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(MSN)   Zimmerman worried about vigilantes who may try to take the law into their own hands   (news.msn.com) divider line 825
    More: Ironic, George Zimmerman, attorney-in-fact, Latin phrases, Mark O'Mara, manslaughter  
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7837 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Jul 2013 at 4:06 PM (51 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-14 09:10:44 PM
phygz:

In other words, yep. just stupid

yup...exactly
 
2013-07-14 09:11:00 PM

Elegy: You might want to ask Roderick Scott about that, a black man who was acquitted of manslaughter charges when he shot a 17 year old white teen who attacked him.

Bonus multiplier: the white kid never touched him
C-c-combo: New York case

/funny how that case didn't become a national call of justice, isn't it?


My fault for not adding the disclaimer that in the centuries-long history of America, past killers of white kids have gone free. But I'm willing to concede that if GZ had confronted THREE TM's then there wouldn't be a problem with his acquittal. After all, we want to make both cases analogous, don't we?

/Again, the race of the shooter in these instances matter not. Though I'm sure debating how much slack black defendants get in the legal system would be a lot of fun.
 
2013-07-14 09:11:03 PM

clowncar on fire: Carth: clowncar on fire: MelGoesOnTour: I for one am sick of the Martin "supporters". They're the type of people who are always actively looking to cry "racism" at every opportunity. Sheesh. Give it a farkin' break, man!

I'm not a Travon supporter. However, I support the fact that someone who walks into a situation of his own making and then shoots someone else "in self defense" even less...

I commend the kid for keeping his distance and his recognition that poking around in other people's property is suspicious- adults have become so unreliable these days-- regret that kids can't just be smart enough to make harmless requests rather then being sneaky about things.  Had they have done so, the boy was welcome to hang out on ...

Zimmerman says exactly what he found suspicious about him during the 911 call and in his statements read at court. Did you listen to the trial at all?

I'm freakin' middle class peasant.  I work.  Who has time for that tripe.  I rely strictly on Fark when I want to know what really happened.  So what exactly did Zimmerman find so "suspicion worthy" that he needed confront after being told to stand down?


The kid was walking down the street being black.

I once took this call when I was an emergency dispatcher. The call went something like this:
"Bel-Air Patrol, what's your emergency?"
"There's a black man walking down Beverly Blvd., and I want you to send someone!"
".....Okay. What's he doing?"
"He's walking down the sidewalk! How soon can your officer be here?"
"Uh.....Is he in your yard?"
"No! He's just walking down the street!"
"Is he trash picking?" (something we'd been having trouble with at that time)
"No!"
"Okay, how is he dressed?"
"He's wearing jeans and a t-shirt! I want an officer here right away!"
"Um, all right, I'll let the officer in the area know. Did you want contact?"
"No! Just get someone here right away!" (click)

If my caller had been a Hispanic wannabe cop instead of a piss-ass white suburbanite, he might have gone out and confronted the black man walking down Beverly Blvd., but luckily, he didn't; and I did not notify my guard in the area, who also, IIRC was black.

Zimmerman thought it was sufficiently suspicious that a black person would be in his neighborhood at that hour and he wanted (instead of my caller) to do something about this black person, rather than calling the cops who would stop Martin, find out he was just looking for his girlfriend and let him go. Zimmerman wanted to be Charles Bronson in "Death Wish" + Dirty Harry; and if Martin really had been the badass thug everyone seems to think he was, Zimmerman would have been deader than shiat when Martin pulled out his own gun and capped his ass. Instead, Zimmerman got the ass-whipping he so richly deserved, and probably really was in genuine fear of his life when he fired.

Now if Martin had been a little LESS of a thug, he would have just stopped when confronted by Zimmerman, told his dim-witted girlfriend to call the cops herself, and waited for them to show up; but he was a kid and playing his own game of quien es mas macho; sadly, he lost. There are no winners in this scenario.
 
2013-07-14 09:11:19 PM

dapharmer: heres some logic for all of you

you have a daughter.. she has racy.. some may say slutty.. pictures of herself on her phone. she gets raped.. in the trial the defense of the rapist uses the pictures on her phone to cite she had been a whorish slut and therefore the rapist committed no crime.

how is that any different then the precedent set by the more red colored neck members of the fark crowd who think pictures of a teenager emulating the people society gives them as role models.. is justification for their death at the hands of a pathetic fat wanna be cop.

both sides of this argument are pretty damn pathetic in their rhetoric, but those who are trying to turn this into justification to shoot an unarmed teen who you think looks dangerous to you... i hope karma comes and rapes your daughters or your mothers , or better yet bends you over and ass rapes you and justifies it by pointing out fark posts you've made that clearly prove your an attention seeking whore who deserves the ass raping.


You're missing the specific Rape Shield Laws that prevent this sort of thing at a rape trial.  There aren't Dumb Kid on the Internet Shield Laws.
 
2013-07-14 09:12:02 PM

Representative of the unwashed masses: SevenizGud: Here is Trayvon Martin in his natural habitat, displaying his normal philosophy towards others. In short, his philosophy is fark YOU. And he's saying it to YOU. fark YOU. YOU! fark YOU!

Now please...apologize for him. Go on...you know you can do it. Apologize for the little drug-addled, tattooed, fark you-gesturing thug. Do it. You know you can't keep from apologizing for him. Apologize for him. Do it! Do it now!

[img21.imageshack.us image 501x432]


easy, the kid was carrying only skittles and iced tea, he was doing nothing illegal when Zimmerman decided to follow him resulting in the altercation.  he was no alter boy but he didn't deserve to die.


This.

Also, I can't think of how many Farkers tell stories of stupid shiat they used to do, bad attitudes, crazy stunts, lives of crime and just sheer debauchery.

And that was before I was 21.

But I guess if you're 17, black and male there is no hope or chance that you will grow up, change - especially when you have parents who give a damn about you.

Trayvon may have been a teenage jerk. I can't really think of too many teenagers who aren't. But he was afraid of the guy following him and he had good right to be. He's dead. He stood up for himself and maybe thought he was protecting a younger child at home by not leading some idiot back to his house.  And he's dead.

I know that I'm not the person I was at 17. I'm not even the person I was last year. George Zimmerman did play judge, jury and executioner and he snuffed out a life...no one knows who or what Trayvon Martin may have become...and now we never will.

This quote sounds bibilical, but it's not.

Not what thou art, not what thou hast been, beholdeth God with His merciful eye, but what thou wouldst be.

George Zimmerman looked at Trayvon Martin and decided he was nothing. George Zimmerman is not God.

I hope he never knows a peaceful moment in this life or the next.
 
2013-07-14 09:12:12 PM

parasol: I find these posts interesting


clowncar on fire: Amusing actually.


Why? Where were these passionate people when the actual evidence was being revealed and discussed? All I see now are speculation and misrepresentations of events that, at best, were openly discussed during the trial and, at worst, have been publicly available since charges were originally filed.

Why should anyone here respect a person who's continually deploying emotionally- and racially-charged rherotic and slogans for dramatic effect, and whose actual words reveal that they have zero familiarity with even the most basic details of the case?

In what way is that sort of person deserving of consideration or rebuttal? It rapidly becomes clear that a large number of people who have flocked to this discussion since the verdict are, at best, trolls, and at worst, the equivalent of proud low-information voters who passionately buy into the lies and slogans of their intellectual superiors and loudly shout down anyone who disagrees.
 
2013-07-14 09:12:49 PM

Treygreen13: dapharmer: heres some logic for all of you

you have a daughter.. she has racy.. some may say slutty.. pictures of herself on her phone. she gets raped.. in the trial the defense of the rapist uses the pictures on her phone to cite she had been a whorish slut and therefore the rapist committed no crime.

how is that any different then the precedent set by the more red colored neck members of the fark crowd who think pictures of a teenager emulating the people society gives them as role models.. is justification for their death at the hands of a pathetic fat wanna be cop.

both sides of this argument are pretty damn pathetic in their rhetoric, but those who are trying to turn this into justification to shoot an unarmed teen who you think looks dangerous to you... i hope karma comes and rapes your daughters or your mothers , or better yet bends you over and ass rapes you and justifies it by pointing out fark posts you've made that clearly prove your an attention seeking whore who deserves the ass raping.

This is the kind of post that should gets someone a ban.


Notify moderators about it and it probably will. Direct threats against other farkers is a no no.
 
2013-07-14 09:13:34 PM

gadian: You're missing the specific Rape Shield Laws that prevent this sort of thing at a rape trial.  There aren't Dumb Kid on the Internet Shield Laws.


thats funny considering it was exactly what was tried to be used in the defense of those asshole kids in ohio.. both in court and in these same forums.. likely by the same people trying to justify the shooting of an unarmed kid
 
2013-07-14 09:17:50 PM

dapharmer: heres some logic for all of you

you have a daughter.. she has racy.. some may say slutty.. pictures of herself on her phone. she gets raped.. in the trial the defense of the rapist uses the pictures on her phone to cite she had been a whorish slut and therefore the rapist committed no crime.

how is that any different then the precedent set by the more red colored neck members of the fark crowd who think pictures of a teenager emulating the people society gives them as role models.. is justification for their death at the hands of a pathetic fat wanna be cop.

both sides of this argument are pretty damn pathetic in their rhetoric, but those who are trying to turn this into justification to shoot an unarmed teen who you think looks dangerous to you... i hope karma comes and rapes your daughters or your mothers , or better yet bends you over and ass rapes you and justifies it by pointing out fark posts you've made that clearly prove your an attention seeking whore who deserves the ass raping.


Which just emphasizes the stupidity of Florida law. Where I come from past history in any form is not permitted in the guilt stage of a criminal trial, only in the punishment phase. But Florida allows it, and that naturally opens the door to put the victim on trial.

And as not a few commentators have noted, Florida has no problem certifying 14 year olds as adults to face adult punishment (and the death penalty until SCOTUS prohibited recently) yet these prosecutors made a huge issue of Treyvon being 17 and calling him "a child."

Florida is just farked up, it richly deserves its tag here on Fark.
 
2013-07-14 09:24:53 PM

dapharmer: you have a daughter.. she has racy.. some may say slutty.. pictures of herself on her phone. she gets raped.. in the trial the defense of the rapist uses the pictures on her phone to cite she had been a whorish slut and therefore the rapist committed no crime.


According to your logic, your daughter went down on the rapist and let him put it in her pooper before crying rape.
 
2013-07-14 09:28:08 PM
In the trial, was there ever once a statistical breakdown of the racial make-up of the "suspects" Zimmerman has called the police on in his "duties"? If they were trying to prove profiling, you know damn well they did one.

Must have also gone counter to their claim.
 
2013-07-14 09:28:24 PM

Molavian: dapharmer: you have a daughter.. she has racy.. some may say slutty.. pictures of herself on her phone. she gets raped.. in the trial the defense of the rapist uses the pictures on her phone to cite she had been a whorish slut and therefore the rapist committed no crime.

According to your logic, your daughter went down on the rapist and let him put it in her pooper before crying rape.


not my logic... the logic of the fark world... if you think i truly believe what i said then you fail at the internets and "logic"
 
2013-07-14 09:32:46 PM

Popcorn Johnny: The Great EZE: That's just the way it is, has been since the founding of America. Are you denying that the lives of black men aren't traditionally held at a lower perceived value relative to other people in the country?

What's the way it is? This incident made it's way through the legal system and the jury made a decision. Either you can point out racial bias along the way, or you have to be accusing the jury of making a ruling based on race.


Again, my statement is much broader than this case and this jury. We're living in a society where an unarmed kid can be shot in the street and, when proven that he wasn't doing anything illegal, the knee-jerk reaction is, "Let's check his records for school suspensions, drug use, and stupid social media pictures!" Whether you absorbed every word related to the case or whether you live under a rock, it is a mentality engrained in every person (black, white, young, old, male, female, otherwise) on some level and influences the judgements they make.


I'm not saying this information was used as part of GM's legal defense. But if you don't think somebody might have been influenced by the possibility that TM did something in the past to deserve it, you're hopelessly naive.


No, this doesn't mean the jury is full of cross-burning Klanswomen. Back to my original point: how can you say certain people are held to an equal standard when they get killed for Walking While Black and still need to defend their character from beyond the grave?
 
2013-07-14 09:36:28 PM

TheSup3rN0va: Holy ignore list, Batman. Only 5-6 posts per page aren't grayed out. The derp is out in full force today :(

Unfortunately, for the most part, no way to tell who's trolling and  who actually believes this nonsense


You're not wrong. The rest of the world is. Although,, you probably can't see this cause most of the world is on ignore due to racism.
 
2013-07-14 09:38:30 PM

amiable: Because the Roderick Scott case was an entirely different set of circumstances where the white kid in question was on his property breaking into his car at the time (he didn't chase him anywhere or stalk him he just walked outside and told them to leave).


The argument was that the justice system doesn't care about dead black teens as it does dead white teens. Do try to keep up.

amiable: Several eye-witnesses corroborated Roderick Scott's story/self-defense claim


You mean just like in the Zimmerman case?

The Great EZE: My fault for not adding the disclaimer that in the centuries-long history of America, past killers of white kids have gone free. But I'm willing to concede that if GZ had confronted THREE TM's then there wouldn't be a problem with his acquittal. After all, we want to make both cases analogous, don't we?


Somehow I doubt that. This was a nationally aired trial, where are the facts were there for anyone interested in them to see. Despite that, we still have people repeating erroneous bullshiat even after the trial is done: illegal stalking; ordered by police to not pursue; injuries insufficient to a self-defense claim; SYG a legal defense to the case; etc. etc. The level of ignorance is staggering, quite frankly.

I cited an analgous case to counter the implied claim "if Martin hadn't been black there would be justice." The teenager Scott shot didn't even touch him, whereas Zimmerman clearly got his ass beat. The other two teens just stood there. That's an argument that would go to your side of this argument, not mine, because at least in the Zimmerman case we have some clear proof that Zimmerman had a direct reason to fear for his life (his injuries), versus the Scott case where the teenager never even reached him.

And yet, the jury came back with a clear verdict of self-defense.

The Great EZE: Again, the race of the shooter in these instances matter not. Though I'm sure debating how much slack black defendants get in the legal system would be a lot of fun.


Again, the 17 year old Scott shot was white, so we are arguing about the race of the victim.

I would agree that there are problems of racial bias in the judicial system in general, but I would argue strenously that they do not apply to the Zimmerman case. Zimmerman had a clear claim of self-defense, and clear evidence to prove that claim. It wasn't a matter of the jury not caring about the death of a black teenager, except to the idiots that are still beating that drum. The evidence was there for everyone to see, including the jury.

This is not the civil rights case you are looking for. Sorry. It's just not.
 
2013-07-14 09:39:17 PM

HAMMERTOE: In the trial, was there ever once a statistical breakdown of the racial make-up of the "suspects" Zimmerman has called the police on in his "duties"? If they were trying to prove profiling, you know damn well they did one.

Must have also gone counter to their claim.


No, because that's not evidence the judge would have allowed as permissible. As scared shiatless as Florida is about blah people there are, surprisingly, still enough good attorneys and judges left who know the legislature is full of shiat.
 
2013-07-14 09:39:56 PM

TuteTibiImperes: markb289: TuteTibiImperes: Azlefty: I hear he has made quite a tidy profit, with at least one book deal to come. On the other hand, the civil suits haven't even started yet

That was covered pretty well in last nights thread; under Florida law he is immune from civil suits since he was acquitted.

While that sucks for the Martin family, I do agree with that - if you're acquitted in a criminal case you shouldn't face civil liability for the same incident.

Why? The standard of proof is completely different and the defendant cannot refuse to testify in a civil suit. There's a much greater likelyhood of getting to the truth in a civil suit.

Personally I believe the standard of proof for civil suits is too low, and they don't require unanimous verdicts.  The criminal system get's it right, IMO, and the burden of proof shouldn't be less just because it's a civil case.


The burden of proof in Criminal cases is higher because the defendant's life and liberty are at stake. A civil suit is just about money.
 
2013-07-14 09:40:28 PM

Owangotang: tenpoundsofcheese: Owangotang: Popcorn Johnny: Owangotang: Funny how all you do is stir the pot with asinine ramblings and cannot even see the hypocrisy in choosing to respond to me with a picture of one person hitting another in the face. Think real hard about why that makes you an idiot.

I've tried a thousand times to discuss the facts with members of Team Trayvon. People such as yourself refuse to ignore the evidence in the case and continue making preposterous assumptions, most that are directly contradicted by the evidence. A silly picture is all the recognition you deserve.

And yet I have stated throughout that legally Zimmerman was not guilty. That does not stop me from believing he did it and that while legal justice was served moral justice was not. Nothing I have stated was contradicted by any hard evidence. If you choose to believe Zimmerman's every word go ahead, but you're believing someone who lied about how much money he had for his legal defense, and you are believing someone who took his story to a right-wing mouthpiece in a calculated move.

I refuse to believe someone who keeps lying about what George said about his financial situation.
Bye bye!

http://gawker.com/5915713/george-zimmermans-lawyer-admits-his-client -l ied-about-his-finances

Hey look, it's almost like you are willfully choosing to distort the truth in favor of Zimmerman! Naw, I am sure that's not it...


Where does it say that George lied to the court?
Someone else (his wife) mis-stated their finances to the court, not George.
 
2013-07-14 09:42:14 PM

The Great EZE: I'm not saying this information was used as part of GM's GZ's legal defense.

 
2013-07-14 09:47:55 PM

Hermione_Granger: Representative of the unwashed masses: SevenizGud: Here is Trayvon Martin in his natural habitat, displaying his normal philosophy towards others. In short, his philosophy is fark YOU. And he's saying it to YOU. fark YOU. YOU! fark YOU!

Now please...apologize for him. Go on...you know you can do it. Apologize for the little drug-addled, tattooed, fark you-gesturing thug. Do it. You know you can't keep from apologizing for him. Apologize for him. Do it! Do it now!

[img21.imageshack.us image 501x432]


easy, the kid was carrying only skittles and iced tea, he was doing nothing illegal when Zimmerman decided to follow him resulting in the altercation.  he was no alter boy but he didn't deserve to die.

This.

Also, I can't think of how many Farkers tell stories of stupid shiat they used to do, bad attitudes, crazy stunts, lives of crime and just sheer debauchery.

And that was before I was 21.

But I guess if you're 17, black and male there is no hope or chance that you will grow up, change - especially when you have parents who give a damn about you.

Trayvon may have been a teenage jerk. I can't really think of too many teenagers who aren't. But he was afraid of the guy following him and he had good right to be. He's dead. He stood up for himself and maybe thought he was protecting a younger child at home by not leading some idiot back to his house.  And he's dead.

I know that I'm not the person I was at 17. I'm not even the person I was last year. George Zimmerman did play judge, jury and executioner and he snuffed out a life...no one knows who or what Trayvon Martin may have become...and now we never will.

This quote sounds bibilical, but it's not.

Not what thou art, not what thou hast been, beholdeth God with His merciful eye, but what thou wouldst be.

George Zimmerman looked at Trayvon Martin and decided he was nothing. George Zimmerman is not God.

I hope he never knows a peaceful moment in this life or the next.


"I hope he never knows a peaceful moment in this life or the next...."

For someone that talks about God quite a bit, that doesn't sound very Christian of you.
 
2013-07-14 09:49:40 PM

The Great EZE: We're living in a society where an unarmed kid can be shot in the street and, when proven that he wasn't doing anything illegal, the knee-jerk reaction is, "Let's check his records for school suspensions, drug use, and stupid social media pictures!"


That only happens when the person involved is black?
 
2013-07-14 09:50:31 PM

Elegy: I would agree that there are problems of racial bias in the judicial system in general, but I would argue strenously that they do not apply to the Zimmerman case. Zimmerman had a clear claim of self-defense, and clear evidence to prove that claim. It wasn't a matter of the jury not caring about the death of a black teenager, except to the idiots that are still beating that drum. The evidence was there for everyone to see, including the jury.

This is not the civil rights case you are looking for. Sorry. It's just not.


How clear can Zimmerman's claim of self-defense be with ambiguous eyewitnesses and a victim too dead to tell his side of the story? He and his friends basically had a clear path to create whatever self-defense story can get him off. Frankly, if he would've gotten convicted his lawyers should have been immediately banished to careers of ice road trucking.
 
2013-07-14 09:52:05 PM
You guys are still arguing with all the morons that never bothered to inform themselves?  Yeah, I gave up on that a few threads ago and pretty much stick to snark now.  That said, I suppose its good they get a thread where the overwhelming majority of morons can stroke each other's egos and bathe in the tears of alleged injustice.  It had to be rough there for a while where people kept shoving logic and reason in their faces until they all cried and either came to the realization that their wasn't enough evidence to disprove it was self-defense or leave in a fiery ball of moderation.
 
2013-07-14 09:53:27 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Where does it say that George lied to the court?
Someone else (his wife) mis-stated their finances to the court, not George.


This is a prime example of the Zimmerman fanbois buying into all his lies. He had some $130,000 in his bank account. Then his wife transferred it all out to his sister's and her account in three separate transactions after
Zimmerman told her in coded language how to do it. It's all on tape.

It's just more evidence of his manipulation of law enforcement and the judicial system his right wing, gun-loving supporters believe, while simultaneously arguing every stupid thing that points to his culpability in Treyvon's death.

I don't know if Florida has conspiracy statute, but if they do now is the time to use it.
 
2013-07-14 09:54:26 PM

dapharmer: heres some logic for all of you

you have a daughter.. she has racy.. some may say slutty.. pictures of herself on her phone. she gets raped.. in the trial the defense of the rapist uses the pictures on her phone to cite she had been a whorish slut and therefore the rapist committed no crime.

how is that any different then the precedent set by the more red colored neck members of the fark crowd who think pictures of a teenager emulating the people society gives them as role models.. is justification for their death at the hands of a pathetic fat wanna be cop.

both sides of this argument are pretty damn pathetic in their rhetoric, but those who are trying to turn this into justification to shoot an unarmed teen who you think looks dangerous to you... i hope karma comes and rapes your daughters or your mothers , or better yet bends you over and ass rapes you and justifies it by pointing out fark posts you've made that clearly prove your an attention seeking whore who deserves the ass raping.


Well,, That's not racist hate speech at all. Nope,, Not one bit. Not the red neck thing, or the rape your mothers and daughters thing,,,, or the just plain "rape you up the arse"  thing. Yeah,,, good thing you said "karma" instead of "my black ass" or someone might have thought that was racist.
 
2013-07-14 09:55:39 PM

Popcorn Johnny: The Great EZE: We're living in a society where an unarmed kid can be shot in the street and, when proven that he wasn't doing anything illegal, the knee-jerk reaction is, "Let's check his records for school suspensions, drug use, and stupid social media pictures!"

That only happens when the person involved is black?


No. It also happens when the victim is a female accuser of sexual assault.

Come on, do you actually believe we DON'T have a habit of groping for information to support our prejudices lest we feel too sympathetic to "others"?
 
2013-07-14 09:57:52 PM
Little Florida law to stir up the pot

Florida justice system is on the line. It seems obvious that the arrest of George Zimmerman violated the Florida statues.
776.012 Use of force in defense of person.-
A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other's imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:
(1)He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
(2)Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.
History.-s. 13, ch. 74-383; s. 1188, ch. 97-102; s. 2, ch. 2005-27.
776.032Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of force.-

See that bolded part. Yep
 
2013-07-14 09:59:19 PM

Abuse Liability: You guys are still arguing with all the morons that never bothered to inform themselves?  Yeah, I gave up on that a few threads ago and pretty much stick to snark now.


Oh, i've got most of the regulars set aside.  I do like to give the new guys some...education, everyone deserves a chance to get informed.

I have outright set a couple aside though, those screaming about zimm's lies, for example.  Obviously not worth the time.
 
2013-07-14 10:01:42 PM

Abuse Liability: Little Florida law to stir up the pot


Florida law applies to Florida prosecutions and civil actions, not Federal.
 
2013-07-14 10:02:48 PM

jaytkay: Abuse Liability: Little Florida law to stir up the pot

Florida law applies to Florida prosecutions and civil actions, not Federal.


Yeah, Too bad the federal civil rights case is dead in the water.

Try again.
 
2013-07-14 10:03:53 PM

omeganuepsilon: Abuse Liability: You guys are still arguing with all the morons that never bothered to inform themselves?  Yeah, I gave up on that a few threads ago and pretty much stick to snark now.

Oh, i've got most of the regulars set aside.  I do like to give the new guys some...education, everyone deserves a chance to get informed.

I have outright set a couple aside though, those screaming about zimm's lies, for example.  Obviously not worth the time.


Aye, but it's like the same 30 of us trying to explain over and over again. It becomes tiring.
 
2013-07-14 10:05:25 PM

jaytkay: Abuse Liability: Little Florida law to stir up the pot

Florida law applies to Florida prosecutions and civil actions, not Federal.


Just so you're sure.  The federal case is laughably stupid.
 
2013-07-14 10:05:36 PM

Elegy: amiable: Because the Roderick Scott case was an entirely different set of circumstances where the white kid in question was on his property breaking into his car at the time (he didn't chase him anywhere or stalk him he just walked outside and told them to leave).

The argument was that the justice system doesn't care about dead black teens as it does dead white teens. Do try to keep up.

amiable: Several eye-witnesses corroborated Roderick Scott's story/self-defense claim

You mean just like in the Zimmerman case?


No, the argument is that had the races been reversed, you would have seen a  different outcome, which the case you cited proves nicely (the African american, under much more meritorious circumstances and in a far more liberal state was still immediately arrested).

Really?  Could you list the eyewitness's that corroborated George Zimmerman's story?  I'll wait.

If you are going to comment on the trial, at least have some basic knowledge of what occurred.
 
2013-07-14 10:05:39 PM

Abuse Liability: Little Florida law to stir up the pot

Florida justice system is on the line. It seems obvious that the arrest of George Zimmerman violated the Florida statues.
776.012 Use of force in defense of person.-
A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other's imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:
(1)He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
(2)Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.
History.-s. 13, ch. 74-383; s. 1188, ch. 97-102; s. 2, ch. 2005-27.
776.032Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of force.-

See that bolded part. Yep


You've posted that about a gazillion times in the last three weeks without rebuttal to answers that Zimmerman did not avail himself of the statute, and is therefore ineligible. So, what makes you so special in the face of dozens of lawyers saying it means jack shiat? Or are just going to keep play that copy-pasta broken record?
 
2013-07-14 10:07:18 PM

Taylor Mental: Abuse Liability: Little Florida law to stir up the pot

Florida justice system is on the line. It seems obvious that the arrest of George Zimmerman violated the Florida statues.
776.012 Use of force in defense of person.-
A person is justified in using force, except deadly force, against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to defend himself or herself or another against the other's imminent use of unlawful force. However, a person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if:
(1)He or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony; or
(2)Under those circumstances permitted pursuant to s. 776.013.
History.-s. 13, ch. 74-383; s. 1188, ch. 97-102; s. 2, ch. 2005-27.
776.032Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of force.-

See that bolded part. Yep

You've posted that about a gazillion times in the last three weeks without rebuttal to answers that Zimmerman did not avail himself of the statute, and is therefore ineligible. So, what makes you so special in the face of dozens of lawyers saying it means jack shiat? Or are just going to keep play that copy-pasta broken record?


and yet it doesn't appear as though his lawyers are worried at all.  Wonder why that is?
 
2013-07-14 10:08:32 PM

Hermione_Granger: Representative of the unwashed masses: SevenizGud: Here is Trayvon Martin in his natural habitat, displaying his normal philosophy towards others. In short, his philosophy is fark YOU. And he's saying it to YOU. fark YOU. YOU! fark YOU!

Now please...apologize for him. Go on...you know you can do it. Apologize for the little drug-addled, tattooed, fark you-gesturing thug. Do it. You know you can't keep from apologizing for him. Apologize for him. Do it! Do it now!

[img21.imageshack.us image 501x432]


easy, the kid was carrying only skittles and iced tea, he was doing nothing illegal when Zimmerman decided to follow him resulting in the altercation.  he was no alter boy but he didn't deserve to die.

This.

Also, I can't think of how many Farkers tell stories of stupid shiat they used to do, bad attitudes, crazy stunts, lives of crime and just sheer debauchery.

And that was before I was 21.

But I guess if you're 17, black and male there is no hope or chance that you will grow up, change - especially when you have parents who give a damn about you.

Trayvon may have been a teenage jerk. I can't really think of too many teenagers who aren't. But he was afraid of the guy following him and he had good right to be. He's dead. He stood up for himself and maybe thought he was protecting a younger child at home by not leading some idiot back to his house.  And he's dead.

I know that I'm not the person I was at 17. I'm not even the person I was last year. George Zimmerman did play judge, jury and executioner and he snuffed out a life...no one knows who or what Trayvon Martin may have become...and now we never will.

This quote sounds bibilical, but it's not.

Not what thou art, not what thou hast been, beholdeth God with His merciful eye, but what thou wouldst be.

George Zimmerman looked at Trayvon Martin and decided he was nothing. George Zimmerman is not God.

I hope he never knows a peaceful moment in this life or the next.


You, sir, are pathetic.  Enjoy your life living as though "the man" is out to get you. And good luck.
 
2013-07-14 10:08:38 PM

Taylor Mental: tenpoundsofcheese: Where does it say that George lied to the court?
Someone else (his wife) mis-stated their finances to the court, not George.

This is a prime example of the Zimmerman fanbois buying into all his lies. He had some $130,000 in his bank account. Then his wife transferred it all out to his sister's and her account in three separate transactions after
Zimmerman told her in coded language how to do it. It's all on tape.

It's just more evidence of his manipulation of law enforcement and the judicial system his right wing, gun-loving supporters believe, while simultaneously arguing every stupid thing that points to his culpability in Treyvon's death.

I don't know if Florida has conspiracy statute, but if they do now is the time to use it.


The man was up againt the same type of lynch mob that let OJ walk. What the fark did you expect him to do? Fork over every dime and hire a public defender? They needed that money to fight off the ridiculous amount of resources the race pimps had stacked against them. I'd be OK with Zimmerman being punished for that,, if we could agree to Jabba the slut going to jail for perjury, and the Martin parents donating their 2 million dollar settlement to charity. Otherwise,,,, Ha Ha!!!!
 
2013-07-14 10:10:11 PM

Abuse Liability: jaytkay: Abuse Liability: Little Florida law to stir up the pot

Florida law applies to Florida prosecutions and civil actions, not Federal.

Yeah, Too bad the federal civil rights case is dead in the water.

Try again.


Try what again?
 
2013-07-14 10:11:53 PM
I'd be more than happy to bet a month of TF that a nobody wins a civil suit against him.
 
2013-07-14 10:12:35 PM

Abuse Liability: and yet it doesn't appear as though his lawyers are worried at all.  Wonder why that is?


I'm sure they would say something to let you know they lacked confidence, like maybe an "OMG, they're suing us!" Would it make you feel better if they said that?
 
2013-07-14 10:13:08 PM

amiable: Elegy: amiable: Because the Roderick Scott case was an entirely different set of circumstances where the white kid in question was on his property breaking into his car at the time (he didn't chase him anywhere or stalk him he just walked outside and told them to leave).

The argument was that the justice system doesn't care about dead black teens as it does dead white teens. Do try to keep up.

amiable: Several eye-witnesses corroborated Roderick Scott's story/self-defense claim

You mean just like in the Zimmerman case?

No, the argument is that had the races been reversed, you would have seen a  different outcome, which the case you cited proves nicely (the African american, under much more meritorious circumstances and in a far more liberal state was still immediately arrested).

Really?  Could you list the eyewitness's that corroborated George Zimmerman's story?  I'll wait.

If you are going to comment on the trial, at least have some basic knowledge of what occurred.


John Good, the only witness that saw the fight itself and who was neigh unimpeachable on the stand.

Done in one. I was here watching the trial everyday. Funny I didn't see you here.

Do try to learn the facts of the case before you argue about it.
 
2013-07-14 10:13:49 PM

Taylor Mental: Abuse Liability: and yet it doesn't appear as though his lawyers are worried at all.  Wonder why that is?

I'm sure they would say something to let you know they lacked confidence, like maybe an "OMG, they're suing us!" Would it make you feel better if they said that?


Would you like to make another wager for TF?  Didn't you just lose one to Elegy or someone?
 
2013-07-14 10:14:26 PM

tenpoundsofcheese: Where does it say that George lied to the court?


His attorneys wouldn't let him testify to the court.
 
2013-07-14 10:16:15 PM

The Great EZE: Elegy: I would agree that there are problems of racial bias in the judicial system in general, but I would argue strenously that they do not apply to the Zimmerman case. Zimmerman had a clear claim of self-defense, and clear evidence to prove that claim. It wasn't a matter of the jury not caring about the death of a black teenager, except to the idiots that are still beating that drum. The evidence was there for everyone to see, including the jury.

This is not the civil rights case you are looking for. Sorry. It's just not.

How clear can Zimmerman's claim of self-defense be with ambiguous eyewitnesses and a victim too dead to tell his side of the story? He and his friends basically had a clear path to create whatever self-defense story can get him off. Frankly, if he would've gotten convicted his lawyers should have been immediately banished to careers of ice road trucking.


Ambiguous witnesses? See my above post. John Good was the one witness that saw the fight itself, and testified definitively that Martin was on top of Zimmerman engaged in "ground and pound."

You're also ignoring the physical evidence and the forensic evidence.

Admit it, you didn't watch the trial and you're running on knee jerk emotional outrage.
 
2013-07-14 10:18:15 PM
Alright, I have work in the morning.  Don't have time to wait around for Mr. emotional reaction to get back to me, so I'll see you guys in the inevitable Zimmerman monday thread.  My offer still stands though.  EIP
 
2013-07-14 10:20:57 PM

ununcle: Taylor Mental: tenpoundsofcheese: Where does it say that George lied to the court?
Someone else (his wife) mis-stated their finances to the court, not George.

This is a prime example of the Zimmerman fanbois buying into all his lies. He had some $130,000 in his bank account. Then his wife transferred it all out to his sister's and her account in three separate transactions after
Zimmerman told her in coded language how to do it. It's all on tape.

It's just more evidence of his manipulation of law enforcement and the judicial system his right wing, gun-loving supporters believe, while simultaneously arguing every stupid thing that points to his culpability in Treyvon's death.

I don't know if Florida has conspiracy statute, but if they do now is the time to use it.

The man was up againt the same type of lynch mob that let OJ walk. What the fark did you expect him to do? Fork over every dime and hire a public defender? They needed that money to fight off the ridiculous amount of resources the race pimps had stacked against them. I'd be OK with Zimmerman being punished for that,, if we could agree to Jabba the slut going to jail for perjury, and the Martin parents donating their 2 million dollar settlement to charity. Otherwise,,,, Ha Ha!!!!


THIS.

And, as an aside, it seems to me in these threads that there is a general assumption being made that equals, in effect, "if you're in favor of Zimmerman you are white; if you are against, you are dark-skinned".

Well, guess what, folks---SOME of us can actually see things as they are without considering "race".

Go figure---a non-white understanding the Zimmerman side.  Who'd'a thunk it?!
 
2013-07-14 10:21:14 PM

ununcle: Taylor Mental: tenpoundsofcheese: Where does it say that George lied to the court?
Someone else (his wife) mis-stated their finances to the court, not George.

This is a prime example of the Zimmerman fanbois buying into all his lies. He had some $130,000 in his bank account. Then his wife transferred it all out to his sister's and her account in three separate transactions after
Zimmerman told her in coded language how to do it. It's all on tape.

It's just more evidence of his manipulation of law enforcement and the judicial system his right wing, gun-loving supporters believe, while simultaneously arguing every stupid thing that points to his culpability in Treyvon's death.

I don't know if Florida has conspiracy statute, but if they do now is the time to use it.

The man was up againt the same type of lynch mob that let OJ walk. What the fark did you expect him to do? Fork over every dime and hire a public defender? They needed that money to fight off the ridiculous amount of resources the race pimps had stacked against them. I'd be OK with Zimmerman being punished for that,, if we could agree to Jabba the slut going to jail for perjury, and the Martin parents donating their 2 million dollar settlement to charity. Otherwise,,,, Ha Ha!!!!


Lynch mob, really? There were no mobs with torches who showed up at the jail to string Zimmerman up as far as I know. In fact, I'm certain of this. However, there has been a long history of this sort of thing happening to blacks in the south. So, maybe they feel like they don't get just even after all these years.

And for you and your ilk it's not about an innocent man being tried for a crime he didn't commit, it's about the "race pimps" demanding justice just like anyone would do if they felt a kid was murdered and the local police didn't do their utmost to enforce the law and see justice done.

Why is that so hard for you to grasp?
 
2013-07-14 10:22:54 PM

Mugato: tenpoundsofcheese: Where does it say that George lied to the court?

His attorneys wouldn't let him testify to the court.


He lied in a bond hearing. They revoked his bail and put him back in jail.
 
2013-07-14 10:23:27 PM

Elegy: John Good


Nope.  John Good contradicted several of Zimmerman's assertions, including that Martin was pounding his head against the ground.
 
2013-07-14 10:24:35 PM
I'm sure it has been said dozens of times ITT (dnrtft), but I'd probably just try to engage him in a confrontation and shoot him when he tried to hit me.
 
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