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(Pop Matters)   In the game world, we can't feel the pain of taking a bullet or check our wallet to see what's in it. There just isn't a button for that   ( popmatters.com) divider line
    More: Interesting, Learn to Love, HUD, Liberty City, London Streets, pain, Telltale Games  
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2624 clicks; posted to Geek » on 21 Jun 2013 at 11:45 AM (4 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



40 Comments     (+0 »)
 
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2013-06-21 11:41:28 AM  
Everyone associated w/ UW-SP is drunk.
 
2013-06-21 11:58:30 AM  
I vaguely remember a vest peripheral for the Sega Genesis that would pulse whenever you got hit in Mortal Kombat, so you could "feel" the character's pain.
 
2013-06-21 12:02:13 PM  
So... HUDs are kinda weird because they're not realistic, but they're ultimately useful as many games would be basically unplayable without them? Was that the point of that article? Ok... thanks, I guess.
 
2013-06-21 12:05:48 PM  
Idiots, that's not Wolfenstein.  That's Wolfenstein 3D, released a decade after Wolfenstein by a completely different company.
 
2013-06-21 12:06:34 PM  
Easy to fix. you die in a game, the game dies.
do you want to play again? pay again.
 
2013-06-21 12:07:13 PM  

Car_Ramrod: So... HUDs are kinda weird because they're not realistic, but they're ultimately useful as many games would be basically unplayable without them? Was that the point of that article? Ok... thanks, I guess.


Actually, some of the HUDs I have seen in games are explained very well. Usually in FPS's, its explained as some form of tech like glasses or part of the suit.
 
2013-06-21 12:11:02 PM  

yves0010: Actually, some of the HUDs I have seen in games are explained very well. Usually in FPS's, its explained as some form of tech like glasses or part of the suit.


Deus Ex: Human Revolution... no HUD before implants if I remember right.
 
2013-06-21 12:11:16 PM  
Castle Wolfenstein (Muse Software, 1981)

Picture of Wolfenstein 3-D


Oh boy.
 
2013-06-21 12:12:19 PM  
If anyone wants an example of a game that does pretty well communicating everything without a HUD, try Miasmata.

There is one HUD element, but it won't come into existence until you're well into the game, only rarely.
 
2013-06-21 12:16:36 PM  

yves0010: Car_Ramrod: So... HUDs are kinda weird because they're not realistic, but they're ultimately useful as many games would be basically unplayable without them? Was that the point of that article? Ok... thanks, I guess.

Actually, some of the HUDs I have seen in games are explained very well. Usually in FPS's, its explained as some form of tech like glasses or part of the suit.


Well yea. It makes sense in Halo, etc, but not GTA, Call of Duty, Bioshock, etc.
 
2013-06-21 12:18:46 PM  
Oh, and there's nothing wrong with having a HUD, or a UI, or arbitrary scoring systems, or whatever systems you're using, so long as you can justify the systems.  Bulletstorm integrates its scoring system with its narrative.  Games like Halo: Combat Evolved and Metroid Prime use narrative to justify the on-screen representations of their mechanics.  It's just that, for roughly twenty years following the first commercial video games, companies didn't have the technology to provide context for those essential details, and then it took them a decade following to really get things hammered and sorted out.  Depending on the game, this can be extremely difficult, so it's usually better to provide quality stylization.  (See: Anything which isn't set in the present or near-future, where you can't use "augmented reality" or computer technology as the justification.)  However, the biggest offender out of the lot is the MMO genre, where third-party applications are openly encouraged and the games play closer to spreadsheet wars than an actual simulation of anything.

In the 1994 open world action game The Getaway,

RRRRRRGGH
 
2013-06-21 12:19:13 PM  

Click Click D'oh: yves0010: Actually, some of the HUDs I have seen in games are explained very well. Usually in FPS's, its explained as some form of tech like glasses or part of the suit.

Deus Ex: Human Revolution... no HUD before implants if I remember right.


FEAR 2 did something like that. Where you do not have your glasses on and you do not have your HUD showing.

Car_Ramrod: yves0010: Car_Ramrod: So... HUDs are kinda weird because they're not realistic, but they're ultimately useful as many games would be basically unplayable without them? Was that the point of that article? Ok... thanks, I guess.

Actually, some of the HUDs I have seen in games are explained very well. Usually in FPS's, its explained as some form of tech like glasses or part of the suit.

Well yea. It makes sense in Halo, etc, but not GTA, Call of Duty, Bioshock, etc.


Isn't there a game that makes your cell phone the HUD and displays everything on it?
 
2013-06-21 12:24:53 PM  
First Person Shooters are, by definition, unrealistic, even the so-called "realistic" ones like Call of Duty.  In the real world, if you get shot a single (excluding maybe in a limb), you are, at the very least, incapacitated, if not dead.  Blood doesn't fall off your face if you duck behind a chest high wall, and picking up a First Aid Kit doesn't immediately heal you of all wounds.  HUDs being unrealistic is much less of an issue than a guy that gets shot ten times and then completely heals himself up if he finds a couple boxes with red crosses on them.
 
2013-06-21 12:27:17 PM  

Geotpf: First Person Shooters are, by definition, unrealistic, even the so-called "realistic" ones like Call of Duty.  In the real world, if you get shot a single (excluding maybe in a limb), you are, at the very least, incapacitated, if not dead.  Blood doesn't fall off your face if you duck behind a chest high wall, and picking up a First Aid Kit doesn't immediately heal you of all wounds.  HUDs being unrealistic is much less of an issue than a guy that gets shot ten times and then completely heals himself up if he finds a couple boxes with red crosses on them.


I think Ghost Recon did a good realistic shooter. You get shot once and you can take sever damage or even get killed.
 
2013-06-21 12:29:49 PM  

Geotpf: First Person Shooters are, by definition, unrealistic, even the so-called "realistic" ones like Call of Duty.  In the real world, if you get shot a single (excluding maybe in a limb), you are, at the very least, incapacitated, if not dead.  Blood doesn't fall off your face if you duck behind a chest high wall, and picking up a First Aid Kit doesn't immediately heal you of all wounds.  HUDs being unrealistic is much less of an issue than a guy that gets shot ten times and then completely heals himself up if he finds a couple boxes with red crosses on them.


There have been first person shooters that actually were aware of that.  Being shot in the first couple rainbow six games(before ubisoft got a hold of the series) was sudden, unexpected, and universally debilitating.
 
2013-06-21 12:47:21 PM  
I see someone doesn't play "HARDCORE" in just about any modern FPS.
 
2013-06-21 12:54:00 PM  
ikanreed:  Being shot in the first couple rainbow six games(before ubisoft got a hold of the series) was sudden, unexpected, and universally debilitating.

Unless you shot a terrorist with the M82A1.  Then there was about an even chance that they would shout for help while slowly limping to cover.
 
2013-06-21 01:05:26 PM  

ikanreed: There have been first person shooters that actually were aware of that. Being shot in the first couple rainbow six games(before ubisoft got a hold of the series) was sudden, unexpected, and universally debilitating.


They're often referred to at 'tactical shooters'. You also lost the mission if a hostage died, which happened easily if you didn't breach a room properly. A lot more thought used to go into playing shooters.
 
2013-06-21 01:24:00 PM  
Many games have found inventive ways to avoid a HUD.

A pretty elegant solution is found in Gears of War of all places.  Your weapons are stored on your characters back in the same orientation as the inventory. You can immediately see that hitting left on the D pad will pull out the weapon on the left of your character's back.
 
2013-06-21 01:46:29 PM  
You would think an Associate Professor of English would have expressed the viewpoint he was arguing a little more clearly.

(Totally reads like it was written by an Associate Professor of English)
 
2013-06-21 01:50:28 PM  

itsdan: ikanreed: There have been first person shooters that actually were aware of that. Being shot in the first couple rainbow six games(before ubisoft got a hold of the series) was sudden, unexpected, and universally debilitating.

They're often referred to at 'tactical shooters'. You also lost the mission if a hostage died, which happened easily if you didn't breach a room properly. A lot more thought used to go into playing shooters.


Delta Force was a very realistic series too. Best bullet ballistics in a FPS that I've ever played. Realistic run speed and distances. Getting shot in a critical spot was instant death; getting pegged elsewhere could kill you too.
 
2013-06-21 01:55:56 PM  
ikanreed:
There have been first person shooters that actually were aware of that.  Being shot in the first couple rainbow six games(before ubisoft got a hold of the series) was sudden, unexpected, and universally debilitating.

if ever there was a game that needed to be updated and/or properly remade it is the first couple rainbow six games.  They were so hard but so fun and MP was a blast.
 
2013-06-21 02:15:35 PM  

Plant Rights Activist: if ever there was a game that needed to be updated and/or properly remade it is the first couple rainbow six games. They were so hard but so fun and MP was a blast.


I want to say there was a kickstarter for one. If there wasn't, there should be. If there was, there should be more.
 
2013-06-21 02:55:20 PM  
media.tumblr.comView Full Size
 
2013-06-21 03:27:25 PM  

itsdan: Plant Rights Activist: if ever there was a game that needed to be updated and/or properly remade it is the first couple rainbow six games. They were so hard but so fun and MP was a blast.

I want to say there was a kickstarter for one. If there wasn't, there should be. If there was, there should be more.


The rights belong to Ubisoft, why the heck would Ubisoft need a kickstarter?
 
2013-06-21 03:31:25 PM  
Just add HUDs to real life.  Realism problem solved.
 
2013-06-21 03:40:07 PM  

ikanreed: The rights belong to Ubisoft, why the heck would Ubisoft need a kickstarter?


Sorry, I meant a kickstarter for a modern tactical shooter, a spiritual successor to the old R6 games, not a new license.
 
2013-06-21 04:49:12 PM  

itsdan: ikanreed: The rights belong to Ubisoft, why the heck would Ubisoft need a kickstarter?

Sorry, I meant a kickstarter for a modern tactical shooter, a spiritual successor to the old R6 games, not a new license.



Done and done. 
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/355932838/crowdsourced-hardcore- ta ctical-shooter

/Got my Red Saber badge in the mail a few months after pledging.
/No note or anything. Clean forgot it was coming.
/Its not often you open a letter and expect to hear: "Greetings, Starfighter. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the frontier against Xur and the Ko-Dan armada."
 
2013-06-21 05:05:21 PM  

artc351: Easy to fix. you die in a game, the game dies.
do you want to play again? pay again.


Already done. Check out "The War Z". While the game doesn't die, your character does- along with all the equipment you were carrying, including weapons. You then have to shell out for new gear (without which you won't survive long) using hard to come by in-game cash, or Special Money paid for with real-world dollars.
 
2013-06-21 06:36:43 PM  

ProfessorOhki: Just add HUDs to real life.  Realism problem solved


With the advent of Google Glass (if it ever) this is a VERY real possibility. In all honesty, a HUD for real life would not only be practical, but the next step. Imagine having a HUD capable of giving you concrete read-outs of for example, your blood-sugar levels, energy levels, calories burnt, calories ingested, etc. Technology is really almost there. Right now, we use Apps for it all anyways, why not streamline that process and be able to see ALL of it at once? Your calendar in a HUD, emails, phone calls, everything that you typically have to run multiple apps to do or use multiple devices at your beck and call. The ability to create custom HUD stats for each user.

If games have taught us anything, it is that we can be more precise, quicker, and informed with a HUD. Besides, in many games, you can always hide it if it gets to be too much...
 
2013-06-21 07:46:15 PM  
I really like games without HUDs (or with very minimal ones). Vietcong's "hardcore" mode is a great example. Looking at your map actually pointed your head down at an object in your hands for example. It's amazing how much more "present" in the world you feel if there isn't a 2D layer between you and it.

Try playing a game like CoD or Battlefield without seeing kill messages or hit confirmation. It's startling how much information (and how little you'd play it like real life) these things add.
 
2013-06-21 08:27:29 PM  

the money is in the banana stand: ProfessorOhki: Just add HUDs to real life.  Realism problem solved

With the advent of Google Glass (if it ever) this is a VERY real possibility. In all honesty, a HUD for real life would not only be practical, but the next step. Imagine having a HUD capable of giving you concrete read-outs of for example, your blood-sugar levels, energy levels, calories burnt, calories ingested, etc. Technology is really almost there. Right now, we use Apps for it all anyways, why not streamline that process and be able to see ALL of it at once? Your calendar in a HUD, emails, phone calls, everything that you typically have to run multiple apps to do or use multiple devices at your beck and call. The ability to create custom HUD stats for each user.

If games have taught us anything, it is that we can be more precise, quicker, and informed with a HUD. Besides, in many games, you can always hide it if it gets to be too much...


Hey speaking of glass I'm really looking forward to the "Find her nudes" app that will dox every woman you meet and impose the pictures upon them as they stand before you.  Its gonna be awesome.
 
2013-06-21 08:29:47 PM  

the money is in the banana stand: Imagine having a HUD capable of giving you concrete read-outs of for example, your blood-sugar levels, energy levels, calories burnt, calories ingested, etc.


I'd love a hud that could mark up heat sources (meese and/or deer) while I'm driving at night, and selectively dampen the glare of oncoming headlights.
 
2013-06-21 08:32:48 PM  

BumpInTheNight: Hey speaking of glass I'm really looking forward to the "Find her nudes" app that will dox every woman you meet and impose the pictures upon them as they stand before you. Its gonna be awesome.


img.fark.netView Full Size
 
2013-06-21 08:44:40 PM  

BumpInTheNight: the money is in the banana stand: ProfessorOhki: Just add HUDs to real life.  Realism problem solved

With the advent of Google Glass (if it ever) this is a VERY real possibility. In all honesty, a HUD for real life would not only be practical, but the next step. Imagine having a HUD capable of giving you concrete read-outs of for example, your blood-sugar levels, energy levels, calories burnt, calories ingested, etc. Technology is really almost there. Right now, we use Apps for it all anyways, why not streamline that process and be able to see ALL of it at once? Your calendar in a HUD, emails, phone calls, everything that you typically have to run multiple apps to do or use multiple devices at your beck and call. The ability to create custom HUD stats for each user.

If games have taught us anything, it is that we can be more precise, quicker, and informed with a HUD. Besides, in many games, you can always hide it if it gets to be too much...

Hey speaking of glass I'm really looking forward to the "Find her nudes" app that will dox every woman you meet and impose the pictures upon them as they stand before you.  Its gonna be awesome.


Meanwhile your face is pulling up the "jerks who use that naked picture finding app" tag on some social gossip/rating site. The future's going to be an interesting place.
 
2013-06-21 08:58:06 PM  
I remember when I was a younger gamer, a game called "Metal Warriors" on the SNES.

The damage indicator was basically how trashed your mech looked. It's the first game I recall that did it well (vs just doing a palette swap).
 
2013-06-21 10:00:29 PM  
What game were you playing where you could push a button to take a bullet...?
 
2013-06-21 11:55:20 PM  

artc351: Easy to fix. you die in a game, the game dies.
do you want to play again? pay again.


i go one

everytime you die you get charged a dollar automatically

turn it into gambling - you bet $.30 on every kill, so it takes 3 kills to make up for your death
 
2013-06-22 04:04:34 AM  

Geotpf: First Person Shooters are, by definition, unrealistic, even the so-called "realistic" ones like Call of Duty.  In the real world, if you get shot a single (excluding maybe in a limb), you are, at the very least, incapacitated, if not dead.  Blood doesn't fall off your face if you duck behind a chest high wall, and picking up a First Aid Kit doesn't immediately heal you of all wounds.  HUDs being unrealistic is much less of an issue than a guy that gets shot ten times and then completely heals himself up if he finds a couple boxes with red crosses on them.


Medic! We need a first aid kit for a field injury of butthurt over here!

/carts the kit with the pic of a butt and crosses over
//agree with ya
 
2013-06-22 12:59:48 PM  

AdamK: artc351: Easy to fix. you die in a game, the game dies.
do you want to play again? pay again.

i go one

everytime you die you get charged a dollar automatically

turn it into gambling - you bet $.30 on every kill, so it takes 3 kills to make up for your death


And It would still be a better game than Diablo 3
 
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