If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(CBC)   Whiny, self entitled "millennials" who wasted their time and put themselves in crushing debt chasing useless degrees STILL complaining about lack of jobs in their chosen fields... like nursing, law, teaching, etc   (cbc.ca) divider line 200
    More: Fail, secondary education, University of Guelph, nursing, Gen Y, bachelor's degrees, higher educations  
•       •       •

7770 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Jun 2013 at 1:19 PM (42 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



200 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | » | Last | Show all
 
2013-06-21 03:50:00 PM

No Such Agency: Galileo's Daughter:
Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.

Sorry, Canadian article.  Most of our young people can do the math: those thousands in signing bonuses don't pay for as much health insurance as our taxes do in Canada (not to mention living in a fundamentalist-infested "right-to-work" state).


So they'd rather other people pay for their healthcare, then? :-P
 
2013-06-21 03:56:14 PM

Maul555: I have been feeling this same crunch in the states...  I got layed off in late 07 when the economy took a dump, and then bounced around for a couple of years.  Now it is almost impossible to get back into my career field with all the new over educated kids up for grabs and the imported people from all over the country swamping the Texas job market that I cant hope to compete with.  Add to that the illegal aliens bringing down wages while congress is trying to make them permanent so I can get farked even harder...


You sound uneducated
 
2013-06-21 03:57:15 PM
News flash: There are way too many farking lawyers students. How do you not know this?
 
2013-06-21 03:58:56 PM

verbaltoxin: Let's say I were a film director. What did I learn in my experiences?

- How to start a project from the ground, which requires budget, financing, equipment, logistics, personnel, and location.
- How to resolve personnel disputes (Can you imagine managing anybody more needy and annoying than actors?).
- How to deal with complex management and work across multiple agencies (Producers, studios, theaters, distributors).
- How to market the product so it can recoup its budget or make a profit.
- How to use graphics and film editing software.
- How to run my own goddamned business, because that's what being a director essentially is, especially if you're independent.

Yeah, there are no companies whatsoever that could use skills like these. None. They're all hiring engineers and only engineers.

Because engineers never need project managers, human resources, financial managers, client representatives or any other support personnel to keep their little projects from going over-budget and burning the building to the ground.


1) A failed film student might not get that experience, otherwise, they wouldn't really be failed.
2) Why would an engineering firm hire someone with a film degree for that job instead of someone in the engineering field with a logistics background?

It's not like I'm deciding that this is the way the world works.  That's what TFA is about, and a dozen like it every day.  You're perpetuating the same stupid ideas that created this problem with too many kids, with impractical degrees looking for work.
 
2013-06-21 03:59:22 PM

overlord_mike: The main problem I'm seeing is that there are tons of jobs out there, but they want experience even for entry level positions and that makes it hard for new grads to get into their desired field.


Here's a tip - any job that lists 1-3 years experience wanted is entry level and they're looking for someone fresh out of school. Any job that lists 3-5 years would take you if you're especially impressive. My first job out if college was listed as minimum 3 years experience. Too many recent grads just give up when they don't see any entry level positions. Also, this "I can't get a job because I don't have experience because I can't get a job" thing has been happening since people started working, nothing new or unique.
 
2013-06-21 04:00:26 PM

The_Gallant_Gallstone: miss jinxed: Getting a kick out of the article since I'm the same age as most of the people in the article and I'm sitting at my current job playing Candy Crush and sending out resumes.

You sound like a perfect candidate for me to hire for my imaginary firm.  I can tell who is loyal and diligent from the most cursory exposure.

We'll give you a top secret clearance, $122K a year, an office in Hawaii and complete, unfettered access to all of our most intimate information.


Not only will I do this job ... I will do it from Hong Kong
 
2013-06-21 04:00:44 PM
Nursing? That's horseshiat. There's a nursing shortage. If you can't find a job as a nurse, you're apparently unwilling to relocate.
 
2013-06-21 04:01:06 PM
BgJonson79:
No Such Agency: Galileo's Daughter:
Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.

Sorry, Canadian article.  Most of our young people can do the math: those thousands in signing bonuses don't pay for as much health insurance as our taxes do in Canada (not to mention living in a fundamentalist-infested "right-to-work" state).

So they'd rather other people pay for their healthcare, then? :-P


static.guim.co.uk
TAXES HOW DO THEY WORK

Generally if you're young and healthy enough to work, on the average you're paying for other people's health care, for the time being.
 
2013-06-21 04:01:57 PM

Joe1549: Hmm... technology increases making the economy too efficient, so there's not enough jobs for everyone. Color me surprised. This will keep on happening, and get worse as technology gets more efficient.


Keep in mind that the last time this happened, it was called the Industrial Revolution.

Large-scale low-labor farming techniques improved yields immensely, forcing millions of small farmers off their land.  They all went inwards to the cities, and worked in hellish conditions in manufacturing.  Eventually, a combination of labor unions, large-scale infrastructure projects to prevent things like dumping raw sewage into the rivers, and the simple fact that increasing industrial production by 2 orders of magnitude over a couple of centuries (while increasing population by 1 order) was eventually going to lift all boats to at least some extent created the modern manufacturing economy we knew and loved during the 1950's.

Since then, a combination of robots and computers on the high end and Chinese workers working for 10 cents a day has wiped out or replaced entire industries (outsourceable manufacturing, secretaries, etc) while leaving others behind (Data entry worker isn't terribly useful).  We're at the "Millions of people get kicked off their land, head to cities and starve while working for pennies a day because they're infinitely replaceable, making the people with money and resources even richer in the process" Gilded Era phase, not the " Modern version of TR shows up and institutes massive reforms now that the new industries have shown up, shaken out and we've eked out another order of magnitude of production on top of the first two (Seriously.  Industrial Revolution numbers are scary.  They're exponential even on log charts. Even Real GDP/Capita did a good order of magnitude between the start and the end.  It wasn't terribly fair, but man there was a lot of money floating around)" phase.

Honestly, what's really screwing people this time around though is that in the First Industrial Revolution, agriculture => manufacturing was an easy transition.  If you were strong and hardworking enough to farm, you were strong and hard-working enough to go work in a factory 12 hours a day.

But this time, the jobs getting wiped out (Manufacturing, secretaries, etc) don't really transition well to the high-paying new jobs (Software programmers).  There's probably a good decade of experience involved in becoming a good engineer.  The newly-useless can't take 5 years off to go back to school.  Even if they have the aptitude, they have kids and a mortgage.  There's some movement between manufacturing and the trades, but  they can't become ditch-diggers or construction workers since these days it's a backhoe and 3 guys with serious tools and (at least in theory) years of experience and training instead of hundreds of guys with picks and hammers (and when theory fails, it's Hispanics who don't speak English working for less than minimum wage).  And the women are screwed.  Any job that requires sheer physical strength is more or less off-limits to 90% of all women.  So if they don't have the education, and they don't have the physical ability, they're screwed.

WIth that said, for the kids entering college:

* T,E, and possibly M are great IFF you have the aptitude and the drive to put in 80-120 hour weeks through much of school.   S has a problem where since it's not directly valuable (and has a massive glut because of all the STEM majors), it's not a great place to make money.

* Look at the average because you are probably average.  Average engineer has an ok house and a nice car in a good neighborhood.  Average actor is waiting tables.  Average PHD in Medieval Lit is overqualified to wait tables and has $200K of student debt they can never get rid of.

* Trades are great because they're not outsourceable.  A plumber here charging $50/hour does me a lot more good than a plumber in China charging 10c/hour.  The second richest of my father's 12 brothers and sisters is a truck driver with a high school diploma (the richest was a mover, went to night school, and ended up a high-up muckity-muck at Ford).  He works 4 days a week, and has a fantastic pension (and is close enough to retirement he'll probably keep it).

* If you're poor, stay the fark away from the coasts.  Your wages stay flat while your rent quadruples.

* If you're rich, get out to the coasts.  Wages go up way faster for programmers/engineers than COL (with the oddball exception of Detroit and surround, which pays like 2x what it "should" be paying given the COL).

* COL matters.  For people from the midwest, $75K/year is not rich in NYC.  It's probably roommate/hour-long commute/both wages.  By the same token, NYC people, $50K in the right midwestern city can be worth a LOT.  My mother just sold the house I grew up in for $150K, and Dad's renting 1000 sq. ft. for $550/month.   And the midwestern cities actually build infrastructure, so commutes aren't hellish nightmares (Chicago doesn't count.  Chicago wishes it was on the East Coast).

* Stay the fark away from political jobs for at least the next few decades.  By "political jobs", I mean any job where your compensation is part of a political debate (healthcare) or partly or wholly government funded(teachers).  The combination of pensions on the state and city level as well as SS and Medicare means that you're about to see a massive crunch.

* Stay the fark away from whatever is hot right now unless you're really, really good.  Everyone else is hearing that it's hot, majoring in it, and then creating a glut 4 years from now when the market crashes and these shiny new grads can't find jobs.

* Don't be afraid to move.  Your local market might be farked, but it doesn't mean that everywhere else is.

* The top end of any market is really farked-up.  Like "Your salary is somewhere between a tenth and a half of your total income depending on what you're doing and how and you have no conception of how actual normal people are doing".   This is especially true for Silicon Valley programmers, where you can create a business, limp it along for a couple years (while paying yourself a "I am quite comfortable, thank you" salary), get noticed by [Insert Large company here] and get acqui-hired at $1 million/head (though not all of that goes to you.  Some goes to your VC.  Between that and taxes, you're lucky to clear a couple hundred K, which is nothing in Silicon Valley).  You can make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year by failing.
 
2013-06-21 04:07:31 PM

Kristoph57: "Follow your passion!"*

*As long as your passion is in a marketable field. Otherwise, good luck, and I'll have that burger medium rare.


"Find something you love doing and make that into a job!"*

*If what you love matches up with industry expectations. Otherwise, good luck, and I'll have that burger medium rare.


"In order to succeed in life, you must pursue higher education!"*

*This statement is opinion of the Canadian College Accreditation Board and is not a guarantee of success. Your results may vary.. and I want whipped cream and a dash of cinnamon on my coffee drink.

"You earn more money by having a college degree under your belt."*

*The college & the banks earn more money by you having a college degree under your belt. We've managed to flood the market with "graduates", and now you're no longer special enough. Try another student loan, something larger, maybe in the Doctorate size? Sign here.


I tried that with chemistry. Turns out science skills won't pay the bills. Seriously though, they'd rather hire some jag off that barely got a BS/BA in chemistry so they can pay them 12/hr at most on contract and will screw up often instead of somebody who knows shiat and pay them 17-20 an hour. I'll share a situation I had. I was asked if I knew an instrument, they even asked a specific brand and model number, I said yes, I had used that exact instrument for years in research only to be immediately told that it didn't count because it wasn't industry experience. I'd be more pissed with the situation if I had gone to an overpriced university and gotten 5-6 figure amounts of debt, luckily I am debt free. I'm not exactly where I expected I'd be but at least I'm not in some deep hole filling with water.
 
2013-06-21 04:07:57 PM

spiderpaz: 2) Why would an engineering firm hire someone with a film degree for that job instead of someone in the engineering field with a logistics background?


Exactly. Engineering project managers are a dime a dozen, but even so, the best ones tend to be failed engineers. They have the degree and work experience credentials, but for a large variety of reasons, they prefer project management to actually doing the engineering work. Some couldn't cut it, some were brilliant but got burned out, some didn't keep up with changing tech, some just wanted a change, etc. But if you're looking for an engineering PM, you start with someone who has engineering credentials in your field. I just can't imagine doing anything else, especially in a buyers job market like we have in the economy today, dozens and dozens of qualified people applying for a single position, etc.
 
2013-06-21 04:17:34 PM
For those of you who are saying "just move to where the jobs are..."

I've made about 6 interstate moves in the past decade both with family and without family (plus numerous in-state).  Moving is hell-on-earth when you have more than yourself to worry about.  Coordinating with a spouse is hard enough, nevermind a child who might be in school or have other ties.  (We're military, so it has even extra complications, but I'm factoring those out.)

And, for those who are not used to dealing with the South, the religious fundies and the ridiculously low pay scale don't really make it worthwhile.  Even if you rationally know it's not everybody, it's still really uncomfortable for people who aren't used to that kind of thing (and/or are Jewish).  The crap pay (comparative to the Northeast) and the fact that most of the public schools are awful don't help.
 
2013-06-21 04:18:36 PM

No Such Agency: BgJonson79:
No Such Agency: Galileo's Daughter:
Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.

Sorry, Canadian article.  Most of our young people can do the math: those thousands in signing bonuses don't pay for as much health insurance as our taxes do in Canada (not to mention living in a fundamentalist-infested "right-to-work" state).

So they'd rather other people pay for their healthcare, then? :-P

[static.guim.co.uk image 169x101]
TAXES HOW DO THEY WORK

Generally if you're young and healthy enough to work, on the average you're paying for other people's health care, for the time being.


Hey, that's how the Canadians decided to do it.  If it works for 'em, then awesome!
 
2013-06-21 04:26:14 PM

Galileo's Daughter: Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.


Yea, I was thinking that myself

when has there ever been a lack of need for nurses
 
2013-06-21 04:29:23 PM

loonatic112358: Yea, I was thinking that myself

when has there ever been a lack of need for nurses


Is this were I take a strong demand for experienced nurses with years of experience and extrapolate from there and assume the job market for entry-level nurses is equally strong?
 
2013-06-21 05:09:08 PM
S.744  -  "Comprehensive Immigration Reform"

This is the new Union-member bill/new voter Bill/lower cost Wages bill

Prepare to find even less work and for lower wages.

img.fark.net
 
2013-06-21 05:10:57 PM
I have met a goodly number of Canadian nurses who have moved to the southern U.S.

There is no lack of jobs, the cost of living is lower, taxes are lower, everything costs less and that more than offsets any reduction in wage scale.

As for the south being a cesspool of religious, cultural and racial intolerance:  that is pretty much in the imagination of the beholder, or perhaps people who haven't checked a calendar in the last 50 years.

The south is a live--and--let--live place, and if you don't bother other people they will not bother you.  However if you are a rude overbearing sort, you ill find as much rejection there as anyplace else, and as usual you will blame others for your own shortcomings.

Minorities are moving in at a rapid rate, we must be doing something right.
 
2013-06-21 05:28:01 PM

groppet: Skraeling: Claire Ferris, a 24-year-old from Fergus, Ont., who now lives in Windsor, is a prime example. After graduating from the University of Windsor with a degree in drama and creative writing

im SHOCKED she cant find work.

I manage a loading dock and we have someone that is sporting a double degree in dance and public speaking.


I bet he waves the trucks in real nice...
 
2013-06-21 05:43:53 PM
If you can't get a job as a nurse there is something very wrong with your personality.  Most places are begging for new people.
 
2013-06-21 05:48:13 PM

redmid17: OldManDownDRoad: redmid17:
I know kids from high school that have been making more per annum since 19 than most of my college graduate friends make now at 26/27. It might not be awesome or a name dropper, but you can make a shiat ton of money. I'd have to double check but IIRC the two "richest" friends of mine from growing up had a a dad who started out as an plumber turned GC and an electrician turned SW developer. Neither father went to college.

My best friend from college became a GC and did very well - at one point he was running five crews and sitting in a very nice office, answering the phone while they raked in the bucks for him.

The other side of that coin was the collapse of the housing industry starting in 2006. By 2009 he was back to swinging a hammer during the day and staying up all night taking care of the paperwork (contracts, take-offs, estimates, supplier bills, etc). He finally gave up and took a job teaching shop at the local high school. He still does remodels and repairs and keeps his license up-to-date, but he says he'll never build another house.

Which is a shame, because he built solid houses and a lot of his business was return customers. But every industry has its weak points.

And besides, you can't fart or tell dirty jokes in shop class.

Man school has changed since I graduated in 2004.


Are we seriously at the point where someone out of high school for less than a decade is telling us about the gold old days? Fark me, I'm old a dirt.

/born at the very tail end of the 60s
 
2013-06-21 05:49:51 PM

meyerkev: Joe1549: Hmm... technology increases making the economy too efficient, so there's not enough jobs for everyone. Color me surprised. This will keep on happening, and get worse as technology gets more efficient.

Keep in mind that the last time this happened, it was called the Industrial Revolution.

Large-scale low-labor farming techniques improved yields immensely, forcing millions of small farmers off their land.  They all went inwards to the cities, and worked in hellish conditions in manufacturing.  Eventually, a combination of labor unions, large-scale infrastructure projects to prevent things like dumping raw sewage into the rivers, and the simple fact that increasing industrial production by 2 orders of magnitude over a couple of centuries (while increasing population by 1 order) was eventually going to lift all boats to at least some extent created the modern manufacturing economy we knew and loved during the 1950's.

Since then, a combination of robots and computers on the high end and Chinese workers working for 10 cents a day has wiped out or replaced entire industries (outsourceable manufacturing, secretaries, etc) while leaving others behind (Data entry worker isn't terribly useful).  We're at the "Millions of people get kicked off their land, head to cities and starve while working for pennies a day because they're infinitely replaceable, making the people with money and resources even richer in the process" Gilded Era phase, not the " Modern version of TR shows up and institutes massive reforms now that the new industries have shown up, shaken out and we've eked out another order of magnitude of production on top of the first two (Seriously.  Industrial Revolution numbers are scary.  They're exponential even on log charts. Even Real GDP/Capita did a good order of magnitude between the start and the end.  It wasn't terribly fair, but man there was a lot of money floating around)" phase.

Honestly, what's really screwing people this time around though is ...


wow.  less is more.
 
2013-06-21 06:02:45 PM

Jument: redmid17: OldManDownDRoad: redmid17:
I know kids from high school that have been making more per annum since 19 than most of my college graduate friends make now at 26/27. It might not be awesome or a name dropper, but you can make a shiat ton of money. I'd have to double check but IIRC the two "richest" friends of mine from growing up had a a dad who started out as an plumber turned GC and an electrician turned SW developer. Neither father went to college.

My best friend from college became a GC and did very well - at one point he was running five crews and sitting in a very nice office, answering the phone while they raked in the bucks for him.

The other side of that coin was the collapse of the housing industry starting in 2006. By 2009 he was back to swinging a hammer during the day and staying up all night taking care of the paperwork (contracts, take-offs, estimates, supplier bills, etc). He finally gave up and took a job teaching shop at the local high school. He still does remodels and repairs and keeps his license up-to-date, but he says he'll never build another house.

Which is a shame, because he built solid houses and a lot of his business was return customers. But every industry has its weak points.

And besides, you can't fart or tell dirty jokes in shop class.

Man school has changed since I graduated in 2004.

Are we seriously at the point where someone out of high school for less than a decade is telling us about the gold old days? Fark me, I'm old a dirt.

/born at the very tail end of the 60s


I blame school administrators, zero tolerance, and lack of dodge ball during passing period.
 
2013-06-21 06:04:03 PM

olddinosaur: As for the south being a cesspool of religious, cultural and racial intolerance: that is pretty much in the imagination of the beholder, or perhaps people who haven't checked a calendar in the last 50 years.


I think you need to visit the Paula Deen thread and educate yourself about the state of racism in the south present day.  It hasn't changed THAT much.  Strom Therman, (R) S. Carolina (the man who filibustered for a record 24 hours against a civil rights bill) was re-elected over and over until he died in office in 2003 at the age of 101.  Racism is still quite popular down there.  They're still dragging their feet and resisting implementing aspects of the Civil Rights until they are forced.  And what do you think the real purpose is for all the laws trying to address the imaginary voter fraud problem is?  It's the modern day version of the literacy test, meant to disenfranchise blacks and keep them from voting.
 
2013-06-21 06:05:49 PM

Maul555: Maul555: I have been feeling this same crunch in the states...  I got layed off in late 07 when the economy took a dump, and then bounced around for a couple of years.  Now it is almost impossible to get back into my career field with all the new over educated kids up for grabs and the imported people from all over the country swamping the Texas job market that I cant hope to compete with.  Add to that the illegal aliens bringing down wages while congress is trying to make them permanent so I can get farked even harder...

I forgot to add that I am non-military living in a military town where everyone and their uncle is screaming "HIRE VETERANS".... and I am not a minority so that hurts me in an affirmative action world...   Basically, everyone else is put at the front of the line before me no matter how early I get there.

/I guess I need to find a 2nd industry to try and get into


You are either in an industry so specialized that only a federal contractor can do it, or you have no farking clue what Affirmative Action is. Guess which is more likely?
 
2013-06-21 06:13:48 PM

Semi-Sane: These young kids are not boot strappy enough to create their own businesses. If you can't find a job create your own job.


Actually, not so much. I moved because my husband's job is the kind you have to move for, and since it was to an area with abso-effing-lutely nothing in my field, I spent a month retraining myself, took tests and got some certifications, got into a new field and started a small business. And then my only local competitor hired me into management, which was actually great because it meant I wasn't absolutely alone with no back-up if two or more clients needed me at once.

We recently had to move again, once more for hubby's work, and I've used my savings to start the business back up again, this time in a new state and with a deeper specialization so I really don't have any competitors. It's been three months and already I have ten bread-and-butter clients who have me on retainer and several other hourly and once-a-week appointments, as well as enough revenue to take a paycheck two months out of the three while still investing heavily into the business itself. I've kept the overhead very low and by advertising to an under-served demographic, I really think I have something going here.

My plan, if I can get enough money together and find a company or cooperative group plan that will let me offer decent benefits, is to hire my first two employees by next February, in time for my twenty-eighth birthday.

Millenials are not lazy or entitled as a generation so much as those of us who are neither are far too busy to talk to reporters. It's like how you never hear from Christians who aren't sanctimonious anti-gay assholes or from retail employees who are paid decently and given fair benefits. Millenials who are willing to work, innovate and even say "Well, can't use THAT degree here, better train myself in something I can pair with it easily and keep going," aren't rare, we're just...quiet.

A 24-year-old friend of mine is into real estate now and owns a small apartment building with all units save her own rented to people older than she is, and a fellow 27-year-old saw the writing on the wall, spent her 2 and 3L years night-classing it at community college and is now a licensed,  attorney with her electrician and plumber's licenses...which both saw her through the bad days of unemployment my making it self-employment and got her into a firm that specializes in going after crooked contractors and landlords. And still another friend is 28, took a degree in, I shiat you not, English Lit (there was a scholarship involved,) and parleyed that and a fondness for working on older Japanese cars into a modest buy-here, pay-here car dealership that employs four people and has kept her clients able to get to work. (Her sole indulgence was paying off her aging parents' mortgage four years early as a gift and the car she drives is still the same sort of high-mileage Toyota or Honda she's always had, because her advertising tagline is "I won't sell you a car I wouldn't drive myself.") I don't agree with her interest rates, but I can't argue with her success, and she does TRY to give people who stop paying the chance to keep their cars, which is more than I can say for her competitors.

Of course, we're all married to guys in the STEM fields, so we had health benefits from our husbands to keep us safe from financial ruin and, in some cases, cover the student-loans while we pursued these dreams, but fix the healthcare problem and any Millenial with brains and drive can succeed in the post-crash economy. Because we whiny Millenials do have a point about the tuition costs, the student loans and the inaccessibility of decent healthcare. A lot of us can't responsibly even consider having ANY children, let alone enough to replace the dying and retiring workers, so the joke's on you Boomers when Social Security takes a hit in your seventies.
 
2013-06-21 06:18:30 PM

verbaltoxin: Way to skip a whole paragraph so you can pour on some more bullsh*t.

Let's say I were a film director. What did I learn in my experiences?

- How to start a project from the ground, which requires budget, financing, equipment, logistics, personnel, and location.
- How to resolve personnel disputes (Can you imagine managing anybody more needy and annoying than actors?).
- How to deal with complex management and work across multiple agencies (Producers, studios, theaters, distributors).
- How to market the product so it can recoup its budget or make a profit.
- How to use graphics and film editing software.
- How to run my own goddamned business, because that's what being a director essentially is, especially if you're independent.

Yeah, there are no companies whatsoever that could use skills like these. None. They're all hiring engineers and only engineers.

Because engineers never need project managers, human resources, financial managers, client representatives or any other support personnel to keep their little projects from going over-budget and burning the building to the ground.

Right.


The experience you just listed might get an interview as graphic designer. Anything actually related to an engineering project or technology project is looking for someone who actually knows the field. It's counterproductive to get a PM who knows nothing about what they are trying to coordinate. Your experience balancing budgets on a movie set isn't going to be very useful either as the company will likely be looking for someone with a CPA or an investment background.
 
2013-06-21 06:24:42 PM

FuzedBox: The only thing I ask is for people to stop lumping us Generation Y folks with the farking millennials.


You may not be as smart as you think you are.

Gen Y was a placeholder name, Millennials seems to be the consensus permanent one, and I generally think of 1980-1995 as the range for birth years. The name for the cohort younger than that us as yet undecided, but I've been trying to start a movement to stick them with Generation Bieber out of spite.
 
2013-06-21 06:25:56 PM

redmid17: Eponymous: doubled99: No, every generation is not seen the same. As a Generation Xer, I can say we were not generally characterized as whiny and entitled, but instead  lazy and apathetic. Still bad, but slightly less annoying.

Agreed....these millennial hipster douchbags make the X'ers look like fine upstanding citizens.

/Judge Smails was wise beyond his years.

I'll put it this way, anyone I knew who was worth hiring out of college has had steady employment since they graduated, STEM, LA, or random degree. These were also the kids who got internships and had some modicum of motivation to achieve than a ged ed diploma*. Of the people I know who suffered through bouts of unemployment, most I would not recommend for an open position in my company if they exceed the requirements twofold (shiatty personality, lazy, mean, dumb, et al).

tldr version: Most of the people my age, whom I'm acquainted with, are unemployed are underemployed because they suck, not because companies are conspiring against them.

I have plenty of friends who have gotten the shaft from companies in the past 4 years (laid off or fired), but they picked up a new job before their severance or next paycheck. Then again, I'm sure some mileage may vary

* I'm talking a 3.0 GPA and some internships, more or less average grades and basic proof you won't poison the coffee on the first day


This is pretty accurate.  I generally take myself as an exception:

Bored, slept through HS.  Dropped out as a 5th year senior (after 1 week).  Dicked around working at a resort for about 2 years.  Decided to get my GED and got hired on for a major software company as a temp in a very very low rung customer service type job.  Decided to apply myself.  Since then, I have received several promotions and after 10 years  I am making about 50% more than the median house hold income for my state (And I am not even in the higher pay area for the state).  I even have ppl attempting to recruit me from time-to-time.
 
2013-06-21 06:27:42 PM

cptjeff: FuzedBox: The only thing I ask is for people to stop lumping us Generation Y folks with the farking millennials.

You may not be as smart as you think you are.

Gen Y was a placeholder name, Millennials seems to be the consensus permanent one, and I generally think of 1980-1995 as the range for birth years. The name for the cohort younger than that us as yet undecided, but I've been trying to start a movement to stick them with Generation Bieber out of spite.


That's just mean.
 
2013-06-21 06:28:06 PM

cptjeff: The name for the cohort younger than that us as yet undecided,


That should be: "The name for the cohort younger than us is as yet undecided..."

That's what I get for trying to make two different edits at once, I suppose.
 
2013-06-21 06:30:46 PM

redmid17: cptjeff: FuzedBox: The only thing I ask is for people to stop lumping us Generation Y folks with the farking millennials.

You may not be as smart as you think you are.

Gen Y was a placeholder name, Millennials seems to be the consensus permanent one, and I generally think of 1980-1995 as the range for birth years. The name for the cohort younger than that us as yet undecided, but I've been trying to start a movement to stick them with Generation Bieber out of spite.

That's just mean.


Yes, but think of how funny it'll be when they're in their late 50's and all the media talking heads start talking about how Generation Bieber is approaching retirement age, is going to stress Social Security, ect. Or whatever the hot topic happens to be.
 
2013-06-21 06:35:40 PM

Kali-Ma: For those of you who are saying "just move to where the jobs are..."

I've made about 6 interstate moves in the past decade both with family and without family (plus numerous in-state).  Moving is hell-on-earth when you have more than yourself to worry about.  Coordinating with a spouse is hard enough, nevermind a child who might be in school or have other ties.  (We're military, so it has even extra complications, but I'm factoring those out.)

And, for those who are not used to dealing with the South, the religious fundies and the ridiculously low pay scale don't really make it worthwhile.  Even if you rationally know it's not everybody, it's still really uncomfortable for people who aren't used to that kind of thing (and/or are Jewish).  The crap pay (comparative to the Northeast) and the fact that most of the public schools are awful don't help.


You sound like you might be our new neighbors across the street.  They are a black family that refuses to acknowledge our presence.   I have tried to just give a friendly wave in the morning or evening, but they most be uncomfortable because I must be a southern religious fundy bigot.
 
2013-06-21 06:38:06 PM

BetterMetalSnake: Maul555: Maul555: I have been feeling this same crunch in the states...  I got layed off in late 07 when the economy took a dump, and then bounced around for a couple of years.  Now it is almost impossible to get back into my career field with all the new over educated kids up for grabs and the imported people from all over the country swamping the Texas job market that I cant hope to compete with.  Add to that the illegal aliens bringing down wages while congress is trying to make them permanent so I can get farked even harder...

I forgot to add that I am non-military living in a military town where everyone and their uncle is screaming "HIRE VETERANS".... and I am not a minority so that hurts me in an affirmative action world...   Basically, everyone else is put at the front of the line before me no matter how early I get there.

/I guess I need to find a 2nd industry to try and get into

You are either in an industry so specialized that only a federal contractor can do it, or you have no farking clue what Affirmative Action is. Guess which is more likely?


Neither?
 
2013-06-21 07:45:30 PM
Ah, another ageist article bashing young people, projecting your flaws on to us and justifying the massive screw-job you're shoving down our throats.

/Yeah, I know.  Welcome to fark
 
2013-06-21 08:33:34 PM
Gobama.

Good thing all those dumbass college kids swoon for him, look at the awesome future they have!!!

Wait....
 
2013-06-21 09:12:27 PM
I work in healthcare as clinical staff (medical imaging), and can hardly get my place of employment to stop trying to get me to work 50-60+ hours/week.  We actually have a couple of CT techs who regularly work 60-70 hours/week.  The money is good, the work is hard, and we have a constant problem that we cannot find enough staff (especially nurses).

I'm not sure if my experiences are just out of the ordinary, but from where I'm standing it looks like there are jobs out there if you have the right skills and are willing to work hard.
 
2013-06-21 09:36:33 PM

Xetal: I work in healthcare as clinical staff (medical imaging), and can hardly get my place of employment to stop trying to get me to work 50-60+ hours/week.  We actually have a couple of CT techs who regularly work 60-70 hours/week.  The money is good, the work is hard, and we have a constant problem that we cannot find enough staff (especially nurses).

I'm not sure if my experiences are just out of the ordinary, but from where I'm standing it looks like there are jobs out there if you have the right skills and are willing to work hard.


This is the critical point.

I'm a software programmer.  It's one thing to say "We train", it's another thing to say "We train from scratch".  There's about 2-3 years worth of stuff you have to know before I'd even consider hiring you as a trainee.  Luckily, that's the first couple years of a good degree program or about 5 years of "home programming where I actually did stuff and made reasonably-sized projects".  I might need to teach you Python, I shouldn't have to teach you data structures and basic Linux commands.

And the problem a lot of people are seeing is that in a lot of industries, you can't acquire that experience in any other way than showing up.  And since no one wants entry-level, you can't show up.  With software programming, you can spend a few hundred extra bucks getting a good laptop, dual boot Ubuntu, install gcc and have at it totally free.  With welding or medical imaging, that's a bit harder and more expensive.
 
2013-06-21 10:37:20 PM
Heh, I was watching this evolve 25 years ago:

"There's going to be a huge demand for computer programmers in the next five years...come to Getintodebt College and learn to be a programmer!" So everyone did, and five years later, there was such a glut of half-trained "programmers" in the entry-level market, you couldn't buy your way into the market; and anyway, the next big thing was "There's going to be a huge demand in the Nursing/Medical Office Administration field!" and off they went for their "nursing" degrees....or was it Criminal Justice? About the time I was leaving law school--yep, everyone wants to become a lawyer now, or a teacher.

You can't go into school based on what seems to be the "next in-demand field," kiddies. By the time you get done with  your degree, whether it's from an accredited top-tier university or ITT Tech, that "in-demand field" is going to be chock-full of useless grads, and you'll be just another inexperienced 20-something looking for work. Or, you'll get halfway through and discover you absolutely hate that in-demand job, and wind up not only with a useless degree, but crippling debt AND no other training or experience in anything you do like and wind up job-hopping or college hopping, looking for something you both can do and want to do.

The real trick is to realize early that what you think you want probably isn't really what you're going to school for. Like all those poor wannabe "CSIs" when I was getting my second bachelor's (B.S., Criminal Justice). I was using it as a springboard into law school; they had all these dreams of being "CSIs, like on TV". I killed a lot of dreams the day I said, "You know, you're going to have to go on from here and get your masters, probably in advanced biology or something. Those guys aren't just cops.".....REALLY?! One girl was just devastated. Here she thought all you needed to grow up to be Gil Grissom was two years at a for-profit college.
 
2013-06-21 10:45:59 PM

meyerkev: Xetal: I work in healthcare as clinical staff (medical imaging), and can hardly get my place of employment to stop trying to get me to work 50-60+ hours/week.  We actually have a couple of CT techs who regularly work 60-70 hours/week.  The money is good, the work is hard, and we have a constant problem that we cannot find enough staff (especially nurses).

I'm not sure if my experiences are just out of the ordinary, but from where I'm standing it looks like there are jobs out there if you have the right skills and are willing to work hard.

This is the critical point.

I'm a software programmer.  It's one thing to say "We train", it's another thing to say "We train from scratch".  There's about 2-3 years worth of stuff you have to know before I'd even consider hiring you as a trainee.  Luckily, that's the first couple years of a good degree program or about 5 years of "home programming where I actually did stuff and made reasonably-sized projects".  I might need to teach you Python, I shouldn't have to teach you data structures and basic Linux commands.

And the problem a lot of people are seeing is that in a lot of industries, you can't acquire that experience in any other way than showing up.  And since no one wants entry-level, you can't show up.  With software programming, you can spend a few hundred extra bucks getting a good laptop, dual boot Ubuntu, install gcc and have at it totally free.  With welding or medical imaging, that's a bit harder and more expensive.


There is state and federal bodies that require you to already be registered in your area before you can work, so training typically involves a "this is the way we do things" and "get used to this brand/model of equipment" rather than training from scratch.

Right out of school a lot of the imaging people get the "crap jobs" that are 2nd/3rd shift, weekends, or variable.  A lot of the nurses right out of school get the same shifts and get the less desirable positions (like floor nursing).  Programming is a whole different beast, but if you go to school for something useful, it seems like there are jobs out there.

The psychology/english/underwater basket waving degree holders are probably in a different boat.
 
2013-06-21 11:10:50 PM

Xetal: The psychology/english/underwater basket waving degree holders are probably in a different boat.


Poli-sci grad working in politics here. Took some doing (and parental support to make a key unpaid internship possible), but it can be done.

Make fun of us all you want, but we rule the world. Literally.
 
2013-06-22 12:12:55 AM

cptjeff: Xetal: The psychology/english/underwater basket waving degree holders are probably in a different boat.

Poli-sci grad working in politics here. Took some doing (and parental support to make a key unpaid internship possible), but it can be done.

Make fun of us all you want, but we rule the world. Literally.


If I may pick your brain as proxy for my sister, who is a Poli-Sci major  (Sophomore, active in the college Democrats, got an internship in Ottawa as unpaid aide to some MP, so it sounds like she's doing everything right)

What would you have told your younger self?  What really stupid mistakes did you make that you'd want to learn from?
 
2013-06-22 12:59:48 AM

meyerkev: cptjeff: Xetal: The psychology/english/underwater basket waving degree holders are probably in a different boat.

Poli-sci grad working in politics here. Took some doing (and parental support to make a key unpaid internship possible), but it can be done.

Make fun of us all you want, but we rule the world. Literally.

If I may pick your brain as proxy for my sister, who is a Poli-Sci major  (Sophomore, active in the college Democrats, got an internship in Ottawa as unpaid aide to some MP, so it sounds like she's doing everything right)

What would you have told your younger self?  What really stupid mistakes did you make that you'd want to learn from?


Do that big internship to give your resume instant credibility, but don't focus on trying to land a prestigious job right out of it. If you intern with an MP, the inclination is to try and get, in effect, a promotion. Yes, apply for and try for those jobs, they do exist and you may the person who gets it. But being a big fish in a small pond has a lot to offer. Go to a small nonprofit that does advocacy work (Washington has a zillion, so must Ottawa), and you get your hands in a hell of a lot, with a lot of responsibility, but in a fairly low pressure setting. There are advantages to being a junior staffer in Congress/Parliament/White House/PM's Office, but if you do an internship there you get most of those benefits in some measure.

Oh, network, network, network. Go to events. Find the right job lists- if she's using the monster.com type stuff, it's not going to work. Idealist for nonprofits, and I have no idea what the Canadian equivalents of the Tom Manatos/ Brad Traverse lists are, but there should be some private or less widely distributed lists around for serious candidates. Oh, and your resume matters. Everybody looks similar on paper, so make sure your paper is neatly arranged, attractive, and clear.

But I really should emphasize the small pond bit. Really feel out nonprofits, trade associations, that sort of thing. They're not large, but there are a lot of them, and a lot less people apply to the lobbying arm of the mattress industry than to a junior job at a big think tank, even though that mattress job might have them meeting with MPs in 2 months

None of it's terribly original, but there you go. Good luck to her.
 
2013-06-22 01:01:55 AM

cptjeff: meeting with MPs in 2 months


Where the fark did my period go? I could swear I typed one. It's late, I suppose. Here are some extras to make up for it........
 
2013-06-22 01:13:16 AM

cptjeff: Where the fark did my period go?


My wife said the same thing a few months back. The new baby will be here in November.
 
2013-06-22 01:13:43 AM
It all comes down to:
1. Shovel other people's shiat. Lots of it.
2. Know when to stop. No, it's not when you're so sick of it you want to kill yourself. It's when you can afford to stop.

This is applying yourself.
 
2013-06-22 01:17:30 AM

cptjeff: meyerkev: cptjeff: Xetal: The psychology/english/underwater basket waving degree holders are probably in a different boat.

Poli-sci grad working in politics here. Took some doing (and parental support to make a key unpaid internship possible), but it can be done.

Make fun of us all you want, but we rule the world. Literally.

If I may pick your brain as proxy for my sister, who is a Poli-Sci major  (Sophomore, active in the college Democrats, got an internship in Ottawa as unpaid aide to some MP, so it sounds like she's doing everything right)

What would you have told your younger self?  What really stupid mistakes did you make that you'd want to learn from?

Do that big internship to give your resume instant credibility, but don't focus on trying to land a prestigious job right out of it. If you intern with an MP, the inclination is to try and get, in effect, a promotion. Yes, apply for and try for those jobs, they do exist and you may the person who gets it. But being a big fish in a small pond has a lot to offer. Go to a small nonprofit that does advocacy work (Washington has a zillion, so must Ottawa), and you get your hands in a hell of a lot, with a lot of responsibility, but in a fairly low pressure setting. There are advantages to being a junior staffer in Congress/Parliament/White House/PM's Office, but if you do an internship there you get most of those benefits in some measure.

Oh, network, network, network. Go to events. Find the right job lists- if she's using the monster.com type stuff, it's not going to work. Idealist for nonprofits, and I have no idea what the Canadian equivalents of the Tom Manatos/ Brad Traverse lists are, but there should be some private or less widely distributed lists around for serious candidates. Oh, and your resume matters. Everybody looks similar on paper, so make sure your paper is neatly arranged, attractive, and clear.

But I really should emphasize the small pond bit. Really feel out nonprofits, trade associations, t ...


Thanks.  No matter what happens, I'm fairly secure (Computer Science, Silicon Valley.  If you do it right, you can make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year by continually failing at startups), and I'm more worried about her odds than mine.
 
2013-06-22 01:23:43 AM

meyerkev: Thanks. No matter what happens, I'm fairly secure (Computer Science, Silicon Valley. If you do it right, you can make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year by continually failing at startups), and I'm more worried about her odds than mine.


Yeah, I just found it more easy to write as a piece directly addressing someone, my brain is pretty fried. I was up at 6 this morning and really should be in bed right now.

Yeah, in politics, you can make a pretty good living for yourself if you're willing to completely sell your soul, but I don't really suggest that. But if she wants to work for big tobacco, lobbying for an oil company, defense contractor, bank, or anyone else nasty that happens to be looking for a corporate giveaway pays pretty well.
 
2013-06-22 03:05:21 AM

Thunderpipes: Gobama.

Good thing all those dumbass college kids swoon for him, look at the awesome future they have!!!

Wait....


Yes, Obama, the President of Canada. For chrissakes, you didn't even need to RTFA to know it was about Canadians, the god damned CBC logo was right next to the headline.

farking dolt.
 
2013-06-22 01:19:12 PM

randomjsa: Nursing? That's horseshiat. There's a nursing shortage. If you can't find a job as a nurse, you're apparently unwilling to relocate.


Whenever I hear someone say (unqualified) there's a "shortage of workers" I want to punch them in the face. There is no shortage of workers.

There is a shortage of workers willing to work for $5.00/hr in a position that requires a college education.
There is a shortage of workers willing (or able) to move to Frog Jump, Alabama for work.
There is a shortage of workers with 10 years of experience on a system that's been around for 5 years.
There is a shortage of fresh college grads with 3 years of experience (duh).
 
2013-06-22 07:36:28 PM
It's all over. Everything is ending.
 
Displayed 50 of 200 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report