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(CBC)   Whiny, self entitled "millennials" who wasted their time and put themselves in crushing debt chasing useless degrees STILL complaining about lack of jobs in their chosen fields... like nursing, law, teaching, etc   (cbc.ca) divider line 200
    More: Fail, secondary education, University of Guelph, nursing, Gen Y, bachelor's degrees, higher educations  
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7782 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Jun 2013 at 1:19 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-06-21 02:19:03 PM  

OldManDownDRoad: redmid17:
I know kids from high school that have been making more per annum since 19 than most of my college graduate friends make now at 26/27. It might not be awesome or a name dropper, but you can make a shiat ton of money. I'd have to double check but IIRC the two "richest" friends of mine from growing up had a a dad who started out as an plumber turned GC and an electrician turned SW developer. Neither father went to college.

My best friend from college became a GC and did very well - at one point he was running five crews and sitting in a very nice office, answering the phone while they raked in the bucks for him.

The other side of that coin was the collapse of the housing industry starting in 2006. By 2009 he was back to swinging a hammer during the day and staying up all night taking care of the paperwork (contracts, take-offs, estimates, supplier bills, etc). He finally gave up and took a job teaching shop at the local high school. He still does remodels and repairs and keeps his license up-to-date, but he says he'll never build another house.

Which is a shame, because he built solid houses and a lot of his business was return customers. But every industry has its weak points.

And besides, you can't fart or tell dirty jokes in shop class.


Man school has changed since I graduated in 2004.
 
2013-06-21 02:21:17 PM  

pute kisses like a man: Agnes Gonxha's Confidant: BafflerMeal: Agnes Gonxha's Confidant: I have a son, so I am paying attention. Honestly. I shall not make fill his little head with promises of undeniable happiness and success.

1. Son, you cannot do anything you set your mind to
2. Son, do not follow your passions, but make time for them instead
3. Son, do not stick your dick in crazy
4. Son, you need not reproduce unless you have a friend to reproduce with

/easier said than done

5.  Do anything you want, but get a fallback trade first.

/best advice my dad gave me

My dad's only advice was:

"I don't know what I'm doing, Son. Don't come to me for advice.You figure it out"

/better than clichés, I guess

my dad's advice, a quote from someone smarter, 80% of success is showing up.

it had some corollaries:

it is better to overdress (if not sure, wear a suit, better to be an asshole than an idiot)

be nice.

when looking for a job. no one hires people from a resume or a phone call (applies to online apps).  go in to the place everyday to meet whoever is hiring.  get to know the the secretary.  if you have to, bring cookies.  be annoying. at least they won't forget you.  even if they don't hire you, check up on them frequently in case they have another position open.  this degree of nuisance will get you something productive.  maybe not a job, but at least some new contacts.  (essentially, be shameless)

finally, never stop looking for a new job.  my dad stayed with the same place for 20 years, but always had another job lined up, just in case.  you never know when a company is about to be acquired or insolvent.  better to assume the ship is sinking.


Please tell me how it's to my benefit to annoy the gate guards at a govt. agency or company that's large enough to have a fenced in campus?

This is stupid advice for anyone looking for a real job, this might work if you're looking to become an overhead cost for a company.
 
2013-06-21 02:22:59 PM  

BMFPitt: Galileo's Daughter: Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.

This.  If you can't get a job in nursing, you must be really, really terrible at it.

KhamanV: I prefer Harlan Ellison's advice on getting paid - do nothing for free and fight for every scrap of silver to cross your palm.  He's a scrappy, angry old man, but he's right on that score.

That is very short-term thinking.  Doing things for free can often be very profitable.


Unless you have to eat.

Also, you might be surprised at the weird politics that come into play in being hired in Canada.
 
2013-06-21 02:24:08 PM  

Girion47: pute kisses like a man: Agnes Gonxha's Confidant: BafflerMeal: Agnes Gonxha's Confidant: I have a son, so I am paying attention. Honestly. I shall not make fill his little head with promises of undeniable happiness and success.

1. Son, you cannot do anything you set your mind to
2. Son, do not follow your passions, but make time for them instead
3. Son, do not stick your dick in crazy
4. Son, you need not reproduce unless you have a friend to reproduce with

/easier said than done

5.  Do anything you want, but get a fallback trade first.

/best advice my dad gave me

My dad's only advice was:

"I don't know what I'm doing, Son. Don't come to me for advice.You figure it out"

/better than clichés, I guess

my dad's advice, a quote from someone smarter, 80% of success is showing up.

it had some corollaries:

it is better to overdress (if not sure, wear a suit, better to be an asshole than an idiot)

be nice.

when looking for a job. no one hires people from a resume or a phone call (applies to online apps).  go in to the place everyday to meet whoever is hiring.  get to know the the secretary.  if you have to, bring cookies.  be annoying. at least they won't forget you.  even if they don't hire you, check up on them frequently in case they have another position open.  this degree of nuisance will get you something productive.  maybe not a job, but at least some new contacts.  (essentially, be shameless)

finally, never stop looking for a new job.  my dad stayed with the same place for 20 years, but always had another job lined up, just in case.  you never know when a company is about to be acquired or insolvent.  better to assume the ship is sinking.

Please tell me how it's to my benefit to annoy the gate guards at a govt. agency or company that's large enough to have a fenced in campus?

This is stupid advice for anyone looking for a real job, this might work if you're looking to become an overhead cost for a company.


for real... I tried this at rack-space recently, when a few years ago you could actually get to the front desk.  the gate guard basically told me that anyone that makes unannounced visits is automatically not considered for employment.   That place is like sentient brick wall that refuses any and all attempts at communication.
 
2013-06-21 02:25:47 PM  
The only advise I can give college kids is do SOMETHING other than "just studying". Part-time job, internship, or extracirriculars. Our hiring team is willing to meet with new grads even if they don't meet the experience, but when asked what all you did in college and we hear "just studied" we immediately think all you did was play video games, drink, go to parties, smoke pot, and generally good around. Then you won't be hired.
 
2013-06-21 02:25:50 PM  
All this advice for the trades, for truck driving, for this and that is great, and young people making these types of decisions should know their options. There is, however, one question that has been avoided in the discussion, especially by those who have issues with education in general and college education in particular: "Is this what you want to do for the next twenty years?"

The answer to that one question is why some people choose college, and some people don't. If you've chosen a field of employment just for the money and know you're going to hate the next twenty years of your life, you had better be earning a good salary with medical insurance, as you'll need it for all the medications for high blood pressure, hypertension, heart disease, ulcers, and other stress related illness.
 
2013-06-21 02:27:32 PM  

BafflerMeal: sovietski: As a nursing school applicant, there are a TON of jobs where I live. We have four hospitals here (Tulsa) that are constantly hiring, regardless of experience.

I just wish I would've done this earlier, but it is what it is.


St. Johns was a good home.


I'll keep that in mind.

Thoughts on St. Francis?
 
2013-06-21 02:29:39 PM  

OldManDownDRoad: Skraeling: Claire Ferris, a 24-year-old from Fergus, Ont., who now lives in Windsor, is a prime example. After graduating from the University of Windsor with a degree in drama and creative writing

im SHOCKED she cant find work.

Unless you hit it big with a novel or screenplay, writers are screwed.


meh.

I had a several friends that were working on their doctorates in English at Rice in Houston. I entered a contest to write a radio commercial and won. -It was actually fairly funny as far as radio advertisements go.

My friends pointed out to me that I have a degree in CS and I was the only one in the room who had actually had a *paid* writing gig.

I also entered a screen writing contest for a new series on TV a while back and got towards the final rounds. While I didn't win, I noticed that another show with almost exactly the same title as the one I had submitted had been created into a sitcom on a sister network the following year.

I'd give this advice to aspiring writers...

1. Do it in your spare time, not as a career unless you *really* know a way to make money off of it.
2. While work is rare, rewards are great, unless you get screwed over, and then there's really no way of proving it. So see #1 again.
 
2013-06-21 02:33:46 PM  
"Oh man, things are turning out the way I told them youths/my kids/my students they would, better shout entitlement to make them look bad for expecting better"

/Joel Stein is a hack
 
2013-06-21 02:34:28 PM  
Getting a kick out of the article since I'm the same age as most of the people in the article and I'm sitting at my current job playing Candy Crush and sending out resumes.

When I was little I told my mom I wanted to be a film critic.  I got 2 degrees in Media Studies.

/at least I have 3 job interviews next week
//I've sent about 100 resumes out in the past 6 months or so
 
2013-06-21 02:38:18 PM  

No Such Agency: Galileo's Daughter:
Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.

Sorry, Canadian article.  Most of our young people can do the math: those thousands in signing bonuses don't pay for as much health insurance as our taxes do in Canada (not to mention living in a fundamentalist-infested "right-to-work" state).


^^^^^^^
THIS.

Better to stay in Canadia.
 
2013-06-21 02:38:45 PM  

miss jinxed: Getting a kick out of the article since I'm the same age as most of the people in the article and I'm sitting at my current job playing Candy Crush and sending out resumes.


You sound like a perfect candidate for me to hire for my imaginary firm.  I can tell who is loyal and diligent from the most cursory exposure.

We'll give you a top secret clearance, $122K a year, an office in Hawaii and complete, unfettered access to all of our most intimate information.
 
2013-06-21 02:43:03 PM  

Maul555: Maul555: I have been feeling this same crunch in the states...  I got layed off in late 07 when the economy took a dump, and then bounced around for a couple of years.  Now it is almost impossible to get back into my career field with all the new over educated kids up for grabs and the imported people from all over the country swamping the Texas job market that I cant hope to compete with.  Add to that the illegal aliens bringing down wages while congress is trying to make them permanent so I can get farked even harder...

I forgot to add that I am non-military living in a military town where everyone and their uncle is screaming "HIRE VETERANS".... and I am not a minority so that hurts me in an affirmative action world...   Basically, everyone else is put at the front of the line before me no matter how early I get there.

/I guess I need to find a 2nd industry to try and get into


I think you need to find the whaaaambulance to try and get into.
 
2013-06-21 02:44:09 PM  

oldfarthenry: ThreeEdgedSword: Yet another story of The Old biatching about The Young out of jealousy.

/Same as it ever was

Jealous? Of what - those tatts & nose-piercings?
I'm getting a tad tired of today's youth telling me to `Hurry up & die!' so they can have my jorb.


Wow.  I mean, I say that to my stepdad but not because I want his job... I just want the beatings to stop.

/redhead
 
2013-06-21 02:45:14 PM  

To The Escape Zeppelin!: FatherChaos: I'll take a job from her, if you know what I'm saying.

Wow, she is remarkably attractive.


FARK translation: I would hit it angry fist penis Duke sucks.
 
2013-06-21 02:47:20 PM  
Even new nursing graduates can find work easily, though they might have to live in the middle of nowhere for a while to gain experience.  Once you have a year or two under your belt, you're good to go almost anywhere.
 
2013-06-21 02:48:55 PM  

The_Gallant_Gallstone: miss jinxed: Getting a kick out of the article since I'm the same age as most of the people in the article and I'm sitting at my current job playing Candy Crush and sending out resumes.

You sound like a perfect candidate for me to hire for my imaginary firm.  I can tell who is loyal and diligent from the most cursory exposure.

We'll give you a top secret clearance, $122K a year, an office in Hawaii and complete, unfettered access to all of our most intimate information.


In a position like mine, that's a perfectly valid use of time, when the govt contract I'm working on in Dec runs out should I start looking for a job then?   Isn't it smarter to take advantage of a lull in current work and search for something to replace a position that is disappearing?
 
2013-06-21 02:49:37 PM  

redmid17: Eponymous: doubled99: No, every generation is not seen the same. As a Generation Xer, I can say we were not generally characterized as whiny and entitled, but instead  lazy and apathetic. Still bad, but slightly less annoying.

Agreed....these millennial hipster douchbags make the X'ers look like fine upstanding citizens.

/Judge Smails was wise beyond his years.

tldr version: Most of the people my age, whom I'm acquainted with, are unemployed are underemployed because they suck, not because companies are conspiring against them.


^^^^^
img.ffffound.com

I went to an Art School for 5 years (because I took a chunk of time doing paid and unpaid internships while in school. I can write a 2 page resume with the relevant experience I've gained) and I can't tell you how much my classmates farking SUCKED at everything.

I once went to a computer lab and saw someone save a resume on the desktop. I clicked it and nearly vomited at the spelling, grammar, and basic math errors that littered the page. The idiot couldn't even spell the name of our school right! And this was a resume that she was writing to get jobs?

Most recent example: I wrote a long-winded rant at 2 a.m to my Career Services Adviser (Who I'm required to keep up-to-date with my job status for the next six months) when I was half-asleep and almost drunk about having to quit my most recent internship due to the company's shady financial practices. She replied that it was the most coherent, thoughtful and well-written e-mail that she has ever gotten from a recent graduate. If something that I shiat out of my A$$ would garner praise from an experienced professional, I can only wonder about my fellow graduates......
 
2013-06-21 02:50:20 PM  

Maul555: Please tell me how it's to my benefit to annoy the gate guards at a govt. agency or company that's large enough to have a fenced in campus?

This is stupid advice for anyone looking for a real job, this might work if you're looking to become an overhead cost for a company.

for real... I tried this at rack-space recently, when a few years ago you could actually get to the front desk.  the gate guard basically told me that anyone that makes unannounced visits is automatically not considered for employment.   That place is like sentient brick wall that refuses any and all attempts at communication.


well... the places I look for work are not so secure.  i'm a lawyer.  the people i seek out are accessible.  i live in a city, there really aren't a lot of fenced in campuses.  there are buildings.  sometimes you have to sign a sheet with a security guard or show id... but, that's a third party security company hired by the building within which whoever I am trying to see owns/leases space.  it's hardly an issue for the employer.  even federal court houses are easy to get into (as long as you don't bring a gun)

/ glad to know only jobs for the government or out in the burbs are real jobs.
 
2013-06-21 02:58:42 PM  

FatherChaos: [img.fark.net image 220x220]

I'll take a job from her, if you know what I'm saying.


I have multiple positions available for her.
 
2013-06-21 03:01:03 PM  

ng2810:  If something that I shiat out of my A$$ would garner praise from an experienced professional, I can only wonder about my fellow graduates......


CSB to match yours:
I took Bio 101 as a Junior instead of Freshman like most folks, so I took it pass/fail.  That semester also turned into my...um...alcoholic semester and I can honestly tell you I don't remember much of it.  I attended class once every two weeks and only showed up to half the labs.  Of the four tests our grades were based on, I got a 48% on one of them.

Once the final grades were curved, I had an 87% in that class.  When I read the scores, with the masses behind me, I just turned around and said "What the holy hell have you people been doing all semester?"

This is essentially what is meant by the "student loan debt problem": people who had no business being there now owe exorbitant sums for something that isn't ever going to help them.
 
2013-06-21 03:04:02 PM  

TelemonianAjax: ng2810:  If something that I shiat out of my A$$ would garner praise from an experienced professional, I can only wonder about my fellow graduates......

CSB to match yours:
I took Bio 101 as a Junior instead of Freshman like most folks, so I took it pass/fail.  That semester also turned into my...um...alcoholic semester and I can honestly tell you I don't remember much of it.  I attended class once every two weeks and only showed up to half the labs.  Of the four tests our grades were based on, I got a 48% on one of them.

Once the final grades were curved, I had an 87% in that class.  When I read the scores, with the masses behind me, I just turned around and said "What the holy hell have you people been doing all semester?"

This is essentially what is meant by the "student loan debt problem": people who had no business being there now owe exorbitant sums for something that isn't ever going to help them.


I took Bio 101 my last semester of school, that too was my alcohol daze semester, and having passed Honors Bio my freshman year of high school, I figured I didn't need to attend lecture except for the tests.   I went to the lab, but they took attendance.    When I showed up for the final the prof thought I wasn't even one of his students.   Anyways, I passed the class, and some people didn't.   I worry for those people.
 
2013-06-21 03:06:46 PM  

Pangea: gnosis301: Galileo's Daughter: Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.

"Georgia". I think I found your problem right there.


You may be surprised to learn that not all of Georgia is rural and populated with hillbillies.


True, but all of Georgia is miserably hot and humid in the summertime.
 
2013-06-21 03:07:08 PM  

The_Gallant_Gallstone: miss jinxed: Getting a kick out of the article since I'm the same age as most of the people in the article and I'm sitting at my current job playing Candy Crush and sending out resumes.

You sound like a perfect candidate for me to hire for my imaginary firm.  I can tell who is loyal and diligent from the most cursory exposure.

We'll give you a top secret clearance, $122K a year, an office in Hawaii and complete, unfettered access to all of our most intimate information.


3.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-06-21 03:09:02 PM  
Hearing about this issue makes me so thankful to be in my field - I'm very lucky in that after I get my degree and get licensed I'll have options. Being a psychologist at a college counseling center is my career goal but in the mean time I could always easily find a job in community mental health if positions aren't available when I start looking for something.

I actually lucked out for once - helps me stay optimistic when the stress of work and grad school get me down.
 
2013-06-21 03:10:18 PM  
"Do what you love, and you'll never work a day in your life."

So true.  My son is going to have a little bit more practical advice on choosing a career.  Something more like "being poor sucks, so do something there is a demand for, even if it's not very much fun.  It's easier to have fun when you have money."
 
2013-06-21 03:11:58 PM  

Mr. Breeze: Pangea: gnosis301: Galileo's Daughter: Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.

"Georgia". I think I found your problem right there.


You may be surprised to learn that not all of Georgia is rural and populated with hillbillies.

True, but all of Georgia is miserably hot and humid in the summertime.


My oncologist left her swanky life in farking Beverly Hills (not to mention, ME) to treat cancer patients in Georgia. I still feel bitter about it.
 
2013-06-21 03:13:41 PM  
Girion47:
I took Bio 101 my last semester of school, that too was my alcohol daze semester, and having passed Honors Bio my freshman year of high school, I figured I didn't need to attend lecture except for the tests.   I went to the lab, but they took attendance.    When I showed up for the final the prof thought I wasn't even one of his students.   Anyways, I passed the class, and some people didn't.   I worry for those people.

I remember on one test, when I didn't know the short answer I would write, sequentially (because I didn't know a lot), the plot of The Godfather.

Also, after 12 years, this one still sticks with me:
  Q: How do fish deal with environmental stresses?
  A: A glass of white wine and a fin massage.

That poor TA...
 
2013-06-21 03:14:18 PM  

sugarhi: Hearing about this issue makes me so thankful to be in my field - I'm very lucky in that after I get my degree and get licensed I'll have options. Being a psychologist at a college counseling center is my career goal ...


Stopped reading there.  Holy cow, the real world is about to punch you in the stomach.  Get ready.
 
2013-06-21 03:16:09 PM  

oldfarthenry: ThreeEdgedSword: Yet another story of The Old biatching about The Young out of jealousy.

/Same as it ever was

Jealous? Of what - those tatts & nose-piercings?
I'm getting a tad tired of today's youth telling me to `Hurry up & die!' so they can have my jorb.


Oh, yeah, I'm sure the most proportionally disenfranchised generation in U.S. history is so because of tattoos.  You've totally solved all our social problems.
 
2013-06-21 03:17:08 PM  
pute kisses: like a man  when looking for a job. no one hires people from a resume or a phone call (applies to online apps).  go in to the place everyday to meet whoever is hiring.  get to know the the secretary.  if you have to, bring cookies.  be annoying. at least they won't forget you.  even if they don't hire you, check up on them frequently in case they have another position open.  this degree of nuisance will get you something productive.  maybe not a job, but at least some new contacts.  (essentially, be shameless)

I never, ever talked to people who just showed up like that. It's very rude. You expect me to just drop what I'm doing to talk to you? You have no respect for my time and lack a basic understanding of how people work. You have poor judgement and are clearly willing to waste time doing something pointless.

If someone sent me a resume and followed-up and said they just wanted to talk about the industry, I'd make time to talk to them, at an appointed time and date.

As for sitting there waiting or being a nuisance, I had had a couple of people try that. I had security remove them because they were creeping out the CSRs.
 
2013-06-21 03:18:13 PM  

ng2810: Mr. Breeze: Pangea: gnosis301: Galileo's Daughter: Lack of jobs in nursing?  Are you kidding?  Here in Georgia, hospitals are paying thousands of dollars in sign-on bonuses to nurses.

"Georgia". I think I found your problem right there.


You may be surprised to learn that not all of Georgia is rural and populated with hillbillies.

True, but all of Georgia is miserably hot and humid in the summertime.

My oncologist left her swanky life in farking Beverly Hills (not to mention, ME) to treat cancer patients in Georgia. I still feel bitter about it.


That's unfortunate for you. Just comfort yourself with knowing that she is living (and suffering) in Georgia.
 
2013-06-21 03:20:20 PM  

sugarhi: Hearing about this issue makes me so thankful to be in my field - I'm very lucky in that after I get my degree and get licensed I'll have options. Being a psychologist at a college counseling center is my career goal but in the mean time I could always easily find a job in community mental health if positions aren't available when I start looking for something.

I actually lucked out for once - helps me stay optimistic when the stress of work and grad school get me down.


We should network, I'm actually having issues trying to accomplish this in Flori-DUH.

/please, help me escape
 
2013-06-21 03:22:28 PM  

Joe1549: Hmm... technology increases making the economy too efficient, so there's not enough jobs for everyone. Color me surprised. This will keep on happening, and get worse as technology gets more efficient.


Yeah.  There is no way that people will creatively adapt or innovate with new technology to create new jobs that were never even thought of before programming jobs came about from the new invention of some computer thingy that wiped out all the stenographers.

*eyeroll at the one person that watches Golden Girl reruns for the thrills*
 
2013-06-21 03:22:59 PM  

spiderpaz: sugarhi: Hearing about this issue makes me so thankful to be in my field - I'm very lucky in that after I get my degree and get licensed I'll have options. Being a psychologist at a college counseling center is my career goal ...

Stopped reading there.  Holy cow, the real world is about to punch you in the stomach.  Get ready.


Not actually - there are TONS of jobs in community mental health out there, and I'm already working at a private practice. Additionally, the majority of recent graduates from my program have had little difficulty getting jobs in the field, whether it be at hospitals, VAs, group private practices, or college counseling centers.

If you're not in the field yourself how would you know? There's a huge demand for jobs in mental health, and the statistics of graduates from my program and others actually disprove your assumption.
 
2013-06-21 03:23:43 PM  

spiderpaz: "Do what you love, and you'll never work a day in your life."

So true.  My son is going to have a little bit more practical advice on choosing a career.  Something more like "being poor sucks, so do something there is a demand for, even if it's not very much fun.  It's easier to have fun when you have money."


How about "Do what you want, but be really good at it." Distinguishing yourself and finding a market for what you are good at is much more valuable than turning yourself into a commodity. The catch is that getting really good at something usually involves doing stuff that isn't fun at some point.
 
2013-06-21 03:25:16 PM  

What_do_you_want_now: sugarhi: Hearing about this issue makes me so thankful to be in my field - I'm very lucky in that after I get my degree and get licensed I'll have options. Being a psychologist at a college counseling center is my career goal but in the mean time I could always easily find a job in community mental health if positions aren't available when I start looking for something.

I actually lucked out for once - helps me stay optimistic when the stress of work and grad school get me down.

We should network, I'm actually having issues trying to accomplish this in Flori-DUH.

/please, help me escape


Well maybe that's your problem, haha. But sure, shoot me an email if you'd like to chat (in profile) - its always helpful to network!
 
2013-06-21 03:26:54 PM  
My wife just finished getting her very own useless degree and is now seriously considering joining me in the trades. If nothing else, watching her try to bend electrical conduit would be worth what I paid for her schooling.
 
2013-06-21 03:27:34 PM  

TelemonianAjax: ng2810:  If something that I shiat out of my A$$ would garner praise from an experienced professional, I can only wonder about my fellow graduates......

CSB to match yours:
I took Bio 101 as a Junior instead of Freshman like most folks, so I took it pass/fail.  That semester also turned into my...um...alcoholic semester and I can honestly tell you I don't remember much of it.  I attended class once every two weeks and only showed up to half the labs.  Of the four tests our grades were based on, I got a 48% on one of them.

Once the final grades were curved, I had an 87% in that class.  When I read the scores, with the masses behind me, I just turned around and said "What the holy hell have you people been doing all semester?"

This is essentially what is meant by the "student loan debt problem": people who had no business being there now owe exorbitant sums for something that isn't ever going to help them.


I was a CS grad.  Basically didn't have a life all through college to the point of mounting my screen on the head of my bed and not getting out of bed for 2-3 days at a time because I was working on 16 credits where 1 class could be 40-60 hours a week.  Where everyone else was drinking, I was chugging caffeine pills.

Not-CSB 1:

Final project, final class, everyone's about to graduate.  Working in a group.  2 of the group had taken EECS 381, the stupidly hard 60+-hour per week class that teaches you how to really, really, really use C++ and some of the basics of program architecture.  2 of the group hadn't.

We're discussing how to architect our game, and I mention that maybe we should use a virtual function.  The 2 guys who hadn't both look up and say in unison "What's a virtual function?".  And then I was appalled, and then I wasted 20 minutes explaining this simple, incredibly critical idea that's a fundamental underlying concept of C++ OOP.

/So lesson is: Michigan CS grads who haven't taken EECS 381 are probably shiat.  Michigan grads who have taken EECS 381 are on the shortlist (which is still really long) for Google.

Not-CSB2:

I once took a class where the class average on the true-false was less than 50%. I got a 55% and ended up with a B+.

/Mind you, it was a theory class, so that was kind of the point.  One really good theorist is more important than thousands of mediocre theorists.
 
2013-06-21 03:28:26 PM  

kriegsgeist: spiderpaz: "Do what you love, and you'll never work a day in your life."

So true.  My son is going to have a little bit more practical advice on choosing a career.  Something more like "being poor sucks, so do something there is a demand for, even if it's not very much fun.  It's easier to have fun when you have money."

How about "Do what you want, but be really good at it." Distinguishing yourself and finding a market for what you are good at is much more valuable than turning yourself into a commodity. The catch is that getting really good at something usually involves doing stuff that isn't fun at some point.


Sure, go study film, and try to become a movie director - but if you're not in the top %0.001 of people in that field, get ready to be poor.  Or be an averagish engineer, and you can buy a house, have saving, security, retirement etc.  They're really equal options.
 
2013-06-21 03:28:52 PM  

Skraeling: Claire Ferris, a 24-year-old from Fergus, Ont., who now lives in Windsor, is a prime example. After graduating from the University of Windsor with a degree in drama and creative writing

im SHOCKED she cant find work.


I manage a loading dock and we have someone that is sporting a double degree in dance and public speaking.
 
2013-06-21 03:32:54 PM  
If I could, I'd change every Fine Arts program in the country to require a minor in marketing. You don't need to be talented. You need to know how to get out there, and sell your product. Your art is a product too, in spite of what your dipsh*t art professors tell you.

The hungry, driven, and connected get work in the arts. The self-important schlubs don't.
 
2013-06-21 03:34:19 PM  
cleaning poop is a noble career.
 
2013-06-21 03:35:07 PM  

Lokasenna: My wife just finished getting her very own useless degree and is now seriously considering joining me in the trades. If nothing else, watching her try to bend electrical conduit would be worth what I paid for her schooling.


Sounds like my hubby.  He's an electrician paying for my 'useless' degrees.  I actually joked that I should go into the trades but he didn't find it funny.
 
2013-06-21 03:37:31 PM  

Carn: It seems to me that one of the biggest problems with this recession in the US has been people who were out of work were also tied up in their homes and unable to sell so they can move to somewhere with more jobs in their field.  This sort of problem doesn't exist for young people so I would expect there to be a lot of young folks moving these days to areas with positive job markets.  Now when the market sucks in general it can be very hard for newbies to find work so I do sympathize.

/graduated in 2001 looking for programming job after .com bubble burst
//moved to NoVA from Indy


though it's not the case with this article, I think a lot of the problems have also been due to ridiculous education requirements from employers.  I don't know how we ended up trending in that direction, but there are jobs which should pay a living wage and not expect a candidate with a PhD in the field.  I have watched seen decent candidates get passed on because they lacked enough formal education even though their experience and references were fine.
 
2013-06-21 03:37:59 PM  

spiderpaz: Sure, go study film, and try to become a movie director - but if you're not in the top %0.001 of people in that field, get ready to be poor.  Or be an averagish engineer, and you can buy a house, have saving, security, retirement etc.  They're really equal options.


And to buttress this bullsh*t with what I just said, a failed filmmaker can end up as a technician, engineer, producer, designer, assistant director, equipment operator, stage manager, casting director, agent, promoter, teacher - any number of other jobs in the entertainment industry.

But you have to work for it. These jobs do not get posted on Monster.com, and usually require tons of self-initiative, willingness to work weird hours and travel, and are at times feast-or-famine.
 
2013-06-21 03:40:27 PM  

verbaltoxin: spiderpaz: Sure, go study film, and try to become a movie director - but if you're not in the top %0.001 of people in that field, get ready to be poor.  Or be an averagish engineer, and you can buy a house, have saving, security, retirement etc.  They're really equal options.

And to buttress this bullsh*t with what I just said, a failed filmmaker can end up as a technician, engineer, producer, designer, assistant director, equipment operator, stage manager, casting director, agent, promoter, teacher - any number of other jobs in the entertainment industry.

But you have to work for it. These jobs do not get posted on Monster.com, and usually require tons of self-initiative, willingness to work weird hours and travel, and are at times feast-or-famine.


"Can" is the operative word in that sentence.  They can also (and very likely will) end up working in retail with high school educated superiors managing them to pay off all those loans.
 
2013-06-21 03:42:06 PM  

The_Gallant_Gallstone: miss jinxed: Getting a kick out of the article since I'm the same age as most of the people in the article and I'm sitting at my current job playing Candy Crush and sending out resumes.

You sound like a perfect candidate for me to hire for my imaginary firm.  I can tell who is loyal and diligent from the most cursory exposure.

We'll give you a top secret clearance, $122K a year, an office in Hawaii and complete, unfettered access to all of our most intimate information.


OMG, really!!!! When can I come interview?

Actually, I'm handle sensitive information, both personal and office related, for multiple people, it has never been an issue.

But honestly, in the industry I work and the part of the country I work in, work on Friday is just non-existent.  Everyone is already heading off to their weekend summer homes, or getting ready for parties, or something like that.  So  I don't have a lot going on.  And I'm still doing actual real work for my office.
 
2013-06-21 03:46:47 PM  
FTFA:  "We have been told since we were born that we could be anything..."

/Well now there's your problem Missy.

//Proud Gen-Xer
 
2013-06-21 03:48:10 PM  

spiderpaz: verbaltoxin: spiderpaz: Sure, go study film, and try to become a movie director - but if you're not in the top %0.001 of people in that field, get ready to be poor.  Or be an averagish engineer, and you can buy a house, have saving, security, retirement etc.  They're really equal options.

And to buttress this bullsh*t with what I just said, a failed filmmaker can end up as a technician, engineer, producer, designer, assistant director, equipment operator, stage manager, casting director, agent, promoter, teacher - any number of other jobs in the entertainment industry.

But you have to work for it. These jobs do not get posted on Monster.com, and usually require tons of self-initiative, willingness to work weird hours and travel, and are at times feast-or-famine.

"Can" is the operative word in that sentence.  They can also (and very likely will) end up working in retail with high school educated superiors managing them to pay off all those loans.


Way to skip a whole paragraph so you can pour on some more bullsh*t.

Let's say I were a film director. What did I learn in my experiences?

- How to start a project from the ground, which requires budget, financing, equipment, logistics, personnel, and location.
- How to resolve personnel disputes (Can you imagine managing anybody more needy and annoying than actors?).
- How to deal with complex management and work across multiple agencies (Producers, studios, theaters, distributors).
- How to market the product so it can recoup its budget or make a profit.
- How to use graphics and film editing software.
- How to run my own goddamned business, because that's what being a director essentially is, especially if you're independent.

Yeah, there are no companies whatsoever that could use skills like these. None. They're all hiring engineers and only engineers.

Because engineers never need project managers, human resources, financial managers, client representatives or any other support personnel to keep their little projects from going over-budget and burning the building to the ground.

Right.
 
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