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(SeattlePI)   Seattle Transgender community holds Trans Pride march and celebration, leaves onlookers confused and strangely aroused   (seattlepi.com) divider line 422
    More: Interesting, Trans Pride, Seattle Transgender  
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8074 clicks; posted to Main » on 29 Jun 2013 at 6:26 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-30 03:39:50 PM

Z-clipped: omeganuepsilon: Pride, as a word, has many negative connotations and synonyms that people will inevitably tie to it.

The kind of people who will jump to paint Pride as negative because of its name are pretty irrelevant to its purpose.  They're of the same ilk who complain that there's no White History Month.


Pride marches are to show that folks value themselves, and their community. Especially when for a long while, folks have tried to make their very identity, their sexuality, their very existence something to be ashamed of.

omeganuepsilon: We earn everything. The rights we currently have, and are fighting for(ie gay marriage), may be granted in part today, but they were paid for dearly in the past.Even now, some in the government and politics in general, there is an effort to countermand some of the very large ones.  Gun control, unreasonable search and seizure, freedom of and from religion, etc.  There is constant back and forth to keep these things as protected and valid as they ever were, as some are always trying to limit or put restrictions on them.People have to fight and keep the powers that be in check or those go away eventually, history has proven that time and time again.

This IS part of that struggle. If anything, it's an affirmation that folks are organized, that they have supporters who AREN'T LGB as well. Pride marches show not just that folks are proud of their identity, but that their families, their friends are likewise proud to know them. To acknowledge their struggle, and make it a positive. I'm a straight male, and I attend Pride Marches, because I have LGBT friends. Folks who might as well be family. I am proud that they are standing up for the radical notion, that they are people. Different perhaps than some, but then again, I'm Irish-German and Japanese--how many Kraut-Mick-Nips you find at a mixer? I'm proud of them not hiding, to say, "Hey, I'm here, and I'm OK with you not understanding, but I'm not going to pretend that I'm different." And different ain't always a bad thing.

Pride Parades are more than just about the folks in the streets, but the pride of the folks who stand with them. Who are their chosen family. Pride Parades assert the radical notion that being ashamed of who you are is not the default position if you are different. Does it confuse some folks? Good. Then let them be confused for a bit, because silence and hiding doesn't educate. Pretending to be a stereotype doesn't educate. It doesn't lead to any good places. Is there some outrageousness at some events? Yup. Because for so many years, folks wanted folks to keep quiet, sit down, shut up, and keep their sh*t behind closed doors. Doors are opening. Folks are out, they're not hiding, and that is good thing. Trans folks still see violence. They still see confusion and discrimination, but little by little it's getting better. Because folks are beginning to see them NOT as just drag queens or men in dresses, or very butch women, but as people. Varied. Different. Coming from all walks of life, and with myriad stories behind them.

You know what LGBT folks want? Most of all? To live, to be normal, to love who they want, to be themselves. That is the radical notion behind Pride Parades. To just be themselves. And if some folks have issue with that, then that is their issue.
 
2013-06-30 03:46:13 PM
cdn.buzznet.com
 
2013-06-30 03:50:00 PM

toyotaboy:


Alright, kinda hot and confusing.

Well, not that confusing. Getting the right shoes would be confusing.
 
2013-06-30 04:08:21 PM

Z-clipped: If a few feathers get ruffled because the word "Pride" is a little uppity, I think the movement can probably live with that, since those are feathers that get ruffled by mosquito farts.


Obviously, as we are still making progress.

However, the offshoot groups still get their people from means other than indoctrination.  The less they have to gravitate towards, the better.

Z-clipped: If you think you can meaningfully improve their tactics


Oh, I don't.  There are plenty of politically involved activists that do follow a lot of the idea's I put forth here already.  I just wanted to bring the idea's up as thinking material.

I've heard it stated on fark that wearing a suit and tie or other business attire as "dressing straight", as well as in other threads as "dressing white".  There are obviously people about that do think that way, and I felt like stirring the discussion a little bit with the concepts and reasoning.

How we represent ourselves is crucial to our success, and a little nuance here and there can have a phenomenal impact. Like any job interview, you don't want to go in with a certain appearance(shaved, showered, clean clothes, no ICP t-shirts, etc) about you and use poop jokes to impress them.

The tiniest thing can turn people off from you.  We're bred, evolutionarily speaking, to be prejudice, keep our numbers low but tightly knit.  In a society this large and diverse, any opportunity to examine ourselves and the way we may be perceived by others, is a good thing, imo.  The more we examine why we do X, and why someone may do Y, the better off we'll be.  It allows empathy to grow, it helps find common ground and write off those differences that we dwell upon.

Not sure if you commented above, but someone called me out by suggesting that was a heineous suggestion, that we attempt to identify with them.

Of course, it was a terrible misswording.  The goal is to get them to identify with us, to alleviate some of that suspicion.  Studies show that children raised with racial variety are less racist.  Same principle.

If we want to be accepted, we need to acclimate them.  To acclimate them, we need to be able to get close and be around them in a way they are comfortable with.  To make them comfortable we need to nullify some of the inherent and misguided prejudice. We do that by showing them that we're not so different, that what they're focusing on isn't all that important, but negligible.

If you want to teach, you don't actively attempt to berate and fail the children.  You nurture and explain.  with children with anger issues, you do it as gently as possible, you ease them into it, and not in a way that makes them feel stupid.  You effectively need to teach them to think, to use reason and logic.

Sure, some obviously are not worth the time, but many are.  I was not suggesting we not stand up for ourselves, but that some can be reasoned with.  Often, some of these people become some of the most rabid defenders.

I'd wager a bit of money that some people in this very thread used to hold prejudices.  They may have still been that way today if people hadn't reasoned with them on a more individual level, taken the time to explain something, instead of just insulting them and stirring the pot of anger and prejudice.

I should know what it's like, I'm one of those people.  Over the years I have learned a LOT from other farkers.  Viewpoints and perspectives that I would never have known had it not been for them.  This is a unique forum in that it goes beyond a melting pot, a very cerebral mix of not just people, but of idea's.  The varying topics, the multitude of personalities within each topic, the life stories shared and the information exchanged in a very casual and often lighthearted manner.

I often complain that it's worse now than ever, the price of popularity, but I do like to attempt to pay it forward, to answer people who may have genuine questions or confusion.  I've been written off and insulted myself as a troll for asking such a question, when all I wanted was to try to wrap my head around it.  It's a shiatty thing to do, in my opinion. And that's part of why I have explained to some above what I could, where others were certainly more inflamatory.

*shrugs*

As I said, its a beautiful day out, and I've got some things to go do.  You don't need to reply, just trying to explain myself a bit further so you understand where I'm coming from. I'm not in here to troll or to split hairs or to insult other people. I simply want to share ideas and concepts that often sadly fall by the wayside in favor of the current flavor of outrage.
 
2013-06-30 04:11:08 PM

toyotaboy: [cdn.buzznet.com image 580x383]


i105.photobucket.com
I have the weirdest boner right now.
 
2013-06-30 05:50:50 PM
Its funny how 3 people in this thread, all of whom I already had marked as "pro-Israeli bullies and shills" are all coming out hard against Transgendered people. Its almost as though a bully in one context remains a bully in another. Remarkable find.
 
2013-06-30 06:16:49 PM

Generation_D: Its funny how 3 people in this thread, all of whom I already had marked as "pro-Israeli bullies and shills" are all coming out hard against Transgendered people. Its almost as though a bully in one context remains a bully in another. Remarkable find.


You don't say?
 
2013-06-30 06:29:31 PM

hardinparamedic: RKade: As a lifelong cripple, I find the word "handicapable" insulting and condescending. More to my original point though, being as disabled as I am is way worse then having gender identity issues and if you'd like to hash it out privately, I'd love to have a go because, as far as the "who got the worst lot in life" championship goes, me and mine are miles ahead of you and yours.

I don't support your sinful lifestyle choice. You did not have to join the crips, you chose to be that way.


Hey! Even I saw what you did there!
 
2013-06-30 07:01:20 PM

Generation_D: Its funny how 3 people in this thread, all of whom I already had marked as "pro-Israeli bullies and shills" are all coming out hard against Transgendered people. Its almost as though a bully in one context remains a bully in another. Remarkable find.


I know.  It's as if all rational people are naturally coming to the same conclusions about things... like... "blowing up jews is bad"... or... "people with penises are male".  It's crazy!  Almost as crazy as the left's subconscious decision to always support the out group.
 
2013-06-30 07:10:44 PM

Generation_D: Its funny how 3 people in this thread, all of whom I already had marked as "pro-Israeli bullies and shills" are all coming out hard against Transgendered people. Its almost as though a bully in one context remains a bully in another. Remarkable find.


thisismyshockedface.jpg
 
2013-06-30 07:26:07 PM
I have no clue if TG's are "natural" or whatever but it does seem to me that maybe what some consider to be normal are really just issues they should fight to overcome.  Okay so it seems studies of their brains so this is natural behavior and everyone must embrace and accept their lifestyle.

okay but what do we do when we find out the pedo's brain is wired to naturally like kids, the sadistic animal abuser brain is different and abusing animals is normal or well you feel free to come up with your own
 
2013-06-30 07:58:04 PM

Waldo Pepper: everyone must embrace and accept their lifestyle.


Not a fan of that sentiment, though it does go around.  I'll tolerate any number of things and still be civil/courteous to people, but I will not embrace or accept those which I don't like.  You can't legislate how people feel, only how they act.

As for the rest of the post, you'll have to figure out how treating people based on actions and not feeling applies.  I do not have the patience to explain it to you.
 
2013-06-30 08:41:13 PM

Waldo Pepper: I have no clue if TG's are "natural" or whatever



I assure you, they weren't created in a lab.

Obviously, since God is omnipotent and can do, or avoid doing, anything He wishes, and since trans people exist, God wants them to exists.  Or do you figure that maybe God is incompetent and didn't know what he was doing when he made them? I'd really like to hear that explanation.  Please tell me how and why did God fark up and accidentally make people who make you feel uncomfortable.  Where, exactly, did God go wrong?

Your only options at this point are to
A) agree that God made trans people on purpose, in which case, they're OK
B) Agree that God made trans people on purpose, but He shouldn't have, in which case God is a fark-up who doesn't live up to your standards
C) Admit that God made trans people by accident, in which case God is a fark-up who doesn't live up to your standards, or
D) Admit that "God" is make believe and it's all in your head.

Trans people exist, so which of those four options is correct?

I recommend that you think before replying.
 
2013-06-30 09:06:21 PM

FloydA: Waldo Pepper: I have no clue if TG's are "natural" or whatever


I assure you, they weren't created in a lab.

Obviously, since God is omnipotent and can do, or avoid doing, anything He wishes, and since trans people exist, God wants them to exists.  Or do you figure that maybe God is incompetent and didn't know what he was doing when he made them? I'd really like to hear that explanation.  Please tell me how and why did God fark up and accidentally make people who make you feel uncomfortable.  Where, exactly, did God go wrong?

Your only options at this point are to
A) agree that God made trans people on purpose, in which case, they're OK
B) Agree that God made trans people on purpose, but He shouldn't have, in which case God is a fark-up who doesn't live up to your standards
C) Admit that God made trans people by accident, in which case God is a fark-up who doesn't live up to your standards, or
D) Admit that "God" is make believe and it's all in your head.

Trans people exist, so which of those four options is correct?

I recommend that you think before replying.


I never claimed that TG don't exist. I simply stated that I don't know if TG's are natural or something else is going on with them, I feel this is a fair assessment and one that quite a lot of people share regardless of their religious belief or non belief.

my point is what if we find out that a lot of anti social or wrong behaviors show up as differences in the brain from birth, do we then start to allow these behaviors as the person is born to be that way.

This is a valid concern.

I honestly have no issues with TG's and when ive had customers that are TG I've treated them with the utmost respect as i do all customers.  Try that with a TG who wears a men's size 12 and wants to try on a ladies size 10 running shoe (converts to a men's 8 1/2), couldn't make it fit but I did find a men's running shoe that was fem enough for her.

I won't address your silly questions about God as God is not limited to the what you are capable of understanding
 
NFA [TotalFark]
2013-06-30 09:23:03 PM

drjekel_mrhyde: /Feel free to post more, my tranny folder is not complete


forums.aaca.org

What a tranny might look like.  : )
 
2013-06-30 09:28:55 PM
RKade:Hey! Even I saw what you did there!

I salute your sense of humor, sir. I'll also wear blue in honor!

mike_the_engineer:I know.  It's as if all rational people are naturally coming to the same conclusions about things... like... "blowing up jews is bad"... or... "people with penises are male".  It's crazy!  Almost as crazy as the left's subconscious decision to always support the out group.

You use that word "rational". I don't think you know what it means.

I also know you never took any kind of biological science other than "Earth Science" if you think that primary sexual characteristics define gender.

You might start with all the horror stories of intersexed and ambiguous genitalia infants who were assigned the wrong gender based on what the chromosomal analysis came back as. There's a reason that they wait until age two or three, provided there are no urogenital abnormalities which endanger an infant's life, to assign a gender in these patients.

But given your cry of "I'm an engineer, I KNOW WITHOUT EMOTION!" through this thread, despite basing arguments on absolutely no science or even being able to grasp the plainly posted diagnostic caveats of "Mental Disorders" on the DSM-IV-TR/DSM-V - but rather emotion and your own personal, irrational felings, I highly doubt you'll even research it beyond your narrow and shallow grasp of human psychology and mental health.
 
2013-06-30 09:38:47 PM
so TG males is just a matter of them wanting their cock and be Edith too?

sorry i know very lame attempt at a joke lol
 
2013-07-01 01:02:57 AM
hardinparamedic: I also know you never took any kind of biological science other than "Earth Science" if you think that primary sexual characteristics define gender.

Biological science only cares about gender in the context of reproduction.  And for that purpose, gender is defined SOLELY by your reproductive characteristics.

You might start with all the horror stories of intersexed and ambiguous genitalia infants who were assigned the wrong gender based on what the chromosomal analysis came back as.

That's a birth defect, not a mental disorder.  Those people have an extra chromosome.

despite basing arguments on absolutely no science or even being able to grasp the plainly posted diagnostic caveats of "Mental Disorders" on the DSM-IV-TR/DSM-V

No science?  Are you farking kidding me?  DSM-4 and DSM-5 are pretty clear that this is a mental disorder.  In fact, the current definition,  according to DSM-5, is...  "strong desires to be treated as the other gender or to be rid of one's sex characteristics, or a strong conviction that one has feelings and reactions typical of the other gender"... which is exactly what the fark I've been telling you.  If you want to cut your penis off, YOU HAVE A MENTAL DISORDER.


i.imgur.com
 
2013-07-01 01:14:42 AM

mike_the_engineer: If you want to cut your penis off, YOU HAVE A MENTAL DISORDER.


What I find entertaining, is that so many want it to not be classified as a disorder.

But if it is classified as a disorder, many qualify through insurance, to get the help that they need, so campaigning to get it removed from the DSM would be a direct detriment to some that need it.

Some people I will just never understand.
 
2013-07-01 01:56:53 AM

Waldo Pepper: okay but what do we do when we find out the pedo's brain is wired to naturally like kids, the sadistic animal abuser brain is different and abusing animals is normal or well you feel free to come up with your own


Many of them specifically request pharmacological drugs that inhibit the sex drive, also referred to as "chemical castration."

Until science invents a pre-pubesent sex robot, pedophilia is not a parasexuality that can engaged in consensually, something that most people with the condition recognize themselves.
 
2013-07-01 01:58:55 AM

mike_the_engineer: hardinparamedic: I also know you never took any kind of biological science other than "Earth Science" if you think that primary sexual characteristics define gender.

Biological science only cares about gender in the context of reproduction.  And for that purpose, gender is defined SOLELY by your reproductive characteristics.

You might start with all the horror stories of intersexed and ambiguous genitalia infants who were assigned the wrong gender based on what the chromosomal analysis came back as.

That's a birth defect, not a mental disorder.  Those people have an extra chromosome.

despite basing arguments on absolutely no science or even being able to grasp the plainly posted diagnostic caveats of "Mental Disorders" on the DSM-IV-TR/DSM-V

No science?  Are you farking kidding me?  DSM-4 and DSM-5 are pretty clear that this is a mental disorder.  In fact, the current definition,  according to DSM-5, is...  "strong desires to be treated as the other gender or to be rid of one's sex characteristics, or a strong conviction that one has feelings and reactions typical of the other gender"... which is exactly what the fark I've been telling you.  If you want to cut your penis off, YOU HAVE A MENTAL DISORDER.


[i.imgur.com image 549x362]


Sir, there are literally entire libraries written about the things you don't know.
 
2013-07-01 03:34:05 AM

mike_the_engineer: If you want to cut your penis off, YOU HAVE A MENTAL DISORDER


Except of course, they dont do that. I know- facts are not your strong suit, but you could read a bit about grs/ srs before opening your mouth ( or typing, in this case )
 
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