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(USA Today)   The audio "expert" who claims it was Trayvon and not Zimmerman screaming for help on the 911 tape will not be allowed to testify at trial   (usatoday.com) divider line 677
    More: Obvious, George Zimmerman, Mark O'Mara, the weekend, jury, screaming  
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6083 clicks; posted to Main » on 22 Jun 2013 at 7:47 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-22 10:28:56 PM

Satan's Girlfriend: ChaosStar: get the picture yet skippy?

Calling me names does not help your argument. I see you're still in denial as well. Sad really. If you had any decency you'd apologize to everyone in this thread and stop posting. Cause right now you're skating on thin ice mister.


I see you've actually stopped trying to pass off your ludicrous claims and now just want to try and paint me in a negative light. The next step is anger right? Or is it denial? I forget, but how many until we get to acceptance and you understand how stupid you're being?
/that's me clogging on your thin ice buddy
 
2013-06-22 10:29:26 PM

Lionel Mandrake: I have better things to do than revel in hate.


Says the guy willing to send a man to prison based on what they think might have happened.
 
2013-06-22 10:30:13 PM

Delay: It looks like vigilante justice will prevail in this case. Thanks but no thanks State of Florida, you had you chance. Your legal system is a sick joke.


I dunno, I would think an all woman jury would help the prosecution more than the defense.
 
2013-06-22 10:31:06 PM

The_Six_Fingered_Man: The defense's countering inference from the non-emergency call would be that Zimmerman was in fear of Martin, given his description "he is walking towards me with his hand in his waistband" and the reluctance of Zimmerman to give out his full address given that he was unaware of Martin's whereabouts. From that evidence the defense could infer that Zimmerman was fearful of Martin and in no way looking to start an altercation.


If he was so terrifies of Trayvon, why was he following him? Why not just stay in his car, or not even follow Trayvon at all??

An inference could also be made from the very fact that Zimmerman called the police that he was not likely to start a fight with police on their way.

Ah, but the police were NOT on their way. Zimmerman refused to tell the dispatcher where he would meet them. " Actually, could you have them call me and I'll tell them where I'm at?" If he wanted a little 'private time' with Trayvon, what better way to ensure the cops would Not arrive, then refuse to tell them where to go?

Zimmerman was more than willing to let the police handle the incident rather than start a fight

...which is why he followed Trayvon... and got into...a fight. Because he wanted the police to handle it.
 
2013-06-22 10:31:47 PM

jaytkay: ChaosStar: still no race or skin color mentioned.

Lets go to a more modern source, Urban Dictionary

Let's go to millions of posts from conservatives in social media in the past several years..

/ We know what you mean my "thug"
// Don't be a dishonest asshole


Of course you do, because you make it all up in your mind. It's obviously racism if, in your mind, it's always tagged to black skin. It doesn't matter that many people of different skin colors fit the definition, no sir, it's always all about black people.
Always
Every time
Never changes
Permanently
 
2013-06-22 10:32:37 PM

ChaosStar: *rage post*


Well I tried to be reasonable about this, but it seems you just want to throw a temper tantrum. Congrats, I have just put you on my ignore list. That should shut you up nice and good. I hope you enjoy your time there because you will NEVER be coming off of it.
 
2013-06-22 10:34:17 PM

Lionel Mandrake: Popcorn Johnny: Lionel Mandrake: s that how you justify being an asshole?  By assuming to know what everyone thinks?

Shouldn't you be out feeding sandwiches and giving fresh rounds to unfortunate gang bangers?

My goodness, aren't you witty.  I think I've soiled myself by stepping into your pathetic world enough for one day.  Enjoy your self-righteous hatred.  What satisfaction it must bring to judge so many people with so little effort or care.

The last word is all yours.  Make it good, but rest assured that I won't waste valuable seconds by reading what you manage to squeeze out.  Unlike you, I have better things to do than revel in hate.

Good luck.


You know, I get where you're coming from. And I find it sad, in abstract, that many are involved in gang life for reasons that are beyond their control. And I realize, having witnessed it first hand, that even the ones who actively try to get out are treated harshly by those stuck in it.

However, when you fail to make the changes needed to begin to get out, or actively participate in the lifestyle that destroys your community and only perpetuates violence and fear, you are scum. You are the very enemy that made you, and you choose to do wrong, hurting innocents in the process.

And, for those who are actively killing each other in pursuit of some criminal enterprise, I'm okay with a population that self-regulates. We have a real problem when those populations begin to grow unchecked and take criminal enterprise to the level of inflicting misery on those who worked hard to not be involved in it.
 
2013-06-22 10:34:35 PM

ChaosStar: it's always all about black people.


So you're saying the thought of black people makes you angry.

Thanks for making one honest statement. It's a start.
 
2013-06-22 10:35:59 PM

Satan's Girlfriend: ChaosStar: *rage post*

Well I tried to be reasonable about this, but it seems you just want to throw a temper tantrum. Congrats, I have just put you on my ignore list. That should shut you up nice and good. I hope you enjoy your time there because you will NEVER be coming off of it.


Yeah, I'm thinking I'll do that, too.  He didn't even start trying to make reasoned arguments; he just started pooping out of his fingers.  I love arguing, but you can't do that with people who are either trolling or don't really care about sharing ideas.
 
2013-06-22 10:36:57 PM
Lets put some of the blame for this where it belongs, Trayvon's parents. The kid has a very checkered past and was currently serving a suspension from school. Mom deals with it by telling him to go stay with dad, and dad lets the kid roam the streets. Maybe if the kid had a little discipline in his life and had been grounded, he'd still be alive.
 
2013-06-22 10:38:12 PM
fredklein: If he wanted a little 'private time' with Trayvon, what better way to ensure the cops would Not arrive, then refuse to tell them where to go?

That makes no sense. If that was Zimmerman's intent, why the fark would he call police in the first place?
 
2013-06-22 10:39:04 PM

cretinbob: Ricardo Klement: Summer Glau's Love Slave: "We need more ice." ~ Midget passenger aboard the Titanic.

This isn't going to end well.

Sure ain't.  I'm looking forward to the riots.

you will be sadly disappint.


I doubt it.
 
2013-06-22 10:39:34 PM

Satan's Girlfriend: ChaosStar: *rage post*

Well I tried to be reasonable about this, but it seems you just want to throw a temper tantrum. Congrats, I have just put you on my ignore list. That should shut you up nice and good. I hope you enjoy your time there because you will NEVER be coming off of it.


Never?
Never ever?
Really?
oh.... well damn.. what am I gonna do now?
Someone on the internet ignored me, wow.
I'm heartbroken, truly I am, but at least I got to read your drama queen post about it.
/gonna go Tweet about it as well little lady?
 
2013-06-22 10:40:27 PM

Prometheus_Unbound: That makes no sense. If that was Zimmerman's intent, why the fark would he call police in the first place?


Duh, he was obviously setting up the perfect crime. That's the same reason he mentored a black kid a couple years earlier and why he was the only person to welcome an elderly black woman to the neighborhood. This was a murder planned for years in advance.
 
2013-06-22 10:41:54 PM

Bravo Two: lantawa: Lionel Mandrake: lantawa: Satan's Girlfriend: Even if he walks though, it's only a matter of time before the NBP hunts him down like dog he is.

What does the National Bank of Pakistan have to do with the price of tea in China?

About as much as a guy with skittles has to do with being a deadly threat.

You're not getting it. Come back to reality, young Lionel Mandrake. Come back.........

So, on top of an admitted clusterfark, you're advocating/condoning vigilante justice and murder? If what Zimmerman did was wrong, how is hoping/condoning the NBP's murder of him any better?


You do, I hope, realize that I was responding, sarcastically, to some douchebag insinuation that Zimmerman is going to be hunted down by vigilante douchebags, right? Beer-like typing detected.....
 
2013-06-22 10:42:21 PM
I hate it when I'm at the movies and then a whole big pack of thugs walk in and sit down.
 
2013-06-22 10:42:39 PM

Popcorn Johnny: Lets put some of the blame for this where it belongs, Trayvon's parents. The kid has a very checkered past and was currently serving a suspension from school. Mom deals with it by telling him to go stay with dad, and dad lets the kid roam the streets. Maybe if the kid had a little discipline in his life and had been grounded, he'd still be alive.


Is this conjecture or fact?

Does it count as "roaming the streets" to go and get some Skittles?  Why are you blaming the kid with a hole in his chest instead of even CONSIDERING DAT DA MAN HOO PUT IT DERE CUD BEEE RESPONSUHBULE?
 
2013-06-22 10:43:35 PM

SacriliciousBeerSwiller: I don't even care who did what at that point. The instant Zimmerman ignored police orders not to follow Martin, his "stand your ground" protections should have been voided.


The argument there is "It was just a police dispatcher so it wasn't really a) a cop or b) an order" depending on who's making the argument. I think the idea is that anything short of a fully armed SWAT team leaping between them and screaming "STOP MOTHERF*CKER!!!" would not have been an order to Zimmerman not to follow Martin.
 
2013-06-22 10:44:03 PM

The_Six_Fingered_Man: Bontesla: She doesn't have a history of overcharging so why start now?

She charged a woman with aggravated assault when the woman discharged her firearm into a wall to escape her abusive husband. She charged a 12 year old kid with homicide and aggravated child abuse and had him charged as an adult. She charged Ronald Thompson with aggravated assault when he discharged his firearm into the ground, garnering a 20 year sentence. The judge thought that ridiculous and gave him 3 years. She appealed and won the 20 years she was looking for. Thankfully THAT decision was overturned and Thompson is free pending a new trial by Corey's office.

So yeah, she kinda DOES have a history of overcharging cases.


Not to mention that she's a fat, grotesque cow of a woman.....
 
2013-06-22 10:44:09 PM

gimmegimme: I ask out of genuine curiosity. What would be your reaction if, the next time you're walking through your neighborhood, you notice someone rolling alongside you in a car and then they begin to follow you on foot?


I would tell the person I'm talking to on my cellphone that I'm concerned and then call the police. I'd also flee and not return to confront them.

Two things Martin failed to do because he was pissed off that someone gave him the stink eye and he wanted to beat some respect into the guy.
 
2013-06-22 10:44:29 PM

Prometheus_Unbound: If that was Zimmerman's intent, why the fark would he call police in the first place?


We don't know Mr. Zimmerman's intent. That's not important under Florida law. Was Mr. Zimmerman doing anything unlawful while stalking a kid with a chambered handgun? Not under Florida law.

We all know that Mr. Zimmerman will be found not guilty in court and receive vigilante justice later.
 
2013-06-22 10:44:29 PM

gimmegimme: Does it count as "roaming the streets" to go and get some Skittles?


It certainly counts as being let out of the house.
 
2013-06-22 10:44:53 PM

gimmegimme: Satan's Girlfriend: ChaosStar: *rage post*

Well I tried to be reasonable about this, but it seems you just want to throw a temper tantrum. Congrats, I have just put you on my ignore list. That should shut you up nice and good. I hope you enjoy your time there because you will NEVER be coming off of it.

Yeah, I'm thinking I'll do that, too.  He didn't even start trying to make reasoned arguments; he just started pooping out of his fingers.  I love arguing, but you can't do that with people who are either trolling or don't really care about sharing ideas.


Gimme, I've seen you in these threads before and I've read a few of your replies in this one.
You wouldn't know a reasoned argument if it bit you in the ass.
You constantly throw out conjecture, you use hyperbolic language, you flat out lie, and you ignore anyone and everyone that gives you evidence that contradicts anything you say except for those rare times where you twist what they say and put words in their mouth to try and make your arguments work.
 
2013-06-22 10:45:52 PM

fredklein: If he was so terrifies of Trayvon, why was he following him? Why not just stay in his car, or not even follow Trayvon at all??


There is no evidence that he continued to follow Martin after being advised that the dispatcher did not need him to do that. Prior to that, the dispatcher explicitly requested that Zimmerman keep them appraised of any further actions by Martin. "Yeah, we've got someone on the way, just let me know if this guy does anything else." There is no indication that Zimmerman was doing anything other than observing and reporting Martin's activities to the police dispatcher.

fredklein: Ah, but the police were NOT on their way. Zimmerman refused to tell the dispatcher where he would meet them. " Actually, could you have them call me and I'll tell them where I'm at?" If he wanted a little 'private time' with Trayvon, what better way to ensure the cops would Not arrive, then refuse to tell them where to go?


Zimmerman: "When you come to the clubhouse you come straight in and make a left. Actually you would go past the clubhouse." Then: "No you go in straight through the entrance and then you make a left, uh, you go straight in, don't turn, and make a left."

At which point Martin begins running, to which the dispatcher requests that Zimmerman tell the dispatcher in which way Martin ran. This is the point where Zimmerman exits his vehicle.

Dispatcher
"Alright, where you going to meet with them at?"

Zimmerman
"Um, if they come in through the, uh, (knocking sound) gate, tell them to go straight past the club house, and uh, (knocking sound) straight past the club house and make a left, and then they go past the mailboxes, that's my truck...[unintelligible] "

The conversation that you point to is because he does not know where around the clubhouse he will be, whether at his truck or by the mailboxes. That you infer nefarious intent is not supported by either the call or the evidence.

fredklein: ...which is why he followed Trayvon... and got into...a fight. Because he wanted the police to handle it.


So you are saying that Zimmerman wanted to get into a potentially lethal confrontation (knowing he was carrying a firearm) with the full knowledge that the police were not only on their way, but knew his name and phone number and were on their way to meet him? Is this part of a somewhat prevalent conspiracy theory that Zimmerman called the police in order to give himself an alibi in order to shoot Martin in cold blood?

The fact that Zimmerman was involved in an altercation has no bearing on whether or not he wanted police to handle the situation. It could be that Martin was the First Aggressor and therefore the choice to confront was not in Zimmerman's hands. But again, there is no evidence that Zimmerman continued to pursue Martin after the dispatcher told him that they did not need him to.
 
2013-06-22 10:48:50 PM

Popcorn Johnny: Lets put some of the blame for this where it belongs, Trayvon's parents. The kid has a very checkered past and was currently serving a suspension from school. Mom deals with it by telling him to go stay with dad, and dad lets the kid roam the streets. Maybe if the kid had a little discipline in his life and had been grounded, he'd still be alive.


Oh come off it. I have tried to give both sides the benefit of the doubt, but this is just utter horseshiat.

Trayvon was a teenager. They go out late and roam around. It's been the way they work for millennia. There's a reason some places have instituted curfews. He had every right to go to the store and buy soda and skittles or sell weed or whatever it was he was doing.

Zimmerman didn't know him and took the whole "zomg black dude in a white neighborhood must be there to rob the place" to a paranoid extreme, by taking "casually following and observing" to an aggressive stance.

Everyone involved did dumbshiat things. However it happened, someone died because of suspicion and fear and chose to attack rather than getting to a safe spot and calling the cops.

Like they teach in every goddamn CCW class on the planet: the gun is a last resort.

Let's not make a massive clusterfark any more stupid by now suggesting that the parents by being separated and not locking their teenager up at night are somehow party to this because they had a difficult time dealing with their son.

I grew up around the ghetto with ghetto friends. When the majority of your peers are doing the gang thing and you have a lot of pressure from them to join in (as opposed to harassment and exile), you're going to get involved to some extent just to fit in and stay under the radar. It's that or your life is a living hell.

As much as I think gimme gimme is full of shiat and just wants to be a contrarian, neither one of you is expressly wrong, merely reading into the evidence what you want to see.

Guilty or not, it boils down to a tragic mound of shiat that got unevenly distributed, and a shiatty situation for the courts.

Let's not pretend that this trial is anything portentous, and admit its just another moment of human stupidity.
 
2013-06-22 10:51:26 PM

Bravo Two: He had every right to go to the store and buy soda and skittles or sell weed or whatever it was he was doing.


I just wanted to point out that he probably didn't have every right to sell weed considering the sale of marijuana is illegal in Florida.
 
2013-06-22 10:51:35 PM
I can't believe there are still people defending Zimmerman and trying to rationalize his actions. If he hadn't been out playing vigilante, the kid would still be alive.
 
2013-06-22 10:52:30 PM

Delay: Prometheus_Unbound: If that was Zimmerman's intent, why the fark would he call police in the first place?

We don't know Mr. Zimmerman's intent. That's not important under Florida law. Was Mr. Zimmerman doing anything unlawful while stalking a kid with a chambered handgun? Not under Florida law.

We all know that Mr. Zimmerman will be found not guilty in court and receive vigilante justice later.


If he does, then I hope those responsible for the lynch mob are tried and convicted of murder, because that's what it will be.
 
2013-06-22 10:54:24 PM

whatshisname: I can't believe there are still people defending Zimmerman and trying to rationalize his actions. If he hadn't been out playing vigilante, the kid would still be alive.


No one is arguing otherwise. What's being argued is whether or not Zimmerman committed the crime of murder under Florida law. It's not as simple as "if he stayed in his car, Martin would be alive, therefore he's guilty." Criminal law doesn't work like that.
 
2013-06-22 10:57:32 PM
Of course it isnt Treyvon.  It's hard to shout out when you have been shot in the chest.
It was clearly Zimmerman, crying out like pussy Man of Steel after breaking Zod's neck.

Supes would have just said 'take all that military superiority and cram it up your cramhole, LaFleur'
 
2013-06-22 10:57:52 PM

The_Six_Fingered_Man: Bravo Two: He had every right to go to the store and buy soda and skittles or sell weed or whatever it was he was doing.

I just wanted to point out that he probably didn't have every right to sell weed considering the sale of marijuana is illegal in Florida.


He had the right to sell it, whether or not it was legal. Legality of product does not make connotations on one's right to conduct business in general. It just makes that product and that particular transaction illegal.
 
2013-06-22 10:58:34 PM

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: whatshisname: I can't believe there are still people defending Zimmerman and trying to rationalize his actions. If he hadn't been out playing vigilante, the kid would still be alive.

No one is arguing otherwise. What's being argued is whether or not Zimmerman committed the crime of murder under Florida law. It's not as simple as "if he stayed in his car, Martin would be alive, therefore he's guilty." Criminal law doesn't work like that.


Does Florida use the common law standard for 2d-degree murder, or being Florida, do they use some weird-ass definition besides deliberation and malice aforethought?
 
2013-06-22 11:01:13 PM

whatshisname: I can't believe there are still people defending Zimmerman and trying to rationalize his actions. If he hadn't been out playing vigilante, the kid would still be alive.


You don't know that.  The only thing that would be true is that this particular altercation would not have happened.
 
2013-06-22 11:01:24 PM

whatshisname: I can't believe there are still people defending Zimmerman and trying to rationalize his actions. If he hadn't been out playing vigilante, the kid would still be alive.


In general, there's nothing vigilante about reporting a suspicious person and keeping an eye on them.
 
2013-06-22 11:02:09 PM

gimmegimme: Maybe Zimmy shouldn't have started a fight he couldn't finish...


He did finish it.
Good to see we are back with GimmeGimme knowing who started the fight.
 
2013-06-22 11:04:28 PM

Oh_Enough_Already: whatshisname: I can't believe there are still people defending Zimmerman and trying to rationalize his actions. If he hadn't been out playing vigilante, the kid would still be alive.

Maybe, and his Thug Life course trajectory would have inevitably seen him getting killed days or weeks or months later and not one single fark would have been given by you or anybody else.

Why does anybody care now?

Oh, that's right, we can magically whiten up the Hispanic guy and "Blame Whitey" for this because not one single black person has ever been killed by another black person in the whole entire history of black people, right?


You've just made a great argument as to why everyone should care about this case.
 
2013-06-22 11:05:15 PM

Bravo Two: The_Six_Fingered_Man: Bravo Two: He had every right to go to the store and buy soda and skittles or sell weed or whatever it was he was doing.

I just wanted to point out that he probably didn't have every right to sell weed considering the sale of marijuana is illegal in Florida.

He had the right to sell it, whether or not it was legal. Legality of product does not make connotations on one's right to conduct business in general. It just makes that product and that particular transaction illegal.


Rights are legal, social, or ethical principles of freedom or entitlement; that is, rights are the fundamental normative rules about what is allowed of people or owed to people, according to some legal system, social convention, or ethical theory.

"Rights" are what are allowed to people as permitted by law. Martin did not have the right to engage in illegal business. He had the right to sell lemonade, but not marijuana. The very fact that the product is illegal negates the right to conduct that particular business. I simply cannot believe that you are unequivocally stating that Martin had the right to engage in illegal activity.

The right to conduct business is not a natural right, and therefore can be infringed or heavily regulated by the State to the point where engaging in illegal business transactions is not a right.
 
2013-06-22 11:05:57 PM
img.fark.net
 
2013-06-22 11:06:50 PM

Oh_Enough_Already: IronTom: Oh_Enough_Already: [img.fark.net image 850x472]


Meanwhile, in a few weeks . . .

Doubtful.  The rule of law must be maintained.

Dat be da' white mans laws, fool!


And you want them to be in place at all times.
 
2013-06-22 11:08:07 PM
Can we all just laugh and point at the gun wankers who will be "armed 24/7", anticipating a race war when the trial is over?

LOL

"I got my CCW and I'm gonna be PACKIN!!!"

While they waddle around.

In the Walmart parking lot.

In some all-white suburb.
 
2013-06-22 11:08:13 PM

The_Six_Fingered_Man: Bravo Two: The_Six_Fingered_Man: Bravo Two: He had every right to go to the store and buy soda and skittles or sell weed or whatever it was he was doing.

I just wanted to point out that he probably didn't have every right to sell weed considering the sale of marijuana is illegal in Florida.

He had the right to sell it, whether or not it was legal. Legality of product does not make connotations on one's right to conduct business in general. It just makes that product and that particular transaction illegal.

Rights are legal, social, or ethical principles of freedom or entitlement; that is, rights are the fundamental normative rules about what is allowed of people or owed to people, according to some legal system, social convention, or ethical theory.

"Rights" are what are allowed to people as permitted by law. Martin did not have the right to engage in illegal business. He had the right to sell lemonade, but not marijuana. The very fact that the product is illegal negates the right to conduct that particular business. I simply cannot believe that you are unequivocally stating that Martin had the right to engage in illegal activity.

The right to conduct business is not a natural right, and therefore can be infringed or heavily regulated by the State to the point where engaging in illegal business transactions is not a right.


I'm fairly certain there's something in the private property rights about buying and selling isn't there?
 
2013-06-22 11:10:12 PM

The_Six_Fingered_Man: marijuana


"Black people smoke marijuana. Case closed, not guilty!"

Thanks, Mr. Legal Expert!
 
2013-06-22 11:10:13 PM
i've read a few thousand posts about this case on FARK since the arrest and am now at this stage:

"You have not been selected for the jury. You are not a family member. You are not on either
legal team. You will not be in the courtroom and the evidence and arguments therein may make your posts look foolish  -  What will happen - and how the verdict is reached - is not in your "wheel house"

I'm wondering, sincerely, how many posters have actively tried to ever avoid jury duty, there are so
many farkers interested in this one case

and for those of you who have wished for a riot? shame on you
 
2013-06-22 11:10:56 PM
He's a 17 year old with a history and currently serving a suspension from school. His ass should have been sitting in his room staring at the walls.
 
2013-06-22 11:14:29 PM
Popcorn Johnny:  had every right, even if he was the aggressor, to use deadly force to protect himself.


No. He doesn't. You can't initiate a conflict then claim self defense. I know you're a known troll but even this is a stretch for you.
 
2013-06-22 11:14:51 PM

Popcorn Johnny: He's a 17 year old with a history and currently serving a suspension from school. His ass should have been sitting in his room staring at the walls.


Now there's a well-reasoned opinion, sticking to the facts of the incident!
 
2013-06-22 11:17:36 PM

jaytkay: The_Six_Fingered_Man: marijuana

"Black people smoke marijuana. Case closed, not guilty!"

Thanks, Mr. Legal Expert!


I have no idea what this means, so I'll just say *plonk* and thank my stars that I don't have to read your inane drivel any longer.
 
2013-06-22 11:18:35 PM

Shaddup: Popcorn Johnny:  had every right, even if he was the aggressor, to use deadly force to protect himself.


No. He doesn't. You can't initiate a conflict then claim self defense. I know you're a known troll but even this is a stretch for you.


See, this is how ignorant one side is.
 
2013-06-22 11:19:29 PM

Shaddup: Popcorn Johnny:  had every right, even if he was the aggressor, to use deadly force to protect himself.


No. He doesn't. You can't initiate a conflict then claim self defense. I know you're a known troll but even this is a stretch for you.


Ya may want to familiarize yourself with Florida's "stand your ground" law.
 
2013-06-22 11:21:02 PM

Shaddup: Popcorn Johnny:  had every right, even if he was the aggressor, to use deadly force to protect himself.


No. He doesn't. You can't initiate a conflict then claim self defense. I know you're a known troll but even this is a stretch for you.


He had it right.
Even if you are the aggressor, if your life is in danger you can defend yourself with lethal force.
Example A:
Zim punches Martin, Martin punches him back, they go to the ground in a flurry of blows and Martin comes out on top, sitting astride Zim repeatedly punching him in the face, his head hitting the pavement with every blow. Zimmerman's life is now in danger and he cannot escape by reasonable means. He can now legally use deadly force.
To add on, according to his testimony Zimmerman said Martin saw his ccw, presumably still holstered, and went for it. Zimmerman now has reasonable fear for his life, as his weapon can be taken and used on him. He draws before Martin can get to it and fires. Legal self defense under Florida law.
 
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