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(The former Exodus International)   Exodus International to the LGBT community: I'm sorry. This will never happen again   (exodusinternational.org) divider line 56
    More: Cool, Exodus International, Oprah Winfrey Network, LGBT community, Lisa Ling, God the Father, finished work, lesbian people  
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8114 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Jun 2013 at 9:22 AM (42 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
2013-06-20 03:57:45 AM
11 votes:
Between ministries like Exodus apologizing for past wrongs against the LGBTQ community, and multiple conservative politicians changing their stance on Gay Marriage (to now be in favor of it) this week, it seems like a lot of people are trying to do one thing: Get on the right side of history, with the SCOTUS decisions on Prop 8 and DOMA coming by the end of the week. It sounds like they see the writing on the wall, assume the SCOTUS will overturn Prop 8 and DOMA, heralding in a major victory for LGBTQ equality in America.

This isn't the end of the fight for equality, if SCOTUS rules favorably, but it is a start. And all these former opponents of LGBTQ equality changing their tune does not mean there are not still many formidable enemies to face. But it is a beginning, and that is all we can ask for.

/Straight Ally
2013-06-20 09:28:42 AM
7 votes:
"You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?
2013-06-20 09:45:30 AM
6 votes:
If you can believe that being gay is sinful and keep it to your farking self, and not treat gay people any differently than anyone else, and refrain from trying to legislate against or prevent teh ghey, then I don't give a fark what you believe, even if it's retarded and hypocritical because you completely ignore every single other so-called abomination in Leviticus, except teh ghey.

The problem is that people who can do this don't seem to exist.
2013-06-20 11:19:01 AM
5 votes:
Yes, sadly, this will happen again. Just not by your hand. Also, FTA:

I cannot apologize for my deeply held biblical beliefs about the boundaries I see in scripture surrounding sex, but I will exercise my beliefs with great care and respect for those who do not share them.  I cannot apologize for my beliefs about marriage. But I do not have any desire to fight you on your beliefs or the rights that you seek. My beliefs about these things will never again interfere with God's command to love my neighbor as I love myself.
You have never been my enemy. I am very sorry that I have been yours. I hope the changes in my own life, as well as the ones we announce tonight regarding Exodus International, will bring resolution, and show that I am serious in both my regret and my offer of friendship. I pledge that future endeavors will be focused on peace and common good.


Speaking as a staunch agnostic, THIS is what a Christian is supposed to sound like. "The god I believe in loves you and can do anything to forgive you, I see you're doing a thing he said not to do and I personally have a problem with that, but he specifically told me to show you the love I would show him so here we are."  If only more holy people paid more attention to their own scripture, "pray away the gay" wouldn't be a thing.
2013-06-20 11:16:46 AM
5 votes:

gshepnyc: QifutuWahuta: gshepnyc: Gone In 26 Minutes: Mostly in response to the earlier messages in the thread:

LGBTQOMGBBQ

Stop farking adding letters to this shiat. LGBT is fine. Not every 'alternative' sexuality deserves its own initial.

THIS.

How about just Gay? Aren't lesbians gay women? And as far as bisexuals, no one says you can't be gay and still sleep with the opposite sex when you want, or straight and still sleep with the same sex when you want. And Transgender is, frankly, an entirely separate concept.

/Gay.

I can understand wanting L and G to be apart, and also needing the B and T.  But Q?  Is that really necessary?  If you're going to add an extra letter, the only letters I can potentially see being justified are I for intersexed and maybe A for asexuals.

/Not gay, but a lesbian trapped in a man's body.

"Q" is "Questioning." Meaning you are undecided. Sorry, but it's only an experiment the first time. The "Q" phase doesn't last long enough to have its own letter.


Okay yall. Lets spell out the alphabet here and let me explain why they all cannot just be gay.

L is for ladies that love the lady lovin'
G is for guys who like guys
B is boys and belles, who like other boys and belles
T is for Travis, who is Trianna on the inside, or Trianna who is really Travis
Q is quirky because it has two meanings; it stands for Queer andstands for Questioning

Questioning means "I'm just not sure"
Queer means "My attractions aren't about what's between the legs, but what's between the ears; my sexuality is abstract"
Queer also encompasses Asexual individuals who say "I like you, but I'm not attracted to you... or anyone"

One group may add the letter "I" pretty soon, for Intersexed. These wonderful people are those born genetically somewhere between male and female.

Why they cannot be just gay:

Lesbian - ladies sometimes take the gay umbrella, if you wanted to collpase L and G into one letter it might make sense here

Bisexuals - They aren't gay; they are not heterosexual nor are they homosexual.

Transgendered - Gay is about sexual expression. Transgender is about gender expression. Sex and gender are not the same.

Questioning - might be gay, might be bisexual, might be straight. Still figuring it out.

Queer - Your "plumbing" isn't in the equation really. Gay is too restrictive.

Asexual - Gay means I'm attracted to someone of the same sex; I'm not attracted to anyone of any sex.

Intersex - My gender identity is somewhat fluid due to my physiology, though I may identify as one over the other. Being gay is about my sexual identity, not my gender identity.
2013-06-20 09:53:39 AM
5 votes:
You cannot hope to begin to make things right between you and someone you wronged until you speak the two words "I'm sorry."

Exodus isn't (and the rest aren't) off the hook yet, but this is an incredible step on par with the Anglicans ordaining gay priests or Episcopals ordaining women. If nothing else, the easily-led will take a cue from an organization they trust and realize that "choice" therapy is bullshiat like phrenology. Hell, maybe this is the next step in getting people (the, what 40%? who don't yet) to realize that gay is not a choice.
2013-06-20 09:38:26 AM
5 votes:

James!: "You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?


I don't see a problem with that.  They can think the other side is wrong all they want... I mean, I know I think they are crazy for wasting time in church once (or more) a week, giving 10% of their money to the church, and praying to an invisible man.

Where you go wrong is when you try to force the other side to change, make life harder on the people that think think and feel differently than you, or keep the other side from doing things that are perfectly legal for your side to do.
2013-06-20 09:33:44 AM
5 votes:

James!: "You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?


I think so, but there's positive in this.   It sounds like they're apologizing for "You're a sinner and need to be cured, and we can force you to do that," so at least they're dropping Asshat Defcon down a few notches.  When one of the most hardcore anti-LGBTQ organizations out there drops an apology and decides to change their core mission, a key point has been won.
2013-06-20 08:21:11 AM
5 votes:

MmmmBacon: Between ministries like Exodus apologizing for past wrongs against the LGBTQ community, and multiple conservative politicians changing their stance on Gay Marriage (to now be in favor of it) this week, it seems like a lot of people are trying to do one thing: Get on the right side of history, with the SCOTUS decisions on Prop 8 and DOMA coming by the end of the week. It sounds like they see the writing on the wall, assume the SCOTUS will overturn Prop 8 and DOMA, heralding in a major victory for LGBTQ equality in America.


I hope you're right about the SCOTUS ruling. But there are ways that they could rule on DOMA that could really put an obstacle in the way of nation wide recognized gay marriage.

This isn't the end of the fight for equality, if SCOTUS rules favorably, but it is a start.

No, it isn't the end. A lot of people seem to think that once we get 'gay marriage' that the fight will be over. There's still discrimination in the work place, adoption rights, and maybe a couple more I'm forgetting.
2013-06-20 02:46:15 AM
5 votes:
I have no clue how they begin to undo the damage they did to tens of thousands of families, but the long journey starts with a single step.
2013-06-20 11:08:23 AM
4 votes:

Cybernetic: BassmanBP: James!: "You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?

I think so, but there's positive in this.   It sounds like they're apologizing for "You're a sinner and need to be cured, and we can force you to do that," so at least they're dropping Asshat Defcon down a few notches.  When one of the most hardcore anti-LGBTQ organizations out there drops an apology and decides to change their core mission, a key point has been won.

I think this is the key point:

"I cannot apologize for my deeply held biblical beliefs about the boundaries I see in scripture surrounding sex, but I will exercise my beliefs with great care and respect for those who do not share them."

What a person thinks in the quiet recesses of his own mind is his own business. When those thoughts translate into actions that affect others, that is another matter entirely. I think he finally came to that realization.


Yeah, I think that's the deal.

The lede is kinda buried.  Elsewhere on the website:
Exodus International to Shut Down
So it looks like the entire mission of trying to pray away the gay is done and gone.

and the statement from the guy's wife is a combination of weird and heartbreaking.
Key quote: "Alan has openly admitted his same-sex attractions. As his wife, I can honestly say that the last thing I want him to pursue is heterosexuality. "  I mean... wow, lady.  You poor thing.  Good luck in riding the emotional roller coaster, seriously.

I honestly wish this guy and his family all the luck in the world. This is definitely a painful journey.
2013-06-20 09:55:39 AM
4 votes:

BassmanBP: James!: "You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?

I think so, but there's positive in this.   It sounds like they're apologizing for "You're a sinner and need to be cured, and we can force you to do that," so at least they're dropping Asshat Defcon down a few notches.  When one of the most hardcore anti-LGBTQ organizations out there drops an apology and decides to change their core mission, a key point has been won.


I think this is the key point:

"I cannot apologize for my deeply held biblical beliefs about the boundaries I see in scripture surrounding sex, but I will exercise my beliefs with great care and respect for those who do not share them."

What a person thinks in the quiet recesses of his own mind is his own business. When those thoughts translate into actions that affect others, that is another matter entirely. I think he finally came to that realization.
2013-06-20 09:44:27 AM
4 votes:

James!: "You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?



yes it is.  said another way, "I still consider you damned to hell and an abomination, but in the interest of not being vilified by a growing majority of my fellow men, I'm going to suppress this burning hatred and put on my nice face."
2013-06-20 09:36:03 AM
4 votes:
Even the professional bigots are throwing in the towel on this issue. Will the Republican Party end up being the last anti gay rights organization in the country?
2013-06-20 09:56:02 AM
3 votes:

Duke_leto_Atredes: How about stop going after our kids, we need to protect our kids and also study the illness that makes people "gay" find the cause and then the cure


0/10, and may God have mercy on your soul
2013-06-20 09:55:36 AM
3 votes:
Hopefully this leads to an end of so-called Biblical values and basing morality on mythology.  The sooner that we can relegate Evangelical, Roman-Catholic, Christians and Mormons to the sidelines of the political process, the better off we'd be as a nation.
2013-06-20 09:45:18 AM
3 votes:

SDRR: Link is Farked. Anyone have copypasta to post in the thread?


No, please, it's a billion words long!

Here's the gist:

"Sorry we tried to pray away the gay, that was wrong and harmed people.
Oh, and I'm gay.
Did mention MY WIFE (I'm not the bad kind of gay).
The end."
2013-06-20 09:43:21 AM
3 votes:

James!: "You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?


I don't think so. I think he's saying that he finally remembers what Jesus said, and if he wants to be a true Christian, he should follow the words of Christ before he follows the misinterpretations and silly whims of the people in his church.
2013-06-20 03:50:52 PM
2 votes:
It's amazing how in a country founded on "all are created equal" we're still having to fight for equality for everyone because of religious idiots.

Hey, guys, when regular humans are more kind and compassionate than your supposed all-loving god who created everything out of love, something went seriously wrong with your religion.
2013-06-20 01:58:33 PM
2 votes:

orbister: For that matter, get the T out of there. T isn't a sexuality. You might as well include V(egan) and F(reckled).


Technically, you're correct - the best kind of correct? - but politically, it makes sense to include transgendered people in a group with gay, lesbian, and bisexual people.

First, opposition to homosexuality often has as much to do with violation of gender norms as it does with who is doing whom. Think of the stereotypes that are used against gay and lesbian men and women, stereotypes of feminine men and masculine women. Think of the criticism of same-sex parenting based upon a perceived deficit in not having a father and mother for the child. Think of the perception that gay men are not real men or are not fully men, or that lesbian women are not fully women. Opposition to transgendered people borrows heavily from opposition to gay and lesbian people for the same reason. In the minds of many of those who oppose rights for transgendered people, transgendered people are the superlative form of homosexual people. Until we can clear up exactly what you've already said, that gender is not sexuality, we all have common cause.

Second, and I hate to point out the obvious here, but many transgendered people start out with one sexual identity and end up with another one. Because sexuality is not gender, a person's attraction to men or to women does not necessarily change after transition. Someone who had a straight identity before transition can wind up having a lesbian or gay identity post-transition. The reverse is also true - someone who had a gay or lesbian identity can end up with a queer or straight identity post-transition. It doesn't necessarily stay the same, either. A transman can begin with a lesbian identity and end up with a gay identity. Hormones are funny things. So in that sense, many if not most T have at one time, or will be, G or L or even B.

Third, as I'm sure you know, it has been assumed in the past and in fact was part of the diagnostic criteria that a transwoman would necessarily be attracted to men and a transman would necessarily be attracted to women. A transwoman presenting as attracted to women would often be assigned a diagnosis not of gender identity disorder, but of autogynephilia - a sexual fetish. Even in the present, transgendered people who are attracted to the same gender as their own perceived gender - transwomen attracted to women, transmen attracted to men - have been denied diagnosis and treatment on that basis alone. So while the very existence of gay or lesbian transgendered people is still denied by enough people in the psychological and medical community that they - and by they I mean we - often cannot access the same care that straight-identified transgendered people can, we all have clear common cause and a clear reason to keep the tomato in the sandwich.
2013-06-20 11:16:02 AM
2 votes:

SheltemDragon: catastrophic wave of homosexuality


Finally found the name for my One Direction cover band.
2013-06-20 11:15:53 AM
2 votes:

cosmiquemuffin: The lede is kinda buried. Elsewhere on the website:
Exodus International to Shut Down
So it looks like the entire mission of trying to pray away the gay is done and gone.


Good. That whole apology makes no sense otherwise.
2013-06-20 10:56:40 AM
2 votes:
img.fark.net

Whoa, crazy stuff here.  At least the guy seems to be trying to do the right thing-- actions will speak louder than words, though.

So... What's Chambers communicating here, other than he feels kinda bad about all the lives destroyed by his organization?

Are they taking the Catholic church's approach-- where it's "OK" to be gay, but you can never have sex unless it's with somebody you're not attracted to, and only then after you got married?  If that's the case, then it's a huge improvement, but still pretty awful.

I can understand Chambers getting married while still in denial about being gay.  It's tragic, but understandable given the bigotry and pressures so many face to be "normal." But what about now?  What about his wife?

What's the purpose for Exodus going forward?  Are they going to disband?  Are they still going to try to turn gay people straight, or are they only going to try to "fix" people they deem aren't "really" gay, but just straight guys who want to suck cock now and then?
2013-06-20 10:32:17 AM
2 votes:

QifutuWahuta: gshepnyc: Gone In 26 Minutes: Mostly in response to the earlier messages in the thread:

LGBTQOMGBBQ

Stop farking adding letters to this shiat. LGBT is fine. Not every 'alternative' sexuality deserves its own initial.

THIS.

How about just Gay? Aren't lesbians gay women? And as far as bisexuals, no one says you can't be gay and still sleep with the opposite sex when you want, or straight and still sleep with the same sex when you want. And Transgender is, frankly, an entirely separate concept.

/Gay.

I can understand wanting L and G to be apart, and also needing the B and T.  But Q?  Is that really necessary?  If you're going to add an extra letter, the only letters I can potentially see being justified are I for intersexed and maybe A for asexuals.

/Not gay, but a lesbian trapped in a man's body.


"Q" is "Questioning." Meaning you are undecided. Sorry, but it's only an experiment the first time. The "Q" phase doesn't last long enough to have its own letter.
2013-06-20 09:54:37 AM
2 votes:
It's always adorable when a hate-filled, god-clotted Liar for Jesus tries to change his spots.
2013-06-20 09:43:02 AM
2 votes:

Cythraul: MmmmBacon: Between ministries like Exodus apologizing for past wrongs against the LGBTQ community, and multiple conservative politicians changing their stance on Gay Marriage (to now be in favor of it) this week, it seems like a lot of people are trying to do one thing: Get on the right side of history, with the SCOTUS decisions on Prop 8 and DOMA coming by the end of the week. It sounds like they see the writing on the wall, assume the SCOTUS will overturn Prop 8 and DOMA, heralding in a major victory for LGBTQ equality in America.

I hope you're right about the SCOTUS ruling. But there are ways that they could rule on DOMA that could really put an obstacle in the way of nation wide recognized gay marriage.


There are a couple of potential results in DOMA I can think of that aren't very clean. One is getting five justices to agree on the 10th amendment solution; that seems basically impossible to me. The other is getting five justices to agree that the BLAG had no standing to defend DOMA and letting the 2nd circuit court opinion stand; that seems possible but still not very likely. Besides, if that second option happened, Obama would then have to choose between enforcing DOMA differently in different parts of the country or choosing to not enforce it anywhere. Do you really think he would choose to enforce it everywhere but the circuits where they ruled it was unconstitutional?

This isn't the end of the fight for equality, if SCOTUS rules favorably, but it is a start.

No, it isn't the end. A lot of people seem to think that once we get 'gay marriage' that the fight will be over. There's still discrimination in the work place, adoption rights, and maybe a couple more I'm forgetting.


There's a whole host of things that need to be done relating to gender identity and expression. The military still bans transgendered people from serving for one.
2013-06-20 09:36:50 AM
2 votes:

BassmanBP: James!: "You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?

I think so, but there's positive in this.   It sounds like they're apologizing for "You're a sinner and need to be cured, and we can force you to do that," so at least they're dropping Asshat Defcon down a few notches.  When one of the most hardcore anti-LGBTQ organizations out there drops an apology and decides to change their core mission, a key point has been won.


True.
2013-06-20 10:41:04 PM
1 votes:

wolfpaq777: ThunderPelvis: If you can believe that being gay is sinful and keep it to your farking self, and not treat gay people any differently than anyone else, and refrain from trying to legislate against or prevent teh ghey, then I don't give a fark what you believe, even if it's retarded and hypocritical because you completely ignore every single other so-called abomination in Leviticus, except teh ghey.

The problem is that people who can do this don't seem to exist.

Problem's not in leviticus.  It's 1 corinthians legitimately in the Bible at all, considering that Levantine cultures in the Bronze and Iron Ages simply did not have the same concept of sexual orientation and gender identity that exists in 21st Century Western Culture.


FTFY.  (An increasing body of Biblical scholars would note that Paul's commentaries were aimed at pretty much ALL sexual indiscretion outside of marriage, and in particular a custom of visiting a particular type of male gigolo explicitly associated with Greek pagan rituals and whose "bordellos" tended to be Greek pagan temple sites; the Leviticus condemnations also are related to condemnations of temple rituals in the "Old Religion" that Judaism had just recently forked off of.)

Among other things, there simply was not a concept of "gay" or "straight" as we know it now; most condemnations of sexual activities in the Bible are (if one does the research) almost directly related to fertility rituals of non-Abrahamic faiths (and yes, there was a lot of farkin' in some of the Old Religions), and in general an effeminate man was often not considered "gay" or "transgender" so much as being considered an outright third sex (this was definitely the case in Greece and Rome, and in other cultures in the Levant).  We don't have a "third sex" concept in modern Western culture, but other cultures DO still have something like this (the general concept of naadleh and "Two-Spirit" people in a number of First Nations cultures, the concept of "Holy Eunuchs" in India, the famous kathooey or lady-boys of Thailand, and so on); there are even hints in the words of Jesus Himself that men who would be classified as "gay" or "transsexual" today were--much like literal eunuchs--considered a sort of third sex.

(Yes, you're reading this right...pretty much the entire "GBTQ" spectrum for Men Not Of The Usual Gender Identity Or Sexual Orientation was considered functionally a third sex of "functional eunuch", i.e. Someone Not In The Reproductive Market.  Note, as well, this only covered men; women were pretty much seen as property throughout the Levant, and women who dared assert themselves like men were seen as either Uppity or Scary (or both).  There would have been much more practical discrimination against lesbians and transmen than, say, effeminate men.)

Also complicating things a bit is the relationship between David and Jonathan, which (again, based on some of the very specific terminology used) went DEFINITELY beyond mere friendship or even "blood brother" bonds; there is even an interpretation (in Abrahamic houses of faith that are open and affirming towards same-sex relationships) that (again, based on some very specific terminology that is normally used only in the context of marriage and sexual relations) holds that David and Jonathan had a de facto same-sex marriage or at least a domestic partnership.

In the case of Christianity, condemnation of LGBT relationships seems to have started at best in the late Middle Ages (about the time that Protestantism started forking off, to be exact); there are church records in Europe (and particularly in France) dating from the Middle Ages that are marriages of men to each other (again, women unfortunately still generally had a legal status of property, something that would not change for a long time).
2013-06-20 08:31:04 PM
1 votes:
In any case, he follows me on Twitter, so in a week or so when the press quiets down, I'm going to see if I can start a conversation with him about what direction he's heading.
2013-06-20 08:22:01 PM
1 votes:

Benevolent Misanthrope: rynthetyn: Benevolent Misanthrope: Dear Mr. Chambers:

Fark you.

I'd be more inclined to believe your sincerity if your website didn't still link to sources and ministries to "help" me because I'm "afflicted" with homosexuality.  Or if your site didn't still peddle anti-gay books.

You seem to think that you can type up a nice, politically correct apology and then grin and say, "It's okay - we're cool, right?"  And then I'll dissolve into tears of gratitude for your fake apology condemning me to eternal torment, while you say you love me.  You are a sham.  A charlatan.  A hateful, self-deluded man masquerading in the robes of a saint.

Again I say, sir, fark you.

Sincerely,

Benevolent Misanthrope

I think you missed the memo, Exodus is disbanding completely. The website and all that jazz will be going away.

So I read this link.

My opinion of Mr. Chambers remains unchanged.  If anything, this is a cynical smokescreen to get gays (and their disposable income) back into church and be "loved" into submission.  But still condemned.

"reducefear.org"?  Really?  Come on.  It's already blocked by our filters as "potentially damaging content."


I'm obviously taking this development with an entire shaker of salt, but I think he is being sincere. He's been getting increasingly short and snarky towards the rest of the anti-gay religious right over the last year and a half. Among other things, he's made sarcastic comments on twitter about Focus on the Family needing to focus on their own family and ended up in a flame war with Matt Barber over it. A few months ago, he got pissed off at the bigotry on some email list of religious leaders and added a gay activist blogger Jeremy Hooper to the mailing list knowing that Hooper would do precisely what he ended up doing--posting the whole thing on the Internet.

I actually think that a new organization is the right thing to do, assuming it really is what he says it is--a group to work towards making the church stop being anti-gay. Not only do I think they need to help clean up the mess they created, there are an awful lot of people who have still drunk the Exodus koolade and Exodus going away isn't going to make them automatically accept themselves. It's going to send them into the arms of the even nastier and more extreme Restored Hope Network. The best case scenario is that this new thing will help them get over their guilt and shame and go on with their lives as healthy gay people. I think that is possible, from what I've heard, today they were having a speaker at their conference who is speaking on how there is nothing wrong with being gay and in a same-sex relationship. That's truly new for an Exodus conference and certainly seems to suggest that Chambers really is stopped with forcing his beliefs on people.
2013-06-20 07:51:52 PM
1 votes:

rynthetyn: Benevolent Misanthrope: Dear Mr. Chambers:

Fark you.

I'd be more inclined to believe your sincerity if your website didn't still link to sources and ministries to "help" me because I'm "afflicted" with homosexuality.  Or if your site didn't still peddle anti-gay books.

You seem to think that you can type up a nice, politically correct apology and then grin and say, "It's okay - we're cool, right?"  And then I'll dissolve into tears of gratitude for your fake apology condemning me to eternal torment, while you say you love me.  You are a sham.  A charlatan.  A hateful, self-deluded man masquerading in the robes of a saint.

Again I say, sir, fark you.

Sincerely,

Benevolent Misanthrope

I think you missed the memo, Exodus is disbanding completely. The website and all that jazz will be going away.


So I read this link.

My opinion of Mr. Chambers remains unchanged.  If anything, this is a cynical smokescreen to get gays (and their disposable income) back into church and be "loved" into submission.  But still condemned.

"reducefear.org"?  Really?  Come on.  It's already blocked by our filters as "potentially damaging content."
2013-06-20 07:41:27 PM
1 votes:

Benevolent Misanthrope: Dear Mr. Chambers:

Fark you.

I'd be more inclined to believe your sincerity if your website didn't still link to sources and ministries to "help" me because I'm "afflicted" with homosexuality.  Or if your site didn't still peddle anti-gay books.

You seem to think that you can type up a nice, politically correct apology and then grin and say, "It's okay - we're cool, right?"  And then I'll dissolve into tears of gratitude for your fake apology condemning me to eternal torment, while you say you love me.  You are a sham.  A charlatan.  A hateful, self-deluded man masquerading in the robes of a saint.

Again I say, sir, fark you.

Sincerely,

Benevolent Misanthrope


I think you missed the memo, Exodus is disbanding completely. The website and all that jazz will be going away.
2013-06-20 07:34:17 PM
1 votes:
I don't think this is the end of the story with Alan Chambers. Eighteen months ago when he showed up at the Gay Christian Network conference for the panel discussion where he ended up acknowledging that people don't change, he was still absolutely and completely refusing to go anywhere near the label "gay" or identify as part of the LGBT community. All he'd admit was that he still had attractions to the same sex. In his apology, he grouped himself in with the alphabet soup. He's finally allowing himself to admit who he really is. Ditto with Exodus' VP, who has actually started referring to himself on his blog as being part of the gay community--something that never happened before.

I don't know where they're going to end up, and I don't think it's going to be any easy road for Chambers and his wife and kids, but I'll be interested in seeing where things are in another few years. What he's talking about though, in working to make the church a safe place for LGBT people, sounds an awful lot like heading down the path of gay rights activism within his own faith community.

/For some reason, Alan Chambers follows me on Twitter, don't ask me why
2013-06-20 07:29:41 PM
1 votes:
Dear Mr. Chambers:

Fark you.

I'd be more inclined to believe your sincerity if your website didn't still link to sources and ministries to "help" me because I'm "afflicted" with homosexuality.  Or if your site didn't still peddle anti-gay books.

You seem to think that you can type up a nice, politically correct apology and then grin and say, "It's okay - we're cool, right?"  And then I'll dissolve into tears of gratitude for your fake apology condemning me to eternal torment, while you say you love me.  You are a sham.  A charlatan.  A hateful, self-deluded man masquerading in the robes of a saint.

Again I say, sir, fark you.

Sincerely,

Benevolent Misanthrope
2013-06-20 05:14:28 PM
1 votes:

wolfpaq777: ThunderPelvis: If you can believe that being gay is sinful and keep it to your farking self, and not treat gay people any differently than anyone else, and refrain from trying to legislate against or prevent teh ghey, then I don't give a fark what you believe, even if it's retarded and hypocritical because you completely ignore every single other so-called abomination in Leviticus, except teh ghey.

The problem is that people who can do this don't seem to exist.

Problem's not in leviticus.  It's 1 corinthians.

Before calling people retarded and hypocritical you should at least do some basic research.  Or not, make a fool of yourself as much as you want.  I don't give a fark.


What does 1st Corinthians say about homosexuality?
2013-06-20 05:12:15 PM
1 votes:
img.fark.net
He's got some serious gay-face going on. I would be please to minister to the missus, though. Yes, I would.
2013-06-20 03:01:24 PM
1 votes:

Deucednuisance: Serious Black: Thanks for revealing yourself as a virulent douchebag. We really appreciate it when you make it obvious instead of hiding behind window dressing.

You can be pretty sure that anyone who takes their Fark handle from a major Dune character has already revealed themselves as such.  It's as good a "tell" as any I've ever seen here.


Ah. I haven't read Dune before. That explains why I didn't recognize it.
2013-06-20 01:47:15 PM
1 votes:

Serious Black: Thanks for revealing yourself as a virulent douchebag. We really appreciate it when you make it obvious instead of hiding behind window dressing.


You can be pretty sure that anyone who takes their Fark handle from a major Dune character has already revealed themselves as such.  It's as good a "tell" as any I've ever seen here.
2013-06-20 01:34:47 PM
1 votes:

IntertubeUser: Hopefully this leads to an end of so-called Biblical values and basing morality on mythology.  The sooner that we can relegate Evangelical, Roman-Catholic, Christians and Mormons to the sidelines of the political process, the better off we'd be as a nation.


I agree. While I believe that a few of their general principles are useful for organizing a civilized society, the blatant injection of their talking points into the American political process has been unhelpful for the past 30 years. Or more than that, depending on which line of history you'd want to trace.

As for Exodus, they are wasted human beings. You get those every once in a while -- people whose adult lives have been devoted to a cause or to a series of actions that have no redeeming social value, and who (if the rest of us are lucky) will recognize this on their deathbeds.
2013-06-20 12:41:21 PM
1 votes:
OK, we'll let in the gay men and lesbian women.  The bisexuals are ok too.  But these cross dressers and people who try to physically change themselves are still whacked.

(is that how you troll?  I'm not very experienced at this.)
2013-06-20 12:40:09 PM
1 votes:
So they prayed away the pray away the gay?
2013-06-20 12:16:11 PM
1 votes:
Go figure that the head of this far-right militia hate group turns out to be a degenerate pedophile himself.  Is any one shocked?  No.  Hang him and everyone like him from the highest tree.
2013-06-20 11:36:57 AM
1 votes:

Anderson's Pooper: Dr Dreidel: dedicated cadre of babymakers

Now opening for the Catastrophic Wave of Homosexuality!


+1 Would lol again.

Long term genetic restriction is why I used 50% as a cut off. I know you could have the species survive on even slimmer numbers, but if 90% of us suddenly turned gay even I'd be looking askance at why. I also allowed for the assumption that near present day population levels were a "good" in and of themselves, which is another debatable point that is tangental to the discussion at hand.

/    I'd totally buy tickets to the show and well exceed the two drink minimum.
//   I envision CWH played totally strait, suits and all, 90's Peter Gabrial style.
///  DCoBM would of course be a gimp suit leather band.
2013-06-20 11:36:00 AM
1 votes:
Fun fact: if you tune into OWN tonight, 10 PM Eastern, you can see the founder sit down with a bunch of his former clients.

I would go get some popcorn ready first.
2013-06-20 11:11:16 AM
1 votes:

flondrix: So, Exodus International is going to continue to exist but with a totally different purpose?  Dude, it's easier to disband.  Whatever good you are hoping to do, there are already organizations trying to do that but without the baggage that Exodus would be dragging along.


Sounds like they're going to disband: link
2013-06-20 11:05:17 AM
1 votes:

Misch: Vodka Zombie: gshepnyc: Gone In 26 Minutes: Mostly in response to the earlier messages in the thread:

LGBTQOMGBBQ

Stop farking adding letters to this shiat. LGBT is fine. Not every 'alternative' sexuality deserves its own initial.

THIS.

How about just Gay? Aren't lesbians gay women? And as far as bisexuals, no one says you can't be gay and still sleep with the opposite sex when you want, or straight and still sleep with the same sex when you want. And Transgender is, frankly, an entirely separate concept.

/Gay.

I'm just wondering why lesbians get always top-billing in LGBT.  Does the acronym just roll off the tongue better that way?

/again, sorry.
//seriously.  You'd think I'd know not to post sometimes.

Rearrange the letters and you're too close to BLT.


It could always be a GQBLT, then you've covered bacon, men's fashion, and pop culture.
2013-06-20 10:34:31 AM
1 votes:
So, Exodus International is going to continue to exist but with a totally different purpose?  Dude, it's easier to disband.  Whatever good you are hoping to do, there are already organizations trying to do that but without the baggage that Exodus would be dragging along.
2013-06-20 10:25:45 AM
1 votes:

Vodka Zombie: gshepnyc: Gone In 26 Minutes: Mostly in response to the earlier messages in the thread:

LGBTQOMGBBQ

Stop farking adding letters to this shiat. LGBT is fine. Not every 'alternative' sexuality deserves its own initial.

THIS.

How about just Gay? Aren't lesbians gay women? And as far as bisexuals, no one says you can't be gay and still sleep with the opposite sex when you want, or straight and still sleep with the same sex when you want. And Transgender is, frankly, an entirely separate concept.

/Gay.

I'm just wondering why lesbians get always top-billing in LGBT.  Does the acronym just roll off the tongue better that way?

/again, sorry.
//seriously.  You'd think I'd know not to post sometimes.


Rearrange the letters and you're too close to BLT.
2013-06-20 10:09:10 AM
1 votes:

Gone In 26 Minutes: Mostly in response to the earlier messages in the thread:

LGBTQOMGBBQ

Stop farking adding letters to this shiat. LGBT is fine. Not every 'alternative' sexuality deserves its own initial.


As GI26M said, LGBT should be fine with USAns.  Let's not make an FBI, CIA, ATF, TSA, PTA, USMC, IBM case out of this, okay, Ds, Rs, Is & TBs?

/sorry.
//I should really know when to just stop posting.
2013-06-20 10:05:11 AM
1 votes:
Mostly in response to the earlier messages in the thread:

LGBTQOMGBBQ

Stop farking adding letters to this shiat. LGBT is fine. Not every 'alternative' sexuality deserves its own initial.
2013-06-20 09:58:51 AM
1 votes:

Duke_leto_Atredes: ThunderPelvis: If you can believe that being gay is sinful and keep it to your farking self, and not treat gay people any differently than anyone else, and refrain from trying to legislate against or prevent teh ghey, then I don't give a fark what you believe, even if it's retarded and hypocritical because you completely ignore every single other so-called abomination in Leviticus, except teh ghey.

The problem is that people who can do this don't seem to exist.

How about stop going after our kids, we need to protect our kids and also study the illness that makes people "gay" find the cause and then the cure


You're so cute. Here's a quarter; go play a song on the jukebox.
2013-06-20 09:58:08 AM
1 votes:

Duke_leto_Atredes: How about stop going after our kids, we need to protect our kids and also study the illness that makes people "gay" find the cause and then the cure


You might get a bite or two with this.

Still, it's kind of sad that acting like a moron simply to get attention is so important to you. You must live a painfully lonely life, friend.
2013-06-20 09:57:52 AM
1 votes:

Duke_leto_Atredes: ThunderPelvis: If you can believe that being gay is sinful and keep it to your farking self, and not treat gay people any differently than anyone else, and refrain from trying to legislate against or prevent teh ghey, then I don't give a fark what you believe, even if it's retarded and hypocritical because you completely ignore every single other so-called abomination in Leviticus, except teh ghey.

The problem is that people who can do this don't seem to exist.

How about stop going after our kids, we need to protect our kids and also study the illness that makes people "gay" find the cause and then the cure


Hah! Where do you think you are? Soccermoms.com? You'll have to try better than that to troll Farkers.
2013-06-20 09:46:21 AM
1 votes:

PawisBetlog: James!: "You're still a sinner, but I apologize for being such a dick about it."

Is that what I'm reading?


yes it is.  said another way, "I still consider you damned to hell and an abomination, but in the interest of not being vilified by a growing majority of my fellow men, I'm going to suppress this burning hatred and put on my nice face."


oh and he also said he's gay, but moved past that point pretty quickly.
2013-06-20 09:30:00 AM
1 votes:
Who the Hell are these Exodus people, and what, exactly did they fark up?
2013-06-20 09:27:22 AM
1 votes:
Link is Farked. Anyone have copypasta to post in the thread?
 
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