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(New York Magazine)   Tear-jerking video of dog burying dead puppy was not compassion... it was food preparation   (nymag.com) divider line 19
    More: Followup, cooking, dog burying, The Christian Post, Museum of Natural History, compassion, Daily Intelligencer, dogs  
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15628 clicks; posted to Main » on 27 Jun 2013 at 5:04 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-27 05:26:59 PM  
3 votes:

buckets_of_fun: So the morale of the story is dead puppies are delicious?


No, the morale of the story is low.
The morel of the story is an edible mushroom found in early spring.
The moral of the story is, a dog may not know why it buries a pup, but it may a cur to it later.
2013-06-27 08:40:47 PM  
2 votes:
When I was a child, my beagle had pups. One died after a fall. I remember watching the dog bury her pup.

I think a mama dog will bury her dead pup to avoid attracting predators to her live pups.
2013-06-27 06:14:45 PM  
2 votes:

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: And when your dog snuggles up to you on the couch, it's because he loves you. It has nothing to do with the fact that you're a heat source.


It might have something to do with that, but it might also have something to do with the fact that dogs are a subspecies of the grey wolf which is a social animal that uses physical contact to establish and maintain familial bonds.
2013-06-28 03:03:47 AM  
1 votes:
i.qkme.me
2013-06-27 09:27:50 PM  
1 votes:

Snapper Carr: J. Frank Parnell: Of course it has to be something like that. The idea animals aren't just meat robots god put here for us to exploit, and might have emotions just like us, is ridiculous.

And now here are a bunch of scientists.

The leap from "animals have emotions" to "animals engage in ritualistic grief rituals" is a mighty big one.


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2013-06-27 09:08:59 PM  
1 votes:
It is instinctive behavior to bury for dogs.  The instinct is there like spinning before laying down,   My dogs will circle around extra long and slowly when told to lay down and they don't want to, complete with a loud sigh.  Circling before laying down may be an instinctive thing, but in the moment they can express themselves in ways that are not simply anthropomorphic projections.

It doesn't threaten anyone's "soul" or "superior intellect" to admit that our domesticated dogs are capable of communicating at about the level of a two or three year old.

What is it like to be a bat, er ... dog?  That is the question really being raised here.
2013-06-27 06:46:23 PM  
1 votes:

omeganuepsilon: Yeah, dogs can love an individual...cuddle for closeness to that person.

But they also can do this with complete strangers, leaving the (humanizing)owner feeling abandoned and neglected.

It's a dog, not a person.  It is a pack animal, and outside normal human boundaries and concepts of love.


Did you bother to watch the vid at the link?

We do know that the dog's brain is flooded with oxytocin when it comes into affectionate contact with its human.  What I don't personally know is whether the experimenters had a control group to determine whether the neurochemical release is unique between a dog and a familial human or whether all humans prompt this response.  I would hope that the researchers would have utilized a control group...but, I don't know that they did.

In any case, your position seems to be one from personal incredulity (that is, "I can't conceive of it; therefore, it must be false").  My position is, let's test the hypothesis to determine whether it's credible.
2013-06-27 06:46:13 PM  
1 votes:
To cite my experience as a dog owner, I can say for a fact that dogs do experience and express various emotions, often more complex than people would expect.  We have Australian Shepherds, they are very intelligent dogs, and very good at solving problems, and making connections between their actions and their consequences, as well as anticipating our response to them...

When our dog detects that we're leaving for a few hours, she walks around the house with her head held low, sits on her "moping chair" and gives us very sad puppy eyes, then proceeds to place her muzzle in the door so we can't close it without pushing her face back inside.  I honestly believe she genuinely gets upset when we leave.

That said, she doesn't write us letters expressing this problem, nor does she do anything else that a human might think of to try in her situation.  I'm pretty sure she'd be sad if one of our other dogs died, but she's not going to bury them.

Dogs don't express emotions like humans do, nor do they cope with things the way we do.  When she gets really upset about us leaving, she'll make a mess out of something so we have to clean it up first, that's pretty much a dog-solution to a problem, she doesn't try to reason with us.
2013-06-27 06:20:25 PM  
1 votes:
There's no immediate intuitive connection between being sad that someone is dead and buying them in the ground. If an animal were capable of grieving, why on earth would it occur to them to bury the dead?
2013-06-27 06:00:06 PM  
1 votes:

Super Chronic: eraser8: One thing that often gets overlooked in these "that dog isn't doing what we think he's doing" stories is the fact that dogs are a subspecies entirely created by human beings.  They've been selectively bred to act according to our preferences.   Dogs simply don't behave in the same ways that wolves or foxes do.

I'm not, by the way, claiming that this guy is wrong.  I'm just saying that "I know what that dog is doing because other beasts do something similar" isn't very convincing.

Fair enough, but this argument...


My argument is simply that we shouldn't be quick to assume a rationale behind dog behavior.

Serious dog behavioral studies began only recently.  It wasn't until a few years ago, for example, that scientists discovered that humans are able to nonverbally communicate with dogs in a way that eludes our closest genetic cousins, chimpanzees (and, dogs' closest relative, the wolf). This, by the way, is true from puppyhood...so, it's not just a matter of training.
2013-06-27 05:45:51 PM  
1 votes:
One thing that often gets overlooked in these "that dog isn't doing what we think he's doing" stories is the fact that dogs are a subspecies entirely created by human beings.  They've been selectively bred to act according to our preferences.   Dogs simply don't behave in the same ways that wolves or foxes do.

I'm not, by the way, claiming that this guy is wrong.  I'm just saying that "I know what that dog is doing because other beasts do something similar" isn't very convincing.
2013-06-27 05:40:01 PM  
1 votes:

meat0918: Super Chronic: I hadn't seen this until just now, but my response is.... duh.  Did anyone really think a dog was engaging in a spontaneous grieving ritual?

Anyway, curious to know what kind of dog that is.  Looks sorta like a Brittany, though with darker spots.

Given the internet tears that have been shed, yes, yes they did.


reillan: Super Chronic: I hadn't seen this until just now, but my response is.... duh.  Did anyone really think a dog was engaging in a spontaneous grieving ritual?

Yes.  based purely on comments, it seems like MOST people thought it was grief.


And look, I don't doubt that dogs are capable of feeling emotion.  But this is a complex behavior, and animals don't carry out complex behaviors except by instinct -- instinct that evolves or is bred over a long period of time.  For example, burying stuff to eat/chew up later.  So, even if this dog is terribly sad to see another dog dead, it cannot possibly be going through the exercise of (1) translating that sadness into a conscious decision to give the dog a dignified farewell, (2) deciding that a dignified farewell consists of a burial, and then (3) acting on it.
2013-06-27 05:35:44 PM  
1 votes:

Spam Pajamas: When I was growing up I was at a friend's house who had a huge pit bull. The little old lady next door had a Chihuahua. One day while we were on his porch his dog came up with the Chihuahua in his mouth and it was dead. We panicked. We figured maybe we could just reattach it to its leash and hope the little old lady thought her dog died on its own. A few hours later we hear her screaming! We run over and she's holding her dead dog. She asked who would do such a thing? We said it looks like it died on its own. She said "It died two days ago. Someone dug it up and reattached it to its leash!"


Provided it's true, THAT is a CSB.
2013-06-27 05:28:36 PM  
1 votes:

Spam Pajamas: When I was growing up I was at a friend's house who had a huge pit bull. The little old lady next door had a Chihuahua. One day while we were on his porch his dog came up with the Chihuahua in his mouth and it was dead. We panicked. We figured maybe we could just reattach it to its leash and hope the little old lady thought her dog died on its own. A few hours later we hear her screaming! We run over and she's holding her dead dog. She asked who would do such a thing? We said it looks like it died on its own. She said "It died two days ago. Someone dug it up and reattached it to its leash!"


I thought it was a rabbit and being put back in its hutch.  But what do I know, it was your childhood.
2013-06-27 05:23:26 PM  
1 votes:
When I was growing up I was at a friend's house who had a huge pit bull. The little old lady next door had a Chihuahua. One day while we were on his porch his dog came up with the Chihuahua in his mouth and it was dead. We panicked. We figured maybe we could just reattach it to its leash and hope the little old lady thought her dog died on its own. A few hours later we hear her screaming! We run over and she's holding her dead dog. She asked who would do such a thing? We said it looks like it died on its own. She said "It died two days ago. Someone dug it up and reattached it to its leash!"
2013-06-27 05:17:02 PM  
1 votes:
I for one cannot WAIT to get on Facebook this afternoon to see how this has blossomed into a many-headed tirade about anthropomorphism versus OMFG YOULIBSRALLRETARDS! to it obviously being Obama's fault because his wife has or had bangs - and of course we all know what THAT means!!
2013-06-27 05:15:34 PM  
1 votes:

buckets_of_fun: So the morale of the story is dead puppies are delicious?


Maybe, but they aren't much fun.
2013-06-27 05:08:09 PM  
1 votes:
Soylent Gray is DOGGGGGGGS!
2013-06-27 05:07:07 PM  
1 votes:
Dogs is better people than people.
 
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