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(The Detroit_News)   City: garages are for cars. Residents: that's racist   (detroitnews.com) divider line 160
    More: Strange, planning commission, Ordinances of 1311, patrol cars, man cave, Orchard Street  
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12016 clicks; posted to Main » on 01 Jul 2013 at 2:10 AM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-07-01 07:47:07 AM  
This is a common problem.  My sister and her husband bought a house that it turned out had an "illegally" converted garage.  They found out it was "illegal" when they were checking on paperwork and/or reduction in taxes for converting it back from living space to a garage.
 
2013-07-01 07:50:37 AM  
I guess people dont know about Dearborn and that there are a crap ton of arabs there. If they thought they were being discriminated against they could always just vote the people doing it out of office. They do make up around 43% of the population of the city.

But no its RACSIST!>
 
2013-07-01 07:50:41 AM  

Burr: I am in the process of building a barn, around 30' X 50'.  The first floor will be:

2 rooms (for a clean workshop and a "lounge")
Open garage space (with a toilet)
Space for animals (probably walled off from the garage)

Upstairs:

Storage
Studio Apartment


That is the plan at least.  It is starting as an empty shell, then everything will be added on as funds arrive.   At the very least, it will be a garage and storage.
/have no visible neighbors


If you ever plan on having it insured I would look into local building codes and the inspection process.
 
2013-07-01 07:50:42 AM  

Mentalpatient87: But GUYS! A fire might break out and those poor people would be trapped in the part of the house with the biggest,easiest to open doors!


Not weighing in on whether people starting a fire is a valid concern or not, but it's not about those poor people who started the fire escaping, it's about neighbors whose homes will be set on fire if it spreads and firefighters who might be injured or killed putting out a fire that might not have started if the space had been up to code.

Go look at a map, or even just out the window in the picture in the article. These people aren't out in the sticks with a quarter mile to the next structure. If some jag sets his garage on fire, his neighbor is going to need new siding, at the very least.
 
2013-07-01 07:51:01 AM  

abhorrent1: So now the government wants to tell people where in their house they can hang out? How about you fark off? Does that work for you? Busy bodies.


Had you read TFA, you'd know that government cares more about cars being parked all over a street that isn't designed for it.
 
2013-07-01 07:57:15 AM  
o5iiawah
Had you read TFA, you'd know that government cares more about cars being parked all over a street that isn't designed for it.


When is the city doing a garage clearance inspection then. Cause garages would never be used as junk storage either.
 
2013-07-01 08:01:45 AM  

freewill: Mentalpatient87: But GUYS! A fire might break out and those poor people would be trapped in the part of the house with the biggest,easiest to open doors!

Not weighing in on whether people starting a fire is a valid concern or not, but it's not about those poor people who started the fire escaping, it's about neighbors whose homes will be set on fire if it spreads and firefighters who might be injured or killed putting out a fire that might not have started if the space had been up to code.

Go look at a map, or even just out the window in the picture in the article. These people aren't out in the sticks with a quarter mile to the next structure. If some jag sets his garage on fire, his neighbor is going to need new siding, at the very least.


How is that different than if the other end of the house caught fire? "They wouldn't be in the garage, possibly causing fires" is the kind of hypothetical, worry wart bullshiat that usually gets dismissed around here.
 
2013-07-01 08:02:37 AM  

ghostfacekillahrabbit: So, were any people actually sleeping in any garages? In the article, "Dearborn officials" cite that as a concern, but nowhere in the article does any side claim anyone was actually sleeping in the garage.

Using the garage primarily for socializing in the summer, including cooking on rainy days is pretty standard in the upper midwest. The big midwestern garage is a blessing in winter, but if you're not rich, in the summer it just takes up too much of your space if you don't use it for something.


People down here in NC convert their garages into extra bedrooms/dens all the time. There are several in my neighborhood in fact. Sure they've got to put in extra insulation in the walls and some more wiring for outlets, take out the garage door and frame up the opening, but so what? It's a fairly inexpensive way to add a big room onto your house if you don't mind losing the storage space and parking your car in the weather. Sounds like Detroit is just upset that they aren't getting their "cut" in the way of taxes for people using a non-living space for living purposes.
 
2013-07-01 08:05:33 AM  

liam76: ongbok: OgreMagi: I'm getting tired of people pulling out that racist card every time some old world tradition collides with our modern world.

What tradition are you talking about? Hanging out on your property having a good time? You see this type of stuff all of the time. A group of people will complain when they see another group that they don't approve of having a good time in a manner that they don't approve of, even if that group isn't causing any problems.

Well as long as you ignore the problems of more crowded street parking, peopel using areas not up to code as living spaces, and avoiding taxes on those living spaces.


Well then what about the people that keep so much junk in their garages that they can't park their cars there? Are they not contributing to the "parking problem" on the street? I bet that is causing more parking on the street than people using their garages as a hang out place. As far as the living space issue, nowhere in the article do they say anybody was using it to sleep in, they were just using it as a place to hang out in. And if the tax issues was such a big deal the city would offer them a solution to remedy that, which they aren't.
 
2013-07-01 08:07:32 AM  
Lots of folks around here hang out in the garage OR barn. I know folks that have kitchens and bathrooms in their barns. Nice, LEGAL kitchens and bathrooms, not dumps. It's quite common, all over the country.
 
2013-07-01 08:10:28 AM  

Peki: FTFA:   In that case, they should be evaluated and taxed accordingly.

And here, ladies and gentlemen, is where the real issue is.
/"dirty camel-jockeys aren't paying their fair share!!!"
//doesn't matter if I have a home gym in my garage and couldn't fit a Mini Cooper, much less the Chevy Suburban I have in the garage
/snark off


Race pimps gotta race pimp.
 
2013-07-01 08:12:23 AM  
"Stop using things the way I don't use them!"
 
2013-07-01 08:15:54 AM  
No more poker games in the garage?  Well that just sucks.
 
2013-07-01 08:19:56 AM  

Mentalpatient87: How is that different than if the other end of the house caught fire? "They wouldn't be in the garage, possibly causing fires" is the kind of hypothetical, worry wart bullshiat that usually gets dismissed around here.


I don't know how else to explain this to you. The city is arguing that the building codes for garages are inferior to the building codes for living spaces, which is why they won't write permits for this. That's how it's different: they're arguing that a fire in the garage is more likely to burn the house, not to mention the damn neighborhood, down, and that sitting in there six hours a day smoking hookahs makes it a whole lot more likely to happen. Smoking and cooking are quite possibly the two most prominent causes of house fires, and there's a different between doing that in a part of the home that was built to anticipate that risk instead of slapping a sliding door on the farking garage and doing it in there.

Now, I could point out that somebody welding in his garage next to a cabinet full of flammable chemicals also makes that a lot more likely to happen, and I don't see the city going apeshiat about that. (Maybe they do, I don't know.) However, pretending like you're completely mystified by their concern is ridiculous.
 
2013-07-01 08:24:39 AM  

OgreMagi: I'm getting tired of people pulling out that racist card every time some old world tradition collides with our modern world.


Did you RTFA? Because the only one who mentioned racism is stubby.
 
2013-07-01 08:26:51 AM  

ongbok: Well then what about the people that keep so much junk in their garages that they can't park their cars there? Are they not contributing to the "parking problem" on the street? I bet that is causing more parking on the street than people using their garages as a hang out place.


Totally, and that's why a sane response to that problem would be to design and enforce some sensible on-street parking rules to go after this directly and let everybody deal with it as they like.

Separately, I don't really care what they're doing with the garage and I don't see why anybody else should, either, as long as it's up to code. I only glossed over the article and it didn't seem too clear on exactly what's going on here (conflicting claims), but I got the impression that the city feels it just isn't up to code, or else they'd be more than happy to write a permit for the conversion and collect new tax revenue on the improvement accordingly.
 
2013-07-01 08:27:03 AM  

Pokey.Clyde: Notabunny: Meh. If you want to convert your garage into living space, get the permits and inspections. Ta-da!

FTFA: They say the structures aren't meant to be living spaces, so building permits can't be issued to convert them.

You were saying?


The reality says the would be permit issuers are just lazy and don't want another hassle so just put a blanket ban on any conversion. Look around the world guys, you can convert damn near anything into a safe, habitable structure.
 
2013-07-01 08:31:11 AM  
There may not be building codes in the savage lands you come from, but we have them here. Sorry.
 
2013-07-01 08:32:39 AM  

LemSkroob: There may not be building codes in the savage lands you come from, but we have them here. Sorry.


If Dearborn ever holds an online contest for a new city motto, Fark should get behind this one.
 
2013-07-01 08:34:07 AM  
It must be about race because every white person does the same thing and no one ever get's in trouble!!!

I'd like to think we can give the city SOME benefit of the doubt here if for no other reason than to play devil's advocate.  Maybe the enforcement issue came up because of some bigoted neighbor or some such, but we're talking about structural changes to an existing building.  Everyone up thread is talking about how this good ole boy network is immune to code enforcement... but that's just not the case.  Moving a bunch of crap into your garage is one thing, but when you start adding design elements that make it "look" like a habitable space you're going to raise red flags.

When someone sues the city because their poor little such and such got roasted alive in a converted garage, the city can only take the "we just didn't know" excuse so far.  A good lawyer is going to point out the fancy sliding doors on the place and say the city should have known and da da da.

Try replacing the your garage door with a sliding glass door and see how far you get.  Sure, you might get away with it for a while until someone actually notifies code enforcement.  Around here, the first thing anyone is going to think is "illegal apartment rental".

Pull any mention of ethnicity out of this article and it becomes such a non-story it wouldn't event have printed.
 
2013-07-01 08:35:30 AM  

ongbok: liam76: ongbok: OgreMagi: I'm getting tired of people pulling out that racist card every time some old world tradition collides with our modern world.

What tradition are you talking about? Hanging out on your property having a good time? You see this type of stuff all of the time. A group of people will complain when they see another group that they don't approve of having a good time in a manner that they don't approve of, even if that group isn't causing any problems.

Well as long as you ignore the problems of more crowded street parking, peopel using areas not up to code as living spaces, and avoiding taxes on those living spaces.

Well then what about the people that keep so much junk in their garages that they can't park their cars there? Are they not contributing to the "parking problem" on the street? I bet that is causing more parking on the street than people using their garages as a hang out place. As far as the living space issue, nowhere in the article do they say anybody was using it to sleep in, they were just using it as a place to hang out in. And if the tax issues was such a big deal the city would offer them a solution to remedy that, which they aren't.


They may be contributing just as much to the parking problem, but there is no way to know without inspecting garages.  Also people don't find about somebody elses trash filled garage and say, hey that is neat, lets do that.  So now we have a problem where we can actually see ti fromt he street and it is spreading.

I said "living space" not "sleeping" space.  FTA,
They migrated over time to the garage as an extension of the living place, and here comes the complaint from people who don't have that as part of their tradition," said Nabeel Abraham, a Dearborn resident

ongbok: And if the tax issues was such a big deal the city would offer them a solution to remedy that, which they aren't


They have a solution.  Rebuild it up to code.  Although I am pretty sure the official is full of shiat by saying they can't be re-purposed simply by inspection.  All the recent houses I have seen built in the bowels of MD where I live have garages that they market as finishable (maybe it is a local thing, or just readjusting for man caves).
 
2013-07-01 08:36:27 AM  
Can't have them furriners hangin' around out side their garages

s17.postimg.org Nope.
 
2013-07-01 08:36:42 AM  

Mentalpatient87: But GUYS! A fire might break out and those poor people would be trapped in the part of the house with the biggest,easiest to open doors!

/freedom


except that in the article, they took down the garage door (which, BTW, is not an acceptable means of egress) and replaced it (doing the work without a permit) with a sliding glass door (which is also not an acceptable means of egress).

This article isnt about "hanging out" in the garage, it's about improperly using a non-habitable space.

The first issue, as the article brought up, is that it creates a parking issue. When a developer is given permission to build, often, that developer is asked to provide X number of off-street parking space. And this takes that away.

Second, while this might be used as a living room now, what if in a few years they decide to just use it as a bedroom, or a rental suite? Now you have a zoning issue as well, and more people on the property than intended. This strains the blocks infrastructure (sewer, power, etc) as it as more users on it than intended.
 
2013-07-01 08:39:38 AM  
I remember when I lived in Bolingbrook, my neighborhood had an ordinance stating that You had to park you car in the garage if there was a space.  You couldn't use your garage as a storage area and park your car on the driveway or street.  At the time, I thought it was a little on the draconian side.  However, I have since moved to a neighborhood in Cedar Park where the roads are essentially choked down to one lane due to everyone parking their cars on the street.  Out here, the garage is apparently glorified storage.

So, if a neighborhood decides it wants to pass an ordinance like this to keep their streets functional, I have no problem with it.
 
2013-07-01 08:47:02 AM  

liam76: ongbok: liam76: ongbok: OgreMagi: I'm getting tired of people pulling out that racist card every time some old world tradition collides with our modern world.

What tradition are you talking about? Hanging out on your property having a good time? You see this type of stuff all of the time. A group of people will complain when they see another group that they don't approve of having a good time in a manner that they don't approve of, even if that group isn't causing any problems.

Well as long as you ignore the problems of more crowded street parking, peopel using areas not up to code as living spaces, and avoiding taxes on those living spaces.

Well then what about the people that keep so much junk in their garages that they can't park their cars there? Are they not contributing to the "parking problem" on the street? I bet that is causing more parking on the street than people using their garages as a hang out place. As far as the living space issue, nowhere in the article do they say anybody was using it to sleep in, they were just using it as a place to hang out in. And if the tax issues was such a big deal the city would offer them a solution to remedy that, which they aren't.

They may be contributing just as much to the parking problem, but there is no way to know without inspecting garages.  Also people don't find about somebody elses trash filled garage and say, hey that is neat, lets do that.  So now we have a problem where we can actually see ti fromt he street and it is spreading.

I said "living space" not "sleeping" space.  FTA,
They migrated over time to the garage as an extension of the living place, and here comes the complaint from people who don't have that as part of their tradition," said Nabeel Abraham, a Dearborn resident
ongbok: And if the tax issues was such a big deal the city would offer them a solution to remedy that, which they aren't

They have a solution.  Rebuild it up to code.  Although I am pretty sure the official is full of shiat b ...


You didn't read the article did you? If you did you would have seen this.

They say the structures aren't meant to be living spaces, so building permits can't be issued to convert them.

That is why I said if the tax issue was such a big deal, they would have created a process to issue permits to convert them.
 
2013-07-01 08:47:18 AM  

LemSkroob: a sliding glass door (which is also not an acceptable means of egress).


Wait, really?
 
2013-07-01 08:48:47 AM  

liam76: If you ever plan on having it insured I would look into local building codes and the inspection process.


Yeah.  Its actually going to be a "project barn".  It is starting out as a pole barn with a gambrel roof for storage space and concrete (and plumbed and electricity ran to it).  After that, I am going to attempt to learn framing walls and putting up drywall for the clean project room (I wanted a separate room for delicate machines and computer away from the dusty dirty garage) and the lounge.  I have some carpenter friends who I can squeeze information out of, and get it inspected along the way.

Plus, I can get my children involved in the process, and give them some practical skills.
 
2013-07-01 08:49:28 AM  
So why aren't garages built to the same standards as living areas? Get some building codes, sheesh.
 
2013-07-01 08:50:36 AM  
Wow. This is one time I expected Fark to be on the brown folks side, but I guess I should know better. Brown people are always bad here and everything brown folks do is suspect or just pain unnatural. Geesh.

Seriously - I'm sure plenty of Farkers have converted a garage into their man/cave and I'm pretty sure very few got a building permit to do it. It just happens over time. So what these folks are using it as an unofficial rumpus room.

Big effing deal.
 
2013-07-01 08:52:43 AM  

Hermione_Granger: Seriously - I'm sure plenty of Farkers have converted a garage into their man/cave and I'm pretty sure very few got a building permit to do it. It just happens over time. So what these folks are using it as an unofficial rumpus room.

Big effing deal.


As somebody else said above, it's one thing when you do this secretly, but if you take your garage door off and put a sliding glass door on, the code inspector is probably going to farking notice that and ask about it.
 
2013-07-01 08:56:29 AM  
Ahh... it's times like this that make me so grateful that my hometown bans parking on the street overnight.
 
2013-07-01 09:01:50 AM  

ongbok: You didn't read the article did you? If you did you would have seen this.


Why did you think I said I thought the city official was full of shiat, if not to counter that line?


ongbok: That is why I said if the tax issue was such a big deal, they would have created a process to issue permits to convert them


There is a process, rebuild them.  However if it is as I suspect the city official was talking out of their ass and all they need to do is redo the electrical wiriing throw up some insulation, and put in two fire exits.
 
2013-07-01 09:03:21 AM  
Wow.  TFA sets raises the bar on hyperbole.  Just dripping with it.  I am okay with making folks get their goddamn cars off the street if they have a home with a driveway there.  Otherwise, it is their goddamned garage.  Naturalization was given up on about 23 years ago.  Same with all of you "ooh look a cute ranch" that bought some re-gentrified WW2 shoebox house with a poorly laid out driveway so you park on the street and cause congestion.  Hope all of your sideview mirrors "fall off".  Sometimes it takes 3 or 4 times but folks figure it out.  You can't underestimate the level of care when they are directly affected.  Not the same level of care that asking them like a nice person or even notes that explain the problem of parking your car at a 4way stop.  A 250 deductible will, apparently.  My weekly rant about on street parking and being considerate is done.
 
2013-07-01 09:25:18 AM  

Priapetic: Public Savant: Peki: FTFA:   //doesn't matter if I have a home gym in my garage and couldn't fit a Mini Cooper, much less the Chevy Suburban I have in the garage

You wrote 'garage' twice...

He really likes garages....


and rape. he really likes rape too.
 
2013-07-01 09:33:06 AM  

God-is-a-Taco: Peki:
/"dirty camel-jockeys aren't paying their fair share!!!"
 

It's the muslins that made it a racial thing. I'm still proud of you for sticking it to whitey, though.
I'm just surprised that arabs apparently have a "tradition" of living in garages. Must be one of those lost chapters of the Koran.


They have a strong social tradition that nuclear families and SFRs don't really accommodate very well. And yes, there are parts of the Koran that dictate socializing. Each meal that breaks the fast each day during Ramadan, and the final feast at the end, are each supposed to be taken in community, with other Muslims, not just by yourself. That's part of Ramadan.

/Non-Muslim white girl here, just educated
//thinks it's more about the money than the race card anyway
 
2013-07-01 09:48:32 AM  

teylix: and rape. he really likes rape too.


Ya'll are funny.
 
2013-07-01 10:21:03 AM  

Clint_Torres: LordOfThePings: [cearensesinternacionais.files.wordpress.com image 350x291]

Hey fellas, the "garage"! Well, ooh la di da, Mr. French Man.

Well what do you call it?


A car hole.
 
2013-07-01 10:23:00 AM  

freewill: I don't know how else to explain this to you. The city is arguing that the building codes for garages are inferior to the building codes for living spaces, which is why they won't write permits for this. That's how it's different: they're arguing that a fire in the garage is more likely to burn the house, not to mention the damn neighborhood, down, and that sitting in there six hours a day smoking hookahs makes it a whole lot more likely to happen.


Well, it's a good thing those normal people in the white neighborhoods with restrictive HOAs prevent people from putting anything in their garages which could possibly catch fire.

www.sfexaminer.com

Wouldn't want anything flammable in the garage since it's such a fire hazard.

I'm with other people here.  I have power tools and gasoline in my garage.  I defy someone to explain how a water pipe is more hazardous than that.
 
2013-07-01 10:32:05 AM  
I suppose I'm late to the party, but doesn't Dearborn follow the general Detroit-area model of detached garages behind the house?  If so, there would typically be plenty of driveway parking to avoid street parking issues - but if there is a street parking issue it should be dealt with as such.

Parking aside, I can see two arguments against allowing garages as social settings -  using the garage as a habitation (sleeping there) and using it for open-flame cooking (grilling).  Unless these people are doing so, leave them alone.  Sliding doors, tables and chairs, even TVs don't affect anyone except those who live there.
 
2013-07-01 10:40:36 AM  
Gotta love Fark; this thread is largely lambasting those dirty immigrants for thinking they can sit around in their garages smoking, and praising gummint for using those code rules to keep people from smoking in their garages; meanwhile, there's a story on the front page about companies cracking down on employee smoking, and Farkers are losing their frickin' minds.
 
2013-07-01 10:44:24 AM  
This seems like an odd thing to get worked up about.  People aren't very neighborly in a lot of places, and front porches and improvised garage hangouts seem like a good way to meet your neighbors.

I know growing up some folks down the block would convert their garage into a kind of sun room (when it wasn't the brutal winter when you needed your garage for parking) and it did kind of serve as an impromptu gathering place for the neighborhood kids.
 
2013-07-01 10:51:18 AM  
Way down at the bottom is the real issue with the garages...

they should be evaluated and taxed accordingly.
 
2013-07-01 10:53:11 AM  

theMightyRegeya: Gotta love Fark; this thread is largely lambasting those dirty immigrants for thinking they can sit around in their garages smoking, and praising gummint for using those code rules to keep people from smoking in their garages; meanwhile, there's a story on the front page about companies cracking down on employee smoking, and Farkers are losing their frickin' minds.


Actually, it is more in support of communities deciding that there's potential code and public safety concerns with people living in spaces that arent designed for it and that cars which should be parked in the garages are choking off the streets

The "Dirty immigrants" part is added by racist assholes like yourself.
 
2013-07-01 11:19:22 AM  

theMightyRegeya: Well, it's a good thing those normal people in the white neighborhoods with restrictive HOAs prevent people from putting anything in their garages which could possibly catch fire.


It's a good thing I didn't mention that in the very next sentence, too, right?

Seriously, though, while garage fires are not uncommon, smoking-related fires are a fark of a lot more common. How many cars have you seen burst into flames in a garage? The chemicals you keep in your garage will ordinarily need something to get them going, and your hookah, well, that could be just perfect, as could introducing a heater into what would otherwise not be a climate-controlled space.

Regardless, if it's not up to code, it's not up to code. Rejecting a permit application for it should be a non-controversy, and it has nothing to do with a restrictive HOA or what's "normal". (The parking issue is a separate but completely valid one.)
 
2013-07-01 11:19:58 AM  

OgreMagi: Bonzo_1116: OgreMagi: I'm getting tired of people pulling out that racist card every time some old world tradition collides with our modern world.

Race card or not, I hope the garage-porch conversion idea gets a permit process. It seems like an outstanding idea, and a cure for the kind of places where you never see your neighbors, because they drive into the garage at the end of their commute and don't emerge until the next morning.

Personally, I don't have a problem with the garage "patio" conversion.  I'm just sick of the cry of racism every time something is different here.


FTA:
"I think it's a class, ethnic reaction."

I don't see a single mention of the term "racism" in the article, in fact the only person obsessing about race is yourself.
 
2013-07-01 11:23:12 AM  

ghostfacekillahrabbit: So, were any people actually sleeping in any garages? In the article, "Dearborn officials" cite that as a concern, but nowhere in the article does any side claim anyone was actually sleeping in the garage.

Using the garage primarily for socializing in the summer, including cooking on rainy days is pretty standard in the upper midwest. The big midwestern garage is a blessing in winter, but if you're not rich, in the summer it just takes up too much of your space if you don't use it for something.


I have no problem with using the garage as a hang out, but the concern here is those people who have cars and don't use their garages for that, instead leaving their cars outside while using their garages for other purposes.
 
2013-07-01 11:24:45 AM  

AverageAmericanGuy: BarkingUnicorn: Priapetic: "The garages are a continuation of marathon socializing sessions that started many years ago in their home countries under shady trees, often accompanied by coffee and a water pipe, known as a hookah or argileh. "

Seriously, Detroit News?  Seriously? And that tidbit adds to the reader education how, exactly? /facepalm

What's your problem with interesting bit of cultural background?  It gives me a good mental picture of what the garage gatherings are like. I was wondering why anyone would tile the floor of a garage and put sliding doors on it.  "Marathon socializing" makes sense.

A lot of people think cultures other than their own are worthless to learn about.


Done in one.

I think the city has lost it on this. So what if they are socializing in their garage? Big deal! Hell, I wouldn't mind hanging out with them. I wish the weather was cool enough for me to do that here in Austin. Hell, this makes me wonder how the city handles garage sales...
 
2013-07-01 12:25:59 PM  

BarkingUnicorn: Priapetic: "The garages are a continuation of marathon socializing sessions that started many years ago in their home countries under shady trees, often accompanied by coffee and a water pipe, known as a hookah or argileh. "

Seriously, Detroit News?  Seriously? And that tidbit adds to the reader education how, exactly? /facepalm

What's your problem with interesting bit of cultural background?  It gives me a good mental picture of what the garage gatherings are like. I was wondering why anyone would tile the floor of a garage and put sliding doors on it.  "Marathon socializing" makes sense.


No problem with their culture.  But I expect the majority of people described in the article who are socializing aren't using a "water pipe, known as a hookah or argileh".  How about we just say they're from a very social culture and leave it at that?  If the majority of the people described in the aricle ARE firing up the water pipe, then fine, it adds clarity to the situation.  Or if the majority of people in their original culture do gather around a water pipe, again, fine.  But I suspect that's not the case, and the resulting mental picture the writer is giving you is not consistent with the cultural reality.  In other words, a stereotype.
 
2013-07-01 02:15:26 PM  

freewill: LemSkroob: a sliding glass door (which is also not an acceptable means of egress).

Wait, really?


Yes. Most building codes state that only swinging doors are considered acceptable on a path of egress. The reason being that you want doors that are to be used in an emergency to be of the most common type, so that during a panicked situation, people don't have any delay. Sliding glass doors also usually have a lower track along the bottom, which can be a trip hazard. Again, not something you want in the way during a quick escape.

For public buildings, the rules are even tighter. they can only swing out (can't swing in, can't be a slider, roll-up door, or a revolving door, etc.), have to have panic hardware, are not lockable from the inside, height and width, and they even specify the amount of force that is required to open the door.

For residential doors, like in this case, they care about quantity and type, but less so on things like swing direction (since the # of occupants is lower, and won't cause a "traffic jam" when trying to pull it open).
 
2013-07-01 02:41:28 PM  
Government small enough not to prevent me from doing whatever I want,
but big enough to prevent people I don't like from doing what I don't like.
 
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