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(PetaPixel)   Amazing cross-section photos of ammunition from WWII   (petapixel.com) divider line 129
    More: Cool, cross-sections, Sabine Pearlman, crash test dummy  
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20707 clicks; posted to Main » on 22 Jun 2013 at 2:22 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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NFA
2013-06-21 09:18:24 PM
Shame they didn't have info on the make and caliber.
 
2013-06-21 09:18:33 PM
This would be a lot more interesting if there were explanations of the bullet designs.
 
2013-06-21 10:14:10 PM
Rounds for everyone!
 
2013-06-21 11:46:01 PM

NFA: Shame they didn't have info on the make and caliber.


h2ogate: This would be a lot more interesting if there were explanations of the bullet designs.


These

/I could guess the what of a few, but not the why
 
2013-06-21 11:57:10 PM

NFA: Shame they didn't have info on the make and caliber.


h2ogate: This would be a lot more interesting if there were explanations of the bullet designs.


Exactly.
 
2013-06-22 12:10:32 AM
cdn.petapixel.com

The one on the left looks like a glaser safety slug.
 
2013-06-22 12:11:09 AM
I don't see no cordite

i42.tinypic.com
 
2013-06-22 12:12:59 AM
My father was a B-17 navigator out of northern Italy.  I got your cross sections right here.
 
2013-06-22 12:17:38 AM
They would have never posted this inside information on the Internet during WWII.
 
2013-06-22 12:19:01 AM
Let's try that again.
img.fark.net
 
2013-06-22 12:20:46 AM
ghertnergenealogyblog.garyghertner.com
 
2013-06-22 12:52:44 AM

Marcus Aurelius: My father was a B-17 navigator out of northern Italy.


Hey, mine too. 8th Air Force England.
 
2013-06-22 01:24:06 AM

RoyBatty: Marcus Aurelius: My father was a B-17 navigator out of northern Italy.

Hey, mine too. 8th Air Force England.


The Eighth.  Mine too.  Did you get his jacket?
 
2013-06-22 01:33:54 AM

Marcus Aurelius: RoyBatty: Marcus Aurelius: My father was a B-17 navigator out of northern Italy.

Hey, mine too. 8th Air Force England.

The Eighth.  Mine too.  Did you get his jacket?


Nah, he came back, and rarely said anything about it. We have a couple of photos of him in uniform, but that's about it. But he kept in touch with his crew, and their captain put together the logs of all their missions and sent everyone copies -- that's pretty interesting reading, especially, IIRC, sightings of the ME-163, and after the war his aircraft traveling through Libya. But that's about all we have.

After the war he wouldn't get into another plane until the 70s when my mom convinced him to fly in a 727 back and forth to Vegas with her.
 
2013-06-22 01:38:14 AM
Doing some quick googling, I thought he was the navigator, but he may have been the Flight Engineer. I know he had this split role and was also the top turret gunner and google suggests that means he was the Flight Engineer.
 
2013-06-22 02:32:07 AM

RoyBatty: Marcus Aurelius: My father was a B-17 navigator out of northern Italy.

Hey, mine too. 8th Air Force England.



John Jacob Jingleheimer Schmidt?
 
2013-06-22 02:38:07 AM
I want to know what these are, especially the blue one and the one with the three metal spikes!
 
2013-06-22 02:39:07 AM
I question the authenticity of this World War II ammo.  I mean, basemetal posts a picture of a glaser safety slug and some sort of WSSM.  I'm not sure how many plastic rounds they used for training during WWII, either.
 
2013-06-22 02:40:59 AM

Molavian: I question the authenticity of this World War II ammo.  I mean, basemetal posts a picture of a glaser safety slug and some sort of WSSM.  I'm not sure how many plastic rounds they used for training during WWII, either.


Yeah, I was thinking that, too.  Most of these seem a hell of a lot more recent than WWII.
 
2013-06-22 02:41:40 AM

basemetal: [cdn.petapixel.com image 620x515]

The one on the left looks like a glaser safety slug.


Doesn't look terribly safe to me
 
2013-06-22 02:45:21 AM

AndreMA: basemetal: [cdn.petapixel.com image 620x515]

The one on the left looks like a glaser safety slug.

Doesn't look terribly safe to me


Depends on if you are directly in front of it or have a wall between you and it. Whereas a regular JHP it doesn't matter if there is a wall between you and it.

/I think that is the "safety" portion of these. Supposed to be safer in home defense or something.
 
2013-06-22 02:46:42 AM

RatMaster999: Molavian: I question the authenticity of this World War II ammo.  I mean, basemetal posts a picture of a glaser safety slug and some sort of WSSM.  I'm not sure how many plastic rounds they used for training during WWII, either.

Yeah, I was thinking that, too.  Most of these seem a hell of a lot more recent than WWII.




Yup, most of it looks modern to me. Also, the stick powder looks more looks more modern too.
 
2013-06-22 02:48:12 AM
Why are most of them stuffed with coffee beans?
 
2013-06-22 02:49:09 AM

NFA: Shame they didn't have info on the make and caliber.


Glad it wasn't just my aspergers that needed that. The utter lack of any detail on the (otherwise rather gorgeous) photographs, distressed me so much, it almost gave me a nosebleed.

:-/
 
2013-06-22 02:49:51 AM
Some of those straight up can't be military small arms ammo. There are international treaties (the Hague conventions specifically) that ban the use of expanding/hollow point ammo in warfare and the Geneva convention's ban on weapons that are expressly designed to maim (in this case that thing that looks like a glazer safety round). So I guess those are either larger fixed case weapons like autocannon ammo or artillery shells, some of them are civilian ammo, or the author is talking out of their arse.
 
2013-06-22 02:53:06 AM
The cross-sections reveal a hidden complexity and beauty of form, which stands in vast contrast to the destructive purpose of the object. It is a representation of the evil and the beautiful, a reflection of the human condition.

Oh for god's sake. You took a picture of bullets. It's not a deep, spiritual journey through the human experience. At least not without a sepia or black and white filter applied.

It's really interesting to see the differences inside the bullets, though.
 
2013-06-22 02:54:58 AM

amindofiron: or the author is talking out of their arse


On the internets? No wai!
 
2013-06-22 02:56:05 AM

Mock26: I want to know what these are, especially the blue one and the one with the three metal spikes!


Dunno for sure, but I have fired thousands of blue low powered .50 caliber slugs that looked similar. Come daylight, I'll go out to the shed and see if I can find one (I have a few spent casings) to compare to the image. Almost the entire round is plastic except for the primer enclosure.

We used them because the FMJ rounds will travel five or so miles, and every fifth (if I remember correctly) round is a tracer.  We built a bullet trap at our local public range out of railroad timbers in an A-frame that was 30 feet deep, filled with earth because shooting them into the hillside cause ricochets that we received complaints about.

They look like this:

img.fark.net
 
2013-06-22 02:56:19 AM

RoyBatty: After the war he wouldn't get into another plane until the 70s when my mom convinced him to fly in a 727 back and forth to Vegas with her.


My dad mentioned he used to work with an aeronautical engineer, who flew on the big mission to bomb the oil refineries at Ploiesti Romania.  He made it back, but suffered PTSD and never flew again.
 
2013-06-22 02:56:42 AM

amindofiron: There are international treaties (the Hague conventions specifically) that ban the use of expanding/hollow point ammo in warfare and the Geneva convention's ban on weapons that are expressly designed to maim (in this case that thing that looks like a glazer safety round).


She said it was a Swiss WWII bunker. She didn't say the contents of the bunker were all from WWII. Even if she had, would you mind taking a stab at whether the Geneva Convention and all those Hague treaties happened before or after WWII? Go ahead, guess.
 
2013-06-22 02:57:46 AM

RoyBatty: Doing some quick googling, I thought he was the navigator, but he may have been the Flight Engineer. I know he had this split role and was also the top turret gunner and google suggests that means he was the Flight Engineer.


If you haven't already read it, you might find John Comer's "Combat Crew" to be interesting.
 
2013-06-22 02:58:55 AM
Forgot to say, John Comer was a top gunner/flight engineer.
 
2013-06-22 03:03:33 AM

AndreMA: basemetal: [cdn.petapixel.com image 620x515]

The one on the left looks like a glaser safety slug.

Doesn't look terribly safe to me


 They break into a cloud of little particles on initial impact. This makes them not so nice for the people they explode inside of, but they are "Safety" rounds as they were apparently originally designed not to penetrate aircraft fuselages when used onboard aircraft, not to ricochet off hard surfaces like pavement and hit bystanders, and not to overpenetrate and exit original target and hit adjacent secondary targets like hostages.
 Safety slugs are cool, they minimize most possibilities of collateral damage in crowded close quarters engagements around numbers of noncombatants.
 They do cost a couple of bucks per round, but are worth it.
 
2013-06-22 03:05:50 AM

HotWingAgenda: amindofiron: There are international treaties (the Hague conventions specifically) that ban the use of expanding/hollow point ammo in warfare and the Geneva convention's ban on weapons that are expressly designed to maim (in this case that thing that looks like a glazer safety round).

She said it was a Swiss WWII bunker. She didn't say the contents of the bunker were all from WWII. Even if she had, would you mind taking a stab at whether the Geneva Convention and all those Hague treaties happened before or after WWII? Go ahead, guess.


Hague conventions where called in 1899 and 1907 respectively and the Geneva conventions where called in 1906, 1929 and 1949 respectively, what's your point? As to your other point, the article's title was "AMMO: Cross Section Photos of Bullets Used During WWII". I suppose you could quibble and claim that some of them where used in the civilian market during the same time but...
 
2013-06-22 03:14:59 AM
Seeing these in cross section kinda makes makes me go: GAH! I can sort of get what a simple "slow" slug can do to a body, but some of these look like they're designed to make burger meat. Does anybody know what's up with that flechette?
 
2013-06-22 03:19:20 AM

DreamyAltarBoy: Seeing these in cross section kinda makes makes me go: GAH! I can sort of get what a simple "slow" slug can do to a body, but some of these look like they're designed to make burger meat. Does anybody know what's up with that flechette?


If you mean the needle looking thing with the fins, the only thing I've ever seen that looked like that where armor piercing discarding sabot anti-tank shells. But because there isn't any scale I have no idea how big it is and thus, no actual clue.
 
2013-06-22 03:21:20 AM

NFA: Shame they didn't have info on the make and caliber.

h2ogate: This would be a lot more interesting if there were explanations of the bullet designs.


these
 
2013-06-22 03:26:00 AM
amindofiron:  There are international treaties (the Hague conventions specifically) that ban the use of expanding/hollow point ammo in warfare and the Geneva convention's ban on weapons that are expressly designed to maim (in this case that thing that looks like a glazer safety round).

Because that's binding :P

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/dec99-03.asp

"The present Declaration is only binding for the Contracting Powers in the case of a war between two or more of them.
It shall cease to be binding from the time when, in a war between the Contracting Parties, one of the belligerents is joined by a non-Contracting Power."

Basically, as soon as any non signatory joins either side, that clause means nah-thing
 
2013-06-22 03:29:56 AM

HotWingAgenda: amindofiron: There are international treaties (the Hague conventions specifically) that ban the use of expanding/hollow point ammo in warfare and the Geneva convention's ban on weapons that are expressly designed to maim (in this case that thing that looks like a glazer safety round).

She said it was a Swiss WWII bunker. She didn't say the contents of the bunker were all from WWII. Even if she had, would you mind taking a stab at whether the Geneva Convention and all those Hague treaties happened before or after WWII? Go ahead, guess.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hague_Conventions_of_1899_and_1907 ht tp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Conventions#Conventions

you are both right and wrong
there were geneva conventions before and after WW2

and in the end, none of it really mattered.
so we couldnt use chemical weapons? no problem, what about NUKES?!

FFS hague banned the use of balloons and other flying things to drop weapons.
Evidently no one paid attention to that part during WW2
 
2013-06-22 03:31:27 AM

Tawnos: Basically, as soon as any non signatory joins either side, that clause means nah-thing


When did the Geneva Conventions get updated to include everyone on the planet and not just people who signed on?
 
2013-06-22 03:32:16 AM

amindofiron: HotWingAgenda: amindofiron: There are international treaties (the Hague conventions specifically) that ban the use of expanding/hollow point ammo in warfare and the Geneva convention's ban on weapons that are expressly designed to maim (in this case that thing that looks like a glazer safety round).

She said it was a Swiss WWII bunker. She didn't say the contents of the bunker were all from WWII. Even if she had, would you mind taking a stab at whether the Geneva Convention and all those Hague treaties happened before or after WWII? Go ahead, guess.

Hague conventions where called in 1899 and 1907 respectively and the Geneva conventions where called in 1906, 1929 and 1949 respectively, what's your point? As to your other point, the article's title was "AMMO: Cross Section Photos of Bullets Used During WWII". I suppose you could quibble and claim that some of them where used in the civilian market during the same time but...


My bad. Generally, everyone born after WWII means the most recent (1949) convention when they are talking about "THE Geneva Convention". Sort of like how when someone mentions "THE president" they're not talking about Taft. You must be extremely long lived. As for whether the photographer says they were WWII ammunition, I can't help you. She deliberately says the subjects were photographed inside a WWII bunker, and does not say they are WWII ammunition. What kind of f*cked up unit would have 900 different types of rounds in one bunker?
 
2013-06-22 03:33:29 AM

amindofiron: DreamyAltarBoy: Seeing these in cross section kinda makes makes me go: GAH! I can sort of get what a simple "slow" slug can do to a body, but some of these look like they're designed to make burger meat. Does anybody know what's up with that flechette?

If you mean the needle looking thing with the fins, the only thing I've ever seen that looked like that where armor piercing discarding sabot anti-tank shells. But because there isn't any scale I have no idea how big it is and thus, no actual clue.


If thats the round I am thinking it is, that is actually a standard flechette as used in a beehive round. About 1.5 inches or so long. A single one was used like that to allow for a handgun cartridge to fire a projectile with enough cross-sectional density to penetrate armor. Problem was, that amount of cross-sectional density also meant it kept right on going, delivering little of its energy to the target and causing little tissue damage and no hydrostatic shock.
 
2013-06-22 03:34:53 AM
These samples were just stored in a WWII-era bunker, not FROM WW2.
Most are modern designs not even invented at the time. Oldest stuff in that spread are Cold-War era.
 
2013-06-22 03:35:10 AM

Tawnos: amindofiron:  There are international treaties (the Hague conventions specifically) that ban the use of expanding/hollow point ammo in warfare and the Geneva convention's ban on weapons that are expressly designed to maim (in this case that thing that looks like a glazer safety round).

Because that's binding :P

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/dec99-03.asp

"The present Declaration is only binding for the Contracting Powers in the case of a war between two or more of them.
It shall cease to be binding from the time when, in a war between the Contracting Parties, one of the belligerents is joined by a non-Contracting Power."

Basically, as soon as any non signatory joins either side, that clause means nah-thing


yaaaah, not so much: http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/judlawre.asp
 
2013-06-22 03:42:41 AM
photographing 900 different "specimens" of cross sectioned ammunition. Her resulting photo series, AMMO,

Her next project, cross sections of adult toys, DILDO.
 
2013-06-22 03:45:38 AM

Mock26: I want to know what these are, especially the blue one and the one with the three metal spikes!


"Metal spikes" looks like a flechette round.
 
2013-06-22 03:50:36 AM

amindofiron: Tawnos: amindofiron:  There are international treaties (the Hague conventions specifically) that ban the use of expanding/hollow point ammo in warfare and the Geneva convention's ban on weapons that are expressly designed to maim (in this case that thing that looks like a glazer safety round).

Because that's binding :P

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/dec99-03.asp

"The present Declaration is only binding for the Contracting Powers in the case of a war between two or more of them.
It shall cease to be binding from the time when, in a war between the Contracting Parties, one of the belligerents is joined by a non-Contracting Power."

Basically, as soon as any non signatory joins either side, that clause means nah-thing

yaaaah, not so much: http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/judlawre.asp


img.fark.net

 "Do not speak to me of rules. This is war! This is not a game of cricket! "
 
2013-06-22 04:03:31 AM

Nill: These samples were just stored in a WWII-era bunker, not FROM WW2.
Most are modern designs not even invented at the time. Oldest stuff in that spread are Cold-War era.


Came here to say this.

I'm curious about the pistol rounds with the giant almost cubical powder grains. What pistol uses powder that burns so slowly? Is it meant as a rifle load?
 
2013-06-22 04:03:56 AM

amindofiron: yaaaah, not so much: http://avalon.law.yale.edu/imt/judlawre.asp


I'm not even sure if you're agreeing or disagreeing with me. I'll go with the better option. You bastard. ;)
 
2013-06-22 04:05:54 AM
How does one safely saw a bullet in half?
 
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