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(ABC Local)   North Carolina summer camp for children is revealed to have two convicted murderers on its staff, including a convicted child killer. That whirring sound you hear is all the helicopter parents throwing fits   (abclocal.go.com) divider line 138
    More: Scary, child murder, North Carolina, helicopter parents, murderers, voluntary manslaughter, Doris Bullock, day camp  
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9107 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Jun 2013 at 12:21 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-28 01:20:10 AM
[GOODcat.jpg]
 
2013-06-28 01:21:01 AM

missmez: Mock26: queezyweezel: I don't think you need to be a helicopter parent too be upset about this. Or even a parent, really.....

They served their time and have been reformed.  End of story.

Seriously?  Because, you know, I'm a fairly awful person.  I genuinely enjoy the misery of others if said others annoy me sufficiently. I know that's immoral, but I don't even feel bad about it.  Somehow, though, I have never killed anyone.

 
2013-06-28 01:23:49 AM
missmez:

Seriously?  Because, you know, I'm a fairly awful person.  I genuinely enjoy the misery of others if said others annoy me sufficiently. I know that's immoral, but I don't even feel bad about it.  Somehow, though, I have never killed anyone.

oops
cdn.niketalk.com
 
2013-06-28 01:26:26 AM

HotWingAgenda: Let me get this straight:  simply having student debt bars you  from the biz, even if payments are not delinquent?

That would actually make sense. They wouldn't want someone having an incentive to sell extra pot on the sly to people that don't have valid scripts, because he has to pay back a huge debt burden.


Why only student debt?  Why not anybody with a mortgage, which is likely to be much larger than a student loan?

No, what makes sense is to bar people who aren't paying their bills.  They're the ones who have significant incentive to cheat.
 
2013-06-28 01:26:31 AM
 
2013-06-28 01:27:20 AM

HotWingAgenda: That would actually make sense.


No, it wouldn't. Are you on crack.
 
2013-06-28 01:29:30 AM

Greywar: Even worse notice...the child killer killed her OWN child.  not just some random kid.


Wait.why is it worse that she did it to her own? If she destroyed her own car would it be worse than if she'd destroyed someone else's car?
 
2013-06-28 01:30:24 AM
The message I take away from this article is that only convicts and murderers are willing to take the jobs of working with today's kids.

/sounds right
 
2013-06-28 01:33:31 AM

Clemkadidlefark: The message I take away from this article is that only convicts and murderers are willing to take the jobs of working with today's kids.

/sounds right


You  can get lots of nice people to work with kids.  These desperate ex-cons have to work with  the president of a religious university, too.
 
2013-06-28 01:34:56 AM
Helicopter parent? I'd be like Ares the God of War parent.
 
2013-06-28 01:37:38 AM
At first I was like this:

queezyweezel: I don't think you need to be a helicopter parent too be upset about this. Or even a parent, really.....


Then I read the article*, and I was like this:

buckler: As long as they aren't in direct contact with kids, and are limited to administrative roles, I have no problem with this. The camp seems to think they are outstanding employees, and they would know best. I'm a firm believer in second chances.


*I don't mean to imply queezyweezel didn't read the article, just that my opinion changed when I did.
 
2013-06-28 01:39:32 AM
OK, after some soul-searching I believe I would not raise a stink about this.  I would be concerned that my kid(s) in the camp might learn of it and be scared, but I think I could reassure them.  I would not tell them about it and raise fears unnecessarily.
 
2013-06-28 01:43:24 AM

BigOle8point: I remember the Fred Lane story and while he was most likely guilty of mentally and physically abusing Diedre, was pretty full of himself, a big time show off and probably pretty douchetastic, it was most likely pre meditated.

Deserved?


Read the account, it was a straight up ambush and possibly to prevent him from turning her in because she didn't know the feds were after her already. The comments were interesting too from someone who knew him in college and said he was a good guy and a second one pledging vengeance for Allah. She'd spent the money from the robbery too and needed more so Fred's dead.
 
2013-06-28 01:45:04 AM

Greywar: Even worse notice...the child killer killed her OWN child.  not just some random kid.


People get charged with and found guilty of, murdering their children for accidental deaths. For cases like leaving the kid in a hot car.

And, yes, negligence like that isn't something you want in a camp councilor, but she isn't a councilor, she's in the administration. And it happened over 30 years ago.

So I believe that she isn't going to just go into work one day and stab some random kid to death.
 
2013-06-28 01:46:10 AM
"One source told ABC11 that both Bullock and Gary work for the president of the school. The source also said that their roles go beyond administrative and that they work directly with kids.
That source also said that parents who enroll their children in the Kiddie Kollege Summer Camp are not told about the women's backgrounds, and that there is no policy on the hiring of ex-felons."

Well if "One source" says it's true on the internet, then it must truly be true!

/Media spin is best spin.
 
2013-06-28 01:51:40 AM

OscarTamerz: Fred's dead.


ymarksthespot.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-06-28 02:07:05 AM
Alright you little shiats, keep on pissing mommy and daddy off and this is where you are going to be spending part of your summer..........
 
2013-06-28 02:07:08 AM
insure the kids for 10M. Win-Win.
 
2013-06-28 02:12:13 AM
Its very difficult for convicted felons to get any type of work
Supervisors said they were great at their jobs
Their crimes were obviously isolated acts of desperation
Leave them alone
 
2013-06-28 02:12:37 AM
Maybe those kids parents don't like them very much....
 
2013-06-28 02:13:42 AM
But they're women, so it's okay. Women are natural nurturers.
 
2013-06-28 02:41:15 AM

Bucky Katt: on it is staff!


take back one kadam!
 
2013-06-28 03:34:04 AM
I forget, which movie had this as the plot?
 
2013-06-28 04:01:58 AM
BarkingUnicorn - You can get lots of very few nice people to work with kids.

FTFY

As someone who has done this type of work for many years now, I can assure you that most child camps get lazy, self-absorbed college students who are more interested in hitting on each other, texting everyone on the planet, and collecting that paycheck than giving one tiny shiat about your kids. Even the ones who are working on a degree in child development (sometimes, they are the worst ones). Of course, between the complete joke of a paycheck, and the fact that one second of camaraderie with a child gets you accused of molestation, those lazy children in adults bodies are about the only ones who would do that work, if they were to do any work at all.

/Bitter? naw, I'm not bitter...I just worked myself into a permanent injury and a major bout of depression for those kids, and got nothing but accused of crap and fired for it. Not a bitter hair on my head...
//I am bald...
 
2013-06-28 04:07:33 AM
Stupid headline is stupid
 
2013-06-28 04:09:37 AM

Born to Die: North Carolina summer camp for children is revealed to have two convicted murderers on it's staff, including a convicted child killer. That whirring sound you hear is all the helicopter parents Bob the Angry Flower throwing fits


I thought he was an angry cabbage.
 
2013-06-28 04:24:52 AM

Farty McPooPants: [eloquentscience.com image 500x265]


Take a look here for clarification:

http://grammar.about.com/od/punctuationandmechanics/tp/GuideApostrop he .htm
 
2013-06-28 04:24:54 AM

payattention: BarkingUnicorn - You can get lots of very few nice people to work with kids.

FTFY

As someone who has done this type of work for many years now, I can assure you that most child camps get lazy, self-absorbed college students who are more interested in hitting on each other, texting everyone on the planet, and collecting that paycheck than giving one tiny shiat about your kids. Even the ones who are working on a degree in child development (sometimes, they are the worst ones). Of course, between the complete joke of a paycheck, and the fact that one second of camaraderie with a child gets you accused of molestation, those lazy children in adults bodies are about the only ones who would do that work, if they were to do any work at all.

/Bitter? naw, I'm not bitter...I just worked myself into a permanent injury and a major bout of depression for those kids, and got nothing but accused of crap and fired for it. Not a bitter hair on my head...
//I am bald...


And I'm not bitter that you ignored my clever witticism.
 
2013-06-28 04:39:04 AM

BarkingUnicorn: Let me get this straight: simply having student debt bars you from the biz, even if payments are not delinquent?


Don't know for sure, as my loans were a wee bit delinquent.  I've heard from other folks who got their licenses denied who claimed they were up on their payments, but that's very anecdotal.

What surprised me was that while that will bar you from the industry, violent felons are a-okay.  And yes, there are most definitely convicted murderers and rapists working at the less scrupulous dispensaries.  I've met a few.  They don't belong in the industry.

HotWingAgenda: That would actually make sense. They wouldn't want someone having an incentive to sell extra pot on the sly to people that don't have valid scripts, because he has to pay back a huge debt burden.


There are three reasons it actually makes zero sense:

1.  A person who has a debt to pay off and is working towards it is more likely to work hard and keep their nose clean, because they don't want to lose their job.  Loss of said job means that their debt spirals out of control, their credit rating is destroyed, and their lives and the lives of their families go in the shiatter.  I know this because I am currently living it.

2.  A person who is not working towards paying off their student loan debt at all is highly unlikely to jeopardize their employment and risk incarceration just so they can give Fannie Mae her due.  They're far more likely to just continue to not make payments.

3.  It is virtually impossible to "sell extra pot on the sly to people that don't have valid scripts" in the medical marijuana industry in Colorado.  From the instant that a cannabis seed or clone is planted, to the instant the cannabis leaves the dispensary, it is vigilantly tracked by the Medical Marijuana Enforcement Division.  Inspections of dispensaries and grow-sites are done frequently.  Scales weigh out to a hundredth of a gram, have to be calibrated and certified by state-licensed technicians a few times a year, and daily weight reports are sent to MMED.  Every inch of every grow op and every dispensary is monitored 24-hours a day by CCTV cameras that feed directly into MMED.  When transporting product from the grow to the shop or from one shop to another, you are required to file a manifest with MMED stating exactly how much product you have, your intended destination, and exactly when you will be on the road and what route you are taking.  I had to learn to fill out more paperwork to sell pot than I had to learn to fill out in cop school, and cops have a lot of paperwork.

If your counts are off by even a gram, MMED will find out about it, and they will find out why.  Medical marijuana is very tightly controlled in Colorado.
 
2013-06-28 04:47:44 AM

payattention: BarkingUnicorn - You can get lots of very few nice people to work with kids.

FTFY

As someone who has done this type of work for many years now, I can assure you that most child camps get lazy, self-absorbed college students who are more interested in hitting on each other, texting everyone on the planet, and collecting that paycheck than giving one tiny shiat about your kids. Even the ones who are working on a degree in child development (sometimes, they are the worst ones). Of course, between the complete joke of a paycheck, and the fact that one second of camaraderie with a child gets you accused of molestation, those lazy children in adults bodies are about the only ones who would do that work, if they were to do any work at all.

/Bitter? naw, I'm not bitter...I just worked myself into a permanent injury and a major bout of depression for those kids, and got nothing but accused of crap and fired for it. Not a bitter hair on my head...
//I am bald...


why aren't Mexicans doing this?
 
2013-06-28 04:52:03 AM

bigbobowski: payattention: BarkingUnicorn - You can get lots of very few nice people to work with kids.

FTFY

As someone who has done this type of work for many years now, I can assure you that most child camps get lazy, self-absorbed college students who are more interested in hitting on each other, texting everyone on the planet, and collecting that paycheck than giving one tiny shiat about your kids. Even the ones who are working on a degree in child development (sometimes, they are the worst ones). Of course, between the complete joke of a paycheck, and the fact that one second of camaraderie with a child gets you accused of molestation, those lazy children in adults bodies are about the only ones who would do that work, if they were to do any work at all.

/Bitter? naw, I'm not bitter...I just worked myself into a permanent injury and a major bout of depression for those kids, and got nothing but accused of crap and fired for it. Not a bitter hair on my head...
//I am bald...

why aren't Mexicans doing this?


Because they already have enough kids to deal with?
 
2013-06-28 05:09:27 AM

radarlove: There are three reasons it actually makes zero sense:


Its not just MMJ bro, thats kind of standard government treatment.  Try joining say, the Air Force sometime with debt.. you'll see real fast.
 
2013-06-28 05:14:43 AM

Alonjar: radarlove: There are three reasons it actually makes zero sense:

Its not just MMJ bro, thats kind of standard government treatment.  Try joining say, the Air Force sometime with debt.. you'll see real fast.


The fact that credit-based employment is systemic doesn't make it right.  Sadly, a lot of private sector businesses are adopting the same policy.  If you're deeply in debt, you can't have a job.  Which, of course, just makes the debt grow exponentially.  Those who most desperately need the work are deprived of it.  That's a total failure of the system.
 
2013-06-28 05:33:04 AM
"I believe that everybody deserves a second chance, but there's some things you should be allowed to do and some things you should not be allowed to do, depending on what you've done before," parent Peggy Wiggins said.

Some things they should be allowed to do, such as find work no better than fast food.

Some things they should not be allowed to do, such as find work that's better than fast food.

Seriously, why would anyone want to give people such as these the actual ability to afford BOTH food and shelter?! They should be struggling to buy food and live in poverty the rest of their lives!
 
2013-06-28 05:59:22 AM

you are a puppet: To be fair they wouldn't have been convicted if Stand your Ground laws existed at the time.


Are you implying that the murdered infant was black and the mother was white?
 
2013-06-28 06:45:37 AM

wildcardjack: Second degree 30+ years ago, and voluntary manslaughter.

I don't see a real murderer here. They might have killed, but they didn't set out to kill.


8/10

Very subtle
 
2013-06-28 06:48:32 AM
One murder happened in 1981. 32 years ago.  And it was her own child (probably a very tragic back story there).  Frankly, I don't see the danger. Leave her alone.

I'm guessing some intrepid reporter looking for ratings wondered what happened to the girl who killed the football player.  She must have been evil.  Let's harrass her until she dies.
 
2013-06-28 06:49:16 AM

Greywar: Even worse notice...the child killer killed her OWN child.  not just some random kid.


She only kills her own?  Then these kids have nothing to worry about!
 
2013-06-28 06:49:56 AM

ReverendJimBobHammer: Felgraf: Uh, as someone who volunteers at a summer camp for one week, this would bother me, and I'm a *counselor*. We've dealt with heleicopter parents. This is not helicopter parenty.

ESPECIALLY the child killing conviction would bug me. Because that makes me think about something potentially happening to one of the campers. Which puts me into a... I think TV tropes calls it "Papa Wolf" state of mind.

Do they.. do they not run background checks or something? Every year I have to submit a background check authorization form via our camp director, who submits it to Council.

Maybe you should rtfa, yes they knew, they are administrative employees not around kids, they were manslaughters possibly accidental, also many years ago.


If you RTFA, you will see that they are, indeed, working with kids, that one was convicted of Burdett and the other of voluntary manslaughter, meaning not only not an accident but also wilful.
 
2013-06-28 06:52:17 AM
I don't even like kids and I think this is a dumb idea.

So there.
 
2013-06-28 06:55:35 AM

ArcadianRefugee: Greywar: Even worse notice...the child killer killed her OWN child.  not just some random kid.

Wait.why is it worse that she did it to her own? If she destroyed her own car would it be worse than if she'd destroyed someone else's car?


You wouldn't download someone ELSE's kid, would you?!
 
2013-06-28 06:56:49 AM

Felgraf: Do they.. do they not run background checks or something? Every year I have to submit a background check authorization form via our camp director, who submits it to Council.


Don't you feel foolish now!
 
2013-06-28 06:59:08 AM

BigOle8point: I remember the Fred Lane story and while he was most likely guilty of mentally and physically abusing Diedre, was pretty full of himself, a big time show off and probably pretty douchetastic, it was most likely pre meditated.

Deserved?


Well, considering she put a bullet in his head while he was on the ground, helpless, I'm going to say it was obviously an accident.
 
2013-06-28 07:23:35 AM

Krieghund: So I believe that she isn't going to just go into work one day and stab some random kid to death.


Well she could, but probably isn't any more likely to than any of the other staff, and probably less likely than the ones that actually have to put up with the kids all the time.
 
2013-06-28 07:24:16 AM
"Not to say you can't hire them, but why put them with children?  Why would they think people would want to leave a child with a killer?" said parent Nicole White.

When Jason Voorhies attacks the camp, don't you want someone defending your kid who already knows how to kill?
 
2013-06-28 07:27:21 AM
Knowing what I know about America through Fark, a 'convicted child killer' could be anyone who was caught looking sideways, a mile away, when some three-year-old had a bruise from falling on a cushion.
 
2013-06-28 07:31:27 AM
OscarTamerz: She'd spent the money from the robbery too and needed more so Fred's dead.

That's what you said?
 
2013-06-28 07:47:31 AM
I'm willing to accept that someone who killed their own child at age 18 is not the same person as they are at age 50. Without knowing the circumstances, it's hard to say, but postpartum depression/psychosis were not well understood back then so I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt.

The school is messed up if the other woman is anywhere near the kids, though.
 
2013-06-28 07:53:45 AM
Man, you guys make it sound like summer camp isn't all about taking showers while "Kip the Counselor" watches you and the evening 'check you buttocks for ticks' inspection. It was also making macrame thongs and have naked greased pyramid parties.
 
2013-06-28 07:59:07 AM

you are a puppet: To be fair they wouldn't have been convicted if Stand your Ground laws existed at the time.


Yeah, that baby was COMMIN' RIGHT AT HER.

Explosive baby shiat is a kind of weapon.
 
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