Black Sox, on the other hand, did just that. For that reason I can never support anyone involved in the Black Sox scandal being inducted. I am all for their accomplishments being recognized in other ways at the museum, though.
 
2013-07-23 08:20:16 PM  
dywed88:I could get behind Rose being inducted after he dies (and I would give it minimal fanfare) because, from what I know, the evidence there is no evidence he ever bet against his team, thereby jeopardising the integrity of the game.

Betting against does not matter. Betting for may make you do things that jeopardize other games, so you win the game you bet for (e.g. leaving your starting pitcher in longer for the game you want to win, changing your decision when to give a player a day off so he's not worn out during the season, etc.). It can also signal the other bookies to bet against your team on the other days, or at least bet with you on the days you place a bet. Besides, it does not matter. It's a hard, fast rule in the MLB, because of how quickly it can ruin the integrity of the game.
 
2013-07-23 08:21:38 PM  

The Downfall: CheatCommando: show me: And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame

The day after he passes away so he can't personally enjoy it.


Shoeless Joe Jackson died 22,511 days ago. He's been dead for 62 years and was only alive for 63.  I'd say his lifetime ban should be considered expired at this point. Is it really that bad to include a dead guy in a museum? The National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum. MUSEUM. People need to quit treating it like it's some kind of freaking holy site. ITS A MUSEUM


Jackson was not banned for life.  Jackson (and Rose) are banned  forever.

Rose and Jackson are in the museum.  They just don't get plaques on the wall.

And Jackson was eligible for the Hall of Fame for decades.  He never came close to being voted in.  Probably because he took money to throw the World Series.
 
2013-07-23 08:33:21 PM  

tenton: dywed88:I could get behind Rose being inducted after he dies (and I would give it minimal fanfare) because, from what I know, the evidence there is no evidence he ever bet against his team, thereby jeopardising the integrity of the game.

Betting against does not matter. Betting for may make you do things that jeopardize other games, so you win the game you bet for (e.g. leaving your starting pitcher in longer for the game you want to win, changing your decision when to give a player a day off so he's not worn out during the season, etc.). It can also signal the other bookies to bet against your team on the other days, or at least bet with you on the days you place a bet. Besides, it does not matter. It's a hard, fast rule in the MLB, because of how quickly it can ruin the integrity of the game.


Betting against yourself gives you incentive to tank the game.

All betting should be banned and I do not support Rose. But betting against your team amounts to being paid to throw games and is far worse than betting for yourself or in games you are not involved in. Short of a Harding-esque crippling of opponents, it is the most despicable thing in sports.
 
2013-07-23 08:37:52 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: The butthurt people get over someone taking a few steroids is simply amazing.  Are you all really that upset or surprised?  And if so - why?


I'm not butthurt about him (or any other athlete for that matter) taking PED's.  I think we should allow them all IMO. I'd say I'm more butthurt about him being a colassal dick and self-righteous butthole about it,
 
2013-07-23 08:55:02 PM  

Magorn: Lance fought off a cancer that ravaged his body and cost him an entire testicle.


It was able to ravage his whole body because he ignored a very obvious problem due to pride and stupidity.

/and they never take part of one, my friend
 
2013-07-23 09:08:31 PM  

dusty15893: Marcus Aurelius: The butthurt people get over someone taking a few steroids is simply amazing.  Are you all really that upset or surprised?  And if so - why?

I'm not butthurt about him (or any other athlete for that matter) taking PED's.  I think we should allow them all IMO. I'd say I'm more butthurt about him being a colassal dick and self-righteous butthole about it,


Bingo, I always felt he was using something since they aren't used just to bulk but to recover and allow people to play an entire season with no dropoff.

If he used steroids and got busted I wouldn't care so much, its the fact he attacked a man doing his job making less money than he makes before the all star break that makes him a douche bag. And then his statement was just how he has made mistakes and owned up to them, wait WTF? You spent a few months destroying this guy without owning up to anything you farking colostomy bag.
 
2013-07-23 09:34:02 PM  

UNC_Samurai: The Museum's mission is to interpret and educate the public on the history of the sport. One of those components is the Hall of Fame.


Like how it's in Abner Doubleday's hometown and they play exhibition games on Doubleday Field.
 
2013-07-23 09:43:50 PM  
So Ryan Braun doesn't like rimjobs, then?
 
2013-07-23 10:38:17 PM  
Of course Ryan Braun isn't no Lance Armstrong. After all there is at lest 10 pople in the US that care about Baseball. No one every cared about cycling in the US.
 
2013-07-24 12:15:08 AM  
Allen262: Of course Ryan Braun isn't no Lance Armstrong. After all there is at lest 10 pople in the US that care about Baseball. No one every cared about cycling in the US.

If that were only true. My boss and a co-worker are Tour de France fanatics, they would come in to the office and before they even had their first cup of coffee would be nattering about it. They'd watch it online too, spend their lunches watching it and somehow we got all our work done. They kind of got me interested, now that I get the strategy part of it, I thought that the finale in Paris was great sports teevee.

/I also like cricket
//runs away from thread
 
2013-07-24 01:03:55 AM  

Henry Holland: /I also like cricket
//runs away from thread


In my vacation to LA this past May, I actually stumbled on a pickup cricket game at Pan Pacific Park. I was invited to join in. It was pretty fun, actually, though I didn't get too much of a handle on the part where you're actually supposed to run with the bat. It's nothing I'll watch on TV, but actually playing it, not too bad.
 
2013-07-24 01:12:03 AM  
Ha. I see that Armstrong is requesting the government drop their malicious lawsuit against him. Hey Lance, remember when ____ and ____ and _____ requested you drop your malicious lawsuit?

Thought so. Karma is a biatch eh? - Reap what you sowed dirtbag. It's still not enough and it won't be until he has to mow Lemond's lawn to make rent.
 
2013-07-24 01:29:30 AM  

Allen262: Of course Ryan Braun isn't no Lance Armstrong. After all there is at lest 10 pople in the US that care about Baseball. No one every cared about cycling in the US.


Does it hurt to have a stroke, or is it just kinda numb?
 
2013-07-24 07:10:26 AM  

Hoopy Frood: UNC_Samurai: The Museum's mission is to interpret and educate the public on the history of the sport. One of those components is the Hall of Fame.

Like how it's in Abner Doubleday's hometown and they play exhibition games on Doubleday Field.


Last time I was there the BBHoF did a pretty good job of discussing not only the actual origin of the game, but the political and social forces that led to Spalding's bogus origin story.
 
2013-07-24 08:16:40 AM  

UNC_Samurai: Hoopy Frood: UNC_Samurai: The Museum's mission is to interpret and educate the public on the history of the sport. One of those components is the Hall of Fame.

Like how it's in Abner Doubleday's hometown and they play exhibition games on Doubleday Field.

Last time I was there the BBHoF did a pretty good job of discussing not only the actual origin of the game, but the political and social forces that led to Spalding's bogus origin story.


Ironically, they could have simply called the Cartwright rules the birth of the game and been done with it, with documented American origins just the way they wanted. I re-read Peter Golenbock's "Wrigleyville" last week, and he didn't have a lot of nice things to say about Spalding between the months leading up to the dissolution of the National Association and the Abner Graves story. Lots of two-timing, manipulation, power grabs, having rules changed for his own financial benefit and things like that.
 
2013-07-24 09:02:21 AM  
Well, I saw in a movie once that Shoeless Joe was the only one who didn't take money and he actually played pretty good. And the movie had Joan Cusack in it, so it must be true.

/durrrrr
 
2013-07-24 09:37:55 AM  

show me: I don't guess there's any way they can take away his MVP at this point, but there should be a big 'ol asterisk by it. And Pete Rose deserves to be in the Hall of Fame, even if he is an asshole that I don't really like all that much.

/don't know why I threw that in, but oh well...


They're not putting an asterisk on Caminiti's MVP, they won't put one on this one, either.
 
2013-07-24 11:00:10 AM  

The Smails Kid: Allen262: Of course Ryan Braun isn't no Lance Armstrong. After all there is at lest 10 pople in the US that care about Baseball. No one every cared about cycling in the US.

Does it hurt to have a stroke, or is it just kinda numb?


Well he's right, if Lance wasn't in it nobody cared in the states except for around .5% of the population. Its easy to say nobody cared since the US is a big country.
 
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