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(BBC-US)   Gen Xers ... the forgotten generation at work   (bbc.com) divider line 286
    More: Interesting, Gen Xers, Generation X, Pew Charitable Trusts, University of Guelph, middle management, acquiescence, latchkey kid, disaffection  
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17934 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Jul 2013 at 5:08 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-12 09:00:09 AM  

crappie: Farkbert: I don't know....I managed to do fairly well, but doing so meant:

1.) Busting my ass non stop.  (hint: if you've never worked 60-80 hour weeks for a couple years straight you haven't busted ass yet)
2.) Taking every opportunity to get ahead, including many job changes and joining 4 different early stage startups.
3.) Changing industries several times in order to be where the best opportunities are.
4.) Proving my worth again and again, but also always demanding compensation that is in line with my contributions.  I walked out of a job once because management lied about potential future stock options that never had any chance of happening.

/ in the end, they brought me back in with an agreement to pay me commissions on products sold, which was a very nice deal
// I quit 6 months later to go to a new startup, which in the end was a much better deal

That's called luck....don't confuse it with work.


Oh I bet it was a lot of work, it`s just that the work done had nothing to do with the resulting situation, which was getting lucky with a new startup offer.

I remember some great words written on the wall outside the employmenty office in the 80`s, they said "WE WANT JOBS, NOT WORK"

boomers won`t get that...
 
2013-07-12 09:01:34 AM  

CarnySaur: They forgot to mention how none of us really recovered from the death of Kurt Cobain.


You laugh, but Gen Xers grew up on punk rock and hip hop, back when both were counter-cultural movements centered around rejection of authority. Now it seems like authority has all the resources and we're frozen out. We're all tatted up, loud and intentionally irresponsible, and the mellenials have learned from our mistakes. Their culture is subtly subversive, with humor as the primary means of self-expression. Mellenials have been conditioned to consume information, process it and conform just enough to get paid, while quietly sneering at the whole silly routine. They're on the inside, laughing at everyone. We're on the outside, still trying to bring it all down.

Xers make the disruptive start-ups that employ Mellenials. Boomers are in charge of the large corporate institutions that reject Xers out of spite. Interesting times.
 
2013-07-12 09:01:48 AM  
Late Gen Xers got royally farked as they were the trailing edge who were graduating college right as Clinton's tech bubble began collapsing. They got hired then laid off within a year or two. They never really had a chance to get in on the gold rush of VC money or options like many of the rest of us.

I can see how that in-between generation would be extremely bitter about watching their older siblings getting rich while the golden ring remained out of their childish reach.
 
2013-07-12 09:04:26 AM  

Silverstaff: GardenWeasel: I've seen this movie. Your Father was aloof and your Mother pushy because you are really a bastard child and she needs you to be upwardly mobile to atone for her sins. Does she have more pills and alcohol than the corner CVS?

My mother, yeah she drank constantly.  She liked to hide it.  The only time as a kid I noticed anything was funny was when I accidentally reached for her glass of coke one day instead of mine on the living room table.  She had a very strong amaretto and coke.  She was very heavily addicted to xanax for many years, even attempted suicide using them in a massive overdose about 5 years ago.  She says she's clean and off the alcohol and pills now, but I have no way to verify that.

She had a job.  She used to be a buyer for a department store chain.  When she got pregnant with me, she had some complications, so she went on maternity leave a little early.  Once I was born, she devoted herself to being a full-time mother, and I was the 100% focus of her life from the day I was born, until around my junior year of college.

What changed?  Well, I went off to college, but that didn't stop her smothering.  I had a phone with an answering machine in my dorm room (remember, mid-to-late 90's, no cell phone), and she'd leave me a half-dozen messages during the day while I was in class.  She'd call me in the morning to wake me up, and want to talk for a ha ...


That's very sad. She should have put you up for adoption or left and lived a real life. You should buy her a copy of The Hours for her birthday, sit down and watch it with her, paying particular attention to the character Julianne Moore plays, and then apologise profusely.
 
2013-07-12 09:04:54 AM  
i.imgur.com
 
2013-07-12 09:05:22 AM  

AverageAmericanGuy: CarnySaur: Many Gen Xers graduated into weak job markets, carrying hefty student debt. Then, along the way, they lost ground in recessions, the dot-com bust, middle management downsizings and the housing market collapse.

They forgot to mention how none of us really recovered from the death of Kurt Cobain.

Yeah, that was pretty heavy. A true legend.


Bleah!

Cobain and his grungy, whiny, navel-gazing compatriots (along with Clear Channel's acquisition and station-mutation...may they rot in Hell) darn near killed my hard rock music altogether.
 
2013-07-12 09:05:45 AM  

mmagdalene: CarnySaur: Many Gen Xers graduated into weak job markets, carrying hefty student debt. Then, along the way, they lost ground in recessions, the dot-com bust, middle management downsizings and the housing market collapse.

They forgot to mention how none of us really recovered from the death of Kurt Cobain.

The flax seeds in my breakfast smoothie have now infiltrated the crevices of my nasal cavities.



See, this is why I never drink fruit.  It's probably best to avoid healthy foods altogether.
 
2013-07-12 09:05:53 AM  

Franko: HO-LEE-CRAP, I'm not alone.

13 years of programming skills: only $45k jobs out there
project management certification: everyone wants at least 10 yrs experience.

I'm seriously on the verge of dropping everything and just cleaning houses for a living.


No one makes big bucks because they have "programming skills". My eight year old son has "programming skills". You want to get ahead at work? Whenever some issue, problem, or otherwise unpleasant situation comes up, just say "I'll do it!"

Observe:

Boss: "We need someone to fly to Korea tomorrow (Dec 23) and debug a problem one of our customers is having"
You: "I'll do it!"

Boss: "The developer who wrote this application just quit, and we need someone to take responsibility for his garbled spaghetti code"
You: "I'll do it!"

Boss: "Someone clogged the office toilet with a toxic dump and it needs to be unclogged"
You: "I'll do it!"

That's it. That's all you need to do.
 
2013-07-12 09:05:54 AM  

Cubansaltyballs: In my experience, a lot of Baby Boomers have jobs they should not have and only have them because some other Boomer promoted them. When they see a Gen Xer, they become afraid that some 35 year-old will show the world how incompetent they are.

It's protectionism. The faster this generation dies, the better off we'll all be.


Speaking as a 35-year-old -- don't pretend that we're any less incompetent.

Also, when they were 35, it's not like they weren't in the same positions you are in right now.
 
2013-07-12 09:07:20 AM  

Prevailing Wind: /Born in 76'
//hated Nirvana
///Ready...Player...One.

////cool beans.  (I had to stab myself after typing that.)


If I ever, ever, EVER hear "cool beans" again, I'm gonna have to choke a b*tch.
/we're roughly the same age
//dreads when "cool beans" makes an inevitable comeback among people younger than us, just as some of us wore tie-dye in the 90s
 
2013-07-12 09:08:58 AM  

WhippingBoy: Franko: HO-LEE-CRAP, I'm not alone.

13 years of programming skills: only $45k jobs out there
project management certification: everyone wants at least 10 yrs experience.

I'm seriously on the verge of dropping everything and just cleaning houses for a living.

No one makes big bucks because they have "programming skills". My eight year old son has "programming skills". You want to get ahead at work? Whenever some issue, problem, or otherwise unpleasant situation comes up, just say "I'll do it!"

Observe:

Boss: "We need someone to fly to Korea tomorrow (Dec 23) and debug a problem one of our customers is having"
You: "I'll do it!"

Boss: "The developer who wrote this application just quit, and we need someone to take responsibility for his garbled spaghetti code"
You: "I'll do it!"

Boss: "Someone clogged the office toilet with a toxic dump and it needs to be unclogged"
You: "I'll do it!"

That's it. That's all you need to do.


Boss: "We need someone to fire because I want to hire a crony and we don't have the budget for another person. I know, that suck-up who cleaned the toilet. Fire his ass."

/seen it several times in my working life
 
2013-07-12 09:10:30 AM  
I'm a GenX er and I get what this article is saying, but if you want a glimpse into my life, get promoted ABOVE even one of these boomers(it does happen folks, just keep working). I've got one working for me now and he is unbearable. I will remember this thread when I eventually have to let him go. In his mind, because he is older and more experienced that HE should be running my team. Of course it never occurs to him that his ATTITUDE is what has been holding him back. He is a great source of information, but he is so bitter about his situation that hes bringing the team down. And he wears so much cologne that I can smell if hes in the building before I even walk in the door LOL.

My advice-make yourself indispensable to your company. If you dont like where you work. Start looking elsewhere and NETWORK. In this day and age you have to move around a bit to get into management.

I always laughed when I was growing up at the stereotype of my generation. lazy, obnoxious, etc etc. I had 3 jobs in high school as did most of my gen X friends. Now you've got millenials and the older generation REALLY understands what lazy and self entitled means LOL.
 
2013-07-12 09:10:38 AM  

OldManDownDRoad: WhippingBoy: Franko: HO-LEE-CRAP, I'm not alone.

13 years of programming skills: only $45k jobs out there
project management certification: everyone wants at least 10 yrs experience.

I'm seriously on the verge of dropping everything and just cleaning houses for a living.

No one makes big bucks because they have "programming skills". My eight year old son has "programming skills". You want to get ahead at work? Whenever some issue, problem, or otherwise unpleasant situation comes up, just say "I'll do it!"

Observe:

Boss: "We need someone to fly to Korea tomorrow (Dec 23) and debug a problem one of our customers is having"
You: "I'll do it!"

Boss: "The developer who wrote this application just quit, and we need someone to take responsibility for his garbled spaghetti code"
You: "I'll do it!"

Boss: "Someone clogged the office toilet with a toxic dump and it needs to be unclogged"
You: "I'll do it!"

That's it. That's all you need to do.

Boss: "We need someone to fire because I want to hire a crony and we don't have the budget for another person. I know, that suck-up who cleaned the toilet. Fire his ass."

/seen it several times in my working life


You're right. What's the point of trying? Just throw up your hands and give up.
 
2013-07-12 09:10:40 AM  

Franko: HO-LEE-CRAP, I'm not alone.

13 years of programming skills: only $45k jobs out there
project management certification: everyone wants at least 10 yrs experience.

I'm seriously on the verge of dropping everything and just cleaning houses for a living.


What town you in? Well maybe if "programming" is what you know, not "I'm a developer." Gotta sell that shiat right. Double your salary depending. On the other hand if you are out in BFE or a college town then yeah, $45K sounds about right. In a big city though, you're underpaid.
 
2013-07-12 09:11:54 AM  

Ishkur: Doc Daneeka: I have two older step-brothers from my (step-)father's first marriage who were born in the early-mid 70s and are clearly Gen-Xers. I'm from my mom's first marriage, but re-married soon after I was born and I have two younger half-siblings from their 2nd marriage who were born in '88 and '90 and are clearly in Millennials.

mother mary of god, you ARE one hell on an anomaly, aren't you?

Howabout this: Did you hang out at video arcades a lot when you were a kid?


Sometimes.

I loved arcades, but they were clearly already declining when I was a kid.

I was in the prime age for NES/SNES when I was a kid, and they were clearly already displacing arcades.
 
2013-07-12 09:15:09 AM  

crappie: Farkbert: I don't know....I managed to do fairly well, but doing so meant:

1.) Busting my ass non stop.  (hint: if you've never worked 60-80 hour weeks for a couple years straight you haven't busted ass yet)
2.) Taking every opportunity to get ahead, including many job changes and joining 4 different early stage startups.
3.) Changing industries several times in order to be where the best opportunities are.
4.) Proving my worth again and again, but also always demanding compensation that is in line with my contributions.  I walked out of a job once because management lied about potential future stock options that never had any chance of happening.

/ in the end, they brought me back in with an agreement to pay me commissions on products sold, which was a very nice deal
// I quit 6 months later to go to a new startup, which in the end was a much better deal

That's called luck....don't confuse it with work.


You think he would have picked up the position at the startup without that work and experience? You think they hand those jobs out to any slacker with a pulse?

Keep investing in powerball tickets, dude.
 
2013-07-12 09:15:37 AM  

meanmutton: Cubansaltyballs: In my experience, a lot of Baby Boomers have jobs they should not have and only have them because some other Boomer promoted them. When they see a Gen Xer, they become afraid that some 35 year-old will show the world how incompetent they are.

It's protectionism. The faster this generation dies, the better off we'll all be.

Speaking as a 35-year-old -- don't pretend that we're any less incompetent.

Also, when they were 35, it's not like they weren't in the same positions you are in right now.


When the Boomers were 35, they had little to no student debt, and had likely spent over a decade working for the same company that paid enough so that one breadwinner could raise a nice middle class family out in the suburbs. The generation before them handed them everything, but it was the Boomers who pulled up the ladder behind them.
 
2013-07-12 09:16:56 AM  

fireclown: ltr77: Alonjar:

/because nobody else wears flannel

Never been to Maine, huh?  If you ain't wearing flannel and driving a Subaru you ain't doing it right.

Untrue.  There are plenty of straight women in Maine.


I've met both of them.
 
2013-07-12 09:18:07 AM  

Doc Daneeka: Ishkur: Doc Daneeka: Definitions of Gen X that I see generally extend it to birth dates in the early 80s. Then again, the Millennial gen is generally defined as starting in the early 80s. As a 1981 baby, this is the source of my confusion.

I'm often considered too young to really be part of Gen X. But I don't identify with the Millennial generation either. I think of Millennials as people either in college now or recent grads. I've been out of college a decade now.


Do you have any siblings? ...how old are they?

That doesn't help much.

I have two older step-brothers from my (step-)father's first marriage who were born in the early-mid 70s and are clearly Gen-Xers.  I'm from my mom's first marriage, but re-married soon after I was born and I have two younger half-siblings from their 2nd marriage who were born in '88 and '90 and are clearly in Millennials.

So my siblings fall cleanly into both generations.  I'm in the middle but not particularly close in age to either set.


Doc Daneeka: Ishkur: Doc Daneeka: Definitions of Gen X that I see generally extend it to birth dates in the early 80s. Then again, the Millennial gen is generally defined as starting in the early 80s. As a 1981 baby, this is the source of my confusion.

I'm often considered too young to really be part of Gen X. But I don't identify with the Millennial generation either. I think of Millennials as people either in college now or recent grads. I've been out of college a decade now.


Do you have any siblings? ...how old are they?

That doesn't help much.

I have two older step-brothers from my (step-)father's first marriage who were born in the early-mid 70s and are clearly Gen-Xers.  I'm from my mom's first marriage, but re-married soon after I was born and I have two younger half-siblings from their 2nd marriage who were born in '88 and '90 and are clearly in Millennials.

So my siblings fall cleanly into both generations.  I'm in the middle but not particularly close in age to either set.


There's this really cool book that mainly concerns the so-called Greatest Generation, but there's this catch you'll like.
 
2013-07-12 09:18:10 AM  

Doc Daneeka: Sometimes.
I loved arcades, but they were clearly already declining when I was a kid.
I was in the prime age for NES/SNES when I was a kid, and they were clearly already displacing arcades.


Congratulations: You're Generation-X.

The Millenials don't even recognize an era where you had to leave your house to play video games.
 
2013-07-12 09:18:37 AM  

Ishkur: Silverstaff: Seriously, my mother was a prototype helicopter parent.

Boomers have a tendency to "overparent". A lot of it comes from their own experiences growing up. Boomers, across the board, universally reviled their parents (and violently fought against their parents generation as soon as they were old enough to). They were raised by the war generation; indeed, some households mimic'd the military barracks their fathers had become accustomed, with utmost discipline and loyalty demanded at all times. Boomers did not have unhappy childhoods, but they grew to resent the stark discipline, rigid morality, and harsh hierarchical structure that their war vet fathers enforced.

So when the Boomers had children of their own, they vowed to not raise them the way they were raised. So instead of being a taskmaster, they sought to be their child's best friend, and involve themselves in every aspect of their child's lives, and give them unconditional affirmation and confidence. And now we're seeing the result of that: A generation that has never been told no, that is conditioned to receive praise and acceptance for everything they do, and expect to be rewarded not for succeeding, but just for the attempt.

The solution, of course, is somewhere in the middle. What children really need from their parents is not a drill sergeant and definitely not a best buddy -- what they need is an actual farking parent.


well put. and a very interesting read.
 
2013-07-12 09:19:24 AM  
I'm in the same boat.

I just work less.

Fark'm
 
2013-07-12 09:23:42 AM  

Phinn: snowshovel: Anyway....I'd probably give the millenials the internet (which I can argue that Generation X may get)...but the millenials more importantly get: always on social connections.

Late Boomers built personal computers and the web software itself, Gen-X built the post-web Internet and blogging, but the Millenials have built the latest round of social media and a lot of apps.

What's the deal with the Gen-Y/Millenial constant social media thing, anyway?  Before the web, Gen-Xers (like me) were the kind of people to keep a Post Office box instead of getting mail at home.  (It helps keep Sallie Mae off our backs.)  The last thing we'd do is put our entire lives online.


I just want to say that Gen Y is NOT the same as Millenials.  Unlike the younguns, I CAN hold a face-to-face conversation, ignore facebook, and hold a steady job.

/apparently I'm invisible to whomever writes these stupid articles.
 
2013-07-12 09:25:35 AM  

TommyymmoT: Cubansaltyballs: In my experience, a lot of Baby Boomers have jobs they should not have and only have them because some other Boomer promoted them. When they see a Gen Xer, they become afraid that some 35 year-old will show the world how incompetent they are.

It's protectionism. The faster this generation dies, the better off we'll all be.

Bide your time, and position yourself.
It's temporary,
They'll be dead, or retired pretty damned soon.


Congratulations. You have just described Walmarts management structure.
 
2013-07-12 09:26:13 AM  

dready zim: Oh I bet it was a lot of work, it`s just that the work done had nothing to do with the resulting situation, which was getting lucky with a new startup offer.

I remember some great words written on the wall outside the employmenty office in the 80`s, they said "WE WANT JOBS, NOT WORK"

boomers won`t get that...


Success is what happens when preparedness meets and seizes opportunity.  "Luck" is an extremely relative term.

You need to grow up.
 
2013-07-12 09:28:36 AM  

snowshovel: Anyway....I'd probably give the millenials the internet (which I can argue that Generation X may get)...but the millenials more importantly get: always on social connections.


As a small child in the 70s, I grew up with 3 TV channels, a rotary phone, the local newspaper & the public library as the only sources of news/information...yet by the time I entered college, we had multiple cable TV channels & personal computers which could dial into this new thing called "the world wide web". Many people were starting to get personal cell phones as well.

That's a pretty radical change in the flow of information, most of it occurring within the span of one decade (the 80s). So really, I'm honestly not sure what technology I'd ascribe to GenXers since so much of it changed - and kept changing - during our childhoods/teen years.
 
2013-07-12 09:29:24 AM  
Interesting, I don't know what draws us as a group, but FARK seems to be full of x-y gappers.

Early boomers and late boomers are different. The former were eligible for Vietnam, while the latter were not. Same goes for their parents and WWII vs Korea.

My father was a typical boomer - his father was an alcoholic, and a WWII vet that painted anything at his house that stopped moving long enough in gunboat grey. His mother was college educated, but stay-at-home and very active in all the social clubs. They were both fairly strict and my father rebelled after he graduated high school. He ended up making six figures, was way too easy on me, and died in his 50's from stress.

My mother is a late boomer - her dad is a Korean War vet and her mom worked, so she was the mother to all her younger siblings. She married young, had me young, mostly to get out of her house. She was a stay at home mom to us until I was 7 and my parents divorced. She was then thrust into the workforce and she's done fairly well considering, but was majorly screwed by the financial collapse (both by the market and through corporate downsizing) and she'll have to work until she dies.

I was born in the late 70's, oldest of the bunch, and loved hanging out at arcades. I grew up fearing we'd all be nuked any day. Latchkey kid. I don't really relate with true Xers (as they're defined), but my experiences and lifestyle define me as one. I'm definitely not a millennial, though I identify with them a bit, too
 
2013-07-12 09:29:32 AM  

WhippingBoy: "I'll do it!"

That's it. That's all you need to do.


There's a reason you're called WhippingBoy, right?

Sucking up to the man will get you nowhere. And you'll never get rich working for somebody else.
 
2013-07-12 09:30:22 AM  

Darke: Phinn: snowshovel: Anyway....I'd probably give the millenials the internet (which I can argue that Generation X may get)...but the millenials more importantly get: always on social connections.

Late Boomers built personal computers and the web software itself, Gen-X built the post-web Internet and blogging, but the Millenials have built the latest round of social media and a lot of apps.

What's the deal with the Gen-Y/Millenial constant social media thing, anyway?  Before the web, Gen-Xers (like me) were the kind of people to keep a Post Office box instead of getting mail at home.  (It helps keep Sallie Mae off our backs.)  The last thing we'd do is put our entire lives online.

I just want to say that Gen Y is NOT the same as Millenials.  Unlike the younguns, I CAN hold a face-to-face conversation, ignore facebook, and hold a steady job.

/apparently I'm invisible to whomever writes these stupid articles.


Yes they are. Some retard working in advertising just decided to change the name.
 
2013-07-12 09:33:54 AM  

OldManDownDRoad: WhippingBoy: Franko: HO-LEE-CRAP, I'm not alone.

13 years of programming skills: only $45k jobs out there
project management certification: everyone wants at least 10 yrs experience.

I'm seriously on the verge of dropping everything and just cleaning houses for a living.

No one makes big bucks because they have "programming skills". My eight year old son has "programming skills". You want to get ahead at work? Whenever some issue, problem, or otherwise unpleasant situation comes up, just say "I'll do it!"

Observe:

Boss: "We need someone to fly to Korea tomorrow (Dec 23) and debug a problem one of our customers is having"
You: "I'll do it!"

Boss: "The developer who wrote this application just quit, and we need someone to take responsibility for his garbled spaghetti code"
You: "I'll do it!"

Boss: "Someone clogged the office toilet with a toxic dump and it needs to be unclogged"
You: "I'll do it!"

That's it. That's all you need to do.

Boss: "We need someone to fire because I want to hire a crony and we don't have the budget for another person. I know, that suck-up who cleaned the toilet. Fire his ass."

/seen it several times in my working life



Um, yeah.  The problem with taking on really hard assignments is that oftentimes you can't get it done according to management's ridiculous timeline.  Despite their doom and gloom attitude, most tech people consistently underestimate how long it will take to do something, especially if they are doing it themselves.  I call it The Star Trek Syndrome.  No matter what Capt. Kirk needed, Scotty was always always able to pull it off in time and save the day.  He'd grumble and complain, but he'd get it done.  Geordi only added to this fictional ability of every time pulling the rabbit out of the hat just in the nick of time.  The real world is rarely like Star Trek and all too often "hero engineers" fail to live up to the hype.  After a few rounds of this, nobody believes you anymore.

/seen it more times than I can count
 
2013-07-12 09:34:58 AM  
As a true Gen X'er, here's my response:  F*ck you.  I don't care.
 
2013-07-12 09:40:38 AM  

theknuckler_33: "Virtually every one of my friends is doing something entrepreneurial," either starting a business or going to work for a start-up, she said. "Xers are drawn to flatter, less-hierarchical firms. They want to take their destinies into their own hands."

I usually loathe articles discussing the traits of entire generations and while I wouldn't necessarily call going to work for a start-up as 'entrepreneurial', I used to work for Prudential Insurance until I was about 29 and left to work for a very small company. And while I left Pru because I hated it there, one of the big appeals of the new company was its size. Of course over the years, that company has been acquired twice and I'm back to working for a huge company again, but those 4-5 years when that small company was still independent, my salary level went up faster than I had ever hoped for. I'm no senior VP or anything, but that really jump started my income compared to what was going on at Pru.




Nascent Entrepreneur, they are called.
 
2013-07-12 09:41:12 AM  

steerforth: Darke: Phinn: snowshovel: Anyway....I'd probably give the millenials the internet (which I can argue that Generation X may get)...but the millenials more importantly get: always on social connections.

Late Boomers built personal computers and the web software itself, Gen-X built the post-web Internet and blogging, but the Millenials have built the latest round of social media and a lot of apps.

What's the deal with the Gen-Y/Millenial constant social media thing, anyway?  Before the web, Gen-Xers (like me) were the kind of people to keep a Post Office box instead of getting mail at home.  (It helps keep Sallie Mae off our backs.)  The last thing we'd do is put our entire lives online.

I just want to say that Gen Y is NOT the same as Millenials.  Unlike the younguns, I CAN hold a face-to-face conversation, ignore facebook, and hold a steady job.

/apparently I'm invisible to whomever writes these stupid articles.

Yes they are. Some retard working in advertising just decided to change the name.


>.< goddammitsomuch.  I should probably actually wiki it before i type.  I stand corrected.

/doesn't mean I have to like it.  I might be technically a millennial (85), but I have nothing in common with them.
 
2013-07-12 09:43:46 AM  

Silverstaff: These "generation" distinctions are a little artificial.

I was born in 1978.  A few sources would call me a millennial, but most try to call me Generation X.  The cutoff date is always put somewhere in the late '70's, usually towards 1980.

The thing is, I have little in common with Gen X.  I never knew who Kurt Cobain was at the time, and for quite a while when other kids were talking about Nirvana in school I thought Buddhism was a fad.  I never listened to grunge music, and I was sheltered enough from a lot of pop culture as a kid I didn't have many of the same cultural touchstones of Gen X (aside from watching the fall of communism, the destruction of Challenger, the Gulf War, ect).

On the other hand, whenever I read about Millennials, I read it and think "that's me".  Grew up around the rise of the PC and the internet, had a devil of a time even finding a job when I went into the workforce, part of a generation which was told from childhood that a college education is self-justifying and to just go and you'll be able to pay for those student loans later. . .

. . .but authors and demographers and such keep wanting to call me a Generation X'er because I was born in '78,


The only generational distinction with hard numbers behind is the baby boom, because it's an actual thing which occurred after WWII and until about 1964, which is when there was a real, statistical drop in the annual birthrate.

All the cultural touchstones marked with Gen. X and the millenials are the same thing, because the boomers were around during all of it. They didn't disappear for 30 years while Kurt Cobain and the internet happened. They watched all that sh*t go down too.

We should accept that the most likely cause of all this sh*t is powerful people sucking up all the resources, and pissing on the middle class and poor, while we are told to fight over the scraps.
 
2013-07-12 09:45:03 AM  
Actually, I think the year brackets for 'generations' should be smaller now, what with the increase in information relay and technological advancements.  I can remember before the internet (I was young sure, but still), whereas my husband always had the internet.
 
2013-07-12 09:48:37 AM  

Arthur Prefect: bathbubble: steerforth: CarnySaur:

Perhaps, but I'm 29 (so sort of a millennial?) and I have to say, Albus Dumbledore was a far better role model than most celebrities that I see on tv. Harry Potter was/is my escape from some rough times, and I'm not ashamed to say that fictional characters from books helped me far more than falling for a band member or film star. And it is definitely a series that is well-known throughout the world.

Your mileage may vary on that though, as we are all different.


Oh, I definitely agree with that! Dumbledore>Cobain for sure
 
2013-07-12 09:49:27 AM  

Phinn: snowshovel: Anyway....I'd probably give the millenials the internet (which I can argue that Generation X may get)...but the millenials more importantly get: always on social connections.

Late Boomers built personal computers and the web software itself, Gen-X built the post-web Internet and blogging, but the Millenials have built the latest round of social media and a lot of apps.

What's the deal with the Gen-Y/Millenial constant social media thing, anyway?  Before the web, Gen-Xers (like me) were the kind of people to keep a Post Office box instead of getting mail at home.  (It helps keep Sallie Mae off our backs.)  The last thing we'd do is put our entire lives online.


It's the same sh*t as when you'd come over, and someone would break out the photo albums and vacation slides. Only now you can do it instantly, instead of horde it in a musty book in your basement.
 
2013-07-12 09:51:24 AM  

Persnickety: Um, yeah.  The problem with taking on really hard assignments is that oftentimes you can't get it done according to management's ridiculous timeline.  Despite their doom and gloom attitude, most tech people consistently underestimate how long it will take to do something, especially if they are doing it themselves.  I call it The Star Trek Syndrome.  No matter what Capt. Kirk needed, Scotty was always always able to pull it off in time and save the day.  He'd grumble and complain, but he'd get it done.  Geordi only added to this fictional ability of every time pulling the rabbit out of the hat just in the nick of time.  The real world is rarely like Star Trek and all too often "hero engineers" fail to live up to the hype.  After a few rounds of this, nobody believes you anymore.


Um No.  Decent management realizes when you are taking on an assignment that involves new skills and allows for extra time and inevitable missteps.  They are absorbing the cost of your on-the-job training in the hopes that it will payoff with a more capable employee.  Secondly, I've never seen anyone in management take the engineers estimates at face value.
 
2013-07-12 09:51:40 AM  

Ishkur: Silverstaff: Seriously, my mother was a prototype helicopter parent.

Boomers have a tendency to "overparent". A lot of it comes from their own experiences growing up. Boomers, across the board, universally reviled their parents (and violently fought against their parents generation as soon as they were old enough to). They were raised by the war generation; indeed, some households mimic'd the military barracks their fathers had become accustomed, with utmost discipline and loyalty demanded at all times. Boomers did not have unhappy childhoods, but they grew to resent the stark discipline, rigid morality, and harsh hierarchical structure that their war vet fathers enforced.

So when the Boomers had children of their own, they vowed to not raise them the way they were raised. So instead of being a taskmaster, they sought to be their child's best friend, and involve themselves in every aspect of their child's lives, and give them unconditional affirmation and confidence. And now we're seeing the result of that: A generation that has never been told no, that is conditioned to receive praise and acceptance for everything they do, and expect to be rewarded not for succeeding, but just for the attempt.

The solution, of course, is somewhere in the middle. What children really need from their parents is not a drill sergeant and definitely not a best buddy -- what they need is an actual farking parent.


My dad was a marine Vietnam vet with severe PTSD and 2 purple hearts.

Please tell me how he wasn't a taskmaster and my "buddy"
 
2013-07-12 09:56:01 AM  

jayphat: TommyymmoT: Cubansaltyballs: In my experience, a lot of Baby Boomers have jobs they should not have and only have them because some other Boomer promoted them. When they see a Gen Xer, they become afraid that some 35 year-old will show the world how incompetent they are.

It's protectionism. The faster this generation dies, the better off we'll all be.

Bide your time, and position yourself.
It's temporary,
They'll be dead, or retired pretty damned soon.

Congratulations. You have just described Walmarts management structure.


Yeah, that is really true with most retail management.  If you have a supervisor you don't like/doesn't like you and they areolder than you by more than a few years, you can usually wait them out.  They will retire/move on.  If they are similar in age or younger than you.... well...  Might as well start looking for a new job.
 
2013-07-12 09:57:16 AM  

Gothnet: WhippingBoy: "I'll do it!"

That's it. That's all you need to do.

There's a reason you're called WhippingBoy, right?

Sucking up to the man will get you nowhere. And you'll never get rich working for somebody else.


Yep, you're right. What the hell was I thinking?
 
2013-07-12 09:58:56 AM  

Deep Contact: I forgot, who are we talking about again?


Soundgarden.
 
2013-07-12 09:59:00 AM  

SharkaPult: jayphat: TommyymmoT: Cubansaltyballs: In my experience, a lot of Baby Boomers have jobs they should not have and only have them because some other Boomer promoted them. When they see a Gen Xer, they become afraid that some 35 year-old will show the world how incompetent they are.

It's protectionism. The faster this generation dies, the better off we'll all be.

Bide your time, and position yourself.
It's temporary,
They'll be dead, or retired pretty damned soon.

Congratulations. You have just described Walmarts management structure.

Yeah, that is really true with most retail management.  If you have a supervisor you don't like/doesn't like you and they areolder than you by more than a few years, you can usually wait them out.  They will retire/move on.  If they are similar in age or younger than you.... well...  Might as well start looking for a new job.


Walmarts problem is quite the opposite. If they are older, you might as well look on. As they were probably put there by someone else who is older and has been with the company forever. So you have two choices: move on or wait for them to die. And people wonder why Walmart has issues with growth. Hard to grow when the young talent abandons ship because the old are entrenched in a position until they die.
 
2013-07-12 09:59:31 AM  

Girion47: My dad was a marine Vietnam vet with severe PTSD and 2 purple hearts.

Please tell me how he wasn't a taskmaster and my "buddy"


You: "You give me what I want, or I'll make the chopper noises again, dad!"
Dad: "No... no!!! Anything but that... of course you can have what you want... we're still buddies, right?"
 
2013-07-12 10:02:49 AM  

verbaltoxin: Phinn: snowshovel: Anyway....I'd probably give the millenials the internet (which I can argue that Generation X may get)...but the millenials more importantly get: always on social connections.

Late Boomers built personal computers and the web software itself, Gen-X built the post-web Internet and blogging, but the Millenials have built the latest round of social media and a lot of apps.

What's the deal with the Gen-Y/Millenial constant social media thing, anyway?  Before the web, Gen-Xers (like me) were the kind of people to keep a Post Office box instead of getting mail at home.  (It helps keep Sallie Mae off our backs.)  The last thing we'd do is put our entire lives online.

It's the same sh*t as when you'd come over, and someone would break out the photo albums and vacation slides. Only now you can do it instantly, instead of horde it in a musty book in your basement.



Yeah, except that now the entire world can flip through your crap, and I don't know if you've noticed, but most of those people are nuts.
 
2013-07-12 10:06:15 AM  

Phinn: verbaltoxin: Phinn: snowshovel: Anyway....I'd probably give the millenials the internet (which I can argue that Generation X may get)...but the millenials more importantly get: always on social connections.

Late Boomers built personal computers and the web software itself, Gen-X built the post-web Internet and blogging, but the Millenials have built the latest round of social media and a lot of apps.

What's the deal with the Gen-Y/Millenial constant social media thing, anyway?  Before the web, Gen-Xers (like me) were the kind of people to keep a Post Office box instead of getting mail at home.  (It helps keep Sallie Mae off our backs.)  The last thing we'd do is put our entire lives online.

It's the same sh*t as when you'd come over, and someone would break out the photo albums and vacation slides. Only now you can do it instantly, instead of horde it in a musty book in your basement.

Yeah, except that now the entire world can flip through your crap, and I don't know if you've noticed, but most of those people are nuts.


That's been the internet's biggest coup: revealing just how utterly stupid and mentally ill most people really are.

It's amazing society hasn't devolved to mass murder and cannibalism, when you think about it. We're maybe a button push away from that happening everyday.
 
2013-07-12 10:14:02 AM  

Ishkur: Doc Daneeka: Sometimes.
I loved arcades, but they were clearly already declining when I was a kid.
I was in the prime age for NES/SNES when I was a kid, and they were clearly already displacing arcades.

Congratulations: You're Generation-X.

The Millenials don't even recognize an era where you had to leave your house to play video games.


I suppose you're right.

And though I was young at the time, I'm old enough to remember when Nirvana and grunge hit the scene and recognized that as a significant change from the pop music that had been on the radio before.

I guess that puts me more at the trailing edge of the Gen-X group.
 
2013-07-12 10:14:57 AM  
I love this argument so much. Where i work there aren't any X'ers, hilariously enough. It's all mid 80's millenials that are being trained in by soon-to-be-retiring boomers that made a fark load of money as project managers and now want out.
 
2013-07-12 10:16:11 AM  
Biggest difference I've seen between Xers and millennials at work is that millennials wait to be told and have to be told to do anything. They don't go figure out how to do things very well - about zero creativity and no autodidaction. It's even worse for my kids generation. Holy shiat. Then they expect a cookie any time they come up with something that's been done the same way for 30 years.

"Oh, you learned how to answer the phone!"
"Yeah, can I have tomorrow off?"
 
2013-07-12 10:16:21 AM  
number 1,  all the members of congress are boomers, and they were voted in by boomers.  boomers you have FAILED, yes I said it, you are a giant group of selfish failures (may God have mercy on your souls)

number 2,  the x'rs are morons for just accepting whatever the media throws at them, and voting obama in.

number 3,   I believe that the boomers have failed humanity as a whole.  And I know this because they are vastly responsible in allowing the federal government to become way way way overpowered.


most importantly:          If the boomers had any balls or brains, they would of protected their children instead of burdening them.
 
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