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(Texas Senate)   So is SB5 dead or not? (Confused Brit)   (capitol.state.tx.us) divider line 34
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2387 clicks; posted to FarkUs » on 26 Jun 2013 at 1:58 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
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Archived thread
2013-06-26 01:43:47 PM
20 votes:
The battle to punish women for having sex will never be over.
2013-06-26 02:04:07 PM
5 votes:
What happened (based on reading many news stories) was the Republicans said Wendy Davis was out of order about 15 mins till midnight.

People in the gallery then started screaming let her talk, really loud that delayed the vote.

The vote was taken but it said 12:03 (or something but after midnight)

REPUBLICANS FORGED THE TIME STAMP TO SAY IT WAS BEFORE MIDNIGHT AND POSTED ON THE SITE IT PASSED BEFORE MIDNIGHT.

The Lt. governor said "Hey um no we aren't going to like forge time stamps to get this passed. I declare it didn't pass in time".

And there you go.

I think the Republicans who forged the time stamp should be investigated and thrown out.
2013-06-26 03:08:49 PM
3 votes:

flondrix: max_pooper: The Governor could call another special session but would expend a lot of political capital to do so. If he does, Democratic Senators could go on vacation out of state preventing a quorum.

I thought that the Republicans had enough seats this time that they have a quorum without the Democrats.  The last time the Democrats went out of state to prevent a quorum, it was to prevent the redistricting that would lead to this situation.


The Texas Senate has 32 members, 31 Senators and the Lieutenant Governor who serves as President and casts any tie breaker votes. The State Constitution states that a quorum is 2/3, or 22 members. The Senate is currently made up of 12 Democrats Senators, 19 Republicans Senators and the Republicans Lieutenant Governor. The Democrats have the power to break quorum and prevent votes by leaving the state.
2013-06-26 02:13:00 PM
3 votes:
pbs.twimg.com

Yep...they changed the time stamps.  It blows my mind that they thought they could get away with that considering how many people were paying attention.  Makes me wonder what they get up to when people *aren't* paying attention.
2013-06-26 02:45:26 PM
2 votes:

cendojr: RanDomino: SB5 opponents have no long-term strategy.

There's only so much long term strategy you can have when the side pushing the vote can push the filibuster requirement beyond human limits.  She had an 11 hour filibuster because the senate refused to waive the 24 hour posting delay due to another senator's father's death.  That ain't happening again, and I really don't think you're going to see a 30+ hour filibuster succeed.
Or they can put in Relief Senate President from the start and have him simply refuse to acknowledge the Democrats who want to speak.  Almost worked last night.


You forgot the part where when Perry called the first special session he changed the rules to simple majority (instead of the 2/3) necessary for debate so that he could push this bill, which got no traction during the regular session, through.

It's hard to have a long term strategy when the other side changes the rules and cheats.
2013-06-26 02:31:27 PM
2 votes:

Soup4Bonnie: NightSteel: I didn't get any replies telling me I'd missed any or that any of these were inaccurate.

Merde!  Why'd you have to go do that faster than I could?!!  :P


Je suis désolé?

I loved watching the session last night. It was riveting, at least, as riveting as parliamentary procedure can be. I shook my head over and over at the temporary president's blatant ignoring of the rules, especially giving the floor to someone else out of order *twice in a row*, I paced around my office while the debate happened with the mic shut off, thinking the Dems wouldn't be able to run down the clock and the vote would pass, I grinned to beat all when the gallery started cheering, and I went to bed thinking the whole thing would have to be decided by the courts after the late vote and timestamp changes. I didn't see a summary of all the awful things the president (and temporary president) had done this morning, so I had to write one myself and see if anyone agreed/disagreed.
2013-06-26 02:21:26 PM
2 votes:

Corvus: What happened (based on reading many news stories) was the Republicans said Wendy Davis was out of order about 15 mins till midnight.


That's more or less the condensed version.  I liked this one from the other thread:

Nightsteel 09:43:48 AM
  So, for those of you keeping score at home, I watched the stream last night myself, and here's what I'm remembering:

The Texas Senate's president made at least one awful ruling on germane-ness (talking about sonograms is not germane to the discussion about abortion? Really?); ended the filibuster without a promised vote to the body; improperly ended the filibuster on only two warnings for germane-ness in contravention to Senate rules requiring three, improperly gave the floor to someone else (who made the motion to table) after the ruling was appealed by Watson, and Watson had not yielded, in contravention of Senate rules; improperly gave the floor to someone else in the middle of Watson's 'closing' remarks on his appeal in contravention of Senate rules; improperly entertained motions beyond the appeal in contravention of Senate rules; refused to recognize Democrat senators at critical points in the debate; held at least one and possibly more votes without order on the floor; declared the vote for the bill valid despite occurring after midnight, which, by law, was the end of the session; and finally, in one last 'fark you' to the people of Texas, fraudulently had the Congressional record changed so said vote was recorded before midnight.


Davis, probably rightly so, is getting the lion's share of the credit, but Watson's part was critical to the bill not passing, as well.
2013-06-26 02:12:36 PM
2 votes:

Corvus: I think the Republicans who forged the time stamp should be investigated and thrown out.


I'd go with "arrested and thrown in jail".
2013-06-26 01:41:02 PM
2 votes:
It is dead as far as this special session goes, but the Governor can call another special session at which time the bill would be re-introduced.
2013-06-26 06:05:23 PM
1 votes:

Hollie Maea: As expected, Rick Perry just called them back to session to try again. Well at least it will fark up their summer vacations.


If the Texas Dems are up for it, this plays like gangbusters in the civilized world.  You've got Republicans trying to break laws to get an unconstitutional bill passed, you've got Dems standing up for the rights of women, you've got the GOP hammering away at an issue that they're on the wrong side of history and science of, and it illustrates how bad it is to let the GOP run anything.  If there's the stamina and political will among the Dems, they could be doing very good work filibustering this until the cows come home (and that's even beyond the already good work of sending this bill to the scrap heap).
2013-06-26 05:11:32 PM
1 votes:

Soup4Bonnie: I don't disagree. It could happen. I do think this is Texas and the Republican base will actually support their efforts last night so you bet we're in for another round yeehaw even if nobody is buying their "protect the health of women" crap.


On the other hand, this is a perfect outcome for the Repubs--they can blame this failure on the liberals, and yet still have abortion clinics in-state for when their daughters and/or mistresses get knocked up.

See: The Only Moral Abortion is My Abortion by Joyce Arthur

"I've had several cases over the years in which the anti-abortion patient had rationalized in one way or another that her case was the only exception, but the one that really made an impression was the college senior who was the president of her campus Right-to-Life organization, meaning that she had worked very hard in that organization for several years. As I was completing her procedure, I asked what she planned to do about her high office in the RTL organization. Her response was a wide-eyed, 'You're not going to tell them, are you!?' When assured that I was not, she breathed a sigh of relief, explaining how important that position was to her and how she wouldn't want this to interfere with it."
2013-06-26 04:49:35 PM
1 votes:

RanDomino: max_pooper
but would expend a lot of political capital to do so

So, no actual reason.


Phins
They know this law is unconstitutional and will be thrown out in court.

Then why work so hard to stop it?


The GOP wants it so that they can take it to the SC and challenge Roe v. Wade while the court is weighted heavily with aholes.
2013-06-26 04:34:35 PM
1 votes:
Since governor goodhair can call for special sessions until the bill passes, it's kind of undead. Think of the parrot sketch, but horrible and depressing.
2013-06-26 04:27:47 PM
1 votes:

NightSteel: mjones71822: I am more curious about the breakdowns of the rule violations last night.

I posted this on the other two big threads:

So, for those of you keeping score at home, I watched the stream last night myself, and here's what I'm remembering:

The Texas Senate's president made at least one awful ruling on germane-ness (talking about sonograms is not germane to the discussion about abortion? Really?); ended the filibuster without a promised vote to the body; improperly ended the filibuster on only two warnings for germane-ness in contravention to Senate rules requiring three; improperly gave the floor to someone else (who made the motion to table) after the ruling was appealed by Watson, and Watson had not yielded, in contravention of Senate rules; improperly gave the floor to someone else in the middle of Watson's 'closing' remarks on his appeal in contravention of Senate rules; improperly entertained motions beyond the appeal in contravention of Senate rules; refused to recognize Democrat senators at critical points in the debate; held at least one and possibly more votes without order on the floor; declared the vote for the bill valid despite occurring after midnight, which, by law, was the end of the session; and finally, in one last 'fark you' to the people of Texas, fraudulently had the Congressional record changed so said vote was recorded before midnight.

Did I miss any?


I didn't get any replies telling me I'd missed any or that any of these were inaccurate.


He also demeaned all the women who would have been affected by this bill when he said, "It's been fun, see you soon".
2013-06-26 04:24:51 PM
1 votes:

Mistymtnhop: Please tell me there is a video of this!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWAOI6x8qus
2013-06-26 03:42:20 PM
1 votes:
What happened to this rule:

LIMITATION ON VOTE
Rule 7.25. No vote shall be taken upon the passage of any bill on its 
third reading after the 135th calendar day of a regular session, nor for any 
purpose within the last 24 hours of the session unless it be to correct an error 
therein. It shall require a vote of four-fifths of members present to suspend this 
rule.
Note of Ruling
The 24-hour rule that prohibits a vote on a bill during 
the last 24 hours of a session of the Legislature makes further 
consideration and debate of the bill out of order when the 24th 
hour before final adjournment has arrived (44 S.J. Reg. 1819 
(1935)).
2013-06-26 03:19:12 PM
1 votes:

phalamir: Dig deep in the weeds of Robert's Rules of Order and start a daisy chain of amendments and points of order.


The GOP would just ignore the rules, as they did last night.
2013-06-26 03:13:11 PM
1 votes:
I don't see why the Democrats couldn't create a nesting doll of filibusters.  Dig deep in the weeds of Robert's Rules of Order and start a daisy chain of amendments and points of order.  Then you filibuster each of those separately.  Pick a person for each.  Give them each reams of material that is germane to that point.  The idea being that any one Democrat only has to talk for a couple hours each, then hands off the baton, not by the traditional means, but by letting another one filibuster for the next point in the chain.  Hell, start arguing with each other!  Decide who gets to be the "bad guys", and start a legislative row.  Just lay into each other, complete with appeals to the Rules and discursive nattering.  It might stall out the Republicans by making them want to watch the Democrats "implode".  If the Democrats need pointers, just go find some geeks and ask them about the fine art of stack resolution in MtG - because Heaven knows those farkers can argue not a goddamn thing for hours and hours.
2013-06-26 03:10:58 PM
1 votes:

max_pooper: flondrix: max_pooper: The Governor could call another special session but would expend a lot of political capital to do so. If he does, Democratic Senators could go on vacation out of state preventing a quorum.

I thought that the Republicans had enough seats this time that they have a quorum without the Democrats.  The last time the Democrats went out of state to prevent a quorum, it was to prevent the redistricting that would lead to this situation.

The Texas Senate has 32 members, 31 Senators and the Lieutenant Governor who serves as President and casts any tie breaker votes. The State Constitution states that a quorum is 2/3, or 22 members. The Senate is currently made up of 12 Democrats Senators, 19 Republicans Senators and the Republicans Lieutenant Governor. The Democrats have the power to break quorum and prevent votes by leaving the state.


I wouldn't do that I would just force them to drag my ass there, with a news crew their to watch.

Can you imagine them dragging women congressmen for that vote to happen?
2013-06-26 03:07:08 PM
1 votes:
www.wizardscupboard.com

Bureaucracy - Sometimes it works biatches!!!
2013-06-26 02:58:27 PM
1 votes:
Oh wait, I just realized that I *did* miss one!

Re: sitting down, a filibustering Texas Senator is not allowed to sit down while talking.. but rules do say that a filibustering senator MUST sit down while points of procedure are debated, and allows for the senator to be FORCED to sit down if they do not do so voluntarily. Which was also ignored by the President, who ruled that she could not sit down while points of procedure were debated.

My wording may not be perfect, but I remember this coming up in one or both of last night's threads; there were points where the rules said she had to sit down, but the President ruled that she could not.
2013-06-26 02:51:00 PM
1 votes:

Mikey1969: OK, so one more question: How does Filibuster work in Texas? Everywhere else, as I understand it, they can talk about whatever they want and can't be told to "shut up" and that they are being shut down because they are "off topic". Do they get to do this in Texas?


No.  It was covered in detail in the big thread last night, but the filibuster in the Texas Senate is a lot stricter than even the Mr Smith Goes to Washington style filibuster.  There's no switching out with other senators, there's no bathroom breaks, and you must stay on-topic (germane) or your filibuster gets ended.  You can't even lean on the desk or sit down.
2013-06-26 02:24:28 PM
1 votes:
The next time a Texas Senate Republican grumbles about the gallery and decorum, someone needs to inform them point blank: When you choose to ignore your own rules, other people aren't going to feel particularly bound to them either.
2013-06-26 02:23:13 PM
1 votes:

Mistymtnhop: StubhyGraham: Corvus: What happened (based on reading many news stories) was the Republicans said Wendy Davis was out of order about 15 mins till midnight.

People in the gallery then started screaming let her talk, really loud that delayed the vote.

The vote was taken but it said 12:03 (or something but after midnight)

REPUBLICANS FORGED THE TIME STAMP TO SAY IT WAS BEFORE MIDNIGHT AND POSTED ON THE SITE IT PASSED BEFORE MIDNIGHT.

The Lt. governor said "Hey um no we aren't going to like forge time stamps to get this passed. I declare it didn't pass in time".

And there you go.

I think the Republicans who forged the time stamp should be investigated and thrown out.

That's close, but they ruled her out of order with about an hour and a half to go. After that, Senator Watson, West, and Van De Platte(sic) drew out the rest of the time with parliamentary procedure questions until about fifteen minutes to go. That's when they started the roll call for the vote to table the motion to debate the out of order call (I think I got that part right). Before the roll call started at 11:50, Van De Platte(sic) asked for another parlimentary procedure question, but the chair ignored her so she interrupted the roll call with "At what point must a female senator raise her hand to be recognized over her male colleagues?" The crowd went nuts and cheer for ten minutes straight so they couldn't finish the roll call.

Please tell me there is a video of this!


http://youtu.be/yPntuZ7jmGY

That's where the cheering kicked off for 10m
2013-06-26 02:20:34 PM
1 votes:

RanDomino: Angry Drunk Bureaucrat
It is dead as far as this special session goes, but the Governor can call another special session at which time the bill would be re-introduced.

This. Depending on how it works in Texas they could pass it tomorrow. SB5 opponents have no long-term strategy.


No they can't. Bills can only be passed when the Legislature is in session. The Texas Legislature is a part time and only meets in odd numbered years. The regular session ended quite some time ago and the special session called by the Governor ended last night at midnight. The Governor would have to call another special session, quorum would need to be determined and the bill would need to be reintroduced following all the procedures starting from scratch.

The Governor could call another special session but would expend a lot of political capital to do so. If he does, Democratic Senators could go on vacation out of state preventing a quorum.
2013-06-26 02:19:21 PM
1 votes:

Corvus: Corvus: What happened (based on reading many news stories) was the Republicans said Wendy Davis was out of order about 15 mins till midnight.

People in the gallery then started screaming let her talk, really loud that delayed the vote.

The vote was taken but it said 12:03 (or something but after midnight)

REPUBLICANS FORGED THE TIME STAMP TO SAY IT WAS BEFORE MIDNIGHT AND POSTED ON THE SITE IT PASSED BEFORE MIDNIGHT.

The Lt. governor said "Hey um no we aren't going to like forge time stamps to get this passed. I declare it didn't pass in time".

And there you go.

I think the Republicans who forged the time stamp should be investigated and thrown out.

Sorry for the caps guys but that's such amazing bullshiat I thought it had to be highlighted.


No worries.  If Pelosi had done that, the tea-bagger screeching would be audible in Outer Mongolia.

Ether way, Governor Goodhair (tm Charles Pierce)  will just call another "emergency session" and it'll pass.  One of the cruel ironies is that the filibustering Senator will be redistricted out of an office shortly thanks to Texas's totally non-partisan and totally non-racist district maps.  In the South, the bad guys always win.
2013-06-26 02:16:22 PM
1 votes:
CNN Says yes. St. Pete Times Looking for chads -OR- "hello, I am write single to salute and wait for answer again"
2013-06-26 02:12:48 PM
1 votes:

Corvus: What happened (based on reading many news stories) was the Republicans said Wendy Davis was out of order about 15 mins till midnight.

People in the gallery then started screaming let her talk, really loud that delayed the vote.

The vote was taken but it said 12:03 (or something but after midnight)

REPUBLICANS FORGED THE TIME STAMP TO SAY IT WAS BEFORE MIDNIGHT AND POSTED ON THE SITE IT PASSED BEFORE MIDNIGHT.

The Lt. governor said "Hey um no we aren't going to like forge time stamps to get this passed. I declare it didn't pass in time".

And there you go.

I think the Republicans who forged the time stamp should be investigated and thrown out

. in prison.

FTFY
2013-06-26 02:12:48 PM
1 votes:

Corvus: What happened (based on reading many news stories) was the Republicans said Wendy Davis was out of order about 15 mins till midnight.

People in the gallery then started screaming let her talk, really loud that delayed the vote.

The vote was taken but it said 12:03 (or something but after midnight)

REPUBLICANS FORGED THE TIME STAMP TO SAY IT WAS BEFORE MIDNIGHT AND POSTED ON THE SITE IT PASSED BEFORE MIDNIGHT.

The Lt. governor said "Hey um no we aren't going to like forge time stamps to get this passed. I declare it didn't pass in time".

And there you go.

I think the Republicans who forged the time stamp should be investigated and thrown out.


That's close, but they ruled her out of order with about an hour and a half to go. After that, Senator Watson, West, and Van De Platte(sic) drew out the rest of the time with parliamentary procedure questions until about fifteen minutes to go. That's when they started the roll call for the vote to table the motion to debate the out of order call (I think I got that part right). Before the roll call started at 11:50, Van De Platte(sic) asked for another parlimentary procedure question, but the chair ignored her so she interrupted the roll call with "At what point must a female senator raise her hand to be recognized over her male colleagues?" The crowd went nuts and cheer for ten minutes straight so they couldn't finish the roll call.
2013-06-26 02:12:17 PM
1 votes:

mjones71822: I am more curious about the breakdowns of the rule violations last night.


I posted this on the other two big threads:

So, for those of you keeping score at home, I watched the stream last night myself, and here's what I'm remembering:

The Texas Senate's president made at least one awful ruling on germane-ness (talking about sonograms is not germane to the discussion about abortion? Really?); ended the filibuster without a promised vote to the body; improperly ended the filibuster on only two warnings for germane-ness in contravention to Senate rules requiring three; improperly gave the floor to someone else (who made the motion to table) after the ruling was appealed by Watson, and Watson had not yielded, in contravention of Senate rules; improperly gave the floor to someone else in the middle of Watson's 'closing' remarks on his appeal in contravention of Senate rules; improperly entertained motions beyond the appeal in contravention of Senate rules; refused to recognize Democrat senators at critical points in the debate; held at least one and possibly more votes without order on the floor; declared the vote for the bill valid despite occurring after midnight, which, by law, was the end of the session; and finally, in one last 'fark you' to the people of Texas, fraudulently had the Congressional record changed so said vote was recorded before midnight.

Did I miss any?



I didn't get any replies telling me I'd missed any or that any of these were inaccurate.
2013-06-26 02:08:01 PM
1 votes:

Corvus: What happened (based on reading many news stories) was the Republicans said Wendy Davis was out of order about 15 mins till midnight.

People in the gallery then started screaming let her talk, really loud that delayed the vote.

The vote was taken but it said 12:03 (or something but after midnight)

REPUBLICANS FORGED THE TIME STAMP TO SAY IT WAS BEFORE MIDNIGHT AND POSTED ON THE SITE IT PASSED BEFORE MIDNIGHT.

The Lt. governor said "Hey um no we aren't going to like forge time stamps to get this passed. I declare it didn't pass in time".

And there you go.

I think the Republicans who forged the time stamp should be investigated and thrown out.


Sorry for the caps guys but that's such amazing bullshiat I thought it had to be highlighted.
2013-06-26 02:06:14 PM
1 votes:

Angry Drunk Bureaucrat: It is dead as far as this special session goes, but the Governor can will call another special session at which time the bill would be re-introduced.


FTFY. We all know what that semi-retarded asshole governor is going to do.
2013-06-26 02:00:54 PM
1 votes:
Angry Drunk Bureaucrat
It is dead as far as this special session goes, but the Governor can call another special session at which time the bill would be re-introduced.

This. Depending on how it works in Texas they could pass it tomorrow. SB5 opponents have no long-term strategy.
2013-06-26 01:05:27 PM
1 votes:
It's Schroedinger's Bill right now.
 
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