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(Vice)   Who you trying to get crazy with, ese? Don't you know I'm loco?   (motherboard.vice.com) divider line 67
    More: Obvious, mental disorders, National Institute for Health, Financial District, first moved, Health research, phone calls, substance misuse  
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11772 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Jul 2013 at 4:05 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-14 11:16:47 AM
That guy isn't in a gang...he's just farkin' metal

\m/
 
2013-07-14 11:23:58 AM
This 'gang mentality' also applies to Mafia types and police officials as well.

Ooops, did forget to mention how many gang bangers there are in active duty military?
 
2013-07-14 11:29:29 AM

rev. dave: Each of us can choose whether to act like a human or act like an animal.  The more we act in each direction, the more it becomes natural to act like an animal or to act like a human.   If you live in an animal state, you are clinically insane.


You assume that choice enters into it.
 
2013-07-14 11:30:47 AM
Beavis, shut up. You've never been to Compton, you're never gonna go to Compton, you're gonna be here for the rest of your life, you're stupid, you don't have any money, and you're never gonna score.
 
2013-07-14 11:30:56 AM

No Such Agency: I wouldn't be surprised f this were true, but depending on the definition of "mental illness", most humans have something going on.  Anxiety, depression, obsessive thoughts, there are a lot of "mild" mental disorders that leave you mostly functional but not very contented in life.

As well, gang members have often grown up in fractured families, with financial desperation, abuse, witnessing murders or the aftermath near their homes, etc.  They grow up in poor neighborhoods where there's no chance to honestly rise above poverty.  Some grow up in what is essentially a war zone, complete with PTSD by the time they're adolescents.

In other words they are already growing up with a completely different set of rules than fuzzy middle-class America:  Strength is survival.  Defend your honor.  Take before you are taken from.  Couple those with deep-seated anger issues and drug use and ta-da!  Insane behaviour.


Let's kick this up a notch, shall we. Take the environment of the average gang member. Even before birth, they are likely subjected to an in-utero environment that indicates a high level of external stressors. They are starting to learn the outside world is going to be difficult. This can prime the individual to be more reactive to potential stressors. Never mind the decreased likelihood of adequate nutrition or prenatal care.

Upon birth, the there are constant triggers to sympathetic activation. Parents aren't fully engaged (either due to parents' struggle with their own issues, work, etc.) This prevents the development of the frontal cortex, attachment to others, and the idea the world is a safe, benevolent, and fair place. Because their world is not. It is dangerous, and you can only rely on yourself. Due to the high levels of HPA axis and limbic actvation, the brain forms in a way that concentrates on immediate survival, with little thought to long term consequences. Hell, why bother thinking beyond a day or two, your environment is telling you you're not likely to survive it.

This amount fight or flight activation works in the short term, but can get overloaded. Think about what happens when you redline an engine for too long. It eventually breaks. You throw a rod, crack the block, warp the head. It may still function, but not as well. Kind of like depression and anxiety. You can still move, just not as well. So, you look for relief. Humans, being social animals, look for those we feel some connection to, in addition to those that can assist with survival. In a world where you've been prey, where you've been helpless, who wouldn't want to be a predator?

So, you join the gang. It doesn't necessarily provide a long term solution to your difficulties, but your environment has joined up with you genes to condition you to react. It's worked so far, why not keep going? So, you join the gang, with your hang ups and all, and it's ok, because it's an escape. And you're with your own kind, people who GET IT. They are you, so it's easy to identify. Looks great on the surface, but there's that bit of you that knows this is temporary, and can be lost at any time. So the sympathetic activation continues.

The further you get in, the worse it gets. You do things, see things. But you can't get out. These are your people. Contrary to what teabagging idiots think, lone wolves tend to die quickly. Not only do you have the same problems you had before, you have new ones. You are blocked, with no sense of control. You want that sense of agency. But....there is SOMETHING you can do. Your life is ultimately your own to give....and take.

Does this mean I condone these actions. Not in the least. But it provides some modicum of understanding, with which solutions can be developed. The solutions do not necessarily feel "right" or "morally correct" to which I say fark that. Reality doesn't work that way.
 
2013-07-14 11:47:33 AM

Lith: rev. dave: Each of us can choose whether to act like a human or act like an animal.  The more we act in each direction, the more it becomes natural to act like an animal or to act like a human.   If you live in an animal state, you are clinically insane.

What about furries?


It depends.
img-cache.cdn.gaiaonline.com
There's a scale.
 
2013-07-14 11:48:43 AM

rev. dave: Lith: rev. dave: Each of us can choose whether to act like a human or act like an animal.  The more we act in each direction, the more it becomes natural to act like an animal or to act like a human.   If you live in an animal state, you are clinically insane.

What about furries?

Why is there any question about that?  Add creepy to crazy.


So, like, creepzy?
 
2013-07-14 11:58:55 AM
I'm an Egyptian!:
Let's kick this up a notch, shall we.

Thanks for bringing on the science.  Mammals after all CAN be "preprogrammed" from before birth to ready them for a high-stress environment.  Epigenetics all up in da hizzouse yo.  My bet is that growing up poor in modern America often just teaches you that being responsible is a waste of time.  If you look at your poor mom (or perhaps, both parents) grinding their life away every day and getting nowhere but sick and old, well who would want that?  Better to live a risky criminal life than that.
 
2013-07-14 02:00:35 PM

ciberido: Lith: rev. dave: Each of us can choose whether to act like a human or act like an animal.  The more we act in each direction, the more it becomes natural to act like an animal or to act like a human.   If you live in an animal state, you are clinically insane.

What about furries?

It depends.
[img-cache.cdn.gaiaonline.com image 311x393]
There's a scale.


NO.  Still crazy.
 
2013-07-14 04:37:48 PM
That song has to hold the record for fastest I ever memorized the lyrics. Maybe b/c they played it non-stop when my brain was still forming up or something.

Like Louis Armstrong, played the trumpet
I'll hit that bong and break ya off somethin'
 
2013-07-14 05:21:24 PM
They are insane in the membrane and insane in the brain.
 
2013-07-14 05:41:03 PM
Trocadero: That song has to hold the record for fastest I ever memorized the lyrics.

For me, that song starts

"One two three and to the four
snoop doggy dogg and Dr.Dre is at the door
ready to make an entrance so back on up
(dre)cause you know we bout to rip shiat up. "
 
2013-07-14 07:15:57 PM
I've lived in gang controlled neighborhoods and middle class neighborhoods and from what I saw, the kids being raised in gang infested areas don't have anywhere near the chance to avoid it like the middle class kids do.

What is 'crazy' changes.   I had a friend who was shot in the face with a shotgun and I saw  him later in the hospital.  He was lucky, it was from far enough away and with birdshot, so he lived and didn't lose an eye.  It was normal though, we all knew people who had been shot, killed, or had been doing the shooting at the opposing gangs.

When I moved up in the world I was living in a neighborhood where people got annoyed if a police helicopter made noise passing overhead on their way to some other area.  The police calls were thefts at shopping centers(by out of towners) and rousting the homeless for the most part.

So my belief is that the mental illness is environmental in origin.
 
2013-07-14 07:41:51 PM

Trocadero: That song has to hold the record for fastest I ever memorized the lyrics.


I never understood a damn thing they were saying until I heard the Richard Cheese version, and now it's plain as day for me.

/let's just get the linking over with
 
2013-07-14 08:48:27 PM

born_yesterday: What if I told you insane was working fifty hours a week in some office for fifty years at the end of which they tell you to piss off; ending up in some retirement village hoping to die before suffering the indignity of trying to make it to the toilet on time? Wouldn't you consider that to be insane?


Fifty hours? Lucky.

That's just labor value theory.
 
Esn
2013-07-15 03:45:05 AM

rev. dave: Each of us can choose whether to act like a human or act like an animal.  The more we act in each direction, the more it becomes natural to act like an animal or to act like a human.   If you live in an animal state, you are clinically insane.


What? Humans ARE animals. This makes no sense to me.

I suppose you mean trying to listen to certain parts of our brain and ignoring others, but can you be more specific? The more uniquely human parts of our brain give us an advantage in analytical thinking, not in morals. Many other animals are just as capable of kindness as humans.

Germans during WW2 were very civilized and ahem, "human" about what they did. Proper record-keeping, rigorous philosophical rationale, all that stuff. No other animal could have done that.
 
2013-07-15 09:28:23 AM

t3knomanser: Regarding TFA: Steven Pinker ran the numbers, and your average street-level gangbanger gets less money from the gang than they'd make working at McDonald's, and suffers a much higher risk of getting shot to death. But the gang creates an illusion of promotion- you could someday be the rich guy at the top of the gang. But the rich guys aren't actually all that rich- they're leasing their cars and jewelry, they're creating an illusion of wealth. The only people getting rich off the gang are waaaaaay up in the stratosphere of the gang organization- the illegal equivalent of CEOs. The labor and the middle management get shiat upon, just like the rest of us.


Averaging $8 an hour? That's a bunch of crap. Any fool in high school who slings weed to his friends can make more than that. I'm not trying to have a pissing contest about "street cred" but in my ancient history every powder or pill dealer I knew would bring in at least a couple hundred to upwards of $1500 a day.

These weren't gang members, but if you're already carrying a gun you can persuade a lot more money out of people than you can get from a fast food job. This is misinformation and propaganda trying to keep people out of gangs... which is probably a  good thing.
 
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