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(MSN)   Zimmerman worried about vigilantes who may try to take the law into their own hands   (news.msn.com) divider line 824
    More: Ironic, George Zimmerman, attorney-in-fact, Latin phrases, Mark O'Mara, manslaughter  
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7844 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Jul 2013 at 4:06 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-14 05:36:10 PM  

clowncar on fire: iq_in_binary: ferretman: Wow...the stupid is out on a Sunday. The inability for some of you to actually review the evidence is astounding. Hopefully if you ever have someone beating the shiat out of you and smashing your head into the sidewalk you won't bother protecting your life if you have the ability.
[t2.gstatic.com image 485x271]

The fact that he had an unarmed teenager on top of him in full mount means that he had absolutely no business carrying the gun he used to kill Trayvon.

Sorry dude, you ended up with a farking teenager on top of you in a FULL MOUNT.

You clearly bit off more than you could chew. And you clearly tried biting something off. You should not be carrying a gun.

The way you describe it- full mount-- is almost sexy.  Was anyone sweating at the time 'cause that kinda helps too.


I bet George was sweating.

Sweating in antici....


.....PATION
 
2013-07-14 05:36:15 PM  

Carth: oregon fubaralas: Carth: oregon fubaralas: phenn: oregon fubaralas: HKW: oregon fubaralas: It would be ironic if Zimmerman WALKED to Treyvons house and started beating the shiat out of a bus driver, and then got shot. That would be ironic! Now... not so ironic.

Justice for Treyvon!

Treyon got justice. Specifically when the 9mm bullet mushroomed as it entered his chest.

FOR WHAT! Walking home from a candy store?

Oh, come now. That's all he did. Just walked home from the candy store. He did absolutely nothing else?

He tried to protect himself from an assailant, also not a reason to be shot.

That word, it does not mean what you think it means. Unless you have evidence the state didn't that Zimmerman started the fight.

He started it by following him. To assail does not legally require physical contact. It can be the fear of being assaulted as well. Look it up.

Sure we have talked about it in numerous other zimmerman threads. In FL it requires an unlawful threat by word or act to do violence to the person of another. Are you suggesting Following someone is unlawful in the state of FL?

What law did zimmerman break that makes him an assailant?


Like I said: It can be the fear of being assaulted as well. Look it up.
Zimmerman made Trayvon fearful, and that is justification for a justifiable homicide defence in FLA.
 
2013-07-14 05:36:26 PM  

DoomPaul: He has a legal right to walk in his neighborhood and ask someone a question.


1. He was driving around in his truck.
2. He obviously felt that the situation (in his tiny mind) was serious enough to call the police
3. This is not "walking around the neighborhood and asking someone a question".
4. Why would he (or you) even do some dumb sh*t like this?
5. Who appointed you neighborhood god?
6. If you "legally" walked up to me and "asked me a question", I would "legally" tell you you to f*ck off, unless you were wearing a badge, gun and ID.
 
2013-07-14 05:36:33 PM  
Ah FARK, where mob justice is bad unless one agrees with the mob.
 
2013-07-14 05:36:43 PM  

stiletto_the_wise: Sofa_king_kewl: This is why I love Fark so much, it's a site inion dated with arm chair lawyers, self righteous  liberals and a bunch of just plan old assholes. He was found not guilty, I hope he still carries his weapon, he may need it.

I'd like to see the same people who believe O.J. "obviously" did it come here to explain to us all how Zimmerman can't possibly be a murderer because he was found not guilty.


Thanks for bringing nothing to the table. You have contributed nothing and no one needs these stupid "well tell me this" BS comments. Killing someone isn't always murder. Is he responsible for Martins death yes. Was he within the law in doing so yes. Is he liable for the death the law says no. Push for new laws or just shut the fark up.
 
2013-07-14 05:36:48 PM  
img822.imageshack.us
 
2013-07-14 05:37:23 PM  
the endorsement deals alone could keep Zimmerman rolling in money for the rest of his life.

i1207.photobucket.com
 
2013-07-14 05:37:33 PM  

iq_in_binary: phenn: iq_in_binary: Yeah, like I said, not somebody I want walking around with a gun

That is your problem. Not his.

As someone who CARRIES a gun, I get to have on opinion.

This isn't the birth control debate, and I'm not a woman, your points are utterly moot.


your point is biased.  Concealed carriers are right, the rest of you are wrong.  Your opinion is of little value- sort of like voting with a six year old on whether or not to have cookies before dinner.
 
2013-07-14 05:38:00 PM  

oregon fubaralas: Carth: oregon fubaralas: Carth: oregon fubaralas: phenn: oregon fubaralas: HKW: oregon fubaralas: It would be ironic if Zimmerman WALKED to Treyvons house and started beating the shiat out of a bus driver, and then got shot. That would be ironic! Now... not so ironic.

Justice for Treyvon!

Treyon got justice. Specifically when the 9mm bullet mushroomed as it entered his chest.

FOR WHAT! Walking home from a candy store?

Oh, come now. That's all he did. Just walked home from the candy store. He did absolutely nothing else?

He tried to protect himself from an assailant, also not a reason to be shot.

That word, it does not mean what you think it means. Unless you have evidence the state didn't that Zimmerman started the fight.

He started it by following him. To assail does not legally require physical contact. It can be the fear of being assaulted as well. Look it up.

Sure we have talked about it in numerous other zimmerman threads. In FL it requires an unlawful threat by word or act to do violence to the person of another. Are you suggesting Following someone is unlawful in the state of FL?

What law did zimmerman break that makes him an assailant?

Like I said: It can be the fear of being assaulted as well. Look it up.
Zimmerman made Trayvon fearful, and that is justification for a justifiable homicide defence in FLA.


Here is the assault law in FL. If you're referring to a different law I"m going to need to you post it. I've never seen a law that says you can hit someone for being afraid of them and I'd be amazed if it existed.
 
2013-07-14 05:38:19 PM  
img607.imageshack.us
/I'm glad its over
 
2013-07-14 05:38:48 PM  

hardinparamedic: DoomPaul: I wouldn't be fond of someone following me asking me what am I doing here, but that is not illegal nor does it warrant me getting physical with them.

Except that in the situation, Zimmerman had no duty to act, nor duty to follow. No one was in imminent danger. And he expressed his intentions on a recorded line. Taking this into account, it's easy to argue that his mentality and mindset, and actions negligently escalated the situation to the point where he had to use lethal force.


His action of following was not illegal; a legal action does not warrant an illegal response. Someone may not like it if I hit on their wife, but if they punch me I can defend myself. Sure I could have prevented it, but that does not excuse their actions nor does it make me legally culpable.
 
2013-07-14 05:39:02 PM  

Molavian: I realize exactly what happens in a case like this, where a defendant has been acquitted.  Do you realize what will happen?


Yes. Because they point out in a HCP class exactly what will happen next when your actions are the reason for the escalation of a situation. Florida law only applies blanket civil immunity in a situation which was deemed stand your ground, or if you are inside of your own dwelling or vehicle at the time lethal force was justifiably used.

Florida law imposes NO duty to act when you suspect a crime is in progress. You have no legal authority to intervene unless you suspect your life, or another person's life, is in imminent danger by the reasonable man standard. Even then, civil protection against lawsuit for negligent/wrongful death is only granted if specific criteria are met.

Zimmerman should take his checkbook out. The Martin family will tell him when to stop writing zeroes.
 
2013-07-14 05:39:05 PM  
So are we ever going to talk about the nature of the law in FL?  I mean, he's obviously not guilty.  But something feels funny about forcing the prosecution in a murder trial to prove that the perpetrator wasn't afraid for his life.  Seems... impossible.
 
2013-07-14 05:39:51 PM  

23FPB23: SMOOOOOOTH UP INION!!!!!


Nice BB reference.
/van halen deux
// just missing a Bernie goets reference.
 
2013-07-14 05:40:02 PM  

Every African American in the United States need to move their money, family, knowledge back to Africa... http://t.co/gYiO6y8zjB

- AKON (@Akon) July 14, 2013
 
2013-07-14 05:40:16 PM  

Spirit Hammer: at this point GZ started walking back to his truck (according to testimony) when he was confronted by TM


As I asked earlier in the thread (and which was never answered) what part of "don't get out of your truck after you've called the cops" do you people not understand?

BTW, [citation needed] on that testimony. I'm sure you can dig it up, as it's public record now, right? I'd like to read it.
 
2013-07-14 05:40:38 PM  

mayIFark: After he get's the book deal and his fans wet their pants to buy them, he will have enough money to carry around a few body guards at all times.

He will never have to worry about anything in life ever again.


Assuming all goes well with that route.

He didn't testify. People may identify with him to the extent that crime is frustrating, but beyond that, most people don't police their own neighborhoods armed with a firearm -- if they did, this would not be news. We don't know if he's likeable or relatable.

There's no evidence he can leverage his notoriety into financial security for the short-term, let alone the long-term. Any book he writes, and any interview he gives, only opens him up to the possibility of perjury charges, etc.

/prosecutors do not like to lose
 
2013-07-14 05:41:22 PM  
static.comicvine.com
Zim fellaters upon hearing verdict
 
2013-07-14 05:41:44 PM  
Carth:
Sorry, just messing about. Started feeling guilty when I saw you were a Libertarian too.

I'm perfectly happy with the verdict and think Treyvon brought it on himself by committing aggravated battery, a felony, and a justifiable homicide defense under FLA law.
 
2013-07-14 05:42:35 PM  

BudTheSpud: [img822.imageshack.us image 800x600]


What a cute picture. Tell us how the DARE class told you the devil weed makes people do evil things, again?

 

DoomPaul: His action of following was not illegal; a legal action does not warrant an illegal response. Someone may not like it if I hit on their wife, but if they punch me I can defend myself. Sure I could have prevented it, but that does not excuse their actions nor does it make me legally culpable.


His action of following was an escalation of action. He suspected a crime was in progress - he's actually stated this. That's the reason he followed Martin. He was even told by a 911 dispatcher not to do that, and that he was putting himself in unnecessary danger by doing so. In that case, Florida Law and the standard for HCPs around the nation is to act as a witness alone, not to intervene. By following Martin, it's easy to point out that in the situation he escalated it to the point of physical altercation. And it's just as easy to argue that Martin felt threatened - since there were no witnesses to what happened next.

Zimmerman played pretend police, and as a result, someone died. His actions, it could be pointed out, were negligent and out of his legal duty to act as a HCP holder.
 
2013-07-14 05:42:57 PM  
Whatever happened that night may be legal to the eyes of the law, but that does not make it right.

/my 2 cents
 
2013-07-14 05:43:22 PM  
 
HKW
2013-07-14 05:43:25 PM  

hardinparamedic: DoomPaul: I wouldn't be fond of someone following me asking me what am I doing here, but that is not illegal nor does it warrant me getting physical with them.

Except that in the situation, Zimmerman had no duty to act, nor duty to follow. No one was in imminent danger. And he expressed his intentions on a recorded line. Taking this into account, it's easy to argue that his mentality and mindset, and actions negligently escalated the situation to the point where he had to use lethal force.


Not true. GZ was working as neighborhood watch, so he has a right or duty to act on suspicious activity. GZ saw a person he did not recognise as a member of the community at night and at a time when the area had recent buglaries.
 
2013-07-14 05:43:51 PM  
If there was a better candidate for plastic surgery that didn't have a first name of Adolph, I'd like to know who he was.
 
2013-07-14 05:44:01 PM  

BudTheSpud: [img845.imageshack.us image 800x672]


The story on the left is factual, the story on the right is editorialized as all hell.  Scott witnessed a crime in progress, confronted the criminals on his front lawn, was charged by one of them and killed his attacker.  Zimmerman saw no crime in progress.  He stalked Martin and left his car to chase him down after being told not to do so by the police.

Those in Zimmerman's corner believe that everything that took place prior to the physical confrontation between Martin and Zimmerman is irrelevant and all that matters is that in the course of a fist fight which Zimmerman was losing, he shot and killed Martin.  The rest of us believe that Zimmerman's actions led directly to the confrontation and his failure to act responsibly led to Martin's death and that he should have to pay for that negligence.

The two cases are not comparable.
 
2013-07-14 05:44:16 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: Every African American in the United States need to move their money, family, knowledge back to Africa... http://t.co/gYiO6y8zjB- AKON (@Akon) July 14, 2013


What a proud, intelligent, upstanding individual. Give that man the Nobel Peace Prize.
 
2013-07-14 05:44:40 PM  
I'm just glad to see a justice system finally taking a good hard look into self defense shootings.  Yes, I know that wasn't used in this defense, but since the survivor is the only one who gets to tell the story, the courts owe it to the deceased to be really sure that's how it went down.  "He was coming right for me!" should never be an automatic Get Out of Jail Free card.
 
2013-07-14 05:44:51 PM  
I love the fact that people on the internet have exaggerated, overstated, and flat out imagined evidence and events that never existed in the altercation, got all hyped up, and now expect the world to hate Zimmerman based on it. fark that.

There wasn't enough evidence to support a conviction. There wasn't enough evidence to even disprove a supposed liar's account, and a fair bit of evidence that supported it.

Also, seriously? "he got out of his car, this proves that he was intent to murder Trayvon"? What the hell?  Seriously, if that's your idea of solid proof of anything, then god help anyone stuck with you as a juror.  You people make me sick. I don't want to see a man walk free that is guilty, but I want to see the justice system stick with what it can prove with evidence. We're not some third world country where we can lynch a man because we think he did something. You got evidence? prove it. Otherwise, shut the fark up.
 
2013-07-14 05:44:59 PM  

FloydA: TuteTibiImperes: FTA: "He's going to be looking over his shoulder the rest of his life," Robert Zimmerman Jr. said during an interview on CNN.

I wonder how he'll react the first time a black guy starts following him around his neighborhood at night.


Sadly, I suspect we already know.


If I had to pick either an alive Travyon or Zimmerman as a neighbor....I'll take Zimmerman every time.
 
2013-07-14 05:45:19 PM  

Mouser: The whole point of our criminal justice system is to prevent civil suits.  The English established that an offense against one of the Sovereign's subjects was an offense against the Sovereign himself to keep people from seeking justice the old-fashioned way with blood-feud.

Under the American version of this, Zimmerman was tried for an offense against "the people of the State of Florida" expressly to prevent the Martin family from seeking private justice for Trayvon's death.


You do know that civil suits are not about justice, right?  Not be cavalier about it, but civil suits are about using the court to mediate compensated loss, contract disputes, probate decisions, etc.  There are many occasions where an act is not criminal, but may indeed meet the criteria for compensation.   For example, many employment  disputes are civil matters, not criminal.  Or are you suggesting that these and others should be handled by the criminal court?  That the government should be large enough to manage that burden as well?
 
2013-07-14 05:45:27 PM  

HKW: GZ was working as neighborhood watch, so he has a right or duty to act on suspicious activity.


No, he does not. He had a duty to observe and report alone. Nothing else. He especially had no duty to follow a person he suspected of a crime onto private property that was not his.

Neighborhood Watch does not make you a state-commissioned security officer, nor does it make you a member of Law Enforcement. The fact you're patrolling the neighborhood while armed with a HCP-permitted weapon makes it even more of a civil danger.

Seriously, if you want to play pretend cop as an adult, just go sign up for Police Academy. Hell, some places will even let you volunteer a day or two a month.
 
2013-07-14 05:46:08 PM  
He'll be looking over his shoulder for the rest of his life?

Well now he knows how it feels to be black.
 
2013-07-14 05:46:14 PM  
BeesNuts: So are we ever going to talk about the nature of the law in FL?  I mean, he's obviously not guilty.  But something feels funny about forcing the prosecution in a murder trial to prove that the perpetrator wasn't afraid for his life.  Seems... impossible.


Oh, it's already started (at least in FL) - what strikes me is, how do you PROVE, without a doubt, a narrative when half those involved are dead and absent anything other than open-to-interpretation evidence? Lacking camera or eye witness accounts? Zimmerman aside, it seems a large flaw in this law and how the legal standard for a criminal charge is worded: "beyond a reasonable doubt". (and that is for the jurists, not the foaming lunatics on fark, tyvm)
 
2013-07-14 05:46:28 PM  

phenn: Iowan73: phenn: Iowan73: There is no evidence of who started the fight. But the only reason those two ever met was because Zimmerman made it happen.

So? Was that illegal?

No. I don't think he should have been convicted of murder. But he is at least partially responsible for getting himself into a an easily avoidable situation and then having to shoot his way out. If he had minded his own business or left it to the police, none of this would have happened.

We can certainly agree on that. He acted stupidly. Totally agree. Doesn't rise to second degree murder, but definitely eaten alive by dumbass.


Which was more stupid, following someone or attacking someone for following?
I wonder how many people in New York are followed by another person while walking a day.......So while i'm taking notes on the new world order, I'm white so I can't walk behind a black person, I cant say I'm not for Obamacare, and I can't even vote for a republican or i'm a racist, right?
 
2013-07-14 05:46:29 PM  

Carth: iq_in_binary: Carth: iq_in_binary: Carth: iq_in_binary: Carth: Benevolent Misanthrope: I wonder what would happen if he made the mistake of walking at night, and someone else took a gun, called the cops, followed him against police instruction, picked a fight, got their ass kicked, and shot him.

Not that it would happen - Zimmerman, despite his self-perception, could never kick anyone's ass.

yea, there is no evidence those two things every happened.

Yes there is, the teenager on his chest in full mount. That he shot in the chest. Because a TEENAGER was on his chest. IN FULL MOUNT. That's like riding a god damned toy pony and getting bucked off.

He's not threatening enough to provoke violence if he's so pathetic that he had to shoot a teenager after getting on him full mount. He had to be an ankle biter.

His gym trainer pretty much testified to that. He said he was so weak and soft he worried he'd lose when shadow boxing. If you have no physical abilities a gun is a pretty good equalizer.

Then you should definitely keep yourself out of situations where a fight is likely.

Nobody has any sympathy for the useless fark that picks a fight and get his ass kicked.

But EVERYBODY has sympathy for him when he goes biatch mode and shoots the guy he picked a fight with.

The jury reviewed the evidence and concluded there wasn't proof beyond a reasonable doubt that he started fight. That's not to say Martin did but there is no way to be sure. Would you really be ok with sending someone to jail for 30 years for something no one can prove?

It is fine to think Zimmerman is an idiot or a wimp (which i would say there is plenty of evidence for) but there is no evidence anything he did that night was illegal

He pursued. Yes I would be fine with it. I go to jail for it? He gets to too.

I have a little bit of a skewed view because of my old job, but I ALSO have a far wider view from a self defense point of view both because of the breadth given me in situations because of my o ...


The basic and most important crux of this problem for me is that Zimmerman INSTIGATED. Do I think he should be found guilty of murder? No. Do I feel that Trayvon's death is solely his fault? No. What I'm pissed about is that he was able to instigate a fight, get into it, start losing, and then shoot claiming self defense.

Sorry, dude, you started the fight. I guess that might actually a big source of our misunderstanding. I see fights a little bit further out because, well, I was bullied. You learn real quick to try and project fights out as possible as you can because of that, and I will very readily cede that sometimes you might see goading a fight where it doesn't really exist because of that very readily cautious behavior, but on the other side of things, hey, after enough of them a guy farking knows when a fight is coming.

Zimmerman pursued. That's not defensive behavior. That's bully behavior. Do I attach a bit more hatred towards him because of my past experiences with bullies? Probably. But even the bullies from my school days that I eventually made good with weren't that stupid. Even bullies Zimmerman's age don't pursue, they've ran into that one farker that was bigger and badder that proved to them the rule. Zimmerman with even 2 farking brain cells to ring together wouldn't have pursued. Yet he did. Sorry, you've just abandoned all hope of not seeing jail time if someone dies as a result, well at least in a sane world. But it's Florida.
 
2013-07-14 05:47:13 PM  

Abox: [static.comicvine.com image 512x384]
Zim fellaters upon hearing verdict


Trayvon fellators upon hearing verdict:

www.hip-hopvibe.com
 
2013-07-14 05:47:43 PM  

iq_in_binary: Carth: iq_in_binary: Carth: Benevolent Misanthrope: I wonder what would happen if he made the mistake of walking at night, and someone else took a gun, called the cops, followed him against police instruction, picked a fight, got their ass kicked, and shot him.

Not that it would happen - Zimmerman, despite his self-perception, could never kick anyone's ass.

yea, there is no evidence those two things every happened.

Yes there is, the teenager on his chest in full mount. That he shot in the chest. Because a TEENAGER was on his chest. IN FULL MOUNT. That's like riding a god damned toy pony and getting bucked off.

He's not threatening enough to provoke violence if he's so pathetic that he had to shoot a teenager after getting on him full mount. He had to be an ankle biter.

His gym trainer pretty much testified to that. He said he was so weak and soft he worried he'd lose when shadow boxing. If you have no physical abilities a gun is a pretty good equalizer.

Then you should definitely keep yourself out of situations where a fight is likely.

Nobody has any sympathy for the useless fark that picks a fight and get his ass kicked.

But EVERYBODY has sympathy for him when he goes biatch mode and shoots the guy he picked a fight with.


But he only confronted Treyvon BECAUSE he had the gun to bolster his self-esteem. If he hadn't had the gun his butt woulda stayed where the 911 operator told him to stay! He was armed so he felt like a bad ass and got out and proceeded to escalate the situation to where he was scared and shot out of fear...
 
2013-07-14 05:48:08 PM  

Stile4aly: BudTheSpud: [img845.imageshack.us image 800x672]

The story on the left is factual, the story on the right is editorialized as all hell.  Scott witnessed a crime in progress, confronted the criminals on his front lawn, was charged by one of them and killed his attacker.  Zimmerman saw no crime in progress.  He stalked Martin and left his car to chase him down after being told not to do so by the police.

Those in Zimmerman's corner believe that everything that took place prior to the physical confrontation between Martin and Zimmerman is irrelevant and all that matters is that in the course of a fist fight which Zimmerman was losing, he shot and killed Martin.  The rest of us believe that Zimmerman's actions led directly to the confrontation and his failure to act responsibly led to Martin's death and that he should have to pay for that negligence.

The two cases are not comparable.


Thats fine unless you take in account that the kid could've been trying to kill Z in which case all your arguments go out the window and thats hard to prove when there's only one witness left.

Circular arguments are circular
 
2013-07-14 05:48:24 PM  

Stile4aly: Those in Zimmerman's corner believe that everything that took place prior to the physical confrontation between Martin and Zimmerman is irrelevant and all that matters is that in the course of a fist fight which Zimmerman was losing, he shot and killed Martin.  The rest of us believe that Zimmerman's actions led directly to the confrontation and his failure to act responsibly led to Martin's death and that he should have to pay for that negligence.


What he did may have been stupid, but it was not illegal. And, Martin had the choice of whether to attack Zimmerman or just go home. He chose to attack. He deserves some culpability in this.  It's not like Zimmerman gave him absolutely no other choice or out.
 
2013-07-14 05:48:25 PM  

Confusean: Which was more stupid, following someone or attacking someone for following?
I wonder how many people in New York are followed by another person while walking a day.......So while i'm taking notes on the new world order, I'm white so I can't walk behind a black person, I cant say I'm not for Obamacare, and I can't even vote for a republican or i'm a racist, right?


I'm not defending Trayvon's actions in the least. Both men farked up. I'm in complete agreement with the verdict.
 
2013-07-14 05:48:30 PM  

TheHappyCanadian: Trayvon fellators upon hearing verdict:


Someone was exercising their first amendment right to free expression by burning a flag.

Oh dear. Next they'll be smoking pot!
 
2013-07-14 05:48:31 PM  
It can't happen soon enough. I know I'll celebrate that day. I hope he suffers.
 
2013-07-14 05:49:24 PM  

DoomPaul: hardinparamedic: DoomPaul: I wouldn't be fond of someone following me asking me what am I doing here, but that is not illegal nor does it warrant me getting physical with them.

Except that in the situation, Zimmerman had no duty to act, nor duty to follow. No one was in imminent danger. And he expressed his intentions on a recorded line. Taking this into account, it's easy to argue that his mentality and mindset, and actions negligently escalated the situation to the point where he had to use lethal force.

His action of following was not illegal; a legal action does not warrant an illegal response. Someone may not like it if I hit on their wife, but if they punch me I can defend myself. Sure I could have prevented it, but that does not excuse their actions nor does it make me legally culpable.


Yes, but you would still be a douche, not a hero.
 
HKW
2013-07-14 05:49:45 PM  

Popcorn Johnny: Every African American in the United States need to move their money, family, knowledge back to Africa... http://t.co/gYiO6y8zjB- AKON (@Akon) July 14, 2013


Well if any African American wishes to immigrate to Africa, it should be payed for entirely by the UK since King and Country are the ones responsible for thenmbeing forced here in the first place.
 
2013-07-14 05:49:50 PM  
HKW: Not true. GZ was working as neighborhood watch, so he has a right or duty to act on suspicious activity. GZ saw a person he did not recognise as a member of the community at night and at a time when the area had recent buglaries.

This has been covered before - neighborhood watch members do NOT have a "right" OR a "duty" to ACT.
They are, in fact, strongly, and repeatedly, told this is a BAD idea.
Mr Zimmerman had every right to carry a weapon, etc - but please do not confuse his rights as a neighborhood watch member.
 
2013-07-14 05:49:52 PM  

Carth: clowncar on fire: Carth: clowncar on fire: MelGoesOnTour: I for one am sick of the Martin "supporters". They're the type of people who are always actively looking to cry "racism" at every opportunity. Sheesh. Give it a farkin' break, man!

I'm not a Travon supporter. However, I support the fact that someone who walks into a situation of his own making and then shoots someone else "in self defense" even less...

I commend the kid for keeping his distance and his recognition that poking around in other people's property is suspicious- adults have become so unreliable these days-- regret that kids can't just be smart enough to make harmless requests rather then being sneaky about things.  Had they have done so, the boy was welcome to hang out on ...

Zimmerman says exactly what he found suspicious about him during the 911 call and in his statements read at court. Did you listen to the trial at all?

I'm freakin' middle class peasant.  I work.  Who has time for that tripe.  I rely strictly on Fark when I want to know what really happened.  So what exactly did Zimmerman find so "suspicion worthy" that he needed confront after being told to stand down?

Here is the full transcript from the 911 call. I got in trouble in another thread for posting too much of it.

Also the state had no evidence that he tried to "confront" martin or did anything other than walk back to his car after being told they didn't need him to follow martin.


"Okay.  He's just walking around the area....looking at all the houses...  Now he's staring at me"
He starts to approach Zimmerman with something in his hand.
Zimmer comments how these a-holes always get away once the police notify him that they are on the way.
Change of heart- Williams makes a run for it.  Police are on the way.  STAND DOWN GEORGE_ PEOPLE RUNNING AWAY POSE NO IMMEDIATE THREAT (unless you have reasonable suspicion that they may be off to get a weapon)
 
2013-07-14 05:50:00 PM  

rewind2846: Mr. Breeze:
I didn't know executioners did their job lying on their backs while getting beaten by the convict.

Execution doesn't need a "convict", genius. Innocent people are executed by those who choose to do them harm all the time. The fact that you choose to call this unarmed murdered young man such a thing shows your obvious bias, lack of sense, and general assholiness.


Executioners, or a person with the occupation of executioner, has the job of executing convicts. Hence the term convict, which was not a descriptor I was using towards TM ya douchebag.
 
2013-07-14 05:50:17 PM  

Stile4aly: BudTheSpud: [img845.imageshack.us image 800x672]

The story on the left is factual, the story on the right is editorialized as all hell.  Scott witnessed a crime in progress, confronted the criminals on his front lawn, was charged by one of them and killed his attacker.  Zimmerman saw no crime in progress.  He stalked Martin and left his car to chase him down after being told not to do so by the police.

Those in Zimmerman's corner believe that everything that took place prior to the physical confrontation between Martin and Zimmerman is irrelevant and all that matters is that in the course of a fist fight which Zimmerman was losing, he shot and killed Martin.  The rest of us believe that Zimmerman's actions led directly to the confrontation and his failure to act responsibly led to Martin's death and that he should have to pay for that negligence.

The two cases are not comparable.


Except, in the latter case you mention, "Zimmerman's actions led directly to the confrontation and his failure to act responsibly led to Martin's death," is not applicable, by law. 

Deal with it.
 
2013-07-14 05:51:08 PM  

hardinparamedic: Molavian: I realize exactly what happens in a case like this, where a defendant has been acquitted.  Do you realize what will happen?

Yes. Because they point out in a HCP class exactly what will happen next when your actions are the reason for the escalation of a situation. Florida law only applies blanket civil immunity in a situation which was deemed stand your ground, or if you are inside of your own dwelling or vehicle at the time lethal force was justifiably used.

Florida law imposes NO duty to act when you suspect a crime is in progress. You have no legal authority to intervene unless you suspect your life, or another person's life, is in imminent danger by the reasonable man standard. Even then, civil protection against lawsuit for negligent/wrongful death is only granted if specific criteria are met.

Zimmerman should take his checkbook out. The Martin family will tell him when to stop writing zeroes.


How much would you care to wager on that?  Clearly I don't know what I'm talking about so it's a safe bet.
 
2013-07-14 05:52:10 PM  

parasol: HKW: Not true. GZ was working as neighborhood watch, so he has a right or duty to act on suspicious activity. GZ saw a person he did not recognise as a member of the community at night and at a time when the area had recent buglaries.

This has been covered before - neighborhood watch members do NOT have a "right" OR a "duty" to ACT.
They are, in fact, strongly, and repeatedly, told this is a BAD idea.
Mr Zimmerman had every right to carry a weapon, etc - but please do not confuse his rights as a neighborhood watch member.


This. In fact, they will tell you in a HCP class that you have extra responsibility to avoid inciting ANY conflict at all. Including to walk away from someone saying mean things about you without saying a word back if you're armed.
 
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