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(USA Today)   Hey, where the white women at?   (usatoday.com) divider line 200
    More: Interesting, George Zimmerman, Relay For Life, jury  
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12763 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Jun 2013 at 10:20 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-21 10:54:43 AM

gimmegimme: Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme:  
Zimmy started the fight by stalking the 17-year-old boy.  If someone is following you around in this manner, you have the right to stand your ground and to defend yourself from the armed man who won't stop following you, first in a vehicle and then on foot.


Interesting.   Where is your evidence that Mr Martin asked Mr Zimmerman to stop following him.

I never said he asked Zimmy to back off.  We just don't know for sure.  It is clear, however, that Martin took evasive maneuvers to get away from the weirdo who was following him for so long.  If I ride up alongside a woman who is walking on the sidewalk...then I get out of the car and follow her on foot...and she tries to get away from me and I continue pursuit...I'm probably going to have a conversation with some police.

You know, unless I shoot the woman in cold blood first.  Then I get a Band-Aid and head home.


Well. why are you stating that someone refused to stop following him then.
Following that logic, a woman jogger can just shoot the male jogger 50 feet behind her on the track, She she didn't like him following her and she never communicated her displeasure to him.  Too bad, he should just know, and he kept on following her for a mile.
 
2013-06-21 10:57:45 AM
img.fark.net

When he was shot, Trayvon Martin was not the baby-faced boy in the photo, and the mugshot of George is from a criminal charge 7 years ago, later dropped. (new window)
 
2013-06-21 10:58:01 AM

Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme:  
Zimmy started the fight by stalking the 17-year-old boy.  If someone is following you around in this manner, you have the right to stand your ground and to defend yourself from the armed man who won't stop following you, first in a vehicle and then on foot.


Interesting.   Where is your evidence that Mr Martin asked Mr Zimmerman to stop following him.

I never said he asked Zimmy to back off.  We just don't know for sure.  It is clear, however, that Martin took evasive maneuvers to get away from the weirdo who was following him for so long.  If I ride up alongside a woman who is walking on the sidewalk...then I get out of the car and follow her on foot...and she tries to get away from me and I continue pursuit...I'm probably going to have a conversation with some police.

You know, unless I shoot the woman in cold blood first.  Then I get a Band-Aid and head home.

Well. why are you stating that someone refused to stop following him then.
Following that logic, a woman jogger can just shoot the male jogger 50 feet behind her on the track, She she didn't like him following her and she never communicated her displeasure to him.  Too bad, he should just know, and he kept on following her for a mile.


Soooo...what you're saying is that we can't go around shooting each other?

It's fascinating that you're criticizing Martin for apparently not communicating his displeasure at being followed to Zimmy, but you're NOT criticizing Zimmy for conducting an armed pursuit in a vehicle and then on foot and shooting the target in the chest.
 
2013-06-21 10:58:32 AM

jehovahs witness protection: abfalter: This makes me sad.  I see no chance of him being convicted.  And he should be, he really should be.

Exactly why you never belong on a jury.


This!

Look, we don't know exactly how things went down.   abfalter has already made up his mind though/  It is up to the prosecution to prove his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt though.  I bet  abfalter is one of those people who decries the death penalty because there's no way to take it back in case a mistake was made, but he's ready to execute Zimmerman based on his own prejudices.

Just based on what I know right now - and the case hasn't even been tried, nor have I sat in a courtroom and listened to all the evidence and testimony - I would have to vote not guilty because just based on what I know the case hasn't been proven beyond a reasonable doubt.

Zimmerman may be a racist wannabe cop although there is certainly quite a bit that suggests he's not racist.  OTOH, he does seem to be a hot head, but none of that proves he murdered Martin.

Drink?   Yeah, I'm way ahead of you all on that!  Cheers.

The really interesting question is how do you pick a jury who is in touch with reality that hasn't heard this story beaten to death already and already made up their mind one way or another?

If I were among the potential jurors I'd have to tell the judge that I've read about the case and see nothing that proves his guilt.  If  abfalter were honest he'd have to say he's already decided Zimmerman is guilty.  We'd both probably be excluded from the jury based on that.
 
2013-06-21 10:59:03 AM

gimmegimme: bopis: gimmegimme: Phinn: gimmegimme: Zimmy started the fight by stalking the 17-year-old boy. If someone is following you around in this manner, you have the right to stand your ground and to defend yourself from the armed man who won't stop following you, first in a vehicle and then on foot.

No, you don't.  The attack must be imminent.  There's no evidence Martin was attacked, or under imminent attack.

Martin knew he was being followed by some weirdo for quite some time, a man who was rolling in a vehicle and then got out on foot.  Was Zimmerman going to kidnap him?  Rape him?  He had no idea.  Martin tried to elude the stranger, but the man would not stop what turned out to be an armed pursuit.

So if I think someone is maybe going to rape me or kidnap me I should A) move away from him preferably to an area with witnessess around or B) hide in the bushes then ambush him from behind and smash his head into the ground? or C) something in between A and B

Awesome job blaming the victim.  Isn't it sad that Zimmy put him in the situation where he had to make such a scary choice?



You haven't proven that Martin was "the victim."  You're just assuming it.  That's called "bootstrapping."

"Putting someone in the position" of having to obey the law of self-defense is not a crime.  The law of self-defense still applies, all the time, even if you intensely dislike one of the parties involved.

You can't use force unless you reasonably believe an attack is imminent, and you still haven't proven that Martin used force on Zimmerman in response to an imminent attack..  Your personal feelings to the contrary are neither a form of evidence nor are they legally relevant.

And, the real kicker is that, even if Zimmerman had been the aggressor, Zimmerman STILL had the right to use lethal force because he had no opportunity to escape from the altercation, because he was pinned to the ground and having his head bashed into the sidewalk.
 
2013-06-21 10:59:04 AM
Juror B-51 sounded like they were trying to say all the right things to ensure a spot on the jury.Also,Zimmerman: Has the right to stand his ground.Martin: Same right? Nah. Let someone shoot him.
 
2013-06-21 10:59:42 AM

gimmegimme: Interesting.   Where is your evidence that Mr Martin asked Mr Zimmerman to stop following him.

I never said he asked Zimmy to back off.  We just don't know for sure.  It is clear, however, that Martin took evasive maneuvers to get away from the weirdo who was following him for so long.  If I ride up alongside a woman who is walking on the sidewalk...then I get out of the car and follow her on foot...and she tries to get away from me and I continue pursuit...I'm probably going to have a conversation with some police.

You know, unless I shoot the woman in cold blood first.  Then I get a Band-Aid and head home.


HAHA.  I just read the rest of your post.   Most women, they go run to open areas when threatened.
People up to no good, they go hide in the bushes.

Sometimes women will go hide in a dark place, with no lights.. maybe an old abandoned house and go find a closet, then they wait for the ominous music to start playing.  Those are called bad movies.
 
2013-06-21 11:01:56 AM

Phinn: gimmegimme: bopis: gimmegimme: Phinn: gimmegimme: Zimmy started the fight by stalking the 17-year-old boy. If someone is following you around in this manner, you have the right to stand your ground and to defend yourself from the armed man who won't stop following you, first in a vehicle and then on foot.

No, you don't.  The attack must be imminent.  There's no evidence Martin was attacked, or under imminent attack.

Martin knew he was being followed by some weirdo for quite some time, a man who was rolling in a vehicle and then got out on foot.  Was Zimmerman going to kidnap him?  Rape him?  He had no idea.  Martin tried to elude the stranger, but the man would not stop what turned out to be an armed pursuit.

So if I think someone is maybe going to rape me or kidnap me I should A) move away from him preferably to an area with witnessess around or B) hide in the bushes then ambush him from behind and smash his head into the ground? or C) something in between A and B

Awesome job blaming the victim.  Isn't it sad that Zimmy put him in the situation where he had to make such a scary choice?

You haven't proven that Martin was "the victim."  You're just assuming it.  That's called "bootstrapping."

"Putting someone in the position" of having to obey the law of self-defense is not a crime.  The law of self-defense still applies, all the time, even if you intensely dislike one of the parties involved.

You can't use force unless you reasonably believe an attack is imminent, and you still haven't proven that Martin used force on Zimmerman in response to an imminent attack..  Your personal feelings to the contrary are neither a form of evidence nor are they legally relevant.

And, the real kicker is that, even if Zimmerman had been the aggressor, Zimmerman STILL had the right to use lethal force because he had no opportunity to escape from the altercation, because he was pinned to the ground and having his head bashed into the sidewalk.


Who threw the first punch and how do you know?

Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: Interesting.   Where is your evidence that Mr Martin asked Mr Zimmerman to stop following him.

I never said he asked Zimmy to back off.  We just don't know for sure.  It is clear, however, that Martin took evasive maneuvers to get away from the weirdo who was following him for so long.  If I ride up alongside a woman who is walking on the sidewalk...then I get out of the car and follow her on foot...and she tries to get away from me and I continue pursuit...I'm probably going to have a conversation with some police.

You know, unless I shoot the woman in cold blood first.  Then I get a Band-Aid and head home.

HAHA.  I just read the rest of your post.   Most women, they go run to open areas when threatened.
People up to no good, they go hide in the bushes.

Sometimes women will go hide in a dark place, with no lights.. maybe an old abandoned house and go find a closet, then they wait for the ominous music to start playing.  Those are called bad movies.


You are making my point.  Why criticize Martin for his ineptitude at getting away from the man who shot him?  Remember...no one HAD to be shot that night.
 
2013-06-21 11:02:13 AM
erry thred is troll thred

for teh lulz
 
2013-06-21 11:04:32 AM

gimmegimme: Who threw the first punch and how do you know?



I don't know.  No one knows (based on the evidence released so far).

Since Zimmerman is presumed innocent, and the evidence is inconclusive, he cannot be convicted.

Pretty simple, really.
 
2013-06-21 11:06:34 AM

Phinn: gimmegimme: Who threw the first punch and how do you know?

I don't know.  No one knows (based on the evidence released so far).

Since Zimmerman is presumed innocent, and the evidence is inconclusive, he cannot be convicted.

Pretty simple, really.


I just don't understand how so many Farkers are gleeful that a "thug" is dead.  They bend over backwards to apply zero responsibility to the man who shot the unarmed teenager.  I have no idea where the glee comes from.
 
2013-06-21 11:06:36 AM

gimmegimme: At the very least, I would just like Zim fans to admit that it's a really pussy move to pretend you're Dirty Harry and then shoot a kid in the chest when you're losing the fight you started.


Where is your evidence that one person started assaulting the other?    If it is just in your mind, it is irrelevant.
 
2013-06-21 11:07:17 AM

gimmegimme: Remember...no one HAD to be shot that night.



Everything you say on these threads is wrong.  Wrong factually.  Wrong legally.

Here's the bottom line -- There is insufficient evidence to rebut the presumption that Zimmerman reasonably believed he HAD to shoot Martin to stop Martin's use of force against him.
 
2013-06-21 11:07:20 AM

Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: At the very least, I would just like Zim fans to admit that it's a really pussy move to pretend you're Dirty Harry and then shoot a kid in the chest when you're losing the fight you started.

Where is your evidence that one person started assaulting the other?    If it is just in your mind, it is irrelevant.


If you look at the autopsy, you'll find that Martin was shot in the chest at intermediate range.
 
2013-06-21 11:10:34 AM

Phinn: gimmegimme: Remember...no one HAD to be shot that night.

Everything you say on these threads is wrong.  Wrong factually.  Wrong legally.

Here's the bottom line -- There is insufficient evidence to rebut the presumption that Zimmerman reasonably believed he HAD to shoot Martin to stop Martin's use of force against him.


If Zimmy had followed the advice of the 911 operator...no one would have been shot.  If Zimmy hadn't decided he was going to play lawman...no one would have been shot.   If Zimmy hadn't gotten out of the car to continue his armed pursuit on foot...no one would have been shot.  If Zimmy had waited in his car for the cops to arrive...no one would have been shot.   If Zimmy hadn't followed his prey between the houses...no one would have been shot.

Please admit that you can at least see how Martin could have been scared of the creepy weirdo who was following him around for so long in a vehicle and then on foot.
 
2013-06-21 11:11:22 AM
gimmegimme: ...blah blah blah...

It's fascinating that you're criticizing Martin for apparently not communicating his displeasure at being followed to Zimmy, but you're NOT criticizing Zimmy for conducting an armed pursuit in a vehicle and then on foot and shooting the target in the chest.


Reading all of your comments, you seem to have been there and saw the entire thing unfold. Have you given your deposition yet? This could be a real game breaker!!!

/shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
 
2013-06-21 11:12:51 AM
If he had skittles, you must acquittles.

/Dude had tea, set Zimmy free.
 
2013-06-21 11:13:08 AM

James_Corn: gimmegimme: ...blah blah blah...

It's fascinating that you're criticizing Martin for apparently not communicating his displeasure at being followed to Zimmy, but you're NOT criticizing Zimmy for conducting an armed pursuit in a vehicle and then on foot and shooting the target in the chest.

Reading all of your comments, you seem to have been there and saw the entire thing unfold. Have you given your deposition yet? This could be a real game breaker!!!

/shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!


Are you denying that Zimmy followed Martin in a vehicle and then on foot?  Are you denying that he was in armed pursuit?  Are you denying that Martin was shot in the chest?

U Sill E
 
2013-06-21 11:15:04 AM
 gimmegimme: Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: At the very least, I would just like Zim fans to admit that it's a really pussy move to pretend you're Dirty Harry and then shoot a kid in the chest when you're losing the fight you started.

Where is your evidence that one person started assaulting the other?    If it is just in your mind, it is irrelevant.

If you look at the autopsy, you'll find that Martin was shot in the chest at intermediate range.


Well, why dont you post us a link?  I have never seen it.

What does that have to do with backing up your statement that Zimmerman started the battery?
An autopsy report, it just shows us who won.  We already know that one.

But just for giggle.  Fatty Mcfat was in fisticuffs lost,  somehow outgrappled and outran the football player.
then says, 'im gonna get you sukka 'and shoots Martinin the chest.  (why is Martin not running and thus, shot in the back?)

Hey, how far is 'intermediate range'?  That seems kind of vague.
 
2013-06-21 11:16:19 AM

occamswrist: megarian: I don't really see a problem with this, but I'm not sure if this represents a jury of his peers adequately.

Its a jury of his peers. Remember the phone recording where one of them screams like a girl?

/never actually listened to the tape


Okay, that was pretty funny. :)
 
2013-06-21 11:17:24 AM
So many people are going to freak when Zimmerman walks.
 
2013-06-21 11:18:05 AM

Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: At the very least, I would just like Zim fans to admit that it's a really pussy move to pretend you're Dirty Harry and then shoot a kid in the chest when you're losing the fight you started.

Where is your evidence that one person started assaulting the other?    If it is just in your mind, it is irrelevant.

If you look at the autopsy, you'll find that Martin was shot in the chest at intermediate range.

Well, why dont you post us a link?  I have never seen it.

What does that have to do with backing up your statement that Zimmerman started the battery?
An autopsy report, it just shows us who won.  We already know that one.

But just for giggle.  Fatty Mcfat was in fisticuffs lost,  somehow outgrappled and outran the football player.
then says, 'im gonna get you sukka 'and shoots Martinin the chest.  (why is Martin not running and thus, shot in the back?)

Hey, how far is 'intermediate range'?  That seems kind of vague.


Are your Google fingers broken? Zimmy shot Martin from "inches away from the teenager."
 
2013-06-21 11:19:23 AM

gimmegimme: Magnanimous_J: gimmegimme: Five of the jurors are mothers; here's hoping they'll think about what it's like when your 17-year-old kid is shot down in cold blood with a can of iced tea in his hand.

Because appealing to illogical emotion is the only chance the prosecution has.

Or maybe the jurors will think about what it's like to be attacked in your own neighborhood by a violent thug. I hear women aren't big fans of that.

Please don't call Zimmerman a "thug." That term carries racial connotations that are unpleasant to many.


That's just silly. Thug is not a racist term IMHO.
 
2013-06-21 11:25:05 AM
An all female jury, with half being minority?  This sounds like a farking setup.   I bet money the prosecutor's argument will go something like this; "Shot this child... more talking... This was somebody's son... more talking...  Defenseless child...  more talking... this childs mother... more talking... killed this mothers child ... more talking... Killed her son...  mothers grief... child... mother.... child... mother... child... mother... child... horrible racist child killing monster...
 
2013-06-21 11:25:52 AM

gimmegimme: If Zimmy had followed the advice of the 911 operator...no one would have been shot.



That's not part of the law of self-defense.

gimmegimme: If Zimmy hadn't decided he was going to play lawman...no one would have been shot.



That's not part of the law of self-defense.

gimmegimme: If Zimmy hadn't gotten out of the car to continue his armed pursuit on foot...no one would have been shot.



That's not part of the law of self-defense.

gimmegimme: If Zimmy had waited in his car for the cops to arrive...no one would have been shot.



That's not part of the law of self-defense.

gimmegimme: If Zimmy hadn't followed his prey between the houses...no one would have been shot.



You haven't proven he was "prey."  People who "prey" on others do not call the police on a recorded line and give them a play-by-play account of their activities and movements.  So, let's say Zimmerman "followed" Martin.  That fact is admitted.

Here, the evidence is that GZ was following Martin at such a distance that he lost sight of him.  That's not an "imminent" attack.

As to what happened exactly after the recorded call ended, when they came to a point when they were close enough that one could possibly pose an imminent threat to the other, there is no evidence as to exactly what happened, and thus no evidence to rebut the presumption that GZ acted in self-defense.

The only evidence that exists is in GZ's favor -- DeeDee the girlfriend has already stated that Martin decided to verbally confront GZ, did so by saying "Why are you following me?" and then violence followed.  Since she was on the phone, she has no means of determining who attacked whom.

gimmegimme: Please admit that you can at least see how Martin could have been scared of the creepy weirdo who was following him around for so long in a vehicle and then on foot.



Being "scared" is not enough to use force in self-defense.  The law says that a person must reasonably believe that force is necessary to prevent an imminent use of force.  (To use lethal force, the standard is the same, except that the threat must also be lethal in nature (i.e., pose a threat of death or serious injury)).

You have no evidence to prove that occurred.
 
2013-06-21 11:26:23 AM

gimmegimme: jfivealive: occamswrist: I love these threads...

Martin was probably looking around at the houses because it was his first time there and he didn't know where he was going and Zimmerman misinterpreted it as a kid unnecesarily standing around in the rain casing the houses.

Yep both of them made incorrect perceptions as to what was going on.  Its really too bad Zimmerman didn't just stay in his care and wait for the police.  Poor decision on his part, but still not illegal, just stupid.

At the very least, I would just like Zim fans to admit that it's a really pussy move to pretend you're Dirty Harry and then shoot a kid in the chest when you're losing the fight you started.

It's like pushing over a row of motorcycles and then shooting all of the bikers with a flamethrower when you start getting your ass kicked.


A few of us have said this.  Nobody likes the fact that the kid was shot (aside from the inevitable snarkfest that will arise from my comment).  The whole damn thing is tragic, but Zimmerman doesn't seem to be culpable, at least not from a legal standpoint. The idiot got in over his head pretending to be an X-man.
 
2013-06-21 11:26:51 AM

Nutsac_Jim: Hey, how far is 'intermediate range'? That seems kind of vague.



Anywhere from about 2 inches to 3 feet or so.
 
2013-06-21 11:26:56 AM
IronOcelot: So many people are going to freak when Zimmerman walks.

Just like OJ
 
2013-06-21 11:28:00 AM

Maul555: An all female jury, with half being minority?  This sounds like a farking setup.   I bet money the prosecutor's argument will go something like this; "Shot this child... more talking... This was somebody's son... more talking...  Defenseless child...  more talking... this childs mother... more talking... killed this mothers child ... more talking... Killed her son...  mothers grief... child... mother.... child... mother... child... mother... child... horrible racist child killing monster...


If the defense didn't think it benefited them somehow, they never would have allowed it.
 
2013-06-21 11:28:36 AM
I submitted this exact same headline yesterday.

You owe me, subby.
 
2013-06-21 11:30:31 AM
These threads bring out superior trolls.  Masters are at work here, my friends.
 
2013-06-21 11:30:39 AM
Given Martin's lifestyle at the time of the attack I feel really comfortable in concluding that society is much better off without him as a member.
 
2013-06-21 11:30:51 AM

Abuse Liability: gimmegimme: jfivealive: occamswrist: I love these threads...

Martin was probably looking around at the houses because it was his first time there and he didn't know where he was going and Zimmerman misinterpreted it as a kid unnecesarily standing around in the rain casing the houses.

Yep both of them made incorrect perceptions as to what was going on.  Its really too bad Zimmerman didn't just stay in his care and wait for the police.  Poor decision on his part, but still not illegal, just stupid.

At the very least, I would just like Zim fans to admit that it's a really pussy move to pretend you're Dirty Harry and then shoot a kid in the chest when you're losing the fight you started.

It's like pushing over a row of motorcycles and then shooting all of the bikers with a flamethrower when you start getting your ass kicked.

A few of us have said this.  Nobody likes the fact that the kid was shot (aside from the inevitable snarkfest that will arise from my comment).  The whole damn thing is tragic, but Zimmerman doesn't seem to be culpable, at least not from a legal standpoint. The idiot got in over his head pretending to be an X-man.


This is the middle ground I'm talking about.  When people say, "HAHA  the THUG got wut he deserrved...purple drank," they don't seem to be arguing from a place of openness and reason.

I can see how Zimmerman was scared because, however the altercation started in earnest, he was in a fight.  Unlike some Zim fans, I can also see how an unarmed 17-year-old kid would be skeeved out  by the weirdo who was following him around for so long.
 
2013-06-21 11:31:42 AM

Profedius: Given Martin's lifestyle at the time of the attack I feel really comfortable in concluding that society is much better off without him as a member.


Zimmerman was the one with the documented history of violence.
 
2013-06-21 11:32:07 AM

gimmegimme: Soooo...what you're saying is that we can't go around shooting each other?

It's fascinating that you're criticizing Martin for apparently not communicating his displeasure at being followed to Zimmy, but you're NOT criticizing Zimmy for conducting an armed pursuit in a vehicle and then on foot and shooting the target in the chest.


No.. I am not criticizing Martin.  I am criticizing you for asserting that the reason for assaulting Zimmerman was because clearly zimmerman would not stop following him.    I think it is fine to assault a person that follows you after you express that you do not like his behavior and you find it threatening.

I have no evidence that Martin demanded Zimmerman stop.  I have no evidence that Martin didnt hide in the bushes and give Zimmerman a donkey punch.
Neither do you.

'Armed pursuit' is loaded.  This makes it sound like someone hunted the other down 'like a dog'.
He was simply following someone and happened to be carrying.  That's it.

Calling someone a pussy for carrying is also loaded.
 
2013-06-21 11:33:15 AM

Magnanimous_J: Maul555: An all female jury, with half being minority?  This sounds like a farking setup.   I bet money the prosecutor's argument will go something like this; "Shot this child... more talking... This was somebody's son... more talking...  Defenseless child...  more talking... this childs mother... more talking... killed this mothers child ... more talking... Killed her son...  mothers grief... child... mother.... child... mother... child... mother... child... horrible racist child killing monster...

If the defense didn't think it benefited them somehow, they never would have allowed it.


I thought most of the jurors were white... I only remember them mention one as 'person of color' (which is pretty laughable in itself).  It did seem pretty straightforward as to which jurors were for which side (hint: the ones that the prosecution tried to dismiss should give you a fair indication)
 
2013-06-21 11:34:03 AM

IronOcelot: So many people are going to freak when Zimmerman walks.


Like the angry white gun enthusiasts who've been freaking out since Newtown?
 
2013-06-21 11:35:22 AM
None of us know all the facts in this case, so why do we keep angrily arguing about it?
 
2013-06-21 11:35:38 AM
Nutsac_Jim:

No.. I am not criticizing Martin.  I am criticizing you for asserting that the reason for assaulting Zimmerman was because clearly zimmerman would not stop following him.    I think it is fine to assault a person that follows you after you express that you do not like his behavior and you find it threatening.

You're putting too much of a burden on the victim.  An adult doesn't have to be told not to follow people around.  Adults understand that is unpleasant and suspicious behavior.  If I follow a 17-year-old woman in a vehicle and then on foot, the police will have a talk with me.

I have no evidence that Martin demanded Zimmerman stop.  I have no evidence that Martin didnt hide in the bushes and give Zimmerman a donkey punch.
Neither do you.

'Armed pursuit' is loaded.  This makes it sound like someone hunted the other down 'like a dog'.
He was simply following someone and happened to be carrying.  That's it.



Zimmy was armed.  He was clearly in pursuit.  I'm sorry if you don't like words.

Calling someone a pussy for carrying is also loaded.

No, a pussy starts a fistfight and then grabs his gun when he's losing.
 
2013-06-21 11:36:45 AM

Lady Beryl Ersatz-Wendigo: I see the Stormfront contingent is up early today.


And the race-baiters.
 
2013-06-21 11:37:40 AM
So I guess the jury's menstrual cycles will all sync up then.

Kinda like in the Politics tab.
 
2013-06-21 11:38:41 AM

Phinn: Nutsac_Jim: Hey, how far is 'intermediate range'? That seems kind of vague.

Anywhere from about 2 inches to 3 feet or so.



To be more clear, "intermediate range" is determined by the existence or absence of powder and/or powder burns.

When a gun is fired, some powder exits along with the bullet.  Some of that powder is still burning as it exits, having reached a fresh supply of oxygen, and continues to burn for a microsecond.  This is the source of the muzzle flash you often see.  Different gun-barrel lengths and different ammunition produce different amounts of still-burning powder at the muzzle.

From the forensic examiner's perspective, if there is no powder at all found on the site of the GSW, then the shot must have been "at a distance."  The powder did not travel all the way to the target.  That varies, but will be at least a few feet away.

If the shot was made at contact, or at near-contact range, then that means the M.E. found a circular or crescent-shaped muzzle-scorch on the target.  The powder was still burning when it made contact.  If it was on skin, then burning powder will tattoo the skin - embed in the outer layer and make a distinctive mark.

"Intermediate" means that (a) there was powder found on the target, but (b) it was not still burning when it landed there.  Powder stops burning after about 2 inches, at most, from the muzzle of a gun, including the kind of gun GZ used.
 
2013-06-21 11:39:23 AM

airsupport: Lady Beryl Ersatz-Wendigo: I see the Stormfront contingent is up early today.

And the race-baiters.


As I already pointed out, "thug" is not a racially loaded term.  It stands for

Totally
Happy
Undergraduate
Geologist.

///I guess that's why some folks claim Martin was interested in rocks.
 
2013-06-21 11:40:38 AM

Phinn: Phinn: Nutsac_Jim: Hey, how far is 'intermediate range'? That seems kind of vague.

Anywhere from about 2 inches to 3 feet or so.

To be more clear, "intermediate range" is determined by the existence or absence of powder and/or powder burns.

When a gun is fired, some powder exits along with the bullet.  Some of that powder is still burning as it exits, having reached a fresh supply of oxygen, and continues to burn for a microsecond.  This is the source of the muzzle flash you often see.  Different gun-barrel lengths and different ammunition produce different amounts of still-burning powder at the muzzle.

From the forensic examiner's perspective, if there is no powder at all found on the site of the GSW, then the shot must have been "at a distance."  The powder did not travel all the way to the target.  That varies, but will be at least a few feet away.

If the shot was made at contact, or at near-contact range, then that means the M.E. found a circular or crescent-shaped muzzle-scorch on the target.  The powder was still burning when it made contact.  If it was on skin, then burning powder will tattoo the skin - embed in the outer layer and make a distinctive mark.

"Intermediate" means that (a) there was powder found on the target, but (b) it was not still burning when it landed there.  Powder stops burning after about 2 inches, at most, from the muzzle of a gun, including the kind of gun GZ used.


Wow.  Those are great descriptions.  That kind of wound sounds terrible.  Kinda makes me wonder why some folks complain about Zimmy's ouchies.
 
2013-06-21 11:41:36 AM

gimmegimme: It's fascinating that you're criticizing Martin for apparently not communicating his displeasure at being followed to Zimmy, but you're NOT criticizing Zimmy for conducting an armed pursuit in a vehicle and then on foot and shooting the target in the chest.


I'm going to criticize Martin for hiding behind peoples houses.  Why? Because that is not what I would do.
Would I have followed Martin?  Nope.  Just not my style.    Should Zimmerman be guilty of manslaughter.  Probably.

Murder... not a chance.
 
2013-06-21 11:42:50 AM

Magnanimous_J: Lady Beryl Ersatz-Wendigo: I see the Stormfront contingent is up early today.


When the facts aren't on your side, cry racism.


Go fark yourself with a rake.



Looks to me like he targeted him because he was black.  Evidence is the racial slurs(supposedly unintelligible)  in the 911 call.  If it was a 17 yo white kid wearing his letter jacket Z would have headed home to watch reruns of Cops and read the latest Guns and Ammo.

Z was told not to pursue from police and he did anyway.  That's why this kid id dead.
 
2013-06-21 11:43:38 AM

Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: It's fascinating that you're criticizing Martin for apparently not communicating his displeasure at being followed to Zimmy, but you're NOT criticizing Zimmy for conducting an armed pursuit in a vehicle and then on foot and shooting the target in the chest.

I'm going to criticize Martin for hiding behind peoples houses.  Why? Because that is not what I would do.
Would I have followed Martin?  Nope.  Just not my style.    Should Zimmerman be guilty of manslaughter.  Probably.

Murder... not a chance.


Please prove that Martin was "hiding behind people's houses."

I just want the case to be dealt with in a fair manner by our criminal justice system.  Some folks don't even think Zimmy should be on trial and that he should be given the key to the city for flushing a Totally Happy Undergraduate Geologist down the drain.
 
2013-06-21 11:44:21 AM

gimmegimme: Are your Google fingers broken? Zimmy shot Martin from "inches away from the teenager."


That is grappling distance.  That is hardly 'hunt him down and kill him distance'
 
2013-06-21 11:46:39 AM
Jeez you people, stupid questions and statements all over the place but nobody has asked the important question.


Are any of the women hot?
 
2013-06-21 11:47:17 AM

gimmegimme: Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: Nutsac_Jim: gimmegimme: At the very least, I would just like Zim fans to admit that it's a really pussy move to pretend you're Dirty Harry and then shoot a kid in the chest when you're losing the fight you started.

Where is your evidence that one person started assaulting the other?    If it is just in your mind, it is irrelevant.

If you look at the autopsy, you'll find that Martin was shot in the chest at intermediate range.

Well, why dont you post us a link?  I have never seen it.

What does that have to do with backing up your statement that Zimmerman started the battery?
An autopsy report, it just shows us who won.  We already know that one.

But just for giggle.  Fatty Mcfat was in fisticuffs lost,  somehow outgrappled and outran the football player.
then says, 'im gonna get you sukka 'and shoots Martinin the chest.  (why is Martin not running and thus, shot in the back?)

Hey, how far is 'intermediate range'?  That seems kind of vague.

Are your Google fingers broken? Zimmy shot Martin from "inches away from the teenager."


How does being 'inches away from the teenager' prove who started the assault?
 
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