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(Washington Post)   Meet Sigfried Gold, an atheist who credits losing 110 pounds and saving his family with praying three times a day to a "spiritual being" he created that he named "God." "That's a big hole in atheist life. Some atheists are saying, 'Let's fill it.'"   (washingtonpost.com) divider line 216
    More: Interesting, gold, complex question, flavors, appeal  
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5645 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Jun 2013 at 8:59 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-25 11:35:57 AM
Monkeyhouse Zendo:

what you've described is a basic zen meditation intended to clarify the impermanence of thoughts, emotions, and finally of self.

Exactly.  I like Zen because it is simple. Just sit long enough and you'll get there.

Every  honest, true thing is simple.  The more complex a thing is made,  the more difficult it is to find the truth in it and the more likely it becomes that its maker is reaching for your wallet.
 
2013-06-25 11:36:11 AM

Mercutio74: give me doughnuts: How does any of that contradict materialist philosophy?

I was taking materialism to the extreme that Barking Unicorn did... where literally there is nothing but matter and energy.

I'll definitely grant you that the vast, vast majority of materialists happen to care about stuff and what you bolded is consistent with materialism, but if you were to distill materialism down to the most basic description, what other people think or feel doesn't really matter.

Only sociopaths would follow this belief system.


It's good to know the classics never really die. American fundamentalists have been spouting that same tired bullshiat about evolutionists for over a century. Switch up the vocabulary if you like.

It's still "holy crap, do you have to wear a helmet when you go outside?"-level retarded...
 
2013-06-25 11:38:40 AM

BarkingUnicorn: Exactly.  I like Zen because it is simple. Just sit long enough and you'll get there.


Sit even longer and you realize there wasn't anywhere to go.
 
2013-06-25 11:39:46 AM
An "atheist" praying to spiritual being called god? Sorry, this man is a theist, NOT an atheist. He may not a Christian, Muslim, Jew, etc. but he's still a theist i.e. believing in a higher, spiritual being in the complete absence of proof. That is not what an atheist is.

Personally, as an atheist, I don't care if believing in some imaginary figure made him feel better, that won't fly with me. I believe that you shouldn't believe in something just because it makes you feel better about yourself, you should believe in something if you honestly think it is true.

I don't believe in god because I haven't seen anything in this world that would convince me that he/she/it exists. The words of believers certainly doesn't persuade me, the Bible doesn't persuade me, and testimonials regarding miracles and being touched by the holy spirit don't persuade me. That's just how I feel. I don't care if a lie would make me feel better, I cannot deluded myself into believing something I know to be false, it won't fly no matter how much I may want it to. This is why I always thought Pacal's Wager was a BS argument - it only worked if you genuinely believe; if you didn't really believe and went through all the motions just to hedge your bets wouldn't god realize that your faith was completely self-serving and not in fact genuine?

I don't know where I heard this but this argument always resonated with me: Human beings have a great capacity of logical thought and reason. It has helped us understand our world and advance beyond groupings of nomadic tribes wandering the plains and jungles in search of food. Why would a god give us such a gift only to have us completely ignore these abilities when it comes to questioning his/her/its own existence? Why would he/she/it completely hide its existence? Why would we have to take something on faith where our minds tell us that this is not the case. In order words, why would god make us smart but want us to be dumb (i.e. by not questioning his existence, accepting something on faith completely uncritically)? It makes no sense.
 
2013-06-25 11:42:23 AM

Mercutio74: give me doughnuts: At it's most basic description, materialism is the idea that nothing exists but matter, energy, and the interactions between them (at least, that's how I see it).
I really don't see how that could lead to the idea that other people's thoughts and feelings aren't of any importance. I'm missing something here.

Like I say, I don't really believe in that definition, it just seemed to be what Barking Unicorn thought of it.  I think materialism as a basis for understanding of the universe is on good solid footing, but if you take it as all there is to know, it's lacking.

Luckily for us, it doesn't exist in a vaccuum we have philosophy, psychology, evolutionary theory etc, etc, to fill in the gaps and make a complete belief system.  I was just making a point that if Barking Unicorn finds materialists to be terrible people, he must be using a very, very basic definition of materialism... one that excludes how humanity actually behaves.


They're not terrible people; they're unskillful people.  They forego skills that could make them feel better.  It's pathetic, not terrible.
 
2013-06-25 11:43:36 AM

Potter82: An "atheist" praying to spiritual being called god? Sorry, this man is a theist, NOT an atheist. He may not a Christian, Muslim, Jew, etc. but he's still a theist i.e. believing in a higher, spiritual being in the complete absence of proof. That is not what an atheist is.


My higher power is Elvis
 
2013-06-25 11:43:55 AM

Modified Wooden Paper Towel Holder: Man whatever. I am a former non-denominational minister. I was a die hard believer who led prayer meetings, led worship for groups of over 1000, put out Christian CD with my Christian bands - all of this for 25 years. Let me just tell you something: this guy is not an atheist. He's a Christian, who doesn't like tithing, or going to a church, but is too scared to take the full atheistic plunge and walk away from it all because he and his family might wind up in hell for all eternity if he doesn't acknowledge God in some fashion so he still prays. Jeez dude. Go get fat, drink some beer, and enjoy life. The evidence is in our favor.


Huh.  And I thought he was just trying to lose weight and feel better.
 
2013-06-25 11:44:20 AM
As an overweight atheist currently in a 12 step program, I'm getting a kick out of these replies.

/I miss drugs.
//I do not miss my life when I was on drugs.
 
2013-06-25 11:47:11 AM
numbquil:  By definition atheists don't believe in god. I guess you could still believe in supernatural forces which could be spiritual. If you believe in god you are not an atheist though.

By definition atheists don't believe in supernatural forces, whether you call them gods, fairies, or Late-For-Dinner.

It might be possible to be an atheist and believe in astrology, if you were misinformed about the extent of a planet's gravity well. I ain't buyin' it, but I accept that the moon's gravity influences the tides. However IMHO the alleged rough correlation between the menstrual cycle and the moon is just an example of "sometimes shiat happens."

E.g., I found a studly on lunar and menstrual phase locking that "proved" they're linked because out of 312 carefully chosen female college students 68 reported their menstrual cycles coincided with the moon's phases. Of those 68, 47 said they got their periods when the moon looked big.

In other words, 21.79487% of those participants said their periods came during the same two weeks of the lunar month, and 69.11764% of those (47 participants, i.e. 15.064102564102564 of the total) said their periods came in the two weeks when the moon looked bigger. So 21 participants, or 6.730769% of the total, reported their periods came when the moon looked smaller. And 244/312 of the participants, 78.2051282051282%, failed to find (or imagine) any definite correlation between their menstrual cycles and the lunar ones.

If only 21.794871795% (68) of the 312 participants supported the conclusion you're trumpeting, and they were divided 47-21 on which half of the lunar cycle that was, what have you proven? Besides that you've wasted the funders' money, I mean.

~22% looks pretty random to me, especially considering that that 22% itself fell into two categories.

Will somebody who at least graduated the 8th grade and/or studied statistics explain this to me? Is there something I'm missing or some math I've done wrong?

Or maybe the Onion must hacked PubMed?
 
2013-06-25 11:47:26 AM

Monkeyhouse Zendo: BarkingUnicorn: Exactly.  I like Zen because it is simple. Just sit long enough and you'll get there.

Sit even longer and you realize there wasn't anywhere to go.


Maybe next lifetime.  :-)

The big advantage of belief in reincarnation is the peace that comes with knowing you cannot fail.  Christians have only one shot at salvation; that creates the ultimate "test anxiety."
 
2013-06-25 11:49:24 AM

BarkingUnicorn: I like Zen because it is simple.


It's simple but hoo boy is it easy to misunderstand.  To most people it might as well be as complex as general relativity.

I liken Zen to walking across a frozen river having no idea how thick the ice is.  The destination is absurdly simple to comprehend, the ice could be three feet thick for all you know and most people get that getting there safely involves staying calm, but it's by no means easy and half the problem is your brain imagining what the ice is.
 
2013-06-25 11:51:47 AM

Bumblefark: It's good to know the classics never really die. American fundamentalists have been spouting that same tired bullshiat about evolutionists for over a century. Switch up the vocabulary if you like.

It's still "holy crap, do you have to wear a helmet when you go outside?"-level retarded...


Yeah, I've always found there's a level of surprise when you point out that basic morality existed before Christianity (unless you're talking to a young earth Creationist, then it's just useless) and that more or less the idea of murder and theft being bad was universal among early historic man.   Even more interesting when you show evidence of altruism among pre-historic man.
 
2013-06-25 11:55:08 AM

BarkingUnicorn: The big advantage of belief in reincarnation is the peace that comes with knowing you cannot fail.  Christians have only one shot at salvation; that creates the ultimate "test anxiety."


Rebirth isn't reincarnation.

The One True TheDavid: 15.064102564102564

Significant figures are your friend.
 
2013-06-25 11:55:48 AM

JRoo: [i21.photobucket.com image 250x250]


Gracious. I've found a new nightmare.
 
2013-06-25 11:58:20 AM

The One True TheDavid: By definition atheists don't believe in supernatural forces, whether you call them gods, fairies, or Late-For-Dinner.


No.

Atheists do not believe in a god. That's it. They can, and many do, have irrational beliefs in things like ghosts, spirits, aliens, ect.

Materialists do not believe in anything supernatural. Atheist and Materialist are not synonymous but are somewhat related.
 
2013-06-25 12:02:49 PM

pkellmey: Wow, there's 2 of them in the world.

CSB
I went to college with someone who was born in an atheistic household and never had any inclination to be anything other than an atheist. He began "praying to no one" as an experiment in his freshman year and enjoyed it so much that he created a daily schedule of prayer times "to no one in particular" and found it to be the most fulfilling experience he had ever had in his life. He believed it was much better than when he had tried yoga for a year.


This makes perfect sense to me. There is a lump of neural matter which creates the illusion of a spiritual existence (just as other lumps of neural matter create the illusions of love, triangles, koalas, the necessity to poop...). Since this structure is there, one might as well use it for something. Typically, I find it handy to use it for taking a broad perspective of things, settling the mind, getting on with things despite apparent hardship etc.

I'm perfectly aware there's no divinity or divinities.
 
2013-06-25 12:06:55 PM

Potter82: I believe that you shouldn't believe in something just because it makes you feel better about yourself, you should believe in something if you honestly think it is true.


it's all about the feeling better.  Truth is unconcerned with you and you have no effect upon truth.
 
2013-06-25 12:08:11 PM

Modified Wooden Paper Towel Holder: Man whatever. I am a former non-denominational minister. I was a die hard believer who led prayer meetings, led worship for groups of over 1000, put out Christian CD with my Christian bands - all of this for 25 years. Let me just tell you something: this guy is not an atheist. He's a Christian, who doesn't like tithing, or going to a church, but is too scared to take the full atheistic plunge and walk away from it all because he and his family might wind up in hell for all eternity if he doesn't acknowledge God in some fashion so he still prays. Jeez dude. Go get fat, drink some beer, and enjoy life. The evidence is in our favor.


He is acknowledging that some religious practices can help him lose weight and achieve better mental health.  He is actively forsaking Jesus Christ and the mythology that accompanies Christianity, which is specifically forbidden in the Christian church.  If he were a "secret" Christion, he would know that is exactly your ticket to eternal hell.
 
2013-06-25 12:15:39 PM
Potter82: I don't know where I heard this but this argument always resonated with me: Human beings have a great capacity of logical thought and reason. It has helped us understand our world and advance beyond groupings of nomadic tribes wandering the plains and jungles in search of food.

Why would a god give us such a gift only to have us completely ignore these abilities when it comes to questioning his/her/its own existence?


Why do we have to ignore logic, thought, and science to claim belief in God?  Or should I say how does claiming belief translate into ignoring logic, thought, or science?  Not all things are currently understood or can be explained by our current level of knowledge.  Perhaps we're just not there yet to understand God.

Why would he/she/it completely hide its existence?

Maybe he's not.  Maybe we're ignoring his existence or not searching hard enough (or in the right ways).  Or maybe revealing himself to us while we were corporeal would negate the whole purpose of our existence in this state (i.e. screw up the experiment, if you will).

Why would we have to take something on faith where our minds tell us that this is not the case. In order words, why would god make us smart but want us to be dumb (i.e. by not questioning his existence, accepting something on faith completely uncritically)? It makes no sense.

I don't think it's God making us smart and expecting us to be dumb.  I think it's okay that we question things, but I wonder if we're actually questioning things with the right attitude.  We're expecting all the answers to work out our way on our schedules.  Perhaps taking things on faith is a part of what we are supposed to do until we mature, develop, evolve, etc. and can find the answers we seek.  As a child, I took it on faith that eating nasty vegetables was good for me because my parents said it was so.  I certainly disagreed and felt that was not the case.  But it's not like I had all the knowledge about health and nutrition to make that judgment.  If I had my way, it'd have been corn dogs and Reese's cups every meal.  In the end, they were right, and all my protests to the contrary didn't mean anything.

You ask a lot of good questions.  My responses are only some possible answers.  I could be wrong.  Keep thinking about those things, and maybe you'll come up with some answers which make sense to you.
 
2013-06-25 12:19:54 PM

dragonchild: BarkingUnicorn: I like Zen because it is simple.

It's simple but hoo boy is it easy to misunderstand.  To most people it might as well be as complex as general relativity.

I liken Zen to walking across a frozen river having no idea how thick the ice is.  The destination is absurdly simple to comprehend, the ice could be three feet thick for all you know and most people get that getting there safely involves staying calm, but it's by no means easy and half the problem is your brain imagining what the ice is.


The destination is  not Zen; it's Enlightenment.  Enlightenment is not understood; it is realized.  Why should the Path (Zen) be understood when the destination is not?

Just sit.  That is the Path.
 
2013-06-25 12:25:34 PM

Mercutio74: Bumblefark: It's good to know the classics never really die. American fundamentalists have been spouting that same tired bullshiat about evolutionists for over a century. Switch up the vocabulary if you like.

It's still "holy crap, do you have to wear a helmet when you go outside?"-level retarded...

Yeah, I've always found there's a level of surprise when you point out that basic morality existed before Christianity (unless you're talking to a young earth Creationist, then it's just useless) and that more or less the idea of murder and theft being bad was universal among early historic man.   Even more interesting when you show evidence of altruism among pre-historic man.


Well, yeah...they're going to be surprised. The only way a person can possibly achieve that level of self-fellating bigotry is to turn a blind eye to the world of observable events -- and then demonize any belief system that takes a central interest in said world, just for good measure. It's why sanctimonious assholes also tend to be some of the most insidiously anti-scientific and intellectually dishonest people you're going to stumble across. They have to be. There is simply nothing in objective reality that is going validate their worldview...so, they look elsewhere.

Usually, it begins with some tortured exercise in definitional reasoning, one that proceeds from violence to the plain meanings of everyday words. And, like every variety of sophistry since, well, the sophists, all you actually find when you untangle their hot mess of poor logic and hasty proclamations is one grand exercise in tautology and sleight-of-mouth.

/but, hey, I don't want to step on anybody's game, here...
 
2013-06-25 12:28:48 PM

BarkingUnicorn: dragonchild: BarkingUnicorn: I like Zen because it is simple.

It's simple but hoo boy is it easy to misunderstand.  To most people it might as well be as complex as general relativity.

I liken Zen to walking across a frozen river having no idea how thick the ice is.  The destination is absurdly simple to comprehend, the ice could be three feet thick for all you know and most people get that getting there safely involves staying calm, but it's by no means easy and half the problem is your brain imagining what the ice is.

The destination is  not Zen; it's Enlightenment.  Enlightenment is not understood; it is realized.  Why should the Path (Zen) be understood when the destination is not?

Just sit.  That is the Path.


Don't just do something, sit there.
 
2013-06-25 12:30:23 PM

BarkingUnicorn: The destination is not Zen; it's Enlightenment. Enlightenment is not understood; it is realized. Why should the Path (Zen) be understood when the destination is not? Just sit. That is the Path.


This is the Zen equivalent of putting a religious bumper sticker on your car and calling yourself a devout Christian.
 
2013-06-25 12:31:50 PM

GilRuiz1: Eighteen percent of atheists say religion has some importance in their life, 26 percent say they are spiritual or religious and 14 percent believe in "God or a universal spirit." Of all Americans who say they don't believe in God - not all call themselves "atheists" - 12 percent say they pray.

Very interesting.


if someone was a pacifist, but couldn't go outside without being swarmed by people beating them with nightsticks, that pacifist would still attribute some importance to nightsticks in their life. it doesn't mean they particularly like nightsticks, or are happy they exist; but when they are constantly surrounded by nightstick wielding assholes who will take any chance to deliver a beating, the nightsticks do have an impact.
 
2013-06-25 12:34:26 PM
Nope, no hole in my life.

/not any that I can't just fill right up with cock, anyway
 
2013-06-25 12:42:09 PM

BarkingUnicorn: Mercutio74: Also, FTFA:

Atheists deny religion's claim of a supernatural god but are starting to look more closely at the "very real effect" that practices such as going to church, prayer and observance of a Sabbath have on the lives of the religious, said Paul Fidalgo, a spokesman for the secular advocacy group the Center for Inquiry. "That's a big hole in atheist life," he said. "Some atheists are saying, 'Let's fill it.' Others are saying, 'Let's not.' "

That's an interesting claim.  I'm an atheist and have been since about grade 3.  I wonder if the "hole" this guy (who I guess is an "expert" on atheists?) talks about is easily filled by volunteering your time to a cause and/or belonging to some kind of social organization.  I really don't know any fellow non-believers who say, "You know what we need?  Social interaction bound together by pointless ritual!"

You don't know any non-believers who play golf, video games, or beer pong?  None who get together to watch The Game on TV?  None who attend concerts together?  Everyone eats alone?


He said pointless ritual.
 
2013-06-25 12:43:43 PM

BarkingUnicorn: This  thread is further testimony that strict materialists are the most shallow, closed-minded, unaware, and miserable of humans.


What are you even talking about anymore?
 
2013-06-25 12:44:45 PM

FarkinHostile: The One True TheDavid:

By definition atheists don't believe in supernatural forces, whether you call them gods, fairies, or Late-For-Dinner.

No.

Atheists do not believe in a god. That's it. They can, and many do, have irrational beliefs in things like ghosts, spirits, aliens, ect.

Materialists do not believe in anything supernatural. Atheist and Materialist are not synonymous but are somewhat related.


Ah. Okay. Point taken. I humbly bow to your more arrant pederasty.

Can someone be a Materialist and a God-believer?
 
2013-06-25 12:45:52 PM

BarkingUnicorn: Infernalist: BarkingUnicorn: This  thread is further testimony that strict materialists are the most shallow, closed-minded, unaware, and miserable of humans.

I'm a secular humanist, thank you.

No, thank you!  I collect non sequiturs.


Ahh, talking about yourself. That makes sense now.
 
2013-06-25 12:47:14 PM

bluefox3681: Alonjar: As an atheist, I must say I am highly confident that I would lead a much happier more fulfilling life if I could convince myself that there was a god, my place in the universe was "meant to be",  and that I should be doing things for a higher purpose than stimulating my bodies receptors until they cease to function.

Oh well.

You see, that's the rub.  Who are you then to try and change someone that does believe those things and as you put it "leads a much happier more fullfilling life."?  Who are you to try and steal someone's purpose and happiness?

This is why a lot of atheists religionists come off as smug douche bags.

 
2013-06-25 12:50:48 PM

The One True TheDavid: FarkinHostile: The One True TheDavid:

By definition atheists don't believe in supernatural forces, whether you call them gods, fairies, or Late-For-Dinner.

No.

Atheists do not believe in a god. That's it. They can, and many do, have irrational beliefs in things like ghosts, spirits, aliens, ect.

Materialists do not believe in anything supernatural. Atheist and Materialist are not synonymous but are somewhat related.

Ah. Okay. Point taken. I humbly bow to your more arrant pederasty.

Can someone be a Materialist and a God-believer?


Nietzsche tried it, with mixed results.
 
2013-06-25 12:52:25 PM

The One True TheDavid: FarkinHostile: The One True TheDavid:

By definition atheists don't believe in supernatural forces, whether you call them gods, fairies, or Late-For-Dinner.

No.

Atheists do not believe in a god. That's it. They can, and many do, have irrational beliefs in things like ghosts, spirits, aliens, ect.

Materialists do not believe in anything supernatural. Atheist and Materialist are not synonymous but are somewhat related.

Ah. Okay. Point taken. I humbly bow to your more arrant pederasty.

Can someone be a Materialist and a God-believer?


I thought that was the norm. Anybody got a figure on the net value of the Vatican these days?
 
2013-06-25 12:52:26 PM

Monkeyhouse Zendo: Weaver95: I'm sticking with paganism. There is a lot less guilt involved

Pagans are the hipsters of religion.

[25.media.tumblr.com image 400x496]


if i could do half of what i said.  i would sleep safe in your bed.  -Mesh
 
2013-06-25 12:55:32 PM
dragonchild:

I liken Zen to walking across a frozen river having no idea how thick the ice is.  The destination is absurdly simple to comprehend, the ice could be three feet thick for all you know and most people get that getting there safely involves staying calm

If the ice is too thin to support your calm weight you better hope it's a shallow calm river you calmly fall into.

If I had to cross I'd scurry over as lightly and quickly as I could, but walking gingerly instead of running because running makes your foot land more forcefully.
  It'd be more like me to wait till it thawed though. "Nothing matters very much..."
 
2013-06-25 12:59:07 PM
PartTimeBuddha:

There is a lump of neural matter which creates the illusion of a spiritual existence (just as other lumps of neural matter create the illusions of love, triangles, koalas, the necessity to poop...).

Needing to poop is an illusion for you? Not "pressure that turns out to be gas," but needing to poop?

I'd like to find the lump of matter that would convince me I'm healthy, happy, gorgeous and brilliant. And it'd be greart to be able to convince at least $15 of this town's hot coeds of the latter two somehow.
 
2013-06-25 01:00:51 PM
Atheism is a Religion.
 
2013-06-25 01:04:03 PM
As a former christian and now atheist, I can see this guy as continuing a cultural tradition.  He acknowledges his "being" is fake, but it provides him with a focus; though he does keep his mind open if the facts are to change.  This type of "spiritual" behavior ,as has been previously pointed out, can have positive influences.  It can also provide a sense of connection to the greater society that looks down upon Atheists as lower than anyone who believes in a god.  This connection to the culture was given in the book, "Little Book of Atheist Spirituality". An interesting book, especially for the non-introverted and isolated in the atheist community.
ecx.images-amazon.com
 
2013-06-25 01:15:56 PM
Maybe he spent all his time praying instead of eating.
 
2013-06-25 01:19:27 PM

letrole: Atheism is a Religion.


i1324.photobucket.com
 
2013-06-25 01:22:15 PM

Babwa Wawa: Also known as meditation, which also does not require faith in the supernatural.


I think this is more visualization than meditation.

When I'm swimming, I like to visualize that there's a shark in the water coming after me and I need to make every stroke and kick count or I won't make it in time. It's given me some fantastic mile times (for a crappy swimmer), and sometimes it's real enough that I catch myself wanting to look back.
 
2013-06-25 01:25:14 PM

The One True TheDavid: Ah. Okay. Point taken. I humbly bow to your more arrant pederasty.


I never touched that boy.

But seriously, it is a very common misconception that atheists are total rationalist/materialistic when many have irrational beliefs like luck, karma, ect. One can be an atheist and be a complete nutjob in other ways than religious belief.
 
2013-06-25 01:39:17 PM

letrole: Atheism is a Religion.


0/10.  I award you no points, and may the imaginary weight loss goddess have mercy on your soul.
 
2013-06-25 01:49:43 PM

FTFA: Eighteen percent of atheists say religion has some importance in their life, 26 percent say they are spiritual or religious and 14 percent believe in "God or a universal spirit."

14% percent of atheists believe in god or a universal spirit?!?!?

i218.photobucket.com
 
2013-06-25 01:53:56 PM
You non-believers can scoff all you want but he does exist!
4.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-06-25 01:57:55 PM

Alonjar: I'm actually agnostic, but I almost never use the word because I find when I mention that I am agnostic, both religious and atheist people turn and combine their outrage together at me.


The only reason for an atheist to get in your face about claiming to be agnostic is to correct you if you think that agnosticism has anything to do with belief in gods.  "Agnostic" is not a "middle position" between theist and atheist.  Most atheists just don't bother with self-applying the term agnostic, because it's assumed.

NostroZ: I find it emotionally lazy and intellectually dishonest to be an atheist, since one cannot posit a certainty (there is no G-d) of a metaphysical concept.


If any more than some tiny obscure fraction of atheists actually made that claim, you might have a point.  I find it intellectually dishonest to purposely misstate your opponent's position, myself.

Mystery Vortex: The ironic thing is that they don't realize that by mocking and tearing people down, they're being just as bad as the hardcore Christians they claim to be nothing like.


Right.

"I believe the Earth is flat, and I just passed a law making it illegal for anyone to teach children otherwise!"
"Actually, there's considerable evidence that it's round.  Here are some pictures from space, and a circumnavigation record."
"Why are you mocking me and tearing me down?!"
 
2013-06-25 02:26:08 PM

Mercutio74: I actually agree with this. If you're the strictest of materialists, you really have no rational excuse to be anything but a sociopath.


Not that Materialism isn't a pretty flawed view of the universe (overly specific in its claims of categorization in the light of ), but that's a pretty enormous question you're begging there.  Philosophical naturalism, utilitarianism, and secular humanism (and many other secular moral philosophies) do not require the existence of anything but matter and energy.  The idea that morality is irrational or can only be derived from supernatural sources is one of the more insidious lies pushed by the religious.
 
2013-06-25 02:28:33 PM
oops, that was supposed to be "in the light of things like modern physics"
 
2013-06-25 02:34:53 PM

Monkeyhouse Zendo: God hates amputees.


Seeing that the word wasn't even coined until the early 20th century, it's kind of silly to look for references to it in The Bible. Don't let that stop you though....
 
2013-06-25 02:47:29 PM
so in other words he believe in 'God'.
OK.
 
2013-06-25 02:50:25 PM

Bumblefark: Cool.

Wanna hear my thoughts on what makes a person an sanctimonious asshole?


Again?  I just read it, twice, man.

The My Little Pony Killer: What are you even talking about anymore?


Ooh, Pick me!

Umm...  His Staggering Superiority Complex?

Did I win?
 
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