tbeatty: Wow. Are you living in the 1980's?The latest crimes regarding abortion seem to be committed by abortion Dr,'s that murdered their patients.
March 10, 1993: Dr. David Gunn of Pensacola, Florida was fatally shot during a protest. He had been the subject of wanted-style posters distributed by Operation Rescue in the summer of 1992. Michael F. Griffin was found guilty of Gunn's murder and was sentenced to life in prison.July 29, 1994: Dr. John Britton and James Barrett, a clinic escort, were both shot to death outside another facility, the Ladies Center, in Pensacola. Rev. Paul Jennings Hill was charged with the killings. Hill received a death sentence and was executed on September 3, 2003. The clinic in Pensacola had been bombed before in 1984 and was also bombed subsequently in 2012.December 30, 1994: Two receptionists, Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols, were killed in two clinic attacks in Brookline, Massachusetts. John Salvi was arrested and confessed to the killings. He died in prison and guards found his body under his bed with a plastic garbage bag tied around his head. Salvi had also confessed to a non-lethal attack in Norfolk, Virginia days before the Brookline killings.January 29, 1998: Robert Sanderson, an off-duty police officer who worked as a security guard at an abortion clinic in Birmingham, Alabama, was killed when his workplace was bombed. Eric Robert Rudolph, who was also responsible for the 1996 Centennial Olympic Park bombing, was charged with the crime and received two life sentences as a result.October 23, 1998: Dr. Barnett Slepian was shot to death with a high-powered rifle at his home in Amherst, New York. His was the last in a series of similar shootings against providers in Canada and northern New York state which were all likely committed by James Kopp. Kopp was convicted of Slepian's murder after finally being apprehended in France in 2001.May 31, 2009: Dr. George Tiller was shot and killed by Scott Roeder as Tiller served as an usher at church in Wichita, Kansas. Attempted murder, assault, and kidnapping According to statistics gathered by the National Abortion Federation (NAF), an organization of abortion providers, since 1977 in the United States and Canada, there have been 17 attempted murders, 383 death threats, 153 incidents of assault or battery, and 3 kidnappings committed against abortion providers. Attempted murders in the U.S. included:August 19, 1993: Dr. George Tiller was shot outside of an abortion facility in Wichita, Kansas. Shelley Shannon was charged with the crime and received an 11-year prison sentence (20 years were later added for arson and acid attacks on clinics).July 29, 1994: June Barret was shot in the same attack which claimed the lives of James Barrett, her husband, and Dr. John Britton.December 30, 1994: Five individuals were wounded in the shootings which killed Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols.October 28, 1997: Dr. David Gandell of Rochester, New York was injured by flying glass when a shot was fired through the window of his home.January 29, 1998: Emily Lyons, a nurse, was severely injured, and lost an eye, in the bombing which also killed Robert Sanderson.May 21, 1998: Three people were injured when acid was poured at the entrances of five abortion clinics in Miami, Florida.October 1999: Martin Uphoff set fire to a Planned Parenthood clinic in Sioux Falls, South Dakota, causing US$100 worth of damage. He was later sentenced to 60 months in prison.May 28, 2000: An arson at a clinic in Concord, New Hampshire resulted in several thousand dollars' worth of damage. The case remains unsolved. This was the second arson at the clinic.September 30, 2000: John Earl, a Catholic priest, drove his car into the Northern Illinois Health Clinic after learning that the FDA had approved the drug RU-486. He pulled out an ax before being forced to the ground by the owner of the building, who fired two warning shots from a shotgun.June 11, 2001: An unsolved bombing at a clinic in Tacoma, Washington destroyed a wall, resulting in $6,000 in damages.July 4, 2005: A clinic Palm Beach, Florida was the target of an arson. The case remains open.December 12, 2005: Patricia Hughes and Jeremy Dunahoe threw a Molotov cocktail at a clinic in Shreveport, Louisiana. The device missed the building and no damage was caused. In August 2006, Hughes was sentenced to six years in prison, and Dunahoe to one year. Hughes claimed the bomb was a "memorial lamp" for an abortion she had had there.September 11, 2006 David McMenemy of Rochester Hills, Michigan, crashed his car into the Edgerton Women's Care Center in Davenport, Iowa. He then doused the lobby in gasoline and started a fire. McMenemy committed these acts in the belief that the center was performing abortions; however, Edgerton is not an abortion clinic. Time magazine listed the incident in a "Top 10 Inept Terrorist Plots" list.April 25, 2007: A package left at a women's health clinic in Austin, Texas, contained an explosive device capable of inflicting serious injury or death. A bomb squad detonated the device after evacuating the building. Paul Ross Evans (who had a criminal record for armed robbery and theft) was found guilty of the crime.May 9, 2007: An unidentified person deliberately set fire to a Planned Parenthood clinic in Virginia Beach, Virginia.December 6, 2007: Chad Altman and Sergio Baca were arrested for the arson of Dr. Curtis Boyd's clinic in Albuquerque. Baca's girlfriend had scheduled an appointment for an abortion at the clinic.January 22, 2009 Matthew L. Derosia, 32, who was reported to have had a history of mental illness rammed an SUV into the front entrance of a Planned Parenthood clinic in St. Paul, Minnesota.January 1, 2012 Bobby Joe Rogers, 41, firebombed the American Family Planning Clinic in Pensacola, Florida with a Molotov cocktail; the fire gutted the building. Rogers told investigators that he was motivated to commit the crime by his opposition to abortion, and that what more directly prompted the act was seeing a patient enter the clinic during one of the frequent anti-abortion protests there. The clinic had previously been bombed at Christmas in 1984 and was the site of the murder of Dr. John Britton and James Barrett in 1994.April 1, 2012 A bomb exploded on the windowsill of a Planned Parenthood clinic in Grand Chute, Wisconsin, resulting in a fire that damaged one of the clinic's examination rooms. No injuries were reported.April 11, 2013 A Planned Parenthood clinic in Bloomington, Indiana was vandalized with an axe.November 2001: After the genuine 2001 anthrax attacks, Clayton Waagner mailed hoax letters containing a white powder to 554 clinics. On December 3, 2003, Waagner was convicted of 51 charges relating to the anthrax scare.
WhoIsWillo: The argument that is being made is that it is the first amendment right of abortion protestors to make their message heard directly outside of the clinic.
skullkrusher: KhamanV: Corvus, I'm going to be taking your C&P listing for use and safekeeping.That list pales in comparison to the total people murdered by abortion doctors since Roe v Wade./someone had to do it
tbeatty: The latest crimes regarding abortion seem to be committed by abortion Dr,'s that murdered their patients.
tbeatty: You're embarrassing yourself with the lack of understanding. Perhaps it's your own cognitive dissonance.
tbeatty: Biological Ali: tbeatty: This ^^^^^ is the cognitive dissonance.I suspect you don't quite have a solid grasp on what this term means.Oh please. You can troll better than that.I live with my mom
tbeatty: Dinjiin: AurizenDarkstar: They are pretty much textbook examples of cognitive dissonance.Agreed.From my own personal experience, I've found that people who hold near fanatical views on a subject often tend to display signs of cognitive dissonance. It seems as if they have so fully committed themselves to the cause that any deviation might shatter their worldview.Case in point: I've had a couple of debates regarding pro-life references within the Bible that many people use as their basis to justify their position. When I point out that there are several passages that show that [Old Testament] God is indifferent [or worse, advocates the use of abortion under some scenarios, like in Numbers V], and how many of their own passages are being used out-of-context, I get a bunch of Whaaarbargle.If people believe that abortion is an immoral act, and that they came to that decision through self-reflection, fine. If they came to that decision because some mentor or authority figure repeated a few cherry-picked verses, then I have a problem. If the latter folks decide to interfere with people who disagree with their opinion, then I have a big problem. If those folks cannot be swayed and have otherwise become irrational, then IMHO, we all have a big problem.A lot of the cognitive dissonance is over late-term abortions. Pro-choice advocates want the option legally available but don't want to really see the doctors and facilities that do it. I listed 3 that have been charged with murder and all lost their medical licenses but there are more. There simply aren't that many doctors willing to do the procedures and so it falls to the least capable. It's not just the horror shops either. The dissonance is heard (*crickets*) when these places are discovered and there is really no defense for it.
AurizenDarkstar: They are pretty much textbook examples of cognitive dissonance.
Bloody William: coeyagi: tbeatty: The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: They should work on "no shooting doctors" and "no firebombing" zones.Wow. Are you living in the 1980's?The latest crimes regarding abortion seem to be committed by abortion Dr,'s that murdered their patients.The only crime related to abortion I see in this post is that the poster wasn't subjected to one.//seriously, that is the saddest f*cking assessment ever, you are basing that on 1 f*cking imbecile in Philly. DURR 1 DATA POINT HURR!!!1!Technically, that's datum. Data implies multiple points. Or anecdontal evidence, since it's just one incident with a specific backstory to it that, statistically, has no farking bearing on trends.
Theaetetus: DarnoKonrad: DamnYankees: I'm not really sure how this is unconstitutional.Consider Snyder v. Phelps. SCOTUS not only stated that the Westboro Baptist Church has a right to spew hatred (sure why not), they stated they have a right to do it at a funeral. I think that's unreasonable, but this is a similar case. If "free speech" means you can harass others with it, then I'd say these buffer laws are going down.The court's opinion also stated that the memorial service was not disturbed, saying, "Westboro stayed well away from the memorial service, Snyder could see no more than the tops of the picketers' signs, and there is no indication that the picketing interfered with the funeral service itself."I'd bet they were at least 35 feet away.
tbeatty: The Beatings Will Continue Until Morale Improves: They should work on "no shooting doctors" and "no firebombing" zones.Wow. Are you living in the 1980's?The latest crimes regarding abortion seem to be committed by abortion Dr,'s that murdered their patients.
what_now: You have no first amendment right to engage anyone in conversation, you have no first amendment right to bully or harass.Massachusetts doesn't have this law for fun, they have it because one of these "right to life" second amendment warriors murdered two receptionists in Brookline.
Lsherm: Isn't this the same rationale they use for "free speech zones" all over the place?
DamnYankees: I'm not really sure how this is unconstitutional.
nmrsnr: El_Perro: Yup. Basically the same issue as Madsen v. Women's Health Center (2004), which upheld a 36-foot buffer while striking down a 300-foot buffer. The vote on the 36-foot buffer was 6-3, with Scalia, Thomas and Kennedy in dissent. Not hard to imagine that Alito and Roberts may join those three, and the fact that the Court even took the case (where the lower court was aligned with the SCOTUS decision from less than 20 years ago) may suggest that at least one of them already has.I'm too lazy to read the decision in that case right now, but what was their rationale? I understand the concept of "free speech zones" is anathema to some, but zoning laws don't let you sell your constitutionally protected porn within 500 yards of schools, or put up election signs within 100 yards of a polling place, so what's the problem with saying "yeah, you can say what you want, just not within 100 yards of their door?"
El_Perro: Yup. Basically the same issue as Madsen v. Women's Health Center (2004), which upheld a 36-foot buffer while striking down a 300-foot buffer. The vote on the 36-foot buffer was 6-3, with Scalia, Thomas and Kennedy in dissent. Not hard to imagine that Alito and Roberts may join those three, and the fact that the Court even took the case (where the lower court was aligned with the SCOTUS decision from less than 20 years ago) may suggest that at least one of them already has.
El_Perro: WhoIsWillo: DamnYankees: I'm not really sure how this is unconstitutional.The argument that is being made is that it is the first amendment right of abortion protestors to make their message heard directly outside of the clinic. If I were arguing the case, I would point out that it is designed to protect one specific form of patient, and is therefore politically motivated to limit a specific kind of speech.Yup. Basically the same issue as Madsen v. Women's Health Center (2004), which upheld a 36-foot buffer while striking down a 300-foot buffer. The vote on the 36-foot buffer was 6-3, with Scalia, Thomas and Kennedy in dissent. Not hard to imagine that Alito and Roberts may join those three, and the fact that the Court even took the case (where the lower court was aligned with the SCOTUS decision from less than 20 years ago) may suggest that at least one of them already has.
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