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(My Fox Phoenix)   18 Firefighters confirmed dead battling Arizona wildfire (article updated)   (myfoxphoenix.com) divider line 341
    More: News, Yarnell Hill, Tonto National Forest, Wildfires in Arizona  
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8416 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Jun 2013 at 11:20 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-30 11:44:28 PM  
Wildfires are called that for a reason.  I was part of a controlled burn once, to help prevent wildfires like this from spreading, and to "restart" the prairie there.

The burn started out fine, but all it took was one gust of wind, and it blew our nice little fire into something terrifying.  This wasn't even dry conditions, and before I knew it our little party was surrounded by fire.  Fortunately for us, we had a pumper truck with us that had enough water in it for us to get out.  We only ended up burning a few acres of grasslands with that mishap.

I can't imagine what it is like fighting a real wildfire is like.  Losing these firefighters is terrible, and my heart goes out to their families.
 
2013-06-30 11:44:46 PM  

thisisyourbrainonFark: Damn, I live near Storm King Mountain in Colorado. Terrible news.


Have you hiked the memorial trail?  I've been thinking about a trip to Glenwood Springs just for that.
 
2013-06-30 11:46:12 PM  

ObnoxiousLonghorn: That is farking huge. That must have been an epic blaze or maybe something exploded. Anyone know if they are pros or volunteers? You never see that many die at once. Holy Fark.


At least one article I read said they were with the Prescott fire department.

Lightning is thought to be the cause of the fire. Add in high temperatures and wind and you've got a rapidly spreading fire.
 
2013-06-30 11:46:47 PM  

picturescrazy: ecmoRandomNumbers: At what point do you just say, "fark it. Just let it burn."

Probably decades ago. Those forests are supposed to burn periodically.


They do that with prescribed burns in certain areas.  The problem is that so may forest are ripe with fuels that have accumulated that this kind of fire is oftimes no longer healthy for the ecosystem. These kind of firest can burn so hot as to sterilize the ground.  It is never good practice to allow these types of fires if you can help it.
 
2013-06-30 11:46:50 PM  
firefly212:

Do wildland firefighters not carry emergency shelters there? I know the fires move fast and all, but I'd like to think that we're learning from previous disasters. =/
Did the shelters not work?

IIRC, the fire shelters got better after the Payson (sp) Arizona fire in 1990.

I wonder what happened, but either way I feel terrible for the families of all the dead.


I think sometimes the speed of the flames is simply too quick.
 
2013-06-30 11:47:10 PM  

doglover: thisdaydreamer: What the farking hell happened?

Wildfires aren't called "tamefires" for a reason.


Nineteen lost at once is pretty farking extreme, even for a wildfire. The people in charge of those firefighters will have some very tough questions to answer.
 
2013-06-30 11:47:27 PM  

firefly212: thelunatick: Elzar: That had to be about the worst article I have read lately - 18 firefighters dead, zero details or even mention of them past sentence one. Are these things now being crowdsourced to twitter for content creation?

Jesus Fuking Christ


In a wildfire details are always almost impossible.   They are unpredictable and highly dangerous.  It could have been something as simple as the wind shifting, or the heat causing a gust that drove the fire into their laps.  They can cover hundreds of feet in seconds.

Do wildland firefighters not carry emergency shelters there? I know the fires move fast and all, but I'd like to think that we're learning from previous disasters. =/
Did the shelters not work?

IIRC, the fire shelters got better after the Payson (sp) Arizona fire in 1990.

I wonder what happened, but either way I feel terrible for the families of all the dead.


A firestorm is a thing of great power. Imagine a hurricane made of gasoline. Now light it on fire. Nothing a man can carry can really stop one.
 
2013-06-30 11:48:54 PM  

ramblinwreck: FireMEN.  I guess the fire took their gender from them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZAuqkqxk9A


I think three women died on Storm King Mountain fighting that fire.
 
2013-06-30 11:49:09 PM  
Someone made a mistake.

Someone made a BIG, goddamn mistake.

i1182.photobucket.com
 
2013-06-30 11:49:42 PM  

BiblioTech: thisisyourbrainonFark: Damn, I live near Storm King Mountain in Colorado. Terrible news.

Have you hiked the memorial trail?  I've been thinking about a trip to Glenwood Springs just for that.


I haven't. Hear that it's both strenuous and poignant.
 
2013-06-30 11:50:02 PM  

thisdaydreamer: doglover: thisdaydreamer: What the farking hell happened?

Wildfires aren't called "tamefires" for a reason.

Nineteen lost at once is pretty farking extreme, even for a wildfire. The people in charge of those firefighters will have some very tough questions to answer.


Extreme?

Do you even Dresden?
 
2013-06-30 11:50:10 PM  
Well that was a fark up of epic proportions.  Whoever is incident commander of that better have a damned good excuse and lawyer.
 
2013-06-30 11:50:35 PM  
Clearly, these firemen needed more flamethrowers.

"Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."

/marginally obscure
 
2013-06-30 11:50:39 PM  
looking at the area on Inciweb's map there are a LOT of natural chimenys to get caught in especially with the fire moving uphill.  The foil in those blankets start breaking down at about 500 degrees, and with 20' flames and 20 mph winds....damn... prayers for the families. A full hand crew, yeah someone is relieved of duty.
 
2013-06-30 11:50:44 PM  
We're up to 19 dead.

The entire Granite Ridge Hotshots team passed.

Live in downtown Phoenix..  we can see and smell the fire from here.
 
2013-06-30 11:51:20 PM  

doglover: firefly212: thelunatick: Elzar: That had to be about the worst article I have read lately - 18 firefighters dead, zero details or even mention of them past sentence one. Are these things now being crowdsourced to twitter for content creation?

Jesus Fuking Christ


In a wildfire details are always almost impossible.   They are unpredictable and highly dangerous.  It could have been something as simple as the wind shifting, or the heat causing a gust that drove the fire into their laps.  They can cover hundreds of feet in seconds.

Do wildland firefighters not carry emergency shelters there? I know the fires move fast and all, but I'd like to think that we're learning from previous disasters. =/
Did the shelters not work?

IIRC, the fire shelters got better after the Payson (sp) Arizona fire in 1990.

I wonder what happened, but either way I feel terrible for the families of all the dead.

A firestorm is a thing of great power. Imagine a hurricane made of gasoline. Now light it on fire. Nothing a man can carry can really stop one.


The shelters did save lives in the Storm King fire, IIRC.
 
2013-06-30 11:51:31 PM  
All the fire departments in the area (and many from out of state even) have been working nonstop since June 18 dealing with wildfires. I have no idea if fatigue might have played a role in this tragedy, but it wouldn't surprise me.

The Doce fire started on the 18th and grew to something like 7000 acres and took the better part of a week and a half to get contained. As soon as that was done we had dozens of lightning sparked fires sprout up all over the county, of which was this one.
 
2013-06-30 11:51:51 PM  

ecmoRandomNumbers: They're just things. You can't bring people back.


Very true and you can bet that every FMO repeats that every 20 seconds in thier mind.  Unfortunately, shiat happens sometimes.  For ths sake of all, I hope this was just an unfortuate circumstance that could not be forseen.
 
2013-06-30 11:52:24 PM  

MorrisBird: Respect, and sadness.


Yes
 
2013-06-30 11:52:44 PM  

darcsun: We're up to 19 dead.

The entire Granite Ridge Hotshots team passed.

Live in downtown Phoenix..  we can see and smell the fire from here.


Raise a glass. Damn.
 
2013-06-30 11:53:33 PM  
Wow, what miserable news to end the weekend with.

RIP, thanks & respect for running in when logic says to run out
 
2013-06-30 11:53:41 PM  
Christ, this says the Prescott Fire Department lost nearly its entire crew.

http://www.dcourier.com/main.asp?SectionID=1&SubSectionID=1&ArticleI D= 120733&TM=85903.19
 
2013-06-30 11:53:53 PM  
Colorado's on fire and now Arizona? Damn
 
2013-06-30 11:54:19 PM  
Not that it brings back the dead parents/siblings/kids but I hope the families get insanely large insurance payouts and MORE. Likely a lawsuit(s) will come out of this, though I don't know what legal stipulations are on that sorta thing being that they "signed up for it."

/I has the sads
 
2013-06-30 11:56:09 PM  
This is just awful. I picked a bad night to have trouble sleeping.
 
2013-06-30 11:56:36 PM  
Sad. :(
 
2013-06-30 11:57:04 PM  
Relevant

Link
 
2013-06-30 11:57:45 PM  

thisisyourbrainonFark: doglover: firefly212: thelunatick: Elzar: That had to be about the worst article I have read lately - 18 firefighters dead, zero details or even mention of them past sentence one. Are these things now being crowdsourced to twitter for content creation?

Jesus Fuking Christ


In a wildfire details are always almost impossible.   They are unpredictable and highly dangerous.  It could have been something as simple as the wind shifting, or the heat causing a gust that drove the fire into their laps.  They can cover hundreds of feet in seconds.

Do wildland firefighters not carry emergency shelters there? I know the fires move fast and all, but I'd like to think that we're learning from previous disasters. =/
Did the shelters not work?

IIRC, the fire shelters got better after the Payson (sp) Arizona fire in 1990.

I wonder what happened, but either way I feel terrible for the families of all the dead.

A firestorm is a thing of great power. Imagine a hurricane made of gasoline. Now light it on fire. Nothing a man can carry can really stop one.

The shelters did save lives in the Storm King fire, IIRC.


To survive a firestorm, you'd need to be in an underground bunker with its own self contained oxygen supply and no ventilation.

If the heat, which can melt rock, doesn't get ya the lack of oxygen will. A foil shelter can only do so much.
 
2013-06-30 11:59:17 PM  
api.ning.com
 
2013-06-30 11:59:56 PM  
What is a "hotshot crew"
 
2013-07-01 12:00:18 AM  
Didn't read through the latest posts, but a buddy of mine is on the Yarnell fire.  Says a thundercell came through at the end of the day. The outflow caused a blow up.  There were 8 tankers and 3 Aircranes launched to help. Couldn't get there in time I guess.
 
2013-07-01 12:00:58 AM  

HeadLever: ecmoRandomNumbers: At what point do you just say, "fark it. Just let it burn."

Typically, when it is dangerous to fight or when the resources are not important enough to just let burn. We had a monster 350,000 acre fire last year where I grew up and for many of the days, the firefighters turned into spectators.  However, when you have hundreds of homes threatened as in the case with this fire, agencies will probably tend to keep thier crews engaged longer than otherwise prudent.




19 dead firemen is a small price to pay to save 50 empty houses built from combustible materials out in the wilderness.

If only there was a fire proof material houses could be built from.
 
2013-07-01 12:01:03 AM  
Jeesus. That's terrible. Thanks guys for your tremendous efforts. :'(.
 
2013-07-01 12:02:03 AM  

WippitGuud: What is a "hotshot crew"

i2.listal.com
 
2013-07-01 12:02:24 AM  

cboppert: Jeesus. That's terrible. Thanks guys for your tremendous efforts. :'(.


Well I can't speak for all of Fark, but you're welcome
 
2013-07-01 12:02:32 AM  

WippitGuud: What is a "hotshot crew"


A clever team name for firefighters who deal with fires, which are hot, playing on the word "hotshot" which denotes a brave or daring person.
 
2013-07-01 12:02:42 AM  

doglover: thisdaydreamer: doglover: thisdaydreamer: What the farking hell happened?

Wildfires aren't called "tamefires" for a reason.

Nineteen lost at once is pretty farking extreme, even for a wildfire. The people in charge of those firefighters will have some very tough questions to answer.

Extreme?

Do you even Dresden?


www.live4ever.uk.com
 
2013-07-01 12:02:43 AM  
HempHead:
19 dead firemen is a small price to pay to save 50 empty houses built from combustible materials out in the wilderness.

If only there was a fire proof material houses could be built from.


So, you would choose to just let the fire burn uncontrolled?
 
2013-07-01 12:02:47 AM  
My grandparents live in one of the home evacuated in Peeple's Valley, AZ. They live there and are about five miles from Yarnell. I know the people there. I am seriously devestated and concerned right now. My grandmother is 78 and my grandfather is 80. She hasn't been doing too hot and now their home is in danger of being destroyed. They designed and built it themselves. They are safe in Prescott but I am still extremely concerned. I was wondering why they didn't call me back today after I left them a message. shiat. shiat. shiat.
 
2013-07-01 12:02:58 AM  

WippitGuud: What is a "hotshot crew"


Firefighters trained to work in rough and remote areas.
 
2013-07-01 12:03:07 AM  
Holy crap. This is horrible.
 
2013-07-01 12:03:39 AM  
Condolences to the families and friends of the firefighters.  :(

Much respect for the people who do this for a living.
 
2013-07-01 12:03:47 AM  

firepilot: Didn't read through the latest posts, but a buddy of mine is on the Yarnell fire.  Says a thundercell came through at the end of the day. The outflow caused a blow up.  There were 8 tankers and 3 Aircranes launched to help. Couldn't get there in time I guess.


Ye gods.
 
2013-07-01 12:03:55 AM  

WippitGuud: What is a "hotshot crew"


Firefighters specially trained in wildfire suppression. Crews generally average 20 firefighters.
 
2013-07-01 12:04:06 AM  

basemetal: [api.ning.com image 512x373]


Tribute.  I salute them too.
 
2013-07-01 12:05:22 AM  
media.oregonlive.com
Hotshot Memorial
 
2013-07-01 12:05:38 AM  
i3.ytimg.com

there wouldn't BE people dying in fires if you people would not go where the FIRE IS!
 
2013-07-01 12:06:05 AM  
http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5186394.pdf 

doglover: thisisyourbrainonFark: doglover: firefly212: thelunatick: Elzar: That had to be about the worst article I have read lately - 18 firefighters dead, zero details or even mention of them past sentence one. Are these things now being crowdsourced to twitter for content creation?

Jesus Fuking Christ


In a wildfire details are always almost impossible.   They are unpredictable and highly dangerous.  It could have been something as simple as the wind shifting, or the heat causing a gust that drove the fire into their laps.  They can cover hundreds of feet in seconds.

Do wildland firefighters not carry emergency shelters there? I know the fires move fast and all, but I'd like to think that we're learning from previous disasters. =/
Did the shelters not work?

IIRC, the fire shelters got better after the Payson (sp) Arizona fire in 1990.

I wonder what happened, but either way I feel terrible for the families of all the dead.

A firestorm is a thing of great power. Imagine a hurricane made of gasoline. Now light it on fire. Nothing a man can carry can really stop one.

The shelters did save lives in the Storm King fire, IIRC.

To survive a firestorm, you'd need to be in an underground bunker with its own self contained oxygen supply and no ventilation.

If the heat, which can melt rock, doesn't get ya the lack of oxygen will. A foil shelter can only do so much.


I hear you. Couldn't find much on how they were used in Storm King except this:

"The remaining 35 firefighters survived by escaping out the east drainage or seeking a safety zone and deploying their fire shelters."

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5186394.pdf
 
2013-07-01 12:06:11 AM  

WippitGuud: What is a "hotshot crew"


Think the Special Ops teams of wildland fire fighters.
 
2013-07-01 12:06:46 AM  
This gives me nightmares since my boyfriend is about to head to fire school.
 
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