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(CBS News)   This is it folks, the moment you've all been waiting for. Will the SCOTUS swat down DOMA? Will they overturn Prop 8? Will Batman finally get a chance to marry Robin? This is your "SCOTUS rulings" thread. (Will start whenever Roberts says so)   (cbsnews.com) divider line 539
    More: Spiffy, California Supreme Court, Justice Anthony Kennedy, Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, DOMA, Jan Crawford, United States Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit, same-sex marriages, rights movement  
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1665 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Jun 2013 at 9:40 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-26 08:52:45 AM
Is it bad when politics threads end up becoming indistinguishable from sports threads?

/go team rainbows!!
 
2013-06-26 08:58:39 AM
Please, please, dear lord, or fates, or whatever force that runs the universe, don't let the SCOTUS go full retard today. Let the poor homosexuals and bisexuals have the ability to get married, and have that marriage be recognized by whatever state they live in.

Pretty please.
 
2013-06-26 08:59:03 AM
Win, Lose or Punt it's a big day.
 
2013-06-26 09:25:07 AM
My predictions:

DOMA upheld 5-4 along partisan lines
Prop8 tossed 7-2, possibly 8-1 (Alito and/or Thomas)
 
2013-06-26 09:41:25 AM
If they rule DOMA unconstitutional on the grounds of the establishment clause, that would be pretty huge I think
 
2013-06-26 09:41:29 AM
I maintain my prediction from yesterday:

5 Justice Conservative Majority: Even though Congress duly passed the VRA 7 years ago, in our judgment what they passed is out of date and we need to overturn it.

5 Justice Conservative Majority: We must uphold DOMA because regardless of our personal moral opinions it was a law duly passed by Congress only 17 years ago.
 
2013-06-26 09:42:09 AM

nekom: If they rule DOMA unconstitutional on the grounds of the establishment clause, that would be pretty huge I think


It wouldn't be the establishment clause, it'd be equal protection. I can't imagine it being an establishment clause case.
 
2013-06-26 09:42:14 AM
I predict:

DOMA ruled unconstitutional
Prop 8 ruled to not have standing
Lots of pointless gesture social media pictures.
 
2013-06-26 09:42:15 AM

DamnYankees: I maintain my prediction from yesterday:

5 Justice Conservative Majority: Even though Congress duly passed the VRA 7 years ago, in our judgment what they passed is out of date and we need to overturn it.

5 Justice Conservative Majority: We must uphold DOMA because regardless of our personal moral opinions it was a law duly passed by Congress only 17 years ago.


That would be a rather remarkable double standard.
 
2013-06-26 09:42:36 AM

cman: My predictions:

DOMA upheld 5-4 along partisan lines
Prop8 tossed 7-2, possibly 8-1 (Alito and/or Thomas)


Nah, DOMA down 7-2 using equal protection clause
Prop 8 tossed to lower court 5-4 under states rights
 
2013-06-26 09:44:00 AM

IdBeCrazyIf: cman: My predictions:

DOMA upheld 5-4 along partisan lines
Prop8 tossed 7-2, possibly 8-1 (Alito and/or Thomas)

Nah, DOMA down 7-2 using equal protection clause
Prop 8 tossed to lower court 5-4 under states rights


I hope you're right. But given this SCOTUS, that is highly doubtful.
 
2013-06-26 09:44:40 AM
I think both DOMA and Prop 8 will be upheld.

Roberts reading the decision is not a good sign at all.
 
2013-06-26 09:44:47 AM

DamnYankees: nekom: If they rule DOMA unconstitutional on the grounds of the establishment clause, that would be pretty huge I think

It wouldn't be the establishment clause, it'd be equal protection. I can't imagine it being an establishment clause case.


That's what I meant.  I have no idea why I typed establishment clause.  I think I need more coffee.

But if it's ruled unconstitutional because of equal protection, couldn't the case be made that every state must allow same sex marriage on the same grounds?  I think it would be powerful and important precedent to set.
 
2013-06-26 09:45:35 AM
Fifteen more minutes, folks. www.scotusblog.com for real time updates, by the way.
 
2013-06-26 09:46:15 AM
Yay, I made it. Here with friends at church. Go gay rights!!!
 
2013-06-26 09:46:38 AM

nekom: But if it's ruled unconstitutional because of equal protection, couldn't the case be made that every state must allow same sex marriage on the same grounds?


Depends how narrowly. They might hold it violates the eequal protection clause because being married under federal law has certain unique benefits which can't be denied to people (like immigration or tax stuff for example), and they might not hold that states have the same level of benefits which would require that holding. Don't know.
 
2013-06-26 09:47:39 AM

Funk Brothers: I think both DOMA and Prop 8 will be upheld.

Roberts reading the decision is not a good sign at all.


They said the same thing about healthcare reform.
 
2013-06-26 09:47:39 AM

Peki: Yay, I made it. Here with friends at church. Go gay rights!!!


I read that as "Gay Church" and thought it was weird that they let clubs open at this hour.
 
2013-06-26 09:47:56 AM
No matter which way this swings, I'm not logging into Facebook for at least a month.
 
2013-06-26 09:48:09 AM

Funk Brothers: I think both DOMA and Prop 8 will be upheld.

Roberts reading the decision is not a good sign at all.


Just like Roberts voted to strike down ObamaCare along politic....oh wait, that wasn't him
 
2013-06-26 09:48:40 AM
I am going to gay marry you all... Well that would be kind of big of me.
 
2013-06-26 09:48:44 AM

WTF Indeed: Peki: Yay, I made it. Here with friends at church. Go gay rights!!!

I read that as "Gay Church" and thought it was weird that they let clubs open at this hour.


Honey, gay church is the gym.  It's been open since six.

::Snaps::
 
2013-06-26 09:48:49 AM

genepool lifeboat: No matter which way this swings, I'm not logging into Facebook for at least a month.


That is very good advice
 
2013-06-26 09:49:07 AM
DamnYankees:
Depends how narrowly. They might hold it violates the eequal protection clause because being married under federal law has certain unique benefits which can't be denied to people (like immigration or tax stuff for example), and they might not hold that states have the same level of benefits which would require that holding. Don't know.

True, but then you have issues of due process.  Say I get gay married in Vermont and move to Texas.  Perhaps they'd at least make the conclusion that every state must recognize gay marriages, not necessarily grant them, which would be a de facto win for gays, just go get married in another state.

/I barely understand any of this, just want to see equal rights for all
 
2013-06-26 09:49:19 AM

somedude210: Is it bad when politics threads end up becoming indistinguishable from sports threads?

/go team rainbows!!


Yes.

I was in the mostly Bruins-related threads, and I can say last night's TX session wiped me out this morning.

/Prop 8 upheld initially, but tossed because you can't take away a right
//DOMA goes bye bye
 
2013-06-26 09:49:37 AM

WTF Indeed: Peki: Yay, I made it. Here with friends at church. Go gay rights!!!

I read that as "Gay Church" and thought it was weird that they let clubs open at this hour.


Well, it's a UU church, so you're not necessarily that far off.
 
2013-06-26 09:49:55 AM
So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?
 
2013-06-26 09:50:17 AM
Ok, lets just get one thing out of the way:

If the court determines that the petitioners in Perry v. Hollingsworth (prop 8) lacked standing, this is not a punt.  The standing issue is actually a rather thorny one, and given the similarities between this case and the facts underlying Romer, it is probably the main reason the court picked it up.

Ruling on procedure in such a way as to clarify it is not punting.  If, however, the court held that cert was improvidently granted and just tosses it without analysis, that would be a punt.
 
2013-06-26 09:50:32 AM
As ordained Pagan clergy in my home state, I'm ready to gay marry anyone who wants to stop by the house.  Let's hope I can.
 
2013-06-26 09:50:47 AM

Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?


A forced gay marriage automatically annuls a traditional marriage. No extra paper work or legal proceedings necessary.
 
2013-06-26 09:51:22 AM

Cythraul: Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?

A forced gay marriage automatically annuls a traditional marriage. No extra paper work or legal proceedings necessary.


Is that before or after forced Kenyan abortions?

I always screw the order up
 
2013-06-26 09:51:26 AM
6:3 to overturn. Kennedy and Roberts will join the liberals for their own reasons: Kennedy because he is convinced anti-gay laws are unconstitutional, and Roberts because he doesn't want to go down as on the wrong side of history.

Prop 8 could be narrowly ruled as to apply to California only...
 
2013-06-26 09:51:43 AM

Cythraul: Let the poor homosexuals and bisexuals have the ability to get married, and have that marriage be recognized by whatever state they live in.


If that happens I may be able to make a living as a PI again,  this economy killed the straight divorce market, no assets to argue over.
 
2013-06-26 09:52:05 AM
I predict DOMA upheld along partisan lines and Prop 8 tossed.
 
2013-06-26 09:52:13 AM

cman: Funk Brothers: I think both DOMA and Prop 8 will be upheld.

Roberts reading the decision is not a good sign at all.

Just like Roberts voted to strike down ObamaCare along politic....oh wait, that wasn't him


Isn't he also the one with the lesbian cousin?  He could very well be one of those conservatives that doesn't care about an issue until it affects someone he knows personally.

/I also think he's a wee bit worried about legacy and this will overshadow even the ACA decision from last year
 
2013-06-26 09:52:21 AM

cman: Just like Roberts voted to strike down ObamaCare along politic....oh wait, that wasn't him


Carth: They said the same thing about healthcare reform.

Roberts is a Roman Catholic. He knows homosexuality is immoral according to church teachings and knows he'll uphold both laws. I don't think he wants to get excommunicated over this.
 
2013-06-26 09:52:31 AM

Wind Chimes: As ordained Pagan clergy in my home state, I'm ready to gay marry anyone who wants to stop by the house.  Let's hope I can.


County-issued marriage licences do not work that way!
 
2013-06-26 09:52:41 AM

Cythraul: Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?

A forced gay marriage automatically annuls a traditional marriage. No extra paper work or legal proceedings necessary.


But there is some paperwork involved with adopting your kid away from you, no?
 
2013-06-26 09:52:58 AM

Peki: WTF Indeed: Peki: Yay, I made it. Here with friends at church. Go gay rights!!!

I read that as "Gay Church" and thought it was weird that they let clubs open at this hour.

Well, it's a UU church, so you're not necessarily that far off.


Yep, my UU fellowship is having a big public to-do this afternoon. I hope it's a celebration and not a protest. My whole family is going.

/really wants to be a mother of the groom someday
 
2013-06-26 09:53:20 AM

Cythraul: Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?

A forced gay marriage automatically annuls a traditional marriage. No extra paper work or legal proceedings necessary.


So do we get to pick the gay person we're forced to marry?  I mean my wife is great in lot of ways but I definitely didn't marry her for her house keeping skills... if I gotta get a new spouse I'd like to shore up that weak area with some higher qualifications.
 
2013-06-26 09:53:33 AM
5/4 split. States get to ban it if they want. Feds wont recognize those that allow it.
 
2013-06-26 09:53:52 AM

Three Crooked Squirrels: Cythraul: Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?

A forced gay marriage automatically annuls a traditional marriage. No extra paper work or legal proceedings necessary.

But there is some paperwork involved with adopting your kid away from you, no?


That falls under the homosexual indoctrination clause. There is a bit of paper work to do, but it has to be filled out by the inferior biological parents, under penalty of imprisonment.
 
2013-06-26 09:54:32 AM
What else is on the docket today other than the gay marriage cases?
 
2013-06-26 09:54:37 AM

Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?


According to my Facebook feed, people are only gay because they gave up looking for a hetero partner and it is just easier to find a gay partner, and since a marriage is work gays shouldn't marry.
 
2013-06-26 09:54:39 AM

xaldin: Cythraul: Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?

A forced gay marriage automatically annuls a traditional marriage. No extra paper work or legal proceedings necessary.

So do we get to pick the gay person we're forced to marry?  I mean my wife is great in lot of ways but I definitely didn't marry her for her house keeping skills... if I gotta get a new spouse I'd like to shore up that weak area with some higher qualifications.


Of course we get to pick. I got dibs on Stone Cold Steve Austin. Yes, you read that right.
 
2013-06-26 09:55:19 AM
Funk Brothers:
Roberts is a Roman Catholic. He knows homosexuality is immoral according to church teachings and knows he'll uphold both laws. I don't think he wants to get excommunicated over this.

There are lots of Roman Catholic Democrats who have voted in favor of gay marriage, abortion, etc.  To the best of my knowledge, none of them have ever been excommunicated.
 
2013-06-26 09:55:25 AM

Cythraul: xaldin: Cythraul: Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?

A forced gay marriage automatically annuls a traditional marriage. No extra paper work or legal proceedings necessary.

So do we get to pick the gay person we're forced to marry?  I mean my wife is great in lot of ways but I definitely didn't marry her for her house keeping skills... if I gotta get a new spouse I'd like to shore up that weak area with some higher qualifications.

Of course we get to pick. I got dibs on Stone Cold Steve Austin. Yes, you read that right.


Maybe if he was 20 years younger...
 
2013-06-26 09:55:33 AM
They'll whack DOMA and punt on Prop. 8
 
2013-06-26 09:55:43 AM

xaldin: Cythraul: Carth: So if the court does strike down DOMA when do the forced gay marriages start? Judging by my facebook feed it would be immediate but I think they'd have to annul all the traditional marriages first right?

A forced gay marriage automatically annuls a traditional marriage. No extra paper work or legal proceedings necessary.

So do we get to pick the gay person we're forced to marry?  I mean my wife is great in lot of ways but I definitely didn't marry her for her house keeping skills... if I gotta get a new spouse I'd like to shore up that weak area with some higher qualifications.


OH wait, you're a 'breeder?' Then no, you don't get to pick . Sorry.
 
2013-06-26 09:55:56 AM
I don't know why (because they're usually wrong), but I'm going with the media's prediction that SCOTUS will rule narrowly on DOMA in a way that strikes it down but doesn't kill any other gay marriage bans, such as Prop 8.
 
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