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(Mother Jones)   Not content with how angry the US is with them already, Wikileaks resorts to "neener neener suck my weiner"   (motherjones.com) divider line 143
    More: Dumbass, WikiLeaks, United States, Espionage Act, Center for Constitutional Rights, Rafael Correa, People of the United States, Russian Government, resorts  
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2384 clicks; posted to Politics » on 24 Jun 2013 at 1:43 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-24 01:47:21 PM
Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?
 
2013-06-24 01:53:00 PM
neversubmit:

Who writes stupid screeds as if the world was a simple child's plaything? Who expects the president to be an all powerful demigod? Who likely has great difficult tying his own shoes, even at this advanced age?

Mysteries, I tell you.
 
2013-06-24 01:53:36 PM

neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?


Aren't you just precious? "He didn't live completely up to what I think his campaign slogan meant! TRAITOR!"
 
2013-06-24 01:58:14 PM

neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?


maybe we can get Wal-Mart to get a return on Obama, they're pretty lax about that sort of thing
 
2013-06-24 01:59:55 PM
Save Freedom?

i.imgur.com

posting this image will get you jailed in China.
 
2013-06-24 02:05:54 PM

DarnoKonrad: Save Freedom?

[i.imgur.com image 300x198]

posting this image will get you jailed in China.


Posting this image will get your arrested in Germany.

image.blingee.com

FREEDOM ISN'T FREE!
 
2013-06-24 02:06:49 PM
IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.
 
2013-06-24 02:10:52 PM

Marcus Aurelius: DarnoKonrad: Save Freedom?

[i.imgur.com image 300x198]

posting this image will get you jailed in China.

Posting this image will get your arrested in Germany.

[image.blingee.com image 302x400]

FREEDOM ISN'T FREE!


Posting this image will get you arrested in Boston:

www.sports-logos-screensavers.com
 
2013-06-24 02:11:27 PM

qorkfiend: Aren't you just precious? "He didn't live completely up to what I think his campaign slogan meant! TRAITOR!"


Obama Has Charged More Under Espionage Act Than All Other Presidents Combined

Is going quite a bit farther than not living up to a campaign slogan.
 
2013-06-24 02:12:24 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.


If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!
 
2013-06-24 02:13:20 PM

Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!


Which laws has the government broken?
 
2013-06-24 02:14:01 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.


The Obama administration leaks classified information continuously. They do it to glorify the President, or manipulate public opinion, or even to help produce a pre-election propaganda film about the Osama bin Laden raid. The Obama administration does not hate unauthorized leaks of classified information. They are more responsible for such leaks than anyone.

It's not wrong when they do it?
 
2013-06-24 02:14:49 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.


GIS for "tyrantosaur" is disappointing

i53.photobucket.com

www.strangecosmos.com
 
2013-06-24 02:15:18 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?


If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.
 
2013-06-24 02:15:41 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.


Hero's a bit of a stretch, but I don't think the public is better served by a bloated overzealous security apparatus. That is exactly the sort of thing that leads to abuses of power. The resources devoted to watching our own citizens could be better applied elsewhere.
 
2013-06-24 02:17:36 PM

neversubmit: qorkfiend: Aren't you just precious? "He didn't live completely up to what I think his campaign slogan meant! TRAITOR!"

Obama Has Charged More Under Espionage Act Than All Other Presidents Combined

Is going quite a bit farther than not living up to a campaign slogan.


Couldn't have anything to do with the increasing ubiquity of the internet and social media making it easier for people to leak shiat or anything, right?
 
2013-06-24 02:18:57 PM

Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?

If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.


For good or bad, everything the NSA has done is legal.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-06-24 02:19:30 PM

neversubmit: But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?


Who is Vladimir Putin , Alex?
 
2013-06-24 02:19:34 PM

UrukHaiGuyz: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

Hero's a bit of a stretch, but I don't think the public is better served by a bloated overzealous security apparatus. That is exactly the sort of thing that leads to abuses of power. The resources devoted to watching our own citizens could be better applied elsewhere.


That's a valid debate, and no one uses hero or traitor to describe the sides of it. Maybe shiatting in the sandbox and running away for an extradition-fighting holiday was not the way to go about it.
 
2013-06-24 02:20:10 PM

Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?

If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.


So none, then.
 
2013-06-24 02:20:28 PM

LordJiro: neversubmit: qorkfiend: Aren't you just precious? "He didn't live completely up to what I think his campaign slogan meant! TRAITOR!"

Obama Has Charged More Under Espionage Act Than All Other Presidents Combined

Is going quite a bit farther than not living up to a campaign slogan.

Couldn't have anything to do with the increasing ubiquity of the internet and social media making it easier for people to leak shiat or anything, right?


The internet made me do it? LOL Or is it the police state that made them do it?
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-06-24 02:20:55 PM

neversubmit: The Obama administration leaks classified information continuously. They do it to glorify the President, or manipulate public opinion, or even to help produce a pre-election propaganda film about the Osama bin Laden raid. The Obama administration does not hate unauthorized leaks of classified information. They are more responsible for such leaks than anyone.

It's not wrong when they do it?


Be fair.  The Bush Admin. did that to... or do we forget?

ww1.prweb.com
 
2013-06-24 02:21:25 PM

qorkfiend: neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?

Aren't you just precious? "He didn't live completely up to what I think his campaign slogan meant! TRAITOR!"


He has a point, though. Obama railed against the Bush administration's policies, and then quietly extended and exploited them once in office.

We are not angry enough with our elected leaders for what has amounted to an erosion of our rights and freedoms, for well over a decade now. It's been 12 years since 2001 - when, exactly, does the USA PATRIOT Act (a supposedly temporary bit of law) completely expire? When does the TSA go away? When do we decide that the cost of our alleged security is far more expensive than the actual security purchased with it? That's part of what Obama was selling, and, let's face it, he's not delivering it - he seems content to continue with Gitmo, with the TSA, with the "no-fly lists" and the secret warrants and the domestic surveillance.

In short, when do we stop being afraid - of terrorism, of fascism, of our own government?
 
2013-06-24 02:21:35 PM

d23: neversubmit: But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?

Who is Vladimir Putin , Alex?


Vlad ran on hope and change? fuuuuuu
 
2013-06-24 02:22:28 PM

LordJiro: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?

If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.

For good or bad, everything the NSA has done is legal.


You are correct.  It was AT&T and Verizon that broke federal wiretap laws several million times before Congress let them off the hook back in 2007.
 
2013-06-24 02:22:53 PM

LordJiro: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?

If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.

For good or bad, everything the NSA has done is legal.


If so, why is there a problem with the public knowing that the government is watching their every communication?  Could it be that, legal or not, the concept is unacceptable to anyone fully aware of it?
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-06-24 02:23:09 PM
i.dailymail.co.uk
 
2013-06-24 02:24:17 PM

neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?


Mmhmm, yes. Because we all remember that glorious time of prosperity, justice, health and wealth that America experienced right before that big traitor Barrack HUSSEIN Obama took office.

/if I rolled my eyes any harder they would fall out of my head
 
2013-06-24 02:24:32 PM
There's less to this than meets the eye.
 
2013-06-24 02:25:20 PM

Lexx: LordJiro: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?

If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.

For good or bad, everything the NSA has done is legal.

If so, why is there a problem with the public knowing that the government is watching their every communication?  Could it be that, legal or not, the concept is unacceptable to anyone fully aware of it?


We knew. We knew back in 2006. Congress knew.

What didn't happen until recently was no NSA staffer took off for parts unknown and started blabbing state secrets to China for the attention.
 
2013-06-24 02:26:12 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: UrukHaiGuyz: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

Hero's a bit of a stretch, but I don't think the public is better served by a bloated overzealous security apparatus. That is exactly the sort of thing that leads to abuses of power. The resources devoted to watching our own citizens could be better applied elsewhere.

That's a valid debate, and no one uses hero or traitor to describe the sides of it. Maybe shiatting in the sandbox and running away for an extradition-fighting holiday was not the way to go about it.


That's the thing, though, there wasn't really much of a debate before Snowden shat the bed. I think that's where most of his support is coming from-people who wanted an honest debate about the role of our security agencies, but lacked any traction because most Americans took the "don't know, don't care" approach to the NSA, TSA, CIA, etc. after 9/11.
 
2013-06-24 02:26:42 PM

LasersHurt: neversubmit:

Who writes stupid screeds as if the world was a simple child's plaything? Who expects the president to be an all powerful demigod? Who likely has great difficult tying his own shoes, even at this advanced age?

Mysteries, I tell you.


Indeed. It's like when Obama said he'd send forces into Pakistan if there was reason to think elements within Pakistan were supportive of or at least complicit with terrorist organizations and he does exactly that, he's totally breaking his campaign promises. Or something. *takes a bong rip*

It's almost like the GOP intentionally fostered an impossibly idealistic, naively simple concept of what Obama stands/stood for during the election with the idea that no one who wasn't an idiot would try to live up to their unrealistic standards and when Obama performed his elected duties like a responsible adult without brain damage, he's a total failure. Good thing the Republicans etc. weren't hoping to manipulate the Blah Guy's powerbase by sowing FUD and uncritical people are happy to lap it up or anything.

I think I might have used too much meta-sarcasm there.
 
2013-06-24 02:27:14 PM

neversubmit: LordJiro: neversubmit: qorkfiend: Aren't you just precious? "He didn't live completely up to what I think his campaign slogan meant! TRAITOR!"

Obama Has Charged More Under Espionage Act Than All Other Presidents Combined

Is going quite a bit farther than not living up to a campaign slogan.

Couldn't have anything to do with the increasing ubiquity of the internet and social media making it easier for people to leak shiat or anything, right?

The internet made me do it? LOL Or is it the police state that made them do it?


The internet made it easier to leak. More leaks = more espionage charges.

I'm not defending it; the surveillance state is bullshiat, but pretending the NSA collecting every bit of data they can get their hands on is anything new means you haven't been paying attention. It's here, and it's not going away, no matter who we elect. Third parties included, because even if one takes the Presidency AND still wants to get rid of the NSA, they'd have to get past Congress.
 
2013-06-24 02:27:39 PM

FormlessOne: He has a point, though. Obama railed against the Bush administration's policies, and then quietly extended and exploited them once in office.


No he didn't.  How do people forget what Bush, and his lawyer Jon Yoo were claiming?  Crazy sweeping powers.  They were spying without FISA warrants, they were torturing and imprisoning people outside the bounds of domestic and international law -- all the while claiming the president could do *anything* he wanted.  Obama is not claiming such powers, nor exercising such power.
 
2013-06-24 02:28:30 PM

d23: neversubmit: The Obama administration leaks classified information continuously. They do it to glorify the President, or manipulate public opinion, or even to help produce a pre-election propaganda film about the Osama bin Laden raid. The Obama administration does not hate unauthorized leaks of classified information. They are more responsible for such leaks than anyone.

It's not wrong when they do it?

Be fair.  The Bush Admin. did that to... or do we forget?

[ww1.prweb.com image 850x1275]


So When Will Dick Cheney Be Charged With Espionage?

While Cheney wasn't the one whose phone call revealed this information, he set in train the events whereby it became well known. (Because Cheney's staff had Plame's information sitting around in plain sight, Armitage discovered it and then was responsible for the leak, but he only scooped Libby and Rove, who had been trying to get someone in the press to run with the Plame story.
 
2013-06-24 02:30:06 PM

neversubmit: d23: neversubmit: The Obama administration leaks classified information continuously. They do it to glorify the President, or manipulate public opinion, or even to help produce a pre-election propaganda film about the Osama bin Laden raid. The Obama administration does not hate unauthorized leaks of classified information. They are more responsible for such leaks than anyone.

It's not wrong when they do it?

Be fair.  The Bush Admin. did that to... or do we forget?

[ww1.prweb.com image 850x1275]

So When Will Dick Cheney Be Charged With Espionage?

 

While Cheney wasn't the one whose phone call revealed this information, he set in train the events whereby it became well known. (Because Cheney's staff had Plame's information sitting around in plain sight, Armitage discovered it and then was responsible for the leak, but he only scooped Libby and Rove, who had been trying to get someone in the press to run with the Plame story.

http://readersupportednews.org/So-When-Will-Dick-Cheney-Be-Charged-Wi t h-Espionage.htm

It threw the link away :(
 
2013-06-24 02:31:05 PM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: LordJiro: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?

If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.

For good or bad, everything the NSA has done is legal.

If so, why is there a problem with the public knowing that the government is watching their every communication?  Could it be that, legal or not, the concept is unacceptable to anyone fully aware of it?

We knew. We knew back in 2006. Congress knew.

What didn't happen until recently was no NSA staffer took off for parts unknown and started blabbing state secrets to China for the attention.


The people who suspected back in 2006/2007, sued for FOIA documentation and were denied due to "national security".  Anyone else who had PROOF should have been screaming, at the top of their farking lungs about this.  That it took 5 years before someone like Snowden emerged is a failure on the part of every goddamned individual involved with, or with knowledge of, these shenanigans.
 
2013-06-24 02:31:38 PM
If memory serves, in his book On War, Carl von Clausewitz stated that 'neener neener suck my weiner' was a fitting diplomatic response in a situation where battle would not be immenent. While a government might have been able to use the more fitting 'neener no-ner suck my boner' I think Wikileaks commited no faux pas in using suck my weiner.
 
2013-06-24 02:31:47 PM

Lexx: If so, why is there a problem with the public knowing that the government is watching their every communication?


An excellent question, as they're handing over the exact same data to private interests that just want to sell them shiat  -- rather than catch terrorists.  Clearly their priorities are kinda farked up.
 
2013-06-24 02:33:52 PM

neversubmit: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

The Obama administration leaks classified information continuously. They do it to glorify the President, or manipulate public opinion, or even to help produce a pre-election propaganda film about the Osama bin Laden raid. The Obama administration does not hate unauthorized leaks of classified information. They are more responsible for such leaks than anyone.

It's not wrong when they do it?


You really don't have any clue how things are declassified with time, so maybe you should STFU. Information is declassified once it is no longer necessary for it to be classified explicitly to maintain some semblance of public oversight... things that are classified whatever level of secret are not meant to be secret ad infinitum (very few exceptions apply).

Granted the lack of direct oversight to the public is troubling, which is why the DOD answers to Congress; when assholes send people like Michelle Bachmann to DC to serve on Intelligence etc. committees this is stupid private citizens making government not work, not a bunch of industrialist hyperevolved velociraptors in league with the Illuminati and HYDRA.

And for the record, yes I am from MN and no, I'm outside of Michelle's very wretched district so I have never had the chance to vote against her.
 
2013-06-24 02:33:55 PM

FormlessOne: qorkfiend: neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?

Aren't you just precious? "He didn't live completely up to what I think his campaign slogan meant! TRAITOR!"

He has a point, though. Obama railed against the Bush administration's policies, and then quietly extended and exploited them once in office.

We are not angry enough with our elected leaders for what has amounted to an erosion of our rights and freedoms, for well over a decade now. It's been 12 years since 2001 - when, exactly, does the USA PATRIOT Act (a supposedly temporary bit of law) completely expire? When does the TSA go away? When do we decide that the cost of our alleged security is far more expensive than the actual security purchased with it? That's part of what Obama was selling, and, let's face it, he's not delivering it - he seems content to continue with Gitmo, with the TSA, with the "no-fly lists" and the secret warrants and the domestic surveillance.

In short, when do we stop being afraid - of terrorism, of fascism, of our own government?


The responsibility for every single one of those things lies with Congress.

Don't want the PATRIOT Act? Congress can abolish it whenever they want, or not vote to renew it when it comes up.
Want Gitmo closed? Ask why Congress continually votes to fund Gitmo and specifically denies any funds for closing it.
Want the TSA to go? Want FISA to go? Congress can abolish both whenever they feel like it.
 
2013-06-24 02:34:36 PM

reklamfox: neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?

Mmhmm, yes. Because we all remember that glorious time of prosperity, justice, health and wealth that America experienced right before that big traitor Barrack HUSSEIN Obama took office.

/if I rolled my eyes any harder they would fall out of my head


Is your point Bush 2 was worst so this is ok? If so way to lower the bar.
 
2013-06-24 02:37:10 PM

Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?

If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.


The issue here isn't any laws the government is breaking (which is none)... the issue here is PRISM is entirely legal.

There are troubling issues these laws raise but to represent the government as being corrupt for operating in the manner Congress has not only approved of but demanded is dishonest, asinine, and pretty much assures nothing will ever be changed for the better. Stop NOT HELPING
 
2013-06-24 02:38:46 PM
It's a damn shame McCain or Romney didn't win.  There's no way in hell they would have continued or deepened these programs, no sir.
 
2013-06-24 02:38:56 PM

neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?


Who has bought the Right-Wing media narrative hook, line and sinker?
 
2013-06-24 02:39:27 PM

FormlessOne: In short, when do we stop being afraid - of terrorism, of fascism, of our own government?


Fear of our own government is a time-honored American tradition, stretching all the way back to the Whiskey Rebellion, The Civil War, and the modern-day Tea Party "movement" (we have our own special brand of these idiots in Texas, they're called Secessionists. The woman who married my grandfather is one. She's a f*cking idiot)

Terrorism is something we may eventually get over our fear of, but we would have to understand statistics.

Fascism is something we don't actually fear, because most of us can't accurately define it.
 
2013-06-24 02:40:09 PM

neversubmit: But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?


That may, in fact, be the single stupidest post anybody has ever used to start off a Fark thread.

Just for future reference, unless you were doing it on purpose, nothing is better at making your opinions sound more childish than phrasing them entirely in the form of rhetorical questions.
 
2013-06-24 02:40:39 PM

neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?


Can I not hold an elected official to a completely ridiculous standard *and* feel like Snowden and Assange and Manning did was probably for the best, *and* also think that they should be prosecuted for it, lest the meaning of what they leaked be undermined by some kind of crazy cult of personality slash digital lynch mob?

/The answer's "no" isn't it?
//grownupdiscussions
 
2013-06-24 02:40:56 PM

Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: LordJiro: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: Lexx: Obama's Reptiloid Master: IT ARE MY RIGHT TO LEAK STATE SEKRETS BECAUSE I SAY SO!

I, the intrepid libertarian hero of this deep political thriller/drama, firmly believe YOU have a right to know the inner workings of national police, the department of state, and the military, because transparency. I am the hero here, and the people trying to enforce the laws are evil tyrantosaurs.

If your government is breaking its own laws in a flagrant and systemic way, YES YOU, THE PEOPLE, HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW!

Which laws has the government broken?

If you haven't 'seen enough evidence of this to convince you since the scandal broke, I'm unlikely to succeed where others failed.

For good or bad, everything the NSA has done is legal.

If so, why is there a problem with the public knowing that the government is watching their every communication?  Could it be that, legal or not, the concept is unacceptable to anyone fully aware of it?

We knew. We knew back in 2006. Congress knew.

What didn't happen until recently was no NSA staffer took off for parts unknown and started blabbing state secrets to China for the attention.

The people who suspected back in 2006/2007, sued for FOIA documentation and were denied due to "national security".  Anyone else who had PROOF should have been screaming, at the top of their farking lungs about this.  That it took 5 years before someone like Snowden emerged is a failure on the part of every goddamned individual involved with, or with knowledge of, these shenanigans.


They're not shenanigans, though. It's all legitimate law enforcement techniques.

If you don't like it, change the law. Don't complain and run off.
 
2013-06-24 02:41:52 PM

Empty Matchbook: neversubmit: Time for the "left" and right change their simple minds.

Julian Assange: The real traitor is US President Barack Obama

But who is really the traitor here? Who was it who promised a generation "hope" and "change," only to betray those promises with dismal misery and stagnation? Who took an oath to defend the US constitution, only to feed the invisible beast of secret law devouring it alive from the inside out? Who is it that promised to preside over The Most Transparent Administration in history, only to crush whistleblower after whistleblower with the bootheel of espionage charges?

Who has bought the Right-Wing media narrative hook, line and sinker?


Trying to hide behind the loony right wing is worst than trying to hide behind a plane of glass.
 
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