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(Gawker)   Part-time is the new full-time   (gawker.com) divider line 114
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4230 clicks; posted to Business » on 15 Jul 2013 at 1:52 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-15 03:30:15 PM  

Katie98_KT: 12349876: Smeggy Smurf: Lost Thought 00: Simple fix for the law - Mandated health care requirement based off total employee hours worked, regardless of how many hours any individual employee works. So whether you have 50 employees working 30 hours a week or 75 employees working 20 per week, you still have to cough up health care contributions.

How about health insurance that is actual insurance?  Nobody files a car insurance claim to get the oil changed.  The same should be for medical.

The problem there being the human "oil changes" can prevent medical costs that make a new car look cheap.

medical insurance is like a combo of insurance and a service plan.

I have a service plan on my car that covers routine maitenance for 4 years (like oil changes). I also have car insurance, that covers me if its stolen, hit with things, etc.

I have medical insurance that covers routine maitenance (yearly checkups) plus insurance than covers if I get sick (appendicitis).

If anything, the medical insurance makes more sense.


Sure, but what happens if someone steals your kidney and drives off in your car?
 
2013-07-15 03:30:55 PM  

Weaver95: I like how our society is actively encouraging poor people to rise up and chop the heads off rich assholes. It's like nobody ever heard of the French revolution before.


Every time I read one of these threads, I wind up hating capitalism. Which is sad, because I don't want to get rid of capitalism, only make it more equitable to those who have less than me. But the people in these threads who defend capitalism are such assholes, they make socialism look like a carnival in comparison.
 
2013-07-15 03:33:33 PM  

ltdanman44:


Man, you really love that idiotic comment.
 
2013-07-15 03:34:47 PM  

JolobinSmokin: I'm not bothered by this.


because you got yours? Fark everyone else?
 
2013-07-15 03:35:25 PM  

graeth: Serves them right; they should have done something more with their lives instead of depending on others.
People need to be taught that there are consequences.


Graeth doesn't have a job!
 
2013-07-15 03:40:22 PM  
Things that should be run by the government:

Health care.
Education.
Pensions.
Prisons.

Nope, sorry, private companies have proven over and over that they aren't able to do this without screwing the customers. Maybe banking should be added to the list.
 
2013-07-15 03:43:19 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: Damn it feels good to have a career


Hold onto that feeling. I had a career, too, until Chase laid me off after 12 years of outstanding performance (no, really, I was in the top 10% and even earned their version of the employee of the quarter) because I lived in the wrong state. Three years later, I can't get a job at Petco because I'm overqualified but I don't have the connections here to get back into data analysis. I'm back in school to become a pharmacist.
 
2013-07-15 03:45:52 PM  
Lost Thought 00:

The French tried this. It did not work.

actually, it did work somewhat. meyerkev's chart proves it.

see that 33% decline in the unemployment rate starting just before 2000, and didn't tick up again until 2003, despite the global economic slowdown in 2000? in 1998, France lowered the work week to 5 hours from 40.
 
2013-07-15 03:47:44 PM  

Uncle Tractor: Things that should be run by the government:

Health care.
Education.
Pensions.
Prisons.

Nope, sorry, private companies have proven over and over that they aren't able to do this without screwing the customers. Maybe banking should be added to the list.


I'm okay with banking being a private enterprise. I think banks should separate from investment brokerages, like they were under Glass-Steagall.
 
2013-07-15 03:48:40 PM  

bbfreak: JolobinSmokin: I'm not bothered by this.

because you got yours? Fark everyone else?


no, I just have a high bother thresh hold.

/I do have mine tho
//lib
///hope others get some too
 
2013-07-15 03:49:24 PM  

Debeo Summa Credo: ltdanman44:

Man, you really love that idiotic comment.


And I love idiotically typing comment instead of comic.
 
2013-07-15 03:50:54 PM  
I guess Temp agencies are going to need to staff up because of all the increased demand for their services.
 
2013-07-15 03:53:01 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: 12349876: Smeggy Smurf: Lost Thought 00: Simple fix for the law - Mandated health care requirement based off total employee hours worked, regardless of how many hours any individual employee works. So whether you have 50 employees working 30 hours a week or 75 employees working 20 per week, you still have to cough up health care contributions.

How about health insurance that is actual insurance?  Nobody files a car insurance claim to get the oil changed.  The same should be for medical.

The problem there being the human "oil changes" can prevent medical costs that make a new car look cheap.

You can afford them if your premiums aren't insanely high.  $300+ a month for a healthy mid 30's woman because she has to be covered for pregnancy even though she's fixed is farking insane.


My former workplace offered 'modest' healthcare. It cost $743 a month for a single person, $1300 for two covered people and $1800 for three plus. The kicker was that my gross pay was only $1800 a month.

In addition to the unaffordable health care, they offered no training for a specialized, knowledge-based and stressful occupation. Officially, we had a 30 minute unpaid lunch, but unofficially at least 10 minutes was carved out of it for various reasons - lunch was offered at a fixed time (11:06 - 11:36) but clients didn't know that. The people who could tell them that information (and thus deflect or delay them while we had our lunches) willfully didn't so that the clients weren't inconvenienced.

My former workplace also wondered why there was such a high turn-over rate.
 
2013-07-15 03:56:01 PM  

JolobinSmokin: bbfreak: JolobinSmokin: I'm not bothered by this.

because you got yours? Fark everyone else?

no, I just have a high bother thresh hold.

/I do have mine tho
//lib
///hope others get some too


So you are one of the jackholes who doesn't care until something directly affects their life? You know those "salt of the earth types" who will claim the volcano isn't erupting until his feet burn off?
 
2013-07-15 03:57:13 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: bbfreak: vpb: Business have been hiring part timers to keep from having to pay full time benefits for decades.

[www.strangecosmos.com image 450x385]

Indeed, the new game in town is to hire temps instead.

Rush Limbaugh called that one years ago.  It is obvious to anybody with any sense of cynacism that it was going to happen that way.


Nothing new there, either.  A lot of companies have been using temps since the 1980's.
 
2013-07-15 03:58:12 PM  

Bung_Howdy: up is down and black is white...


And short is long?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KThlYHfIVa8
 
2013-07-15 03:58:21 PM  

Kittypie070: graeth: Serves them right; they should have done something more with their lives instead of depending on others.
People need to be taught that there are consequences.

Graeth doesn't have a job!


I lol'ed. Almost all over my desk in my office.
I miss being able to laugh at poor people who had chosen poorly. Then the government came in to kick natural selection in the balls.
 
2013-07-15 04:00:43 PM  
this is what france WANTED to do......  make a 30 hour work week
 
2013-07-15 04:03:42 PM  
What kills me is the outrage when businesses respond rationally to the incentives put before them. It's like shoving people over a cliff and being pissed off that gravity did what it normally does instead of what you hoped for.
 
2013-07-15 04:08:50 PM  

Mateorocks: FTA:

50 employees working 30 hours or more a week= mandatory insurance by employers

Even if that is correct, for a lot of companies it's cheaper to simply pay the penalties.


And therein lies the problem. Until penalties are a >1 multiplier of the cost, no one's ever going to obey these. It's like the banks that settled the overdraft penalty rearranging to maximize fees for a fraction of what they made. AND they earned interest on that money.
 
2013-07-15 04:13:08 PM  

nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: bbfreak: JolobinSmokin: I'm not bothered by this.

because you got yours? Fark everyone else?

no, I just have a high bother thresh hold.

/I do have mine tho
//lib
///hope others get some too

So you are one of the jackholes who doesn't care until something directly affects their life? You know those "salt of the earth types" who will claim the volcano isn't erupting until his feet burn off?


Nope, I'll be happy when ppl have universal healthcare and better wages and work quality.  I live in Oklahoma so these ppl with part time work who would be getting Medicaid but aren't because of republican jesus I know many of them.  I'll keep voting to get these part time workers benefits, but being from OKlahoma gives me a higher bother threshold, since ppl are constantly being farked over in this state and keep voting to be farked over.  This makes me not as bothered as some.

/but thanks for being a prejudiced dickhole
 
2013-07-15 04:16:12 PM  

Another Government Employee: Smeggy Smurf: bbfreak: vpb: Business have been hiring part timers to keep from having to pay full time benefits for decades.

[www.strangecosmos.com image 450x385]

Indeed, the new game in town is to hire temps instead.

Rush Limbaugh called that one years ago.  It is obvious to anybody with any sense of cynacism that it was going to happen that way.

Nothing new there, either.  A lot of companies have been using temps since the 1980's.


Fifteen years ago, people in my profession were about 80% employed and 20% independent contractors/temps. Over this time, those numbers have gradually reversed, and a large part of the reason is increased employer health care costs.

Whaddya gonna do?
 
2013-07-15 04:52:45 PM  
Law of Unintended Consequences, but I guess this is what happens when you suckered in to the "we have to do something" crowd of legislators and then have someone else write your legislation and then publicly cry out that, "You won't know what's in it until we pass it."

Turns out none of those dumb shiats knew what was in it or they would have seen this coming a mile away. This is what happens when your gov't lets stooges from various industries write your laws and them pimp it out without taking the time to examine it so that can say they "Did something." This is no different than the current  1200 page immigration bill. How many of the people that voted for it have read it? I bet i could count that number on one hand.
 
2013-07-15 04:59:38 PM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: Then abolish all taxes and laws and let people act like 'human beings'.


In other words: you got nuthin'.

If companies act like assholes, they get the hate. It doesn't matter what the law is. Just because screwing people over is legal doesn't mean they're above reproach.
 
2013-07-15 05:09:14 PM  

Mike Chewbacca: Smeggy Smurf: Damn it feels good to have a career

Hold onto that feeling. I had a career, too, until Chase laid me off after 12 years of outstanding performance (no, really, I was in the top 10% and even earned their version of the employee of the quarter) because I lived in the wrong state. Three years later, I can't get a job at Petco because I'm overqualified but I don't have the connections here to get back into data analysis. I'm back in school to become a pharmacist.


What state?  Willing to relocate?  Still interested in data analysis?
 
2013-07-15 05:13:32 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: Damn it feels good to have a career


Until you're expendable. You're a fool if you think you're not.
 
2013-07-15 05:23:16 PM  
A better idea is for restaurants to hire you as an intern so you can work for free. Colleges with English Departments should combine forces with fast food and restaurant companies to use summer internships for college students.
 
2013-07-15 05:29:48 PM  

Weaver95: I like how our society is actively encouraging poor people to rise up and chop the heads off rich assholes. It's like nobody ever heard of the French revolution before.


Revolution will never happen until people have nothing left to lose. We're still a LONG ways away from that. When I can no longer feed my family, I may be forced to turn to violence. Until then, I'll biatch about it on the internet, maybe take part in a meaningless protest, and then go vote for the guy who is a member of whichever of the two corporate owned political parties I have arbitrarily chosen to support.

The French peasants had literally nothing. The overwhelming majority of Americans have, at the very least, a roof over their heads, clothes on their backs and food in their bellies. It's really hard to build momentum for the overthrow of the government in a country where the largest threat to public health is obesity.
 
2013-07-15 05:35:04 PM  

JolobinSmokin: nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: bbfreak: JolobinSmokin: I'm not bothered by this.

because you got yours? Fark everyone else?

no, I just have a high bother thresh hold.

/I do have mine tho
//lib
///hope others get some too

So you are one of the jackholes who doesn't care until something directly affects their life? You know those "salt of the earth types" who will claim the volcano isn't erupting until his feet burn off?

Nope, I'll be happy when ppl have universal healthcare and better wages and work quality.  I live in Oklahoma so these ppl with part time work who would be getting Medicaid but aren't because of republican jesus I know many of them.  I'll keep voting to get these part time workers benefits, but being from OKlahoma gives me a higher bother threshold, since ppl are constantly being farked over in this state and keep voting to be farked over.  This makes me not as bothered as some.

/but thanks for being a prejudiced dickhole


Yes, I am prejudiced toward "not MY problem" assholes.

Sorry its a flaw.
 
2013-07-15 05:48:08 PM  

nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: bbfreak: JolobinSmokin: I'm not bothered by this.

because you got yours? Fark everyone else?

no, I just have a high bother thresh hold.

/I do have mine tho
//lib
///hope others get some too

So you are one of the jackholes who doesn't care until something directly affects their life? You know those "salt of the earth types" who will claim the volcano isn't erupting until his feet burn off?

Nope, I'll be happy when ppl have universal healthcare and better wages and work quality.  I live in Oklahoma so these ppl with part time work who would be getting Medicaid but aren't because of republican jesus I know many of them.  I'll keep voting to get these part time workers benefits, but being from OKlahoma gives me a higher bother threshold, since ppl are constantly being farked over in this state and keep voting to be farked over.  This makes me not as bothered as some.

/but thanks for being a prejudiced dickhole

Yes, I am prejudiced toward "not MY problem" assholes.

Sorry its a flaw.


Who is this not my problem asshole your talking too?
 
2013-07-15 05:50:11 PM  

graeth: Kittypie070: graeth: Serves them right; they should have done something more with their lives instead of depending on others.
People need to be taught that there are consequences.

Graeth doesn't have a job!

I lol'ed. Almost all over my desk in my office.
I miss being able to laugh at poor people who had chosen poorly. Then the government came in to kick natural selection in the balls.


Awright, so I was a bit off.

How about this?

What? Nope, not me. I never smile if I can help it. When someone smiles at me, all I see is a chimpanzee begging for its life. I never need to worry about those chimps in HR, or performance reviews while I'm pissing away the boss' time on Fark. I don't depend on a boss. Dependency is a vile weakness that should be punished.

I don't even depend on my job being here tomorrow.

Bananas.
 
2013-07-15 06:07:10 PM  

JolobinSmokin: nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: bbfreak: JolobinSmokin: I'm not bothered by this.

because you got yours? Fark everyone else?

no, I just have a high bother thresh hold.

/I do have mine tho
//lib
///hope others get some too

So you are one of the jackholes who doesn't care until something directly affects their life? You know those "salt of the earth types" who will claim the volcano isn't erupting until his feet burn off?

Nope, I'll be happy when ppl have universal healthcare and better wages and work quality.  I live in Oklahoma so these ppl with part time work who would be getting Medicaid but aren't because of republican jesus I know many of them.  I'll keep voting to get these part time workers benefits, but being from OKlahoma gives me a higher bother threshold, since ppl are constantly being farked over in this state and keep voting to be farked over.  This makes me not as bothered as some.

/but thanks for being a prejudiced dickhole

Yes, I am prejudiced toward "not MY problem" assholes.

Sorry its a flaw.

Who is this not my problem asshole your talking too?


A hint: he's also in denial about it.
 
2013-07-15 06:17:01 PM  

nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: nmemkha: JolobinSmokin: bbfreak: JolobinSmokin: I'm not bothered by this.

because you got yours? Fark everyone else?

no, I just have a high bother thresh hold.

/I do have mine tho
//lib
///hope others get some too

So you are one of the jackholes who doesn't care until something directly affects their life? You know those "salt of the earth types" who will claim the volcano isn't erupting until his feet burn off?

Nope, I'll be happy when ppl have universal healthcare and better wages and work quality.  I live in Oklahoma so these ppl with part time work who would be getting Medicaid but aren't because of republican jesus I know many of them.  I'll keep voting to get these part time workers benefits, but being from OKlahoma gives me a higher bother threshold, since ppl are constantly being farked over in this state and keep voting to be farked over.  This makes me not as bothered as some.

/but thanks for being a prejudiced dickhole

Yes, I am prejudiced toward "not MY problem" assholes.

Sorry its a flaw.

Who is this not my problem asshole your talking too?

A hint: he's also in denial about it.


Dude leave Tom cruise alone.
 
2013-07-15 08:13:00 PM  

Tommy Moo: This is a good thing. We should be transitioning to a part time labor economy. Automation relieves the demand for human labor. This in turn either creates high unemployment or shorter work weeks. I for one would rather see a world with everyone working 30 hours than with 3/4 of the people working 40 and 1/4 not working at all. What we need to do is to change our paradigms and stop seeing 30 hour weeks as "part time." Why not call 40 hour weeks overtime instead? Give people mandated benefits at 30 hours and time and a half for everything over that. What unemployment problem? It would drop to 2% overnight.



If part-time work paid enough to get by on (and still came with adequate health insurance), more people would do it.  I know I would.
 
2013-07-15 10:39:35 PM  

Debeo Summa Credo: Lost Thought 00: Simple fix for the law - Mandated health care requirement based off total employee hours worked, regardless of how many hours any individual employee works. So whether you have 50 employees working 30 hours a week or 75 employees working 20 per week, you still have to cough up health care contributions.

Or, just get rid of the employer mandate altogether. Much simpler!


Single payer, or getting employers out of the picture altogether would be waaaaay better.  My company really only should be on the hook for workers comp if I get hurt on or because of the job.  I think it's ludicrous that buying your health insurance on the individual market is done with post-tax income, as opposed to when it's employer provided it's pre-tax.  farking stupid, and it's been that way for 50 years.
 
2013-07-15 10:48:06 PM  

Bung_Howdy: up is down and black Hispanic is white...


/only shades of gray


Sorry had to do it
 
2013-07-15 10:59:45 PM  

vpb: Business have been hiring part timers to keep from having to pay full time benefits for decades.

[www.strangecosmos.com image 450x385]


Well, as long as we can defend Obama from perceived slights, that's OK then.
 
2013-07-15 11:04:50 PM  

sendtodave: Well, as long as we can defend Obama from perceived slights, that's OK then.


It's really hard not to sound like a rabid Obama fanatic when the right-wing tries to connect every last negative effect of everything that's ever happened back to Obama's direct action or inaction. Proving them wrong invariably sounds like defending Obama.
 
2013-07-15 11:15:41 PM  

Tommy Moo: This is a good thing. We should be transitioning to a part time labor economy. Automation relieves the demand for human labor. This in turn either creates high unemployment or shorter work weeks. I for one would rather see a world with everyone working 30 hours than with 3/4 of the people working 40 and 1/4 not working at all. What we need to do is to change our paradigms and stop seeing 30 hour weeks as "part time." Why not call 40 hour weeks overtime instead? Give people mandated benefits at 30 hours and time and a half for everything over that. What unemployment problem? It would drop to 2% overnight.


Shorter work weeks were always a goal in the past.  Why did people expect that there would be no pay cuts?

Increased efficiency does NOT increase wages.  It does the opposite.  Though it does bring down the cost of goods.

Increased efficiency is a race to the bottom for everyone but the owners.
 
2013-07-15 11:16:30 PM  

Sergeant Grumbles: sendtodave: Well, as long as we can defend Obama from perceived slights, that's OK then.

It's really hard not to sound like a rabid Obama fanatic when the right-wing tries to connect every last negative effect of everything that's ever happened back to Obama's direct action or inaction. Proving them wrong invariably sounds like defending Obama.


You can just ignore them, you know.
 
2013-07-15 11:20:16 PM  
http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/users/rauch/worktime/

Always thought this was interesting.

An average worker needs to work a mere 11 hours per week to produce as much as one working 40 hours per week in 1950...

The average worker would therefore need to work only 23 hours per week to produce as much as one working as recently as 1975...

And, if the productivity measures have any meaning, the average worker could have a 29-hour workweek if he were satisfied with producing as much as a 40-hour worker as recently as 1990.
 
2013-07-15 11:22:11 PM  

sendtodave: You can just ignore them, you know.


What's stopping you?
 
2013-07-15 11:31:57 PM  

Sergeant Grumbles: sendtodave: You can just ignore them, you know.

What's stopping you?


Boredom, mostly.
 
2013-07-15 11:34:09 PM  

sendtodave: Boredom, mostly.


Here, we can agree.
 
2013-07-16 12:38:55 AM  
the only true solution is to ban health insurance altogether and require full transparent pricing of medical services.

/never mix socialism with captialism, you get the worst of both worlds
 
2013-07-16 12:41:15 AM  

Smeggy Smurf: 12349876: Smeggy Smurf: Lost Thought 00: Simple fix for the law - Mandated health care requirement based off total employee hours worked, regardless of how many hours any individual employee works. So whether you have 50 employees working 30 hours a week or 75 employees working 20 per week, you still have to cough up health care contributions.

How about health insurance that is actual insurance?  Nobody files a car insurance claim to get the oil changed.  The same should be for medical.

The problem there being the human "oil changes" can prevent medical costs that make a new car look cheap.

You can afford them if your premiums aren't insanely high.  $300+ a month for a healthy mid 30's woman because she has to be covered for pregnancy even though she's fixed is farking insane.


Maybe if you're only talking checkups it could work.  But if you're talking allergy medication and cholesterol medication and diabetes medication and colonoscopies and mammograms no way are you going to be able to in our current system.  And there will always be dumbasses and who have a ridiculously low breaking point for checkup vs. no checkup and those people will be hitting YOUR pocketbook in the end.
 
2013-07-16 12:48:05 AM  

mr lawson: /never mix socialism with captialism, you get the worst of both worlds


But neither pure socialism nor pure capitalism works either. What do?
 
2013-07-16 01:22:45 AM  

Sergeant Grumbles: mr lawson: /never mix socialism with captialism, you get the worst of both worlds

But neither pure socialism nor pure capitalism works either. What do?


Well, there is indeed some cool sh*t in both.

So you take only the cool sh*t from one and blend in the cool sh*t from the other.

Trouble is, you gotta get the correct definition of "sh*t".
 
2013-07-16 01:32:13 AM  
Employers also are also considering workarounds. Mark Lettelleir, chief executive of M.B.A. Inc., a human-resources firm in St. Petersburg, Fla., is helping several different area restaurants manage their staff so they can share employees. The test program, which is expected to begin in the fourth quarter, will involve about 500 employees of both chain and local restaurants looking to retain their full-time employees without counting them as such.

A smart lawyer could make the case that the employers of these workers are not the individual restaurants but the partnership formed to share them, which should still be required to treat them as full-time employees.
 
2013-07-16 06:00:58 AM  

Cornelius Dribble: A smart lawyer could make the case that the employers of these workers are not the individual restaurants but the partnership formed to share them, which should still be required to treat them as full-time employees.


The counter-argument being that the only thing they share in common is one person managing both their scheduling needs, and are otherwise independent organizations. If the restaurant is clever, they'll outsource the scheduling as well, thus eliminating the so-called "partnership" before it's even formed.
 
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