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(Fark)   Has anyone ever convinced you to change from being conservative to being liberal (or vice versa)?   (fark.com ) divider line
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1373 clicks; posted to Politics » on 22 Jul 2013 at 2:49 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-22 12:37:48 AM  
feckingmorons

And goats. I want goats.

Everyone wants goats.
 
2013-07-22 12:37:54 AM  

CommieTaoist: The older I get, the more liberal I get.


Me too. I basically see too many conservatives clinging to their idea of a past that never really was without adding much of substance to the discussion while liberals stumble in the main but still make progress towards a better future.

I've seen society evolve a lot in my lifetime so far and it's practically all due to progressive liberal beliefs which have made their progress despite the naysaying, foot dragging and open rejection by conservative forces.
 
2013-07-22 12:39:09 AM  

SuperTramp: feckingmorons

And goats. I want goats.

Everyone wants goats.


I actually think I might be a liberal who doesn't like to pay taxes.
 
2013-07-22 12:39:23 AM  
www.damninteresting.com
 
2013-07-22 12:40:35 AM  

syrynxx: make me some tea: As an ex-conservatve

I think that's a touchy word.  I'd still like to think I'm fiscally-conservative, but "socially conservative" is just a code word for "legislating what we imagine the Bible's version of morality to be".  F* that.  I don't support fining people who don't purchase 3rd-party health insurance.  The US government has no more right to force me to buy 3rd-party health insurance than it does to force me to buy ketchup or soup or footwear.  It certainly doesn't have the authority to penalize me for not buying a commercial product.


You do realize that the AHCA is essentially a give-away to the health insurance industry, don't you. Don't you?
 
2013-07-22 12:43:06 AM  
Once I realized that conservatives are horribly selfish people, I realized I didn't want to be one.
 
2013-07-22 12:43:20 AM  

syrynxx: make me some tea: As an ex-conservatve

I think that's a touchy word.  I'd still like to think I'm fiscally-conservative, but "socially conservative" is just a code word for "legislating what we imagine the Bible's version of morality to be".  F* that.  I don't support fining people who don't purchase 3rd-party health insurance.  The US government has no more right to force me to buy 3rd-party health insurance than it does to force me to buy ketchup or soup or footwear.  It certainly doesn't have the authority to penalize me for not buying a commercial product.


It is not a penalty, it is a tax.

Those are markedly different I'm told.

/They'll never have that thing running before I retire in 20 some years. By then I'll be in Mexico or taking a dirt nap.
 
2013-07-22 12:43:41 AM  
feckingmorons

I actually think I might be a liberal who doesn't like to pay taxes.

From henceforth, I shall call you Jeremiah Johnson. A rugged individualist, making his way through the wilderness with his horse and a herd of goats.
 
2013-07-22 12:45:23 AM  
I think fiscal conservatives with more moderate views don't stand a chance with the right wing extremists ready to cannibalize anyone in their own ranks who even appears to stray from fundamentalist Christian dogma. In today's GOP, it's not good enough to espouse conservative fiscal views. You also have to hate on gays and women and the poor and "freeloaders" who want their SS benefits after decades of paying into the system. Smart people who want to help the country economically don't stand a chance against the moral idiocy block that controls the party.
 
2013-07-22 12:45:28 AM  

SuperTramp: feckingmorons

I actually think I might be a liberal who doesn't like to pay taxes.

From henceforth, I shall call you Jeremiah Johnson. A rugged individualist, making his way through the wilderness with his horse and a herd of goats.


And bacon and tea and good TP.

Other than that I am set.
 
2013-07-22 12:45:42 AM  

CommieTaoist: The older I get, the more liberal I get.


^^^
 
2013-07-22 12:45:44 AM  

sn82: The theory of small government and not spending as much as democrats do.


I'd prefer that we paid for our spending rather than continually kick the can. The Democrats seem the closest to doing that.
 
2013-07-22 12:47:55 AM  

feckingmorons: SuperTramp: feckingmorons

And goats. I want goats.

Everyone wants goats.

I actually think I might be a liberal who doesn't like to pay taxes.


Look, despite the propaganda you have have heard, no one likes to pay taxes. It's just that a lot of us see it as a necessary evil to maintain things that contribute to the common good.
 
2013-07-22 12:49:08 AM  

Satan's Chocolate Starfish: Smart people who want to help the country economically don't stand a chance against the moral idiocy block that controls the party.


This is sadly true. Can't get good candidates thru the primaries.
 
2013-07-22 12:49:31 AM  

Abacus9: No, I prefer to do my own thinking instead of having someone else do it for me. It makes me a riot at family get-togethers. Also this:

CommieTaoist: The older I get, the more liberal I get.


Yeah, my family are mostly all republicans and not afraid to voice it. I guess they all assume everyone they know are, too. They know now where I stand but I refuse to get into it with them because its not worth it.
 
2013-07-22 12:49:37 AM  

angrymacface: Once I realized that conservatives are horribly selfish people, I realized I didn't want to be one.


I know, right - like that Neil Armstrong guy taking the moon all for himself.
 
2013-07-22 12:50:39 AM  

sn82: The theory of small government and not spending as much as democrats do.


Have you really taken the time to think this through? I used to be very libertarian too, mind you. I've determined that's also not a sustainable path.
 
2013-07-22 12:50:55 AM  
feckingmorons
And bacon and tea and good TP.

Other than that I am set.


Okay, add a herd of pigs. But the tea, and the TP might be a little problematic unless you're willing to spend some time growing the tea and the trees.

Otherwise, you're dependent upon the labor of others. And those who labor on your behalf have a right to be treated humanely. Safe working conditions, a living wage, decent affordable health care, a safe place to sleep at night. To think otherwise is to imagine yourself a king at best, a tyrant at worst.
 
2013-07-22 12:51:27 AM  

make me some tea: feckingmorons: SuperTramp: feckingmorons

And goats. I want goats.

Everyone wants goats.

I actually think I might be a liberal who doesn't like to pay taxes.

Look, despite the propaganda you have have heard, no one likes to pay taxes. It's just that a lot of us see it as a necessary evil to maintain things that contribute to the common good.


I'd settle for the common mediocre.
 
2013-07-22 12:51:52 AM  

sn82: make me some tea: sn82: I was a democrat until I met my ex several years ago. Then he told me more about republican and it made sense. I'm still kind of in the middle of the two parties but am more to the right than in the past. I still mostly vote for the right candidate versus voting for which party they're affiliated with.

As an ex-conservatve, what "made sense" to you specifically?

The theory of small government and not spending as much as democrats do.


If you think conservatives care about small government and less spending, perhaps you don't remember GWB? Starting unnecessary wars, greatly expanding the power of government under the Patriot Act, Defense of Marriage and all that?

syrynxx: The US government has no more right to force me to buy 3rd-party health insurance than it does to force me to buy ketchup or soup or footwear. It certainly doesn't have the authority to penalize me for not buying a commercial product.


You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?
 
2013-07-22 12:52:10 AM  
Growing up, I read a lot of military sci-fi and fantasy, and things with a fairly libertarian bent. But the older I got, the more I realized how absurd some of the stuff was, and the more liberal I got. In the last few years, I've drifted even farther from the center and towards the left.

When I was in High SChool, you could probably describe me as a centrist Democrat. Now I'm much more progressive and leftist in a wide variety of ways, mostly due to the influence of my girlfriend, who is practically a communist.
 
2013-07-22 12:52:25 AM  

Abacus9: You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?


You don't have to own a car.
 
2013-07-22 12:52:54 AM  

syrynxx: make me some tea: As an ex-conservatve

I think that's a touchy word.  I'd still like to think I'm fiscally-conservative, but "socially conservative" is just a code word for "legislating what we imagine the Bible's version of morality to be".  F* that.  I don't support fining people who don't purchase 3rd-party health insurance.  The US government has no more right to force me to buy 3rd-party health insurance than it does to force me to buy ketchup or soup or footwear.  It certainly doesn't have the authority to penalize me for not buying a commercial product.


As SCOTUS determined (correctly, I might add), you have a right to abstain from buying a health insurance plan, but you'll be obligated to pay more tax on April 15th.
 
2013-07-22 12:53:07 AM  

Abacus9: If you think conservatives care about small government and less spending, perhaps you don't remember GWB? Starting unnecessary wars, greatly expanding the power of government under the Patriot Act, Defense of Marriage and all that?


Don't forget making government so small they can shove it up a woman's vagina.
 
2013-07-22 12:53:14 AM  

Rincewind53: Growing up, I read a lot of military sci-fi and fantasy, and things with a fairly libertarian bent. But the older I got, the more I realized how absurd some of the stuff was, and the more liberal I got. In the last few years, I've drifted even farther from the center and towards the left.

When I was in High SChool, you could probably describe me as a centrist Democrat. Now I'm much more progressive and leftist in a wide variety of ways, mostly due to the influence of my girlfriend, who is practically a communist.


Well you are in law school. You couldn't find a Republican with a search party and a weeks worth of Ramen noodles.
 
2013-07-22 12:53:22 AM  
Conservatists are a bunch of assholes
 
2013-07-22 12:53:38 AM  

feckingmorons: I'd settle for the common mediocre.


What does that even mean?
 
2013-07-22 12:53:45 AM  
Republicans are about as far as you can get from small government and fiscal intelligence. They fiddle and back bite while Rome burns.
 
2013-07-22 12:54:28 AM  

make me some tea: feckingmorons: I'd settle for the common mediocre.

What does that even mean?


I have no idea, this is a political discussion that started on TF.
 
2013-07-22 12:54:37 AM  

feckingmorons: Abacus9: You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?

You don't have to own a car.


But you do have to have health care (literally everyone will incur a hospital bill in their lifetime). And someone has to pay for it. So it's either going to be the government and therefore your fellow taxpayers, or it's going to be you.
 
2013-07-22 12:54:41 AM  

feckingmorons: I actually think I might be a liberal who doesn't like to pay taxes.


Naw, you're not a liberal who doesn't like to pay taxes. Nor a patriot either.

We got into two wars during Bush II and the Republican Congress. They also cut taxes in 2001 (good-bye budget surplus) and in 2003 after we invaded Iraq. Paying taxes to cover the wars and to keep us in surplus to pay down debt would have been patriotic.

/Being patriotic is more than just sending somebody else's kids to fight in wars.
 
2013-07-22 12:55:13 AM  

Triumph: angrymacface: Once I realized that conservatives are horribly selfish people, I realized I didn't want to be one.

I know, right - like that Neil Armstrong guy taking the moon all for himself.


Well, considering the fact he blew up the moon so that no one else would ever be able to walk on it, I'd say so.
 
2013-07-22 12:55:26 AM  

feckingmorons: Rincewind53: Growing up, I read a lot of military sci-fi and fantasy, and things with a fairly libertarian bent. But the older I got, the more I realized how absurd some of the stuff was, and the more liberal I got. In the last few years, I've drifted even farther from the center and towards the left.

When I was in High SChool, you could probably describe me as a centrist Democrat. Now I'm much more progressive and leftist in a wide variety of ways, mostly due to the influence of my girlfriend, who is practically a communist.

Well you are in law school. You couldn't find a Republican with a search party and a weeks worth of Ramen noodles.


Just look for the law students who are failing civil rights class. Those are Republicans.
 
2013-07-22 12:55:29 AM  
Someone once said "Fartbama" and that totally made me switch over to the conservative side.
 
2013-07-22 12:55:45 AM  

feckingmorons: Well you are in law school. You couldn't find a Republican with a search party and a weeks worth of Ramen noodles.


Not true at all, I'm good friends with the head of the Federalist Society, who's a member of the Armed Forces. He's an awesome guy.

/I'll admit he's outnumbered.
//I go to a "Catholic" law school, so there's a lot more Republicans than, say, at Yale.
 
2013-07-22 12:55:47 AM  

Rincewind53: feckingmorons: Abacus9: You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?

You don't have to own a car.

But you do have to have health care (literally everyone will incur a hospital bill in their lifetime). And someone has to pay for it. So it's either going to be the government and therefore your fellow taxpayers, or it's going to be you.


I love you.
 
2013-07-22 12:56:12 AM  

Rincewind53: feckingmorons: Abacus9: You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?

You don't have to own a car.

But you do have to have health care (literally everyone will incur a hospital bill in their lifetime). And someone has to pay for it. So it's either going to be the government and therefore your fellow taxpayers, or it's going to be you.


So people should have the choice to save up their own money, or buy insurance. I think you're an idiot if you don't buy insurance, but me getting superAIDS isn't going to make the guy next door have to replace his left front fender.
 
2013-07-22 12:56:22 AM  

rappy: Rincewind53: feckingmorons: Abacus9: You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?

You don't have to own a car.

But you do have to have health care (literally everyone will incur a hospital bill in their lifetime). And someone has to pay for it. So it's either going to be the government and therefore your fellow taxpayers, or it's going to be you.

I love you.


media.sdreader.com
 
2013-07-22 12:56:27 AM  
No, but I did eventually concede to the fact that it did not taste great (it tasted awful), but was indeed less filling.
 
2013-07-22 12:57:17 AM  

Rincewind53: But you do have to have health care


No you don't. It is entirely possible to choose not to receive health care. It doesn't make for a long life span, but it is possible.
 
2013-07-22 12:57:51 AM  

feckingmorons: So people should have the choice to save up their own money, or buy insurance. I think you're an idiot if you don't buy insurance, but me getting superAIDS isn't going to make the guy next door have to replace his left front fender.


The point is that if a person does  not buy healthcare, they are then forcing the rest of us to subsidize their health care. That is, as a taxpayer, I will pay  more money in both health care premiums and taxes, in order to pay for the person with no health insurance who has to go to the emergency room to get primary medical care.
 
2013-07-22 12:57:51 AM  

feckingmorons: Abacus9: You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?

You don't have to own a car.


You don't have to live.

brownlady79: Abacus9: No, I prefer to do my own thinking instead of having someone else do it for me. It makes me a riot at family get-togethers. Also this:

CommieTaoist: The older I get, the more liberal I get.

Yeah, my family are mostly all republicans and not afraid to voice it. I guess they all assume everyone they know are, too. They know now where I stand but I refuse to get into it with them because its not worth it.


Same here, both sides are ultra-conservative, and they consider me the libbiest lib that ever libbed (which isn't completely true). They also consider me the smartest in the family, go figure.
 
2013-07-22 12:58:25 AM  

feckingmorons: make me some tea: feckingmorons: I'd settle for the common mediocre.

What does that even mean?

I have no idea, this is a political discussion that started on TF.


Nice copout.
 
2013-07-22 12:58:40 AM  

EatenTheSun: Rincewind53: But you do have to have health care

No you don't. It is entirely possible to choose not to receive health care. It doesn't make for a long life span, but it is possible.


Even Christian Scientists get hit by cars.
 
2013-07-22 12:59:18 AM  

syrynxx: I don't support fining people who don't purchase 3rd-party health insurance.  The US government has no more right to force me to buy 3rd-party health insurance than it does to force me to buy ketchup or soup or footwear.  It certainly doesn't have the authority to penalize me for not buying a commercial product.


Quit whining like a baby. Congress and President Obama signed it into law. SCOTUS backed them up.

Be a responsible person and buy health insurance like a real American. Quit depending on us taxpayers to foot your bill when you get sick or hurt without coverage.
 
2013-07-22 12:59:55 AM  

feckingmorons: I'd settle for the common mediocre.

make me some tea: What does that even mean?

feckingmorons: I have no idea, this is a political discussion that started on TF.


About gotdang time, I say..
 
2013-07-22 01:00:40 AM  

feckingmorons: Rincewind53: feckingmorons: Abacus9: You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?

You don't have to own a car.

But you do have to have health care (literally everyone will incur a hospital bill in their lifetime). And someone has to pay for it. So it's either going to be the government and therefore your fellow taxpayers, or it's going to be you.

So people should have the choice to save up their own money, or buy insurance. I think you're an idiot if you don't buy insurance, but me getting superAIDS isn't going to make the guy next door have to replace his left front fender.


Yeah, you can buy a ton of health insurance with the net from those $145/wk service jobs. If you think there aren't millions of people in this country who work hard and take care of families and want to be contributors, not freeloaders, yet are completely hobbled by the lack of decent paying jobs, you are wilfully ignorant of reality.
 
2013-07-22 01:00:46 AM  

feckingmorons: Abacus9: You have to purchase auto insurance if you own a car. How is that different?

You don't have to own a car.


Because you don't need to own a  car.

Therefore you may not in your lifetime need to ever purchase auto insurance.

Health Insurance, on the other hand, is something everyone can and does access throughout the course of their lives.

Therefore if you know everyone is gonna take out of the system how does it not make sense to make everyone (who can) pay into the system?
 
2013-07-22 01:01:41 AM  
By the way, I'm still a moderate Democrat who certainly will not become a conservative. They whine too much on AM radio for my taste.
 
2013-07-22 01:01:45 AM  

Rincewind53: EatenTheSun: Rincewind53: But you do have to have health care

No you don't. It is entirely possible to choose not to receive health care. It doesn't make for a long life span, but it is possible.

Even Christian Scientists get hit by cars.


And they can refuse treatment for their injuries, and walk out in the woods and die if they want.
 
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