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(Independent)   From the better late then never ministry, Alan Turing to be pardoned   (independent.co.uk) divider line 27
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3837 clicks; posted to Geek » on 20 Jul 2013 at 6:30 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-20 04:48:12 PM  
6 votes:

quatchi: Nice gesture is nice albeit long overdue.


And what about all the other good folks in Britain over the centuries that were convicted and/or killed for being gay?  Not that Parliament should pay reparations or anything, but an apology would be nice.   You know, for firing, beating, raping and/or killing us over the years.  Also, a promise to STOP TREATING US LIKE shiat would be good.

Just sayin'.
2013-07-20 06:46:49 PM  
4 votes:
Jon iz teh kewl:  when we're just human

There's a test for that. And the majority of the net trolls would fail it.
2013-07-20 04:54:38 PM  
4 votes:
The man practically single-handedly broke the Nazi's encryption for the Brits and the Brits betrayed him after the war. I don't think a mere apology goes far enough.
2013-07-20 04:55:00 PM  
3 votes:

Benevolent Misanthrope: quatchi: Nice gesture is nice albeit long overdue.

And what about all the other good folks in Britain over the centuries that were convicted and/or killed for being gay?  Not that Parliament should pay reparations or anything, but an apology would be nice.   You know, for firing, beating, raping and/or killing us over the years.  Also, a promise to STOP TREATING US LIKE shiat would be good.

Just sayin'.


Not treating gay people like shiat works for me.

But it's not enuff.

Why not just declare a new national holiday in lieu of another apology?

Oscar Wilde Day.

A day to somberly reflect on the injustices historically dealt to the gay community and to celebrate snarky clever witticisms.

It would be epic.
2013-07-20 09:25:53 PM  
2 votes:
THAN
2013-07-21 02:51:43 AM  
1 votes:

epoch_destroi: I'm not saying the law shouldn't have been changed, but all this does is show people that no matter what law they break, they may be some day pardoned. Which is bullshiat.


The future always wins arguments with the past.
2013-07-20 10:03:54 PM  
1 votes:

RexTalionis: The man practically single-handedly broke the Nazi's encryption for the Brits and the Brits betrayed him after the war. I don't think a mere apology goes far enough.


He was no longer useful or needed and had to be put out of play. Realpolitik sucks.
2013-07-20 10:03:28 PM  
1 votes:

gingerjet: epoch_destroi: thunderbird8804: Hey dumbasses, pardoning Turing is a GOOD THING!

/Can never please these hysterical jackasses

Why is it good? I'm willing to listen. Please explain.

You never admit you farked up? You must be a joy to be around.

/not to mention it sends a positive message to the young brilliant gay kids


No, I think it's more important to dismantle farked up laws and do things for lgbt people here and now rather than dismissing somebody for actually breaking a law that existed.
2013-07-20 09:54:21 PM  
1 votes:

WhyteRaven74: epoch_destroi: Why should he be pardoned? It was against the law, and he broke the law, whether or not you like that law.

He was openly gay, during the 30s and through most of the 40s no one gave a damn. Then one day, for God knows what reason, they decided to care.


That's kind of how it goes with shiatty pointless laws.
2013-07-20 09:35:14 PM  
1 votes:

epoch_destroi: Why should he be pardoned? It was against the law, and he broke the law, whether or not you like that law.


He was openly gay, during the 30s and through most of the 40s no one gave a damn. Then one day, for God knows what reason, they decided to care.
2013-07-20 09:31:56 PM  
1 votes:
It is kinda confusing.  If you get thousands of men killed needlessly, and fark some tarted up seacow, you get an earldom; if you get thousands of men needlessly not-killed, and then fark one of them, you get death.  Ahh, Britain.
2013-07-20 09:13:50 PM  
1 votes:

gameshowhost: epoch_destroi: gameshowhost: epoch_destroi: Why should he be pardoned? It was against the law, and he broke the law, whether or not you like that law.

You're right.... enshrine the law in the Awesome Law Place Of The Most Awesome Laws!

I'm not saying the law shouldn't have been changed, but all this does is show people that no matter what law they break, they may be some day pardoned. Which is bullshiat.

Hey, I completely agree that laws targeting sexual orientation are utter shiat and shouldn't exist.  Yes, I agree that it'd be more than just nice to get a full apology from the gov't.

But I hope you're not suggesting that the act of pardoning be completely eliminated? It's still a useful tool for when the legal *system* fails to yield a fair/just/correct result (presuming the underlying law itself remains sound).


Maybe we just see it differently. What I would have liked to see is a public apology for the law, and a post-mortem apology to him for what happened to him in the hands of the law. But as farked up as the law was, he obviously broke it.

I don't know. I could very well be wrong. I just...feel weird about this.
2013-07-20 08:20:51 PM  
1 votes:

austerity101: epoch_destroi: Why should he be pardoned? It was against the law, and he broke the law, whether or not you like that law.

Exactly.  They should apologize for the law existing in the first place.  A pardon just insinuates that the law was a good one to begin with.


EXACTLY. Point out that the law was farked. A  padon is pointless.
2013-07-20 08:04:09 PM  
1 votes:

epoch_destroi: Why should he be pardoned? It was against the law, and he broke the law, whether or not you like that law.


Exactly.  They should apologize for the law existing in the first place.  A pardon just insinuates that the law was a good one to begin with.
2013-07-20 07:51:06 PM  
1 votes:
I don't like this.  Pardoning someone says, "Yeah, you did something wrong, but we're going to just ignore that crime you committed."  Turing didn't  do anything wrong, even if at the time what he was was a criminal offense.  Hiding behind "Well, it was illegal at the time" is just a cowardly, cultural-relativist way of avoiding the issue.

In lieu of a pardon, the British government should be publicly apologizing to those and to the surviving families of those who were convicted under this hateful law.  One at a time.  And build a memorial or something.
2013-07-20 07:49:26 PM  
1 votes:
As a Turing fan, I'm also alarmed that they would pardon him but not everyone else who was arrested for the same "crime." That doesn't seem fair at all.

Either way, it seems like an attempt to whitewash history.
2013-07-20 07:48:03 PM  
1 votes:
Why don't they pardon EVERY person who was jailed/etc... for being gay?
2013-07-20 07:45:47 PM  
1 votes:
So, he was forgiven for being persicuted? LOL WUT
2013-07-20 07:42:00 PM  
1 votes:

Glockenspiel Hero: IIRC, it was because he felt that a pardon would imply the conviction had been voided. He thought that it should remain on the books to remind people of what happens when you have laws that discriminate.

Thinking about it, I kind of agree with him. Don't pretend you never did something truly shameful


You remembered it with more rose-colored glasses than I did:

"A posthumous pardon was not considered appropriate as Alan Turing was properly convicted of what at the time was a criminal offence," he said.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16919012
2013-07-20 07:38:04 PM  
1 votes:
Better late than never would be creating a large, conspicuous monument of shame for the people who persecuted Turing.
2013-07-20 07:26:00 PM  
1 votes:

quatchi: Nice gesture is nice albeit long overdue.


He's dead and likely so are all the people involved with it. This makes no sense to me honestly. Background checks up at Jesus H. Christ's Heavenly Valley subdivision now?
2013-07-20 07:21:22 PM  
1 votes:

quatchi: Oscar Wilde Day. A day to somberly reflect on the injustices historically dealt to the gay community and to celebrate snarky clever witticisms.

It would be epic.


How about calling it Stephen Fry Appreciation Day instead? He's still alive and would probably get an kick out of it, and SFAD sounds better than OWD.
2013-07-20 06:45:18 PM  
1 votes:

Jon iz teh kewl: how can you "be" a homosexual.  that's like saying someone can "be" a pedophile.  when we're just human


How you can "be" a human?  When we're just mammals.
2013-07-20 06:29:34 PM  
1 votes:
FFS...

THEN != THAN!!!

Better late THAN never. Please go commit seppuku with a dull #2 pencil, to expiate the shame of what you have done.

/ unless that was a grammar troll
// then 9.5/10
2013-07-20 05:58:39 PM  
1 votes:

cman: Sure as shiat it is overdue.

Is there any upcoming anniversary of Turings life events that can give us a round number?


The centenary of Turing's life was last year. One of the cabinet ministers was asked to pardon Turing, but he refused.
2013-07-20 05:01:47 PM  
1 votes:
Ministry should be pardoned for it too. Right after it has been dead and gone as long as Turing has.
2013-07-20 04:41:23 PM  
1 votes:
Nice gesture is nice albeit long overdue.
 
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