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(The Heckler)   Cubs finally unload Carlos Marmol, invoking the little-used "No take backs" clause   (theheckler.com) divider line 33
    More: Amusing, Carlos Marmol, Cubs, Dodgers, Steny Hoyer, clauses, lower back  
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580 clicks; posted to Sports » on 02 Jul 2013 at 8:12 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-02 08:30:50 PM
Yeah but they also picked up Pedro Strop today too. So they will still blow games late the only difference is that the pitcher's hat will be at a different angle.
 
2013-07-02 08:48:53 PM
The Dodgers gave up Matt Guerrier, whom they had DFA'd the day before, for Marmol, whom the Cubs had DFA'd.  Basically, a "take my problem and we'll take yours" kind of deal.  No real winner, unless one of them manages an unlikely turnaround.
The Cubs lose $500,000 in salary, which the Dodgers won't even notice, but L.A. also picks up $200,000 in slot money for international signings.
It's an OK move for both teams -- but no big deal.
 
2013-07-02 09:02:20 PM
And in other Dodgers/Cubs news, former outfielder (for both teams) Milton Bradley was sentenced to 2 years 8 months in prison today for spousal abuse.
 
2013-07-02 09:10:49 PM
Homer Bailey of the Reds is perfect through six innings against the Giants. 3-0 Reds.
 
2013-07-02 09:11:40 PM
Homer Bailey now has a no-hitter through six. Just walked his first batter.
 
2013-07-02 09:18:11 PM
UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Homer Bailey of the Reds is perfect through six innings against the Giants. 3-0 Reds.
As difficult as it is for me to root for the Reds, I think I can manage it for another 3 innings.
 
2013-07-02 09:23:49 PM

ragsthetiger: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: Homer Bailey of the Reds is perfect through six innings against the Giants. 3-0 Reds.
As difficult as it is for me to root for the Reds, I think I can manage it for another 3 innings.


Lol, me too. You can watch it here: http://www.vipboxonline.eu/baseball/161883/3/cincinnati-reds-vs-san-f r ancisco-giants-live-stream-online.html
 
2013-07-02 09:28:07 PM
UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can watch it here...

Thanks for the link...unfortunately I'm at work, but I can still listen.
 
2013-07-02 09:39:10 PM

ragsthetiger: UNAUTHORIZED FINGER: You can watch it here...

Thanks for the link...unfortunately I'm at work, but I can still listen.


BTW, you got a great handle. I'm juuust old enough to know who Rags the Tiger is:

www.claytonemery.com

I once won a dinner for two from a radio show for knowing that the T. in Ragland T. Tiger stands for Larry ("My father can't spell").

/No hitter intact, through eight
 
2013-07-02 09:48:26 PM
UNAUTHORIZED FINGER:  I'm juuust old enough to know who Rags the Tiger is...

Just old enough is plenty old -- congratulations on being the very nearly the first person I've met online since the internets were babies who recognizes the reference.  Crusader and Rags were kind of the Ur Rocky and Bullwinkle.
And I used to watch the show when I was a kid, so I'm even older.
 
2013-07-02 09:54:42 PM
D'oh hitter complete.
 
2013-07-02 09:58:33 PM
And Homer Bailey gets his no-no!  If the Dodgers can hang on in Denver, they will be out of the cellar and back in the NL West picture.
 
2013-07-02 10:00:15 PM
Aaaand, NO-HITTER!
 
2013-07-02 10:03:58 PM

ragsthetiger: And in other Dodgers/Cubs news, former outfielder (for both teams) Milton Bradley was sentenced to 2 years 8 months in prison today for spousal abuse.


That's hilarious. Assault with a deadly weapon, brandishing a deadly weapon, menacing, vandalism, anger management, yeah, let's have this guy spend 400 hours with children.
 
2013-07-02 10:05:00 PM

Hoopy Frood: ragsthetiger: And in other Dodgers/Cubs news, former outfielder (for both teams) Milton Bradley was sentenced to 2 years 8 months in prison today for spousal abuse.

That's hilarious. Assault with a deadly weapon, brandishing a deadly weapon, menacing, vandalism, anger management, yeah, let's have this guy spend 400 hours with children.


Er, 200 hours with children. Like the length is the relevant part.
 
2013-07-02 10:08:27 PM
Hoopy Frood:Er, 200 hours with children. Like the length is the relevant part.

200 hours with some kids might possibly do him some good -- not sure if that's the intention, though.
 
2013-07-02 10:09:19 PM

Hoopy Frood: Hoopy Frood: ragsthetiger: And in other Dodgers/Cubs news, former outfielder (for both teams) Milton Bradley was sentenced to 2 years 8 months in prison today for spousal abuse.

That's hilarious. Assault with a deadly weapon, brandishing a deadly weapon, menacing, vandalism, anger management, yeah, let's have this guy spend 400 hours with children.

Er, 200 hours with children. Like the length is the relevant part.


Come on.  Nobody has made a "Go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200" joke?

GET IT TOGETHER FARK.
 
2013-07-02 10:50:45 PM

ragsthetiger: The Dodgers gave up Matt Guerrier, whom they had DFA'd the day before, for Marmol, whom the Cubs had DFA'd.  Basically, a "take my problem and we'll take yours" kind of deal.  No real winner, unless one of them manages an unlikely turnaround.
The Cubs lose $500,000 in salary, which the Dodgers won't even notice, but L.A. also picks up $200,000 in slot money for international signings.
It's an OK move for both teams -- but no big deal.


Are you paying attention to the NL West?  The Dodgers are looking like the world beaters they were projected to be.
 
2013-07-02 10:56:29 PM
Didn't the Dogdgers also take Todd Hundley?
 
2013-07-03 12:27:32 AM

ragsthetiger: The Dodgers gave up Matt Guerrier, whom they had DFA'd the day before, for Marmol, whom the Cubs had DFA'd. Basically, a "take my problem and we'll take yours" kind of deal. No real winner, unless one of them manages an unlikely turnaround.


I thought that was the usual M.O. for ex-Cubs.
 
2013-07-03 01:18:09 AM

generaltimmy: Didn't the Dogdgers also take Todd Hundley?


If I'm not mistaken, the Cubs got both Eric Karros and Mark Grudzielanek--both of whom were reasonably solid contributors for them.
 
2013-07-03 01:28:16 AM
Thanks for the choke tonight, Cubs.

/'preciate ya.
//'preciate ya.
///pretty much hate ya.
 
2013-07-03 04:56:52 AM

Victoly: ragsthetiger: The Dodgers gave up Matt Guerrier, whom they had DFA'd the day before, for Marmol, whom the Cubs had DFA'd. Basically, a "take my problem and we'll take yours" kind of deal. No real winner, unless one of them manages an unlikely turnaround.

I thought that was the usual M.O. for ex-Cubs.


And lets not forget that marmol has incredible stuff.  Some of the best ive ever seen.  I dont know where it WENT, mind you, but if someone can find it....
 
2013-07-03 09:45:59 AM
Cubs pulled some moves that are going to be copied by other GMs around the league from now on.  While they made trades that appear to be bad when you just look at the players involved, they figured out how to get more international pool money.  This is HUGE.  It's basically the next advantage, following the old "trade players and get compensatory draft picks" advantage that went out the window with the last player's association deal.  Why is this significant?  Because it allowed the Cubs to sign both Eloy Jimenez and Gleyber Torres, two of the highest rated international prospects.

What's big about this, and what I have been excited about since day one of the Epstein hire, is that the Cubs FINALLY have a management team that is cutting edge.  They are the guys who will figure out how to gain the advantage no matter how the rules change.  Maybe the international prospects work out, maybe they don't.  But this process of figuring out the advantages ahead of other teams is what will make Epstein and co. successful.

This is exactly why I don't give one tin shiat about what the team does until about 2018-2019.  That's when we'll start seeing the real effect of the rebuild.  Epstein has implemented an entirely new system of how the game is scouted, taught, and played.  That takes a long time to implement, and you have to have the right kind of players in the system (meaning their own draft picks, not Hendry's).  Cubs fans have always had remarkable patience.  This is the best time to show it, because the team is finally going to build something good.
 
2013-07-03 10:00:21 AM
I'll build on my post with this, which is a fantastic breakdown of what went down:

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/orioles-upgrade-with-scott-feldman-cu bs -continue-stocking-up/
 
2013-07-03 11:36:11 AM

Orgasmatron138: Cubs pulled some moves that are going to be copied by other GMs around the league from now on.  While they made trades that appear to be bad when you just look at the players involved, they figured out how to get more international pool money.  This is HUGE.  It's basically the next advantage, following the old "trade players and get compensatory draft picks" advantage that went out the window with the last player's association deal.  Why is this significant?  Because it allowed the Cubs to sign both Eloy Jimenez and Gleyber Torres, two of the highest rated international prospects.

What's big about this, and what I have been excited about since day one of the Epstein hire, is that the Cubs FINALLY have a management team that is cutting edge.  They are the guys who will figure out how to gain the advantage no matter how the rules change.  Maybe the international prospects work out, maybe they don't.  But this process of figuring out the advantages ahead of other teams is what will make Epstein and co. successful.

This is exactly why I don't give one tin shiat about what the team does until about 2018-2019.  That's when we'll start seeing the real effect of the rebuild.  Epstein has implemented an entirely new system of how the game is scouted, taught, and played.  That takes a long time to implement, and you have to have the right kind of players in the system (meaning their own draft picks, not Hendry's).  Cubs fans have always had remarkable patience.  This is the best time to show it, because the team is finally going to build something good.


The extra dollars they got in the trades are dwarfed by the extra dollars they got by being really terrible though.  Their intl. signing budget was already double what the middle of the pack (15th and 16th) teams can spend and nearly 1.6 million (i.e., the amount of buying one of the top guys, since 1.6 is what the White Sox just paid for a guy pretty much universally considered one of the top 5 intl prospects this year) more than the Royals, who were 8th.  We do at least know the Cubs will use as much of their pool as they can though, while I suspect some others will not even come close, and were willing to make trades to get extra signing bucks once they realized they'd need it to get the guys they wanted, so I assume we'll also see them buying up a lot of "lesser" guys that are basically lottery tickets -- they have the money, they may as well use as much of it as they are allowed to, and once in a while one of those turns into an all-star.
 
2013-07-03 12:08:14 PM
Marmol has already been DFA'd by the Dodgers. Hilarious.
 
2013-07-03 12:24:11 PM

GQueue: The extra dollars they got in the trades are dwarfed by the extra dollars they got by being really terrible though.  Their intl. signing budget was already double what the middle of the pack (15th and 16th) teams can spend and nearly 1.6 million (i.e., the amount of buying one of the top guys, since 1.6 is what the White Sox just paid for a guy pretty much universally considered one of the top 5 intl prospe ...


They can only increase the signing budget by 50% though.  Which is a strange rule.  The trade with Houston pretty much assured that the Cubs were the major players on the international market this year - they took a chunk of the Astro's budget.

The players are all lotto tickets, but so is the regular draft.  So you may as well get all the tickets you can get.  That is how you build depth in the organization.
 
2013-07-03 12:35:23 PM

bacongood: GQueue: The extra dollars they got in the trades are dwarfed by the extra dollars they got by being really terrible though.  Their intl. signing budget was already double what the middle of the pack (15th and 16th) teams can spend and nearly 1.6 million (i.e., the amount of buying one of the top guys, since 1.6 is what the White Sox just paid for a guy pretty much universally considered one of the top 5 intl prospe ...

They can only increase the signing budget by 50% though.  Which is a strange rule.  The trade with Houston pretty much assured that the Cubs were the major players on the international market this year - they took a chunk of the Astro's budget.

The players are all lotto tickets, but so is the regular draft.  So you may as well get all the tickets you can get.  That is how you build depth in the organization.


Well, the Cubs aren't going to be much better in the near future, so take a few years of this kind of stockpiling, and I'm seriously looking forward to a team like the Braves of the 90s or the Cardinals of today; they are always there.  That's how the Cubs will win it all, eventually.  Just be the team that keeps getting to the postseason, and with Rickett's willingness to spend, they can pick their spots to make really strong runs.
 
2013-07-03 01:27:01 PM

bacongood: They can only increase the signing budget by 50% though.  Which is a strange rule.  The trade with Houston pretty much assured that the Cubs were the major players on the international market this year - they took a chunk of the Astro's budget


And you have to trade specific slot values (basically like trading draft picks, except of course you can't trade draft picks, unless you get a "competitive balance" draft pick, which for some reason has one of the highest-spending, best teams in baseball included as eligible for picks, and ARGH BASEBALL WHY ARE YOU SO SCREWY) rather than just some amount of pool money.  And I think MLB's pretty clearly setting it up to be an international draft eventually if they get their way.

I don't know if it still applies but last year you could do six bonuses of 50K or less that didn't count against the pool, and everyone that you signed for 10K or less didn't count.
 
2013-07-03 01:27:37 PM

Orgasmatron138: Well, the Cubs aren't going to be much better in the near future, so take a few years of this kind of stockpiling, and I'm seriously looking forward to a team like the Braves of the 90s or the Cardinals of today; they are always there.  That's how the Cubs will win it all, eventually.  Just be the team that keeps getting to the postseason, and with Rickett's willingness to spend, they can pick their spots to make really strong runs.


This is likely a one year move.

All evidence points to Bud creating an international draft.  The slotting system used this year is seen as a step in that direction.  We're probably looking at a short draft (4-5 rounds) followed by undrafted free agents.

You can look at how Houston is gaming the current draft set up.  It is interesting but requires you to completely sell out a couple ML seasons.
 
2013-07-03 01:29:54 PM

GQueue: bacongood: They can only increase the signing budget by 50% though.  Which is a strange rule.  The trade with Houston pretty much assured that the Cubs were the major players on the international market this year - they took a chunk of the Astro's budget

And you have to trade specific slot values (basically like trading draft picks, except of course you can't trade draft picks, unless you get a "competitive balance" draft pick, which for some reason has one of the highest-spending, best teams in baseball included as eligible for picks, and ARGH BASEBALL WHY ARE YOU SO SCREWY) rather than just some amount of pool money.  And I think MLB's pretty clearly setting it up to be an international draft eventually if they get their way.

I don't know if it still applies but last year you could do six bonuses of 50K or less that didn't count against the pool, and everyone that you signed for 10K or less didn't count.


I haven't heard anything about non-counting bonuses this year.  Clear cut info is hard to come by.

Also haven't figured out if you can trade away the $700k everyone gets in addition to the slots.  I assume no, but figure the Marlins will find a way if they can.
 
2013-07-03 01:41:03 PM

bacongood: Orgasmatron138: Well, the Cubs aren't going to be much better in the near future, so take a few years of this kind of stockpiling, and I'm seriously looking forward to a team like the Braves of the 90s or the Cardinals of today; they are always there.  That's how the Cubs will win it all, eventually.  Just be the team that keeps getting to the postseason, and with Rickett's willingness to spend, they can pick their spots to make really strong runs.

This is likely a one year move.

All evidence points to Bud creating an international draft.  The slotting system used this year is seen as a step in that direction.  We're probably looking at a short draft (4-5 rounds) followed by undrafted free agents.

You can look at how Houston is gaming the current draft set up.  It is interesting but requires you to completely sell out a couple ML seasons.


But there will always be a way to game the system.  My main point was that I'm ecstatic that it's finally the friggin Cubs that have the guys to figure it out.
 
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