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(Eater)   The contract for employees working at Crazy Amy's Baking Company is as farked up as you would imagine   (eater.com ) divider line
    More: Obvious, Ramsay's Kitchen Nightmares, Gordon Ramsay  
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20096 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Jun 2013 at 10:42 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-30 05:01:10 PM  
seriously they should call it Crazy Amy's now
 
2013-06-30 05:03:30 PM  

LtDarkstar: malaktaus: ZeroCorpse: I wish they'd just throw these two into a cage with the Koch brothers and a few baseball nail-filled baseball bats, and tell them only one person will be let out of the cage in the end.

And then don't open the cage in the end, anyway, because the winner had "an attitude."

This is my idea for one of those big, outdoor summer festivals. This is called Slug Fest. This is for men only. Here's what you do. You get about a hundred thousand of these farking men. You know the ones I mean. These macho motherfarkers. These strutting, preening, posturing, hairy, sweaty, alpha male jackoffs. The muscle assholes. You take about a hundred thousand of these disgusting pricks, and you throw them in a big dirt arena, big twenty-five acre dirt arena. And you just let them beat the shiat out of each other  for twenty-four hours non-stop. No food, no water, just whiskey and PCP. And you just let them punch and pound and kick the shiat out of each other until only one guy is left standing, then you take that guy and you put him on a pedestal and you shoot him in the farking head.

Your newsletter, let me subscribe to it

/seriously
//You are my new idol!


Idolize him if you wish but George Carlin has been dead for a few years now.

/classic
//Credit where it is due
 
2013-06-30 05:05:33 PM  

Chaghatai: BizarreMan: Not to white knight Crazy Amy but, many of those don't seem too outrageous.

Expecting people to be on time and ready to start working when their shift is scheduled to begin isn't unreasonable.

Telling people up front to expect to work weekends and holidays is fine too.  When we hire people where I work we tell people up front that they are not guaranteed any specific shift or any specific days.  They are expected to be able to work whatever we put them on the schedule.  Employees will agree that yes, they can work any time.  Until they get the job and the first schedule comes out, then it's I can't work that day because I have church, I can't work that day because I don't have daycare for my child.....

So much THIS^^^

Amy's is terrible and taking tips is illegal in AZ I'm pretty sure, but not hiring anyone who doesn't have honest-to-goodness "open" availability shouldn't be wrong in anybody's book. You won't believe how many employees who agreed to open availability tell me all the time that they need specific allowances and can't work their schedules.


Meh.  It's about balance.  I've never had any problems finding a way to Tetris people into a schedule.

Have college kids working for you?  Work the kids that have classes Mon Wed Fri opposite the kids who have classes Tues Thurs.  Some of your people need Sun off for church or to watch the big game?  Have a few people who love to work weekends to offset them.

I've handled this in bookstores, offices, restaurants, and regular retail.  Little mom & pop places and big box retail.  Just takes a few more minutes of your time.  Makes for -much- happier workers.  No one should have to stress about losing their job because they want to watch their kid play soccer on Saturday mornings.
 
2013-06-30 05:23:24 PM  

lack of warmth: $250 for missing a shift and paying for something that gets broken.  I don't think so.  I don't think the owners understand the risk that is just business.

The second half of rule 6 is stupid when rule 11 is enough.  However if ABC doesn't want the business of parents who may want to patronize their establishment so the parents' kid can wait on ole mom and dad, then that is ABC's loss.  My parents did that to me a few times, my boss never complained about the money.

When Kitchen Nightmares pointed out the tipping issue, I was outraged.  However if I had to choose between the $8-$12/hr solid pay compared to 2.15-4.10/hr with tips, I will go with sure money.  I guess we now know why folks keep applying there.



A local beer co-op here has a no-tipping policy and pays a "living wage" (I think its around $11 an hour).  The nytimes had an op-ed about it last week.

There's a waiting list to work there because many experienced restaurant veterans prefer the stable income.

They're able to do it because they don't need an army of table waiters.  You place your order, receive a numbered placard, then someone brings the food to you.
 
2013-06-30 05:25:42 PM  

penthesilea: Chaghatai: BizarreMan: Not to white knight Crazy Amy but, many of those don't seem too outrageous.

Expecting people to be on time and ready to start working when their shift is scheduled to begin isn't unreasonable.

Telling people up front to expect to work weekends and holidays is fine too.  When we hire people where I work we tell people up front that they are not guaranteed any specific shift or any specific days.  They are expected to be able to work whatever we put them on the schedule.  Employees will agree that yes, they can work any time.  Until they get the job and the first schedule comes out, then it's I can't work that day because I have church, I can't work that day because I don't have daycare for my child.....

So much THIS^^^

Amy's is terrible and taking tips is illegal in AZ I'm pretty sure, but not hiring anyone who doesn't have honest-to-goodness "open" availability shouldn't be wrong in anybody's book. You won't believe how many employees who agreed to open availability tell me all the time that they need specific allowances and can't work their schedules.

Meh.  It's about balance.  I've never had any problems finding a way to Tetris people into a schedule.

Have college kids working for you?  Work the kids that have classes Mon Wed Fri opposite the kids who have classes Tues Thurs.  Some of your people need Sun off for church or to watch the big game?  Have a few people who love to work weekends to offset them.

I've handled this in bookstores, offices, restaurants, and regular retail.  Little mom & pop places and big box retail.  Just takes a few more minutes of your time.  Makes for -much- happier workers.  No one should have to stress about losing their job because they want to watch their kid play soccer on Saturday mornings.


I don't think it has anything to do with that crazy biatch wanting to work around schedules.  She and her sugar daddy act like the kind of people who are very disappointed that slavery was abolished and have no problem with treating people as if they were slaves, anyway.  They are control freaks.  They don't see their relationship with their employees as a partnership as good bosses do.
 
2013-06-30 05:27:11 PM  

Brittabot: Chaghatai: BizarreMan: Not to white knight Crazy Amy but, many of those don't seem too outrageous.

Expecting people to be on time and ready to start working when their shift is scheduled to begin isn't unreasonable.

Telling people up front to expect to work weekends and holidays is fine too.  When we hire people where I work we tell people up front that they are not guaranteed any specific shift or any specific days.  They are expected to be able to work whatever we put them on the schedule.  Employees will agree that yes, they can work any time.  Until they get the job and the first schedule comes out, then it's I can't work that day because I have church, I can't work that day because I don't have daycare for my child.....

So much THIS^^^

Amy's is terrible and taking tips is illegal in AZ I'm pretty sure, but not hiring anyone who doesn't have honest-to-goodness "open" availability shouldn't be wrong in anybody's book. You won't believe how many employees who agreed to open availability tell me all the time that they need specific allowances and can't work their schedules.

It's almost like employees are human beings with actual lives outside of work...

One can have open availability but pretty much anyone is going to have either planned or unplanned things come up from time to time that will prevent them from being able to work a certain shift.

Employers would see much lower turnover if they recognized the need for a work/life balance and allowed people a bit of leeway once in awhile.


I think the point was about employees not being up front about their scheduling requirements. Of course it is okay if someone needs a particular day off to worship their sky wizard of choice, and if the day care at which they leave their crotch fruit only operates certain hours, but if they don't say that in the first place, the manager will schedule them assuming "I can work anytime" actually means "I can work anytime". A good scheduling manager should allow for these kinds of things anyway, especially in a restaurant environment where there "should" be a pool of wait staff clamoring for extra hours and willing to cover for one another. The point that Crazy Amy is essentially demanding open availability says to me (a) she is too lazy to put together a decent schedule and (b) she can't keep enough wait staff to ensure coverage. But we already inferred the latter since she is insane and impossible to work for.

As far as work/life balance, I try to keep my underlings proles workers as happy as I can. If they need a day off, I accomodate. We're a small lab (5 employees plus myself, and we all have specialized functions), but we pick up each other's slack when someone isn't around. I don't keep attendance "points" or demerits for tardiness or absenteeism under the premise of "shiat happens". If they aren't there, they don't get paid. If it becomes a problem, we have a talk. If it's still a problem, we have a talk with Corporate HR. But you know what? I treat my minions with respect, and they pay it back in kind by working hard and showing up for work on time. Maybe I'm just lucky, though.
 
2013-06-30 05:36:10 PM  

bunner: My point, should you be curious, was that - in light of all of the cheap, disingenuous, two faced prick as a business model, usurious, class war instigating, wealth disparity encouraging, sh*tty, hateful behavior that passes for culture, these days - if Armageddon started outside of my window in 5 min. not only would I not be surprised, I would probably dance.


Someone been pissing in your coffee again? You're quite the little bundle of rage.
 
2013-06-30 05:43:43 PM  
"19) The wait staff understands that any and all "tips" are property of the "house." "

This is 100% illegal via IRS tax code unless the 'house' owners are actively participating in serving the guests. If they do not much of jack and the waitstaff handles customer service, then no, those tips don't belong to the house.

/already embroiled in a lawsuit over this with Red Delivery Guy
//I will win, and they will be audited and the owners jailed. Too much evidence.
 
2013-06-30 05:44:11 PM  

Abox: BizarreMan: Not to white knight Crazy Amy but, many of those don't seem too outrageous.

Expecting people to be on time and ready to start working when their shift is scheduled to begin isn't unreasonable.

Telling people up front to expect to work weekends and holidays is fine too.  When we hire people where I work we tell people up front that they are not guaranteed any specific shift or any specific days.  They are expected to be able to work whatever we put them on the schedule.  Employees will agree that yes, they can work any time.  Until they get the job and the first schedule comes out, then it's I can't work that day because I have church, I can't work that day because I don't have daycare for my child.....

I once took a tech job with the stipulation that I would be flexible with my schedule.  To me that meant I'd work any shift - day, swings, graveyard, whatever.  So my shift ended up being this weird mix where I'd work 8a-5p on a Friday and have to be back at work for another full shift starting at 1a Saturday...so eight hours between workdays. When I couldn't take it anymore and gave notice the boss said I was being unreasonable because I had said I'd be flexible.


That effin sucks. I've done the crazy shift thing while working as a supervisor when needed (like 2 nights every quarter) and it was horrible. I couldn't imagine doing it every week and for someone who didn't appreciate the hard work involved.
 
2013-06-30 05:45:52 PM  

Endive Wombat: A 50 mile, 1 year non-compete to not work in another restaurant?  GTFO of here.  No way that would stand up in court


Article regarding the enforceability of covenants not to compete in Arizona:   http://www.anthemlaw.com/articles/non-compete-agreements/ 

Based on that article, it's not completely clear that a court would find it unreasonable.  It outright says in the article that six months to a year is a reasonable time frame.  A fifty mile radius may or may not be reasonable depending on the landscape out there--fifty miles in Arizona isn't what it is in New England, and, given that I've never lived in that part of the country, I'll be the first to admit I don't have a clue.  I think the kicker would be whether the person could reasonably find another job in his or her field after ceasing work there, and whether the covenant at hand serves a legitimate business purpose--likely, the protection of ABC's intellectual property (recipes, production techniques, and other trade secrets).

The kicker, of course, is being sufficiently savvy about your rights to know that you can petition to have such an agreement invalidated or curtailed,and the money to hire a lawyer to do so, which is a position that not many people in the food service business are likely to be in.
 
2013-06-30 05:46:15 PM  

Waldo Pepper: Other than the $250 fine I though the part about weekends and holidays makes sense.


You better re-educate your ignorant ass - religious exemptions BY LAW must be made.

/no wonder we've got such a shiat economy when people don't even know what freaking rights they have.
//you damned moron
 
2013-06-30 05:47:40 PM  

Morgellons: I think the point was about employees not being up front about their scheduling requirements


Which is really something everyone should do in an economy that won't employ people unless they say they're willing to work any time, any day, and be on call at a moment's notice from midnight to midnight.
 
2013-06-30 05:48:03 PM  

The Numbers: Someone been pissing in your coffee again? You're quite the little bundle of rage.


Oh, tee hee. I have dismissed you! I have pronounced you EnrAgEd!11  On the internet!  Sniff sniff, oh dear me.  Don't you feel quite silly?"  You troll monkeys never get tired of this sh*t, do you?  :  )
 
2013-06-30 05:49:08 PM  

The My Little Pony Killer: HempHead: The My Little Pony Killer: HempHead: Barfmaker: dickfreckle: If this contract is real, it's not much different than than what many restaurant employees endure even without signing something. The tips thing is over the top, but the language in this contract isn't far different from what you'll actually hear on the floor of a turn-burn establishment.

If you want to make money in the hospitality business, either tend bar at a trendy spot (difficult gigs to get) or wait tables where dinner and wine for 2 is $175, and you have a 4 table section that rotates in reasonable time.

Whatever you do, turn down offers for management. Christ, that was the worst job I ever had. All the headaches (all of them) and you were making more as a bartender a few months ago.

Yup, bartender at my local I reckon is making almost 80k/year on 4 shifts/week, no weekends. It's all regulars and we're all older and tip outrageously well (2 bucks per pint).

The bartender will not sleep with you no matter how much you tip.

No, but they will recognize me as the person who tips well and they will mix special drinks when I come in.

Well, as long as you are recognized as a big tipper, I guess it's well worth it. May you guys could get little buttons to wear that way when you visit other places, people will be aware of your tipping prowess?

Didn't I just say that bartenders recognize the behavior? Why would I need to wear a little button?




So other people will realize how cool you are.
 
2013-06-30 05:49:47 PM  
I should add, BTW, that I am not a lawyer and nothing I say should be considered legal advice.
 
2013-06-30 05:50:48 PM  

Morgellons: I think the point was about employees not being up front about their scheduling requirements.


By law, that doesn't matter. We've got FMLA and all sorts of other stuff to prevent EXACTLY THIS KIND OF BULLshiat.

Also, employers are not legally allowed to ask about certain things, like how many children you have, religious orientation, etc.

If it's not a BFOQ it's ILLEGAL, period.

/mfw it seems most of fark has no clue about their rights, which is fine, ignorant fools like yourself need to be stripped of those rights since you don't respect them anyways.
 
2013-06-30 05:52:23 PM  

geekbikerskum: I should add, BTW, that I am not a lawyer and nothing I say should be considered legal advice.


That's fine with me, I've been through the legal bullcrap and can say with court rulings backing me up that this is entirely illegal.

/about to be rich from not only a drunk driver accident but a major violation of labor laws here in SoCal.
 
2013-06-30 06:03:39 PM  
A lot of that stuff is pretty boilerplate for the food industry, one of the major issues I have with it is the charging the employee for missing days.  Now we don't know what other agreements and policies there are in place, but if you have an employee that's sick with something like the flu.  They can't call in because on top of not getting paid for that day, they might lose wages from before, so they come in, transmit the disease to co-workers and customers and cause the company to lose even MORE money than they would have being short staffed that day.

The Holiday thing is a lack of planning and foresight in addition to being cheap, and again the docking pay thing.

The tips thing looks more like a way to get away from the tipping controversy,  pay their people at least minimum wage and do away with having to deal with tips.  Not unusual, something of a prick move, but not out of the ordinary.

The non-compete clause, however, seems way over the top, this is fine when an industry fits in a certain niche and doesn't want employes taking expertise to a direct competitor, but this is a restaurant.  This means that someone who leaves there may be facing a whole year of unemployment because being wait-staff or cook is the only thing they know.  Non-compete clauses are ok when a companies competitors number less than 10 nationally, it's terrible when you might have that many just in the 1 mile radius around the business.
 
2013-06-30 06:07:22 PM  

Waldo Pepper: khyberkitsune: Waldo Pepper: Other than the $250 fine I though the part about weekends and holidays makes sense.

You better re-educate your ignorant ass - religious exemptions BY LAW must be made.

/no wonder we've got such a shiat economy when people don't even know what freaking rights they have.
//you damned moron

Wow are you really sinking to calling me a name?  religious exemptons do not have to be made in all cases. 
http://religionclause.blogspot.com/2011/07/restaurant-wins-in-employ ee s-religious.html


That's a purely money-made decision and flies in the face of religious exemptions allowed for Christianity.

AKA that judge was bought out.

Please re-read your laws and come back when you understand them.
 
2013-06-30 06:13:07 PM  

Waldo Pepper: The employer is also required to reasonably accommodate the employee's religious beliefs unless such accommodation would result in undue hardship to the employer.


Never proven in the case, and in fact never weighed upon in the case you're mentioning.

Try again.

/Electronic Arts is bankrupt because of me. Would you like to take this further and add in my THQ win as well?
//never lost a lawsuit because he UNDERSTANDS THE LAW.
 
2013-06-30 06:15:12 PM  
To further add, your case is being used as an EXAMPLE in my current case against Red Delivery Guy - try again when you really know what you're talking about and have LOTS of employment lawyers to explain the nuances to you.
 
2013-06-30 06:15:27 PM  

khyberkitsune: geekbikerskum: I should add, BTW, that I am not a lawyer and nothing I say should be considered legal advice.

That's fine with me, I've been through the legal bullcrap and can say with court rulings backing me up that this is entirely illegal.


Maybe it is in California, where, from what I've read, covenants not to compete are almost unenforceable, but laws in Arizona are very different.  Given the stuff in that article I posted, it's not completely clear that the covenant not to compete in question is out of bounds according to Arizona law, although if it amounts to an effective ban on the person making a living, the court would probably rule that way if I had to guess.

/about to be rich from not only a drunk driver accident but a major violation of labor laws here in SoCal.

Wow.  I'm sorry.  What a crappy lot of stuff to have to endure in order to get rich.  Almost everyone I know who's gotten any sort of sizeable lawsuit payout would gladly trade the money for not having had to deal with the life events that led to the suit.
 
2013-06-30 06:23:24 PM  

geekbikerskum: Endive Wombat: A 50 mile, 1 year non-compete to not work in another restaurant?  GTFO of here.  No way that would stand up in court

Article regarding the enforceability of covenants not to compete in Arizona:   http://www.anthemlaw.com/articles/non-compete-agreements/ 

Based on that article, it's not completely clear that a court would find it unreasonable.  It outright says in the article that six months to a year is a reasonable time frame.  A fifty mile radius may or may not be reasonable depending on the landscape out there--fifty miles in Arizona isn't what it is in New England, and, given that I've never lived in that part of the country, I'll be the first to admit I don't have a clue.  I think the kicker would be whether the person could reasonably find another job in his or her field after ceasing work there, and whether the covenant at hand serves a legitimate business purpose--likely, the protection of ABC's intellectual property (recipes, production techniques, and other trade secrets).

The kicker, of course, is being sufficiently savvy about your rights to know that you can petition to have such an agreement invalidated or curtailed,and the money to hire a lawyer to do so, which is a position that not many people in the food service business are likely to be in.


A non-compete clause can not prevent you from working in your profession.  A waitress job is not something that can have a non-compete because there is absolutely nothing "trade secret" about it.
 
2013-06-30 06:27:36 PM  

geekbikerskum: Maybe it is in California, where, from what I've read, covenants not to compete are almost unenforceable, but laws in Arizona are very different.


It's FEDERAL, not state. This was a USSC ruling about 4-5 years ago, right as I moved into California.

The only reason this isn't hitting the news and courts as hard as it should be is because the workers are gnorant of their rights under the law.

Waldo Pepper: nah i find people that sue companies and others and brag about it to be among the scum of the earth


Well, put it like this, without me, your entire computer would be laden with DRM that can destroy your hardware at any time (like EA's Spore DRM and THQ's crap tech support caused to my machines.)

So you better be grateful that these companies can't rape you any more than they already are without notifying you first, because I'm the one behind that.

Waldo Pepper: so it appears you like to make your living suing employers. Hmmm I wonder if your comments here could be used against you. doubtful I'm sure but would be just if they could


Given your lack of thought process, you can wonder all day long. I make my living keeping your asses fed. I only come across these labor violations when I take up a secondary job to get extra R&D money for my LED and zero-light growth technology (which Texas and California and thus the majority of your Ag. Economy are dependent upon.)
 
2013-06-30 06:33:33 PM  

HempHead: The My Little Pony Killer: HempHead: The My Little Pony Killer: HempHead: Barfmaker: dickfreckle: If this contract is real, it's not much different than than what many restaurant employees endure even without signing something. The tips thing is over the top, but the language in this contract isn't far different from what you'll actually hear on the floor of a turn-burn establishment.

If you want to make money in the hospitality business, either tend bar at a trendy spot (difficult gigs to get) or wait tables where dinner and wine for 2 is $175, and you have a 4 table section that rotates in reasonable time.

Whatever you do, turn down offers for management. Christ, that was the worst job I ever had. All the headaches (all of them) and you were making more as a bartender a few months ago.

Yup, bartender at my local I reckon is making almost 80k/year on 4 shifts/week, no weekends. It's all regulars and we're all older and tip outrageously well (2 bucks per pint).

The bartender will not sleep with you no matter how much you tip.

No, but they will recognize me as the person who tips well and they will mix special drinks when I come in.

Well, as long as you are recognized as a big tipper, I guess it's well worth it. May you guys could get little buttons to wear that way when you visit other places, people will be aware of your tipping prowess?

Didn't I just say that bartenders recognize the behavior? Why would I need to wear a little button?

So other people will realize how cool you are.


You just don't get it.
 
2013-06-30 06:45:36 PM  

malaktaus: ZeroCorpse: I wish they'd just throw these two into a cage with the Koch brothers and a few baseball nail-filled baseball bats, and tell them only one person will be let out of the cage in the end.

And then don't open the cage in the end, anyway, because the winner had "an attitude."

This is my idea for one of those big, outdoor summer festivals. This is called Slug Fest. This is for men only. Here's what you do. You get about a hundred thousand of these farking men. You know the ones I mean. These macho motherfarkers. These strutting, preening, posturing, hairy, sweaty, alpha male jackoffs. The muscle assholes. You take about a hundred thousand of these disgusting pricks, and you throw them in a big dirt arena, big twenty-five acre dirt arena. And you just let them beat the shiat out of each other  for twenty-four hours non-stop. No food, no water, just whiskey and PCP. And you just let them punch and pound and kick the shiat out of each other until only one guy is left standing, then you take that guy and you put him on a pedestal and you shoot him in the farking head.


Now there's something to justify the sports package on DirecTV.

/still waiting for the Ocho
 
2013-06-30 07:01:50 PM  

penthesilea: Meh. It's about balance. I've never had any problems finding a way to Tetris people into a schedule.

Have college kids working for you? Work the kids that have classes Mon Wed Fri opposite the kids who have classes Tues Thurs. Some of your people need Sun off for church or to watch the big game? Have a few people who love to work weekends to offset them.

I've handled this in bookstores, offices, restaurants, and regular retail. Little mom & pop places and big box retail. Just takes a few more minutes of your time. Makes for -much- happier workers. No one should have to stress about losing their job because they want to watch their kid play soccer on Saturday mornings.


Yeah, pretty much this.  Also, if you can't find a way to accomidate a request off... allow them to find someone to cover their shift.  Happens all the time.
 
2013-06-30 07:05:46 PM  

Commander_Neckbeard: A lot of that stuff is pretty boilerplate for the food industry, one of the major issues I have with it is the charging the employee for missing days.  Now we don't know what other agreements and policies there are in place, but if you have an employee that's sick with something like the flu.  They can't call in because on top of not getting paid for that day, they might lose wages from before, so they come in, transmit the disease to co-workers and customers and cause the company to lose even MORE money than they would have being short staffed that day.

The Holiday thing is a lack of planning and foresight in addition to being cheap, and again the docking pay thing.

The tips thing looks more like a way to get away from the tipping controversy,  pay their people at least minimum wage and do away with having to deal with tips.  Not unusual, something of a prick move, but not out of the ordinary.

The non-compete clause, however, seems way over the top, this is fine when an industry fits in a certain niche and doesn't want employes taking expertise to a direct competitor, but this is a restaurant.  This means that someone who leaves there may be facing a whole year of unemployment because being wait-staff or cook is the only thing they know.  Non-compete clauses are ok when a companies competitors number less than 10 nationally, it's terrible when you might have that many just in the 1 mile radius around the business.


In over 20 years in this industry, I have never garnished, or "fined" and employee's wages for conduct related issues. No show, no call, no job. THAT is the standard. Docking wages for behavior is more than a bit hinkey. They worked the hours, they get paid for them. Put someone on disciplinary leave? Yes, that happens, and it's usually the step before firing--but if someone works the hours, they get paid for the hours. Replacing broken equipment or dishes? That is a solid dick move, because accidents DO happen. In very few cases could I justify trying to get an employee to replace equipment of pay for something that they ruined, and that would have to be bare, nekkid negligence after being trained upon the station or procedure, or just outright dickishness, and that would also go in line with firing, immediately. Theft? That's a whole different story, and that's not docking pay, that is the step before charges are filed, and if there is restitution, then we can NOT file charges, and leave them with the chance of getting another job in the industry, but for DAMNS sure, their recommendation is going to be chilly--without charges filed, it is unofficial and thus you don't mention, "she's a f*cking thief" but you use key words like "inter personnel problems" or "trust issues."

Holidays? That is the really sucky part of the job, but then again, you also balance those days so only your management are doing all the holidays. Chefs work when others are playing. It's our curse. Well, that and dodging very close to sexual harassment suits with waitstaff and hostesses.

Non-compete clause? WTF? These are servers and line cooks. Your chef, your KM, your GM, you might think about putting it in, but considering that she opens boxes of pastries and sells them at a markup, the "secret" practices aren't exactly tradecraft. That is just plain over-reach, and a power trip. The whole thing drips of adequacy issues, and tragic over compensation to make her business seem much more important than a f*cking bakery that resells other folks' pastries. Which is really, why you could only laugh at someone trying to get you to sign something like this.

I've had to do NDAs--opening a new joint in Phoenix, out here in Western Mass when a place merged with another company and joined two breweries into a decent sized brewing empire--and even then I was never brought into a "non-compete" clause, and I wrote half the gottverdammt menu and handbook. That is just delusions of competence screaming out to the heavens. These are some odd, odd, odd people who have seen way too much television, and have too many friends who talk about their own industries, and they seem to think a bakery is on the same scale.
 
2013-06-30 07:07:41 PM  

bunner: Maybe you should give the "Oh, pooh! People LOVE pseudo-prestigious crap, so phooey!" a rest. Just saying. People love salt, sugar and lard, too but it doesn't make it a good diet.


Shouldn't you and Vinnie be out torching a Starbucks, or something?
 
2013-06-30 07:09:07 PM  

HempHead: So other people will realize how cool you are.


Man you're a buzzkill. Lighten up.
 
2013-06-30 07:09:11 PM  

Chariset: BizarreMan: Not to white knight Crazy Amy but, many of those don't seem too outrageous.

Expecting people to be on time and ready to start working when their shift is scheduled to begin isn't unreasonable.

It's not that the demands are so bad, it's more that I would never, ever expect Amy to be a fair arbiter of whether I had broken any of those rules.  Especially the one about "attitude."


That's my biggest issue as well with those clauses. Usually it's called "insubordination" when you dare to ask a question or point out how doing something slightly different would be better.
 
2013-06-30 07:45:35 PM  
"will betaken from your pay check at ABC's cost."
am I misunderstanding this? shouldn't the last phrase be, "at the employee's cost"?

"No outside Food or Beverages may be brought inside ABC."
... why?

"If you fail to show up for your scheduled shift we maypenalize you monetarily. "
in addition to losing the money I would have earned, you're going to fine me on top of that? no thanks.

"Any type of attitude will result in immediate termination. "
you know, like happy or cheerful or thoughtful?

"You must leave the premise immediately after your scheduled shift "
... why? maybe it's just me, but I usually like to stay after work for 15 minutes or so, tidying things up and closing loose ends

"ABC has the legal right and consent to inspect any and all packages "
nope. nope. nooooooope. not even a little bit.

"no facial hair is allowed (unless for religious beliefs). "
also no.

"distance must be given to all fellow employees "
that's ... just really bad management

"Holidays and Weekends are Mandatory "
wait, but facial hair is allowed for religious beliefs? you know, my parents make triple pay working on holidays. and even then, they're not required
 
2013-06-30 08:04:17 PM  
These people are apparently unaware that a contract has to be legal to be valid. You can't legally take tips and it doesn't matter if the employee signed a contract that says you can. It's still illegal.


Endive Wombat: As a waiter, you need to be at the restaurant at least 15-30 min before your shift starts.  Sudden rushes happen, and grabbing an extra table or two before you are scheduled adds quite a bit to your take home pay over time.  Working in a restaurant is very dynamic.  Really, being 5 min early to your shift in my mind = 10+ min late.

A person's shift starts when it starts, not 5 or 15 minutes before. If I'm scheduled to work at 5:00, my shift starts at 5:00. You want me there at 4:30 or 4:45, schedule me for that time and start paying me at that time. That's how it works. You can't tell a person to come in a certain time but not start paying the person at that time.


DerAppie: They say you need to be ready to start working at least 5 minutes in advance. You don't actually need to start working 5 minutes in advance. That is quite a relevant difference.

No, it's not. You have to start paying an employee at the time you require him/her to be there. If you require someone to be there at 4:55, you have to start paying them at 4:55, not at 5:00.

TheDirtyNacho: A local beer co-op here has a no-tipping policy and pays a "living wage" (I think its around $11 an hour).  The nytimes had an op-ed about it last week.

Yes, but if someone does leave a tip, it has to go to the employees. Having a "no tipping" policy is not the same thing as confiscating tips.

/dad owned a restaurant
 
2013-06-30 08:58:40 PM  
Let's break the whole thing down.

1). No Cell Phones allowed while working.

People with families need to be able to be contacted.  A reasonable employer would only have an issue if an employee abused the privilege of having a cell phone.  Not allowing them at all is a dick move.

2). No outside Food or Beverages may be brought inside ABC.

If the employees eat in area away from the customers, where they got their food is none of your farking business.  In fact, if someone has religious or health requirements that your food does not satisfy, your rule violates a few laws.

3). If you fail to show up for your scheduled shift we may penalize you monetarily.

ILLEGAL!  You can not take someone's money.  They earned it.  Your choice is to warn them, give them unpaid time off as a punishment, or fire them.

4). When you show up for work you must be dressed appropriately, and properly covered. And you must be ready to work with your hair pulled back, and hands washed by no later than 5minutes before your scheduled shift begins.

They need to be ready to work WHEN THEIR SHIFT STARTS.  If you require them to be there earlier, you must pay them for that time.

5). Any type of attitude will result in immediate termination.

Void for vagueness.

6). You must leave the premise immediately after your scheduled shift, and no family or friends may come to see you while working.

Your restaurant, your rules, but this is a dick thing to do.

7). You must remain in your designated working area.

Another dick thing.  People are not robots.

8). No purses or bags are allowed inside ABC, (exceptions may be made) however upon leaving a designated employee of ABC has the legal right and consent to inspect any and all packages that you may have brought with you.

Banning bags and purses may not be legal.  Searching them is definitely not legal.

9). At no point is any food or any type of open beverage allowed in the kitchen. This is a direct Health Code Violation.

It's going to be hard to cook food when you don't allow any.  Also, standing over a hot stove all die will dehydrate.  Not allowing the cooks to drink is a safety hazard.

10). ABC has multiple security cameras and any type of theft will be punished by the fullest extent of the Law.

Duh.  That you would go out of your way to point this out suggests you expect the employees to rob you blind.  Probably because you are a vapid c00nt who should be robbed blind.

11). No visiting or unnecessary talking is allowed during your work shift. This causes distractions and results in loss of product. Any may result in possible harm to you, or to others.

Again, people are not robots.  Treating as such is a dick move.

12). Workers must keep their hair pulled back in a bun and no facial hair is allowed (unless for religious beliefs).

Being neatly groomed is standard in the industry.  However, given the quality of your restaurant, it shouldn't be a surprise that you need to emphasize this point since the only people who would work for you would have to be desperate to the point of being homeless.

13). Any product such as food or plates that are broken or burned due to direct negligence will be taken from your pay check at ABC's cost.

ILLEGAL!  You can not make employees pay for breakage.  Even if an employee broke something on purpose you have to take them to court and get a ruling in your favor.  You don't get to decide.

14). Respect and distance must be given to all fellow employees. No harassment or bulling of any type will be tolerated and will be cause for immediate termination. If such an event happens you must report the incident immediately to Samy or Amy Bouzaglo.

Does that apply to you, too?  Because if it does, you're going to have to fire yourself.

15) You must treat the equipment and all property of ABC with respect .Equipment should be cleaned and maintained nightly as part of your scheduled shifts responsibilities.

Why are you putting job duties in an employment contract like this?  This is standard restaurant shiat that anyone who's been in the business already knows and expects.  This shows what an amateur you are.

16) Holidays and Weekends are Mandatory, by signing this contract you are accepting that you will be required to work all Holidays, and Weekends. Due to the nature of our Industry this is a necessity and any No-Show will be monetarily penalized with a fee of $250.00.

ILLEGAL!  That's called theft.  You can not "fine" employees".  Your choices are a warning, unpaid time off, or firing.

17) The recipes and techniques that have been developed by Amy at ABC are exclusive and shall remain confidential. Any removal of recipes will be considered theft.

Yeah, because opening a box of canned ravioli is a ground breaking cooking technique.

18) You must possess a current Maricopa County Food Handlers Card.

Another standard that anyone who works in restaurants already knows.  You tell them this requirement before hiring and make them produce the document when you are processing their hiring paperwork.

19) The wait staff understands that any and all "tips" are property of the "house." By signing this contract, you agree that you willingly accept a payment of $8.00 to $12.00 per hour to ensure that you will receive some type of payment. Due to the volatile nature of any retail business we are unable to predict when we will have buissness.By signing this contact you agree that you are willfully accepting a payment of $___ per hour instead of tips.

ILLEGAL!  Again, this is called theft.  You can't touch their tips.

20) It takes a great deal of time, energy and patience on the part of Samy & Amy (the owners) to train and teach our employees. We are investing in you as a new employee, and we are paying you to teach you. By signing this contract you are hereby accepting that you will be employed exclusively by ABC Amy's Baking Co. LLC. And shall not work for any competitor within a 50 mile radius of ABC within one year of temination or voluntary Resignation, without prior authorization from ABC. Amy's Baking Co LLC. Nor shall you be allowed to open your own business of the same type, within the above mentioned radius.

The Federal courts would like a word with you.  Non-competes are not enforceable.
 
2013-06-30 09:17:05 PM  

OgreMagi: Non-competes are not enforceable.


Slow down there big fella -- non-competes *are* enforceable. The state courts generally use "reasonableness" as the guiding principle.

/was under just such a restrictive covenant back in the days I was a 'puter weenie. It withstood the test of a court.
//Amy is being a dick (yeah, I know - Capt. Obvious)
 
2013-06-30 09:30:24 PM  

HotnSweaty: OgreMagi: Non-competes are not enforceable.

Slow down there big fella -- non-competes *are* enforceable. The state courts generally use "reasonableness" as the guiding principle.

/was under just such a restrictive covenant back in the days I was a 'puter weenie. It withstood the test of a court.
//Amy is being a dick (yeah, I know - Capt. Obvious)


In the past, sure they were in some states.  Definitely not enforceable in California.  I pointed that out to my current employer when they hired me and it was in the contract.  They removed it.

It was my understanding that a Federal court ruled them unenforceable a few years ago.
 
2013-06-30 09:36:25 PM  

HotnSweaty: OgreMagi: Non-competes are not enforceable.

Slow down there big fella -- non-competes *are* enforceable. The state courts generally use "reasonableness" as the guiding principle.

/was under just such a restrictive covenant back in the days I was a 'puter weenie. It withstood the test of a court.
//Amy is being a dick (yeah, I know - Capt. Obvious)


I also had a "non-compete" clause but it was in financial services and was limited to not having any contact with any clients of, or leads generated by, the previous employer (even if they were clients I signed on) for one year.
 
2013-06-30 09:48:24 PM  

Phins: These people are apparently unaware that a contract has to be legal to be valid. You can't legally take tips and it doesn't matter if the employee signed a contract that says you can. It's still illegal.


Endive Wombat: As a waiter, you need to be at the restaurant at least 15-30 min before your shift starts.  Sudden rushes happen, and grabbing an extra table or two before you are scheduled adds quite a bit to your take home pay over time.  Working in a restaurant is very dynamic.  Really, being 5 min early to your shift in my mind = 10+ min late.

A person's shift starts when it starts, not 5 or 15 minutes before. If I'm scheduled to work at 5:00, my shift starts at 5:00. You want me there at 4:30 or 4:45, schedule me for that time and start paying me at that time. That's how it works. You can't tell a person to come in a certain time but not start paying the person at that time.


DerAppie: They say you need to be ready to start working at least 5 minutes in advance. You don't actually need to start working 5 minutes in advance. That is quite a relevant difference.

No, it's not. You have to start paying an employee at the time you require him/her to be there. If you require someone to be there at 4:55, you have to start paying them at 4:55, not at 5:00.

TheDirtyNacho: A local beer co-op here has a no-tipping policy and pays a "living wage" (I think its around $11 an hour).  The nytimes had an op-ed about it last week.

Yes, but if someone does leave a tip, it has to go to the employees. Having a "no tipping" policy is not the same thing as confiscating tips.

/dad owned a restaurant


There's no tip jars or tip line on the receipt. And if asked, they turn them down.

I suppose one could leave cash on the table, but who knows where it would end up. The employees are also member-owners so it would make sense to put it into the restaurant somehow if cash were found. Or hold it in a list and found just in case.
 
2013-06-30 09:49:19 PM  

OgreMagi: In the past, sure they were in some states. Definitely not enforceable in California. I pointed that out to my current employer when they hired me and it was in the contract. They removed it.

It was my understanding that a Federal court ruled them unenforceable a few years ago.


CA does not allow for non-competes on employees and contractors; however, they still allow them for corps, LLC's and I think partnerships. The concept is if I sell you my business, you may require that I not go back and snipe your customers, protecting the integrity of the business that was sold, ergo a non-compete. AZ allows reasonable employee non-competes which obviously the one in question is not.

It's a state rather than a federal thing.
 
2013-06-30 09:49:28 PM  

catmandu: HotnSweaty: OgreMagi: Non-competes are not enforceable.

Slow down there big fella -- non-competes *are* enforceable. The state courts generally use "reasonableness" as the guiding principle.

/was under just such a restrictive covenant back in the days I was a 'puter weenie. It withstood the test of a court.
//Amy is being a dick (yeah, I know - Capt. Obvious)

I also had a "non-compete" clause but it was in financial services and was limited to not having any contact with any clients of, or leads generated by, the previous employer (even if they were clients I signed on) for one year.


My non-compete is limited to trade secrets.  I work for Sony Computer Entertainment (Playstation).  I could go work for Microsoft Xbox and they couldn't stop me, but if I spilled inside information, they would own my skinny white ass in court.  No, I'm not going to go to Microsoft.  I'd rather be unemployed.
 
2013-06-30 09:56:07 PM  
5). Any type of attitude will result in immediate termination.

Helpful attitude? Fired! Cheerful attitude? Fired. Good luck finding Zen Masters to dish up your slop.
 
2013-06-30 10:03:24 PM  

Bathia_Mapes: 13). Any product such as food or plates that are broken or burned due to direct negligence will be taken from your pay check at ABC's cost.


Pretty sure that and keeping an employee's tips are illegal, even if the employee signs a contract. Hopefully the state labor board will investigate.

if it is illegal, this is true...can't have contracts for anything that's illegal
 
2013-06-30 10:18:25 PM  

Endive Wombat: Waldo Pepper: ^^^^^^I'm sure is the first too complain when a retail store is short-handed due to weather issues, prom, holidays or if a store is closed for Easter/Christmas.

I worked at a very fine dining restaurant that did to go, fully prepared turkey dinners for Thanksgiving.  All the customer had to do was warm it back up, and it was delish!!!  We were closed for Thanksgiving, but open from like 7am to about 1pm.  The chef made breakfast and lunch for the staff, we were paid like $10 per hour (which really just went to our taxes)...and got to drink all the wine and beer we wanted all day long.  They only needed like 10 staff members to work this, and the 25 or so of us on staff had to fight it out so to speak on who got to work it.

So much fun!


It's amazing what you can get an employee to do if they're given proper incentive.
 
2013-06-30 10:20:54 PM  
A couple violations of labor law, I think, but to be fair, I once got an application from Mrs. Field's Cookies that was worse.  It included clauses about binding arbitration and agreeing to settle any disputes (including if they pressed criminal charges against you in their home state (which was across the country) and attend trial there, at your expense or plead guilty.
 
2013-06-30 10:28:21 PM  

The Numbers: The Thoroughbred of Sin: I dont see how it can have any negative impact on a business to allow employees to eat their own food.

Risk of health-code violations?


Not if you have a separate break area.

Bad for the image? McDonalds would hardly be thrilled at their employees eating Burger King stuff on their premises.

Again, that's why you have a separate break area. Typically these are not within view of the customers. I actually did work for McDonald's for a spell back in college, and it wasn't unheard of for one of the employees to grab something from Subway while on break, though we weren't allowed to eat it in the main dining room.
 
2013-06-30 10:41:40 PM  
lack of warmth:
The second half of rule 6 is stupid when rule 11 is enough.  However if ABC doesn't want the business of parents who may want to patronize their establishment so the parents' kid can wait on ole mom and dad, then that is ABC's loss.  My parents did that to me a few times, my boss never complained about the money.

Not taking ABC's side, but I'm pretty sure they meant that they don't want them coming to the business to interact with you without being a customer, i.e. taking you away from your job for socializing.
 
2013-06-30 10:44:42 PM  

Astorix: letrole: Businesses with a left-leaning ethos tend to have a dependence on cultish followings of fanboys who make purchasing decisions based on emotions. Apple, Ben and Jerry's, Starbucks. Left-leaning businesses also do better in service sectors where absolute quality is less important that perceived quality.

Businesses with a right-leaning ethos (aka 'businesses') mostly depend upon profitability in a competitive market, where purchasing decisions are made based upon value-for-money.

Oh for farks sake. Troll.


You noticed the Fark handle, right?
 
2013-06-30 11:21:57 PM  

chitownmike: Brittabot: The Thoroughbred of Sin: I thought this was one of the more interesting bits:
2). No outside Food or Beverages may be brought inside ABC.

Want to pack a lunch?  NO FOOD FOR YOU!
how on earth is that rational at all?  I dont see how it can have any negative impact on a business to allow employees to eat their own food.

But then crazy Amy is crazy.

That's made even more appallingly unfair when you realize that ABC does not give any free or even discounted food to its employees. The waitress who answered questions on Reddit awhile back said any food they wanted to eat had to be purchased at full price.

So not only are the workers paid shiattily, they now have to take cost of their own meals into account as well.

Stay classy ABC!

Not saying it's right, they should get a discount, but waitstaff don't, typicly, work long shifts. Eat before you go to work.


When I was a student, in a previous century, I worked as a busboy in one of Montreal's best known restaurants. During our breaks we were allowed to order any item on the menu and help ourselves to the drinks fountain. It was all free.
 
2013-07-01 12:41:52 AM  

mhuckins: Abox: BizarreMan: Not to white knight Crazy Amy but, many of those don't seem too outrageous.

Expecting people to be on time and ready to start working when their shift is scheduled to begin isn't unreasonable.

Telling people up front to expect to work weekends and holidays is fine too.  When we hire people where I work we tell people up front that they are not guaranteed any specific shift or any specific days.  They are expected to be able to work whatever we put them on the schedule.  Employees will agree that yes, they can work any time.  Until they get the job and the first schedule comes out, then it's I can't work that day because I have church, I can't work that day because I don't have daycare for my child.....

I once took a tech job with the stipulation that I would be flexible with my schedule.  To me that meant I'd work any shift - day, swings, graveyard, whatever.  So my shift ended up being this weird mix where I'd work 8a-5p on a Friday and have to be back at work for another full shift starting at 1a Saturday...so eight hours between workdays. When I couldn't take it anymore and gave notice the boss said I was being unreasonable because I had said I'd be flexible.

That effin sucks. I've done the crazy shift thing while working as a supervisor when needed (like 2 nights every quarter) and it was horrible. I couldn't imagine doing it every week and for someone who didn't appreciate the hard work involved.


CSB time: Had one particular tech job where I worked 50-hour weeks as a supervisor-- on a salary where I did not get paid for overtime. Instead, I was given "comp" hours to use. Technically, this was not something my manager was supposed to do, and I was the only supervisor on the floor who did it (and only because I agreed to do it because I was being nice, she couldn't manage a schedule, and I planned to have a super long honeymoon). I also happened to be one of her best supervisors.

So then came the day I had jury duty... Jury duty would go from 8am-5pm. My shifts started at 8pm and ended at 7am the day before and after. I literally had to explain to her that it was not only impossible for me to work on that day due to not having had any sleep but that she was LEGALLY REQUIRED to give me the day off for jury duty. She disagreed, and that's the only time in my life I've ever had to go over someone's head. Thankfully the site manager was aware that jury duty isn't optional.

/This place had HORRIBLE turnover rates due to horrible upper middle management, and it cost the company dearly.
//They finally crumbled.
 
2013-07-01 12:50:39 AM  

Waldo Pepper: supayoda: The Numbers: The Thoroughbred of Sin: I dont see how it can have any negative impact on a business to allow employees to eat their own food.

Risk of health-code violations?

Not if you have a separate break area.

Bad for the image? McDonalds would hardly be thrilled at their employees eating Burger King stuff on their premises.

Again, that's why you have a separate break area. Typically these are not within view of the customers. I actually did work for McDonald's for a spell back in college, and it wasn't unheard of for one of the employees to grab something from Subway while on break, though we weren't allowed to eat it in the main dining room.

you can't drink a pepsi in the breakroom at a coca-cola plant


Good for Coca-Cola if that's the case, but I wasn't saying it's illegal or even unusual to have such a requirement. I was saying it's not unheard of for restaurants (which would be a completely different thing from a Coca-Cola plant) to allow their employees to eat outside food (even from competitors) within their break rooms. The previous person had mentioned McD's, and I've worked for McD's and simply stated that yes we would eat Subway sandwiches in the break room area. Also, most restaurants (including McD's) give their employees either reduced or free meals during their shifts.
 
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