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(Real Clear Science)   Teach creationism in schools? How would Star Trek: Deep Space Nine handle that question? Besides have Avery Brooks punch Q that is   (realclearscience.com ) divider line
    More: Amusing, Star Trek, Deep Space Network, creationism in schools, Bajorans, Education Act, Springboro  
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6502 clicks; posted to Main » on 27 Jun 2013 at 10:23 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-27 09:40:35 AM  
Remember kids:
www.marijuana.com
 
2013-06-27 09:54:17 AM  
At the end of the episode, cooler heads prevailed. Though the devout, orthodox spiritual leader wasn't convinced, almost all of her followers realized that science wasn't directly attacking their beliefs. On the other side, the Federation personnel accepted that religion can indeed serve a positive purpose.

i76.photobucket.com
 
2013-06-27 10:12:37 AM  
I think the real lesson to be learned frin Winn is that if you act like a religious nut and persecuting science is the key to political success.  Act reasonable and the best you can hope for is to be a mere Vedic, but shut down a school and you'll eventually become Kai.
 
2013-06-27 10:17:21 AM  

serial_crusher: I think the real lesson to be learned frin Winn is that if you act like a religious nut and persecuting science is the key to political success.  Act reasonable and the best you can hope for is to be a mere Vedic, but shut down a school and you'll eventually become Kai.


Also, religious fanatics are most likely to be seduced by Satan and thrown into the Fire Caves.
 
2013-06-27 10:24:24 AM  
They'll all go to the holosuites for an holographic orgy?
 
2013-06-27 10:24:52 AM  

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: serial_crusher: I think the real lesson to be learned frin Winn is that if you act like a religious nut and persecuting science is the key to political success.  Act reasonable and the best you can hope for is to be a mere Vedic, but shut down a school and you'll eventually become Kai.

Also, religious fanatics are most likely to be seduced by Satan and thrown into the Fire Caves.


This renews my hope.
 
2013-06-27 10:28:14 AM  
How would it handle the question? Probably by developing some boring, ill-conceived story arc around it that they'd drop halfway through in order to have an episode where everyone plays baseball in the holodeck.
 
2013-06-27 10:30:48 AM  
I guess the article forgot that later on in that episode they bomb the school under Wynn's influence/command and she then supports a military coup to take over Bajor a couple of episodes later.
 
2013-06-27 10:34:03 AM  

texdent: They'll all go to the holosuites for an holographic orgy?


God I would hate to be on the engineering team assigned to the holodeck.

Imagine the messes you would be called to clean up.
 
2013-06-27 10:34:15 AM  
How has the earth managed to stay 6,000 years old for centuries?
 
2013-06-27 10:34:44 AM  
This is a planet founded by people who believed in Creationism. They were left here by people who believed in science since they lacked the technology to travel in space. In the 2000 years that followed, they splintered in to numerous factions each arguing that their beliefs are the correct ones and others, no matter how miniscule in difference are completely wrong.

I'm surprised they haven't destroyed each other in many meaningless wars.

Actually, they did. Everyone is dead. These are just their television broadcasts set on a constant loop.

"Oh Davey. Your views of Christianity are completely wrong."

"Says you, dog. The Bible tells us that everyone who parts their hair down the middle are drug addicts and devil worshipers! Die and join your creator Satan in Hell!"

Lock phasers on that transmitter and fire on my command.

"Destroy me and your soul will be committed to the depths of hell, Davey"

"Bang!"

And... fire phasers.
 
2013-06-27 10:36:21 AM  
Picard would never hit me!
 
2013-06-27 10:36:42 AM  

IdBeCrazyIf: God I would hate to be on the engineering team assigned to the holodeck.

Imagine the messes you would be called to clean up.


Even in the future, jizz mopper will still be a job.
 
2013-06-27 10:36:45 AM  
Christians practically have a building devoted to teaching their beliefs built on every street corner in most parts of the country. But, increasingly, they're having problems getting people to come into them. And it's not like there's any shortage of Christians. The vast majority of Americans are still raised Christian and identify as Christian. So it's Christians that aren't going into the buildings that exist specifically to teach about Christian beliefs.

The utter lack of self-awareness among the people who try to force their beliefs into schools is mind-numbing. You can't even get your own people to listen to your crap in your own house so your solution is to try and force your way into your neighbor's house with lies like a robber pretending to be a magazine seller?

And then you wonder why I'm hostile to you? Really?
 
2013-06-27 10:39:53 AM  
At the end of the episode, cooler heads prevailed. Though the devout, orthodox spiritual leader wasn't convinced, almost all of her followers realized that science wasn't directly attacking their beliefs. revealed to have stirred the whole thing up on purpose to cause trouble.She actually didn't give a flying crap about any of it and was just trying to get an opportunity to murder a more progressive - and popular - rival.

FTFTFA
 
2013-06-27 10:41:59 AM  
Annnnd we are joined by the internet atheists, who are even more hated than their religious cousins.
 
2013-06-27 10:43:57 AM  
That was actually the episode that got me to say "Maybe this show will be better than The Next Generation."
 
2013-06-27 10:46:00 AM  

super_grass: Annnnd we are joined by the internet atheists, who are even more hated than their religious cousins.


Hey, everyone needs a hobby.  Like not stamp collecting...
 
2013-06-27 10:47:42 AM  

super_grass: Annnnd we are joined by the internet atheists, who are even more hated than their religious cousins.


Yup
 
2013-06-27 10:48:08 AM  

Prank Call of Cthulhu: IdBeCrazyIf: God I would hate to be on the engineering team assigned to the holodeck.

Imagine the messes you would be called to clean up.

Even in the future, jizz mopper will still be a job.

couldn't they just set phasers  on "bleach"?

 
2013-06-27 10:48:31 AM  

mekki: super_grass: Annnnd we are joined by the internet atheists, who are even more hated than their religious cousins.

Hey, everyone needs a hobby.  Like not stamp collecting...


Hooray the "We're not irrational dicks" irrational dicks have shown up.
 
2013-06-27 10:51:57 AM  
A similar situation was born out in America's past. African-American science fiction writer Octavia Butler's distant relatives suffered through years of inhuman treatment and incessant toil as slaves on southern plantations. In an interview with  Locus in 2000, Butler said:

"I used to despise religion... but I think I've become more understanding of [it]. Religion kept some of my relatives alive, because it was all they had. If they hadn't had some hope of heaven, some companionship in Jesus, they probably would have committed suicide."


Christianity is a good religion for slaves. It teaches them to be meek, humble, and to accept their lot in life.
 
2013-06-27 10:52:33 AM  

super_grass: Annnnd we are joined by the internet atheists, who are even more hated than their religious cousins.


Well the important thing is that you've found a way to superior to both.
 
2013-06-27 10:52:38 AM  

Great Janitor: That was actually the episode that got me to say "Maybe this show will be better than The Next Generation."
do you know the name/number of the episode? I would like to watch it.

 
2013-06-27 10:55:58 AM  

IdBeCrazyIf: texdent: They'll all go to the holosuites for an holographic orgy?

God I would hate to be on the engineering team assigned to the holodeck.

Imagine the messes you would be called to clean up.


Sounds like a job for Space Mexicans.

They'll have those, right?
 
2013-06-27 10:56:14 AM  

one-in-the-chamber: Prank Call of Cthulhu: IdBeCrazyIf: God I would hate to be on the engineering team assigned to the holodeck.

Imagine the messes you would be called to clean up.

Even in the future, jizz mopper will still be a job.

couldn't they just set phasers  on "bleach"?


I imagine the inventors of the holodeck a year after its release coming up with a retrofit bayron sweep mechanism because they never factored in the jizz factor.

Like that skit in Movie 43
 
2013-06-27 10:58:04 AM  

Jacob_Roberson: superior


I accidentally feel.
 
2013-06-27 10:58:09 AM  

one-in-the-chamber: Great Janitor: That was actually the episode that got me to say "Maybe this show will be better than The Next Generation."
do you know the name/number of the episode? I would like to watch it.


It was the season one finale.
 
2013-06-27 10:58:44 AM  

one-in-the-chamber: Great Janitor: That was actually the episode that got me to say "Maybe this show will be better than The Next Generation."
do you know the name/number of the episode? I would like to watch it.


It was called "In The Hands Of The Prophets", and was the final episode of the first season.
 
2013-06-27 11:03:18 AM  
Why didn't anybody interview Morn?  I want to know what he thinks.
 
2013-06-27 11:07:38 AM  
This Just in: Star Trek Episodes are often tied to moral and ethical debates in the current era.

CSB:  One of the pastors in my church is a woman who generally resembles Kain Winn, her voice is compatible, but much more striking is her manner of speech...the way she pauses when speaking... almost identically to Kai Winn.  When we first started attending the church, I LOLed  when I first heard her speak. My wife sneered at me, but I was so overjoyed at the coincidence couldn't stop smiling.
We went straight home and after I had my wife watch an episode segment or two, she reluctantly conceded.

/I'm still amused to this day
 //The Borg as an allegory for Chinese Manufacturing. Discuss.
 
2013-06-27 11:10:10 AM  
give me doughnuts:  Christianity is a good religion for slaves. It teaches them to be meek, humble, and to accept their lot in life.

The 1% agree with this philosophy.
 
2013-06-27 11:10:21 AM  

give me doughnuts: Christianity is a good religion for slaves. It teaches them to be meek, humble, and to accept their lot in life


I'm thinking the Quakers might disagree.
 
2013-06-27 11:12:35 AM  

huntercr: The Borg as an allegory for Chinese Manufacturing. Discuss.


I don't see any suicide nets.
www.daviddarling.info
 
2013-06-27 11:15:31 AM  
I think this debate could have been better settled if Kira had just punched Kai Winn in the face, like she so obviously wanted to.
 
2013-06-27 11:19:33 AM  
The Ferrangi are obviously based on the Jewish people.  Discuss.
 
2013-06-27 11:25:11 AM  
So god just has better technology. Lets go back in time and rattle the cages.
 
2013-06-27 11:26:08 AM  
If logic and reason could end the battle over the correct place for religion in our society, then it would have done so a long while back.

The problem is religion is more than just a feel-good thing; it's a means to control and manipulate people. Those doing that manipulation don't want to give up their easy means of manipulating the masses so vehemently resist having religion be relegated to its logical and reasonable role in society.
 
2013-06-27 11:26:56 AM  
Don't blame me, I voted for Vedek Bareil
 
2013-06-27 11:27:27 AM  

skozlaw: Christians practically have a building devoted to teaching their beliefs built on every street corner in most parts of the country. But, increasingly, they're having problems getting people to come into them. And it's not like there's any shortage of Christians. The vast majority of Americans are still raised Christian and identify as Christian. So it's Christians that aren't going into the buildings that exist specifically to teach about Christian beliefs.

The utter lack of self-awareness among the people who try to force their beliefs into schools is mind-numbing. You can't even get your own people to listen to your crap in your own house so your solution is to try and force your way into your neighbor's house with lies like a robber pretending to be a magazine seller?

And then you wonder why I'm hostile to you? Really?


Someone else said it, but it has a ring of truth, paraphrased: "I don't think we'd have as many christians if we could just make them read the bible."

Surveys say something like 10% of christians have ever read the book, and even fewer have made it all the way through.  Regardless, many of them are still willing to tell people they have absolute faith in a thing they have no real knowledge of, and to follow anyone who says they were inspired by it, and accept any interpretations out of it as long as they can be used to show how others are wrong.

Basically, they're morons.

Once you make that realization, it's hard to be angry at them.   They're just too dumb to make rational, intelligent choices, and really, the fault is yours for expecting that from them.
 
2013-06-27 11:36:19 AM  

huntercr: The Borg as an allegory for Chinese Manufacturing. Discuss.


I see the Borg as an allegory for Socialism/Communism.  No individuals, just the collective whole to the point where the betterment of the state/collective overrides the needs of the individual.  The state/collective is a super nanny state that individuals can not exist outside of it or don't know how to cope outside of it since it provides for all, including jobs, housing and transportation.  Race and religion no longer matters since everyone is now 100% equal, healthcare comes from the state, as does food...or nutrition.  Plus, thought control.  No will or thought may exist that goes against the will of the state/collective.  The ruler of the state/collective is not a commoner, but rather, a person who is simply better than you by birth, class and upbringing in a system that could never allow for anyone not of that birth to lead the state/collective.  All resources obtained are given first to the state/collective, almost in the form of a 100% tax rate.  Doesn't matter if drone 557/8000 discovered said technology, it goes to the state who then gives it to all.

discuss...
 
2013-06-27 11:37:28 AM  

simplicimus: How has the earth managed to stay 6,000 years old for centuries?


You know, I was just about to say that figure wasn't "calculated" until the early 20th-century, but according to Wikipedia, it turns out that even Shakespeare was using it in "As You Like It."

So... huh.
 
2013-06-27 11:38:05 AM  

quietwalker: skozlaw: Christians practically have a building devoted to teaching their beliefs built on every street corner in most parts of the country. But, increasingly, they're having problems getting people to come into them. And it's not like there's any shortage of Christians. The vast majority of Americans are still raised Christian and identify as Christian. So it's Christians that aren't going into the buildings that exist specifically to teach about Christian beliefs.

The utter lack of self-awareness among the people who try to force their beliefs into schools is mind-numbing. You can't even get your own people to listen to your crap in your own house so your solution is to try and force your way into your neighbor's house with lies like a robber pretending to be a magazine seller?

And then you wonder why I'm hostile to you? Really?

Someone else said it, but it has a ring of truth, paraphrased: "I don't think we'd have as many christians if we could just make them read the bible."

Surveys say something like 10% of christians have ever read the book, and even fewer have made it all the way through.  Regardless, many of them are still willing to tell people they have absolute faith in a thing they have no real knowledge of, and to follow anyone who says they were inspired by it, and accept any interpretations out of it as long as they can be used to show how others are wrong.

Basically, they're morons.

Once you make that realization, it's hard to be angry at them.   They're just too dumb to make rational, intelligent choices, and really, the fault is yours for expecting that from them.


Hello, there. How're you today? Good, good.
Define  na'chash for me.
 
2013-06-27 11:39:25 AM  

IdBeCrazyIf: I imagine the inventors of the holodeck a year after its release coming up with a retrofit bayron sweep mechanism because they never factored in the jizz factor.


I always envisioned a kind of steam mop space roomba.  KISS rule and all.
 
2013-06-27 11:39:28 AM  

Great Janitor: huntercr: The Borg as an allegory for Chinese Manufacturing. Discuss.

I see the Borg as an allegory for Socialism/Communism.  No individuals, just the collective whole to the point where the betterment of the state/collective overrides the needs of the individual.  The state/collective is a super nanny state that individuals can not exist outside of it or don't know how to cope outside of it since it provides for all, including jobs, housing and transportation.  Race and religion no longer matters since everyone is now 100% equal, healthcare comes from the state, as does food...or nutrition.  Plus, thought control.  No will or thought may exist that goes against the will of the state/collective.  The ruler of the state/collective is not a commoner, but rather, a person who is simply better than you by birth, class and upbringing in a system that could never allow for anyone not of that birth to lead the state/collective.  All resources obtained are given first to the state/collective, almost in the form of a 100% tax rate.  Doesn't matter if drone 557/8000 discovered said technology, it goes to the state who then gives it to all.

discuss...


The flaw in your reasoning is that many of those statements apply equally to the Federation.
 
2013-06-27 11:43:05 AM  

I Ate Shergar: At the end of the episode, cooler heads prevailed. Though the devout, orthodox spiritual leader wasn't convinced, almost all of her followers realized that science wasn't directly attacking their beliefs. revealed to have stirred the whole thing up on purpose to cause trouble.She actually didn't give a flying crap about any of it and was just trying to get an opportunity to murder a more progressive - and popular - rival.

FTFTFA


I guess it goes to show..  political conflicts are often disguised as religious conflicts.
 
2013-06-27 11:48:51 AM  

Hickory-smoked: Great Janitor: huntercr: The Borg as an allegory for Chinese Manufacturing. Discuss.

I see the Borg as an allegory for Socialism/Communism.  No individuals, just the collective whole to the point where the betterment of the state/collective overrides the needs of the individual.  The state/collective is a super nanny state that individuals can not exist outside of it or don't know how to cope outside of it since it provides for all, including jobs, housing and transportation.  Race and religion no longer matters since everyone is now 100% equal, healthcare comes from the state, as does food...or nutrition.  Plus, thought control.  No will or thought may exist that goes against the will of the state/collective.  The ruler of the state/collective is not a commoner, but rather, a person who is simply better than you by birth, class and upbringing in a system that could never allow for anyone not of that birth to lead the state/collective.  All resources obtained are given first to the state/collective, almost in the form of a 100% tax rate.  Doesn't matter if drone 557/8000 discovered said technology, it goes to the state who then gives it to all.

discuss...

The flaw in your reasoning is that many of those statements apply equally to the Federation.


That is because the Federation is Communist.  But, in the Federation, there is religion (Vulcans, for example), individuality, free will, not all jobs and housing is through the government, healthcare is not 100% provided through the state and technology doesn't have to be surrendered to the state instantly upon discovery.
 
2013-06-27 11:52:27 AM  

fireclown: IdBeCrazyIf: I imagine the inventors of the holodeck a year after its release coming up with a retrofit bayron sweep mechanism because they never factored in the jizz factor.

I always envisioned a kind of steam mop space roomba.  KISS rule and all.


The holodeck works using the same basic technology as the transporter and replicators.  It actually replicates real matter into the holodeck (it's how during Encounter at Farpoint, Wesley managed to fall into a creek and still be wet after exiting the holodeck.  That was regular water.  Complex objects and humanoid characters like Moriarty or the Doctor are a composition of light and force fields, but inanimate objects and materials are straight up replicated matter).

So, when the holodeck is deactivated or items fall outside the walls, they just get beamed out, decompiled, and stored in the matter buffers, the same way regular waste reclamation works.  I don't see any reason why that would work any differently for bodily fluids left behind by crewmen than it would for holodeck-created fluids.  Basically it's self-cleaning by design.
 
2013-06-27 11:55:38 AM  
Finding a middle-ground between creationism and science is silly.  Religion has a purpose, of sorts, but it is in no way related to scientific endeavours.  It's meant to be a balm...a source of solace for many in a world where we all will one day have to deal with the great unknown.

That, and if you finish a scientific mystery with "because God," you close your mind and cheat yourself out of the opportunity to discover even more of the wonders in the universe.
 
2013-06-27 11:58:02 AM  

fireclown: I always envisioned a kind of steam mop space roomba. KISS rule and all.


spoogeanator 5000
 
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